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*** I don't know if you've ever seen anyone with PTSD, but it can be ''very, very'' severe. She is a POW. Being nearly catatonic for a few minutes is not unheard of. As I already said, I'm positive she would have died anyway. But Dom didn't know that--he expressed as much in the comic. He didn't even try to save her. As I said earlier, Dom had already prioritized Maria over the mission. What if she had been somewhat functional? What if she could speak? Do you think she would have shot her then? My issue is that he didn't even consider for a second that she could be saved. He just shot her.

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*** I don't know if you've ever seen anyone with PTSD, but it can be ''very, very'' severe. She is a POW. Being nearly catatonic for a few minutes is not unheard of. As I already said, I'm positive she would have died anyway. But Dom didn't know that--he expressed as much in the comic. He didn't even try to save her. As I said earlier, Dom had already prioritized Maria over the mission. What if she had been somewhat functional? What if she could speak? Do you think she would have shot her then? My issue is that he didn't even consider for a second that she could be saved. He just shot her.her.
** Tai, one of the toughest men in the world, committed suicide after suffering only a few hours' worth of torture at the hands of the Locust. Maria suffered even longer, without the training or mental fortitude that Tai would have possessed. Furthermore, she's an unarmed noncombatant who is in no position whatsoever to assist them in combat, and they're surrounded by literally millions of Locust with no immediate way out. They can't extract her, and they've seen what happened to Tai and other Gears. What is Dom ''supposed'' to do?

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** The simplest way to sum up many fans (including this Troper) dislike for Karen Traviss boils down to her total lack of respect or professionalism as an author. Her works were a mess of canonical errors and intentional mischaracterisations (in Legacy of the Force for example Luke Skywalker cannot explain to a layman the differences between Jedi and Sith) towards characters/organisations she herself does not like to the point her novels practically became a platform for her own soapboxing. All her characters held identical views to one another and her mischaracterisations are never once challenged by the opposite side.
*** To elaborate, her Mandalorians were perfect in practically every way, their combat skills were greater than the Jedi, their ability as soldiers exceeded everything in the Republic and their creed was morally superior. Neutral characters fall over one another trying to help Kal Skirata rescue the Clones from the evil Jedi. The planet Mandalore was a self-sustaining agrarian world, and the Mandalorians a race of relatively peaceful farmers and smiths (which Mandalorian Iron changed from being from a natural ore with energy resistant properties to something unique to Mandalorian smithing) when they're not being the best warriors in the galaxy. This is despite the Mandalorian legacy as a race of brutal warmongers who made war because Mandalore was not self-sustaining (all of which is quietly ignored save for a few cursory mentions of Death Watch).
*** When called on her blatant disregard for the IP (which Traviss admitted she had never read any of) Ms Traviss responded by calling her detractors '''Talifans''' and act so unprofessional it practically boggles the mind.
*** Probably the most scathing review of her work this Troper has ever seen (and it's all accurate) came from TheForce.Net's literature boards from YodaKenobi regarding Legacy of the Force: Revelation which can be found '''[[http://boards.theforce.net/literature/b10003/28128642/p5 here]]'''
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** I think you are understating just how bad off Maria was. She was so weak that she couldn't hold herself up, and clearly emaciated to the point that starvation was likely close at hand. Her mental faculties were degraded; she was unable to even respond to simple human contact, much less recognize and acknowledge any sort of communication, or more importantly, command. Heck, the scars on her head may have even indicated brain damage. Dom's been a soldier for a long time; he's seen people die from just about every cause under the sun. He knows when someone's time is short, and Maria wasn't going to make it out of the Hollow. Even if she'd been conscious and mobile, Dom and Marcus couldn't go back. They had a mission to complete, and were smack in the middle of hostile territory. She would have never made it back on her own, especially not in her current state, and the couldn't escort her. Dom only had two options: Leave her, to face death (or worse, recapture) at the hands of the Locust, or bring her with them and risk putting all of their lives in danger. Dom didn't kill her because of how much she'd suffered (though that probably helped the decision), he killed her because there was no way he could get her out, and he didn't want her to suffer again. I hate to sound cliche, but its very likely what Maria would have wanted.

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** I think you are understating just how bad off Maria was. She was so weak that she couldn't hold herself up, and clearly emaciated to the point that starvation was likely close at hand. Her mental faculties were degraded; she was unable to even respond to simple human contact, much less recognize and acknowledge any sort of communication, or more importantly, command. Heck, the scars on her head may have even indicated brain damage. Dom's been a soldier for a long time; he's seen people die from just about every cause under the sun. He knows when someone's time is short, and Maria wasn't going to make it out of the Hollow. Even if she'd been conscious and mobile, Dom and Marcus couldn't go back. They had a mission to complete, and were smack in the middle of hostile territory. She would have never made it back on her own, especially not in her current state, and the couldn't escort her. Dom only had two options: Leave her, to face death (or worse, recapture) at the hands of the Locust, or bring her with them and risk putting all of their lives in danger. Dom didn't kill her because of how much she'd suffered (though that probably helped the decision), he killed her because there was no way he could get her out, and he didn't want her to suffer again. I hate to sound cliche, but its very likely what Maria would have wanted.wanted.
*** I don't know if you've ever seen anyone with PTSD, but it can be ''very, very'' severe. She is a POW. Being nearly catatonic for a few minutes is not unheard of. As I already said, I'm positive she would have died anyway. But Dom didn't know that--he expressed as much in the comic. He didn't even try to save her. As I said earlier, Dom had already prioritized Maria over the mission. What if she had been somewhat functional? What if she could speak? Do you think she would have shot her then? My issue is that he didn't even consider for a second that she could be saved. He just shot her.
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**** How do they act in ways superior to most COG soldiers? They are often very modest about their skills. In an actual firefight, Pesangas would get torn apart, as seen in Aspho Fields. They specilize in stealth and commando tactics. As for being mistreated for no apparant reason, the top level COG politicians are racist and xenophobic, as often happened in real life. The other COG soldiers admire them because they do their job damn well, and are fellow Gears.
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* Why did Dom kill Maria? She was a prisoner of war. She had been tortured and deprived of food and water for a long time. Of course she's going to look sick. So, upon seeing a POW with a severe case of PTSD, he shoots her. Why? He already expressed that Maria and her safety was more important than his own, more important than than the mission, and more important than Sera. Then how is she too much of a burden? He didn't want her to suffer? It would be considered extremely, ''extremely'' immoral to kill a POW because of the tragedy she's suffered. The state she was in did not necessarily mean that's how she'll always be for the rest of her life. I know the comics said something about her dying anyway, but that's even more damning in my book: because he didn't know that, it means he had no idea that she would have died anyway. He didn't know what was wrong with her, only that ''something'' was wrong. But without knowing the details, he couldn't possibly fathom how critical her state was. Earlier in the game he was willing to move slowly to protect a box of explosives. But he couldn't move slowly to protect Maria? What would have have done if she were weak, but still seemed sane? Would he have killed her then for being a burden, for being weak? I doubt it. Is there some piece I'm missing that made this alright?

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* Why did Dom kill Maria? She was a prisoner of war. She had been tortured and deprived of food and water for a long time. Of course she's going to look sick. So, upon seeing a POW with a severe case of PTSD, he shoots her. Why? He already expressed that Maria and her safety was more important than his own, more important than than the mission, and more important than Sera. Then how is she too much of a burden? He didn't want her to suffer? It would be considered extremely, ''extremely'' immoral to kill a POW because of the tragedy she's suffered. The state she was in did not necessarily mean that's how she'll always be for the rest of her life. I know the comics said something about her dying anyway, but that's even more damning in my book: because he didn't know that, it means he had no idea that she would have died anyway. He didn't know what was wrong with her, only that ''something'' was wrong. But without knowing the details, he couldn't possibly fathom how critical her state was. Earlier in the game he was willing to move slowly to protect a box of explosives. But he couldn't move slowly to protect Maria? What would have have done if she were weak, but still seemed sane? Would he have killed her then for being a burden, for being weak? I doubt it. Is there some piece I'm missing that made this alright?alright?
** I think you are understating just how bad off Maria was. She was so weak that she couldn't hold herself up, and clearly emaciated to the point that starvation was likely close at hand. Her mental faculties were degraded; she was unable to even respond to simple human contact, much less recognize and acknowledge any sort of communication, or more importantly, command. Heck, the scars on her head may have even indicated brain damage. Dom's been a soldier for a long time; he's seen people die from just about every cause under the sun. He knows when someone's time is short, and Maria wasn't going to make it out of the Hollow. Even if she'd been conscious and mobile, Dom and Marcus couldn't go back. They had a mission to complete, and were smack in the middle of hostile territory. She would have never made it back on her own, especially not in her current state, and the couldn't escort her. Dom only had two options: Leave her, to face death (or worse, recapture) at the hands of the Locust, or bring her with them and risk putting all of their lives in danger. Dom didn't kill her because of how much she'd suffered (though that probably helped the decision), he killed her because there was no way he could get her out, and he didn't want her to suffer again. I hate to sound cliche, but its very likely what Maria would have wanted.

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** Karen Traviss' [[WallBanger abortion of a novel]] spawned the idea. This is the same novel where the Locust ignore a strategically critical food equipment convoy to kill the half-dozen Gears protecting it, as apparently killing a squad of Gears is more important than starving out all of Jacinto. Yeah.

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** Karen Traviss' [[WallBanger abortion of a novel]] novel spawned the idea. This is the same novel where the Locust ignore a strategically critical food equipment convoy to kill the half-dozen Gears protecting it, as apparently killing a squad of Gears is more important than starving out all of Jacinto. Yeah.



** The "breeding camps" thing pops up in the latest comic issue - only they're ''rape'' camps. [[WallBanger COG-operated rape camps.]]

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** The "breeding camps" thing pops up in the latest comic issue - only they're ''rape'' camps. [[WallBanger COG-operated rape camps.]]



* Dudes. [[DespairEventHorizon Despair]]. ''[[WallBanger Karen]] [[RuinedFOREVER Traviss]]'' is confirmed to be writing the story for Gears 3. Should we abandon ship now and make up our own endings, or stay and watch the train wreck happen?

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* Dudes. [[DespairEventHorizon Despair]]. ''[[WallBanger Karen]] ''Karen [[RuinedFOREVER Traviss]]'' is confirmed to be writing the story for Gears 3. Should we abandon ship now and make up our own endings, or stay and watch the train wreck happen?



** See [[{{Wallbangers/Literature}} the Literature Wallbangers page]] for a solid list of the idiocy.



** In the future, apparently, there will be no duct tape. Also, [[WallBanger THE FUCKING CENTAUR DOESN'T HAVE HEADLIGHTS.]]

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** In the future, apparently, there will be no duct tape. Also, [[WallBanger THE FUCKING CENTAUR DOESN'T HAVE HEADLIGHTS.]]
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*** Oh, yeah? Well... [[LameComeback your FACE!]]

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*** Oh, yeah? Well... [[LameComeback your FACE!]]FACE!]]

* Why did Dom kill Maria? She was a prisoner of war. She had been tortured and deprived of food and water for a long time. Of course she's going to look sick. So, upon seeing a POW with a severe case of PTSD, he shoots her. Why? He already expressed that Maria and her safety was more important than his own, more important than than the mission, and more important than Sera. Then how is she too much of a burden? He didn't want her to suffer? It would be considered extremely, ''extremely'' immoral to kill a POW because of the tragedy she's suffered. The state she was in did not necessarily mean that's how she'll always be for the rest of her life. I know the comics said something about her dying anyway, but that's even more damning in my book: because he didn't know that, it means he had no idea that she would have died anyway. He didn't know what was wrong with her, only that ''something'' was wrong. But without knowing the details, he couldn't possibly fathom how critical her state was. Earlier in the game he was willing to move slowly to protect a box of explosives. But he couldn't move slowly to protect Maria? What would have have done if she were weak, but still seemed sane? Would he have killed her then for being a burden, for being weak? I doubt it. Is there some piece I'm missing that made this alright?
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** Basically, KarenTraviss is known mostly in StarWars for a great number of books on the Mandalorians, the race of whom Jango and Boba Fett descend from. She has a tendency to extol {{Proud Warrior Race Guy}}s in all of her works, and usually that cultural mindset is treated as being superior to the main heroes of the fiction in every way. In general, her books are considered good and interesting but is ''really'' polarizing with how her works fit into the main universe and how the fandom responds to her. StarWarsTheCloneWars overwrote her Mandalorian stories during that time period and the outrage from fans of her books was enormous, while others believed that TheCloneWars depiction was a far superior view on the culture (Her stories were rather bog standard Proud Warrior Race stuff while TheCloneWars had a more complex story of a recently formed ''neutral pacifist'' government trying to downplay their warrior race past). "Travissty" is a DetractorNickname for her works.
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**** Alright anonymous Karen Traviss hate-fan troper, Do some damn research. Karen Traviss is a military fiction writer, and has strong associations with the British military. If you know this, the Pesanga are immediately obvious in their origins: expies of the Nepalese Gurkha regiments that the British government regularly recruits. A lot of punch for a bunch of little guys, check; bushcraft, check; outstanding valor in battle, check; big machete, verily checked (see Kukri); the facsimile is perfect right down to the fact that they were snubbed honors for their distinguished military service. Write what you know and all that.
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** Have you ever actually hit someone in the neck or taken a hit to the head or neck? It's quite flexible and you can maneuver it pretty quickly out of harm's way. Plus, it's a substantially smaller target than the torso, which also contains a lot more blood and vital organs, not to mention that the guy you're trying to kill has arms with a weapon or another chainsaw he could train on you. Attacking high for the neck would leave your vitals very open to an attack. Besides, chainsaw's don't cut like swords. They tear out chunks of matter and they are very heavy and dangerous to use. If you hit someone with a heavy implement like a chaisnaw in an evasive target like the neck, the last thing you want is for the blade to go through a quickly with all the momentum of your swing, which then goes directly into your thigh (which too has a lot of blood vessels) or into your squadmates. Also, if you've ever done sparring, it's a lot easier to evade a strike aimed at your head or neck than it is to evade someone aiming for your torso. Bottom line: the neck is a tempting, but difficult target to hit with something than cuts by exerting pressure and ripping while the torso is a much safer target to go after and also makes being counterattacked by your victim much less likely.

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** Have you ever actually hit someone in the neck or taken a hit to the head or neck? It's quite flexible and you can maneuver it pretty quickly out of harm's way. Plus, it's a substantially smaller target than the torso, which also contains a lot more blood and vital organs, not to mention that the guy you're trying to kill has arms with a weapon or another chainsaw he could train on you. Attacking high for the neck would leave your vitals very open to an attack. Besides, chainsaw's don't cut like swords. They tear out chunks of matter and they are very heavy and dangerous to use. If you hit someone with a heavy implement like a chaisnaw in an evasive target like the neck, the last thing you want is for the blade to go through a quickly with all the momentum of your swing, which then goes directly into your thigh (which too has a lot of blood vessels) or into your squadmates. Also, if you've ever done sparring, it's a lot easier to evade a strike aimed at your head or neck than it is to evade someone aiming for your torso. Bottom line: the neck is a tempting, but difficult target to hit with something than cuts by exerting pressure and ripping while the torso is a much safer target to go after and also makes being counterattacked by your victim much less likely.likely.
***Oh, yeah? Well... [[LameComeback your FACE!]]
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**What this troper got from it was that drones were quite good at TACTICS (smallest scale of battle planning such as traps and ambushes) but total morons about STRATEGY (higher level planning like starving your enemy).
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** Have you ever actually hit someone in the neck or taken a hit to the head or neck? It's quite flexible and you can maneuver it pretty quickly out of harm's way. Plus, it's a substantially smaller target than the torso, which also contains a lot more blood and vital organs, not to mention that the guy you're trying to kill has arms with a weapon or another chainsaw he could train on you. Attacking high for the neck would leave your vitals very open to an attack. Besides, chainsaw's don't cut like swords. They tear out chunks of matter and they are very heavy and dangerous to use. If you hit someone with a heavy implement like a chaisnaw in an evasive target like the neck,

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** Have you ever actually hit someone in the neck or taken a hit to the head or neck? It's quite flexible and you can maneuver it pretty quickly out of harm's way. Plus, it's a substantially smaller target than the torso, which also contains a lot more blood and vital organs, not to mention that the guy you're trying to kill has arms with a weapon or another chainsaw he could train on you. Attacking high for the neck would leave your vitals very open to an attack. Besides, chainsaw's don't cut like swords. They tear out chunks of matter and they are very heavy and dangerous to use. If you hit someone with a heavy implement like a chaisnaw in an evasive target like the neck,neck, the last thing you want is for the blade to go through a quickly with all the momentum of your swing, which then goes directly into your thigh (which too has a lot of blood vessels) or into your squadmates. Also, if you've ever done sparring, it's a lot easier to evade a strike aimed at your head or neck than it is to evade someone aiming for your torso. Bottom line: the neck is a tempting, but difficult target to hit with something than cuts by exerting pressure and ripping while the torso is a much safer target to go after and also makes being counterattacked by your victim much less likely.
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* The Lancer's chainsaw bayonet seems to saw straight through enemies' chests in a matter of seconds. So why don't the people who wield them just [[OffWithHisHead go for the neck]] and make it a simple slashing attack? (Yes, it's a matter of balance in multiplayer, but other than that it doesn't make sense.)

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* The Lancer's chainsaw bayonet seems to saw straight through enemies' chests in a matter of seconds. So why don't the people who wield them just [[OffWithHisHead go for the neck]] and make it a simple slashing attack? (Yes, it's a matter of balance in multiplayer, but other than that it doesn't make sense.))
** Have you ever actually hit someone in the neck or taken a hit to the head or neck? It's quite flexible and you can maneuver it pretty quickly out of harm's way. Plus, it's a substantially smaller target than the torso, which also contains a lot more blood and vital organs, not to mention that the guy you're trying to kill has arms with a weapon or another chainsaw he could train on you. Attacking high for the neck would leave your vitals very open to an attack. Besides, chainsaw's don't cut like swords. They tear out chunks of matter and they are very heavy and dangerous to use. If you hit someone with a heavy implement like a chaisnaw in an evasive target like the neck,
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** Dom and Carmine talk about that in 2. Basically, it's spotting snipers vs. the occasional dust cloud. Doesn't quite explain why the COG doesn't issue the filters alone if the snipers are such a problem they allow the Gears to go around without helmets.

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** Dom and Carmine talk about that in 2. Basically, it's spotting snipers vs. the occasional dust cloud. Doesn't quite explain why the COG doesn't issue the filters alone if the snipers are such a problem they allow the Gears to go around without helmets.helmets.

*The Lancer's chainsaw bayonet seems to saw straight through enemies' chests in a matter of seconds. So why don't the people who wield them just [[OffWithHisHead go for the neck]] and make it a simple slashing attack? (Yes, it's a matter of balance in multiplayer, but other than that it doesn't make sense.)
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* Surely all of the Gears are issued helmets? It's fair enough if you want a better field of vision, but it just seems ''monumentally'' stupid to leave free breathing apparatus at home, especially when you're fighting against enemies that aren't shy about using biological weapons.

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* Surely all of the Gears are issued helmets? It's fair enough if you want a better field of vision, but it just seems ''monumentally'' stupid to leave free breathing apparatus at home, especially when you're fighting against enemies that aren't shy about using biological weapons.weapons.
** Dom and Carmine talk about that in 2. Basically, it's spotting snipers vs. the occasional dust cloud. Doesn't quite explain why the COG doesn't issue the filters alone if the snipers are such a problem they allow the Gears to go around without helmets.
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* Surely all of the Gears are issued helmets? It's fair enough if you want a better field of vision, but it just seems ''monumentally'' stupid to leave free breathing apparatus at home, especially when you're fighting against enemies that aren't shy about using biological weapons.
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**** Or someone well revised in the hatedom of Karen Traviss could just come in and personally explain it in detail without referring to some other source, because not all of us want join in on one of the largest expanded universes in fiction just so we can understand the notoriety of a random bad author
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** As noted above, that is EXACTLY what they did with great success during the opening days of the war. Indeed, E-Day was pretty much them doing this to one settlement after another and then moving on. The only reason Jacinto survived was because the solid foundation upon which it rests apparently is prohibitively difficult to tunnel through, thus forcing the Locust to launch frontal assaults against the fairly entrenched defenses. The plot of Gears 2 was basically their attempt to find something big enough to sink Jacinto and prepare it for the slaughter in a massive project that must have been a massive engineering project and the Gears' discovery that preventing them from doing it was more or less hopeless and the only way to save the city's populace (if not the city itself) was to sink it before the Locust were ready and thus flood the Hollows. TL;DR: They do it all the time. Jacinto was the only city we know of they couldn't do so easily due to the natural protection it lies on, and they eventually found a way to sink it despite even THAT.
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**** You ought to read her Star Wars novels, sir, and learn about the notoriety she has in that community. You'll understand quite quickly.
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** What good are flashlights going to do? The kryll will just fly around the beams and swarm from multiple directions.
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*** Apart from all those things can be explained if you stop going for blood; industrial capacity has been reduced but that doesn't mean people can't still rig something up but it's not going to be mass produced and replacing parts is going to be a lot harder. She never says that all women are forced into the "rape camps" as they've now been called, in fact I think she was the first one to include a female COG member and it was one line hardly a pivotal plot point. Locust setting up traps for the guys that have spent the last 10+ years killing them versus attacking the convoy of unknown goods and farming equipment (they could easily attack once they got rid of the defenders) seems like a good plan when it's coming from something that can't even manage two syllables. In short I don't really understand all the hatred for Travis.
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*** What are you talking about? There's a whole scene about its headlights breaking down.
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*** Yeah, and then they cut their way out of the worm with their chainsaws. What, it's nuke-proof but susceptible to a hedge-strimmer? Either that or its skin is somehow easier to cut through from one side than the other.
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** In the future, apparently, there will be no duct tape. Also, [[WallBanger THE FUCKING CENTAUR DOESN'T HAVE HEADLIGHTS.]]
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* God guys do the research. They're not camps they're ''farms''. Sera has been in a sate of total war for over a century and in total war NOBODY is a civilian. If you're a woman and can't fight in the Army, than you fight with your body; by being ''paid'' (in rations which are at this point the most valuable thing on Sera) to breed. Of course, giving hormones to 10-year olds is a little extreme but it doesn't show any differnce between what the rest of what [[NukeEm COG]] [[KillSat has done]].

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* God guys *** God, guys, do the research. They're not camps camps; they're ''farms''. Sera has been in a sate of total war for over a century and in total war NOBODY is a civilian. If you're a woman and can't fight in the Army, than then you fight with your body; by being ''paid'' (in rations which are at this point the most valuable thing on Sera) to breed. Of course, giving hormones to 10-year olds is a little extreme but it doesn't show any differnce between what it's not that different from the rest of what [[NukeEm COG]] [[KillSat has done]].
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* God guys do the research. They're not camps they're ''farms''. Sera has been in a sate of total war for over a century and in total war NOBODY is a civilian. If you're a woman and can't fight in the Army, than you fight with your body; by being ''paid'' (in rations which are at this point the most valuable thing on Sera) to breed. Of course, giving hormones to 10-year olds is a little extreme but it doesn't show any differnce between what the rest of what [[NukeEm COG]] [[CKillSat has done]].

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* God guys do the research. They're not camps they're ''farms''. Sera has been in a sate of total war for over a century and in total war NOBODY is a civilian. If you're a woman and can't fight in the Army, than you fight with your body; by being ''paid'' (in rations which are at this point the most valuable thing on Sera) to breed. Of course, giving hormones to 10-year olds is a little extreme but it doesn't show any differnce between what the rest of what [[NukeEm COG]] [[CKillSat [[KillSat has done]].
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** It may be worth visiting Chairman Prescott's [http://gearsofwar.wikia.com/wiki/Gears_of_War_Wiki Gearspedia] page, in which it is noted that the COG's scorched earth tactic is extremely unpopular with the people left behind but that Prescott simply doesn't care. In his mind, it is not necessarily the ''only'' choice, but it is the one most guaranteed to be effective.

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** It may be worth visiting Chairman Prescott's [http://gearsofwar.[[http://gearsofwar.wikia.com/wiki/Gears_of_War_Wiki Gearspedia] Gearspedia]] page, in which it is noted that the COG's scorched earth tactic is extremely unpopular with the people left behind but that Prescott simply doesn't care. In his mind, it is not necessarily the ''only'' choice, but it is the one most guaranteed to be effective.
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*** OP here: In my case, I was figuring it was its own universe, or at least own corner of the universe. The only reason I considered the option of it being a colony world was a bogus citation of Word of God.
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-->'''Tai:''' Might versus light.
-->'''Carmine:''' ...Meaning?
-->'''Tai:''' That I'd take an extra gun over a flashlight any day.
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*How come the gears don't have flashlights for use against the Krill?

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