History Headscratchers / ApolloJusticeAceAttorney

12th Apr '16 11:10:12 AM OrangenChan
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** Most likely because there was a very narrow window of time that Lamiroir [[spoiler: was actually in the vent. Sure, Daryan may have known she was there (or at least that there was some time that Lamiroir was off stage), but he'd still have to get her at just the right time]]. It's just much simpler to assume that the accomplice was [[spoiler: Machi]] all along; or it just didn't occur to anyone until later.




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** Maybe she just assumed everyone would put two and two together sooner than they did, since it was obvious to her what she meant, or... Lamiroir might have had a hard time keeping up with the trial. Sure, she knows English and she's considerably more fluent than Machi, but the speed at which everyone was going may caused her to miss some things.


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** It likely either happened rarely enough that Apollo didn't put much thought into it, or he simply had no real reason to put it to use until the start of the game. That, and even if he did notice, going from "Hey, my bracelet randomly tightens sometimes" to "I have magical lie-detecting abilities" would be kind of a leap if he didn't have Phoenix there to point it out to him.
7th Apr '16 5:05:09 AM SolidSonicTH
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-->'''Phoenix''': A fraud? How can you be so sure? \\
-->'''Kristoph''': Wh-What...? \\
-->'''Phoenix''': I would think the only person who could claim it was a fraud would be the one who took the real card from the crime scene... The real killer!

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-->'''Phoenix''': '''Phoenix''': A fraud? How can you be so sure? \\
-->'''Kristoph''': '''Kristoph''': Wh-What...? \\
-->'''Phoenix''': '''Phoenix''': I would think the only person who could claim it was a fraud would be the one who took the real card from the crime scene... The real killer!
7th Apr '16 5:04:57 AM SolidSonicTH
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** Phoenix specifically says to Kristoph that only someone who was at the crime scene at the time in question would be able to prove what he is presenting as fabrication. To say it's fake is also to implicate yourself, so Kristoph had to shut himself up.
-->'''Kristoph''': The court can't accept this evidence! It's a fraud! \\
-->'''Phoenix''': A fraud? How can you be so sure? \\
-->'''Kristoph''': Wh-What...? \\
-->'''Phoenix''': I would think the only person who could claim it was a fraud would be the one who took the real card from the crime scene... The real killer!

* Why do you think Apollo never noticed his ability to catch people lying? He's had that bracelet all his life and surely every now and then he'd feel it randomly tighten around his wrist when talking with someone. After awhile you'd probably start to wonder why and maybe read into the situation a little deeper.
19th Mar '16 6:02:42 PM rjd1922
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* In Ace Attorney 4, where did everyone ''go''? Not only is Phoenix left with only Ema -- a side character who appeared only once, and that was in the "postscript" game -- as support, none of the "old guard" appear in [[spoiler: the flashback case... which takes place only two months after the final case of Ace Attorney 3. Would Edgeworth, Maya, Pearl and Gumshoe really just stand back as Nick's life went "boom"? Or was the need to clear the decks for a new cast -- and have Phoenix radically altered in terms of personality-- just so strong it defied all laws of common sense?]]

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* In Ace ''Ace Attorney 4, 4'', where did everyone ''go''? Not only is Phoenix left with only Ema -- a side character who appeared only once, and that was in the "postscript" game -- as support, none of the "old guard" appear in [[spoiler: the flashback case... which takes place only two months after the final case of Ace Attorney 3. Would Edgeworth, Maya, Pearl and Gumshoe really just stand back as Nick's life went "boom"? Or was the need to clear the decks for a new cast -- and have Phoenix radically altered in terms of personality-- just so strong it defied all laws of common sense?]]



*** [[spoiler: It should be noted that it's never stated or even implied that Phoenix completely lost contact with them, but they have lives too, Maya has to be watching over Kurain now. Also, Phoenix went through a lot those 7 years, it must have been trying to completely lose your life's work and lose faith in the justice system all at once, and end up working as a poker player in a dive of a restaraunt]]

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*** [[spoiler: It should be noted that it's never stated or even implied that Phoenix completely lost contact with them, but they have lives too, Maya has to be watching over Kurain now. Also, Phoenix went through a lot those 7 years, it must have been trying to completely lose your life's work and lose faith in the justice system all at once, and end up working as a poker player in a dive of a restaraunt]]restaraunt.]]



*** Forget his past; Phoenix isn't exactly forthcoming about his ''present''. He pops in for five minutes per case and then takes off again. For all we know, he could be heading out to poker night with Edgeworth, Franzy, Gumshoe, Maya, etc. Apollo doesn't know any of these people and Phoenix doesn't have any reason to go, "Hey, Apollo, did I ever tell you about how my friends and I used to have a joke about the way Larry Butz smells?" Keep in mind: he did manage to get a [[JustForPun trial]] run of [[spoiler: a new court system]] off the ground. That's quite an accomplishment for a disgraced ex-lawyer, but much more feasible for a disgraced ex-lawyer who is well-connected within the prosecutors' office and the police station.

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*** Forget his past; Phoenix isn't exactly forthcoming about his ''present''. He pops in for five minutes per case and then takes off again. For all we know, he could be heading out to poker night with Edgeworth, Franzy, Gumshoe, Maya, etc. Apollo doesn't know any of these people and Phoenix doesn't have any reason to go, "Hey, Apollo, did I ever tell you about how my friends and I used to have a joke about the way Larry Butz smells?" Keep in mind: he did manage to get a [[JustForPun trial]] run of [[spoiler: a [[spoiler:a new court system]] off the ground. That's quite an accomplishment for a disgraced ex-lawyer, but much more feasible for a disgraced ex-lawyer who is well-connected within the prosecutors' office and the police station.



** I always thought that the real douchebag was Magnify. He made his apprentices think that they had killed his daughter. He apparently made the same daughter abandon her child (maybe even her husband if he really isn't dead). He didn't think that making both of his apprentices think that they were getting his will was enough, so he also killed himself just to frame the rejected apprentice of murdering him.
I didn't think that Zak was really a bad person, he did make some bad choices, but he wasn't evil. About the matters of his wife and Valant, he was manipulated by Magnify. And for not choosing Kristoph because of a poker match, it does not really say but a popular headcanon is that he averted him cheating.

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** I always thought that the real douchebag was Magnify.Magnifi. He made his apprentices think that they had killed his daughter. He apparently made the same daughter abandon her child (maybe even her husband if he really isn't dead). He didn't think that making both of his apprentices think that they were getting his will was enough, so he also killed himself just to frame the rejected apprentice of murdering him.
I didn't think that Zak was really a bad person, he did make some bad choices, but he wasn't evil. About the matters of his wife and Valant, he was manipulated by Magnify.Magnifi. And for not choosing Kristoph because of a poker match, it does not really say but a popular headcanon is that he averted him cheating.
19th Mar '16 5:55:55 PM rjd1922
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** Valant would have gotten the rights if Zak didn't show up at all, or if he showed up and didn't shoot anything.
1st Mar '16 1:46:26 AM nowaymanguy
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** If I recall, the game actually implies on several occasions (pretty strongly) that, while Ema's undoubtedly good at forensics, and has the mental know-how, she's pretty bad when it comes to practical forensics. Or the very least when it comes to putting practical forensics to new use. When they use the footprint analysis kit, she reads the instructions while going through process, and specifically passes the buck to Apollo. Been a while since I've played the game, but I think I recall the game emphathizing how Ema seemed to make Apollo do it, and didn't seem to want to do it yourself. So it's implied she has quite a bit of trouble actually learning new techniques. Plus, simply being knowledgeable and decently adapted to forensics isn't exactly going to make sure you get in. Honestly, let's be frank here: Ema's main trait when it comes to forensics is her enthusiasm and love for the entire thing. Yes, she's knowledgeable and good at it too, but the main reason she's seen as a forensics centered character is because of how much she loves it, not because of how good she is at it.
18th Feb '16 6:59:56 PM BillyMT
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** The main problem with this big plot hole is that, from the jury's viewpoint (which was the whole reason that this "intermission" happened), Phoenix created the MASON, which was reproducing testimonies from different times regarding this one case, not unlike a very fancy and expensive videoplayer. Which means that, just like any other media presented as factual evidence in court, he basically fabricated evidence based on his own uncreditable testimony. Wasn't him disbarred for this very reason?!

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** The main problem with this big plot hole is that, from the jury's viewpoint (which was the whole reason that this "intermission" happened), Phoenix created the MASON, which was reproducing testimonies from different times regarding this one case, not unlike a very fancy and expensive videoplayer. Which means that, just like the bias on any other media presented as factual evidence in court, he Phoenix could basically fabricated fabricate evidence based on his own uncreditable testimony. Wasn't him disbarred for this very reason?!
18th Feb '16 6:56:19 PM BillyMT
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** The main problem with this big plot hole is that, from the jury's viewpoint (which was the whole reason that this "intermission" happened), Phoenix created the MASON to fabricate evidence based on his own uncreditable testimony. Wasn't him disbarred for this very reason?!

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** The main problem with this big plot hole is that, from the jury's viewpoint (which was the whole reason that this "intermission" happened), Phoenix created the MASON to fabricate MASON, which was reproducing testimonies from different times regarding this one case, not unlike a very fancy and expensive videoplayer. Which means that, just like any other media presented as factual evidence in court, he basically fabricated evidence based on his own uncreditable testimony. Wasn't him disbarred for this very reason?!
reason?!
18th Feb '16 6:50:40 PM BillyMT
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to:

**The main problem with this big plot hole is that, from the jury's viewpoint (which was the whole reason that this "intermission" happened), Phoenix created the MASON to fabricate evidence based on his own uncreditable testimony. Wasn't him disbarred for this very reason?!
11th Feb '16 2:39:15 AM OrangenChan
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** Valant was screwed either way simply due to the fact that Zak came first. Even if he ''had'' gotten the chance to [[spoiler: do Magnifi's "test"]], it wouldn't have mattered; Magnifi being a jerk and saying "Only Zak gets them" is basically what happened anyway, if I'm remembering it right. [[spoiler: And if Zak had done it "wrong," then Magnifi's ''dead'' and it doesn't matter anyway.]]
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