Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Editing.
Deleted line(s) 14 (click to see context) :
* AMillionIsAStatistic: Discussed by [=McNulty=] in the opening scenes. Savior 28 and Savior 13 have their epic final battle that causes mass casualties (offscreen, of course) and massive amounts of property damage. [=McNulty=] comments that people aren't meant to process so much grief, and therefore compartmentalize such things between "people who matter" and "people who don't." Notably, during a dark moment, 13 leaves 28 in rubble while announcing that he's going to go and kill Samantha, 28's ex-girlfriend. 28, who until then had been trying to get 13 to surrender peacefully, immediately gets up and delivers a NoHoldsBarredBeatdown on 13, who simply chuckles that he knew that would get a rise out of 28.
Changed line(s) 35 (click to see context) from:
* AMillionIsAStatistic: [=McNulty=] says that if someone treated every death as if they "really mattered", he would go catatonic. Savior 28 goes catatonic after helping free Buchenwald in his civilian identity.
to:
* AMillionIsAStatistic: [=McNulty=] says that if someone treated every death as if they "really mattered", he would go catatonic. Savior 28 goes catatonic after helping free Buchenwald in his civilian identity. In the opening scene, 28 and Savior 13 have their epic final battle that causes mass casualties (offscreen, of course) and massive amounts of property damage. During a dark moment, 13 leaves 28 in rubble while announcing that he's going to go and kill Samantha, 28's ex-girlfriend. 28, who until then had been trying to get 13 to surrender peacefully, immediately gets up and delivers a NoHoldsBarredBeatdown on 13, who simply chuckles that he knew that would get a rise out of 28.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Adding tropes.
Added DiffLines:
* AMillionIsAStatistic: Discussed by [=McNulty=] in the opening scenes. Savior 28 and Savior 13 have their epic final battle that causes mass casualties (offscreen, of course) and massive amounts of property damage. [=McNulty=] comments that people aren't meant to process so much grief, and therefore compartmentalize such things between "people who matter" and "people who don't." Notably, during a dark moment, 13 leaves 28 in rubble while announcing that he's going to go and kill Samantha, 28's ex-girlfriend. 28, who until then had been trying to get 13 to surrender peacefully, immediately gets up and delivers a NoHoldsBarredBeatdown on 13, who simply chuckles that he knew that would get a rise out of 28.
Added DiffLines:
* NotSoDifferentRemark: During their final fight--the first issue's first scene--Savior 28 tries to get Savior 13 to surrender, saying that he can turn himself in and 28 will help him get his life together. 13 simply says that 28 has done this routine before, and that the latter should just admit that he enjoys fighting and beating people up as much as 13 does. "So stop pretending you're ''better'' than me," 13 coldly replies.
Added DiffLines:
* TheParagonAlwaysRebels: An interesting take on the concept; Savior 28 doesn't become an outright supervillain like in most BewareTheSuperman tales. Rather, 28 becomes disillusioned with fighting after defeating his long-time rival Savior 13 and realizing that he still feels empty at the end of it all. Moreover, he mourns 13's death as a waste of life. After 9/11 happens while he was hungover, 28 decides that he won't help in the War on Terror, opting instead to advocate for pacifism and peace for all parties involved. Naturally, the very pro-war American population and US Government see this as 28 "betraying" them.
Added DiffLines:
** While people are mourning 28, George W. Bush is shown claiming that Saddam Hussein used a mind-control device hidden under Baghdad to cause 28 to go down the path that led to his death. This is an obvious jab at the Bush Administration's claims that Iraq had hidden weapons of mass destruction. The whole work in general takes a huge swing at Bush and the War on Terror.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Adding tropes.
Changed line(s) 21 (click to see context) from:
* CreatorInJoke: At one point, [=McNulty=] reminisces about how a supervillain named Roar drugged 28 and locked him away in an asylum for some time. In the meantime, Roar took 28's costume and went around disguised as him (and [=McNulty=] specifies that this was during 28's "black leather phase" ("God, he looked ridiculous."), attacking all criminals who crossed his path--"everyone from hard-core hitmen to two-bit pot-dealers"--with equal ferocity. This is a reference to ''ComicBook/KravensLastHunt'', which [=DeMatteis=] also wrote.
to:
* CreatorInJoke: At one point, [=McNulty=] reminisces about how a supervillain named Roar drugged 28 and locked him away in an asylum for some time. In the meantime, Roar took 28's costume and went around disguised as him (and [=McNulty=] specifies that this was during 28's "black leather phase" ("God, he looked ridiculous."), him, attacking all criminals who crossed his path--"everyone from hard-core hitmen to two-bit pot-dealers"--with equal ferocity.ferocity. [=McNulty=] also specifies that this was during 28's "black leather phase" ("God, he looked ridiculous."). This is a reference to ''ComicBook/KravensLastHunt'', which [=DeMatteis=] also wrote.
Added DiffLines:
* TakeThat: [=McNulty's=] comment about 28's black leather phase being ridiculous can be seen as a mild one to [[ComicBook/SpiderMan Peter Parker]]'s time with the Black Symbiote suit. Notably, [=DeMatteis=], while still proud of the work he did writing ''ComicBook/KravensLastHunt'', has commented on his blog that it was reflective of the struggles he was dealing with at the time, hence the more melancholic and somber mood. He has since moved on and become a much happier person since then, so this whole bit about 28 could just be a little laugh at his past DarkerAndEdgier self.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Adding tropes.
Added DiffLines:
** Roar is one for Kraven; see CreatorInJoke.
Added DiffLines:
* CreatorInJoke: At one point, [=McNulty=] reminisces about how a supervillain named Roar drugged 28 and locked him away in an asylum for some time. In the meantime, Roar took 28's costume and went around disguised as him (and [=McNulty=] specifies that this was during 28's "black leather phase" ("God, he looked ridiculous."), attacking all criminals who crossed his path--"everyone from hard-core hitmen to two-bit pot-dealers"--with equal ferocity. This is a reference to ''ComicBook/KravensLastHunt'', which [=DeMatteis=] also wrote.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
The relationship between Savior 28 and Queen Shakti was never mentioned on the list of Tropes.
Added DiffLines:
* DatingCatwoman: Savior 28 and Queen Shakti.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 32 (click to see context) from:
* NoCelebritiesWereHarmed: While we see various real-world celebrities and historical figures, including UsefulNotes/FranklinDRoosevelt and Orson Welles, Dennis [=McNulty=] looks a lot like JackKirby. Artist Mike Cavallaro himself has said he didn't intend [=McNulty=] to look like Kirby, instead trying to go for James Cagney and Leo Gorcey. "So yes, Dennis does kinda look like Jack Kirby. But he also kinda looks like James Cagney with maybe a little Leo Gorcey, which is what I was really shooting for," Cavallaro says. "No attempt was made by either J.M. nor [me] to draw any connection between Jack Kirby's beliefs and those of the character, Dennis [=McNulty=]."
to:
* NoCelebritiesWereHarmed: While we see various real-world celebrities and historical figures, including UsefulNotes/FranklinDRoosevelt and Orson Welles, Dennis [=McNulty=] looks a lot like JackKirby.Creator/JackKirby. Artist Mike Cavallaro himself has said he didn't intend [=McNulty=] to look like Kirby, instead trying to go for James Cagney and Leo Gorcey. "So yes, Dennis does kinda look like Jack Kirby. But he also kinda looks like James Cagney with maybe a little Leo Gorcey, which is what I was really shooting for," Cavallaro says. "No attempt was made by either J.M. nor [me] to draw any connection between Jack Kirby's beliefs and those of the character, Dennis [=McNulty=]."
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 36 (click to see context) from:
* Sidekick: Dennis [=McNulty's=] original job as the Daring Disciple.
to:
* Sidekick: {{Sidekick}}: Dennis [=McNulty's=] original job as the Daring Disciple.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Moving to proper namespace.
Added DiffLines:
[[quoteright:250:http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Savior28.jpg]]
[[caption-width-right:250:"Well, that'll happen."]]
->''"It's funny, y'know? And kind of sad. Never once... in all the decades I spent solving every problem with my fists -- did anyone ever accuse me of preaching violence. But now... when I talk about finding another way... a better way... for us to live... they're always accusing me of ramming my views down people's throats..."''
''The Life and Times of Savior 28'' is a miniseries published by IDW, written by J.M. [=DeMatteis=] and drawn by Michael Cavallaro. Savior 28, a CaptainErsatz of Franchise/{{Superman}} and ComicBook/CaptainAmerica, has been called the Avatar of Liberty for 60 years. His real name is Jimmy Smith and he is 102 years old, even though he still looks to be 35. However, Savior 28 has finally decided to stop fighting for justice with violence and become a Pacifist. Of course, being an ActualPacifist and a TechnicalPacifist are two different things. Also, there are supervillains eager for his blood, superheroes who wonder whether he's an evil impostor, and his former sidekick, who narrates the whole tragic tale. Dennis [=McNulty=], formerly the Daring Disciple, assassinates Savior 28 midway through the first issue.
The miniseries is based on an idea J.M. [=DeMatteis=] had for Captain America in the early 1980s, where Cap would decide to become an advocate for peace and eventually get assassinated. After 30 years and Cap's own (temporary) death, [=DeMatteis=] wanted to use the miniseries to explain how fruitless the use of violence can be in solving conflict, in general and specifically in superhero comic books.
----
!!Tropes:
* TheAlcoholic: Smith's problem with alcohol is mentioned quite often.
* BewareTheSuperman: "But my employers knew there was nothing funny about a raging alcoholic with a history of mental illness... who just happened to be powerful enough to take the whole damn country, maybe even the whole damn world, down with him."
* CaptainErsatz:
** Savior 28 has a lot in common with both Superman and Captain America. There's a bit of Captain Marvel in there as well. The three vastly different origins (aliens, government experiment, the Spirit of America) he has told cloud the issue even more.
** Hadrach the Lemurian seems to be a mix of the ComicBook/SubMariner and ComicBook/SwampThing.
* ClothesMakeTheLegend: Savior 28 altered his costume over the years to fit the times. [=McNulty=] mocks his love beads in the '60s and black leather in the '80s.
* ComicBookTime: Averted, as Savior 28 has been around for 60 years but hasn't aged.
* CutShort: This was originally going to be a six-issue miniseries. The removal of one issue leaves questions about certain bits of dialog and plotlines.
* ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin: We get to see the life and times of Savior 28.
* EvilCounterpart: Savior 13. They both got their powers from The Master Stone.
* EvilKnockoff: Savior 13
* FemmeFatale: Queen Shakti
* FallenHero: Right before his assassination, we see that Savior 28 has fallen out of favor with the public. We learn how in issue 5.
* FlyingBrick: Savior 28 has the basic flight, strength, invulnerability set of powers. He gets them from the Master Stone.
* GoodIsOldFashioned: Savior 28 was seen as outmoded or an "establishment tool" by the counterculture movement of the 1960s. Savior 28 himself sees violence as old fashioned, saying it goes back to the ancient myths and the Old Testament. He wants to find a better way.
* GreenRocks: The Master Stone itself. The final issue reveals that [[spoiler:The Master Stone is somehow the only thing that can "fatally" hurt Savior 28. Savior 13 once nearly killed him with a dagger made of the stone. Dennis uses bullets made from his piece of the Master Stone to finally murder Savior 28.]]
* HumansAreBastards: Dennis [=McNulty=]'s opinion about humanity.
* IdentityImpersonator: [=McNulty=] filled in as Savior 28 while Smith was catatonic after World War II, at the request of President Truman. [=McNulty=] says Jimmy saw him as an impostor, but Dennis isn't the most reliable narrator.
* AMillionIsAStatistic: [=McNulty=] says that if someone treated every death as if they "really mattered", he would go catatonic. Savior 28 goes catatonic after helping free Buchenwald in his civilian identity.
* NoCelebritiesWereHarmed: While we see various real-world celebrities and historical figures, including UsefulNotes/FranklinDRoosevelt and Orson Welles, Dennis [=McNulty=] looks a lot like JackKirby. Artist Mike Cavallaro himself has said he didn't intend [=McNulty=] to look like Kirby, instead trying to go for James Cagney and Leo Gorcey. "So yes, Dennis does kinda look like Jack Kirby. But he also kinda looks like James Cagney with maybe a little Leo Gorcey, which is what I was really shooting for," Cavallaro says. "No attempt was made by either J.M. nor [me] to draw any connection between Jack Kirby's beliefs and those of the character, Dennis [=McNulty=]."
* OddFriendship: James Smith was good friends with Orson Welles.
* SamaritanSyndrome: Whether it is more about doing good or feeding one's ego is brought up.
* ShowWithinAShow: Various movies and serials were done about Savior 28, usually ending in a climactic battle with Savior 13.
* Sidekick: Dennis [=McNulty's=] original job as the Daring Disciple.
* SuperHeroOrigin: We never get a full origin of Savior 28 and how he got the Master Stone. The three versions we're given all at once are drastically different. Dennis comments that most origins are bogus and the heroes themselves don't even know.
* ToBeLawfulOrGood: The dilemma of Savior 28's peace movement, especially with the War on Terror just getting started.
* UnreliableNarrator: [=McNulty=] may be projecting a lot of his own issues with himself onto Savior 28.
----
[[caption-width-right:250:"Well, that'll happen."]]
->''"It's funny, y'know? And kind of sad. Never once... in all the decades I spent solving every problem with my fists -- did anyone ever accuse me of preaching violence. But now... when I talk about finding another way... a better way... for us to live... they're always accusing me of ramming my views down people's throats..."''
''The Life and Times of Savior 28'' is a miniseries published by IDW, written by J.M. [=DeMatteis=] and drawn by Michael Cavallaro. Savior 28, a CaptainErsatz of Franchise/{{Superman}} and ComicBook/CaptainAmerica, has been called the Avatar of Liberty for 60 years. His real name is Jimmy Smith and he is 102 years old, even though he still looks to be 35. However, Savior 28 has finally decided to stop fighting for justice with violence and become a Pacifist. Of course, being an ActualPacifist and a TechnicalPacifist are two different things. Also, there are supervillains eager for his blood, superheroes who wonder whether he's an evil impostor, and his former sidekick, who narrates the whole tragic tale. Dennis [=McNulty=], formerly the Daring Disciple, assassinates Savior 28 midway through the first issue.
The miniseries is based on an idea J.M. [=DeMatteis=] had for Captain America in the early 1980s, where Cap would decide to become an advocate for peace and eventually get assassinated. After 30 years and Cap's own (temporary) death, [=DeMatteis=] wanted to use the miniseries to explain how fruitless the use of violence can be in solving conflict, in general and specifically in superhero comic books.
----
!!Tropes:
* TheAlcoholic: Smith's problem with alcohol is mentioned quite often.
* BewareTheSuperman: "But my employers knew there was nothing funny about a raging alcoholic with a history of mental illness... who just happened to be powerful enough to take the whole damn country, maybe even the whole damn world, down with him."
* CaptainErsatz:
** Savior 28 has a lot in common with both Superman and Captain America. There's a bit of Captain Marvel in there as well. The three vastly different origins (aliens, government experiment, the Spirit of America) he has told cloud the issue even more.
** Hadrach the Lemurian seems to be a mix of the ComicBook/SubMariner and ComicBook/SwampThing.
* ClothesMakeTheLegend: Savior 28 altered his costume over the years to fit the times. [=McNulty=] mocks his love beads in the '60s and black leather in the '80s.
* ComicBookTime: Averted, as Savior 28 has been around for 60 years but hasn't aged.
* CutShort: This was originally going to be a six-issue miniseries. The removal of one issue leaves questions about certain bits of dialog and plotlines.
* ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin: We get to see the life and times of Savior 28.
* EvilCounterpart: Savior 13. They both got their powers from The Master Stone.
* EvilKnockoff: Savior 13
* FemmeFatale: Queen Shakti
* FallenHero: Right before his assassination, we see that Savior 28 has fallen out of favor with the public. We learn how in issue 5.
* FlyingBrick: Savior 28 has the basic flight, strength, invulnerability set of powers. He gets them from the Master Stone.
* GoodIsOldFashioned: Savior 28 was seen as outmoded or an "establishment tool" by the counterculture movement of the 1960s. Savior 28 himself sees violence as old fashioned, saying it goes back to the ancient myths and the Old Testament. He wants to find a better way.
* GreenRocks: The Master Stone itself. The final issue reveals that [[spoiler:The Master Stone is somehow the only thing that can "fatally" hurt Savior 28. Savior 13 once nearly killed him with a dagger made of the stone. Dennis uses bullets made from his piece of the Master Stone to finally murder Savior 28.]]
* HumansAreBastards: Dennis [=McNulty=]'s opinion about humanity.
* IdentityImpersonator: [=McNulty=] filled in as Savior 28 while Smith was catatonic after World War II, at the request of President Truman. [=McNulty=] says Jimmy saw him as an impostor, but Dennis isn't the most reliable narrator.
* AMillionIsAStatistic: [=McNulty=] says that if someone treated every death as if they "really mattered", he would go catatonic. Savior 28 goes catatonic after helping free Buchenwald in his civilian identity.
* NoCelebritiesWereHarmed: While we see various real-world celebrities and historical figures, including UsefulNotes/FranklinDRoosevelt and Orson Welles, Dennis [=McNulty=] looks a lot like JackKirby. Artist Mike Cavallaro himself has said he didn't intend [=McNulty=] to look like Kirby, instead trying to go for James Cagney and Leo Gorcey. "So yes, Dennis does kinda look like Jack Kirby. But he also kinda looks like James Cagney with maybe a little Leo Gorcey, which is what I was really shooting for," Cavallaro says. "No attempt was made by either J.M. nor [me] to draw any connection between Jack Kirby's beliefs and those of the character, Dennis [=McNulty=]."
* OddFriendship: James Smith was good friends with Orson Welles.
* SamaritanSyndrome: Whether it is more about doing good or feeding one's ego is brought up.
* ShowWithinAShow: Various movies and serials were done about Savior 28, usually ending in a climactic battle with Savior 13.
* Sidekick: Dennis [=McNulty's=] original job as the Daring Disciple.
* SuperHeroOrigin: We never get a full origin of Savior 28 and how he got the Master Stone. The three versions we're given all at once are drastically different. Dennis comments that most origins are bogus and the heroes themselves don't even know.
* ToBeLawfulOrGood: The dilemma of Savior 28's peace movement, especially with the War on Terror just getting started.
* UnreliableNarrator: [=McNulty=] may be projecting a lot of his own issues with himself onto Savior 28.
----
