History Main / DecisiveBattle

27th Feb '16 12:30:27 AM Faruke97
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* In UsefulNotes/WorldWarTwo there are several examples of battles which helped turn the tide in favour of the allies. The battle of Stalingrad was the big one [[note]] The Soviets let the Germans dangerously overextend and totally exhaust themselves trying to take the city while drip-feeding just enough men in to keep them from taking it... before launching a devastating surprise counter-offensive that encircled the entire German siege-force. Although ''Unternehmen Taifun'' had been a defeat, the Soviet counter-offensive that had followed it had not been well-planned enough to make it a ''decisive'' one[[/note]], with 200,000 German combat-troops (and 200,000 Rumanians+Italians) and all their heavy weapons being killed or forced to surrender - this being a full 1/8 of the Germans' entire combat-strength on the Ostfront (1.6 million), and 1/9 of their entire combat-strength. While this may not sound like much, take our word for it that Germany would take at least six months to replace those losses[[note]] Well. 'Six months' at all-out war-production levels, but in 1942 Hitler had refused to fully convert the German economy to a war-footing. It was only ''after'' Stalingrad that this was done. This is because replacing these losses with the 1942-level of production would take ''four years''. [[/note]]and there was no way in hell that the Soviets were going to give them that kind of time (after Stalingrad they went on to liberate the entire Caucusus and eastern Ukraine in four months, killing or taking prisoner another 100,000 German and 100,000 Rumanian+Italian combat troops). Before Stalingrad, some thought the Germans could win the war. After Stalingrad, even the Germans themselves knew that they would lose[[note]] If only because before Taifun/The Winter Counter-Offensive/Stalingrad, the Germans assumed that reality did not apply to them and they would beat absolutely anyone they made war upon. As early as 29/6/1941, the seventh day of the war with the USSR, Joseph Goebbels (German minister of propaganda) noted that "In foreign countries our military situation is, if anything, being judged rather too optimistically, even by our enemies. They think our Wehrmacht capable of the most amazing achievements." This can be seen even today, where it is hard to find any works from the USA which analyse the Wehrmacht for what it really was (deeply flawed institution that could only succeed against weaker opponents) and not the image it projected (flawless, invincible army of genius supermen that only failed because it was [[ZergRush drowned out by endless hordes of mindless inferiors/subhumans]]) [[/note]].

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* In UsefulNotes/WorldWarTwo there are several examples of battles which helped turn the tide in favour of the allies. The battle of Stalingrad was the big one [[note]] The Soviets let the Germans dangerously overextend and totally exhaust themselves trying to take the city while drip-feeding just enough men in to keep them from taking it... before launching a devastating surprise counter-offensive that encircled the entire German siege-force. Although ''Unternehmen Taifun'' had been a defeat, the Soviet counter-offensive that had followed it had not been well-planned enough to make it a ''decisive'' one[[/note]], with 200,000 German combat-troops (and 200,000 Rumanians+Italians) and all their heavy weapons being killed or forced to surrender - this being a full 1/8 of the Germans' entire combat-strength on the Ostfront (1.6 million), and 1/9 of their entire combat-strength. While this may not sound like much, take our word for it that Germany would take at least six months to replace those losses[[note]] Well. 'Six months' at all-out war-production levels, but in 1942 Hitler had refused to fully convert the German economy to a war-footing. It was only ''after'' Stalingrad that this was done. This is because replacing these losses with the 1942-level of production would take ''four years''. [[/note]]and there was no way in hell that the Soviets were going to give them that kind of time (after Stalingrad they went on to liberate the entire Caucusus Caucasus and eastern Ukraine in four months, killing or taking prisoner another 100,000 German and 100,000 Rumanian+Italian combat troops). Before Stalingrad, some thought the Germans could win the war. After Stalingrad, even the Germans themselves knew that they would lose[[note]] If only because before Taifun/The Winter Counter-Offensive/Stalingrad, the Germans assumed that reality did not apply to them and they would beat absolutely anyone they made war upon. As early as 29/6/1941, the seventh day of the war with the USSR, Joseph Goebbels (German minister of propaganda) noted that "In foreign countries our military situation is, if anything, being judged rather too optimistically, even by our enemies. They think our Wehrmacht capable of the most amazing achievements." This can be seen even today, where it is hard to find any works from the USA which analyse the Wehrmacht for what it really was (deeply flawed institution that could only succeed against weaker opponents) and not the image it projected (flawless, invincible army of genius supermen that only failed because it was [[ZergRush drowned out by endless hordes of mindless inferiors/subhumans]]) [[/note]].
21st Dec '15 1:41:17 PM Str8taim
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** The Battle of the Bulge was the final decisive battle that erased any sliver of hope for the Germans that they might still win. Hitler hoped to split the Allied lines by dashing for and re-capturing the port of Antwerp. Despite taking the Allies completely by surprise, the Americans were able to hold the Germans off and then push back hard. While the battle was the bloodiest for the U.S. in the European theatre, with some 19,000 killed, the Germans had anywhere from 67,500 to 125,000 soldiers killed wounded or captured. And 800 tanks and armored guns were destroyed. As a result, Germany's last remaining strategic reserve forces were destroyed. The Western Allies soon invaded Germany itself,advancing rapidly through the western half of the country and with the Soviets squeezing them from the other side, the Nazis were finished within 5 months.
3rd Nov '15 5:48:03 PM Grithalmur
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* In the ''Franchise/{{FireEmblem}}'' series, being a series of strategy RPG games all about warfare where death is (mostly) permanent, losing any battle means game over, but at least once a game there are battles where victory turns the tides of the conflict on a larger scale than your own survival, even when it's not the final battle itself.
** In ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemAkaneia Shadow Dragon]]'', there's a series of them for each major obstacle Marth faces on his journey, but an important one halfway through the game is in Chapter 12, where he liberates the ancient capital of Archanea and the focus of his army's efforts shifts from gathering their strength to an all-out offensive campaign against the Dohlrian empire and their allies. Also notable is Chapter 23, featuring the battle against [[EvilSorceror Gharnef]] and his powerful dark magic to reclaim the Falchion, the only human weapon effective against the FinalBoss Medeus.
** For the sequel ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemAkaneia New Mystery of the Emblem]]'', there's Chapter 20, which is the final battle against Marth's former ally Emperor Hardin. However, the decisive part of the battle boils down to [[spoiler:whether you collected all the spheres of the Shield of Seals and are able to restore it after reclaiming the Darksphere from Hardin. Succeeding allows you to play the rest of the game, while failing to do so leads to the party getting tricked by an illusion and being convinced that the war is over, leaving a resurrected Gharnef to revive Medeus behind the scenes.]]
** ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemElibe Blazing Sword]]'' has an example different from the others in that the conflict throughout the story remains fairly small, as causing a large-scale war between the nations of the continent is the BigBad's ultimate goal. Even so, Chapter 19 still fulfills this role, as [[spoiler:Eliwood's party finally finds his father Elbert, only for him to die protecting them from Nergal, the true villain of the game. The story then shifts from finding Elbert to stopping Nergal's nefarious plans.]]
** ''VideoGame/FireEmblemTheSacredStones'' has a few at key points in the story. Chapter 8: where Eirika and Ephraim fight off a trap by Grado's forces and are finally reunited after the start of the game, allowing them to plan their counterattack against Grado and splitting up again to do so, Chapter 15: where the twins join up once again and the end the result of their campaigns have utterly destroyed the Grado Empire's forces, reducing them to being known as "The Remnant" when fighting them in all subsequent story battles, and Chapter 19: where before marching to the final battle, Eirika and Ephraim must fend off an assault by the enemy to protect the final Sacred Stone, the only thing capable of sealing away the Demon King for good.
** ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemTellius Path of Radiance]]'' has one that lasts through Chapters 26 and 27, featuring Ike and the Crimean army's offense against Daein's final defenses standing between them and King Ashnard. [[spoiler:The final part of Chapter 27 also features the climactic battle against the Black Knight, not only representing the peak of Ike's journey throughout the game, but also where he gets Ragnell, a weapon so powerful that it allows him to almost handle the rest of the game on his own from this point, provided that he's gotten strong enough to do so.]]
** ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemTellius Radiant Dawn]]'' has a major one for each part of the game. Part 1 has Chapter 5, where Micaiah and the Dawn Brigade join up with the lost prince Pelleas and the forces he's managed to put together to become the Daein Liberation Army, spending the rest of the Part freeing their country from Begnion forces. Part 2's in in its Endgame, [[spoiler:where Ludveck's rebellion enters its final stages and marches on Elincia at the castle while the Royal Knights were engaged elsewhere, the fate of Crimea resting on the outcome.]] Part 3 also has one in its Endgame, featuring [[spoiler: the final clash against the Laguz army (led by Ike,) and the Daein army (led by Micaiah,) deciding whether the laguz army can advance into Begnion, only for the medallion to awaken due to the chaos, and unleashing an apocalypse, petrifying most of the people of the world.]] Part 4's is also the FinalBattle, [[spoiler:featuring Yune's chosen (Ike, Micaiah, and Elincia's armies,) against Ashera's chosen (Lekain, Zelgius/The Black Knight, and Dheginsea's armies, as well as Lehran and Ashera herself) to decide the fate of the world.]]
** ''VideoGame/FireEmblemAwakening'' has a major one in Chapter 9, where Chrom and the Shepherds infiltrate Plegia to rescue Emmeryn from Gangrel's Execution ceremony. [[spoiler:Unfortunately, their plan to rescue her fails, and they are held at sword point to make a Sadistic Choice to either give up the Fire Emblem or watch Emmeryn be executed. However, before Chrom and Robin can make their choice, Emmeryn chooses to sacrifice herself. However, this turns out to be very important, as Emmeryn's selfless display ends up having the opposite effect that Gangrel intended her death to be: the majority of the Plegian soldiers quickly drop their arms and desert the army, allowing the Shepherds to easily wrap up the war in Chapter 11.]] Chapter 18, near the end of the Valmese war section of the game, turns out to be one of these in hindsight: [[spoiler:The majority of the Valmese forces fighting for Walhart were being held in check by Yen'Fay, and with his death, the armies quickly defect from Walhart's side and join Chrom's at the end of Chapter 19, suddenly reducing Walhart's side to merely the forces he has with him in his castle.]] The final major one that isn't the final battle occurs in Chapter 23, where Chrom and company try to stop Validar from carrying out Grima's resurrection. [[spoiler:They succeed, only for Validar's Heirophant to appear and reveal themself as the Robin from Lucina's future, who is possessed by Grima, as the ritual was carried out without interference in that timeline. They then carry out the ritual on their own body, reviving Grima in the present day.]]
20th Sep '15 5:17:51 PM nombretomado
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* The Battle of Trafalgar is considered one of the most decisive battles of the NapoleonicWars and the greatest British naval victory of all time. Before the battle, Napoleon had been building up the French and Spanish navies for a potential invasion of England, as you cannot invade the British Isles without going through the Royal Navy. Admiral Horatio Nelson lead the British fleet to victory and though he did not survive the battle, nearly half of the Combined Franco-Spanish Fleet was captured with the British losing no ships of their own. Never again would the French be in a position to challenge the British at sea, leaving them to blockade and strangle off trade bound for the continent.

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* The Battle of Trafalgar is considered one of the most decisive battles of the NapoleonicWars UsefulNotes/TheNapoleonicWars and the greatest British naval victory of all time. Before the battle, Napoleon had been building up the French and Spanish navies for a potential invasion of England, as you cannot invade the British Isles without going through the Royal Navy. Admiral Horatio Nelson lead the British fleet to victory and though he did not survive the battle, nearly half of the Combined Franco-Spanish Fleet was captured with the British losing no ships of their own. Never again would the French be in a position to challenge the British at sea, leaving them to blockade and strangle off trade bound for the continent.
20th Sep '15 7:19:27 AM EDP
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** From November 1917 to late October 1918, the three Battles of the Piave. Coming right after Russia's collapse and the German-supported Austro-Hungarian victory at Caporetto and starting before the United States could even start to bring troops in Europe, it was believed it would give Italy the final blow to kick them out of the war, thus freeing the entire Austro-Hungarian military to fight in France and the Atlantic Ocean. Then the Italians brutally defeated the first Austro-Hungarian offensive in November and treated even more brutally the second in June 1918, making clear that the Austro-Hungarians would not be freed up anytime soon and the only thing that remained was to try and fight through winter to negotiate a favourable peace, and the last battle, better known as the Battle of Vittorio Veneto, saw the Austro-Hungarian Empire ''collapse'' and opening the southern border of Germany to Italian invasion, that, in the already dire straits they were for both the mutiny of the navy and the contemporary Hundred Days Offensive, could do nothing but surrender.
23rd Aug '15 8:44:46 AM Saber15
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* The Battle of Trafalgar is considered one of the most decisive battles of the NapoleonicWars and the greatest British naval victory of all time. Before the battle, Napoleon had been building up the French and Spanish navies for a potential invasion of England, as you cannot invade the British Isles without going through the Royal Navy. Admiral Horatio Nelson lead the British fleet to victory and though he did not survive the battle, nearly half of the Combined Franco-Spanish Fleet was captured with the British losing no ships of their own. Never again would the French be in a position to challenge the British at sea, leaving them to blockade and strangle off trade bound for the continent.

to:

* The Battle of Trafalgar is considered one of the most decisive battles of the NapoleonicWars and the greatest British naval victory of all time. Before the battle, Napoleon had been building up the French and Spanish navies for a potential invasion of England, as you cannot invade the British Isles without going through the Royal Navy. Admiral Horatio Nelson lead the British fleet to victory and though he did not survive the battle, nearly half of the Combined Franco-Spanish Fleet was captured with the British losing no ships of their own. Never again would the French be in a position to challenge the British at sea, leaving them to blockade and strangle off trade bound for the continent.continent.
* In ''Tabletopgame/BattleTech'', the Battle of Tukayyid was a last stand against the invading ProudWarriorRace Clans after the previously neutral [=ComStar=] realized the Clan's end goal was capturing PlanetTerra, their headquarters. [=ComStar=] set up a treaty with the Clans; should [=ComStar=] win, the Clans would sign a 15 year armistice with the rest of the Inner Sphere, but if the Clans won ComStar would not oppose them. [=ComStar=] unveiled the [[SuperweaponSurprise hidden ComGuard]], a well trained army using LostTechnology. Through martial prowess, excellent leadership, and exploitation of the [[HonorBeforeReason Clans warrior code]], the battle was won in favor of [=ComStar=], with only three of the eleven clans achieving even part of the agreed upon objectives. The Battle of Tukayyid became one of the largest and most important battles in the history of the Inner Sphere, appearing in several of the [[Franchise/BattleTechExpandedUniverse expanded universe]] novels.
9th Jun '15 4:21:12 PM LtFedora
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* The Battle of Trafalgar is considered one of the most decisive battles of the NapoleonicWars and the greatest British naval victory of all time. Before the battle, Napoleon had been building up the French and Spanish navies for a potential invasion of England, as you cannot invade the British Isles without going through the Royal Navy. Admiral Horatio Nelson lead the British fleet to victory and though he did not survive the battle, nearly half of the Combined French-Spanish Fleet was captured with the British losing no ships of their own. Never again would the French be in a position to challenge the British at sea, leaving them to blockade and strangle off trade bound for the continent.

to:

* The Battle of Trafalgar is considered one of the most decisive battles of the NapoleonicWars and the greatest British naval victory of all time. Before the battle, Napoleon had been building up the French and Spanish navies for a potential invasion of England, as you cannot invade the British Isles without going through the Royal Navy. Admiral Horatio Nelson lead the British fleet to victory and though he did not survive the battle, nearly half of the Combined French-Spanish Franco-Spanish Fleet was captured with the British losing no ships of their own. Never again would the French be in a position to challenge the British at sea, leaving them to blockade and strangle off trade bound for the continent.
6th Jun '15 8:46:53 AM hollow49
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->''[[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5Qo9iAB9q0 Dun-dun-dun-dun\\

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->''[[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5Qo9iAB9q0 com/watch?v=K05gPSrsE-c Dun-dun-dun-dun\\
20th May '15 7:21:23 AM LtFedora
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* In the backstory for ''Literature/ASongOfIceAndFire'', and its TV adaptation ''Series/GameOfThrones'', the Battle of the Trident was the decisive battle of Robert's Rebellion. Despite setbacks and defeats at the hands of House Tyrell, Robert Baratheon faced Prince Rhaegar Targaryen at the Trident and personally killed him, shattering the royal armies. This battle made Lord Tywin Lannister, who by then had been sitting out the war, to realize that the rebel cause would soon be victorious and so lead his own armies to King's Landing to sack it as a sign of fealty to Robert.

to:

* In the backstory for ''Literature/ASongOfIceAndFire'', and its TV adaptation ''Series/GameOfThrones'', the Battle of the Trident was the decisive battle of Robert's Rebellion. Despite setbacks and defeats at the hands of House Tyrell, Robert Baratheon faced Prince Rhaegar Targaryen at the Trident and personally killed him, shattering the royal armies. This battle made Lord Tywin Lannister, who by then had been sitting out the war, to realize that the rebel cause would soon be victorious and so lead his own armies to King's Landing to sack it as a sign of fealty to Robert.Robert.
* The Battle of Trafalgar is considered one of the most decisive battles of the NapoleonicWars and the greatest British naval victory of all time. Before the battle, Napoleon had been building up the French and Spanish navies for a potential invasion of England, as you cannot invade the British Isles without going through the Royal Navy. Admiral Horatio Nelson lead the British fleet to victory and though he did not survive the battle, nearly half of the Combined French-Spanish Fleet was captured with the British losing no ships of their own. Never again would the French be in a position to challenge the British at sea, leaving them to blockade and strangle off trade bound for the continent.
8th May '15 6:02:35 AM LtFedora
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* In ''Franchise/StarWars'', the separate destruction of both Death Stars are this. The first one at Yavin killed a number of the Emperor's best servants, especially Grand Moff Tarkin. However, it is subverted in that the Imperial Fleet was not damaged and a squadron of Star Destroyers was quickly sent to Yavin to quarantine the Rebels. A better example is the Second Death Star at Endor. Its destruction and the preceding space battle resulted in the death of the Emperor, Darth Vader, along with the loss of the flagship ''Executor'' and nearly half the fleet engaged. ExpandedUniverse material reveals that the ''Executor'' was the greater loss; while other leaders stepped in to fill the Emperor's shoes and frankly couldn't do worse than he had, the loss of the flagship (and the best and brightest of the officer corp that were serving on her) was a blow they didn't recover from until the war had turned against them.

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* In ''Franchise/StarWars'', the separate destruction of both Death Stars are this. The first one at Yavin killed a number of the Emperor's best servants, especially Grand Moff Tarkin. However, it is subverted in that the Imperial Fleet was not damaged and a squadron of Star Destroyers was quickly sent to Yavin to quarantine the Rebels. A better example is the Second Death Star at Endor. Its destruction and the preceding space battle resulted in the death of the Emperor, Darth Vader, along with the loss of the flagship ''Executor'' and nearly half the fleet engaged. ExpandedUniverse material reveals that the ''Executor'' was the greater loss; while other leaders stepped in to fill the Emperor's shoes and frankly couldn't do worse than he had, the loss of the flagship (and the best and brightest of the officer corp that were serving on her) was a blow they didn't recover from until the war had turned against them.them.
* In the backstory for ''Literature/ASongOfIceAndFire'', and its TV adaptation ''Series/GameOfThrones'', the Battle of the Trident was the decisive battle of Robert's Rebellion. Despite setbacks and defeats at the hands of House Tyrell, Robert Baratheon faced Prince Rhaegar Targaryen at the Trident and personally killed him, shattering the royal armies. This battle made Lord Tywin Lannister, who by then had been sitting out the war, to realize that the rebel cause would soon be victorious and so lead his own armies to King's Landing to sack it as a sign of fealty to Robert.
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