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** It is also possible that some might be squicked by the relative commonness and casual acceptance of incest, especially among the Highborn families [[spoiler:not to mention the increasing hints that {{Twincest}} is in Jame and Tori's future. It's one thing when your [[VillainousIncest villains are incestuous]], but quite another when it seems predestined for your hero and heroine!]]

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** It is also possible that some might be squicked by the relative commonness and casual acceptance of incest, [[RoyalInbreeding especially among the Highborn families families]] [[spoiler:not to mention the increasing hints that {{Twincest}} is in Jame and Tori's future. It's one thing when your [[VillainousIncest villains are incestuous]], but quite another when it seems predestined for your hero and heroine!]]
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Evil Is Sexy TRS; this has become an objective, in-universe trope.


* EvilIsSexy:
** Rawneth is described as darkly seductive in the very best way, especially in the short story and flashbacks that take place in Ganth's youth.
** Also Kallystine, in very different way. While Rawneth is sexy in a FemmeFatale way that knowingly {{exploit|edTrope}}s EvilIsSexy, Kallystine doesn't, and so she comes off very differently--like something overly-sweet with a bad aftertaste.
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wick cleaning


** It is also possible that some might be squicked by the relative commonness and casual acceptance of [[IncestIsRelative incest]], especially among the Highborn families [[spoiler:not to mention the increasing hints that {{Twincest}} is in Jame and Tori's future. It's one thing when your [[VillainousIncest villains are incestuous]], but quite another when it seems predestined for your hero and heroine!]]

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** It is also possible that some might be squicked by the relative commonness and casual acceptance of [[IncestIsRelative incest]], incest, especially among the Highborn families [[spoiler:not to mention the increasing hints that {{Twincest}} is in Jame and Tori's future. It's one thing when your [[VillainousIncest villains are incestuous]], but quite another when it seems predestined for your hero and heroine!]]

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* CompleteMonster: [[TheHeavy Gerridon]], in the distant backstory, was the [[FallenHero greatest leader of the people]], Highlord of the Kencyrath and Master of Knorth, but he would go down in history as [[TheParagonAlwaysRebels their greatest traitor]]. Desiring {{immortality|Immorality}}—in a MartyrdomCulture--and bitter that the [[HaveYouSeenMyGod absent]] Three-Faced God wouldn't grant it to him, he sold the souls of his race to their [[BigBad ancient enemy]], [[EldritchAbomination Perimal Darkling]], in exchange for eternal life and manipulated his twin sister Jamethiel Dream-Weaver into reaping them for him. This betrayal would not only destroy two-thirds of the Kencyrath, but leave scars in their collective psyche that would linger for millennia. When Gerridon's immortality began to fail him he sought out various means of sustaining it, including attempting to create a child of his or Jamethiel's blood to take over as Dream-Weaver--by rape if necessary--and taking command of an ancient religious sect and whipping them into a fanatical fervor in which they [[ColdBloodedTorture brutally tortured]] hundreds of Kencyr prisoners of war, including Gerridon's own nephew, in an attempt to force them to convert. Driven solely by his selfish desire for immortality, Gerridon will sacrifice anyone and anything--including his own blood-kin--to save himself and prolong his life. Not not only did he betray his people and his god, but he plans to do the same to his "master" Perimal Darkling, if he can find a way to maintain his immortality outside of its control; his pride rankles at the thought of being subordinate to anyone or anything. As Jame observes, there is nothing Gerridon won't do to keep on living and to avoid paying the karmic price for his long-ago betrayal, and his remains a unique and infamous position in the long annals of the Kencyrath's history.

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* CompleteMonster: [[TheHeavy Gerridon]], in the distant backstory, was the [[FallenHero greatest leader of the people]], Highlord of the Kencyrath and Master of Knorth, but he would go down in history as [[TheParagonAlwaysRebels their greatest traitor]]. Desiring {{immortality|Immorality}}—in a MartyrdomCulture--and bitter that the [[HaveYouSeenMyGod absent]] Three-Faced God wouldn't grant it to him, he sold the souls of his race to their [[BigBad ancient enemy]], [[EldritchAbomination Perimal Darkling]], in exchange for eternal life and manipulated his twin sister Jamethiel Dream-Weaver into reaping them for him. This betrayal would not only destroy two-thirds of the Kencyrath, but leave scars in their collective psyche that would linger for millennia. When Gerridon's immortality began to fail him he sought out various means of sustaining it, including attempting to create a child of his or Jamethiel's blood to take over as Dream-Weaver--by rape if necessary--and taking command of an ancient religious sect and whipping them into a fanatical fervor in which they [[ColdBloodedTorture brutally tortured]] hundreds of Kencyr prisoners of war, including Gerridon's own nephew, in an attempt to force them to convert. Driven solely by his selfish desire for immortality, Gerridon will sacrifice anyone and anything--including his own blood-kin--to save himself and prolong his life. Not not only did he betray his people and his god, but he plans to do the same to his "master" Perimal Darkling, if he can find a way to maintain his immortality outside of its control; his pride rankles at the thought of being subordinate to anyone or anything. As Jame his niece [[ActionGirl Lady Jamethiel Priest's-bane of Knorth]] (Jame) observes, there is nothing Gerridon won't do to keep on living and to avoid paying the karmic price for his long-ago betrayal, and his remains a unique and infamous position in the long annals of the Kencyrath's history.
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* LauncherOfAThousandShips: Kirien is awesome and likable in a kind of general, adaptable way. Kirien/Tori? Plausible (and pointed out by Trishien). Kirien/Kindrie? Plausible ([[spoiler:and eventually canon]]). Kirien/Jame? Plausible.

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* LauncherOfAThousandShips: Kirien is awesome and likable in a kind of general, adaptable way. Kirien/Tori? Plausible Reasonable enough (and pointed out by Trishien). Kirien/Kindrie? Plausible Reasonable enough ([[spoiler:and eventually canon]]). Kirien/Jame? Plausible.Reasonable enough.
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* LauncherOfAThousandShips: Kirien is awesome and likable in a kind of general, adaptable way. Kirien/Jame? Plausible. Kirien/Tori? Plausible (and pointed out by Trishien). Kirien/Kindrie? Plausible ([[spoiler:and eventually canon]]).

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* LauncherOfAThousandShips: Kirien is awesome and likable in a kind of general, adaptable way. Kirien/Jame? Plausible. Kirien/Tori? Plausible (and pointed out by Trishien). Kirien/Kindrie? Plausible ([[spoiler:and eventually canon]]). Kirien/Jame? Plausible.
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*OneTrueThreesome: Considering Jame, Torisen, and Kindrie are already a PowerTrio, it's really no surprise that some would be happy to see Kindrie included too.
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* LauncherOfAThousandShips: Kirien is awesome and likable in a kind of general, adaptable way. Kirien/Jame? Plausible. Kirien/Tori? Plausible (and pointed out by Trishien). Kirien/Kindrie? Plausible (and [[spoiler:eventually canon]].

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* LauncherOfAThousandShips: Kirien is awesome and likable in a kind of general, adaptable way. Kirien/Jame? Plausible. Kirien/Tori? Plausible (and pointed out by Trishien). Kirien/Kindrie? Plausible (and [[spoiler:eventually canon]].([[spoiler:and eventually canon]]).

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* CompleteMonster: [[TheHeavy Gerridon]], in the distant backstory, was the [[FallenHero greatest leader of the people]], Highlord of the Kencyrath and Master of Knorth, but he would go down in history as [[TheParagonAlwaysRebels their greatest traitor]]. Desiring {{immortality|Immorality}}—in a MartyrdomCulture--and bitter that the [[HaveYouSeenMyGod absent]] Three-Faced God wouldn't grant it to him, he sold the souls of his race to their [[BigBad ancient enemy]], [[EldritchAbomination Perimal Darkling]], in exchange for eternal life and manipulated his twin sister Jamethiel Dream-Weaver into reaping them for him. This betrayal would not only destroy two-thirds of the Kencyrath, but leave scars in their collective psyche that would linger for millennia. When Gerridon's immortality began to fail him he sought out various means of sustaining it, including attempting to create a child of his or Jamethiel's blood to take over as Dream-Weaver--by rape if necessary--and taking command of an ancient religious sect and whipping them into a fanatical fervor in which they [[ColdBloodedTorture brutally tortured]] hundreds of Kencyr prisoners of war, including Gerridon's own nephew, in an attempt to force them to convert. Driven solely by his selfish desire for immortality, Gerridon will sacrifice anyone and anything--including his own blood-kin--to save himself and prolong his life. Not not only did he betray his people and his god, but he plans to do the same to his "master" Perimal Darkling, if he can find a way to maintain his immortality outside of its control; his pride rankles at the thought of being subordinate to anyone or anything. As his niece [[TheProtagonist Lady Jamethiel Priest's-bane of Knorth]] (Jame) observes, there is nothing Gerridon won't do to keep on living and to avoid paying the karmic price for his long-ago betrayal, and his remains a unique and infamous position in the long annals of the Kencyrath's history.

to:

* CompleteMonster: [[TheHeavy Gerridon]], in the distant backstory, was the [[FallenHero greatest leader of the people]], Highlord of the Kencyrath and Master of Knorth, but he would go down in history as [[TheParagonAlwaysRebels their greatest traitor]]. Desiring {{immortality|Immorality}}—in a MartyrdomCulture--and bitter that the [[HaveYouSeenMyGod absent]] Three-Faced God wouldn't grant it to him, he sold the souls of his race to their [[BigBad ancient enemy]], [[EldritchAbomination Perimal Darkling]], in exchange for eternal life and manipulated his twin sister Jamethiel Dream-Weaver into reaping them for him. This betrayal would not only destroy two-thirds of the Kencyrath, but leave scars in their collective psyche that would linger for millennia. When Gerridon's immortality began to fail him he sought out various means of sustaining it, including attempting to create a child of his or Jamethiel's blood to take over as Dream-Weaver--by rape if necessary--and taking command of an ancient religious sect and whipping them into a fanatical fervor in which they [[ColdBloodedTorture brutally tortured]] hundreds of Kencyr prisoners of war, including Gerridon's own nephew, in an attempt to force them to convert. Driven solely by his selfish desire for immortality, Gerridon will sacrifice anyone and anything--including his own blood-kin--to save himself and prolong his life. Not not only did he betray his people and his god, but he plans to do the same to his "master" Perimal Darkling, if he can find a way to maintain his immortality outside of its control; his pride rankles at the thought of being subordinate to anyone or anything. As his niece [[TheProtagonist Lady Jamethiel Priest's-bane of Knorth]] (Jame) Jame observes, there is nothing Gerridon won't do to keep on living and to avoid paying the karmic price for his long-ago betrayal, and his remains a unique and infamous position in the long annals of the Kencyrath's history.



* HilariousInHindsight: Creator/BaenBooks rescued the series after other publishers fell through... ''Baen--Bane''--as the one to save the day is funny.

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* HilariousInHindsight: Creator/BaenBooks rescued the series after other publishers fell through... ''Baen--Bane''--as through. Baen--''Bane''--being the one to save the day is funny.pretty funny.
*LauncherOfAThousandShips: Kirien is awesome and likable in a kind of general, adaptable way. Kirien/Jame? Plausible. Kirien/Tori? Plausible (and pointed out by Trishien). Kirien/Kindrie? Plausible (and [[spoiler:eventually canon]].

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* CompleteMonster: [[TheHeavy Gerridon]], in the distant backstory, was the [[FallenHero greatest leader of the people]], Highlord of the Kencyrath and Master of Knorth, but he would go down in history as [[TheParagonAlwaysRebels their greatest traitor]]. Desiring {{immortality|Immorality}}—in a MartyrdomCulture--and bitter that the [[HaveYouSeenMyGod absent]] Three-Faced God wouldn't grant it to him, he sold the souls of his race to their [[BigBad ancient enemy]], [[EldritchAbomination Perimal Darkling]], in exchange for eternal life and manipulated his twin sister Jamethiel Dream-Weaver into reaping them for him. This betrayal would not only destroy two-thirds of the Kencyrath, but leave scars in their collective psyche that would linger for millennia. When Gerridon's immortality began to fail him he sought out various means of sustaining it, including attempting to create a child of his or Jamethiel's blood to take over as Dream-Weaver--by rape if necessary--and taking command of an ancient religious sect and whipping them into a fanatical fervor in which they [[ColdBloodedTorture brutally tortured]] hundreds of Kencyr prisoners of war, including Gerridon's own nephew, in an attempt to force them to convert. Driven solely by his selfish desire for immortality, Gerridon will sacrifice anyone and anything--including his own blood-kin--to save himself and prolong his life. Not not only did he betray his people and his god, but he plans to do the same to his "master" Perimal Darkling, if he can find a way to maintain his immortality outside of its control; his pride rankles at the thought of being subordinate to anyone or anything. As his niece [[TheHero Jame]] observes, there is nothing Gerridon won't do to keep on living and to avoid paying the karmic price for his long-ago betrayal, and his remains a unique and infamous position in the long annals of the Kencyrath's history.

to:

* CompleteMonster: [[TheHeavy Gerridon]], in the distant backstory, was the [[FallenHero greatest leader of the people]], Highlord of the Kencyrath and Master of Knorth, but he would go down in history as [[TheParagonAlwaysRebels their greatest traitor]]. Desiring {{immortality|Immorality}}—in a MartyrdomCulture--and bitter that the [[HaveYouSeenMyGod absent]] Three-Faced God wouldn't grant it to him, he sold the souls of his race to their [[BigBad ancient enemy]], [[EldritchAbomination Perimal Darkling]], in exchange for eternal life and manipulated his twin sister Jamethiel Dream-Weaver into reaping them for him. This betrayal would not only destroy two-thirds of the Kencyrath, but leave scars in their collective psyche that would linger for millennia. When Gerridon's immortality began to fail him he sought out various means of sustaining it, including attempting to create a child of his or Jamethiel's blood to take over as Dream-Weaver--by rape if necessary--and taking command of an ancient religious sect and whipping them into a fanatical fervor in which they [[ColdBloodedTorture brutally tortured]] hundreds of Kencyr prisoners of war, including Gerridon's own nephew, in an attempt to force them to convert. Driven solely by his selfish desire for immortality, Gerridon will sacrifice anyone and anything--including his own blood-kin--to save himself and prolong his life. Not not only did he betray his people and his god, but he plans to do the same to his "master" Perimal Darkling, if he can find a way to maintain his immortality outside of its control; his pride rankles at the thought of being subordinate to anyone or anything. As his niece [[TheHero Jame]] [[TheProtagonist Lady Jamethiel Priest's-bane of Knorth]] (Jame) observes, there is nothing Gerridon won't do to keep on living and to avoid paying the karmic price for his long-ago betrayal, and his remains a unique and infamous position in the long annals of the Kencyrath's history.

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Approved by the thread.

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*CompleteMonster: [[TheHeavy Gerridon]], in the distant backstory, was the [[FallenHero greatest leader of the people]], Highlord of the Kencyrath and Master of Knorth, but he would go down in history as [[TheParagonAlwaysRebels their greatest traitor]]. Desiring {{immortality|Immorality}}—in a MartyrdomCulture--and bitter that the [[HaveYouSeenMyGod absent]] Three-Faced God wouldn't grant it to him, he sold the souls of his race to their [[BigBad ancient enemy]], [[EldritchAbomination Perimal Darkling]], in exchange for eternal life and manipulated his twin sister Jamethiel Dream-Weaver into reaping them for him. This betrayal would not only destroy two-thirds of the Kencyrath, but leave scars in their collective psyche that would linger for millennia. When Gerridon's immortality began to fail him he sought out various means of sustaining it, including attempting to create a child of his or Jamethiel's blood to take over as Dream-Weaver--by rape if necessary--and taking command of an ancient religious sect and whipping them into a fanatical fervor in which they [[ColdBloodedTorture brutally tortured]] hundreds of Kencyr prisoners of war, including Gerridon's own nephew, in an attempt to force them to convert. Driven solely by his selfish desire for immortality, Gerridon will sacrifice anyone and anything--including his own blood-kin--to save himself and prolong his life. Not not only did he betray his people and his god, but he plans to do the same to his "master" Perimal Darkling, if he can find a way to maintain his immortality outside of its control; his pride rankles at the thought of being subordinate to anyone or anything. As his niece [[TheHero Jame]] observes, there is nothing Gerridon won't do to keep on living and to avoid paying the karmic price for his long-ago betrayal, and his remains a unique and infamous position in the long annals of the Kencyrath's history.
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** Rawneth is described as darkly seductive in the very best FemmeFatale way, especially in the short story and flashbacks that take place in Ganth's youth.

to:

** Rawneth is described as darkly seductive in the very best FemmeFatale way, especially in the short story and flashbacks that take place in Ganth's youth.

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De-wicking Flame Bait trope


* SuetifulAllAlong: Jame is, as even fans must admit, mightily close to MarySue, and the author has admitted that the character originated as her "dark alter ego". Jame herself honestly doesn't think she's all that special in most ways, and this is believably written, but it's obvious that to an unbiased observer she is beautiful, if a little unconventional, and her list of abilities and accomplishments is as long as your arm. If you run her through almost any online Mary Sue Test you care to name, she rates in the "Kill it, now!" level of Sue-dom. It's a testament to Hodgell's ability to write that she gets away with it.
** However, unlike most Sues Jame actually has to work for the respect of others and is lucky if that respect comes along with affection of any sort. Also, Sueness can be justified due to the whole [[spoiler:god in the making]].
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* HilariousInHindsight: Creator/BaenBooks rescued the series after other publishers fell through... ''Baen, Bane...''

to:

* HilariousInHindsight: Creator/BaenBooks rescued the series after other publishers fell through... ''Baen, Bane...''''Baen--Bane''--as the one to save the day is funny.

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* LawfulGood: Immalai the Silent.
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*HilariousInHindsight: Creator/BaenBooks rescued the series after other publishers fell through... ''Baen, Bane...''


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** When Gorbel's foot is infected with the willow. The idea of that, and the imagery, just really freaked me out.
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** Also Kallystine, in very different way. While Rawneth is sexy in a way that knowing {{exploit|edTrope}}s EvilIsSexy, Kallystine doesn't, and so she comes off very differently--like something overly-sweet with a bad aftertaste.

to:

** Also Kallystine, in very different way. While Rawneth is sexy in a FemmeFatale way that knowing knowingly {{exploit|edTrope}}s EvilIsSexy, Kallystine doesn't, and so she comes off very differently--like something overly-sweet with a bad aftertaste.



* MoralEventHorizon: How Gerridon became immortal in the Backstory. Jamethiel Dream-Weaver may have committed the actual soul-reaping, but it was Gerridon's idea and he was the one who benefited, so it counts as his crossing more so than hers.

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* MoralEventHorizon: How Gerridon became immortal in the Backstory.backstory. Jamethiel Dream-Weaver may have committed the actual soul-reaping, but it was Gerridon's idea and he was the one who benefited, so it counts as his crossing more so than hers.



* SituationalSexuality: In the Women's World. Whether or not sister-kinship would exist if the Kencyr Society didn't work so hard to separate and/or make enemies of the sexes is unknown to all but the author.

to:

* SituationalSexuality: In the Women's World. Whether or not sister-kinship would exist if the Kencyr Society society didn't work so hard to separate and/or make enemies of the sexes is unknown to all but the author.



** It is also possible that some might be squicked by the relative commonness and casual acceptance of [[IncestIsRelative incest]], especially among the Highborn families [[spoiler:not to mention the increasing hints that {{Twincest}} is in Jame and Tori's future. It's one thing when your villains are incestuous, but quite another when it seems predestined for your hero and heroine!]]

to:

** It is also possible that some might be squicked by the relative commonness and casual acceptance of [[IncestIsRelative incest]], especially among the Highborn families [[spoiler:not to mention the increasing hints that {{Twincest}} is in Jame and Tori's future. It's one thing when your [[VillainousIncest villains are incestuous, incestuous]], but quite another when it seems predestined for your hero and heroine!]]



** However, unlike most Sues Jame actually has to work for the respect of others and is lucky if that respect comes along with affection of any sort. Also, Sueness can be justified due to the whole [[spoiler: god in the making]].

to:

** However, unlike most Sues Jame actually has to work for the respect of others and is lucky if that respect comes along with affection of any sort. Also, Sueness can be justified due to the whole [[spoiler: god [[spoiler:god in the making]].

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* EvilIsSexy: Rawneth is described as darkly seductive in the very best FemmeFatale way, especially in the short story and flashbacks that take place in Ganth's youth. Also Kallystine.

to:

* EvilIsSexy: Rawneth EvilIsSexy:
**Rawneth
is described as darkly seductive in the very best FemmeFatale way, especially in the short story and flashbacks that take place in Ganth's youth. Also Kallystine.youth.
**Also Kallystine, in very different way. While Rawneth is sexy in a way that knowing {{exploit|edTrope}}s EvilIsSexy, Kallystine doesn't, and so she comes off very differently--like something overly-sweet with a bad aftertaste.

Added: 4

Changed: 24

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* EvilIsSexy -- Rawneth is described as darkly seductive in the very best FemmeFatale way, especially in the short story and flashbacks that take place in Ganth's youth. Also Kallystine.

to:

* EvilIsSexy -- EvilIsSexy: Rawneth is described as darkly seductive in the very best FemmeFatale way, especially in the short story and flashbacks that take place in Ganth's youth. Also Kallystine.



* MoralEventHorizon -- How Gerridon became immortal in the Backstory. Jamethiel Dream-Weaver may have committed the actual soul-reaping, but it was Gerridon's idea and he was the one who benefited, so it counts as his crossing more so than hers.
* NightmareFuel -- The description of day-to-day life in Ganth's place of exile (mostly in the short stories) [[spoiler:where the vegetables were animate and there was so little meat that one of the guards resorted to cutting off and eating his own toes. And the way Ganth's horse died and became a haunt--and wasn't all that different personality-wise?]] Perhaps the [[{{Squick}} squickiest]] part was not so much the description of the things themselves, but the way Jame and Tori and all the others accepted them as a part of their "normal" life.
* SituationalSexuality -- In the Women's World. Whether or not sister-kinship would exist if the Kencyr Society didn't work so hard to separate and/or make enemies of the sexes is unknown to all but the author.
* {{Squick}} -- As much horror imagery as there is in the series, there is bound to be ''something'' that will squick you. (See NightmareFuel above.)

to:

* MoralEventHorizon -- MoralEventHorizon: How Gerridon became immortal in the Backstory. Jamethiel Dream-Weaver may have committed the actual soul-reaping, but it was Gerridon's idea and he was the one who benefited, so it counts as his crossing more so than hers.
* NightmareFuel -- NightmareFuel: The description of day-to-day life in Ganth's place of exile (mostly in the short stories) [[spoiler:where the vegetables were animate and there was so little meat that one of the guards resorted to cutting off and eating his own toes. And the way Ganth's horse died and became a haunt--and wasn't all that different personality-wise?]] Perhaps the [[{{Squick}} squickiest]] part was not so much the description of the things themselves, but the way Jame and Tori and all the others accepted them as a part of their "normal" life.
* SituationalSexuality -- SituationalSexuality: In the Women's World. Whether or not sister-kinship would exist if the Kencyr Society didn't work so hard to separate and/or make enemies of the sexes is unknown to all but the author.
* {{Squick}} -- {{Squick}}: As much horror imagery as there is in the series, there is bound to be ''something'' that will squick you. (See NightmareFuel above.)



* SuetifulAllAlong -- Jame is, as even fans must admit, mightily close to MarySue, and the author has admitted that the character originated as her "dark alter ego". Jame herself honestly doesn't think she's all that special in most ways, and this is believably written, but it's obvious that to an unbiased observer she is beautiful, if a little unconventional, and her list of abilities and accomplishments is as long as your arm. If you run her through almost any online Mary Sue Test you care to name, she rates in the "Kill it, now!" level of Sue-dom. It's a testament to Hodgell's ability to write that she gets away with it.
** However, unlike most Sues Jame actually has to work for the respect of others and is lucky if that respect comes along with affection of any sort. Also, Sueness can be justified due to the whole [[spoiler: god in the making]].

to:

* SuetifulAllAlong -- SuetifulAllAlong: Jame is, as even fans must admit, mightily close to MarySue, and the author has admitted that the character originated as her "dark alter ego". Jame herself honestly doesn't think she's all that special in most ways, and this is believably written, but it's obvious that to an unbiased observer she is beautiful, if a little unconventional, and her list of abilities and accomplishments is as long as your arm. If you run her through almost any online Mary Sue Test you care to name, she rates in the "Kill it, now!" level of Sue-dom. It's a testament to Hodgell's ability to write that she gets away with it.
** However, unlike most Sues Jame actually has to work for the respect of others and is lucky if that respect comes along with affection of any sort. Also, Sueness can be justified due to the whole [[spoiler: god in the making]].making]].
----
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* SituationalSexuality -- In the Women's World. Whether or not sister-kinship would exist if the Kencyr Society didn't work so hard to separate and/or make enemies of the sexes is unknown to all but the author.
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** However, unlike most Sues Jame actually has to work for the respect of others and is lucky if that respect comes along with affection of any sort. Also, Sueness can be justified due to the whole [[soiler: god in the making]].

to:

** However, unlike most Sues Jame actually has to work for the respect of others and is lucky if that respect comes along with affection of any sort. Also, Sueness can be justified due to the whole [[soiler: [[spoiler: god in the making]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* SuetifulAllAlong -- Jame is, as even fans must admit, mightily close to MarySue, and the author has admitted that the character originated as her "dark alter ego". Jame herself honestly doesn't think she's all that special in most ways, and this is believably written, but it's obvious that to an unbiased observer she is beautiful, if a little unconventional, and her list of abilities and accomplishments is as long as your arm. If you run her through almost any online Mary Sue Test you care to name, she rates in the "Kill it, now!" level of Sue-dom. It's a testament to Hodgell's ability to write that she gets away with it.

to:

* SuetifulAllAlong -- Jame is, as even fans must admit, mightily close to MarySue, and the author has admitted that the character originated as her "dark alter ego". Jame herself honestly doesn't think she's all that special in most ways, and this is believably written, but it's obvious that to an unbiased observer she is beautiful, if a little unconventional, and her list of abilities and accomplishments is as long as your arm. If you run her through almost any online Mary Sue Test you care to name, she rates in the "Kill it, now!" level of Sue-dom. It's a testament to Hodgell's ability to write that she gets away with it.it.
** However, unlike most Sues Jame actually has to work for the respect of others and is lucky if that respect comes along with affection of any sort. Also, Sueness can be justified due to the whole [[soiler: god in the making]].

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This page is not about you. NEVER use \"this troper\" when writing for the wiki. Ever. Also, Nightmare Fuel no longer has an octane level, never refer to \"above\" or \"below\" examples (tropes are re-named and re-alphabetised all the time), and double curly braces are only required around single-word trope names (and are doubly redundant if the trope is being potholed to from another phrase).


* HighOctaneNightmareFuel -- Since this is a Victorian fantasy/horror novel, ''so, so much of it''.
** The part that always got to this troper was the description of day-to-day life in Ganth's place of exile (mostly in the short stories) [[spoiler:where the vegetables were animate and there was so little meat that one of the guards resorted to cutting off and eating his own toes. And the way Ganth's horse died and became a haunt--and wasn't all that different personality-wise?]] Perhaps the [[{{Squick}} squickiest]] part was not so much the description of the things themselves, but the way Jame and Tori and all the others accepted them as a part of their "normal" life.



* {{Squick}} -- As much horror imagery as there is in the series, there is bound to be ''something'' that will squick you. (See {{HighOctaneNightmareFuel}} above.)
** It is also possible that some might be squicked by the relative commonness and casual acceptance of [[{{IncestIsRelative}} incest]], especially among the Highborn families [[spoiler:not to mention the increasing hints that {{Twincest}} is in Jame and Tori's future. It's one thing when your villains are incestuous, but quite another when it seems predestined for your hero and heroine!]]

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* NightmareFuel -- The description of day-to-day life in Ganth's place of exile (mostly in the short stories) [[spoiler:where the vegetables were animate and there was so little meat that one of the guards resorted to cutting off and eating his own toes. And the way Ganth's horse died and became a haunt--and wasn't all that different personality-wise?]] Perhaps the [[{{Squick}} squickiest]] part was not so much the description of the things themselves, but the way Jame and Tori and all the others accepted them as a part of their "normal" life.
* {{Squick}} -- As much horror imagery as there is in the series, there is bound to be ''something'' that will squick you. (See {{HighOctaneNightmareFuel}} NightmareFuel above.)
** It is also possible that some might be squicked by the relative commonness and casual acceptance of [[{{IncestIsRelative}} [[IncestIsRelative incest]], especially among the Highborn families [[spoiler:not to mention the increasing hints that {{Twincest}} is in Jame and Tori's future. It's one thing when your villains are incestuous, but quite another when it seems predestined for your hero and heroine!]]
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* MoralEventHorizon -- How Gerridon became immortal in the Backstory. Jamethiel Dream-Weaver may have committed the actual soul-reaping, but it was Gerridon's idea and he was the one who benefited, so it counts as his crossing more so than hers.
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* LawfulGood: Immalai the Silent.

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