History ValuesDissonance / VideoGames

16th Feb '17 6:38:33 PM FF32
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* ''RuleOfRose'' was subject to this trope in many parts of Europe where the publishers were pressured to pulling it out of the shelves. All because it depicted children as something other than innocent little angels, capable of extreme cruelty and spite, and possessing early signs of developing sexuality -- even though nothing unwholesome happens with preteen children in that area, and the sexual abuse of a sixteen-year old girl is treated with all the horror it deserves.

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* ''RuleOfRose'' ''VideoGame/RuleOfRose'' was subject to this trope in many parts of Europe where the publishers were pressured to pulling it out of the shelves. All because it depicted children as something other than innocent little angels, capable of extreme cruelty and spite, and possessing early signs of developing sexuality -- even though nothing unwholesome happens with preteen children in that area, and the sexual abuse of a sixteen-year old girl is treated with all the horror it deserves.
10th Feb '17 12:46:05 PM Mineboot45
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** Australia's game classification system in general can be a case of this trope for other countries, as several games are rated higher or lower there than averywhere else. It seems that sex and violence are really the only things that can push a game into the two highest categories (MA15+ and R18+), while countries like America can have games rated M due simply to mature themes (the [=MegaTen=] series being a prime example). Australia also views cartoon violence as less "harsh" than realistic violence, hence why games like ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBros'', ''Franchise/RatchetAndClank'', and ''VideoGame/TeamFortress2'' get lower ratings there than America. Meanwhile ''AtelierTotoriTheAdventurerOfArland'', rated T by the ESRB and 12 by PEGI, was classified R18+ in Australia simply for [[RapeIsASpecialKindOfEvil "references to sexual violence"]], ''VideoGame/EarthBound'' is slapped with an M (13+) for crude humor and "sexual references", and ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaSkywardSword'' got a 15+ rating over there, but an E10+ rating in America and 12+ in Europe.

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** Australia's game classification system in general can be a case of this trope for other countries, as several games are rated higher or lower there than averywhere else. It seems that sex and violence are really the only things that can push a game into the two highest categories (MA15+ ([=MA15+=] and R18+), while countries like America can have games rated M due simply to mature themes (the [=MegaTen=] series being a prime example). Australia also views cartoon violence as less "harsh" than realistic violence, hence why games like ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBros'', ''Franchise/RatchetAndClank'', and ''VideoGame/TeamFortress2'' get lower ratings there than America. Meanwhile ''AtelierTotoriTheAdventurerOfArland'', rated T by the ESRB and 12 by PEGI, was classified R18+ in Australia simply for [[RapeIsASpecialKindOfEvil "references to sexual violence"]], ''VideoGame/EarthBound'' is slapped with an M (13+) for crude humor and "sexual references", and ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaSkywardSword'' got a 15+ rating over there, but an E10+ rating in America and 12+ in Europe.
3rd Feb '17 4:48:51 AM Aipom-pom
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* In the Japanese version of ''VideoGame/IceClimbers'' the yeti-looking Topis are seals. They were redesigned internationally due to the fact seal clubbing is more of a controversial subject outside of Japan. This change affected ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBros Melee'' as well. Even if you put your game's language to Japanese, Topis will not turn into seals unless you own a Japanese copy.

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* In the Japanese version of ''VideoGame/IceClimbers'' ''VideoGame/IceClimber'' the yeti-looking Topis are seals. They were redesigned internationally due to the fact seal clubbing is more of a controversial subject outside of Japan. This change affected ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBros Melee'' as well. Even if you put your game's language to Japanese, Topis will not turn into seals unless you own a Japanese copy.



* In ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZelda'', the third dungeon is in the shape of a Manji, which is sometimes called a reverse swastika. While the Manji itself has a more religious meaning, most western players saw it as the swastika used by the Nazis. On the subject of religion, the game and its sequel have the holy cross symbol on Link's shield and on the gravestones found in the graveyard. The Magic Book item not only had a cross on it as well, but it was called a Bible in the Japanese version. Originally, [[WhatCouldHaveBeen the games were going to feature Christianity as the main religion everyone followed]], but the idea was changed to having just nameless gods. While Japanese games usually have no problem using religious references and characters, they are widely seen as taboo for Nintendo games due to the main audience being young children. The cross idea was dropped by ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaALinkToThePast'', but the Japanese version still referenced gods and the title was called ''Trifoce of the Gods'' instead of ''A Link to the Past''. By ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaOcarinaOfTime'', characters and text talking about goddesses and gods were done more freely in the English version since there was no real life religions or symbols being used.

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* In ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZelda'', the third dungeon is in the shape of a Manji, which is sometimes called a reverse swastika. While the Manji itself has a more religious meaning, most western players saw it as the swastika used by the Nazis. On the subject of religion, the game and its sequel have the holy cross symbol on Link's shield and on the gravestones found in the graveyard. The Magic Book item not only had a cross on it as well, but it was called a Bible in the Japanese version. Originally, [[WhatCouldHaveBeen the games were going to feature Christianity as the main religion everyone followed]], but the idea was changed to having just nameless gods. While Japanese games usually have no problem using religious references and characters, they are widely seen as taboo for Nintendo games due to the main audience being young children. The cross idea was dropped by ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaALinkToThePast'', but the Japanese version still referenced gods and the title was called ''Trifoce ''Triforce of the Gods'' instead of ''A Link to the Past''. By ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaOcarinaOfTime'', characters and text talking about goddesses and gods were done more freely in the English version since there was no real life religions or symbols being used.
17th Jan '17 7:12:04 PM jormis29
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* As a general factor to note when it comes to values dissonance and video game storytelling, Japanese gamers and critics alike are generally more accepting of wacky, over-the-top, and - above all else - heavily disjointed plotlines that western gamers often find difficult to keep up with or make sense of. In Japan, games such as ''Bayonetta'', ''Killer Is Dead'', ''Final Fantasy XIII'', and ''Devil's Third'' have been praised for their wild and exciting plotlines that take players on a multitude of different paths and thus, add to the overall fun. In the western world however, such games have been criticized by many discerning gamers and critics (i.e. [[WebAnimation/ZeroPunctuation Yahtzee]] and [[WebVideo/{{Jimquisition}} Jim Sterling]]) for being poorly thought-out and all over the place; a jumbled mess of ideas thrown randomly together with no overarching theme, concept, premise, or focus point that would otherwise tie everything together. As Jim points out in [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2DGSR7ZY_sU this video]], this is likely the reason for Square Enix's infamous downward spiral in the West post-2001; ''"If brevity is the sole of wit, then Square Enix boasts some of the most witless fuckers in video games"''.

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* As a general factor to note when it comes to values dissonance and video game storytelling, Japanese gamers and critics alike are generally more accepting of wacky, over-the-top, and - above all else - heavily disjointed plotlines that western gamers often find difficult to keep up with or make sense of. In Japan, games such as ''Bayonetta'', ''Killer Is Dead'', ''Final Fantasy XIII'', ''VideoGame/{{Bayonetta}}'', ''VideoGame/KillerIsDead'', ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyXIII'', and ''Devil's Third'' ''VideoGame/DevilsThird'' have been praised for their wild and exciting plotlines that take players on a multitude of different paths and thus, add to the overall fun. In the western world however, such games have been criticized by many discerning gamers and critics (i.e. [[WebAnimation/ZeroPunctuation Yahtzee]] and [[WebVideo/{{Jimquisition}} Jim Sterling]]) for being poorly thought-out and all over the place; a jumbled mess of ideas thrown randomly together with no overarching theme, concept, premise, or focus point that would otherwise tie everything together. As Jim points out in [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2DGSR7ZY_sU this video]], this is likely the reason for Square Enix's infamous downward spiral in the West post-2001; ''"If brevity is the sole of wit, then Square Enix boasts some of the most witless fuckers in video games"''.



* Similarly, America's ESRB is ''much'' harsher on sexual content than most other countries, and many games that get M ratings for sexual content in America get lower ratings overseas (such as Akiba's Trip, which is rated the equivalent of T in Australia). "Partial Nudity", which even extends to exposed breasts on monster enemies not intended as sexual, is grounds for an automatic M rating in the ESRB's system, while other countries allow it in lower ratings and only give high ratings for full-frountal, explicitly sexual nudity. And the gap between the ESRB's M and AO ratings is only sexual content in most cases, leading to ''VideoGame/GrandTheftAutoSanAndreas'' getting pulled from shelves and re-rated due to the "Hot Coffee" mod (there was little fanfare in Europe since the game was already rated 18+ for violence anyway). Skimpy outfits on characters is sometimes enough for an ESRB M rating, which often results in outfits being censored in US releases (for example, Tharja's swimsuit scene in ''VideoGame/FireEmblemAwakening'''s DLC was censored in the US version, but not in the European version).

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* Similarly, America's ESRB is ''much'' harsher on sexual content than most other countries, and many games that get M ratings for sexual content in America get lower ratings overseas (such as Akiba's Trip, ''VideoGame/AkibasTrip'', which is rated the equivalent of T in Australia). "Partial Nudity", which even extends to exposed breasts on monster enemies not intended as sexual, is grounds for an automatic M rating in the ESRB's system, while other countries allow it in lower ratings and only give high ratings for full-frountal, explicitly sexual nudity. And the gap between the ESRB's M and AO ratings is only sexual content in most cases, leading to ''VideoGame/GrandTheftAutoSanAndreas'' getting pulled from shelves and re-rated due to the "Hot Coffee" mod (there was little fanfare in Europe since the game was already rated 18+ for violence anyway). Skimpy outfits on characters is sometimes enough for an ESRB M rating, which often results in outfits being censored in US releases (for example, Tharja's swimsuit scene in ''VideoGame/FireEmblemAwakening'''s DLC was censored in the US version, but not in the European version).
11th Jan '17 1:02:35 PM Steven
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Added DiffLines:

* In ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZelda'', the third dungeon is in the shape of a Manji, which is sometimes called a reverse swastika. While the Manji itself has a more religious meaning, most western players saw it as the swastika used by the Nazis. On the subject of religion, the game and its sequel have the holy cross symbol on Link's shield and on the gravestones found in the graveyard. The Magic Book item not only had a cross on it as well, but it was called a Bible in the Japanese version. Originally, [[WhatCouldHaveBeen the games were going to feature Christianity as the main religion everyone followed]], but the idea was changed to having just nameless gods. While Japanese games usually have no problem using religious references and characters, they are widely seen as taboo for Nintendo games due to the main audience being young children. The cross idea was dropped by ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaALinkToThePast'', but the Japanese version still referenced gods and the title was called ''Trifoce of the Gods'' instead of ''A Link to the Past''. By ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaOcarinaOfTime'', characters and text talking about goddesses and gods were done more freely in the English version since there was no real life religions or symbols being used.
7th Jan '17 10:36:21 PM SuperMafia
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Added DiffLines:

** It may be getting better, if one does wanna take a look at the ''Shantae'' series. For having a lot of cute girls in skimpy outfits and braless mermaids, it does go pretty well in the E10+/T rating.
1st Jan '17 2:34:39 PM Valiona
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** [[GagPenis Mara]]'s presence alone should be enough to force an M rating on any [=MegaTen=] game it's in, since the Persona in question appears as ''[[{{Squick}} a man-sized slimy penis with a mouth, spindly human arms]] and NaughtyTentacles'' riding a chariot. The few US-released games in the franchise that don't have a T rating are the same games that don't feature him. A prime example would be comparing ''VideoGame/Persona4ArenaUltimax'' to ''{{VideoGame/Persona Q}}''. ''Ultimax'' is a fighting game that features teenagers beating up each other with swords, knives ect. and doesn't have Mara. It's rated T. On the other hand, ''Q'' has RPG elements of defeating Shadows and even has a cute artstyle...and has Mara. It's rated M. M for Mara indeed.
** There's even a bit of ValuesDissonance between English speaking countries on the series, since America is the only country that rates the ''Persona'' series as high as M (17+). There, "sexualized imagary" (Mara and some female Personas having exposed breasts) is enough to warrent an M rating, whereas other countries don't consider that nearly as harsh, since there's no ''actual'' sexual acts depicted in the series. Looking at the ESRB page for ''VideoGame/{{Persona4}}'' also shows that a major factor in its M rating was the "King's Game" scene, where the teenaged protagonists go to a bar and start acting drunk and playing "drinking games" despite the game making very clear that their drinks are non-alcaholic (the bar has never served alcohol in years). This is probably due to America's legal drinking age being much higher than most other countries.

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** [[GagPenis Mara]]'s presence alone should be enough to force an M rating on any [=MegaTen=] game it's in, since the Persona in question appears as ''[[{{Squick}} a man-sized slimy penis with a mouth, spindly human arms]] and NaughtyTentacles'' riding a chariot. The few US-released games in the franchise that don't have a T rating are the same games that don't feature him. A prime example would be comparing ''VideoGame/Persona4ArenaUltimax'' to ''{{VideoGame/Persona Q}}''. ''Ultimax'' is a fighting game that features teenagers beating up each other with swords, knives ect.knives, etc. and doesn't have Mara. It's rated T. On the other hand, ''Q'' has RPG elements of defeating Shadows and even has a cute artstyle...and has Mara. It's rated M. M for Mara indeed.
** There's even a bit of ValuesDissonance between English speaking countries on the series, since America is the only country that rates the ''Persona'' series as high as M (17+). There, "sexualized imagary" (Mara and some female Personas having exposed breasts) is enough to warrent an M rating, whereas other countries don't consider that nearly as harsh, since there's no ''actual'' sexual acts depicted in the series. Looking at the ESRB page for ''VideoGame/{{Persona4}}'' also shows that a major factor in its M rating was the "King's Game" scene, where the teenaged protagonists go to a bar and start acting drunk and playing "drinking games" despite the game making very clear that their drinks are non-alcaholic (the bar has never served alcohol in years). This is probably due to America's legal drinking age being much higher than most other countries. countries.
** In the ''Golden'' re-release of Persona 4, Adachi complains about having to serve as a peacemaker in a domestic dispute as an example of how boring Inaba is, reflecting Japanese attitudes about outside intervention in family affairs. That said, Adachi's boredom over being stuck as a detective in Inaba [[spoiler:results in him killing two people and sitting back to watch as the end of the world happens]], so it's unclear how sympathetic he's supposed to be when complaining about his work. In another bit of Adachi-related Values Dissonance, he also claims that he wanted to become a police officer so that he could legally carry a gun, something that would naturally happen as a result of Japan's strict gun control laws (and makes one wonder how Naoto, a teenager, got permission to carry one).
25th Dec '16 7:07:15 PM Drope
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** The entire court system is this. It is supposed to satirize the Japanese court system, which is heavily biased towards the prosecution, an aspect that baffles western audiences (who are more used to more impartial trials).

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** The entire court system is this. It is supposed to satirize the Japanese court system, which is heavily biased towards the prosecution, an aspect that baffles western audiences (who are more used to more impartial trials).systems).
25th Dec '16 7:05:25 PM Drope
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* The entire court system is this. It is supposed to satirize the Japanese court system, which is heavily biased towards the prosecution, an aspect that baffles westerners( who are used to more fair and impartial systems).

to:

* ** The entire court system is this. It is supposed to satirize the Japanese court system, which is heavily biased towards the prosecution, an aspect that baffles westerners( who western audiences (who are more used to more fair and impartial systems).trials).
25th Dec '16 7:03:12 PM Drope
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* Godot, a character in the third ''Franchise/AceAttorney'' game, is viewed by western audiences as sexist and patronizing towards women: he refuses to take Franziska seriously and tends to refer to her by condescending pet names, not to mention his insistence that Mia needed to be protected, if not by him then by Phoenix. While it is still presented as a character flaw in the Japanese version (given that his guilt over his failure and resentment toward Phoenix [[spoiler:led him to make a plan to protect Mia's sister Maya that results in him killing their mother]]), it's not presented as a serious flaw; as a result, he's pretty much universally beloved in Japan (although he is still much-loved in western audiences as well).

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* ''Franchise/AceAttorney''
* The entire court system is this. It is supposed to satirize the Japanese court system, which is heavily biased towards the prosecution, an aspect that baffles westerners( who are used to more fair and impartial systems).
**
Godot, a character in the third ''Franchise/AceAttorney'' game, is viewed by western audiences as sexist and patronizing towards women: he refuses to take Franziska seriously and tends to refer to her by condescending pet names, not to mention his insistence that Mia needed to be protected, if not by him then by Phoenix. While it is still presented as a character flaw in the Japanese version (given that his guilt over his failure and resentment toward Phoenix [[spoiler:led him to make a plan to protect Mia's sister Maya that results in him killing their mother]]), it's not presented as a serious flaw; as a result, he's pretty much universally beloved in Japan (although he is still much-loved in western audiences as well).
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=ValuesDissonance.VideoGames