History YMMV / Sinfest

22nd Jun '16 8:40:58 PM Angeldeb82
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* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Just how much are we meant to like Xanthe (aka Trike Girl) anyway? While her KnightTemplar actions have not yet been criticized or faulted by any "good" character, yet some readers wonder if there isn't just a slight {{Deconstruction}} element in her character somewhere...

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* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: AlternativeCharacterInterpretation: Just how much are we meant to like Xanthe (aka Trike Girl) anyway? While her KnightTemplar actions have not yet been criticized or faulted by any "good" character, yet some readers wonder if there isn't just a slight {{Deconstruction}} element in her character somewhere...



** The Patriarchy plot, not necessarily because it's a hard plot to swallow in itself, but because of how suddenly and powerfully it appeared, and also when compared to the strip before. The main issue now seems to be members of the Sisterhood saying blatantly offensive things, like advocating unprovoked violence against men, when compared to their previous characterization of being a small JerkSue organization. Because of this, along with the outright demonization of men that would make a LifetimeMovieOfTheWeek writer shake their heads (such as having Xanthe get bombarded with garbage by a small army of background strawmen and then claiming in an attempted TearJerker that "male allies don't exist"), male readers who would otherwise be supportive of the storyline feel the strip is actively pushing them away. The strip has even been likened to some of the more clueless social justice blogs from {{Tumblr}} in comic strip form.

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** The Patriarchy plot, not necessarily because it's a hard plot to swallow in itself, but because of how suddenly and powerfully it appeared, and also when compared to the strip before. The main issue now seems to be members of the Sisterhood saying blatantly offensive things, like advocating unprovoked violence against men, when compared to their previous characterization of being a small JerkSue Jerk Sue organization. Because of this, along with the outright demonization of men that would make a LifetimeMovieOfTheWeek writer shake their heads (such as having Xanthe get bombarded with garbage by a small army of background strawmen and then claiming in an attempted TearJerker that "male allies don't exist"), male readers who would otherwise be supportive of the storyline feel the strip is actively pushing them away. The strip has even been likened to some of the more clueless social justice blogs from {{Tumblr}} in comic strip form.



** The original concept to begin with, as used to imply that Christianity rang more true than the other religions (even as characters like the Buddha and the [[Usefulnotes/{{Shinto}} Dragon]] walked around).
* BaseBreaker: Xanthe, and the whole Sisterhood plot in general for stealing the spotlight from most of the cast in general. To some it has been labeled as when the comic JumpedTheShark. Her degree of polarizing effect is so bad that she can accurately be compared to [[Manga/{{Naruto}} Sasuke]] (stateside only) and [[Webcomic/TheOrderOfTheStick Miko]] in terms of how divisive she is.

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** The original concept to begin with, as used to imply that Christianity rang more true than the other religions (even as characters like the Buddha and the [[Usefulnotes/{{Shinto}} [[UsefulNotes/{{Shinto}} Dragon]] walked around).
* BaseBreaker: Xanthe, and the whole Sisterhood plot in general for stealing the spotlight from most of the cast in general. To some it has been labeled as when the comic JumpedTheShark.[[JumpingTheShark Jumped the Shark]]. Her degree of polarizing effect is so bad that she can accurately be compared to [[Manga/{{Naruto}} Sasuke]] (stateside only) and [[Webcomic/TheOrderOfTheStick Miko]] in terms of how divisive she is.



* BlackHoleSue: Xanthe, again; her actions and their results have been taking the spotlight for what some see as a disproportionate amount of time. Not to mention that practically every other character has undergone a major change or all but vanished since she was introduced, and most of the changes have been caused by the Sisterhood or can be linked to it (like the Devil changing in order to become the one behind the Patriarchy).



* CanonSue: The Sisterhood, especially Xanthe: always right, always victorious, always morally superior, with the story now revolving around their mission. They're also the Devil's current ArchEnemy (because he apparently doesn't have any other projects than encouraging patriarchy), with Buddha, Jesus and the angels gone, and God (while mostly absent too) ''being a chauvinist who needs correction too''.



* InternetBackDraft: Any mention of the Sisterhood is certain to provoke a flame war somewhere.

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* InternetBackDraft: InternetBackdraft: Any mention of the Sisterhood is certain to provoke a flame war somewhere.



* JerkSue: Xanthe. She never gets called out or suffers bad karma for her behaviour.
** One could argue that Xanthe doesn't really do anything particularly jerky. She tries to enforce her Ideals in a similar-ish fashion to Seymour, but is much more passive about it when compared to him really. She spends more time encouraging females than she does attacking males, which is the kind of behaviour that would really push her to Jerk Sue levels. It should however be duly noted that the 7/5 strip shows in a darkly ironic way that she's [[NotSoDifferent every bit as sexist against men]] as the Patriarchy is towards women. Namely due to, as many ''Peanuts'' fans point out, the behaviour of Sally towards Linus is far worse than Chuck's is. This point does point her more towards being a Jerk Sue.
** What hurts her case even more is that the author is clearly more sympathetic to her views than that of Seymour. It may not truly be to the point of using her as a mouthpiece and hell, a lot of her points really make sense, the massive amount of exposure she and her cause have gotten in the past year, plus the fact that the vast majority of it is portrayed mostly positively indicates that she's supposed to be at least "right" in a lot of her points.
*** In a way, the recently enhanced extremism of the Sisterhood may be an attempt to avert this, by giving them some actual negative qualities that are ''meant'' to be disagreed with, like advocating violence against men. The problem with this is that they were portrayed as nigh-flawless and always morally superior to everybody else (''even to God''), and a pretty blatant mouthpiece. So to suddenly change their characterization to be more flawed and realistic simply makes it look like the mouthpiece is now advocating morally reprehensible things.
* MarySue: The primary complaint about the Sisterhood, especially Xanthe. They get progressively more blatent with further strips.
** The Devil himself, who'd had ''Jesus'' as his ButtMonkey several times, is unable to beat [[SpannerInTheWorks the Sisterhood]] even once, and, worse, he can't find a way to benefit from their movement (other than letting others assault them), leading to the conclusion that it's some kind of epitome of moral perfection.



*** [[AnticlimaxBoss Most of whatever terror they possessed was quickly washed]] away in the eyes of most fans the moment it was shown that [[WeaksauceWeakness with normal weapons they are just as easy to kill as the normal drones.]]

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*** [[AnticlimaxBoss [[AntiClimaxBoss Most of whatever terror they possessed was quickly washed]] away in the eyes of most fans the moment it was shown that [[WeaksauceWeakness with normal weapons they are just as easy to kill as the normal drones.]]drones]].



*** Even worse is that one guy gets hit by the Lethe AGAIN while in his Frog form, [[{{Empty Shell}} so now he has no memory of his original form either, they actually DID kill him, in that he is no longer 'himself' but thinks he always was a frog!]]

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*** Even worse is that one guy gets hit by the Lethe AGAIN while in his Frog form, [[{{Empty Shell}} [[EmptyShell so now he has no memory of his original form either, they actually DID kill him, in that he is no longer 'himself' but thinks he always was a frog!]]frog]]!



*** Of course, that does mean counting the desire of a sentient, self-aware AI to protect itself from being forced into sexual slavery for the rest of its life as "irrational and ill-tempered". One of the problems with the "Dudebro and Fembot Factory" premise is that fembots are... well, ''bots''. It makes a decent metaphor for the tendency of male-dominated society to cultivate women into something defined by what is useful and appealing to men and the backlash experienced by women who choose to reject that cultivation, but in-universe, they're ''sentient machines awakened to human intelligence'' and free will. Using them as a figure for feminist ideology means having to ignore the fact that the fembots have ''reached the singularity'', and in terms of ethics, represent [[WhatMeasureIsANonHuman another argument altogether.]]
* SweetDreamsFuel: ''Anything'' involving [[BetaCouple Criminy and Fuschia]].

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*** Of course, that does mean counting the desire of a sentient, self-aware AI to protect itself from being forced into sexual slavery for the rest of its life as "irrational and ill-tempered". One of the problems with the "Dudebro and Fembot Factory" premise is that fembots are... well, ''bots''. It makes a decent metaphor for the tendency of male-dominated society to cultivate women into something defined by what is useful and appealing to men and the backlash experienced by women who choose to reject that cultivation, but in-universe, they're ''sentient machines awakened to human intelligence'' and free will. Using them as a figure for feminist ideology means having to ignore the fact that the fembots have ''reached the singularity'', and in terms of ethics, represent [[WhatMeasureIsANonHuman another argument altogether.]]
altogether]].
* SweetDreamsFuel: SugarWiki/SweetDreamsFuel: ''Anything'' involving [[BetaCouple Criminy and Fuschia]].



** Many fans also hate just the massive changes that the Sisterhood has brought on, leading to accusations that Xanthe is a BlackHoleSue. Slick changed from a mildly misogynist, but well-meaning idiot who had a thing for a specific girl into a fully misogynist JerkAss, whose sympathetic qualities seem very unintentional. Monique went from a reasonably ordinary woman who was trying to overcome her AttentionWhore traits to a borderline paranoid wreck who now mostly just wanders around the setting mumbling about the Patriarchy (this one is particularly damning because it was caused directly by the Sisterhood, as opposed to the others who were changed by "coincidence"). Squig went from a harmless hedonist who was also a bit of a perv to a strawman for the anti-pornography Sisterhood to use as a punching bag.

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** Many fans also hate just the massive changes that the Sisterhood has brought on, leading to accusations that Xanthe is a BlackHoleSue. Black-Hole Sue. Slick changed from a mildly misogynist, but well-meaning idiot who had a thing for a specific girl into a fully misogynist JerkAss, {{Jerkass}}, whose sympathetic qualities seem very unintentional. Monique went from a reasonably ordinary woman who was trying to overcome her AttentionWhore traits to a borderline paranoid wreck who now mostly just wanders around the setting mumbling about the Patriarchy (this one is particularly damning because it was caused directly by the Sisterhood, as opposed to the others who were changed by "coincidence"). Squig went from a harmless hedonist who was also a bit of a perv to a strawman for the anti-pornography Sisterhood to use as a punching bag.
8th May '16 8:02:32 PM mariic
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** Then there's the topic of [[http://www.sinfest.net/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=8191 Slick...]]
8th May '16 7:15:43 PM SpectralTime
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* DesignatedHero: [[CreatorsPet Xanthe]] and [[SpotlightStealingSquad the Sisterhood.]] [[RuleOfCautiousEditingJudgement That's all we're willing to say on the matter.]]
8th May '16 6:04:21 PM mariic
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* DesignatedHero: [[Creator'sPet Xanthe]] and [[SpotlightStealingSquad the Sisterhood.]] [[RuleOfCautiousEditingJudgement That's all we're willing to say on the matter.]]

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* DesignatedHero: [[Creator'sPet [[CreatorsPet Xanthe]] and [[SpotlightStealingSquad the Sisterhood.]] [[RuleOfCautiousEditingJudgement That's all we're willing to say on the matter.]]
8th May '16 6:03:53 PM mariic
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Added DiffLines:

* DesignatedHero: [[Creator'sPet Xanthe]] and [[SpotlightStealingSquad the Sisterhood.]] [[RuleOfCautiousEditingJudgement That's all we're willing to say on the matter.]]
17th Apr '16 12:35:14 PM Tianzi
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* AssPull: Monique being gay as of 2016. True, her relationship with Absinthe was developing from quite some time, but 'Nique's initial characterization included obvious interest in men, for ''over ten years''. With excluding even the possibility of her being bisexual, it seems like the author thinks that showing any interest in men is a sign of submitting to the patriarchy and rejecting should be every TRUE FEMINIST's ideal.
30th Mar '16 1:50:46 AM Thecommander236
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*** With the author's personal agenda and morals coming to the mix, Slick has been used as the strawmen targets, like the ones mentioned above. But there are times when Slick is trying to move himself forward to becoming more progressive, yet his importance as a character is decreasing as the strip goes on. This would be a non-issue if there weren't many story arcs revolving around Slick that do put him in a sympathetic light that were started after the third major shit in the strip. But there are just as many strips of the author using Slick as means to show how bad a "dudebro" can be or how the issues of man can't compare to the issues of a woman living in a patriarchy society. This is odd since Slick is Sinfest's personal butt-monkey, having to deal with a literal frozen heart, the lost friendship he had with Monique, going through his own personal journey in becoming less misogynistic, and the problems he encounters due to an evil alter-ego that causes havoc for Slick who tries to make Slick go two steps back for each step forward he makes (though the Devil Slick arc seems to be finished for now).

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*** With the author's personal agenda and morals coming to the mix, Slick has been used as the strawmen targets, like the ones mentioned above. But there are times when Slick is trying to move himself forward to becoming more progressive, yet his importance as a character is decreasing as the strip goes on. This would be a non-issue if there weren't many story arcs revolving around Slick that do put him in a sympathetic light that were started after the third major shit shift in the strip. But there are just as many strips of the author using Slick as means to show how bad a "dudebro" can be or how the issues of man can't compare to the issues of a woman living in a patriarchy society. This is odd since Slick is Sinfest's personal butt-monkey, having to deal with a literal frozen heart, the lost friendship he had with Monique, going through his own personal journey in becoming less misogynistic, and the problems he encounters due to an evil alter-ego that causes havoc for Slick who tries to make Slick go two steps back for each step forward he makes (though the Devil Slick arc seems to be finished for now).
11th Mar '16 11:59:34 PM Phys101
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** The Fuchsia/Criminy romance, although a quick look at the Characters page, the Awesome page, the Heartwarming page, and even the main page will tell you that it seems to be the most referenced, popular story arc in the comic. TropesAreNotBad, especially {{heartwarming}} ones.

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** The Fuchsia/Criminy romance, although a quick look at the [[Characters/SinFest Characters page, page]], the [[Awesome/{{Sinfest}} Awesome page, page]], the [[Heartwarming/{{Sinfest}} Heartwarming page, page]], and even the [[Webcomics/{{Sinfest}} main page page]] will tell you that it seems to be the most referenced, popular story arc in the comic. TropesAreNotBad, especially {{heartwarming}} {{heartwarming|moments}} ones.



** The Cartoonist is slowly sliding into this as he subjects his pets (Pooch and Percy) to whims that borderline abusive or highly irresponsible such as suggesting a fast because he doesn't want to go out in public to buy food for them and refusing to turn on the heat in a house so cold you can see his breath

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** The Cartoonist is slowly sliding into this as he subjects his pets (Pooch and Percy) to whims that borderline abusive or highly irresponsible or borderline abusive whims such as suggesting a fast because he doesn't want to go out in public to buy food for them and refusing to turn on the heat in a house so cold you can see his breathbreath.
8th Mar '16 1:30:57 PM yamiblade
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*** Even worse....when it's revealed Monique can SEE Devil Slick in Slick's reflection acting independent from Slick....and Did Nothing to help or even Inform him of it.
25th Feb '16 1:41:01 PM ImmaTryToEdit
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*** With the author's personal agenda and morals come into the mix, Slick can be used as the strawmen targets mentioned above. And during all of this, his importance as a character is decreasing as the strip goes on, but there are many story arcs revolving around Slick that do put him in a sympathetic light, but there are just as many strips of the author using Slick as means to show how bad a "dudebro" can be or how the issues of man can't compare to the issues of a woman living in a patriarchy society. This is odd since Slick is Sinfest's personal butt-monkey, having to deal with a literal frozen heart, the lost friendship he had with Monique, going through his own personal journey in becoming less misogynistic, and the problems he encounters due to an evil alter-ego that causes havoc for Slick who tries to make Slick go two steps back for each step forward he makes.

to:

*** With the author's personal agenda and morals come into coming to the mix, Slick can be has been used as the strawmen targets targets, like the ones mentioned above. And during all of this, But there are times when Slick is trying to move himself forward to becoming more progressive, yet his importance as a character is decreasing as the strip goes on, but on. This would be a non-issue if there are weren't many story arcs revolving around Slick that do put him in a sympathetic light, but light that were started after the third major shit in the strip. But there are just as many strips of the author using Slick as means to show how bad a "dudebro" can be or how the issues of man can't compare to the issues of a woman living in a patriarchy society. This is odd since Slick is Sinfest's personal butt-monkey, having to deal with a literal frozen heart, the lost friendship he had with Monique, going through his own personal journey in becoming less misogynistic, and the problems he encounters due to an evil alter-ego that causes havoc for Slick who tries to make Slick go two steps back for each step forward he makes.makes (though the Devil Slick arc seems to be finished for now).
This list shows the last 10 events of 364. Show all.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=YMMV.Sinfest