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* WhatAnIdiot: So... killing Roose makes some sense for Ramsay (though even the "Inside the Episode" points out obvious drawbacks), but feeding Walda and her babe to the hounds rather than a more discrete method like VorpalPillow that could pass for DeathByChildbirth will definitely destroy the crucial Bolton-Frey alliance they represented. Remember, the Lannisters are coming, and Walder Frey is the kind of man who set up the Red Wedding because Robb failed to ''marry'' one of his daughters. What'll he want to do if he even suspects Ramsay ''murdered'' his granddaughter and her son? And Frey is lord paramount of the Riverlands in a way the Boltons can only dream of since he still has the true lord, Edmure Tully, locked in his dungeon. Adding another ''entire region'' your list of enemies is an expensive way to make puppy chow.
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** Tyrion's handling of the chained dragons. Is he really that good of a talker, or [[spoiler:is he really what the fan theories suggest: the promised "third head" of the Targaryan dragon - along with Dany and Jon Snow - that would save the Seven Kingdoms in its time of need?]]
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* TheWoobie: Serving under Ramsay Bolton, Maester Wolkan has to have the most soul-crushing jobs of all Citadel alumni. Even something as cheerful as a copybook birth can be turned into NightmareFuel in an instant. All while he's forced to endure, assist and mind his choice of words at all times or he'll be next.

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* TheWoobie: Serving under Ramsay Bolton, Maester Wolkan has to have the most soul-crushing jobs of all Citadel alumni. Even something as cheerful as a copybook textbook birth can be turned into NightmareFuel in an instant. All while he's forced to endure, assist and mind his choice of words at all times or he'll be next.

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Alternate Character Interpretation for Ser Robert Strong's action.


* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Roose Bolton was a DeathSeeker who was goading Ramsay to kill him and take over Winterfell. Roose knew that he was too cautious to actually win a battle or war on his own, but he wanted to ensure that Ramsay had it in him to jump the final hurdle and be a true Bolton, ruthless and treacherous, so he kept taunting him about his newborn son. His lack of reaction to Ramsay's betrayal is out of stoic acceptance and not pained betrayal.[[note]]In the books, Roose tells Theon that he expects House Bolton to die out soon. Walda is pregnant and he expects Ramsay to kill her and the baby.[[/note]]

to:

* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: AlternateCharacterInterpretation:
**
Roose Bolton was a DeathSeeker who was goading Ramsay to kill him and take over Winterfell. Roose knew that he was too cautious to actually win a battle or war on his own, but he wanted to ensure that Ramsay had it in him to jump the final hurdle and be a true Bolton, ruthless and treacherous, so he kept taunting him about his newborn son. His lack of reaction to Ramsay's betrayal is out of stoic acceptance and not pained betrayal.[[note]]In the books, Roose tells Theon that he expects House Bolton to die out soon. Walda is pregnant and he expects Ramsay to kill her and the baby.[[/note]][[/note]]
** Ser Robert Strong simply hates the smell of urine and treated the offender in kind (the smell of blood and brain matter, on the other hand, is ok).
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** One of the common complaints about the adaptation of [[Recap/GameOfThronesS3E9TheRainsOfCastamere The Red Wedding]] is that Robb's failings as a leader to spur the betrayal were not properly shown in the series. In this episode, it's shown the Starks actually ''don't'' have the OneHundredPercentAdorationRating, with House Karstark in particular still vengeful for Robb killing their lord.

to:

** One of the common complaints about the adaptation of [[Recap/GameOfThronesS3E9TheRainsOfCastamere The Red Wedding]] is that Robb's failings as a leader to spur the betrayal were not properly shown in the series. In this episode, it's shown the Starks actually ''don't'' have the OneHundredPercentAdorationRating, HundredPercentAdorationRating, with House Karstark in particular still vengeful for Robb killing their lord.

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* AuthorsSavingThrow: One of the common complaints about the adaptation of [[Recap/GameOfThronesS3E9TheRainsOfCastamere The Red Wedding]] is that Robb's failings as a leader to spur the betrayal were not properly shown in the series. In this episode, it's shown the Starks actually ''don't'' have the OneHundredPercentAdorationRating, with House Karstark in particular still vengeful for Robb killing their lord.

to:

* AuthorsSavingThrow: AuthorsSavingThrow:
** After the assassination of Trystane Martell seemed to have been [[FailedASpotCheck completely ignored]] by Jaime in the season premiere despite taking place on his ship in the cargo hold, this one has him not only show awareness, but also seemingly let go of the IdiotBall to show he is unclear on who had him killed, but that it would not have been Cersei, MamaBear or no.
**
One of the common complaints about the adaptation of [[Recap/GameOfThronesS3E9TheRainsOfCastamere The Red Wedding]] is that Robb's failings as a leader to spur the betrayal were not properly shown in the series. In this episode, it's shown the Starks actually ''don't'' have the OneHundredPercentAdorationRating, with House Karstark in particular still vengeful for Robb killing their lord.
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** Some reviewers outright suspect that the showrunners dumped all of the Dorne material in the first episode, and killed off many characters in it, because they realized it wasn't working and wanted to quickly wash their hands of it - knowing that the second episode was so strong that it would stand a good chance of quickly winning back the audience after last week. The Dorne material was 1 - a controversial and drastic change, and 2 - most reviewers simply watching it didn't like it - the showrunners can't be totally oblivious, they must have known this material might not be received well...so why else would they prominently put it in the ''season premiere'', which would be under heavy scrutiny? If anything they would have at least tried to push back Doran Martell's death to a later episode - it wasn't even directly connected to other events in the premiere. So it seems likely they were actively relying on this episode to win back the crowd.

to:

** Some reviewers outright suspect that the showrunners dumped all of the Dorne material in the first episode, and killed off many characters in it, because they realized it wasn't working and wanted to quickly wash their hands of it - knowing that the second episode was so strong that it would stand a good chance of quickly winning back the audience after last week. The Dorne material was 1 - a controversial and drastic change, and 2 - most reviewers simply watching it simply didn't like it - the showrunners can't be totally oblivious, they must have known this material might not be received well...so why else would they prominently put it in the ''season premiere'', which would be under heavy scrutiny? If anything they would have at least tried to push back Doran Martell's death to a later episode - it wasn't even directly connected to other events in the premiere. So it seems likely they were actively relying on this episode to win back the crowd.

Added: 959

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** There were two major new subplots introduced in the fourth novel that shifted focus to the fringes of Westeros: Dorne and the Iron Islands. Both were pushed back to later in the TV series and were feared to be cut entirely if the show only lasted seven TV seasons. The Dorne subplot was drastically changed, leading some to fear how they would handle the Iron Islands subplot also returning this season. As it turned out, the Iron Islands material introduced in this episode is ''very'' faithful to the novels and includes many line for line quotes from them. The only major difference is that Balon's DisneyVillainDeath is caused by Euron himself rather than a Faceless Man he hired to MakeItLookLikeAnAccident.

to:

** There were two major new subplots introduced in the fourth novel that shifted focus to the fringes of Westeros: Dorne and the Iron Islands. Both were pushed back to later in the TV series and were feared to be cut entirely if the show only lasted seven TV seasons. The Dorne subplot was drastically changed, leading some to fear how they would handle the Iron Islands subplot also returning this season. As it turned out, the Iron Islands material introduced in this episode is ''very'' faithful to the novels and includes many line for line quotes from them. The only major difference is that Balon's DisneyVillainDeath is caused by Euron himself rather than a Faceless Man he hired to MakeItLookLikeAnAccident.MakeItLookLikeAnAccident - but this was so they could give Balon and Euron a face-to-face confrontation, compared to the novels in which Balon complains about Euron before his return, then Euron complains about Balon after his death (the lines Euron gives are from the book, though he said them to other people).
**Some reviewers outright suspect that the showrunners dumped all of the Dorne material in the first episode, and killed off many characters in it, because they realized it wasn't working and wanted to quickly wash their hands of it - knowing that the second episode was so strong that it would stand a good chance of quickly winning back the audience after last week. The Dorne material was 1 - a controversial and drastic change, and 2 - most reviewers simply watching it didn't like it - the showrunners can't be totally oblivious, they must have known this material might not be received well...so why else would they prominently put it in the ''season premiere'', which would be under heavy scrutiny? If anything they would have at least tried to push back Doran Martell's death to a later episode - it wasn't even directly connected to other events in the premiere. So it seems likely they were actively relying on this episode to win back the crowd.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* TheWoobie: Serving under Ramsay Bolton, Maester Wolkan has to have the most soul-crushing jobs of all Citadel alumni. Even something as cheerful as a copybook birth can be turned into NightmareFuel in an instant. All while he's forced to endure, assist and mind his choice of words at all times or he'll be next.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* AuthorsSavingThrow: One of the common complaints about the adaptation of [[Recap/GameOfThronesS3E9TheRainsOfCastamere The Red Wedding]] is that Robb's failings as a leader to spur the betrayal were not properly shown in the series. In this episode, it's shown the Starks actually ''don't'' have the OneHundredPercentAdorationRating, with House Karstark in particular still vengeful for Robb killing their lord.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* CreepyCute: There's something very endearing about the two second and third most dangerous reptiles of the known world cuddling each other after getting unshackled.

to:

* CreepyCute: There's something very endearing about the two second and third most dangerous reptiles of the known world cuddling each other after getting unshackled.



* WinBackTheCrowd: This episode was far better recieved than the first one, since it stopped spinning the wheels, saw the return of PutOnABus characters like Bran and the Greyjoys, the flashbacks to the backstory, as well as ending the year-and-a-week-wait for Jon Snow's resurrection. Where last week's purge of the Martells was poorly executed, this week's Bolton massacre felt in keeping with the characters and was more properly foreshadowed and with fewer plotholes.

to:

* WinBackTheCrowd: This episode was far better recieved received than the first one, since it stopped spinning the wheels, saw the return of PutOnABus characters like Bran and the Greyjoys, the flashbacks to the backstory, as well as ending the year-and-a-week-wait for Jon Snow's resurrection. Where last week's purge of the Martells was poorly executed, this week's Bolton massacre felt in keeping with the characters and was more properly foreshadowed and with fewer plotholes.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** There were two major new subplots introduced in the fourth novel that shifted focus to the fringes of Westeros: Dorne and the Iron Islands. Both were pushed back to later in the TV series and were feared to be cut entirely if the show only lasted seven TV seasons. The Dorne subplot was drastically changed, leading some to fear how they would handle the Iron Islands subplot also returning this season. As it turned out, the Iron Islands material introduced in this episode is ''very'' faithful to the novels and includes many line for line quotes from them.

to:

** There were two major new subplots introduced in the fourth novel that shifted focus to the fringes of Westeros: Dorne and the Iron Islands. Both were pushed back to later in the TV series and were feared to be cut entirely if the show only lasted seven TV seasons. The Dorne subplot was drastically changed, leading some to fear how they would handle the Iron Islands subplot also returning this season. As it turned out, the Iron Islands material introduced in this episode is ''very'' faithful to the novels and includes many line for line quotes from them. The only major difference is that Balon's DisneyVillainDeath is caused by Euron himself rather than a Faceless Man he hired to MakeItLookLikeAnAccident.
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trivia


* IKnewIt: Jon's resurrection had been wildly speculated before the start of the season and denied multiple times. Sure enough, Jon gets better.
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None

Added DiffLines:

* CreepyCute: There's something very endearing about the two second and third most dangerous reptiles of the known world cuddling each other after getting unshackled.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Roose Bolton was a DeathSeeker who was goading Ramsay to kill him and take over Winterfell. Roose knew that he was too cautious to actually win a battle or war on his own, but he wanted to ensure that Ramsay had it in him to jump the final hurdle and be a true Bolton, ruthless and treacherous, so he kept taunting him about his newborn son. His lack of reaction to Ramsay's death is his usual stoic acceptance.[[note]]In the books, Roose tells Theon that he expects House Bolton to die out soon. Walda is pregnant and he expects Ramsay to kill her and the baby.[[/note]]

to:

* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Roose Bolton was a DeathSeeker who was goading Ramsay to kill him and take over Winterfell. Roose knew that he was too cautious to actually win a battle or war on his own, but he wanted to ensure that Ramsay had it in him to jump the final hurdle and be a true Bolton, ruthless and treacherous, so he kept taunting him about his newborn son. His lack of reaction to Ramsay's death betrayal is his usual out of stoic acceptance.acceptance and not pained betrayal.[[note]]In the books, Roose tells Theon that he expects House Bolton to die out soon. Walda is pregnant and he expects Ramsay to kill her and the baby.[[/note]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Roose Bolton was a DeathSeeker who was goading Ramsay to kill him and take over Winterfell. Roose knew that he was too cautious to actually win a battle or war on his own and being ruthless and treacherous himself, but he wanted to ensure that Ramsay had it in him to jump the final hurdle and be a true Bolton. His lack of reaction to Ramsay's death is his usual stoic acceptance.[[note]]In the books, Roose tells Theon that he expects House Bolton to die out soon. Walda is pregnant and he expects Ramsay to kill her and the baby.[[/note]]

to:

* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Roose Bolton was a DeathSeeker who was goading Ramsay to kill him and take over Winterfell. Roose knew that he was too cautious to actually win a battle or war on his own and being ruthless and treacherous himself, own, but he wanted to ensure that Ramsay had it in him to jump the final hurdle and be a true Bolton.Bolton, ruthless and treacherous, so he kept taunting him about his newborn son. His lack of reaction to Ramsay's death is his usual stoic acceptance.[[note]]In the books, Roose tells Theon that he expects House Bolton to die out soon. Walda is pregnant and he expects Ramsay to kill her and the baby.[[/note]]
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* TakeThatScrappy: [[CanonForeigner Olly]], who had become the {{Scrappy}} for much of Season 5, is among those who are sent South of the Wall for TheMutiny.

to:

* TakeThatScrappy: [[CanonForeigner Olly]], who had become the {{Scrappy}} for much of Season 5, is among those who are sent South of to the Wall Cells for TheMutiny.
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None

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* CrowningMusicOfAwesome: The tune playing over the end credits just after Jon's resurrection is Djawadi epicness at its best.
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What was the reason for deleting this?

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* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Roose Bolton was a DeathSeeker who was goading Ramsay to kill him and take over Winterfell. Roose knew that he was too cautious to actually win a battle or war on his own and being ruthless and treacherous himself, but he wanted to ensure that Ramsay had it in him to jump the final hurdle and be a true Bolton. His lack of reaction to Ramsay's death is his usual stoic acceptance.[[note]]In the books, Roose tells Theon that he expects House Bolton to die out soon. Walda is pregnant and he expects Ramsay to kill her and the baby.[[/note]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Roose Bolton was a DeathSeeker who was goading Ramsay to kill him and take over Winterfell. Roose knew that he was too cautious to actually win a battle or war on his own and being ruthless and treacherous himself, but he wanted to ensure that Ramsay had it in him to jump the final hurdle and be a true Bolton. His lack of reaction to Ramsay's death is his usual stoic acceptance.[[note]]In the books, Roose tells Theon that he expects House Bolton to die out soon. Walda is pregnant and he expects Ramsay to kill her and the baby.[[/note]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

**There were two major new subplots introduced in the fourth novel that shifted focus to the fringes of Westeros: Dorne and the Iron Islands. Both were pushed back to later in the TV series and were feared to be cut entirely if the show only lasted seven TV seasons. The Dorne subplot was drastically changed, leading some to fear how they would handle the Iron Islands subplot also returning this season. As it turned out, the Iron Islands material introduced in this episode is ''very'' faithful to the novels and includes many line for line quotes from them.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* TakeThatScrappy: [[CanonForeigner Olly]], who had become the {{Scrappy}} for much of Season 5, is among those who are sent South of the Wall for TheMutiny.

to:

* TakeThatScrappy: [[CanonForeigner Olly]], who had become the {{Scrappy}} for much of Season 5, is among those who are sent South of the Wall for TheMutiny.TheMutiny.
* WinBackTheCrowd: This episode was far better recieved than the first one, since it stopped spinning the wheels, saw the return of PutOnABus characters like Bran and the Greyjoys, the flashbacks to the backstory, as well as ending the year-and-a-week-wait for Jon Snow's resurrection. Where last week's purge of the Martells was poorly executed, this week's Bolton massacre felt in keeping with the characters and was more properly foreshadowed and with fewer plotholes.
----
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The episode was written and filmed before the broadcast od the first episode. There's no saving throw...


* AuthorsSavingThrow: This episode was far better recieved than the first one, since it stopped spinning the wheels, saw the return of PutOnABus characters like Bran and the Greyjoys, the flashbacks to the backstory, as well as ending the year-and-a-week-wait for Jon Snow's resurrection. Where last week's purge of the Martells was poorly executed, this week's Bolton massacre felt in keeping with the characters and was more properly foreshadowed and with fewer plotholes.
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No spoiler warning for recap pages...


* IKnewIt: [[spoiler: Jon's resurrection had been wildly speculated before the start of the season and denied multiple times. Sure enough, Jon gets better.]]

to:

* IKnewIt: [[spoiler: Jon's resurrection had been wildly speculated before the start of the season and denied multiple times. Sure enough, Jon gets better.]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Roose Bolton was a DeathSeeker who was goading Ramsay to kill him and take over Winterfell. Roose knew that he was too cautious to actually win a battle of defense, that Ramsay was always a more agressive heir

to:

* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Roose Bolton was a DeathSeeker who was goading Ramsay to kill him and take over Winterfell. Roose knew that he was too cautious to actually win a battle of defense, or war on his own and being ruthless and treacherous himself, but he wanted to ensure that Ramsay was always had it in him to jump the final hurdle and be a more agressive heirtrue Bolton. His lack of reaction to Ramsay's death is his usual stoic acceptance.[[note]]In the books, Roose tells Theon that he expects House Bolton to die out soon. Walda is pregnant and he expects Ramsay to kill her and the baby.[[/note]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Roose Bolton was a DeathSeeker who was goading Ramsay to kill him and take over Winterfell. Roose knew that he was too cautious to actually win a battle of defense, that Ramsay was always a more agressive heir
* AuthorsSavingThrow: This episode was far better recieved than the first one, since it stopped spinning the wheels, saw the return of PutOnABus characters like Bran and the Greyjoys, the flashbacks to the backstory, as well as ending the year-and-a-week-wait for Jon Snow's resurrection. Where last week's purge of the Martells was poorly executed, this week's Bolton massacre felt in keeping with the characters and was more properly foreshadowed and with fewer plotholes.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* TakeThatScrappy: [[CanonForeigner Olly]], who had become the SpotlightStealingSquad for much of Season 5, is among those who are sent South of the Wall for TheMutiny.

to:

* TakeThatScrappy: [[CanonForeigner Olly]], who had become the SpotlightStealingSquad {{Scrappy}} for much of Season 5, is among those who are sent South of the Wall for TheMutiny.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* IKnewIt: [[spoiler: Jon's resurrection had been wildly speculated before the start of the season and denied multiple times. Sure enough, Jon gets better.]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* TakeThatScrappy: [[CanonForeigner Olly]], who had become the SpotlightStealingSquad for much of Season 5, is among those who are sent South of the Wall for TheMutiny.

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