History Headscratchers / Lucifer2016

* What's with the precinct location change between seasons one and two? The precinct in season one looks completely different to the one in season two. Was that ever explained? Did they change location in universe? Or did Chloe just move to a different part of the building?

* The nature of supernatural beings in this universe is a profoundly confusing matter. At first, you have Lucifer, who appears to be an entirely physical being (capable of being shot, cut, and drunk, however little these affect him long-term) with two forms: the human one and the red, charred one. Maze and Amenadiel seem to follow this trend, with Maze's true face being half-decayed and Amenadiel's true form sprouting [[spoiler: decaying]] wings. But then, there's Lucifer's mother, who appears to lack a physical form entirely: she's able to leave hell as Lucifer did, but has to [[BodySurf Body Surf]] to exist on Earth and can only possess fresh corpses at that. One might assume the other three are similarly possessing corpses, but whereas they can die and resurrect, Lucifer's mother has to jump to a new corpse if her host is killed. The easiest assumption is that her physical form was somehow destroyed by God, but [[spoiler: since Uriel left a corpse when he was "completely destroyed,"]] that seems unlikely. Besides, since the angels and demon are apparently corporeal beings, how could they torture one who was not? And don't even get me started on the ill-defined powers. Lucifer, but keeps his specialty (persuasion) for ages in Hell, but [[spoiler: Amenadiel falls and loses his specialty (time dilation) after a few months on Earth]]? What gives?

[[folder:Returning to Hell\\

** Lucifer has the ability to bring out a persons inner desires. Blackmail and extortion would be trivial to him. Other than that, he has probably be watching humanity for a long time. It would be child's play to find hidden or sunken treasure to gain money. He has also shown an ability to integrate himself quite easily with the movers and shakers of L.A.

*** There's probably also a measure of magic and intent; prior, he's always shown his face when he's also wanted to scare the crap out of people.

*** So is the main plot of trying to get him to go back rather than forcing him back built on a lie? Alternatively, God is supposed to be the master of even reality and all of nature anywhere anyway. If Hell can be escaped in the first place, how infallible is God? At any time another manager could be promoted?
*** If the show follows the comic's rules even slightly, then Hell is something that you impose on yourself. Lucifer left because he finally realised that nothing was forcing him to stay down there, and the same applies to every other denizen.

*** I seem to recall Chloe drunkenly stating at the bar during girls night out that one of her fears was her and Trixie being homeless. That dialogue indicates that she has to move, like she was being evicted or something.
*** Considering she was drunk at the time, probably best not to take her word for it.
*** It's probably ultimately about independence and holding out that they would get back together again. Chloe may not be rich but an LA Detective is not in any danger of being homeless, just of living modestly.

* If Lucifer can just flash his red eyes at people, why doesnt he show Chloe the red eyes or maybe his "true form" if he wants to prove things to her so badly?

** As far as Mum, that one's both very easy and very tricky. Easy because she's one half of the creator of everything including physical existence. She probably doesn't have a physical form to begin with. Why that imposes her particular limitations, hard to say. Given divine power, punishing a non-corporeal thing is probably not an issue. As for their powers, Luci left Heaven and Hell on his own and probably would have guiled his way into keeping his powers. Amen lost faith, such as it was, or perhaps because Luci's feather was used to prevent his death (which may have gone against God's plans, or otherwise affected his divine purity), God took away those powers, or at least, the ones not inherent to Amen himself. And of course, it's suggested that God's plans for Luci aren't done yet.

** As far as Mum, that one's both very easy and very tricky. Easy because she's one half of the creator of everything including physical existence. She probably doesn't have a physical form to begin with. Why that imposes her particular limitations, hard to say. Given divine power, punishing a non-corporeal thing is probably not an issue. As for their powers, Luci left Heaven and Hell on his own and probably would have guiled his way into keeping his powers. Amen lost faith, such as it was, or perhaps because Luci's feather was used to prevent his death (which may have gone against God's plans, or otherwise affected his divine purity), God took away those powers, or at least, the ones not inherent to Amen himself.

** As far as Mum, that one's both very easy and very tricky. Easy because she's one half of the creator of everything including physical existence. She probably doesn't have a physical form to begin with. Why that imposes her particular limitations, hard to say. Given divine power, punishing a non-corporeal thing is probably not an issue. As for their powers, Luci left on his own. Amen lost faith, such as it was.

* The nature of supernatural beings in this universe is a profoundly confusing matter. At first, you have Lucifer, who appears to be an entirely physical being (capable of being shot, cut, and drunk, however little these affect him long-term) with two forms: the human one and the red, charred one. Maze and Amenadiel seem to follow this trend, with Maze's true face being half-decayed and Amenadiel's true form sprouting [[spoiler: decaying]] wings. But then, there's Lucifer's mother, who appears to lack a physical form entirely: she's able to leave hell as Lucifer did, but has to [[BodySurf Body Surf]] to exist on Earth and can only possess fresh corpses at that. One might assume the other three are similarly possessing corpses, but whereas they can die and resurrect, Lucifer's mother has to jump to a new corpse if her host is killed. The easiest assumption is that her physical form was somehow destroyed by God, but [[spoiler: since Uriel left a corpse when he was "completely destroyed,"]] that seems unlikely. Besides, since the angels and demon are apparently corporeal beings, how could they torture one who was not? And don't even get me started on the ill-defined powers. Lucifer, but keeps his specialty (persuasion) for ages in Hell, but [[spoiler: Amenadiel falls and loses his specialty (time dilation) after a few months on Earth]]? What gives?

** As the latest episode reveals: He doesn't actually want to show her, because he has feelings for her and is scared that she'll run and/or treat him as a monster if she knows the truth.

* If Lucifer can just flash his red eyes at people, why doesnt he show chloe the red eyes or maybe his "true form" if he wants to prove things to her so badly?

*** If Lucifer can just flash his red eyes at people, why doesnt he show chloe the red eyes or maybe his "true form" if he wants to prove things to her so badly?

*** It's probably ultimately about independence and holding out that they would get back together again. Chloe may not be rich but an LA Detective is not in any danger of being homeless, just of living modestly.

*** Considering she was drunk at the time, probably best not to take her word for it.

*** I seem to recall Chloe drunkenly stating at the bar during girls night out that one of her fears was her and Trixie being homeless. That dialogue indicates that she has to move, like she was being evicted or something.

** I'm pretty sure she stated that she needed to be her own woman and live in the real world instead of relying on her mother. Most likely Chloe was only staying at her mother's place until either she and Dan got back together or made their divorce final.

* Why did Chole need to move out of the house and find a roommate when her and Dan decided to divorce? Chole's mother is the owner of the house and surely Dan could have helped pay taxes on the house where his child would be living, provided Chole's mother wasn't paying the taxes already.

** Lucifer has the ability to bring out a persons inner desires. Blackmail and extortion would be trivial to him. Other than that, he has probably be watching humanity for a long time. It would be child's play to find hidden or sunken treasure to gain money.

*** If the show follows the comic's rules even slightly, then Hell is something that you impose on yourself. Lucifer left because he finally realised that nothing was forcing him to stay down there, and the same applies to every other denizen.

Maze's reflection in the mirror shows a decaying face, but she's a demon. Is the skull face just a mask that Lucifer puts on or has his time in Hell changed his true form somehow?

*** So is the main plot of trying to get him to go back rather than forcing him back built on a lie? Alternatively, God is supposed to be the master of even reality and all of nature anywhere anyway. If Hell can be escaped in the first place, how infallible is God? At any time another manager could be promoted?

** Hell's punishment is described as taking what one most appreciates in life and turning it around as punishment (Malcolm had a "hunger" for living and thus was punished by feeling unending starvation), which implies Hell is unique to each person and they may perceive it differently, so it might not look to them anything like the way Lucifer saw it. Lucifer's role is possibly something like the general manager of a business; if the manager in unavailable, the place can still function because the other employees know what they have to do, but at some point problems will appear they aren't able to handle, and the longer the manager isn't around, the greater the number of issues that start piling up until the business is in real trouble. His statement about people not being punished because he isn't there could simply be hyperbole, the same way a boss could say that nothing is getting done if he isn't there to oversee the place.

** Hell's punishment is described as taking what one most appreciates in life and turning it around as punishment (Malcolm had an "appetite" for living and thus was punished by feeling unending hunger), which implies Hell is unique to each person and they may perceive it differently, so it might not look to them anything like the way Lucifer saw it. Lucifer's role is possibly something like the general manager of a business; if the manager in unavailable, the place can still function because the other employees know what they have to do, but at some point problems will appear they aren't able to handle, and the longer the manager isn't around, the greater the number of issues that start piling up until the business is in real trouble. His statement about people not being punished because he isn't there could simply be hyperbole, the same way a boss could say that nothing is getting done if he isn't there to oversee the place.

** Hell's punishment is described as taking what one most appreciates in life and turning it around as punishment (Malcolm had an "appetite" for living and thus was punished by feeling unending hunger), which implies Hell is unique to each person and they may perceive it differently, so it might not look to them anything like the way Lucifer saw it. Lucifer's role is possibly something like the general manager of a business; if the manager in unavailable, the place can still function because the other employees know what they have to do, but at some point problems will appear they aren't able to handle, and the longer the manager isn't around, the greater the number of issues that start piling up until the business is in real trouble. His statement about people not being punished because he isn't then could simply be the same way an egotistical boss could say that nothing is getting done if he isn't there to oversee the place.

* At what point in the series' timeline did Amenadiel reach his accord with Malcolm? At what point did Lucifer break out of Hell? Most of the main plot tells us that without Lucifer, no one in Hell is being tormented. No one is being punished. So is the Hell world fine and peaceful as shown in the brief scene depicted in the season finale where Lucifer returns to Hell? Because the way Malcolm put it, Hell was horrible and he doesn't wish to go back. Was he there while Lucifer was still there? Is it still a fucked up place after, and God is the one being unnecessarily mean to Lucifer? Were things okay for a while, then Amenadiel briefly engineered Malcolm's personal experience to convince him later? What made Malcolm so motivated?

** He intentionally burned his wings so that he could ''never'' go back willingly. Amenadiel pointed out that they were a cop-out---a one-way ticket to hell in case he ever changed his mind. Since Amenadiel, Maze, and God are all trying to bring Lucifer back; Lucifer exerted his independence and finality of his decision to stay on Earth by burning his wings.

** He was planning to use his coin to return to Hell (or the other way around), but it's a one-time use. Either he originally had a second one and doesn't know where to get more, or he only ever had one, and the first time he used his wings to fly up--which isn't an option any more. Yes, that means he shouldn't have burned his wings or cut them off in the first place, but no one has ever accused him of thinking ahead.

* What is preventing Lucifer from going to Hell aside from not being in the mood? Not going and resuming his duties, the opening of the show suggests that there was nothing keeping him in Hell aside from being obedient and thus far no mechanic has been explained that would keep him there. This is important because depending on how strict the rules of heaven and hell are in this universe at least some of the dead people probably didn't go upstairs. Like the thief who stole his wings. Luci could pop down to hell, interrogate the man who just commited suicide and skip a lot of detective work. Which in most cases is acceptable, he's having fun with Chloe. He cares if they solve the case in the same way we care about any game. Enough to get emotional over but not enough to cheat (generally) but his wings was not fun and games.
** It seems to be implied that Lucifer is intending to avoid Hell at all costs, since he'd probably be locked down so he's not able to shirk his duties and leave again.

* What is preventing Lucifer from going to Hell aside from not being in the mood? Not going and resuming his duties, the opening of the show suggests that there was nothing keeping him in Hell aside from being obedient and thus far no mechanic has been explained that would keep him there. This is important because depending on how strict the rules of heaven and hell are in this universe at least some of the dead people probably didn't go upstairs. Like the thief who stole his wings. Luci could pop down to hell, interrogate the man who just commited suicide and skip a lot of detective work. Which in most cases is acceptable, he's having fun with Chloe. He cares if they solve the case in the same way we care about any game. Enough to get emotional over but not enough to cheat (generally) but his wings was not fun and games.