History VideoGame / The7thSaga

24th Aug '16 7:52:24 PM Jacob175
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* AllinaRow: The apprentice and the occasional non-fighting NPC guest will follow you thoroughly through the adventure

to:

* AllinaRow: AllInARow: The apprentice and the occasional non-fighting NPC guest will follow you thoroughly through the adventure



* ArmorandMagicDon'tMix: Esuna and Lejes, the two magic caster characters, cannot wear armor at all, being very frail to physical attacks
* BattleThemeMusic: Quite the memorable tunes
* BeatThematTheirOwnGame: Most of the enemies that abuse deadly status effects are subsceptible to them: use them yourself (if you have a magician\hybrid character) or hoard on "Magic Mirrors", them being pretty much "Reflect" from Final Fantasy for such kind of spells (do not reflect instant death)
* BlackandWhiteMagic: Most of the characters can use either one, either the other, or a mix of both, or rather a unique set of spells

to:

* ArmorandMagicDon'tMix: ArmorAndMagicDontMix: Esuna and Lejes, the two magic caster characters, cannot wear armor at all, being very frail to physical attacks
* BattleThemeMusic: Quite the memorable tunes
tunes.
* BeatThematTheirOwnGame: BeatThemAtTheirOwnGame: Most of the enemies that abuse deadly status effects are subsceptible to them: use them yourself (if you have a magician\hybrid character) or hoard on "Magic Mirrors", them being pretty much "Reflect" from Final Fantasy for such kind of spells (do not reflect instant death)
* BlackandWhiteMagic: BlackAndWhiteMagic: Most of the characters can use either one, either the other, or a mix of both, or rather a unique set of spells



* CameraLock-On: While fighting, you have to select an enemy and the camera locks on him

to:

* CameraLock-On: CameraLockOn: While fighting, you have to select an enemy and the camera locks on him



* CrueltyIstheOnlyOption: You are forced to kill a witch that just kidnapped kids to make them play happily together, because she lost her own child unfarly, to receive a required plot-advancing contrivance

to:

* CrueltyIstheOnlyOption: CrueltyIsTheOnlyOption: You are forced to kill a witch that just kidnapped kids to make them play happily together, because she lost her own child unfarly, unfairly, to receive a required plot-advancing contrivance



* DifficultyByRegion: Due to developer carelessness in the US and EU versions, you get smaller bonuses upon levelup, and the game was not rebalanced accordingly. (Naturally there are [[{{UsefulNotes/Emulation}} fan-created patches]] that fix this.) It's entirely possible for some characters to die on the very first monster they encounter. The amount of level grinding} [[ForcedLevelGrinding needed to get anywhere]] borders on the obscene with certain characters. But the game {{cap}}s your level just a little too soon so you're never quite the level you need to be. Equipment is also overpriced and underpowered. Monsters regularly thrown nasty status effects and instant death attacks at you. It's the hardest RPG on the SNES without question.

to:

* DifficultyByRegion: Due to developer carelessness in the US and EU versions, you get smaller bonuses upon levelup, and the game was not rebalanced accordingly. (Naturally there are [[{{UsefulNotes/Emulation}} fan-created patches]] that fix this.) It's entirely possible for some characters to die on the very first monster they encounter. The amount of level grinding} grinding [[ForcedLevelGrinding needed to get anywhere]] borders on the obscene with certain characters. But the game {{cap}}s your level just a little too soon so you're never quite the level you need to be. Equipment is also overpriced and underpowered. Monsters regularly thrown nasty status effects and instant death attacks at you. It's the hardest RPG on the SNES without question.



* EarlyGameHell: Under-equipped, poor, against lethal crows
* Enemy-DetectingRadar: The first RPG to have one, making random encounters only semi-random, has one, if flaired enough, can skip them by zig-zagging through them

to:

* EarlyGameHell: Under-equipped, poor, Under-equipped and poor against lethal crows
crows.
* Enemy-DetectingRadar: EnemyDetectingRadar: The first RPG to have one, making random encounters only semi-random, has one, if flaired enough, can skip them by zig-zagging through them



* FakeBalance: Enemies have skills you cannot use; enemies have chances to resist\dodge status effects you can acquire only via very obscure to be found equiment garments; enemies will one-shot you often if unprepared\not defending
* '''''ForcedLevelGrinding'''''

to:

* FakeBalance: Enemies have skills you cannot use; enemies have chances to resist\dodge status effects you can acquire only via very obscure to be found equiment equipment garments; enemies will one-shot you often if unprepared\not defending
defending.
* '''''ForcedLevelGrinding''''''''''ForcedLevelGrinding''''': You're going to need it to get the gear and stats just to survive.



* GetontheBoat: If you are playing as Esuna the female sorcercer or friendly clanky cluttery robot Lux, you will sail on a boat to reach a far-end area the other side of the continent, where enemies are MUCH stronger... this two characters are clearly the "hard mode" representative to an already difficult game (US Version only, JP version is piss easy)

to:

* GetontheBoat: GetOnTheBoat: If you are playing as Esuna the female sorcercer or friendly clanky cluttery robot Lux, you will sail on a boat to reach a far-end area the other side of the continent, where enemies are MUCH stronger... this two characters are clearly the "hard mode" representative to an already difficult game (US Version only, JP version is piss easy)



* HellIsThatNoise: Whenever Vacuum2 is used, a high pitched screech is played.

to:

* HellIsThatNoise: Whenever Vacuum2 [=Vacuum2=] is used, a high pitched screech is played.



* LevelGrinding: Required to just beat the second weakest enemy in the game

to:

* LevelGrinding: Required to just beat the second weakest enemy in the gamegame.



* [[spoiler:MacGuffinDeliveryService: Once you obtain all of the runes, Gorsia steals their power and breaks them into pieces.]]



* MasterOfNone: Kamil. Intended as a JackOfAllTrades, the stat growths bug leaves him worse than everybody at almost everything. Literally the ONLY two people he beats at ANYTHING are Lux and Wilme in MP and Valsu and Esuna in Power; he's got more magic than the non-magic classes, and more combat ability than the non-combat ones. Whoopee. Lejes or Olvan are better jack of all trades than Kamil is, due to having better growths and a better spell selection.

to:

* MacGuffinDeliveryService: [[spoiler:Once you obtain all of the runes, Gorsia steals their power and breaks them into pieces.]]
* MasterOfNone: Kamil. Intended as a JackOfAllTrades, the stat growths growth bug leaves him worse than everybody at almost everything. Literally the ONLY two people he beats at ANYTHING are Lux and Wilme in MP and Valsu and Esuna in Power; he's got more magic than the non-magic classes, and more combat ability than the non-combat ones. Whoopee. Lejes or Olvan are better jack of all trades than Kamil is, due to having better growths and a better spell selection.



* One-Hit-PointWonder: The player character for a long time when facing unfair mobs of overpowered enemies, Esuna busy the mage girl all the time against heavy-hitting enemies, IF they it her
* OneStattoRuleThemAll: Speed: it regulates chance to hit, chance to dodge, chance to escape, which pretty much guarantee the protagonists survival (Lejes + Esuna have the Highest Speed Combined, making them a very evasive and escapist team, but very, very weak to physical attacks)

to:

* One-Hit-PointWonder: OneHitPointWonder: The player character for a long time when facing unfair mobs of overpowered enemies, enemies. Esuna busy the mage girl all the time against heavy-hitting enemies, IF they it her
hit her.
* OneStattoRuleThemAll: OneStatToRuleThemAll: Speed: it regulates chance to hit, chance to dodge, chance to escape, which pretty much guarantee the protagonists survival (Lejes + Esuna have the Highest Speed Combined, making them a very evasive and escapist team, but very, very weak to physical attacks)



* PointofNoReturn: Once the past it is reached, you cannot fight easier enemies anymore

to:

* PointofNoReturn: PointOfNoReturn: Once the past it is reached, you cannot fight easier enemies anymore



* ScratchDamage: 1 is the minimum amount of HP you will lose by any attack
* Secret A.I.Moves: Poisoning Touch, inflicting "Poison", an enemy-only status effect
* Self-ImposedChallenge: Beating the game with very bad pairings (Wilme + Lux for example) is a well known challenge
* ShapedLikeItself: An enemy called the sword has a chance of dropping a weapon called Sword (famous for being Wilme's only equip-able weapon) when it's defeated. Except 7th Saga equipment is automatically suffixed with the type of item, so the item's full name is "Sword Sword".

to:

* ScratchDamage: 1 is the minimum amount of HP you will lose by any attack
attack..
* Secret A.I.Moves: SecretAIMoves: Poisoning Touch, inflicting "Poison", an enemy-only status effect
effect.
* Self-ImposedChallenge: SelfImposedChallenge: Beating the game with very bad pairings (Wilme + Lux for example) is a well known challenge
challenge.
* ShapedLikeItself: An enemy called the sword has a chance of dropping a weapon called Sword (famous for being Wilme's only equip-able equipable weapon) when it's defeated. Except 7th Saga equipment is automatically suffixed with the type of item, so the item's full name is "Sword Sword".



* StandardRPGItems: Pretty much, with the added utility of some items that imitate buffing\debuffing spells

to:

* StandardRPGItems: Pretty much, with the added utility of some items that imitate buffing\debuffing spellsspells.



* [[spoiler: TakingYouWithMe: The final boss fight.]]

to:

* [[spoiler: TakingYouWithMe: The [[spoiler:The final boss fight.]]



* {{Useless Useful Spell}}: Averted. Petrify, Defense2, Vacuum1, and Vacuum2 are all very useful, due to how hard normal enemies are.

to:

* {{Useless Useful Spell}}: Averted. Petrify, Defense2, Vacuum1, [=Defense2=], [=Vacuum1=], and Vacuum2 [=Vacuum2=] are all very useful, due to how hard normal enemies are.



* UnwinnablebyDesign: Once you are back to the past, if you are way too low level (level 25-30), you are done for as enemies are WAY too strong
* VillainForgottoLevelGrind: The only mandatory fight against an apprentice has the apprentice being set at +5 levels in relation to when you exited from an early-game cave after beating Bounty-Hunter Pison

to:

* UnwinnablebyDesign: UnwinnableByDesign: Once you are back to the past, if you are way too low level (level 25-30), you are done for as enemies are WAY too strong
* VillainForgottoLevelGrind: VillainForgotToLevelGrind: The only mandatory fight against an apprentice has the apprentice being set at +5 levels in relation to when you exited from an early-game cave after beating Bounty-Hunter PisonPison.



* YouALLLookFamiliar: The water sage being identical to other sages around the world: children being carbon-copies of each other and much more on
----

to:

* YouALLLookFamiliar: YouAllLookFamiliar: The water sage being identical to other sages around the world: world, children being carbon-copies of each other and much more on
----
more.
5th Jul '16 7:58:52 AM karl90
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* AbsurdlyHighLevelCap: Level 78, when you can complete the game at level 60 (solo) or 45 (coupled with another apprentice)



* AllinaRow: The apprentice and the occasional non-fighting NPC guest will follow you thoroughly through the adventure



* ArmorandMagicDon'tMix: Esuna and Lejes, the two magic caster characters, cannot wear armor at all, being very frail to physical attacks
* BattleThemeMusic: Quite the memorable tunes
* BeatThematTheirOwnGame: Most of the enemies that abuse deadly status effects are subsceptible to them: use them yourself (if you have a magician\hybrid character) or hoard on "Magic Mirrors", them being pretty much "Reflect" from Final Fantasy for such kind of spells (do not reflect instant death)
* BlackandWhiteMagic: Most of the characters can use either one, either the other, or a mix of both, or rather a unique set of spells



* CameraLock-On: While fighting, you have to select an enemy and the camera locks on him
* CanonName: Each apprentice has one, just don't input any name when selecting a character at the start of the game



* CriticalHit: Critical hits will either make or disrupt a match
* CrueltyIstheOnlyOption: You are forced to kill a witch that just kidnapped kids to make them play happily together, because she lost her own child unfarly, to receive a required plot-advancing contrivance



* FakeDifficulty: The game (or at least the American version) practically ''is'' this, since the difficulty largely comes from insufficient stat boosts when you level up. Also, if you chose Esuna or Lux as your main character, you'll have to take a ferry to the northern continent. You get dropped in an area with monsters 7-8 levels above where you're supposed to be. Hope you can outrun them.

to:

* FakeDifficulty: DiscOneFinalDungeon: The game (or at least the American version) practically ''is'' this, since the difficulty largely comes from insufficient stat boosts when you level up. Also, if you chose Esuna or Lux as your main character, you'll have to take a ferry to the northern continent. You get dropped in an area with monsters 7-8 levels above cave where you're supposed to be. Hope you can outrun them.fight Present!Gorsia


Added DiffLines:

* AnEconomyIsYou: No food, no house utilities: what is sold is just what you specifically need
* EarlyGameHell: Under-equipped, poor, against lethal crows
* Enemy-DetectingRadar: The first RPG to have one, making random encounters only semi-random, has one, if flaired enough, can skip them by zig-zagging through them
* EventFlag: Pretty much how the game works: once you have set on the flag for something to happen, it will happen.
* ExperienceBooster: By going solo, you will level up twice faster, so you can just go solo until you are very high in level and then ask an apprentice that has not became an enemy of yours to join (him\her having stronger stats compared to you when you are at the same level, as the US version of the game decreases the stat gains a character YOU use obtains after a fight, while leaving the apprentice you ask help from intact)
*ExpositoryGameplayLimitation: While visiting a foreign continent eternally covered in snow, for a while a curse won't allow you to use any abilities nor spells, greatly limiting caster characters
* FakeDifficulty: The game (or at least the American version) practically ''is'' this, since the difficulty largely comes from insufficient stat boosts when you level up. Also, if you chose Esuna or Lux as your main character, you'll have to take a ferry to the northern continent. You get dropped in an area with monsters 7-8 levels above where you're supposed to be. Hope you can outrun them.
* FakeBalance: Enemies have skills you cannot use; enemies have chances to resist\dodge status effects you can acquire only via very obscure to be found equiment garments; enemies will one-shot you often if unprepared\not defending


Added DiffLines:

* Game-FavoredGender: the only female character, Esuna the magician elf, is the worst to add as an end-game party, as magic-attacks are extremely weak by then (subversion for buffs and debuffs, being always useful regardless the situation); in comparison, the meelee fighters and only hybrid spell caster are way stronger, with the hybrid mage\fighter reaching the pick at the end of his training, obtaining utility spells unattainable by any other character
* GetontheBoat: If you are playing as Esuna the female sorcercer or friendly clanky cluttery robot Lux, you will sail on a boat to reach a far-end area the other side of the continent, where enemies are MUCH stronger... this two characters are clearly the "hard mode" representative to an already difficult game (US Version only, JP version is piss easy)


Added DiffLines:

* JobSystem: Each character represents a class: Electric Magic Tank (Lux), Red Mage (Kamil), Glass Cannon Black Knight (Lejes), Fire Magic Tank (Olvan), Fire Magic Heavy Hitter (Wilme), Evasive Black Mage (Esuna)
* LevelGrinding: Required to just beat the second weakest enemy in the game


Added DiffLines:

* MetalSlime: "Brain" family monsters in the US Version, with the "running away" technique replaced with "massively powerful 1-hit kill electricity-based spell". Good exp and gold rewarded too. Also, Naked Golden Man (US Version only) function as this.


Added DiffLines:

* One-Hit-PointWonder: The player character for a long time when facing unfair mobs of overpowered enemies, Esuna busy the mage girl all the time against heavy-hitting enemies, IF they it her
* OneStattoRuleThemAll: Speed: it regulates chance to hit, chance to dodge, chance to escape, which pretty much guarantee the protagonists survival (Lejes + Esuna have the Highest Speed Combined, making them a very evasive and escapist team, but very, very weak to physical attacks)
* RandomEvent: The allied apprentice has a chance to betray you, with a minimum of 1/256 up to a maximum of 1/8 (it changes in relation to the apprentice you are sided with, and only at very important events or when you are deciding to swap the apprentice you sided with for another)


Added DiffLines:

* PointofNoReturn: Once the past it is reached, you cannot fight easier enemies anymore


Added DiffLines:

* ScratchDamage: 1 is the minimum amount of HP you will lose by any attack
* Secret A.I.Moves: Poisoning Touch, inflicting "Poison", an enemy-only status effect
* Self-ImposedChallenge: Beating the game with very bad pairings (Wilme + Lux for example) is a well known challenge


Added DiffLines:

* Sidequest: None at all!
* StandardRPGItems: Pretty much, with the added utility of some items that imitate buffing\debuffing spells
* StoryBreadcrumbs: The backstory of the game is quite vast but most of it can only be discerned by talking to random NPC more times


Added DiffLines:

* ThematicSeries: The first, followed by Mystic Ark for SNES and Mystic Ark 2 (very obscure) for PS1


Added DiffLines:

* TierSystem: It changes in relation to how far in the game one is. At the beginning of the game, as characters obtain spells and abilities that make them better at facing various enemies with stats to match. It works like this: Lux>Wilme>Esuna>Olvan>Kamil>Valsu>Lejes at the beginning; Lejes>Lux>Valsu>Wilme>Olvan>Esuna>Kamil at the end of the game


Added DiffLines:

* UniversalPoison: Enemies-only status effect to boot! And it is always afflicted by a strong physical attack
* UnwinnablebyDesign: Once you are back to the past, if you are way too low level (level 25-30), you are done for as enemies are WAY too strong
* VillainForgottoLevelGrind: The only mandatory fight against an apprentice has the apprentice being set at +5 levels in relation to when you exited from an early-game cave after beating Bounty-Hunter Pison


Added DiffLines:

* YouALLLookFamiliar: The water sage being identical to other sages around the world: children being carbon-copies of each other and much more on
13th Feb '16 4:02:05 PM Prfnoff
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'''''The 7th Saga''''' (known as '''''Elnard''''' in Japan) is an {{R|olePlayingGame}}PG for the {{S|uperNintendoEntertainmentSystem}}NES, released in 1993. It is known for one thing, and that is [[NintendoHard difficulty]].

to:

'''''The ''The 7th Saga''''' Saga'' (known as '''''Elnard''''' ''Elnard'' in Japan) is an {{R|olePlayingGame}}PG for the {{S|uperNintendoEntertainmentSystem}}NES, released in 1993. It is known for one thing, and that is [[NintendoHard difficulty]].
23rd Jan '16 3:19:26 PM Hayati
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Added DiffLines:

* HellIsThatNoise: Whenever Vacuum2 is used, a high pitched screech is played.
4th Oct '15 7:20:00 PM hamonrye
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->''This is one of the stories that will be known for generations to come.''

to:

->''This is one of the stories that will be known talked about for generations to come.''



-->'''[[http://lparchive.org/The-7th-Saga/Update%2031/ Nakar]]''': This isn't a photoshop. The project leader is named Dr. Fail...Foma is not evil per se, but '''runs''' on evil. I guess they're siphoning the Dark World, you know the place where all the monsters and GORSIA come from, to power a computer. This is quite possibly the most idiotic thing anyone in any RPG has ever tried.

to:

-->'''[[http://lparchive.org/The-7th-Saga/Update%2031/ Nakar]]''': This isn't a photoshop. The project leader is named Dr. Fail...Okay, Foma is not evil per se, but '''runs''' on evil. I guess they're siphoning the Dark World, World -- you know the place where all the monsters and GORSIA come from, from -- to power a computer. This is quite possibly the most idiotic thing anyone in any RPG has ever tried.
4th Oct '15 9:04:18 AM hamonrye
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This game is notorious for the nasty tricks it pulls on the player, most of which were exacerbated by Enix's bean-counting localization team. In an effort to pad out the length, Nintendo had a habit of jacking up the damage output and random encounters in their games, rendering some of them unplayable. The US version of ''7th Saga'' is one of the biggest casualties of this approach. Blessedly, it was also one of the last.

to:

This game is notorious for the nasty tricks it pulls on the player, most of which were exacerbated by Enix's {{Creator/Enix}}'s bean-counting localization team. In an effort to pad out the length, Nintendo had a habit of jacking up the damage output and random encounters in their games, rendering some of them unplayable. The US English version of ''7th Saga'' is one of the biggest casualties of this approach. Blessedly, it was also one of the last.
4th Oct '15 9:03:26 AM hamonrye
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This game is notorious for the nasty tricks it pulls on the player, most of which were exacerbated by Nintendo's bean-counting localization team. In an effort to pad out the length, Nintendo had a habit of jacking up the damage output and random encounters in their games, rendering some of them unplayable. The US version of ''7th Saga'' is one of the biggest casualties of this approach. Blessedly, it was also one of the last.

to:

This game is notorious for the nasty tricks it pulls on the player, most of which were exacerbated by Nintendo's Enix's bean-counting localization team. In an effort to pad out the length, Nintendo had a habit of jacking up the damage output and random encounters in their games, rendering some of them unplayable. The US version of ''7th Saga'' is one of the biggest casualties of this approach. Blessedly, it was also one of the last.



* {{AI Is A Crapshoot}}: New rule: You do not power a giant supercomputer with pure evil.

to:

* {{AI Is A Crapshoot}}: Crapshoot}}[=/=]AppliedPhlebotinum: New rule: You do not power a giant supercomputer with pure evil.
4th Oct '15 9:00:43 AM hamonrye
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* DifficultyByRegion: Due to developer carelessness in the US and EU versions]], you get smaller bonuses upon levelup, and the game was not rebalanced accordingly. (Naturally there are fan-created patches that fix this.) It's entirely possible for some characters to die on the very first monster they encounter. The amount of level grinding} [[ForcedLevelGrinding needed to get anywhere]] borders on the obscene with certain characters. But the game {{cap}}s your level just a little too soon so you're never quite the level you need to be. Equipment is also overpriced and underpowered. Monsters regularly thrown nasty status effects and instant death attacks at you. It's the hardest RPG on the SNES without question.

to:

* DifficultyByRegion: Due to developer carelessness in the US and EU versions]], versions, you get smaller bonuses upon levelup, and the game was not rebalanced accordingly. (Naturally there are [[{{UsefulNotes/Emulation}} fan-created patches patches]] that fix this.) It's entirely possible for some characters to die on the very first monster they encounter. The amount of level grinding} [[ForcedLevelGrinding needed to get anywhere]] borders on the obscene with certain characters. But the game {{cap}}s your level just a little too soon so you're never quite the level you need to be. Equipment is also overpriced and underpowered. Monsters regularly thrown nasty status effects and instant death attacks at you. It's the hardest RPG on the SNES without question.
4th Oct '15 8:59:55 AM hamonrye
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* CataclysmicBackstory: Half an eon later and the world is still limping away from Gorsia's destruction.

to:

* CataclysmicBackstory: CataclysmBackstory: Half an eon later and the world is still limping away from Gorsia's destruction.
4th Oct '15 8:59:36 AM hamonrye
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-->'''[[http://lparchive.org/The-7th-Saga/Update%2031/ Nakar]]'''''': This isn't a photoshop. The project leader is named Dr. Fail...Foma is not evil per se, but '''runs''' on evil. I guess they're siphoning the Dark World, you know the place where all the monsters and GORSIA come from, to power a computer. This is quite possibly the most idiotic thing anyone in any RPG has ever tried.

to:

-->'''[[http://lparchive.org/The-7th-Saga/Update%2031/ Nakar]]'''''': Nakar]]''': This isn't a photoshop. The project leader is named Dr. Fail...Foma is not evil per se, but '''runs''' on evil. I guess they're siphoning the Dark World, you know the place where all the monsters and GORSIA come from, to power a computer. This is quite possibly the most idiotic thing anyone in any RPG has ever tried.
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