History YMMV / PokemonGoldandSilver

11th Dec '17 12:15:46 PM Rytex
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** [[InstantAwesomeJustAddDragons Lance]], who is so good a dragon trainer, he can evolve Pokémon early and teach his Dragonite a move it normally can't even learn![[note]]Dragonite evolves from Dragonair at level 55, and he has ''two'' below that. Also, Dragonite can't normally learn Barrier, but his level 53 one knows it.[[/note]]

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** [[InstantAwesomeJustAddDragons Lance]], who is so good a dragon trainer, he can evolve Pokémon early and teach his Dragonite a move it normally can't even learn![[note]]Dragonite evolves from Dragonair at level 55, and he has ''two'' ''three'' below that. Also, Dragonite can't normally learn Barrier, but his level 53 one knows Dragonite in Red, Blue, and Green knew it.[[/note]]
6th Dec '17 9:02:48 AM Rytex
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%%* MemeticBadass:
%%** Not quite as much as Red [[AlwaysSomeoneBetter (naturally)]], but Blue still is very much treated as one.
%%** Gym Leader Chuck. See MemeticMutation below.
%%** Don't forget [[InstantAwesomeJustAddDragons Lance]].
%%** To a small degree, Kris.

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%%* MemeticBadass:
%%** Not quite as much as Red [[AlwaysSomeoneBetter (naturally)]], but Blue still is very much treated as one.
%%**
* MemeticBadass:
** Red, both in and out of universe. '''THE''' strongest trainer across the entire series at the time of release, brought down to second by Steven in ''Emerald'' only to regain his throne come HGSS. The fandom almost unanimously has come to agree that if anyone goes up against Red, they don't stand a chance. By characters in universe, his feats are talked about with a sort of awe, how a child from Pallet Town was able to take down Team Rocket, vanquish the Elite 4 and then... vanish without a trace.
**
Gym Leader Chuck. See MemeticMutation below.
%%** Don't forget
Chuck, who demonstrates on-screen that [[VideoGame/DonkeyKong64 he can lift up a boulder with relative ease and makes tossing rocks seem such a breeze]]. Bear in mind, the best any of your Pokémon can do is to push it one tile sideways, where he can lift it up, ''and then toss it two tiles away onto a statue!'' It also helps that he's a bit of a Creator/ChuckNorris {{expy}}.
**
[[InstantAwesomeJustAddDragons Lance]].
%%** To
Lance]], who is so good a small degree, Kris.dragon trainer, he can evolve Pokémon early and teach his Dragonite a move it normally can't even learn![[note]]Dragonite evolves from Dragonair at level 55, and he has ''two'' below that. Also, Dragonite can't normally learn Barrier, but his level 53 one knows it.[[/note]]
** Youngster Joey's Rattata, remembered for being in the top percentage of Rattatas (even after it evolves into Raticate).
** Kris is remembered for being the first female protagonist in the series. When she was replaced with Lyra in the remakes, fans claimed it was because she was too powerful to make the game a challenge.



** The noise most psychic moves make is particularly satisfying, especially ''psychic'' itself!

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** The noise most psychic moves make is particularly satisfying, especially ''psychic'' itself!itself! New games even brought it back because of this!
** The opening notes to the [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4zqdU7izi4 Legendary Dogs battle theme]] when you encounter them in the wild. It also helps that the rest of the song is considered one of the best pieces of AwesomeMusic in the game already.



* MemeticBadass: Red already was in the original games, but his appearance in this game takes it UpToEleven. Just look at some of his fanart, it screams badass.

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* MemeticBadass: MemeticBadass:
**
Red already was in the original games, but his appearance in this game takes it UpToEleven. While Steven Stone had taken the "Most Powerful Trainer In The Series" title in ''Emerald,'' Red took it back here, which added fuel to the fire when it came to fans' belief that Red would never let anyone be better than him. Just look at some of his fanart, it screams badass.badass.
** While Kris was already one as well, the use of Lyra in her place catapulted her even higher, with many fans who think she was outright replaced thinking it was only fair because Kris was too powerful for the game to be any fun.



** Joey's Ratatta is in the top percentage of Rattata!

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** Joey's Ratatta is (still) in the top percentage of Rattata!


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** '''Voltorb Flip'''. While there is a sizable portion of fans who like the game, there are notable flaws. For starters, some of the games come down to luck, rather than logic or skill, which jeopardizes your progress in that game and can send you down a few levels, back into lower payouts. As well, the payouts are small but get bigger as you level up, but it is still a heft grind for the 9,999-coin Porygon or 10,000+-coin TMs. And there's also the lack of an option to simply buy the coins with regular currency. And of course, none of this is helped by the Voltorb Flip replacing the fan-favorite Card-Flip and Slot Machine games to comply with the stricter PEGI ratings.
21st Nov '17 12:22:37 PM PDL
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** ''Gold'' and ''Silver'' were the first games to introduce time as an integral mechanic to the series. From the pallet shifts between day and night, daily and weekly events in the overworld to affecting Pokémon encounters, how effective certain moves were and even how certain Pokémon evolve. These additions were so important that nearly every game after had some way to keep track of time. The day-night cycle being downplayed in ''Ruby'', ''Sapphire'' and ''Emerald'' and absent in ''Fire Red'' and ''Leaf Green'' is met with negative reception.

to:

** ''Gold'' and ''Silver'' were the first games to introduce time as an integral mechanic to the series. From the pallet shifts between day and night, daily and weekly events in the overworld to affecting Pokémon encounters, how effective certain moves were and even how certain Pokémon evolve. These additions were so important that nearly every game after had some way to keep track of time. The day-night cycle being downplayed in ''Ruby'', ''Sapphire'' and ''Emerald'' and absent in ''Fire Red'' and ''Leaf Green'' is was met with negative reception.
21st Nov '17 12:13:44 PM Chasem
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Added DiffLines:

** Speaking of translations, these are the games that started the trend of eliminating some regions' local language translations of the franchise to be replaced with another country's "universal" translation; the European French translations of the games were made available in Quebec and began to phase out the French-Canadian version of the franchise. Fans were not happy, largely because the English dub names for 400+ Pokémon and characters (used in French-Canadian translations of the anime and books/merchandise) were being officially replaced with a hefty tome of completely different French names. Similar homogenizations would later occur in Latin America and in China, to similar fandom displeasure.
13th Nov '17 3:38:13 PM MayIncon
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** ''Gold and Silver'' were the first games to introduce time as an integral mechanic to the series. From the pallet shifts between day and night, daily and weekly events in the overworld to affecting Pokémon encounters, how effective certain moves were and even how certain Pokémon evolve. These additions were so important that nearly every game after had some way to keep track of time (although this was downplayed in ''Ruby and Sapphire'' and absent in ''Fire Red and Leaf Green'').

to:

** ''Gold ''Gold'' and Silver'' ''Silver'' were the first games to introduce time as an integral mechanic to the series. From the pallet shifts between day and night, daily and weekly events in the overworld to affecting Pokémon encounters, how effective certain moves were and even how certain Pokémon evolve. These additions were so important that nearly every game after had some way to keep track of time (although this was time. The day-night cycle being downplayed in ''Ruby ''Ruby'', ''Sapphire'' and Sapphire'' ''Emerald'' and absent in ''Fire Red Red'' and Leaf Green'').''Leaf Green'' is met with negative reception.
13th Nov '17 2:01:44 PM rjd1922
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* GeniusProgramming: In development, the game filled up the entire cartridge despite only being half-finished. Satoru Iwata, former president of Creator/{{Nintendo}}, singlehandedly did some very heavy compression to save the project from being released as an ObviousBeta. When he was done, there was enough space in the cartridge to include all of Kanto. To summarize, thanks to Iwata, this game has twice as big a setting region-wise as every other Pokémon game released until the remakes.

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* GeniusProgramming: In development, the game filled up the entire cartridge despite only being half-finished. Satoru Iwata, former Creator/SatoruIwata, then president of Creator/HALLaboratory and later president of Creator/{{Nintendo}}, singlehandedly did some very heavy compression to save the project from being released as an ObviousBeta. When he was done, there was enough space in the cartridge to include all of Kanto. To summarize, thanks to Iwata, this game has twice as big a setting region-wise as every other Pokémon game released until the remakes.
12th Nov '17 6:33:18 PM Isaac_Heller
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* VindicatedByHistory: At the time of release, ''[=HeartGold=]'' and ''[=SoulSilver=]'' were very well-received, but there was some debate in the fandom on whether they were better than the original Gen II games or not, with many people continuing to support the originals due to [[NostalgiaFilter nostalgia]]. Over time, the Gen II fandom waned, and ''HGSS'' not only became unanimously agreed to be better than the originals, but also became one of the top candidates for the best games in the series.
* WhatDoYouMeanItsForKids: A staple of the series, in this case it's present with [[spoiler:Giovanni's implied suicide]].

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* VindicatedByHistory: At the time of release, ''[=HeartGold=]'' and ''[=SoulSilver=]'' were very well-received, but there was some debate in the fandom on whether they were better than the original Gen II games or not, with many people continuing to support the originals due to [[NostalgiaFilter nostalgia]]. Over time, the Gen II fandom waned, and ''HGSS'' not only became unanimously widely agreed to be better than the originals, but also became one of the top candidates for the best games in the series.
* WhatDoYouMeanItsForKids: A staple of the series, in this case it's present with [[spoiler:Giovanni's implied suicide]].
series.
12th Nov '17 6:23:48 PM Isaac_Heller
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** Many people agree that this is when the ''Pokémon'' game franchise became ''really'' good in terms of playability, and to this day it's still the generation with the highest Gamerankings score along with Generation I (and is widely believed to be superior than Gen I). It's widely agreed that the Johto games and their remakes are among the best games in the series; ''[=HeartGold=]'' and ''[=SoulSilver=]'' are often cited as the best ''Pokémon'' games overall, to the point that they're the only ones that fans of both the older and newer generations tend to agree on.

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** Many people agree that this is when the ''Pokémon'' game franchise became ''really'' good in terms of playability, and to this day it's still the generation with the highest Gamerankings score along with Generation I (and is widely believed to be superior than Gen I). It's widely agreed that the Johto games and their remakes are among the best games in the series; ''[=HeartGold=]'' and ''[=SoulSilver=]'' are also often cited as the best ''Pokémon'' games overall, to the point that they're the only ones that fans of both the older and newer generations tend to agree on.



** Gold and Silver were the first games to introduce time as an integral mechanic to the series. From the pallet shifts between day and night, daily and weekly events in the overworld to affecting Pokémon encounters, how effective certain moves were and even how certain Pokémon evolve. These additions were so important that nearly every game after had some way to keep track of time (although this was downplayed in ''Ruby and Sapphire'' and absent in ''Fire Red and Leaf Green'').

to:

** Gold ''Gold and Silver Silver'' were the first games to introduce time as an integral mechanic to the series. From the pallet shifts between day and night, daily and weekly events in the overworld to affecting Pokémon encounters, how effective certain moves were and even how certain Pokémon evolve. These additions were so important that nearly every game after had some way to keep track of time (although this was downplayed in ''Ruby and Sapphire'' and absent in ''Fire Red and Leaf Green'').
7th Nov '17 5:12:58 PM MayIncon
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** Feraligatr is a big one, moreso than any other starter. The entire game can be turned into a giant CurbStompBattle with its surprisingly good movepool for this generation (Ice Punch trivializes both the rival and the last gym). Worse, the only two gyms out of 16 that this Pokémon has a disadvantage at are in the post-game and relatively easy. ThatOneBoss, Whitney, struggles to counter a well-raised Water-type. It can breeze through the Elite Four with its HUGE movepool and [[LightningBruiser fast and strong attacks for this generation]], curbstomping [[UpToEleven EVEN THE CHAMPION]] (Hello, [[AnIcePerson Ice Punch]]). This Pokémon alone is the reason some found this gen easy, and it is even a common criticism of Gen II's balancing issues in the wake of some HypeBacklash. Even in the remakes, with better balancing, it is still one tough Mon to best.

to:

** Feraligatr is a big one, moreso than any other starter. The entire game can be turned into a giant CurbStompBattle with its surprisingly good movepool for this generation (Ice Punch trivializes both the rival and the last gym). Worse, the only two gyms out of 16 that this Pokémon has a disadvantage at are in the post-game and relatively easy. ThatOneBoss, Whitney, struggles to counter a well-raised Water-type. It can breeze through the Elite Four with its HUGE movepool and [[LightningBruiser fast and strong attacks for this generation]], curbstomping [[UpToEleven EVEN THE CHAMPION]] (Hello, [[AnIcePerson Ice Punch]]). It reaches its final form at level 30, the earliest among the starters in the entire series. This Pokémon alone is the reason some found this gen easy, and it is even a common criticism of Gen II's balancing issues in the wake of some HypeBacklash. Even in the remakes, with better balancing, it is still one tough Mon to best.
3rd Nov '17 11:59:07 AM Retloclive
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* ItsTheSameSoItSucks: A common criticism towards this generation is its over-reliance on Gen I Pokémon, making many of Gen II's fall into obscurity. Many of them are [[GuideDangIt not used by trainers]], some can only be found under conditions that are not recorded in the Pokédex[[labelnote: *]]fishing and headbutting trees[[/labelnote]], some are [[MetalSlime swarm-exclusive]][[labelnote: *]] which requires [[ScrappyMechanic some specific trainers' phone numbers in order to trigger said swarm]][[/labelnote]] and some of them are only [[BraggingRightsReward exclusive to the post-game]]. Up to this day there are fans who thought that Skarmory and the Slugma lines for example originate from [[VideoGame/PokemonRubyAndSapphire Hoenn]] as they're much more common over there.

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* ItsTheSameSoItSucks: ItsTheSameSoItSucks:
**
A common criticism towards this generation is its over-reliance on Gen I Pokémon, making many of Gen II's fall into obscurity. Many of them are [[GuideDangIt not used by trainers]], some can only be found under conditions that are not recorded in the Pokédex[[labelnote: *]]fishing and headbutting trees[[/labelnote]], some are [[MetalSlime swarm-exclusive]][[labelnote: *]] which requires [[ScrappyMechanic some specific trainers' phone numbers in order to trigger said swarm]][[/labelnote]] and some of them are only [[BraggingRightsReward exclusive to the post-game]]. Up to this day there are fans who thought that Skarmory and the Slugma lines for example originate from [[VideoGame/PokemonRubyAndSapphire Hoenn]] as they're much more common over there.there.
** A majority of the Johto gym Pokémon being from Gen I is seen as quite disappointing since there's many Johto Pokémon that could have been used on the gym teams. Falkner, Bugsy, Morty and Chuck don't even use a single Johto Pokémon on their team.


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** The remakes were a perfect opportunity to fix up the Johto gym leader teams to have more Pokémon from the region they're in. However, apart from a few level changes, and one of Clair's Dragonairs being replaced with a Gyarados, the teams stayed the same.
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=YMMV.PokemonGoldandSilver