History Main / MaryTzu

7th Jun '16 2:52:47 AM Morgenthaler
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Named for SunTzu, a RealLife (maybe) [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun_Tzu Ancient Chinese general]] whose ''[[TheArtOfWar Art of War]]'' is still used by many militaries around the world and is considered one of the greatest treatises on warfare ever written, as well as MarySue, the archetype of the unrealistically perfect protagonist.

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Named for SunTzu, a RealLife (maybe) [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun_Tzu Ancient Chinese general]] whose ''[[TheArtOfWar Art of War]]'' ''Literature/TheArtOfWar'' is still used by many militaries around the world and is considered one of the greatest treatises on warfare ever written, as well as MarySue, the archetype of the unrealistically perfect protagonist.
29th May '15 8:39:12 AM rjd1922
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'''No examples please, as this just explains the term.'''

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'''No examples please, as this just explains the a term.'''
29th May '15 8:38:53 AM rjd1922
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'''No examples please, this just explains the term.'''

to:

'''No examples please, as this just explains the term.'''
26th Apr '15 6:44:08 PM Mr.Movie
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In Real Life cases exist of brilliant strategists successfully predicting their opponent's plans, only to then dismiss their own prediction as depending on ascribing Mary Tzu-like powers to their enemy.


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In Real Life cases exist of brilliant strategists successfully predicting their opponent's plans, only to then dismiss their own prediction as depending on ascribing Mary Tzu-like powers to their enemy.

enemy, as well as certain commanders having a Marty Tzu status in legend and image if not in actual performance.

25th Mar '15 5:09:46 PM Kendrix
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->''[[DrivingQuestion Who is Clara Oswald?]] Well it is clear that this version of her character is a shallow vacuous non-entity...The way that she suddenly turns into some kind of military commander who can handle open warfare with the Cybermen is just taking the piss. There is no sense that this kind of responsibility bothers her or makes her doubt herself; nope, she takes to the stage like General Custer and barks orders like she has been doing this all of her life.''
-->--'''[[http://docohobigfinish.blogspot.com/2012/09/series-seven.html Doc Oho]]''' on ''Series/DoctorWho'', [[{{Recap/DoctorWhos33e12NightmareinSilver}} "Nightmare in Silver"]]

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->''[[DrivingQuestion Who is Clara Oswald?]] Well it is clear that this version of her character is a shallow vacuous non-entity...The way that she suddenly turns into some kind of military commander who can handle open warfare with the Cybermen is just taking the piss. There is no sense that this kind of responsibility bothers her or makes her doubt herself; nope, she takes to the stage like General Custer and barks orders like she has been doing this all of her life.''
-->--'''[[http://docohobigfinish.blogspot.com/2012/09/series-seven.html Doc Oho]]''' on ''Series/DoctorWho'', [[{{Recap/DoctorWhos33e12NightmareinSilver}} "Nightmare in Silver"]]

12th Jan '15 10:32:56 AM hbi2k
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Compare to TheChessmaster or TheStrategist, which are for masterminds that push, but don't destroy, WillingSuspensionOfDisbelief. Also see HollywoodTactics and IdiotBall as (like all MarySue types), Mary Tzu's main ability is to make everyone else incompetent so that she looks good.

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Compare to TheChessmaster or TheStrategist, which are for masterminds that push, but don't destroy, WillingSuspensionOfDisbelief. Also see HollywoodTactics and IdiotBall as (like all MarySue types), a Mary Tzu's main ability is to make everyone else incompetent so that she looks they look good.
12th Jan '15 10:32:38 AM hbi2k
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More common in works revolving around warfare, a Mary Tzu is a character, usually a military commander, with unrealistic tactical abilities. She (or he; actually more often he, [[JustForPun we just couldn't pass up the pun]]) can pull a win out of any battle no matter how outnumbered, outgunned, or outmatched, she can guess any enemy commander's plan no matter how convoluted or how little information she has to work from, and any plan she comes up with will work perfectly, often employing HollywoodTactics, resulting in total enemy defeat and another smashing success for General Tzu's track record. As per the standard MarySue traits, such a character is usually treated as a paragon and/or revered by the other characters. Sometimes she comes complete with a BigBookOfWar, possibly written by her.

To be clear, this trope only deals with ''unrealistically'' good tacticians. ''Merely great'' commanders wouldn't apply, as long as they're fallible, or if they're written well enough to make their victories seem plausible. If it looks like they play GambitRoulette instead of [[ThePlan more sound and realistic plans]] you've got a Mary Tzu. Another test you can do: Are the character's victories all perfect? Or does he suffer losses and pay prices? Even if there isn't a GambitRoulette every other victory, having plans that are unrealistically successful, such as losing ''no'' troops who were sent in to distract heavy fire, that's also a Mary Tzu.

to:

More common in works revolving around warfare, a Mary Tzu is a character, usually a military commander, with unrealistic tactical abilities. She (or he; actually more often he, [[JustForPun we just couldn't pass up the pun]]) They can pull a win out of any battle no matter how outnumbered, outgunned, or outmatched, she can guess any enemy commander's plan no matter how convoluted or how little information she has they have to work from, and any plan she comes they come up with will work perfectly, often employing HollywoodTactics, resulting in total enemy defeat and another smashing success for General Tzu's track record. As per the standard MarySue traits, such a character is usually treated as a paragon and/or revered by the other characters. Sometimes she comes they come complete with a BigBookOfWar, possibly written by her.

self-written.

To be clear, this trope only deals with ''unrealistically'' good tacticians. ''Merely great'' commanders wouldn't apply, as long as they're fallible, or if they're written well enough to make their victories seem plausible. If it looks like they play GambitRoulette instead of [[ThePlan more sound and realistic plans]] you've got a Mary Tzu. Another test you can do: Are the character's victories all perfect? Or does he do they suffer losses and pay prices? Even if there isn't a GambitRoulette every other victory, having plans that are unrealistically successful, such as losing ''no'' troops who were sent in to distract heavy fire, that's also a Mary Tzu.
9th Jan '15 10:22:24 PM johnnyfog
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Added DiffLines:

->''[[DrivingQuestion Who is Clara Oswald?]] Well it is clear that this version of her character is a shallow vacuous non-entity...The way that she suddenly turns into some kind of military commander who can handle open warfare with the Cybermen is just taking the piss. There is no sense that this kind of responsibility bothers her or makes her doubt herself; nope, she takes to the stage like General Custer and barks orders like she has been doing this all of her life.''
-->--'''[[http://docohobigfinish.blogspot.com/2012/09/series-seven.html Doc Oho]]''' on ''Series/DoctorWho'', [[{{Recap/DoctorWhos33e12NightmareinSilver}} "Nightmare in Silver"]]
19th Sep '13 11:42:43 AM ChaoticNovelist
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In Real Life cases exist of brilliant strategists successfully predicting their opponent's plans, only to then dismiss their own prediction as depending on ascribing Mary Tzu-like powers to their enemy.




'''No examples please, this just explains the term.''' (Note in passing, however, that numerous Real Life cases exist of brilliant strategists successfully predicting their opponent's actual plans, only to then dismiss their own prediction as depending on ascribing Mary Tzu-like powers to their enemy.)

to:

'''No examples please, this just explains the term.''' (Note in passing, however, that numerous Real Life cases exist of brilliant strategists successfully predicting their opponent's actual plans, only to then dismiss their own prediction as depending on ascribing Mary Tzu-like powers to their enemy.)'''
31st Jan '13 5:35:59 PM skywerewolf
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To be clear, this trope only deals with ''unrealistically'' good tacticians. ''Merely great'' commanders wouldn't apply, as long as they're fallible, or if they're written well enough to make their victories seem plausible. If it looks like they play GambitRoulette instead of [[ThePlan more sound and realistic plans]] you've got a Mary Tzu.

to:

To be clear, this trope only deals with ''unrealistically'' good tacticians. ''Merely great'' commanders wouldn't apply, as long as they're fallible, or if they're written well enough to make their victories seem plausible. If it looks like they play GambitRoulette instead of [[ThePlan more sound and realistic plans]] you've got a Mary Tzu. Another test you can do: Are the character's victories all perfect? Or does he suffer losses and pay prices? Even if there isn't a GambitRoulette every other victory, having plans that are unrealistically successful, such as losing ''no'' troops who were sent in to distract heavy fire, that's also a Mary Tzu.
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