History YMMV / MetalGearSolid4GunsOfThePatriots

18th Oct '17 6:23:17 AM CrowTR0bot
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* AuthorsSavingThrow: Two. The main one was Creator/HideoKojima's attempt to turn the much-ridiculed "magic hand" plotline into something remotely sensible (which more or less worked), but a lesser one was a bone of contention from ''VideoGame/MetalGearSolid'': it was believed by ''[[VideoGame/MetalGearSolid2SonsOfLiberty Metal Gear Solid 2]]''[='=]s non-direct mention of Meryl Silverburgh that Snake had cracked under Ocelot's torture, the "Otacon" ending was canon and Meryl was dead, which fans thought hugely out of character for Snake.[[note]]Although it should be noted that the in-game book ''In the Darkness of Shadow Moses: The Unofficial Truth'' mentioned that Meryl survived the events of Shadow Moses, and the two references to the book in the game itself implies that it was actually the Meryl ending that was canon, as well as the nod to the Infinity Bandana.[[/note]]

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* AuthorsSavingThrow: Two. The main one was Creator/HideoKojima's attempt to turn the much-ridiculed "magic hand" plotline into something remotely sensible (which more or less worked), (though that was pretty contentious in its own right. See BrokenBase below), but a lesser one was a bone of contention from ''VideoGame/MetalGearSolid'': it was believed by ''[[VideoGame/MetalGearSolid2SonsOfLiberty Metal Gear Solid 2]]''[='=]s non-direct mention of Meryl Silverburgh that Snake had cracked under Ocelot's torture, the "Otacon" ending was canon and Meryl was dead, which fans thought hugely out of character for Snake.[[note]]Although it should be noted that the in-game book ''In the Darkness of Shadow Moses: The Unofficial Truth'' mentioned that Meryl survived the events of Shadow Moses, and the two references to the book in the game itself implies that it was actually the Meryl ending that was canon, as well as the nod to the Infinity Bandana.[[/note]]
18th Oct '17 6:08:43 AM CrowTR0bot
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Added DiffLines:

** Having it turn out that Liquid's spirit was [[spoiler: DeadAllAlong, with Ocelot cutting off his arm and only pretending to still be possessed via nanomachines and hypnotherapy]]. Some fans consider it an AuthorsSavingThrow for one of the franchise's most ludicrous plot twists, while others think it cheapened the conflict between Snake and Liquid by [[spoiler: having him be exorcised offscreen and be forced to fight a cheap imitation throughout the game]].
10th Oct '17 5:54:10 AM PF
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** The tagline "War has changed" being [[http://coolman229.deviantart.com/gallery/32625991#/d49u77o directly contentious]] to ''VideoGame/{{Fallout}}'''s "War never changes".
*** Starting around the time of the UsefulNotes/XboxOne reveal, Snake's "War has changed" monologue has been adapted to "Gaming has changed" to reflect the state of the gaming industry. [[http://patterninterrupt.tumblr.com/post/51142092459/i-hate-posting-screencaps-from-4chan-but-this-was This 4chan post is a good example.]]

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** The tagline "War has changed" being [[http://coolman229.deviantart.com/gallery/32625991#/d49u77o directly contentious]] to ''VideoGame/{{Fallout}}'''s "War never changes".
***
changes". Starting around the time of the UsefulNotes/XboxOne reveal, Snake's "War has changed" monologue has been adapted to "Gaming has changed" to reflect the state of the gaming industry. [[http://patterninterrupt.tumblr.com/post/51142092459/i-hate-posting-screencaps-from-4chan-but-this-was This 4chan post is a good example.]]
10th Oct '17 5:53:23 AM PF
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** Snake's comments about Samus Aran in ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBros Brawl'' - namely, that he's attracted to her - become this upon the introduction of the Beauty and Beast Corps; an entire group of women who wear "sneaking suits" and big power armour, just like Samus does. Not only could he not tell that they were women at first (unlike with Samus), but he seems mildly repelled by them. Guess they're not "your kind of woman" after all, eh Snake?
*** He also has a line, while discussing Meta Knight with Mei Ling, that Foreshadows the infamous "Mt. Snakemore", and the fact that the writers were making fun of it well before any fans did is absolutely amazing:

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** Snake's comments about Samus Aran in ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBros Brawl'' - namely, that he's attracted to her - become this upon the introduction of the Beauty and Beast Corps; an entire group of women who wear "sneaking suits" and big power armour, just like Samus does. Not only could he not tell that they were women at first (unlike with Samus), but he seems mildly repelled by them. Guess they're not "your kind of woman" after all, eh Snake?
***
Snake? He also has a line, while discussing Meta Knight with Mei Ling, that Foreshadows the infamous "Mt. Snakemore", and the fact that the writers were making fun of it well before any fans did is absolutely amazing:
9th Sep '17 7:12:22 PM Kadorhal
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** Rosemary. Most fans didn't care for her overly dramatic and annoying moments over the Codec in the second game. In the fourth game, fans didn't like the fact that she was [[spoiler: married to Colonel Campbell, although once it was revealed she did it to protect Raiden and their child, fans warmed up to her.]] Her conversations with Snake about psychology were also very well written, not to mention they weren't forced on the player ever hour or so like in ''2''.
* ScrappyMechanic: The game railroads you into using the Operator and much more rarely M4 Custom after certain cutscenes. While they are decent weapons with plentiful ammo, it's pretty jarring if you want to experiment with other pistols and assault rifles; you're forced to limit yourself from five active inventory slots to three while keeping the Operator and M4 in the other two, or to ruin the effect of the cutscene transitioning into gameplay by going into the menu to swap weapons because the game replaced whichever one you actually wanted to use with the Operator.

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** Rosemary. Most fans didn't care for her overly dramatic and annoying moments over the Codec in the second game. In the fourth game, fans didn't like the fact that she was [[spoiler: married to Colonel Campbell, although once it was revealed she did it to protect Raiden and their child, fans warmed up to her.]] Her conversations with Snake about psychology were also very well written, not to mention they weren't forced on the player ever every hour or so like her conversations with Raiden regarding their anniversary in ''2''.
* ScrappyMechanic: The game railroads you into using the Operator and much more rarely M4 Custom after certain cutscenes. While they are decent weapons with plentiful ammo, it's pretty jarring if you want to experiment with other pistols and assault rifles; you're basically forced to limit yourself from five active inventory slots to three while keeping plus the Operator and M4 in M4, because otherwise whichever gun you want to use will be forcibly replaced with the other two, or Operator during the transition from cutscene to gameplay, thus forcing you to ruin the effect cool factor of the cutscene transitioning into gameplay transition by going back into the menu to swap weapons because the game replaced whichever one inventory and re-equipping what you actually wanted to use with the Operator.wanted.



** Vamp. If you go into the battle without knowing how to properly execute a CQC hold then you can be totally screwed, as failing to execute the hold exactly right at a critical moment of the battle will result in Vamp just knocking you flying, regenerating all his health and continuing the battle. Ditto if you don't realize that the syringe is an equippable combat item.
** The Suicide Gekkos. How can you even pay attention to them when there's a ninja knife fight taking up the right half of the screen?[[note]]The answer: [[LetsPlay/ChipCheezum You record it and watch it while commentating afterwards.]][[/note]]

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** Vamp. If you go into the battle without knowing how to properly execute a CQC hold then you can be totally screwed, as failing to execute the hold exactly right at a critical moment of the battle will result in Vamp just knocking you flying, regenerating all his health and continuing the battle. Ditto if you don't realize that the syringe is an equippable combat item.
item that can be used on enemies in CQC.
** The Suicide Gekkos.Gekkos immediately afterwards. How can you even pay attention to them when there's a ninja knife fight taking up the right half of the screen?[[note]]The answer: [[LetsPlay/ChipCheezum You record it and watch it while commentating afterwards.]][[/note]]
1st Sep '17 5:28:33 PM Kadorhal
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** One gun towers over all others: The M14 EBR. Breaking tradition, not every gun in the game insta-kills with a headshot, but this one still does. It has a very large magazine, uses common ammo, and can be silenced. It also features full-auto as well as single-shots modes, so you can still use it in close combat, with slightly more power than the M4. The scope means that those long-range headshots you used to be so proud of with the pistol in ''Metal Gear Solid 2'' and ''Metal Gear Solid 3'' are now ridiculously easy, so you can pop off a few headshots and immediately remove whatever "sneaking" you might've had to do. The real kicker though? It's a DiscOneNuke. It's so early that you can often buy it ''immediately after meeting Drebin with the points you earn retroactively from everything before meeting him because it's so damn cheap'' - or, if you want to save those points for more suppressors, just steal and unlock one from the snipers in the ''very next map area after meeting Drebin''.

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** One gun towers over all others: The the M14 EBR. Breaking tradition, not every gun in the game insta-kills with a headshot, but this one still does. It has a very large magazine, magazine (20 rounds, which goes quite a ways in semi-auto), uses common ammo, ammo (since almost every PMC guy you find uses a gun with the same ammo), and can be silenced. silenced (the only sniper rifle in the game that can take one, save for another integrally-suppressed one with much rarer ammo). It also features both full-auto as well as single-shots semi-auto modes, so you can still use it in close combat, with slightly more power than the M4. The scope means that those long-range headshots you used to be so proud of with the pistol in ''Metal Gear Solid 2'' and ''Metal Gear Solid 3'' are now ridiculously easy, so you can pop off a few headshots and immediately remove whatever "sneaking" you might've had to do. The real kicker though? It's a DiscOneNuke. It's so early that you can often buy it ''immediately after meeting Drebin with the points you earn retroactively from everything before meeting him because it's so damn cheap'' - or, if you want to save those points for more suppressors, just steal and unlock one from the snipers in the ''very next map area after meeting Drebin''.



** Overlapping with LethalJokeItem, the Tranquilizer Gun can be this if one is going for a StealthRun. It puts the target to sleep with just a single shot, instantly if it's a headshot and a few moments longer if it isn't. The kicker though, is how stealthy it is. Shooting it makes no sound and raises no alarm, enemy instantly put to sleep by a headshot raises no alarm, enemy hit on the limb and wondering what just happened before knocked out cold raises no alarm (compare to standard firearm which will raise alarm), enemies seeing their ally put to sleep raises no alarm either (so you can hit A, then as B wakes A up, put B to sleep, and while A is waking up, put A back to sleep). Since disabling an enemy is as good as killing them in a StealthBasedGame, you are looking at a OneHitKill gun that raises no alarm unless you yourself are seen.

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** Overlapping with LethalJokeItem, the Tranquilizer Gun Mk 2 tranquilizer gun can be this if one is going for a StealthRun. It puts the target to sleep with just a single shot, instantly if it's a headshot and a few moments longer if it isn't. The kicker though, is how stealthy it is. Shooting It's integrally silenced, so firing it makes no sound and raises no alarm, doesn't alert anyone except the person you shot with it. An enemy that gets instantly put to sleep by a headshot raises no alarm, which is pretty good. What makes it better is that, unlike a lethal firearm, an enemy hit on getting shot in the limb and wondering what just happened before knocked out cold by it doesn't have any reaction beyond looking in the direction you shot them from, so that only raises no the alarm (compare to standard firearm which will if they can see you. And if another enemy sees one of their buddies drop from being tranquilized, they don't immediately raise alarm), enemies seeing their ally put to sleep raises no the alarm either (so - they go to investigate and wake him back up, allowing you can hit A, then as B wakes A up, put B a chance to sleep, and tranquilize him while A is waking up, put A back to sleep). Since disabling he's standing in place as well. The best part, however - whereas knocking an enemy is as good as killing them out by bashing him over the head, strangling him to unconsciousness, or whatnot will have him call it in a StealthBasedGame, you are looking at a OneHitKill gun and make the other guards more cautious when he wakes back up, an enemy that raises no alarm unless you yourself are seen.wakes up from being tranquilized will simply shrug off the fact that they'd fallen asleep and get back to their patrol route as if nothing happened.



** Thanks to the passing of Creator/ChikaoOhtsuka, [[spoiler: Big Boss]]'s final line is hit hard with this.

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** Thanks to the passing of Creator/ChikaoOhtsuka, [[spoiler: Big [[spoiler:Big Boss]]'s final line is hit hard with this.



** Snake's comments about Samus Aran in ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBrosBrawl'' - namely, that he's attracted to her - become this upon the introduction of the Beauty and Beast Corps; an entire group of women who wear "sneaking suits" and big power armour, just like Samus does. Not only could he not tell that they were women at first (unlike with Samus), but he seems mildly repelled by them. Guess they're not "your kind of woman" after all, eh Snake?

to:

** Snake's comments about Samus Aran in ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBrosBrawl'' ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBros Brawl'' - namely, that he's attracted to her - become this upon the introduction of the Beauty and Beast Corps; an entire group of women who wear "sneaking suits" and big power armour, just like Samus does. Not only could he not tell that they were women at first (unlike with Samus), but he seems mildly repelled by them. Guess they're not "your kind of woman" after all, eh Snake?
6th Aug '17 6:06:06 AM PF
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** The story in general. Some fans find that it is a satisfying conclusion that pulled off a large share of TearJerker moments and did as well as it could have to wrap up the [[JigsawPuzzlePlot huge number of dangling plot threads]] from all the previous games into a GrandFinale that made sense, even if it had to strain at times. Others think it contradicts everything previous games told (most notably the ending of ''Metal Gear Solid 2''). For those people, the changes that bothered fans are Snake's depressive personality even though Snake is already used to these situations ([[http://www.1up.com/news/anime-expo-david-hayter-critical David Hayter came to complain about some of his actions]]), Meryl's romance is considered an AssPull, Raiden going from a normal man happy with his life to a depressed badass cyborg, Sunny overshadowing Otacon and Naomi despite her young age and several plot mysteries being [[HandWave explained away]] with [[MemeticMutation nanomachines]].

to:

** The story in general. Some fans find that it is a satisfying conclusion that pulled off a large share of TearJerker moments and did as well as it could have to wrap up the [[JigsawPuzzlePlot huge number of dangling plot threads]] from all the previous games into a GrandFinale that made sense, even if it had to strain at times. Others think it contradicts everything previous games told (most notably the ending of ''Metal Gear Solid 2''). For those people, the The changes that bothered fans them are Snake's depressive personality even though Snake is he's already used to these situations ([[http://www.1up.com/news/anime-expo-david-hayter-critical David Hayter came to complain about some of his actions]]), Meryl's romance is considered an AssPull, Raiden going from a normal man happy with his life to a depressed badass cyborg, Sunny overshadowing Otacon and Naomi despite her young age age, and several plot mysteries being [[HandWave explained away]] with [[MemeticMutation nanomachines]].



** Raiden's "I am lightning, the rain transformed". While famous for the badassery behind Raiden it resulted in people trying to come up with similar phrases like "I am hamburger, the cow transformed."

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** Raiden's "I am lightning, the rain transformed". While famous for the badassery behind Raiden Raiden, it resulted in people fans trying to come up with similar phrases like "I am hamburger, the cow transformed."



** [[spoiler:Big Boss: Not dead, but instead induced into an artificial Locked-In state so that he can be used as the key to the world's EvilOverlord computer, one can't help but feel sorry for the guy. Until after the surprise ending, when it turns out it was more likely Solidus Snake that suffered the sad fate of being thrown into a fire.]]

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** [[spoiler:Big Boss: Not dead, but instead induced into an artificial Locked-In locked-in state so that he can be used as the key to the world's EvilOverlord computer, one can't help but feel sorry for the guy. Until after the surprise ending, when it turns out it was more likely Solidus Snake that suffered the sad fate of being thrown into a fire.]]
23rd Jun '17 5:26:49 PM AlleyOop
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** The story in general. Some fans find that it is a good conclusion. Others think it contradicts everything previous games told (most notably the ending of ''Metal Gear Solid 2''). The changes that bothered fans are Snake's depressive personality even though Snake is already used to these situations ([[http://www.1up.com/news/anime-expo-david-hayter-critical David Hayter came to complain about some of his actions]]), Meryl's romance is considered an AssPull, Raiden going from a normal man happy with his life to a depressed badass cyborg, Sunny overshadowing Otacon and Naomi despite her young age and several plot mysteries being [[HandWave explained away]] with [[MemeticMutation nanomachines]].

to:

** The story in general. Some fans find that it is a good conclusion.satisfying conclusion that pulled off a large share of TearJerker moments and did as well as it could have to wrap up the [[JigsawPuzzlePlot huge number of dangling plot threads]] from all the previous games into a GrandFinale that made sense, even if it had to strain at times. Others think it contradicts everything previous games told (most notably the ending of ''Metal Gear Solid 2''). The For those people, the changes that bothered fans are Snake's depressive personality even though Snake is already used to these situations ([[http://www.1up.com/news/anime-expo-david-hayter-critical David Hayter came to complain about some of his actions]]), Meryl's romance is considered an AssPull, Raiden going from a normal man happy with his life to a depressed badass cyborg, Sunny overshadowing Otacon and Naomi despite her young age and several plot mysteries being [[HandWave explained away]] with [[MemeticMutation nanomachines]].
11th Jun '17 4:43:48 PM nombretomado
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*** Starting around the time of the XboxOne reveal, Snake's "War has changed" monologue has been adapted to "Gaming has changed" to reflect the state of the gaming industry. [[http://patterninterrupt.tumblr.com/post/51142092459/i-hate-posting-screencaps-from-4chan-but-this-was This 4chan post is a good example.]]

to:

*** Starting around the time of the XboxOne UsefulNotes/XboxOne reveal, Snake's "War has changed" monologue has been adapted to "Gaming has changed" to reflect the state of the gaming industry. [[http://patterninterrupt.tumblr.com/post/51142092459/i-hate-posting-screencaps-from-4chan-but-this-was This 4chan post is a good example.]]
3rd Jun '17 10:35:20 AM PF
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* {{Misblamed}}: Many people cited the Beauty and the Beast unit as an example of the oversexualization of women in video games. However, the game is basically twenty-five hours of Hideo Kojima passive-aggressively fucking with his audience of fanboys who [[FranchiseZombie won't let the franchise die]]. It's basically a bored and worn-out Kojima asking his audience, "You want [=T&A=]? [[BeCarefulWhatYouWishFor I'll give you [=T&A=]]]." The highly-eroticized, mentally-broken women moaning and screaming and trying to kill Snake by hugging him to death while gunfire and breaking glass batter the player's ears is so ludicrously over-the-top it's clearly DeliberateValuesDissonance.
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=YMMV.MetalGearSolid4GunsOfThePatriots