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** The "Fem Hulk" form, a {{gonk}}y She-Hulk more in line with She-Thing in terms of physical appearance (aka "The Hulk with Boobs"), that Jen developed as a result of the aforementioned "Gray Savage Hulk" storyline is a highly contentious angle. It has its hardcore defenders, often rallying around the idea that She-Hulk's original design was sexist, but also a large and vocal {{hatedom}}, whose complaints range from disapproval of the {{gonk}}y design to those who argue that it makes no sense, since She-Hulk is supposed to be an embodiment of Jennifer's repressed desires and wishes, rather than an expression of pent-up rage and self-loathing like her cousin.[[note]]In a nutshell, Hulk is Bruce's inner monster, embodying his repressed anger and sorrow; She-Hulk was conceived of as Jennifer's inner ''bombshell'', the confident, sexual and fearless woman she always wanted to be. The two are very different base concepts, so it makes sense that the two forms would look differently.[[/note]]
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** The "Fem Hulk" form, a {{gonk}}y She-Hulk more in line with She-Thing in terms of physical appearance (aka "The Hulk with Boobs"), that Jen developed as a result of the aforementioned "Gray Savage Hulk" storyline is a highly contentious angle. It has its hardcore defenders, often rallying around the idea that She-Hulk's original design was sexist, but also a large and vocal {{hatedom}}, whose complaints range from disapproval of the {{gonk}}y design to those who argue that it makes no sense, since She-Hulk is supposed to be an embodiment of Jennifer's repressed desires and wishes, rather than an expression of pent-up rage and self-loathing like her cousin. It didn't help that Aaron himself hit back at his critics in Avengers #20 in an attempt to justify the change in her character.[[note]]In a nutshell, Hulk is Bruce's inner monster, embodying his repressed anger and sorrow; She-Hulk was conceived of as Jennifer's inner ''bombshell'', the confident, sexual and fearless woman she always wanted to be. The two are very different base concepts, so it makes sense that the two forms would look differently.[[/note]]
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Meta/non-character example. Requires 25-year waiting period.
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** Her focus issue in ''ComicBook/TheAvengers (2018) #20'' became ''infamous'' for Jason Aaron's TakeThatCritics {{AuthorTract}}s.
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This is pretty much an exact copy of the entry in the Author Tract page. We've already got a decent chunk of this page made up of criticizing Aaron's take on the character so may as well abbreviate some of it.
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* AuthorTract: ''ComicBook/TheAvengers (2018) #20'' is pretty much an entire issue dedicated to Jason Aaron using Jennifer to [[TakeThatCritics deliver a meta-mockery of everyone who has criticized his run on her]]. The most infamous highlight has to be the sequence where she notes that [[ComicBook/IncredibleHulk Bruce Banner]] once confessed to envying her, because her Hulk form was far less threatening and more socially acceptable than his own deformed and monstrous body -- and she, incensed by it, retorted by complaining to him how her form was less frightening, but she was also the target of constantly being hit on by her allies, lusted after by civilians, exploited by sleazy paparazzi, and groped during her fights with supervillains. The issue literally concludes with her stating that she loves being ugly and scary like Bruce, and she wouldn't go back to her older She-Hulk bodies if she had the choice.
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* AuthorTract: ''ComicBook/TheAvengers (2018) #20'' is pretty much an entire issue dedicated to Jason Aaron using Jennifer to [[TakeThatCritics deliver a meta-mockery of everyone who has criticized his run on her]]. The most infamous highlight has to be the sequence where she notes that [[ComicBook/IncredibleHulk Bruce Banner]] once confessed to envying her, because her Hulk form was far less threatening and more socially acceptable than his own deformed and monstrous body -- and she, incensed by it, retorted by complaining to him how her form was less frightening, but she was also the target of constantly being hit on by her allies, lusted after by civilians, exploited by sleazy paparazzi, and groped during her fights with supervillains. The issue literally concludes with her stating that she loves being ugly and scary like Bruce, and she wouldn't go back to her older She-Hulk bodies if she had the choice.
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** The "Fem Hulk" form, a {{gonk}}y She-Hulk more in line with She-Thing in terms of physical appearance (aka "The Hulk with Boobs"), that Jen developed as a result of the aforementioned "Gray Savage Hulk" storyline is a highly contentious angle. It has its hardcore defenders, often rallying around the idea that She-Hulk's original design was sexist, but also a large and vocal {{hatedom}}, whose complaints range from disapproval of the {{gonk}}y design to those who argue that it makes no sense, since She-Hulk is supposed to be an embodiment of Jennifer's repressed desires and wishes, rather than an expression of pent-up rage and self-loathing like her cousin.
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** The "Fem Hulk" form, a {{gonk}}y She-Hulk more in line with She-Thing in terms of physical appearance (aka "The Hulk with Boobs"), that Jen developed as a result of the aforementioned "Gray Savage Hulk" storyline is a highly contentious angle. It has its hardcore defenders, often rallying around the idea that She-Hulk's original design was sexist, but also a large and vocal {{hatedom}}, whose complaints range from disapproval of the {{gonk}}y design to those who argue that it makes no sense, since She-Hulk is supposed to be an embodiment of Jennifer's repressed desires and wishes, rather than an expression of pent-up rage and self-loathing like her cousin.[[note]]In a nutshell, Hulk is Bruce's inner monster, embodying his repressed anger and sorrow; She-Hulk was conceived of as Jennifer's inner ''bombshell'', the confident, sexual and fearless woman she always wanted to be. The two are very different base concepts, so it makes sense that the two forms would look differently.[[/note]]
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** The "Fem Hulk" era that she entered afterwards under Jason Aaron, if considered separate to the above at all, is regarded just as poorly.
*** This is bordering on WriterRevolt with other authors either refusing to acknowledge Aaron's She-Hulk (Marvel Comics 1000) or snidely commenting on editorial mandates (Gwenpool Strikes Back)
*** This is bordering on WriterRevolt with other authors either refusing to acknowledge Aaron's She-Hulk (Marvel Comics 1000) or snidely commenting on editorial mandates (Gwenpool Strikes Back)
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** The "Fem Hulk" era that she entered afterwards under Jason Aaron, if considered separate to the above at all, is regarded just as poorly.
*** This is bordering onpoorly. Indeed, it has provoked a borderline WriterRevolt at Marvel, with other authors either refusing to acknowledge Aaron's She-Hulk (Marvel Comics 1000) or snidely commenting on editorial mandates (Gwenpool Strikes Back)
*** This is bordering on
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** In ''She-Hulk Volume #2 Issue #4'' of Dan Slott's run, Jennifer declares Bruce Banner has never killed anyone during his Hulk rampages, because if he had he would have committed suicide to keep it from ever happening again. Seven years later in ''Film/{{The Avengers|2012}}'' film Bruce claims that he ''can't'' kill himself, even though he's tried.
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** In ''She-Hulk Volume #2 Issue #4'' of Dan Slott's run, Jennifer declares Bruce Banner has never killed anyone during his Hulk rampages, because if he had he would have committed suicide to keep it from ever happening again. Seven years later in ''Film/{{The Avengers|2012}}'' film Bruce claims that he ''can't'' kill himself, even though he's tried.tried... which was then doubled-down on and made canon to the comics with ''ComicBook/ImmortalHulk''.
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** Many people have called the "Grey Trauma Rage" era that she went through on the aftermath of ''ComicBook/CivilWarII'' this (look up on BrokenBase for specifics).
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** Many people have called the "Grey Trauma Rage" era that she went through on the aftermath of ''ComicBook/CivilWarII'' this (look up on BrokenBase for specifics). Though some see it more favorably than "Fem Hulk" and some saw Tamaki's run as an interesting story about trauma, though debate on whether or not it should have been done with Jen.
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*** This is bordering on Writer Revolt with other authors either refusing to acknowledge Aaron's She-Hulk (Marvel Comics 1000) or snidely commenting on editorial mandates (Gwenpool Strikes Back)
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*** This is bordering on Writer Revolt WriterRevolt with other authors either refusing to acknowledge Aaron's She-Hulk (Marvel Comics 1000) or snidely commenting on editorial mandates (Gwenpool Strikes Back)
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*** This is bordering on AuthorRevolt with other authors either refusing to acknowledge Aaron's She-Hulk like MarvelComics1000 or snidely commenting on editorial mandates like GwenpoolStrikesBack.
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*** This is bordering on AuthorRevolt Writer Revolt with other authors either refusing to acknowledge Aaron's She-Hulk like MarvelComics1000 (Marvel Comics 1000) or snidely commenting on editorial mandates like GwenpoolStrikesBack.(Gwenpool Strikes Back)
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*** This is bordering on AuthorRevolt with other authors either refusing to acknowledge Aaron's She-Hulk like MarvelComics1000 or snidely commenting on editorial mandates like GwenpoolStrikesBack.
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** The "Fem Hulk" form, a {{gonk}}y She-Hulk more in line with She-Thing in terms of physical appearance (aka "The Hulk with Boobs"), that Jen developed as a result of the aforementioned "Gray Savage Hulk" storyline is a highly contentious angle. It has its hardcore defenders, often rallying around the idea that She-Hulk's original design was sexist, but also a large and vocal {{hatedom}}, whose complaints range from disapproval of the {{gonky}} design to those who argue that it makes no sense, since She-Hulk is supposed to be an embodiment of Jennifer's repressed desires and wishes, rather than an expression of pent-up rage and self-loathing like her cousin.
to:
** The "Fem Hulk" form, a {{gonk}}y She-Hulk more in line with She-Thing in terms of physical appearance (aka "The Hulk with Boobs"), that Jen developed as a result of the aforementioned "Gray Savage Hulk" storyline is a highly contentious angle. It has its hardcore defenders, often rallying around the idea that She-Hulk's original design was sexist, but also a large and vocal {{hatedom}}, whose complaints range from disapproval of the {{gonky}} {{gonk}}y design to those who argue that it makes no sense, since She-Hulk is supposed to be an embodiment of Jennifer's repressed desires and wishes, rather than an expression of pent-up rage and self-loathing like her cousin.
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** Her focus issue in ''ComicBook/TheAvengers (2018) #20'' became ''infamous'' for Jason Aaroon's TakeThatCritics AuthorTract antics, and it's going to be quite some time (if ever) before she'll live that down.
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** Her focus issue in ''ComicBook/TheAvengers (2018) #20'' became ''infamous'' for Jason Aaroon's Aaron's TakeThatCritics AuthorTract antics, and it's going to be quite some time (if ever) before she'll live that down. {{AuthorTract}}s.
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We really don't need an entire wall of text explaining or endorsing fan complaints.
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** Her focus issue in ''ComicBook/TheAvengers (2018) #20'' became ''infamous'' for Jason Aaroon's TakeThatCritics AuthorTract antics, and it's going to be quite some time (if ever) before she'll live that down. To wit, people aren't angry about Jennifer complaining about her saying it's better to be bigger and scarier (which is fair given that the supervillains she routinely deals with would have no problem sexually harassing her and the public probably sees her as a MsFanservice superhero InUniverse.) but that Aaroon is completely glossing over what it's like to be Bruce Banner. Aaroon even writes a line about how Bruce agrees with her in a way that seems to imply that the only bad thing about being a hulk is being big and scary. Bruce Banner's life is literal HELL (he even went there in the {{ComicBook/ImmortalHulk}} series) with him having multiple personalities, no real control over his transformations or even his own mind, he destroys and hurts people without meaning too, is constantly on the run from authorities, and no place to call home with most of his friends or loved ones threatened by his mere existence. In spite of the hardships Jen has had to endure in her superheroing life and career, it's absolutely sunshine ans rainbows compared to what happens to [[CosmicChewToy Bruce.]]
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** Her focus issue in ''ComicBook/TheAvengers (2018) #20'' became ''infamous'' for Jason Aaroon's TakeThatCritics AuthorTract antics, and it's going to be quite some time (if ever) before she'll live that down. To wit, people aren't angry about Jennifer complaining about her saying it's better to be bigger and scarier (which is fair given that the supervillains she routinely deals with would have no problem sexually harassing her and the public probably sees her as a MsFanservice superhero InUniverse.) but that Aaroon is completely glossing over what it's like to be Bruce Banner. Aaroon even writes a line about how Bruce agrees with her in a way that seems to imply that the only bad thing about being a hulk is being big and scary. Bruce Banner's life is literal HELL (he even went there in the {{ComicBook/ImmortalHulk}} series) with him having multiple personalities, no real control over his transformations or even his own mind, he destroys and hurts people without meaning too, is constantly on the run from authorities, and no place to call home with most of his friends or loved ones threatened by his mere existence. In spite of the hardships Jen has had to endure in her superheroing life and career, it's absolutely sunshine ans rainbows compared to what happens to [[CosmicChewToy Bruce.]]
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** Her focus issue in ''ComicBook/TheAvengers (2018) #20'' became ''infamous'' for Jason Aaroon's TakeThatCritics AuthorTract antics, and it's going to be quite some time (if ever) before she'll live that down.
to:
** Her focus issue in ''ComicBook/TheAvengers (2018) #20'' became ''infamous'' for Jason Aaroon's TakeThatCritics AuthorTract antics, and it's going to be quite some time (if ever) before she'll live that down. To wit, people aren't angry about Jennifer complaining about her saying it's better to be bigger and scarier (which is fair given that the supervillains she routinely deals with would have no problem sexually harassing her and the public probably sees her as a MsFanservice superhero InUniverse.) but that Aaroon is completely glossing over what it's like to be Bruce Banner. Aaroon even writes a line about how Bruce agrees with her in a way that seems to imply that the only bad thing about being a hulk is being big and scary. Bruce Banner's life is literal HELL (he even went there in the {{ComicBook/ImmortalHulk}} series) with him having multiple personalities, no real control over his transformations or even his own mind, he destroys and hurts people without meaning too, is constantly on the run from authorities, and no place to call home with most of his friends or loved ones threatened by his mere existence. In spite of the hardships Jen has had to endure in her superheroing life and career, it's absolutely sunshine ans rainbows compared to what happens to [[CosmicChewToy Bruce.]]
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*CompleteMonster: ''ComicBook/SheHulk Ceremony (October and November 1989)'': Carlton Beatrice is the [[CorruptCorporateExecutive CEO of Carlton Industries]] who tries to purchase Apache sacred land, Keewazi Reservation, for business purposes. Learning about the Apache people's religious ceremony, Beatrice masters the art of [[YourSoulIsMine soul stealing]]. Learning that he lacks the beneficient energy produced by women, he killed an Apache woman who tried to stop him. Learning that the mystic basket that could expand his powers was in the possession of She-Hulk, Beatrice attempts to persuade her, and when his assistant hurts She-Hulk with his spirits, Beatrice [[BadBoss punishes him by ripping his soul apart]]--not because of any standards, but because [[PragmaticVillainy he needed She-Hulk]] to give the basket to him to harness its power. To this end, he ripped out her fiancé's soul and used it as a bargain to retrieve the basket. After retrieving the basket, Beatrice performs a ritual to consume all of the souls in Earth to gain more power.
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* AuthorTract: ''ComicBook/TheAvengers (2018) #20'' is pretty much an entire issue dedicated to Jason Aaron using Jennifer to [[TakeThatCritics deliver a meta-mockery of everyone who has criticized his run on her]]. The most infamous highlight has to be the sequence where she notes that [[ComicBook/IncredibleHulk Bruce Banner]] once confessed to envying her, because her Hulk form was far less threatening and more socially acceptable than his own deformed and monstrous body -- and she, incensed by it, retorted by complaining to him how her form was less frightening, but she was also the target of constantly being hit on by her allies, lusted after by civilians, exploited by sleazy paparazzi, and groped during her fights with supervillains. The issue literally concludes with her stating that she loves being ugly and scary like Bruce, and she wouldn't go back to her older She-Hulk bodies if she had the choice.
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* DorkAge: Many people have called the "Grey Trauma Rage" era that she went through on the aftermath of ''ComicBook/CivilWarII'' this (look up on BrokenBase for specifics).
to:
** The "Fem Hulk" form, a {{gonk}}y She-Hulk more in line with She-Thing in terms of physical appearance (aka "The Hulk with Boobs"), that Jen developed as a result of the aforementioned "Gray Savage Hulk" storyline is a highly contentious angle. It has its hardcore defenders, often rallying around the idea that She-Hulk's original design was sexist, but also a large and vocal {{hatedom}}, whose complaints range from disapproval of the {{gonky}} design to those who argue that it makes no sense, since She-Hulk is supposed to be an embodiment of Jennifer's repressed desires and wishes, rather than an expression of pent-up rage and self-loathing like her cousin.
*DorkAge: DorkAge:
** Many people have called the "Grey Trauma Rage" era that she went through on the aftermath of ''ComicBook/CivilWarII'' this (look up on BrokenBase forspecifics).specifics).
** The "Fem Hulk" era that she entered afterwards under Jason Aaron, if considered separate to the above at all, is regarded just as poorly.
*
** Many people have called the "Grey Trauma Rage" era that she went through on the aftermath of ''ComicBook/CivilWarII'' this (look up on BrokenBase for
** The "Fem Hulk" era that she entered afterwards under Jason Aaron, if considered separate to the above at all, is regarded just as poorly.
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* NeverLiveItDown: Did someone mention lately that She-Hulk slept with Juggernaut? ([[FlipFlopOfGod Maybe]])
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* NeverLiveItDown: NeverLiveItDown:
** Did someone mention lately that She-Hulk slept with Juggernaut? ([[FlipFlopOfGodMaybe]])Maybe]])
** Her focus issue in ''ComicBook/TheAvengers (2018) #20'' became ''infamous'' for Jason Aaroon's TakeThatCritics AuthorTract antics, and it's going to be quite some time (if ever) before she'll live that down.
** Did someone mention lately that She-Hulk slept with Juggernaut? ([[FlipFlopOfGod
** Her focus issue in ''ComicBook/TheAvengers (2018) #20'' became ''infamous'' for Jason Aaroon's TakeThatCritics AuthorTract antics, and it's going to be quite some time (if ever) before she'll live that down.
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I wanted to replace this image link with a higher quality version so like people checking this out aren't greated with an artifacted mess
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* BrokenBase: Between people who like a [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/-She_hulk_7.jpg more comedic Jen]] (see Dan Slott) or are somewhat more serious (but still funny) [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/She_HulkPAD.gif Jen]] (see Creator/PeterDavid) AND those who like the [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/SavageShe-Hulk.gif original Savage She-Hulk incarnation]] and those that favour the 4th wall breaking [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/SheHulk4thWallBreaker.gif John Byrne era]] insanity... and just to top it off, those that are just in it for the fetish appeal of a female Hulk.
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* BrokenBase: Between people who like a [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/-She_hulk_7.jpg more comedic Jen]] (see Dan Slott) or are somewhat more serious (but still funny) [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/She_HulkPAD.gif Jen]] (see Creator/PeterDavid) AND those who like the [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/SavageShe-Hulk.gif org/pmwiki/pub/images/savage_she_hulk_vol_1_9_small.png original Savage She-Hulk incarnation]] and those that favour the 4th wall breaking [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/SheHulk4thWallBreaker.gif John Byrne era]] insanity... and just to top it off, those that are just in it for the fetish appeal of a female Hulk.
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** Jen losing the "trauma angst Grey Hulk" angle and even getting a power boost to boot... But the trade off is that now Jen loses some intelligence when she is in Hulk mode, even occasionally using HulkSpeak in a non-joking fashion because that's how "articulate" her form has become. Mention this in a forum and stand back because the fireworks will be ''nuclear''.
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* HarsherInHindsight: In ''She-Hulk Volume #2 Issue #4'' of Dan Slott's run, Jennifer declares Bruce Banner has never killed anyone during his Hulk rampages, because if he had he would have committed suicide to keep it from ever happening again. Seven years later in ''Film/{{The Avengers|2012}}'' film Bruce claims that he ''can't'' kill himself, even though he's tried.
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* HarsherInHindsight: HarsherInHindsight:
** In ''She-Hulk Volume #2 Issue #4'' of Dan Slott's run, Jennifer declares Bruce Banner has never killed anyone during his Hulk rampages, because if he had he would have committed suicide to keep it from ever happening again. Seven years later in ''Film/{{The Avengers|2012}}'' film Bruce claims that he ''can't'' kill himself, even though he'stried.tried.
** One of her win quotes against {{ComicBook/Deadpool}} in ''VideoGame/MarvelVsCapcom3'' has her saying that she'll win against Deadpool again if there was ever a ''Marvel VS Capcom 4''. ''VideoGame/MarvelVsCapcomInfinite'' has neither She-Hulk or Deadpool in the final roster.
** In ''She-Hulk Volume #2 Issue #4'' of Dan Slott's run, Jennifer declares Bruce Banner has never killed anyone during his Hulk rampages, because if he had he would have committed suicide to keep it from ever happening again. Seven years later in ''Film/{{The Avengers|2012}}'' film Bruce claims that he ''can't'' kill himself, even though he's
** One of her win quotes against {{ComicBook/Deadpool}} in ''VideoGame/MarvelVsCapcom3'' has her saying that she'll win against Deadpool again if there was ever a ''Marvel VS Capcom 4''. ''VideoGame/MarvelVsCapcomInfinite'' has neither She-Hulk or Deadpool in the final roster.
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** [[spoiler:Jennifer's death on ''ComicBook/CivilWarII''. Made even more raging because it was done by an attack that she has survived before (and her reaction to being hit is borderline {{Narm}}). The whole scene has been argued back and forth (alongside Rhodey's death) as an example of StuffedInTheFridge in order to make Carol's (and Tony's) WellIntentionedExtremist (and TookALevelInJerkass) bent more sympathetic than it was on the first ''ComicBook/CivilWar''. Thankfully, She-Hulk is alive as of Civil War II #4, although she's understandably not happy...]]
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** During ''ComicBook/CivilWarII'', [[spoiler:Jennifer's death on ''ComicBook/CivilWarII''.death. Made even more raging because it was done by an attack that she has survived before (and her reaction to being hit is borderline {{Narm}}). The whole scene has been argued back and forth (alongside Rhodey's death) as an example of StuffedInTheFridge in order to make Carol's (and Tony's) WellIntentionedExtremist (and TookALevelInJerkass) bent more sympathetic than it was on the first ''ComicBook/CivilWar''. Thankfully, She-Hulk is alive as of Civil War II #4, although she's understandably not happy...]]
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Better then it sound can't be placed in other works.
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* BetterThanItSounds: The first few issues of Mariko Tamaki's run have garnered this response. The premise of "She-Hulk but without the humor" was understandably considered quite divisive (see below), but so far the consensus seems to be that the new series is well written and handles her trauma with care.
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* DorkAge: Her second series, ''The Sensational She-Hulk'', languished in a Dork Age in between Creator/JohnByrne's two runs on the title. The second one actually begins with She-Hulk realizing the comics Byrne didn't write were AllJustADream.
** Many people are already calling the "Grey Trauma Rage" era that she will go through on the aftermath of ''ComicBook/CivilWarII'' this (look up on BrokenBase for specifics).
** Many people are already calling the "Grey Trauma Rage" era that she will go through on the aftermath of ''ComicBook/CivilWarII'' this (look up on BrokenBase for specifics).
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* DorkAge: Her second series, ''The Sensational She-Hulk'', languished in a Dork Age in between Creator/JohnByrne's two runs on the title. The second one actually begins with She-Hulk realizing the comics Byrne didn't write were AllJustADream.
**Many people are already calling have called the "Grey Trauma Rage" era that she will go went through on the aftermath of ''ComicBook/CivilWarII'' this (look up on BrokenBase for specifics).
**
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Fetish Fuel is now just a fan-speak term. It shouldn't be linked to, not even for YMMV purposes. In-universe examples are the Fetish trope.
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* BrokenBase: Between people who like a [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/-She_hulk_7.jpg more comedic Jen]] (see Dan Slott) or are somewhat more serious (but still funny) [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/She_HulkPAD.gif Jen]] (see Creator/PeterDavid) AND those who like the [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/SavageShe-Hulk.gif original Savage She-Hulk incarnation]] and those that favour the 4th wall breaking [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/SheHulk4thWallBreaker.gif John Byrne era]] insanity... and just to top it off, those that are just in it for the FetishFuel of a female Hulk.
to:
* BrokenBase: Between people who like a [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/-She_hulk_7.jpg more comedic Jen]] (see Dan Slott) or are somewhat more serious (but still funny) [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/She_HulkPAD.gif Jen]] (see Creator/PeterDavid) AND those who like the [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/SavageShe-Hulk.gif original Savage She-Hulk incarnation]] and those that favour the 4th wall breaking [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/SheHulk4thWallBreaker.gif John Byrne era]] insanity... and just to top it off, those that are just in it for the FetishFuel fetish appeal of a female Hulk.
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Just from context, I'm assuming "savaged" was meant here rather than "saved."
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** [[spoiler:And then there's the reveal (thanks to pre-order advertisement) that the trauma of being killed/put into a coma and all the crap that happened on Civil War II because of Carol (apparently) misunderstanding her "last words" ''made her so traumatized that she has devolved into a pure rage-filled, grey Hulk'' (the relaunch of her series even ditched the "She-" from the title), with the series' creators telling that the thing will be an exploration of how Jennifer is now more like Bruce, seen as a monster and yet still being heroic and her struggles with said trauma...]] The fact that people love her because she's FunPersonified have taken this quite badly and denounce it as yet another example of Marvel shitting on a character (ex. "Superior Spider-Man" or Robbie Baldwin/Speedball/Penance) for the sake of shock value. However, while ''Civil War II'' was saved by critics and fans, the first two issues of the ''Hulk'' series by Mariko Tamaki were actually fairly well received.
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** [[spoiler:And then there's the reveal (thanks to pre-order advertisement) that the trauma of being killed/put into a coma and all the crap that happened on Civil War II because of Carol (apparently) misunderstanding her "last words" ''made her so traumatized that she has devolved into a pure rage-filled, grey Hulk'' (the relaunch of her series even ditched the "She-" from the title), with the series' creators telling that the thing will be an exploration of how Jennifer is now more like Bruce, seen as a monster and yet still being heroic and her struggles with said trauma...]] The fact that people love her because she's FunPersonified have taken this quite badly and denounce it as yet another example of Marvel shitting on a character (ex. "Superior Spider-Man" or Robbie Baldwin/Speedball/Penance) for the sake of shock value. However, while ''Civil War II'' was saved savaged by critics and fans, the first two issues of the ''Hulk'' series by Mariko Tamaki were actually fairly well received.
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* BetterThanItSounds: The first few issues of Mariko Tamaki's run have garnered this response. The premise of "She-Hulk but without the humor" was understandably considered quite divisive (see below), but so far the consensus seems to be that the new series is well written and handles her trauma with care.
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** [[spoiler:And then there's the reveal (thanks to pre-order advertisement) that the trauma of being killed/put into a coma and all the crap that happened on Civil War II because of Carol (apparently) misunderstanding her "last words" ''made her so traumatized that she has devolved into a pure rage-filled, grey Hulk'' (the relaunch of her series even ditched the "She-" from the title), with the series' creators telling that the thing will be an exploration of how Jennifer is now more like Bruce, seen as a monster and yet still being heroic and her struggles with said trauma...]] The fact that people love her because she's FunPersonified have taken this quite badly and denounce it as yet another example of Marvel shitting on a character (ex. "Superior Spider-Man" or Robbie Baldwin/Speedball/Penance) for the sake of shock value.
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** [[spoiler:And then there's the reveal (thanks to pre-order advertisement) that the trauma of being killed/put into a coma and all the crap that happened on Civil War II because of Carol (apparently) misunderstanding her "last words" ''made her so traumatized that she has devolved into a pure rage-filled, grey Hulk'' (the relaunch of her series even ditched the "She-" from the title), with the series' creators telling that the thing will be an exploration of how Jennifer is now more like Bruce, seen as a monster and yet still being heroic and her struggles with said trauma...]] The fact that people love her because she's FunPersonified have taken this quite badly and denounce it as yet another example of Marvel shitting on a character (ex. "Superior Spider-Man" or Robbie Baldwin/Speedball/Penance) for the sake of shock value. However, while ''Civil War II'' was saved by critics and fans, the first two issues of the ''Hulk'' series by Mariko Tamaki were actually fairly well received.
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** In UltimateMarvel, readers are dealt a ShockingSwerve when that universe's version of Shulkie turns out to be [[spoiler:Betsy Ross]], rather than Jennifer Walters. Then, in mainstream continuity, we get the TheReveal for Red Shulkie's identity. Guess who again?
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** In UltimateMarvel, ComicBook/UltimateMarvel, readers are dealt a ShockingSwerve when that universe's version of Shulkie turns out to be [[spoiler:Betsy Ross]], rather than Jennifer Walters. Then, in mainstream continuity, we get the TheReveal for Red Shulkie's identity. Guess who again?
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** Many people are already calling the "Grey Trauma Rage" era that she will go through on the aftermath of ''ComicBook/CivilWarII'' this (look up on BrokenBase for specifics).
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* DorkAge: Her second series, ''The Sensational She-Hulk'', languished in a Dork Age before and after Creator/JohnByrne's two runs on the title.
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* DorkAge: Her second series, ''The Sensational She-Hulk'', languished in a Dork Age before and after in between Creator/JohnByrne's two runs on the title.title. The second one actually begins with She-Hulk realizing the comics Byrne didn't write were AllJustADream.
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** [[spoiler:And then there's the reveal (thanks to pre-order advertisement) that the trauma of being killed/put into a coma and all the crap that happened on Civil War II because of Carol (apparently) misunderstanding her "last words" ''made her so traumatized that she has devolved into a pure rage-filled, grey Hulk'' (the relaunch of her series even ditched the "She-" from the title), with the series' creators telling that the thing will be an exploration of how Jennifer is now more like Bruce, seen as a monster and yet still being heroic and her struggles with said trauma...]] The fact that people love her because she's FunPersonified have taken this quite badly and denounce it as yet another example of Marvel shitting on a character (ex. "Superior Spider-Man" or Robbie Baldwin/Speedball/Penance) for the sake of shock value.
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* BrokenBase: Between people who like a [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/-She_hulk_7.jpg more comedic Jen]] (see Dan Slott) or are somewhat more serious (but still funny) [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/She_HulkPAD.gif Jen]] (see PeterDavid) AND those who like the [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/SavageShe-Hulk.gif original Savage She-Hulk incarnation]] and those that favour the 4th wall breaking [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/SheHulk4thWallBreaker.gif John Byrne era]] insanity... and just to top it off, those that are just in it for the FetishFuel of a female Hulk.
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* BrokenBase: Between people who like a [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/-She_hulk_7.jpg more comedic Jen]] (see Dan Slott) or are somewhat more serious (but still funny) [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/She_HulkPAD.gif Jen]] (see PeterDavid) Creator/PeterDavid) AND those who like the [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/SavageShe-Hulk.gif original Savage She-Hulk incarnation]] and those that favour the 4th wall breaking [[http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/SheHulk4thWallBreaker.gif John Byrne era]] insanity... and just to top it off, those that are just in it for the FetishFuel of a female Hulk.
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moved to Old Man Logan page
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* {{Squick}}: In the alternate universe "Old Man Logan," a trio of redneck Hulks rule over the West Coast. The implication is that the Hulk raped Jennifer and had children with her (his [[KissingCousins first cousin]]) because she was the only one who could "handle" having sex with The Hulk.
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** [[spoiler:Jennifer's death on ''ComicBook/CivilWarII''. Made even more raging because it was done by an attack that she has survived before (and her reaction to being hit is borderline {{Narm}}). The whole scene has been argued back and forth (alongside Rhodey's death) as an example of StuffedInTheFridge in order to make Carol's (and Tony's) WellIntentionedExtremist (and TookALevelInJerkass) bent more sympathetic than it was on the first ''ComicBook/CivilWar''.]]
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** [[spoiler:Jennifer's death on ''ComicBook/CivilWarII''. Made even more raging because it was done by an attack that she has survived before (and her reaction to being hit is borderline {{Narm}}). The whole scene has been argued back and forth (alongside Rhodey's death) as an example of StuffedInTheFridge in order to make Carol's (and Tony's) WellIntentionedExtremist (and TookALevelInJerkass) bent more sympathetic than it was on the first ''ComicBook/CivilWar''. Thankfully, She-Hulk is alive as of Civil War II #4, although she's understandably not happy...]]
