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''Pokémon Sword and Shield'' proved themselves to be the most controversial titles in the entire franchise since ''Pokémon Black and White'', thanks to a number of design choices that not only [[OldGuardVersusNewBlood greatly shifted the priorities of the games]], but [[FranchiseOriginalSin brought several long held problems with the series to a head]]. Nearly every facet of the game starts some kind of debate, and just about the only thing Pokémon fans can agree on is that these games completely shattered the fandom. But two things that stands out on both sides of the fandom are cautionary tales about why game development should be handled carefully and why the developers should take both praise and criticism seriously from fans.

to:

''Pokémon Sword and Shield'' proved themselves to be the most controversial titles in the entire franchise since ''Pokémon Black and White'', thanks to a number of design choices that not only [[OldGuardVersusNewBlood greatly shifted the priorities of the games]], but [[FranchiseOriginalSin brought several long held problems with the series to a head]]. Nearly every facet of the game starts some kind of debate, and just about the only thing Pokémon fans can agree on is that these games completely shattered the fandom. But two things that what stands out on both sides of the fandom are cautionary tales about why game development should be handled carefully brand power and why merchandising over their own works and importance of social media to the developers should take both praise and criticism seriously from fans.world.
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''Pokémon Sword and Shield'' proved themselves to be the most controversial titles in the entire franchise since ''Pokémon Black and White'', thanks to a number of design choices that not only [[OldGuardVersusNewBlood greatly shifted the priorities of the games]], but [[FranchiseOriginalSin brought several long held problems with the series to a head]]. Nearly every facet of the game starts some kind of debate, and just about the only thing Pokémon fans can agree on is that these games completely shattered the fandom. But two things that stands out on both sides of the fandom are cautionary tales on why game development should be handled carefully and that the developers should take both praise and criticism seriously from fans.

to:

''Pokémon Sword and Shield'' proved themselves to be the most controversial titles in the entire franchise since ''Pokémon Black and White'', thanks to a number of design choices that not only [[OldGuardVersusNewBlood greatly shifted the priorities of the games]], but [[FranchiseOriginalSin brought several long held problems with the series to a head]]. Nearly every facet of the game starts some kind of debate, and just about the only thing Pokémon fans can agree on is that these games completely shattered the fandom. But two things that stands out on both sides of the fandom are cautionary tales on about why game development should be handled carefully and that why the developers should take both praise and criticism seriously from fans.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


''Pokémon Sword and Shield'' proved themselves to be the most controversial titles in the entire franchise since ''Pokémon Black and White'', thanks to a number of design choices that not only [[OldGuardVersusNewBlood greatly shifted the priorities of the games]], but [[FranchiseOriginalSin brought several long held problems with the series to a head]]. Nearly every facet of the game starts some kind of debate, and just about the only thing Pokémon fans can agree on is that these games completely shattered the fandom.

to:

''Pokémon Sword and Shield'' proved themselves to be the most controversial titles in the entire franchise since ''Pokémon Black and White'', thanks to a number of design choices that not only [[OldGuardVersusNewBlood greatly shifted the priorities of the games]], but [[FranchiseOriginalSin brought several long held problems with the series to a head]]. Nearly every facet of the game starts some kind of debate, and just about the only thing Pokémon fans can agree on is that these games completely shattered the fandom. But two things that stands out on both sides of the fandom are cautionary tales on why game development should be handled carefully and that the developers should take both praise and criticism seriously from fans.
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* The music. Some think ''Pokémon X'' and ''Y''[='=]s soundtrack a solid entry in the series, while others find it painfully bland compared to that of other games. The end credits song "KISEKI", in particular, is seen as either heartwarming and beautiful or pretentious and unfitting, particularly as its lyrics aren't actually sung; many fans agree that the concept of a Nintendo song with lyrics was built upon better with "[[VideoGame/FireEmblemFates Lost in Thoughts All Alone]]", "[[VideoGame/SuperMarioOdyssey Jump Up, Super Star!]]" and "[[VideoGame/SuperSmashBrosUltimate Lifelight]]", all of which have sung lyrics and varying moods.

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* The music. Some think ''Pokémon X'' and ''Y''[='=]s soundtrack a solid entry in the series, while others find it painfully bland compared to that of other games. The end credits song "KISEKI", in particular, is seen as either heartwarming and beautiful or pretentious and unfitting, particularly as its lyrics aren't actually sung; many fans agree that the concept of a Nintendo song with lyrics was built upon better with "[[VideoGame/FireEmblemFates Lost in Thoughts All Alone]]", "[[VideoGame/SuperMarioOdyssey Jump Up, Super Star!]]" and Star!]]", "[[VideoGame/SuperSmashBrosUltimate Lifelight]]", "[[VideoGame/XenobladeChronicles2 Drifting Soul", "One Last You]]" and "[[VideoGame/FireEmblemThreeHouses The Edge of Dawn]]", all of which have sung lyrics and varying moods.
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** Generations VI, VII, and VIII marked a general shift towards streamlined, casualized and linear main plots, gimmicks such as Mega Evolution, Z-Moves, and Dynamaxing, larger regional Pokédexes that rely heavily on past generations (especially [[VideoGame/PokemonRedAndBlue Gen I]]), and more user-friendly competitive breeding and training in favor of fewer postgame features. Some fans highly enjoyed these changes, as shown by the greater sales and mainstream attention of games from ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' onwards; the increased focus on classic Pokémon helped [[WinBackTheCrowd win back]] those who were alienated by the Unova games, and many fans highly appreciated how Game Freak finally acknowledged and helped players deal with GuideDangIt competitive mechanics like [=EV's=] and [=IV's=]. Other fans did not enjoy this new direction for the franchise, mostly for making the games less engaging for fans invested in single-player campaigns, sidequests/exploration, and postgame facilities. This divide wasn't at all helped by the many design and technical flubs in the Gen VI, VII, and VIII games, such as highly inefficient programming (resulting in framerate drops), oversights in Pokémon movesets and mechanics, underwhleming visuals, and of course the infamous Pokédex and move exclusions. Overall, fans in the latter category accused the games of transitioning from self-contained creative endeavors to an unpolished, MerchandiseDriven arm meant to advertise the rest of the franchise and establish Pokémon as marketing icons, much like [[Anime/PokemonTheSeries the anime]].[[note]]Coincidentally, the corresponding seasons of the anime are viewed as significant improvements over its adaptations of Generations III through V, but suffer from many of the same complaints, leading to accusations that effort is "divided more evenly" between the anime and games than before.[[/note]]

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** Generations VI, VII, and VIII marked a general shift towards streamlined, casualized and linear main plots, gimmicks such as Mega Evolution, Z-Moves, and Dynamaxing, larger regional Pokédexes that rely heavily on past generations (especially [[VideoGame/PokemonRedAndBlue Gen I]]), and more user-friendly competitive breeding and training in favor of fewer postgame features. Some fans highly enjoyed these changes, as shown by the greater sales and mainstream attention of games from ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' onwards; the increased focus on classic Pokémon helped [[WinBackTheCrowd win back]] those who were alienated by the Unova games, and many fans highly appreciated how Game Freak finally acknowledged and helped players deal with GuideDangIt competitive mechanics like [=EV's=] and [=IV's=]. Other fans did not enjoy this new direction for the franchise, mostly for making the games less engaging for fans invested in single-player campaigns, sidequests/exploration, and postgame facilities. This divide wasn't at all helped by the many design and technical flubs in the Gen VI, VII, and VIII games, such as highly inefficient programming (resulting in framerate drops), oversights in Pokémon movesets and mechanics, underwhleming underwhelming visuals, and of course the infamous Pokédex and move exclusions. Overall, fans in the latter category accused the games of transitioning from self-contained creative endeavors to an unpolished, MerchandiseDriven arm meant to advertise the rest of the franchise and establish Pokémon as marketing icons, much like [[Anime/PokemonTheSeries the anime]].[[note]]Coincidentally, the corresponding seasons of the anime are viewed as significant improvements over its adaptations of Generations III through V, but suffer from many of the same complaints, leading to accusations that effort is "divided more evenly" between the anime and games than before.[[/note]]
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** Generations VI, VII, and VIII marked a general shift towards streamlined, casualized and linear main plots, gimmicks such as Mega Evolution, Z-Moves, and Dynamaxing, larger regional Pokédexes that rely heavily on past generations (especially [[VideoGame/PokemonRedAndBlue Gen I]]), and more user-friendly competitive breeding and training in favor of fewer postgame features. Some fans highly enjoyed these changes, as shown by the greater sales and mainstream attention of games from ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' onwards; the increased focus on classic Pokémon helped [[WinBackTheCrowd win back]] those who were alienated by the Unova games, and many fans highly appreciated how Game Freak finally acknowledged and helped players deal with GuideDangIt competitive mechanics like [=EV's=] and [=IV's=]. Other fans did not enjoy this new direction for the franchise, mostly for making the games less engaging for fans invested in single-player campaigns, sidequests/exploration, and postgame facilities. This divide wasn't at all helped by the many design and technical flubs in the Gen VI, VII, and VIII games, such as highly inefficient programming (resulting in framerate drops), oversights in Pokémon movesets and mechanics, and of course the infamous Pokédex and move exclusions. Overall, fans in the latter category accused the games of transitioning from self-contained creative endeavors to an unpolished, MerchandiseDriven arm meant to advertise the rest of the franchise and establish Pokémon as marketing icons, much like [[Anime/PokemonTheSeries the anime]].[[note]]Coincidentally, the corresponding seasons of the anime are viewed as significant improvements over Generations III through V, but suffer from many of the same complaints, leading to accusations that effort is "divided more evenly" between the anime and games than before.[[/note]]

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** Generations VI, VII, and VIII marked a general shift towards streamlined, casualized and linear main plots, gimmicks such as Mega Evolution, Z-Moves, and Dynamaxing, larger regional Pokédexes that rely heavily on past generations (especially [[VideoGame/PokemonRedAndBlue Gen I]]), and more user-friendly competitive breeding and training in favor of fewer postgame features. Some fans highly enjoyed these changes, as shown by the greater sales and mainstream attention of games from ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' onwards; the increased focus on classic Pokémon helped [[WinBackTheCrowd win back]] those who were alienated by the Unova games, and many fans highly appreciated how Game Freak finally acknowledged and helped players deal with GuideDangIt competitive mechanics like [=EV's=] and [=IV's=]. Other fans did not enjoy this new direction for the franchise, mostly for making the games less engaging for fans invested in single-player campaigns, sidequests/exploration, and postgame facilities. This divide wasn't at all helped by the many design and technical flubs in the Gen VI, VII, and VIII games, such as highly inefficient programming (resulting in framerate drops), oversights in Pokémon movesets and mechanics, underwhleming visuals, and of course the infamous Pokédex and move exclusions. Overall, fans in the latter category accused the games of transitioning from self-contained creative endeavors to an unpolished, MerchandiseDriven arm meant to advertise the rest of the franchise and establish Pokémon as marketing icons, much like [[Anime/PokemonTheSeries the anime]].[[note]]Coincidentally, the corresponding seasons of the anime are viewed as significant improvements over its adaptations of Generations III through V, but suffer from many of the same complaints, leading to accusations that effort is "divided more evenly" between the anime and games than before.[[/note]]
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* [[VideoGame3DLeap The transition from 2D sprites to 3D models.]] While there's no denying that many of the models are pretty and many think they blend in well with the stereoscopic 3D, [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks some think they aren't as cool as the Gen V animations were]]; many Fire-types have SpecialEffectsFailure with their body flames, and many flying Pokémon with wings are showing hovering in place in a very {{Narm}}y way ([[http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-xy/277.shtml Swellow]] is probably the best/worst example of this one) since they have to use the same models for Sky Battles. There's also the fact that ''Franchise/{{Pokemon}}'' was ''Creator/{{Nintendo}}'''s only major IP that didn't make the VideoGame3DLeap yet (even ''Franchise/{{Kirby}}'' games had started to mostly use 3D models), and many 2D sprite fans found it refreshing they stuck to them for so long. Others think it was about time they did it and were happy with the results.

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* [[VideoGame3DLeap The transition from 2D sprites to 3D models.]] While there's no denying that many of the models are pretty and many think they blend in well with the stereoscopic 3D, [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks some think they aren't as cool as the Gen V animations were]]; many Fire-types have SpecialEffectsFailure with their body flames, and many flying Pokémon with wings are showing hovering in place in a very {{Narm}}y way ([[http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-xy/277.shtml Swellow]] is and [[https://www.serebii.net/pokedex-xy/178.shtml Xatu]] are probably the best/worst example examples of this one) since they have to use the same models for Sky Battles. There's also the fact that ''Franchise/{{Pokemon}}'' was ''Creator/{{Nintendo}}'''s only major IP that didn't make the VideoGame3DLeap yet (even ''Franchise/{{Kirby}}'' games had started to mostly use 3D models), and many 2D sprite fans found it refreshing they stuck to them for so long. Others think it was about time they did it and were happy with the results.
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* The overall structure of the main series has been slowly but surely causing more and more rifts in the playerbase, with there being numerous points of contention. Many players want to see ''some'' sort of noticeably distinct change to the plot mechanism and/or battle mechanics, seeing the games as extremely similar and derivative, and those who don't want to fix what isn't broken, as the games in spite of this are of generally good and consistent quality. Major changes in creative direction were made twice -- first in Gen V, then in Gen VI, the latter lasting through Gen VII -- and both times evoked mixed reactions in the fanbase, with different demographics.

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* The overall structure of the main series has been slowly but surely causing more and more rifts in the playerbase, with there being numerous points of contention. Many players want to see ''some'' sort of noticeably distinct change to the plot mechanism and/or battle mechanics, seeing the games as extremely similar and derivative, and those who don't want to fix what isn't broken, as the games in spite of this are of generally good and consistent quality. Major changes in creative direction were made twice -- first in Gen V, then in Gen VI, the latter lasting through Gen VII VIII -- and both times evoked mixed reactions in the fanbase, with different demographics.



** Generations VI, VII, and VIII marked a general shift towards streamlined, casualized and linear main plots, gimmicks such as Mega Evolution, Z-Moves, and Dynamaxing, larger regional Pokédexes that rely heavily on past generations (especially [[VideoGame/PokemonRedAndBlue Gen I]]), and more user-friendly competitive breeding and training in favor of fewer postgame features and increased linearity. Some fans highly enjoyed these changes, as shown by the greater sales and mainstream attention of games from ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' onwards; the increased focus on classic Pokémon helped [[WinBackTheCrowd win back]] those who were alienated by the Unova games, and many fans highly appreciated how Game Freak finally acknowledged and helped players deal with GuideDangIt competitive mechanics like [=EV's=] and [=IV's=]. Other fans did not enjoy this new direction for the franchise, mostly for making the games less engaging for fans invested in single-player campaigns, sidequests/exploration, and postgame facilities. This divide wasn't at all helped by the many design and technical flubs in the Gen VI, VII, and VIII games, such as highly inefficient programming (resulting in framerate drops), oversights in Pokémon movesets and mechanics, and of course the infamous Pokédex and move exclusions. Overall, fans in the latter category accused the games of transitioning from self-contained creative endeavors to an unpolished, MerchandiseDriven arm meant to advertise the rest of the franchise and establish Pokémon as marketing icons, much like [[Anime/PokemonTheSeries the anime]].[[note]]Coincidentally, the corresponding seasons of the anime are viewed as significant improvements over Generations III through V, but suffer from many of the same complaints, leading to accusations that effort is "divided more evenly" between the anime and games than before.[[/note]]

to:

** Generations VI, VII, and VIII marked a general shift towards streamlined, casualized and linear main plots, gimmicks such as Mega Evolution, Z-Moves, and Dynamaxing, larger regional Pokédexes that rely heavily on past generations (especially [[VideoGame/PokemonRedAndBlue Gen I]]), and more user-friendly competitive breeding and training in favor of fewer postgame features and increased linearity.features. Some fans highly enjoyed these changes, as shown by the greater sales and mainstream attention of games from ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' onwards; the increased focus on classic Pokémon helped [[WinBackTheCrowd win back]] those who were alienated by the Unova games, and many fans highly appreciated how Game Freak finally acknowledged and helped players deal with GuideDangIt competitive mechanics like [=EV's=] and [=IV's=]. Other fans did not enjoy this new direction for the franchise, mostly for making the games less engaging for fans invested in single-player campaigns, sidequests/exploration, and postgame facilities. This divide wasn't at all helped by the many design and technical flubs in the Gen VI, VII, and VIII games, such as highly inefficient programming (resulting in framerate drops), oversights in Pokémon movesets and mechanics, and of course the infamous Pokédex and move exclusions. Overall, fans in the latter category accused the games of transitioning from self-contained creative endeavors to an unpolished, MerchandiseDriven arm meant to advertise the rest of the franchise and establish Pokémon as marketing icons, much like [[Anime/PokemonTheSeries the anime]].[[note]]Coincidentally, the corresponding seasons of the anime are viewed as significant improvements over Generations III through V, but suffer from many of the same complaints, leading to accusations that effort is "divided more evenly" between the anime and games than before.[[/note]]
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** Generations VI and VII marked a general shift towards streamlined, casualized and linear main plots, gimmicks such as Mega Evolution and Z-Moves, larger regional Pokédexes that rely heavily on past generations (especially [[VideoGame/PokemonRedAndBlue Gen I]]), and more user-friendly competitive breeding and training in favor of fewer postgame features. Some fans highly enjoyed these changes, as shown by the greater sales and mainstream attention of games from ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' onwards; the increased focus on classic Pokémon helped [[WinBackTheCrowd win back]] many fans who were alienated by the Unova games, and many fans highly appreciated how Game Freak finally acknowledged and helped players deal with GuideDangIt competitive mechanics like [=EV's=] and [=IV's=]. Other fans did not enjoy this new direction for the franchise, mostly for making the games less engaging for fans invested in single-player campaigns, sidequests/exploration, and postgame facilities. This divide wasn't at all helped by the many design and technical flubs in the Gen VI and VII games, such as highly inefficient programming (resulting in framerate drops) and oversights in Pokémon movesets and mechanics. Overall, fans in the latter category accused the games of transitioning from self-contained creative endeavors to an unpolished, MerchandiseDriven arm meant to advertise the rest of the franchise and establish Pokémon as marketing icons, much like [[Anime/{{Pokemon}} the anime]].[[note]]Coincidentally, the anime saw an overall bump in quality at that time, but suffered from many of the same complaints, leading to accusations that effort was "divided more evenly" between the anime and games than before.[[/note]]
** The intense extremes between the above have led fans to debate whether the main series should go in a more story-driven direction like Generations V and VII, or stick to an ExcusePlot like the older games and Generation VI, and make the game more about [[GottaCatchEmAll catching 'em all]] and exploration.

to:

** Generations VI VI, VII, and VII VIII marked a general shift towards streamlined, casualized and linear main plots, gimmicks such as Mega Evolution and Evolution, Z-Moves, and Dynamaxing, larger regional Pokédexes that rely heavily on past generations (especially [[VideoGame/PokemonRedAndBlue Gen I]]), and more user-friendly competitive breeding and training in favor of fewer postgame features. features and increased linearity. Some fans highly enjoyed these changes, as shown by the greater sales and mainstream attention of games from ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' onwards; the increased focus on classic Pokémon helped [[WinBackTheCrowd win back]] many fans those who were alienated by the Unova games, and many fans highly appreciated how Game Freak finally acknowledged and helped players deal with GuideDangIt competitive mechanics like [=EV's=] and [=IV's=]. Other fans did not enjoy this new direction for the franchise, mostly for making the games less engaging for fans invested in single-player campaigns, sidequests/exploration, and postgame facilities. This divide wasn't at all helped by the many design and technical flubs in the Gen VI VI, VII, and VII VIII games, such as highly inefficient programming (resulting in framerate drops) and drops), oversights in Pokémon movesets and mechanics. mechanics, and of course the infamous Pokédex and move exclusions. Overall, fans in the latter category accused the games of transitioning from self-contained creative endeavors to an unpolished, MerchandiseDriven arm meant to advertise the rest of the franchise and establish Pokémon as marketing icons, much like [[Anime/{{Pokemon}} [[Anime/PokemonTheSeries the anime]].[[note]]Coincidentally, the corresponding seasons of the anime saw an overall bump in quality at that time, are viewed as significant improvements over Generations III through V, but suffered suffer from many of the same complaints, leading to accusations that effort was is "divided more evenly" between the anime and games than before.[[/note]]
** The intense extremes between the above have led fans to debate whether the main series should go in a more story-driven direction like Generations V and VII, or stick to an ExcusePlot like the older games and Generation VI, Generations VI and VIII, and make the game more about [[GottaCatchEmAll catching 'em all]] and exploration.
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** There's also a FandomRivalry between fans of Flygon (an antlion [[OurDragonsAreDifferent that is somehow a dragon]]) and Garchomp (a land shark... [[OurDragonsAreDifferent that is also somehow a dragon]].) Flygon fans viciously and relentlessly bash Garchomp for being overrated, overpowered, outclassing Flygon in every way, having an ugly and overcomplicated design, and getting "special treatment" from Creator/GameFreak while Flygon's been left in the dust ''since the generation of its debut'', ''especially'' after Garchomp got a [[SuperMode Mega Evolution]] and Flygon didn't[[labelnote:note]]Gamefreak's actually pretty much MisBlamed on that last bit; they genuinely tried to come up with Mega Evolutions for ''both'' Pokémon, and while they succeeded with Garchomp, even after several attempts during the development of ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' and ''[[VideoGame/PokemonRubyAndSapphire Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire]]'' they couldn't get a design for Mega Flygon down they felt was good enough[[/labelnote]]. Garchomp fans just want Flygon fans to stop complaining and leave them and their landshark be, are just as prone to playing the "overrated" card as their opposition, and sometimes claim ''they'' and their Pokémon of choice are the ''real'' underdogs fandom-wise (the last two being fueled by the fact people who prefer Flygon actually seem to outnumber them by a good margin).

to:

** There's also a FandomRivalry between fans of Flygon (an antlion [[OurDragonsAreDifferent that is somehow a dragon]]) and Garchomp (a land shark... [[OurDragonsAreDifferent that is also somehow a dragon]].) Flygon fans viciously and relentlessly bash Garchomp for being overrated, overpowered, outclassing Flygon in every way, having an ugly and overcomplicated design, and getting "special treatment" from Creator/GameFreak while Flygon's been left in the dust ''since the generation of its debut'', ''especially'' after Garchomp got a [[SuperMode Mega Evolution]] and Flygon didn't[[labelnote:note]]Gamefreak's didn't[[labelnote:note]]Game Freak's actually pretty much MisBlamed on that last bit; they genuinely tried to come up with Mega Evolutions for ''both'' Pokémon, and while they succeeded with Garchomp, even after several attempts during the development of ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' and ''[[VideoGame/PokemonRubyAndSapphire Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire]]'' they couldn't get a design for Mega Flygon down they felt was good enough[[/labelnote]]. Garchomp fans just want Flygon fans to stop complaining and leave them and their landshark be, are just as prone to playing the "overrated" card as their opposition, and sometimes claim ''they'' and their Pokémon of choice are the ''real'' underdogs fandom-wise (the last two being fueled by the fact people who prefer Flygon actually seem to outnumber them by a good margin).
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* Tying into EnjoyTheStorySkipTheGame, the games' main campaign, ditching the ExcusePlot of previous games (aside from Gen 5) in favor of a more serious and overarching storyline and dialogue reminiscent of other [[EasternRPG JRPGs]], which notably reverses the Gen 5/Gen 6 rivalry. Many fans love it due to giving the plot more significance and fleshing out the characters and story more, particularly against ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' which were often criticized for lacking in these regards. On the other hand, other fans find it a case of TheyChangedItNowItSucks, as the ExcusePlot was a keystone of Pokémon games in the past and they feel the design of Pokémon games does not facilitate serious stories well. The implementation of said story is also a frequent point of debate, with Pokémon threads on Twitter, reddit, and elsewhere constantly going back and forth about the long stretches of dialogue at each plot point (some of which is arguably unnecessary), the subsequent decreased focus on competitive battling improvements and map exploration (particularly from those who PlayTheGameSkipTheStory), the major players of the story's conflict being {{Base Breaking Character}}s (the biggest example being Lillie), and the questionable pacing of the campaign itself (particularly dealing with the third island). And that doesn't even get into the replacement of Gyms with trials...

to:

* Tying into EnjoyTheStorySkipTheGame, the games' main campaign, ditching the ExcusePlot of previous games (aside from Gen 5) in favor of a more serious and overarching storyline and dialogue reminiscent of other [[EasternRPG JRPGs]], which notably reverses the Gen 5/Gen 6 rivalry. Many fans love it due to giving the plot more significance and fleshing out the characters and story more, particularly against ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' which were often criticized for lacking in these regards. On the other hand, other fans find it a case of TheyChangedItNowItSucks, as the ExcusePlot was a keystone of Pokémon games in the past and they feel the design of Pokémon games does not facilitate serious stories well. The implementation of said story and its quality is also a frequent point of debate, with Pokémon threads on Twitter, reddit, and elsewhere social media constantly going back and forth about the long stretches of dialogue at each plot point (some of which is arguably unnecessary), the subsequent decreased focus on competitive battling improvements and map exploration (particularly from those who PlayTheGameSkipTheStory), the major players of the story's conflict being {{Base Breaking Character}}s (the biggest example being Lillie), and the questionable pacing of the campaign itself (particularly dealing with the third island). And that doesn't even get into the replacement of Gyms with trials...
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Broken base entries cannot be added until 6 months after the game releases, so likely mid-2022.



!!''BDSP''
* The chibi artstyle. There are people who prefer the artstyle of SWSH and there are others who liked the artstyle as they compare it to ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaLinksAwakening''.
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''Pokémon Sword and Shield'' proved themselves to be the most controversial titles in the entire franchise since Pokémon Black and White, thanks to a number of design choices that not only [[OldGuardVersusNewBlood greatly shifted the priorities of the games]], but [[FranchiseOriginalSin brought several long held problems with the series to a head]]. Nearly every facet of the game starts some kind of debate, and just about the only thing Pokémon fans can agree on is that these games completely shattered the fandom.

to:

''Pokémon Sword and Shield'' proved themselves to be the most controversial titles in the entire franchise since Pokémon ''Pokémon Black and White, White'', thanks to a number of design choices that not only [[OldGuardVersusNewBlood greatly shifted the priorities of the games]], but [[FranchiseOriginalSin brought several long held problems with the series to a head]]. Nearly every facet of the game starts some kind of debate, and just about the only thing Pokémon fans can agree on is that these games completely shattered the fandom.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


''Pokémon Sword and Shield'' proved themselves to be the most controversial titles in the entire franchise, thanks to a number of design choices that not only [[OldGuardVersusNewBlood greatly shifted the priorities of the games]], but [[FranchiseOriginalSin brought several long held problems with the series to a head]]. Nearly every facet of the game starts some kind of debate, and just about the only thing Pokémon fans can agree on is that these games completely shattered the fandom.

to:

''Pokémon Sword and Shield'' proved themselves to be the most controversial titles in the entire franchise, franchise since Pokémon Black and White, thanks to a number of design choices that not only [[OldGuardVersusNewBlood greatly shifted the priorities of the games]], but [[FranchiseOriginalSin brought several long held problems with the series to a head]]. Nearly every facet of the game starts some kind of debate, and just about the only thing Pokémon fans can agree on is that these games completely shattered the fandom.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
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Added DiffLines:


!!''BDSP''
* The chibi artstyle. There are people who prefer the artstyle of SWSH and there are others who liked the artstyle as they compare it to ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaLinksAwakening''.
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* The Gym-less gameplay has had some levels of this thrown at it. Many people liked the formula being shaken up a bit and bringing a new idea to the table. Others cried that [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks they changed the formula]] and [[ItsShortSoItSucks it makes the game feel even shorter]]. ''Others'' don't think enough changed, arguing that the Island Trials were still too similar to gyms (both involve beating a strong opponent of a certain type specialty and their underlings), aside from a few elements such as the Totem calling an ally Pokémon.

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* The Gym-less gameplay has had some levels of this thrown at it. Many people liked the formula being shaken up a bit and bringing a new idea to the table. Others cried that [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks they changed the formula]] and [[ItsShortSoItSucks it makes the game feel even shorter]]. ''Others'' don't think enough changed, arguing that the Island Trials were Challenge was still too similar to gyms Gyms (both involve beating a strong opponent of a certain type specialty and their underlings), aside from a few elements such as the Totem calling an ally Pokémon.
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* The main plot. On the one hand, there are those who consider it a step back from ''VideoGame/PokemonBlackAndWhite'' for various reasons, including flat characterisation, less involved Gym Leaders, less detailed (and [[spoiler:apart from AZ,]] [[TrueArtIsAngsty less tragic]]) backstories, and a smaller post-game. On the other, there are those who felt the story in ''Black'' and ''White'' was melodramatic and overblown (and point out that the post-game of the original ''Black'' and ''White'' was also small - not as much as ''X'' and ''Y'' but not as large as [[VideoGame/PokemonBlack2AndWhite2 their own sequels]]), and see ''X'' and ''Y'' as a nice step back to the more conventional plots of the series.

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* The main plot. On the one hand, there are those who consider it a step back from ''VideoGame/PokemonBlackAndWhite'' for various reasons, including flat characterisation, less involved Gym Leaders, less detailed (and (and, [[spoiler:apart from AZ,]] AZ and maybe Emma,]] [[TrueArtIsAngsty less tragic]]) backstories, and a smaller post-game. On the other, there are those who felt the story in ''Black'' and ''White'' was melodramatic and overblown (and point out that the post-game of the original ''Black'' and ''White'' was also small - not as much as ''X'' and ''Y'' but not as large as [[VideoGame/PokemonBlack2AndWhite2 their own sequels]]), and see ''X'' and ''Y'' as a nice step back to the more conventional plots of the series.
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* A common debate is whether these games or ''Omega Ruby'' and ''Alpha Sapphire'' are the superior Gen VI games. Supporters of ''X'' and ''Y'' tend to enjoy the hugely expanded Pokédex and the return of Gen I favorites, Trainer customization, the Friend Safari and the Kalos region itself. Supporters of ''ORAS'' cite the wider variety of features, more balanced difficulty, greater level of polish, more extensive postgame, wider variety of obtainable starters and legendaries, and the Delta Episode. Of note is the fact that both sets of games [[PanderingToTheBase attempt to pander to nostalgic fans]], albeit in different ways, and also have deeper and more involved plots than previous ''Pokémon'' games.

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* A common debate is whether these games or ''Omega Ruby'' and ''Alpha Sapphire'' are the superior Gen VI games. Supporters of ''X'' and ''Y'' tend to enjoy the hugely expanded Pokédex and the return of Gen I favorites, Trainer customization, the Friend Safari and the Kalos region itself. Supporters of ''ORAS'' cite the wider variety of features, more balanced difficulty, greater level of polish, more extensive postgame, wider variety of obtainable starters and legendaries, Legendaries, and the Delta Episode. Of note is the fact that both sets of games [[PanderingToTheBase attempt to pander to nostalgic fans]], albeit in different ways, and also have deeper and more involved plots than previous ''Pokémon'' games.
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* The selection of older postgame Legendary Pokémon brings up some "quality vs. quantity" debates; apart from Latios and Latias, none of them are particularly popular or iconic, so there's some debate on how good the selection is and whether it would have been preferable to have more iconic legendaries such as the version mascots and Mewtwo.

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* The selection of older postgame Legendary Pokémon brings up some "quality vs. quantity" debates; apart from Latios and Latias, none of them are particularly popular or iconic, so there's some debate on how good the selection is and whether it would have been preferable to have more iconic legendaries Legendaries such as the version mascots and Mewtwo.
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* Iris, the gym leader in the first ''White'' game/Drayden's apprentice in ''Black'' is now the games' new champion, dressing like a fancy Franchise/DisneyPrincess and giving off a roar in her sprite animation before she battles you. There's a legion of fans who love this, while others argue that Iris is too bratty to actually deserve the title, claiming Alder, Marshal or even Drayden himself more fitting for the title. Her theme is either refreshingly upbeat compared to the intense themes of champions past or unfitting MagicalGirl anime music that serves as the worst Champion theme ever.

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* Iris, the gym leader Gym Leader in the first ''White'' game/Drayden's apprentice in ''Black'' is now the games' new champion, Champion, dressing like a fancy Franchise/DisneyPrincess and giving off a roar in her sprite animation before she battles you. There's a legion of fans who love this, while others argue that Iris is too bratty to actually deserve the title, claiming Alder, Marshal or even Drayden himself more fitting for the title. Her theme is either refreshingly upbeat compared to the intense themes of champions past or unfitting MagicalGirl anime music that serves as the worst Champion theme ever.
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* There's a huge drift in the fandom on whether Lyra is a SuspiciouslySimilarSubstitute or she simply is Kris redesigned.

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* There's a huge drift in the fandom on whether Lyra is a SuspiciouslySimilarSubstitute or she simply is Kris redesigned.redesigned, though this has subsided to an extent when ''VideoGame/PokemonMasters'' confirms they are separate characters.
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* The games are either praised for playing on the original games' strengths and transitioning well into the then-current game aesthetics, as well as including content from ''Crystal'' as well as ''Platinum'''s Battle Frontier [[VindicatedByHistory (especially as it's the last time the Battle Frontier appeared on the series)]], or criticized because there has been little to no work into fixing the most recognizable flaws of the original games, such as the difficulty and level curves, the wild Pokémon distribution locking several Johto species into the postgame, and Kanto feeling like {{filler}}, making the remakes look like a missed opportunity, if not outright worse than the originals.
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* Datamining, [[ContentLeak the act of going through the game's code to suss out every secret and tidbit the game has on file]]. On one hand, people appreciate plumbing the depths of the game's coding because [[GuideDangit so many mechanics on how the game functions is largely unexplained by the game itself]][[note]]Without datamining, things such as Pokémon stats, movepools, egg groups, effort values and individual values would be completely unknown without tedious trial and error as they are intentionally kept secret by the developers to make the experience more "organic"[[/note]]. On the other hand, it also inadvertently reveals a great number of spoilers (story related or Pokémon related), who some people unscrupulously post everywhere upon revelation. It's nearly impossible to go into the newest generation of games completely blind unless you've actively avoided all social media or the internet in general (which is increasingly harder to do as time goes on). It also spoils when things such as a new mythical Pokémon is officially revealed by the company; [[ItWasHisSled the fanbase already found out about it months in advance]], thus the shock factor of the reveal that the company wanted is completely lost. A portion of the fanbase feel the need to put on a {{Kayfabe}} of sorts (pretending that the information isn't known) while a portion does not and treat the spoilers as common knowledge (without consideration for those who do not want to be spoiled). It also puts fan websites, wikis (including this one), gaming news sites and Website/YouTube channels in a bind where their creators and maintainers want to enjoy the product spoiler-free but need to post ''something'' about the revealed information. Gen VIII would rectify some of this by leaving its mythicals out of the game entirely at launch, only adding them in with an update after the reveal. (Though that said, when the first DLC was released lots of data for the ''second'' DLC was found to be in the files as well.)

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* Datamining, [[ContentLeak the act of going through the game's code to suss out every secret and tidbit the game has on file]]. On one hand, people appreciate plumbing the depths of the game's coding because [[GuideDangit so many mechanics on how the game functions is largely unexplained by the game itself]][[note]]Without datamining, things such as Pokémon stats, movepools, egg groups, effort values and individual values would be completely unknown without tedious trial and error as they are intentionally kept secret by the developers to make the experience more "organic"[[/note]]. On the other hand, it also inadvertently reveals a great number of spoilers (story related or Pokémon related), who which some people unscrupulously post everywhere upon revelation. It's nearly impossible to go into the newest generation of games completely blind unless you've actively avoided all social media or the internet in general (which is increasingly harder to do as time goes on). It also spoils when things such as a new mythical Pokémon is officially revealed by the company; [[ItWasHisSled the fanbase already found out about it months in advance]], thus the shock factor of the reveal that the company wanted is completely lost. A portion of the fanbase feel the need to put on a {{Kayfabe}} of sorts (pretending that the information isn't known) while a portion does not and treat the spoilers as common knowledge (without consideration for those who do not want to be spoiled). It also puts fan websites, wikis (including this one), gaming news sites and Website/YouTube channels in a bind where their creators and maintainers want to enjoy the product spoiler-free but need to post ''something'' about the revealed information. Gen VIII would rectify some of this by leaving its mythicals out of the game entirely at launch, only adding them in with an update after the reveal. (Though that said, when the first DLC was released lots of data for the ''second'' DLC was found to be in the files as well.)
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* The PronounTrouble that occurs when referring to certain Pokémon. Is it appropriate to use "[[ItIsDehumanizing It]]", or go with gender-indicating pronouns? This is prominent in regards to Pokémon that are {{One Gender Race}}s, especially since there's more then one individual.

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* The PronounTrouble that occurs when referring to certain Pokémon. Is it appropriate to use "[[ItIsDehumanizing It]]", or go with gender-indicating pronouns? This is prominent in regards to Pokémon that are {{One Gender Race}}s, especially since there's more then than one individual.
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* The CasualCompetitiveConflict of Pokémon is also a common source for breaks in the fandom. It isn't as bad as other fandoms, as most competitive gamers also play casually, and the vast majority of people on both sides just kinda wanna have fun playing the game their own way, but there's enough dicks on either side (competitive gamers who are insistent that it makes them smarter to play the game this way, regarding casual gamers as incompetent noobs and "not real fans", and casual gamers who treat competitive gamers as though they're abusing real animals instead of game data and then hypocritically scorn competitive gamers for taking the game 'too seriously' as though [[MeasuringTheMarigolds wanting to know deeply about something makes it impossible to enjoy it]]) to make it a touchy subject at times.

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* The CasualCompetitiveConflict of Pokémon is also a common source for breaks in the fandom. It isn't as bad as other fandoms, as most competitive gamers also play casually, and the vast majority of people on both sides just kinda wanna have fun playing the game their own way, but there's enough dicks on either side (competitive gamers who are insistent that it makes them smarter to play the game this way, regarding casual gamers as incompetent noobs and "not real fans", and casual gamers who treat competitive gamers as though they're abusing real animals instead of game data and then hypocritically scorn competitive gamers for taking the game 'too seriously' as though (as if [[MeasuringTheMarigolds wanting to know deeply about something makes it impossible to enjoy it]]) to make it a touchy subject at times.
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This argument barely comes up anymore. Good lord, it’s about time this franchise got its own page


* For your own sake, it's best you don't get into a debate regarding whether or not "Pokémon" and the species' names should be capitalized when referring to the creatures. For example, is it proper to say "My strongest Pokémon is a Pikachu", "My strongest pokémon is a pikachu", or something in-between? It's a very hot-button issue in the fanfic community.[[note]]To elaborate, those opposed to capitalization argue that since you don't capitalize words like "animal", "cat", "dog", or similar, you shouldn't capitalize the word "pokémon" or any of the species names. The people in favor of capitalization point out that the words are capitalized in canon, so it would make sense to capitalize them in fanfiction. Most writers don't care either way, but some are very adamant about how they think it should work.[[/note]]
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* Dynamax and Gigantamax. Reception to them was already cold from the start thanks to being partially to blame for the Dex exclusions as well as being seen as an uninspired combination of Mega Evolutions and Z-Moves, neither of which returned in these games, resulting in the mechanic being seen as a big-time ReplacementScrappy for those mechanics by many people. On the one hand, many enjoy the simplicity of the mechanic and how much the additional effects of Max Moves add to the battle dynamics (especially in doubles), while rectifying issues that both Megas (being usable by only 42 Pokémon) and Z-Moves (were one time use) had (both mechanics also required giving up the Pokémon's held item, with one wild exception) and being set as a more fitting and time appropriate spectacle in the game's story. On the other hand, others see Dynamax as unoriginal and boring, as well as horridly unbalanced in practice (especially in singles), with people disliking the numerous benefits Dynamax Pokémon gain for what is seen as little to lose (the big one being their ability to set up a number of beneficial field effects and stat boosts ''and'' deal hefty damage to opponents at the same time).

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* Dynamax and Gigantamax. Reception to them was already cold from the start thanks to being partially to blame for the Dex exclusions as well as being seen as an uninspired combination of Mega Evolutions and Z-Moves, neither of which returned in these games, resulting in the mechanic being seen as a big-time ReplacementScrappy for those mechanics by many people. On the one hand, many enjoy the simplicity of the mechanic and how much the additional effects of Max Moves add to the battle dynamics (especially in doubles), while rectifying issues that both Megas (being usable by only 42 forty-two Pokémon) and Z-Moves (were one time (being strictly one-time use) had (both mechanics also required giving up the Pokémon's held item, with one wild exception) and being set as a more fitting and time appropriate spectacle in the game's story. On the other hand, others see Dynamax as unoriginal and boring, as well as horridly unbalanced in practice (especially in singles), with people disliking the numerous benefits Dynamax Pokémon gain for what is seen as little to lose (the big one being their ability to set up a number of beneficial field effects and stat boosts ''and'' deal hefty damage to opponents at the same time).
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* The big one is the infamous decision to disallow the acquisition and subsequent use of Pokémon not in the game's regional Pokédex. Formerly one of the core pillars of the franchise (per the former series tagline "Gotta catch 'em all!"), this change in mindset already proved incredibly divisive from the onset of its announcement, what with the Treehouse stream where it was announced being slammed by thousands of dislikes, and the topic trending within hours and being a source of debate for the rest of the prerelease. But the game's release and the reveal that 465 Pokemon were completely unavailable, thus excising over half of what the roster totaled to then, added further fuel to the fire. Those opposed to the decision, especially those whose main directive in the games was to collect them all, argue that having them all is so fundamental that removing them is not only an insult to both the fans that cherish each creature and the people that made them, but led to many other parts of the game suffering (such as the Battle Tower, which was inevitably going to be far less compelling as a result of a Dex purge). Those who defend it say that they never cared to collect them all and that the work needed to bring them all in every game would be massive for very little payoff, especially when the series had been piling up baggage for so long, and "Dexit" gave them a chance to start fresh and reevaluate the series on the whole (though whether they succeeded or not is a subject of very heavy debate as well).

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* The big one is the infamous decision to disallow the acquisition and subsequent use of Pokémon not in the game's regional Pokédex. Formerly one of the core pillars of the franchise (per the former series tagline "Gotta catch 'em all!"), this change in mindset already proved incredibly divisive from the onset of its announcement, what with the Treehouse stream where it was announced being slammed by thousands of dislikes, and the topic trending within hours and being a source of debate for the rest of the prerelease. But the The game's release and the reveal that 465 Pokemon Pokémon were completely unavailable, thus excising over half of what the roster totaled to then, added further fuel to the fire. Those opposed to the decision, especially those whose main directive in the games was to collect them all, all and those whose preferred Pokémon and team compositions were made unavailable, argue that having them all is so fundamental that removing them is not only an insult to both the fans that cherish each creature and the people that made them, but led to many other parts of the game suffering (such as the Battle Tower, which was inevitably going to be far less compelling as a result of a Dex purge). Those who defend it say that they never cared to collect them all and that the work needed to bring them all in every game would be massive for very little payoff, especially when the series had been piling up baggage for so long, and "Dexit" gave them a chance to start fresh and reevaluate the series on the whole (though whether they succeeded or not is a subject of very heavy debate as well).

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merging in entries from broken base page


* The fanbase is hugely divided over which generation is best, and with every new addition (or lack thereof) to the series, many people cry the entire franchise (or just a generation) ruined.
* Even playing the games divides the fans. Either [[StopHavingFunGuys you play competitively and are "taking the game too seriously"]], or [[{{Scrub}} you play for fun and "can't understand the subtle mathematics of the game"]].
* Fans are also divided over whether the main series should go in a more story-driven direction like [[VideoGame/PokemonBlackAndWhite Generation]] [[VideoGame/PokemonBlack2AndWhite2 V]] and [[VideoGame/PokemonSunAndMoon Generation VII]], or stick to an [[ExcusePlot excuse plot]] like the older games and [[VideoGame/PokemonXAndY Generation VI]], and make the game more about [[GottaCatchEmAll catching 'em all]] and exploration. There's also a divide between those who care more about what goes on during the main story campaign to those who care more about competitive battling [[note]]You usually only have access to the tools needed to create competitive monsters only after completing the main story, which can be a huge slog for those who only pick up the game for the competitive battling aspect.[[/note]]

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* The fanbase is hugely divided over which generation is best, and generations are the best or worst; with every new addition (or lack thereof) to the series, many people cry the entire franchise (or just a generation) ruined.
* Even playing the games divides the fans. Either [[StopHavingFunGuys you play competitively and
ruined. Here are "taking the game too seriously"]], or [[{{Scrub}} you play for fun and "can't understand the subtle mathematics just a handful of the game"]].
* Fans are also divided over whether the main series should go in a more story-driven direction like [[VideoGame/PokemonBlackAndWhite Generation]] [[VideoGame/PokemonBlack2AndWhite2 V]] and [[VideoGame/PokemonSunAndMoon
breaks:
**
Generation VII]], or stick to an [[ExcusePlot excuse plot]] like 1 vs. 2-8: Dubbed the older games "genwunners", these types of Pokémon fans refuse to acknowledge any part of the Pokémon franchise after the first generation, almost exclusively due to childhood [[NostalgiaFilter nostalgia]]. The phrase "There are only 151 real Pokémon" is often used, both seriously and [[VideoGame/PokemonXAndY [[MemeticMutation satirically]].
** Generations 2-8 vs.
Generation VI]], 1: Because of the "genwunners", there are now many fans who are sick of the first generation and make refuse to acknowledge it, often bashing the game more about [[GottaCatchEmAll catching 'em all]] somewhat dated designs of the earliest Pokémon and exploration. There's the buggy, flawed battle system.
** Generation 1-2 vs. 3-8: Some count the second generation along with the first one as being "real" but still refuse to enjoy any generations released afterwards. They're often lumped in with the "genwunners" as a result.
** Generations 5-8 vs Generations 1-4: Some fans exclude everything before the fifth generation, preferring only the newest Pokémon (some will count Generation 4 though).
** Generations 1-5 vs. Generation 6-8: Some fans dislike and refuse to acknowledge the sixth generation onward for two main reasons: the introduction of the "Fairy" type and gimmicks like Mega Evolutions and Z-Moves. Later generations have
also been accused of [[NostalgiaFilter grossly frequent Generation 1 pandering]] (Kanto starters in Generation 6, only Kanto Pokémon getting Alolan versions in Generation 7, the mere existence of Pokémon Let's Go: Pikachu and Eevee, and most of the Pokémon getting Gigantimax versions in Generation 8 being either Kanto Pokémon or Galar newcomers).
** Generations 5 and 7 vs. Generations 1-4, 6, and 8: Essentially boiling down to the CasualCompetitiveConflict, the aforementioned two generations (particularly 7) have a much heavier emphasis on story than is typical for the franchise, leading to
a divide between people who think the plot is interesting and engaging and those who care more feel it resulted in a rather lackluster metagame.
** Generations 1-7 vs. Generation 8: Easily the most heated and infamous one. This one essentially boils down to the removal of certain Pokémon in the roster of Sword and Shield (as well as Mega Evolutions and Z-Moves). Older fans consider the roster exclusions to be insulting to fans of Pokémon that did not get into the newer games (even those that were added later as DLC), rallying under the hashtag [=#BringBackNationalDex=]. They also claim that [[ReplacementScrappy the replacement for the 3DS games' Mega Evolutions and Z-Moves,]] [[ScrappyMechanic Dynamaxing,]] [[GameBreaker is wildly overpowered,]] and consider Sword and Shield's $60 (now $40 as of October 2020) price tag (with $30 DLC) to be overpriced considering the price of earlier installments and the length of the base game being only around 20 hours. Conversely, fans of Generation 8 don't mind the roster cut, saying that it alters the competitive scene in an interesting way and makes 100% completion less of a tedious chore. Similarly, the price of the game has also been linked to the console the system was released on rather then the game itself. They also consider going the DLC route to be an improvement over older games [[CapcomSequelStagnation just repackaging earlier installments as a definitive version]] and selling the improved version at the same price, [[OneGameForThePriceOfTwo causing players to buy the same game twice.]]
** There are many others; "Generations 1-2 and 5-7 vs. Generations 3-4", "Generations 1-4 vs. 5-7", "Generations 1-3 vs. 4-8", "Generations 2-4 vs. Generation 1 and 5-7", "Generations 1-3 and 6 vs. Generations 4-5 and 7", "Generations 6 and 7 vs. Generation 8", and so on. ''Pokémon'' has gone through so many changes throughout its history that it's difficult to find fans that fully accept every generation in the franchise.
* The CasualCompetitiveConflict of Pokémon is also a common source for breaks in the fandom. It isn't as bad as other fandoms, as most competitive gamers also play casually, and the vast majority of people on both sides just kinda wanna have fun playing the game their own way, but there's enough dicks on either side (competitive gamers who are insistent that it makes them smarter to play the game this way, regarding casual gamers as incompetent noobs and "not real fans", and casual gamers who treat competitive gamers as though they're abusing real animals instead of game data and then hypocritically scorn competitive gamers for taking the game 'too seriously' as though [[MeasuringTheMarigolds wanting to know deeply
about what goes something makes it impossible to enjoy it]]) to make it a touchy subject at times.
* Competitive players themselves are also very divided
on during the main story campaign to many subjects, with numerous divisions among those as well. You got those who care more about denounce people who plug numbers into battle simulators or "Pokémon generators" instead of taking the time to raise their own team, those who swear themselves off of "cheap" strategies as well as those who will use anything that is part of the game, and of course you can't forget those who see no value in Pokémon games aside from the competitive battling [[note]]You aspect of it and perceive the main campaign as little more than padding[[note]]You usually only have access to the tools needed to create competitive monsters only after completing the main story, which can be a huge slog for those who only pick up the game for the competitive battling aspect.[[/note]][[/note]]. It's telling how much fragmentation there is in the Pokémon metagame, both inside and outside of the Smogon community.



* A seldom-seen but vocal group are the people who dislike the localization of the names of Pokémon, characters, and places, and would rather all international versions retain the Japanese names for everything. This, of course, doesn't sit well with the people who were introduced to Pokémon via names in their country's language or otherwise prefer their own country's localization over the original Japanese versions, and as what's essentially a SubbingVsDubbing debate, discussions get dicey really quickly.



* Sometimes debates can exist between fans of two different Pokémon species for whatever reason:
** The Arceus vs. Mew debate. Some fans argue that, in canon, Mew is the original ancestor of all Pokémon (as it contains the DNA of all Pokémon), while other fans put Arceus at the top of the pinnacle as the absolute progenitor of all Pokémon (as its mythos describes it creating the universe itself). Some go the opposite way and say that Arceus created Mew first, and then used her/it to create every other Pokémon, or all other Pokémon developed from Mew via Darwinian evolution; another compromise, though there are some who disagree with this too, of course.
** There's also a FandomRivalry between fans of Flygon (an antlion [[OurDragonsAreDifferent that is somehow a dragon]]) and Garchomp (a land shark... [[OurDragonsAreDifferent that is also somehow a dragon]].) Flygon fans viciously and relentlessly bash Garchomp for being overrated, overpowered, outclassing Flygon in every way, having an ugly and overcomplicated design, and getting "special treatment" from Creator/GameFreak while Flygon's been left in the dust ''since the generation of its debut'', ''especially'' after Garchomp got a [[SuperMode Mega Evolution]] and Flygon didn't[[labelnote:note]]Gamefreak's actually pretty much MisBlamed on that last bit; they genuinely tried to come up with Mega Evolutions for ''both'' Pokémon, and while they succeeded with Garchomp, even after several attempts during the development of ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' and ''[[VideoGame/PokemonRubyAndSapphire Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire]]'' they couldn't get a design for Mega Flygon down they felt was good enough[[/labelnote]]. Garchomp fans just want Flygon fans to stop complaining and leave them and their landshark be, are just as prone to playing the "overrated" card as their opposition, and sometimes claim ''they'' and their Pokémon of choice are the ''real'' underdogs fandom-wise (the last two being fueled by the fact people who prefer Flygon actually seem to outnumber them by a good margin).
** The ''exact'' same situation exists between fans of Scyther and Scizor as Flygon and Garchomp for the ''exact'' same reasons. The irony? Scizor is Scyther's ''[[EvolutionPowerup evolution.]]''
* With every new generation comes claims from some long-time "fans" that the new Pokémon are "lame" and "unoriginal", [[NostalgiaFilter and that the 'mons before them are far superior]]. Normally, the "fans" who complain when a new generation comes out are the ones who complained when the previous generation came out, and all complaints about said previous gen are instantly forgotten. [[note]]This can be called the "Zelda Cycle", which is also very prominent in that series' fanbase.[[/note]]
* There is also a divide between Pokémon designs in general. Many players will only use Pokémon that they consider to have a close resemblance to actual animals or fantasy creatures whilst denouncing all others as either ugly, filler, or both. Then there are the people who consider the animal-esque Pokémon boring and overused, and instead use Pokémon with more surreal or humorous designs. And finally, there are the people who appreciate all (or almost all) Pokémon designs, use both animal-esque and surreal Pokémon, and consider the design divide ridiculous and childish.
* Which types should get Eeveelutions? Should ''every'' type get an Eeveelution or not? There's also the issue of portraying them as male-biased (which respects their gender ratio) or female-only or -biased. The latter irks followers of the former, particularly since followers of the latter seem obsessed with doing it to them specifically, while considering males of other Pokémon (even ones that ''are'' female-biased!) to be fair game.



* There is a growing divide within the fanbase ever since Gen V and the perceived direction of the franchise, with several things being a point of contention. Major changes in creative direction were made twice -- first in Gen V, then in Gen VI, the latter lasting through Gen VII -- and both times evoked mixed reactions in the fanbase, with different demographics.
** Generation V was the first generation to see significant change for the ''Pokémon'' franchise, mostly with a focus on deeper lore and more developed characters and stories, as well as a completely new, self-contained regional Pokédex with no older species. However, the games were met with glowing praise by some fans and apathy from others, resulting in lower sales than Gen IV; many of the changes and innovations Gen V introduced fell by the wayside in the subsequent (and differently polarizing) 3DS entries. Some fans (especially overzealous supporters of the generation) believe Gen V to be [[SacredCow perfect]] and point to "[[FirstInstallmentWins genwunners]]" as the main or sole reason why its innovations fell by the wayside. Others believe that the games' novelty was undermined by some of their creative decisions being out of touch with the fanbase at large -- such as with the extremely polarizing Unova Pokédex of ''VideoGame/PokemonBlackAndWhite'' -- and that Game Freak misattributed the blame to fans not liking Gen V in general, resulting in future games distancing themselves from Gen V as a whole. Others still believe Gen V [[http://twinfinite.net/2017/12/best-pokemon-generations-ranked/1/ to not have been as innovative or groundbreaking at many people claimed]], and in fact that its weak attempts at being "different" were already signs of ''Pokémon'' being desperate for new ideas and continuing along its path of being a FranchiseZombie -- and that, in fact, the games tried ''so'' hard to be different that they ended up alienating fans of the classic formula and Pokémon species.
** Generations VI and VII marked a general shift towards streamlined, casualized and linear main plots, gimmicks such as Mega Evolution and Z-Moves, larger regional Pokédexes that rely heavily on past generations (especially [[VideoGame/PokemonRedAndBlue Gen I]]), and more user-friendly competitive breeding and training in favor of fewer postgame features. Some fans highly enjoyed these changes, as shown by the greater sales and mainstream attention of games from ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' onwards; the increased focus on classic Pokémon helped [[WinBackTheCrowd win back]] many fans who were alienated by the Unova games, and many fans highly appreciated how Game Freak finally acknowledged and helped players deal with GuideDangIt competitive mechanics like [=EV's=] and [=IV's=]. Other fans did not enjoy this new direction for the franchise, mostly for making the games less engaging for fans invested in single-player campaigns, sidequests/exploration, and postgame facilities. This divide wasn't at all helped by the many design and technical flubs in the Gen VI and VII games, such as highly inefficient programming (resulting in framerate drops) and oversights in Pokémon movesets and mechanics. Overall, fans in the latter category accused the games of transitioning from self-contained creative endeavors to an unpolished, MerchandiseDriven arm meant to advertise the rest of the franchise and establish Pokémon as marketing icons, much like [[Anime/{{Pokemon}} the anime]].[[note]]Coincidentally, the anime saw an overall bump in quality at that time, but suffered from many of the same complaints, leading to accusations that effort was "divided more evenly" between the anime and games than before.[[/note]]

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* There is a growing divide within the fanbase ever since Gen V and the perceived direction of the franchise, with several things being a point of contention. Major changes in creative direction were made twice -- first in Gen V, then in Gen VI, the latter lasting through Gen VII -- and both times evoked mixed reactions in the fanbase, with different demographics.
** Generation V was the first generation to see significant change for the
The overlap between ''Pokémon'' franchise, mostly with a focus on deeper lore and more developed characters and stories, as well as a completely new, self-contained regional Pokédex with no older species. However, the games were met with glowing praise by some fans and apathy from others, resulting [[UsefulNotes/FurryFandom furries]] creates a rather notorious divide. The existence of Pokémon anthros, known as Pokémorphs[[labelnote:note]]Though the term's also been applied to things as varied as [[VoluntaryShapeshifting people who can turn into Pokémon]] a la ''Literature/{{Animorphs}}'', to fully human [[MoeAnthropomorphism gijinkas]] who just have clothes, hair and eyes/eye colors resembling the Pokémon species they're based on and everything in lower sales than Gen IV; many between[[/labelnote]], just makes both halves of the changes and innovations Gen V introduced fell by debate worse, to the wayside in the subsequent (and differently polarizing) 3DS entries. Some fans (especially overzealous supporters point on one end of the generation) believe Gen V to be [[SacredCow perfect]] and point to "[[FirstInstallmentWins genwunners]]" as divide [[FanFic/{{Morphic}} one of the main or sole reason why its innovations fell by the wayside. Others believe that the games' novelty was undermined by some most famous Pokémon fanfics]] is an intentional {{Deconstruction}} of their creative decisions being out of touch with Pokemorph fics.
* In a different direction,
the fanbase at large -- such as with the extremely polarizing Unova Pokédex of ''VideoGame/PokemonBlackAndWhite'' -- and that Game Freak misattributed the blame to fans not liking Gen V in general, resulting in future games distancing themselves from Gen V as a whole. Others still believe Gen V [[http://twinfinite.net/2017/12/best-pokemon-generations-ranked/1/ to not have been as innovative or groundbreaking at many people claimed]], and in fact that its weak attempts at being "different" were already signs of for ''Pokémon'' being desperate for new ideas and continuing along its path of being a FranchiseZombie -- and that, in fact, the games tried ''so'' hard to be different that they ended up alienating fans had already been broken right from Day 1. Fans of the classic formula and Pokémon species.
** Generations VI and VII marked a general shift towards streamlined, casualized and linear main plots, gimmicks such as Mega Evolution and Z-Moves, larger regional Pokédexes that rely heavily on past generations (especially [[VideoGame/PokemonRedAndBlue Gen I]]), and more user-friendly competitive breeding and training in favor of fewer postgame features. Some fans highly enjoyed these changes, as shown by the greater sales and mainstream attention of games from ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' onwards; the increased focus on classic Pokémon helped [[WinBackTheCrowd win back]] many fans who were alienated by the Unova
video games, and many fans highly appreciated how Game Freak finally acknowledged and helped players deal with GuideDangIt competitive mechanics like [=EV's=] and [=IV's=]. Other fans did not enjoy this new direction for the franchise, mostly for making the games less engaging for fans invested in single-player campaigns, sidequests/exploration, and postgame facilities. This divide wasn't at all helped by the many design and technical flubs in the Gen VI and VII games, such as highly inefficient programming (resulting in framerate drops) and oversights in Pokémon movesets and mechanics. Overall, fans in the latter category accused the games of transitioning from self-contained creative endeavors to an unpolished, MerchandiseDriven arm meant to advertise the rest of the franchise and establish Pokémon as marketing icons, much like [[Anime/{{Pokemon}} the anime]].[[note]]Coincidentally, the anime saw an overall bump in quality at that time, but suffered from many anime]], and of the same complaints, leading to accusations that effort was "divided more evenly" [[TabletopGame/{{Pokemon}} Trading Card Game]] are largely separate. Chances are if someone says they're a fan of Pokémon, they're only a fan of one of the above and range between a passing interest to vile disgust at the anime and games than before.[[/note]]other two.




to:

** The use of legendaries in-game is also something of a divider. They're already relegated to the Uber tier in competitive battling, and banned in battle frontiers/subways/towers/whatever, but players still disagree over whether it's okay to use legendaries during the storyline to make it easier (or precisely ''because'' they have undergone such UniquenessDecay that using them should ultimately be inconsequential) or if it just makes it way too easy and being able to use Legendaries so early on "breaks the spirit" of the game. Then of course there's player vs player wireless play outside the Smogon rules, where some will use them and some won't.
* The overall structure of the main series has been slowly but surely causing more and more rifts in the playerbase, with there being numerous points of contention. Many players want to see ''some'' sort of noticeably distinct change to the plot mechanism and/or battle mechanics, seeing the games as extremely similar and derivative, and those who don't want to fix what isn't broken, as the games in spite of this are of generally good and consistent quality. Major changes in creative direction were made twice -- first in Gen V, then in Gen VI, the latter lasting through Gen VII -- and both times evoked mixed reactions in the fanbase, with different demographics.
** Generation V was the first generation to see significant change for the ''Pokémon'' franchise, mostly with a focus on deeper lore and more developed characters and stories, as well as a completely new, self-contained regional Pokédex with no older species. However, the games were met with glowing praise by some fans and apathy from others, resulting in lower sales than Gen IV; many of the changes and innovations Gen V introduced fell by the wayside in the subsequent (and differently polarizing) 3DS entries. Some fans (especially overzealous supporters of the generation) believe Gen V to be [[SacredCow perfect]] and point to "[[FirstInstallmentWins genwunners]]" as the main or sole reason why its innovations fell by the wayside. Others believe that the games' novelty was undermined by some of their creative decisions being out of touch with the fanbase at large -- such as with the extremely polarizing Unova Pokédex of ''VideoGame/PokemonBlackAndWhite'' -- and that Game Freak misattributed the blame to fans not liking Gen V in general, resulting in future games distancing themselves from Gen V as a whole. Others still believe Gen V [[http://twinfinite.net/2017/12/best-pokemon-generations-ranked/1/ to not have been as innovative or groundbreaking at many people claimed]], and in fact that its weak attempts at being "different" were already signs of ''Pokémon'' being desperate for new ideas and continuing along its path of being a FranchiseZombie -- and that, in fact, the games tried ''so'' hard to be different that they ended up alienating fans of the classic formula and Pokémon species.
** Generations VI and VII marked a general shift towards streamlined, casualized and linear main plots, gimmicks such as Mega Evolution and Z-Moves, larger regional Pokédexes that rely heavily on past generations (especially [[VideoGame/PokemonRedAndBlue Gen I]]), and more user-friendly competitive breeding and training in favor of fewer postgame features. Some fans highly enjoyed these changes, as shown by the greater sales and mainstream attention of games from ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' onwards; the increased focus on classic Pokémon helped [[WinBackTheCrowd win back]] many fans who were alienated by the Unova games, and many fans highly appreciated how Game Freak finally acknowledged and helped players deal with GuideDangIt competitive mechanics like [=EV's=] and [=IV's=]. Other fans did not enjoy this new direction for the franchise, mostly for making the games less engaging for fans invested in single-player campaigns, sidequests/exploration, and postgame facilities. This divide wasn't at all helped by the many design and technical flubs in the Gen VI and VII games, such as highly inefficient programming (resulting in framerate drops) and oversights in Pokémon movesets and mechanics. Overall, fans in the latter category accused the games of transitioning from self-contained creative endeavors to an unpolished, MerchandiseDriven arm meant to advertise the rest of the franchise and establish Pokémon as marketing icons, much like [[Anime/{{Pokemon}} the anime]].[[note]]Coincidentally, the anime saw an overall bump in quality at that time, but suffered from many of the same complaints, leading to accusations that effort was "divided more evenly" between the anime and games than before.[[/note]]
** The intense extremes between the above have led fans to debate whether the main series should go in a more story-driven direction like Generations V and VII, or stick to an ExcusePlot like the older games and Generation VI, and make the game more about [[GottaCatchEmAll catching 'em all]] and exploration.



!!General
* A common debate is whether these games or ''Omega Ruby'' and ''Alpha Sapphire'' are the superior Gen VI games. Supporters of ''X'' and ''Y'' tend to enjoy the hugely expanded Pokédex and the return of Gen I favorites, Trainer customization, the Friend Safari and the Kalos region itself. Supporters of ''ORAS'' cite the wider variety of features, more balanced difficulty, greater level of polish, more extensive postgame, wider variety of obtainable starters and legendaries, and the Delta Episode. Of note is the fact that both sets of games [[PanderingToTheBase attempt to pander to nostalgic fans]], albeit in different ways, and also have deeper and more involved plots than previous ''Pokémon'' games.



* ''Pokémon X and Y'' also introduced the all new Fairy-type, [[WordOfGod explicitly]] to [[ObviousRulePatch balance]] the increasingly overpowered Dragon-type. Opinions of this type vary wildly:
** There are the purists, who hate that a new type is being added at all, as it shatters years of continuity (for the most part, disliking the type for this reason is understandable, considering how complex the franchise is).
** There are people who like the Fairy-type and consider it a much-needed addition to the franchise.
** There are people who would be fine with a new type but think the Fairy-type sounds stupid.
** There are people who do not like how Fairy-type focuses mainly on small, cute and mostly feminine Pokémon and completely ignores TheFairFolk (though some Pokédex entries do mention that some are mischievous).
** There are people who are fine with the Fairy-type but don't think it should be effective against Dragon-types (mainly hardcore Dragon-type fans who are upset that their favorite type is now only weaker).
** And, finally, there are those who feel the type has utterly ruined others, lamenting the fact that now Ice-type Pokémon are rendered almost useless, since that type possess mostly slow Pokémon and harbor no less than 4 weaknesses against very common types, including the Rock-type (including the Stealth Rock move mentioned above), only resist its own type, and was mostly use to counter Dragon-type Pokémon. Now that the Fairy-type is here and can do the job far better, there is very little reason to use Ice-type Pokémon in X/Y. It also greatly weakened the already weak Dark-type, giving it three weaknesses and two strengths, and also weakened the Bug-type, another weak type (the already-weak Grass-type was also not improved in Generation 6). It also gave the Fire-type another resistance, and since this type is strong against Ice, Bug and Grass, those types are now even weaker. And, after going through such lengths to make Dragon-types weaker, Mega Garchomp was introduced[[note]]Ironically, Mega Garchomp is considered a PowerUpLetDown in practice by the competitive community, for the following reasons: it loses 10 points in its Speed stat, taking away its niche to outspeed the average Pokémon and hit hard, making its 40 Attack Stat boost moot, it loses its ability Rough Skin, meaning it loses chip damage done to physical attackers in exchange for Sand Force, which is far more situational and only activates in a sandstorm, and the most important reason: it sacrifices the Mega Evolution slot (and a hold-able item) for a more useful Mega Evolution [[/note]].



* The addition of the rollerblades; some find them to be RollerbladeGood and a nice way to get around quickly while others consider it a ScrappyMechanic, especially since it's impossible to remove them, unlike a bike.
* A common debate is whether these games or ''Omega Ruby'' and ''Alpha Sapphire'' are the superior Gen VI games. Supporters of ''X'' and ''Y'' tend to enjoy the hugely expanded Pokédex and the return of Gen I favorites, Trainer customization, the Friend Safari and the Kalos region itself. Supporters of ''ORAS'' cite the wider variety of features, more balanced difficulty, greater level of polish, more extensive postgame, wider variety of obtainable starters and legendaries, and the Delta Episode. Of note is the fact that both sets of games [[PanderingToTheBase attempt to pander to nostalgic fans]], albeit in different ways, and also have deeper and more involved plots than previous ''Pokémon'' games.

to:

* The addition of the rollerblades; some find them to be RollerbladeGood and a nice way to get around quickly quickly, while others consider it a ScrappyMechanic, especially ScrappyMechanic since it's impossible to remove them, them unlike a bike.
* A common debate is whether these games or ''Omega Ruby'' and ''Alpha Sapphire'' are the superior Gen VI games. Supporters of ''X'' and ''Y'' tend to enjoy the hugely expanded Pokédex and the return of Gen I favorites, Trainer customization, the Friend Safari and the Kalos region itself. Supporters of ''ORAS'' cite the wider variety of features, more balanced difficulty, greater level of polish, more extensive postgame, wider variety of obtainable starters and legendaries, and the Delta Episode. Of note is the fact that both sets of games [[PanderingToTheBase attempt to pander to nostalgic fans]], albeit in different ways, and also have deeper and more involved plots than previous ''Pokémon'' games.



* A common debate is whether these games or ''X'' and ''Y'' are the superior Gen VI games. Supporters of ''X'' and ''Y'' tend to enjoy the hugely expanded Pokédex and the return of Gen I favorites, Trainer customization, the Friend Safari and the Kalos region itself. Supporters of ''ORAS'' cite the wider variety of features, more balanced difficulty, greater level of polish, more extensive postgame, wider variety of obtainable starters and legendaries, and the Delta Episode. Of note is the fact that both sets of games [[PanderingToTheBase attempt to pander to nostalgic fans]], albeit in different ways, and also have deeper and more involved plots than previous ''Pokémon'' games.



''Pokémon Sword and Shield'' proved themselves to be the most controversial titles in the entire franchise, thanks to a number of design choices that not only [[OldGuardVersusNewBlood greatly shifted the priorities of the games]], but [[FranchiseOriginalSin brought several long held problems with the series to a head]]. Really the only thing Pokémon fans can agree on is that these games completely shattered the fandom.

to:

''Pokémon Sword and Shield'' proved themselves to be the most controversial titles in the entire franchise, thanks to a number of design choices that not only [[OldGuardVersusNewBlood greatly shifted the priorities of the games]], but [[FranchiseOriginalSin brought several long held problems with the series to a head]]. Really Nearly every facet of the game starts some kind of debate, and just about the only thing Pokémon fans can agree on is that these games completely shattered the fandom.


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* Dynamax and Gigantamax. Reception to them was already cold from the start thanks to being partially to blame for the Dex exclusions as well as being seen as an uninspired combination of Mega Evolutions and Z-Moves, neither of which returned in these games, resulting in the mechanic being seen as a big-time ReplacementScrappy for those mechanics by many people. On the one hand, many enjoy the simplicity of the mechanic and how much the additional effects of Max Moves add to the battle dynamics (especially in doubles), while rectifying issues that both Megas (being usable by only 42 Pokémon) and Z-Moves (were one time use) had (both mechanics also required giving up the Pokémon's held item, with one wild exception) and being set as a more fitting and time appropriate spectacle in the game's story. On the other hand, others see Dynamax as unoriginal and boring, as well as horridly unbalanced in practice (especially in singles), with people disliking the numerous benefits Dynamax Pokémon gain for what is seen as little to lose (the big one being their ability to set up a number of beneficial field effects and stat boosts ''and'' deal hefty damage to opponents at the same time).
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
brought most of the entries across the franchise here

Added DiffLines:

Being one of the biggest franchises with decades worth of content and games, it's not surprising that some aspects of the franchise have proven divisive.
----

* ''BrokenBase/PokemonTheSeries''
* ''BrokenBase/PokemonGO''

[[foldercontrol]]

!Main Series


[[folder:General]]

* The fanbase is hugely divided over which generation is best, and with every new addition (or lack thereof) to the series, many people cry the entire franchise (or just a generation) ruined.
* Even playing the games divides the fans. Either [[StopHavingFunGuys you play competitively and are "taking the game too seriously"]], or [[{{Scrub}} you play for fun and "can't understand the subtle mathematics of the game"]].
* Fans are also divided over whether the main series should go in a more story-driven direction like [[VideoGame/PokemonBlackAndWhite Generation]] [[VideoGame/PokemonBlack2AndWhite2 V]] and [[VideoGame/PokemonSunAndMoon Generation VII]], or stick to an [[ExcusePlot excuse plot]] like the older games and [[VideoGame/PokemonXAndY Generation VI]], and make the game more about [[GottaCatchEmAll catching 'em all]] and exploration. There's also a divide between those who care more about what goes on during the main story campaign to those who care more about competitive battling [[note]]You usually only have access to the tools needed to create competitive monsters only after completing the main story, which can be a huge slog for those who only pick up the game for the competitive battling aspect.[[/note]]
* Are version-exclusive contents totally fair or blatantly one-sided? Groudon's and Yveltal's severe disadvantage against Kyogre and Xerneas respectively, the version-exclusive Mega Evolutions (''especially'' [[WolverinePublicity Mega Charizard]] [[PanderingToTheBase X]]), and White 2 players only getting [[ItsEasySoItSucks Easy]] [[BraggingRightsReward Mode]] are some of the examples. While such content can be traded between games, one really has to wonder if the trade-off is really fair to begin with if one version is clearly inferior to the other.
* There is a notable BrokenBase as to the Pokémon's cries, due to how they differ across incarnations. Fans argue over whether the synthesized animal noises of the games, the PokemonSpeak of the [[Anime/{{Pokemon}} anime]] and numerous spinoffs, or the voiced animal noises of ''Anime/PokemonOrigins'' and the ''[=B2W2=]'' animated trailer are the best and should be used in media. While PokemonSpeak was once more widely criticized due to its heavy association with the anime, it became more accepted as the norm as it was used in more media (most notably the live-action ''Film/PokemonDetectivePikachu''), to the point that some reviewers such as [[WebVideo/{{Jimquisition}} Jim Sterling]] criticized its absence in the games in favor of the digitized cries they always used.
* For your own sake, it's best you don't get into a debate regarding whether or not "Pokémon" and the species' names should be capitalized when referring to the creatures. For example, is it proper to say "My strongest Pokémon is a Pikachu", "My strongest pokémon is a pikachu", or something in-between? It's a very hot-button issue in the fanfic community.[[note]]To elaborate, those opposed to capitalization argue that since you don't capitalize words like "animal", "cat", "dog", or similar, you shouldn't capitalize the word "pokémon" or any of the species names. The people in favor of capitalization point out that the words are capitalized in canon, so it would make sense to capitalize them in fanfiction. Most writers don't care either way, but some are very adamant about how they think it should work.[[/note]]
* The PronounTrouble that occurs when referring to certain Pokémon. Is it appropriate to use "[[ItIsDehumanizing It]]", or go with gender-indicating pronouns? This is prominent in regards to Pokémon that are {{One Gender Race}}s, especially since there's more then one individual.
* A common argument among the fandom is whether dragon-like Pokémon that aren't Dragon-type, such as (non-Mega X) Charizard, Gyarados, Aerodactyl, Thundurus-Therian and (non-Mega) Sceptile, count as dragons or not, and whether they were intended to be dragons in the first place. [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sK6ycwaSjZ8 This video]] has more on the issue, and concludes that the lack of Dragon typing was simply in order to prevent Charizard from being overpowered (similar arguments can apply to Gyarados and Sceptile), and [[https://drm.pokemontcg.com/en-us/ the TCG website]] confirms that such Pokémon are "inspired by" dragons of various kinds. Some people look to the franchise's SpiritualAntithesis ''VideoGame/MonsterHunter'' for the answer: while most monsters in that series are dragons,[[note]]most of which are referred to as "wyverns" in the English localization,[[/note]] there is also a ''Pokémon''-like "Dragon" elemental typing that only applies to a subset of powerful monsters (some of which aren't traditionally draconic), bringing up the possibility of "Dragon" as an elemental classification rather than an animal descriptor. The issue isn't limited to dragonlike Pokémon, as there are other species with appearances, habits and movepools that defy their typing, such as the fairylike Celebi not being Fairy-type, Midnight Form Lycanroc looking and acting like a textbook Dark-type but being pure Rock, the antlion-based Trapinch line not being Bug-type despite being in the Bug egg group, and quite a few aquatic Pokémon (such as Lugia, Stunfisk and Dragalge) not being Water-type.
* Any time a mechanic or content featured in the tail-end game(s) of a generation (such as Move Tutors that teach a wider variety of moves or a greater/more readily-accessible amount of Mega Evolutions) is removed from the first two games of the next one, often only to be added back in when that gen's tail-end games are released. Some defend this practice as Game Freak has to convince people to buy the next games somehow, and it gives them the opportunity to improve on the first two. Others find it to be an egregious case of planned obsolesence (why bother buying the first two games when there'll always be an UpdatedRerelease or [[{{Sequel}} rough]] [[VideoGameRemake equivalent]] that'll have more things in it?), and point out that taking something out of a game only to add it back into a new game later on does not an improvement make.
* There is a growing divide within the fanbase ever since Gen V and the perceived direction of the franchise, with several things being a point of contention. Major changes in creative direction were made twice -- first in Gen V, then in Gen VI, the latter lasting through Gen VII -- and both times evoked mixed reactions in the fanbase, with different demographics.
** Generation V was the first generation to see significant change for the ''Pokémon'' franchise, mostly with a focus on deeper lore and more developed characters and stories, as well as a completely new, self-contained regional Pokédex with no older species. However, the games were met with glowing praise by some fans and apathy from others, resulting in lower sales than Gen IV; many of the changes and innovations Gen V introduced fell by the wayside in the subsequent (and differently polarizing) 3DS entries. Some fans (especially overzealous supporters of the generation) believe Gen V to be [[SacredCow perfect]] and point to "[[FirstInstallmentWins genwunners]]" as the main or sole reason why its innovations fell by the wayside. Others believe that the games' novelty was undermined by some of their creative decisions being out of touch with the fanbase at large -- such as with the extremely polarizing Unova Pokédex of ''VideoGame/PokemonBlackAndWhite'' -- and that Game Freak misattributed the blame to fans not liking Gen V in general, resulting in future games distancing themselves from Gen V as a whole. Others still believe Gen V [[http://twinfinite.net/2017/12/best-pokemon-generations-ranked/1/ to not have been as innovative or groundbreaking at many people claimed]], and in fact that its weak attempts at being "different" were already signs of ''Pokémon'' being desperate for new ideas and continuing along its path of being a FranchiseZombie -- and that, in fact, the games tried ''so'' hard to be different that they ended up alienating fans of the classic formula and Pokémon species.
** Generations VI and VII marked a general shift towards streamlined, casualized and linear main plots, gimmicks such as Mega Evolution and Z-Moves, larger regional Pokédexes that rely heavily on past generations (especially [[VideoGame/PokemonRedAndBlue Gen I]]), and more user-friendly competitive breeding and training in favor of fewer postgame features. Some fans highly enjoyed these changes, as shown by the greater sales and mainstream attention of games from ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' onwards; the increased focus on classic Pokémon helped [[WinBackTheCrowd win back]] many fans who were alienated by the Unova games, and many fans highly appreciated how Game Freak finally acknowledged and helped players deal with GuideDangIt competitive mechanics like [=EV's=] and [=IV's=]. Other fans did not enjoy this new direction for the franchise, mostly for making the games less engaging for fans invested in single-player campaigns, sidequests/exploration, and postgame facilities. This divide wasn't at all helped by the many design and technical flubs in the Gen VI and VII games, such as highly inefficient programming (resulting in framerate drops) and oversights in Pokémon movesets and mechanics. Overall, fans in the latter category accused the games of transitioning from self-contained creative endeavors to an unpolished, MerchandiseDriven arm meant to advertise the rest of the franchise and establish Pokémon as marketing icons, much like [[Anime/{{Pokemon}} the anime]].[[note]]Coincidentally, the anime saw an overall bump in quality at that time, but suffered from many of the same complaints, leading to accusations that effort was "divided more evenly" between the anime and games than before.[[/note]]
* Datamining, [[ContentLeak the act of going through the game's code to suss out every secret and tidbit the game has on file]]. On one hand, people appreciate plumbing the depths of the game's coding because [[GuideDangit so many mechanics on how the game functions is largely unexplained by the game itself]][[note]]Without datamining, things such as Pokémon stats, movepools, egg groups, effort values and individual values would be completely unknown without tedious trial and error as they are intentionally kept secret by the developers to make the experience more "organic"[[/note]]. On the other hand, it also inadvertently reveals a great number of spoilers (story related or Pokémon related), who some people unscrupulously post everywhere upon revelation. It's nearly impossible to go into the newest generation of games completely blind unless you've actively avoided all social media or the internet in general (which is increasingly harder to do as time goes on). It also spoils when things such as a new mythical Pokémon is officially revealed by the company; [[ItWasHisSled the fanbase already found out about it months in advance]], thus the shock factor of the reveal that the company wanted is completely lost. A portion of the fanbase feel the need to put on a {{Kayfabe}} of sorts (pretending that the information isn't known) while a portion does not and treat the spoilers as common knowledge (without consideration for those who do not want to be spoiled). It also puts fan websites, wikis (including this one), gaming news sites and Website/YouTube channels in a bind where their creators and maintainers want to enjoy the product spoiler-free but need to post ''something'' about the revealed information. Gen VIII would rectify some of this by leaving its mythicals out of the game entirely at launch, only adding them in with an update after the reveal. (Though that said, when the first DLC was released lots of data for the ''second'' DLC was found to be in the files as well.)
* The growing number of [[OlympusMons Legendary/Mythical Pokémon]] over the years has caused some to believe that [[UniquenessDecay there are so many of them (some even filling the same "roles" as older ones), that the term "Legendary" has lost all meaning]]. A portion of fans tend to look the other way for one reason or another (be it the competitive viability of Legendaries like Heatran and the Tapu, or categorizing each gen's Legendaries into "pantheons").
** A related debate is the nature of Legendary species -- should they be SingleSpecimenSpecies (with multiple members existing being a bad idea that [[UniquenessDecay cheapens them]]), or should their reappearance in multiple games be a sign that more than one exists? Some split the difference by applying the former belief to "major" mascot Legendaries, and the latter to "minor" ones like Articuno.[[note]]''VideoGame/PokemonLetsGoPikachuAndLetsGoEevee'' supports this with multiple Legendary Birds being up for capture.[[/note]] Others staunchly stand by the former opinion, even in the face of official material and openly non-unique Legendaries like the Cosmog line. And when discussing the topic in relation to [[ArtificialHuman Mewtwo]] (and [[Anime/PokemonGenesectAndTheLegendAwakened a very controversial movie's stance]]), ''tread carefully''.

[[/folder]]



[[folder:Gen III]]

!!''RSE''
* The games were, and still are, divisive (as expected of any Pokémon region, to be fair). There are copious arguments about whether the Hoenn games are good, or even ''the best ever'' or ''worst ever''. Pros include the ''gorgeous'' diversity of the region. It's packed with so many different kinds of places to explore, such as a shipwreck, meteor falls, volcanoes, etc. The storyline is also widely praised, as well as the introduction of Battle Frontier. The most common complaints are easy to sum up: Surf and trumpets. Hoenn has the most abundant and expansive bodies of water of all the regions, causing people to complain about how you need the HM move Surf at your disposal so often and as soon as you can. Hoenn defenders have noted that this is a case of RealityIsUnrealistic, although the fact that the Pokémon universe is hardly reality also bears consideration. The trumpets just refer to the trumpet-heavy soundtrack.

!!''FRLG''
* Unlike with ''[=HeartGold=]'' and ''[=SoulSilver=]'', which are near-universally considered an upgrade from ''Gold'' and ''Silver'', debates rage on about whether ''[=FireRed=]'' and ''[=LeafGreen=]'' are {{Polished Port}}s of ''Red'' and ''Blue'' and better than the originals, or not. From the group that was not satisfied with the remakes, there is another division on the reason of their discontent - namely, whether the games [[ItsTheSameNowItSucks stick too much to the originals]] (preventing breeding or obtaining any Pokémon beyond the first 151 until the post-game, among other absent features) to be appealing, or [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks whether the game's additions (such as the tutorials, or the required Sevii Islands post-game) bring the games down]].

[[/folder]]


[[folder:Gen IV]]

!!''[=DPPt=]''
* Stealth Rock. Competitive players love it for keeping borderline {{Game Breaker}}s in check and having universal application, while casuals hate it because [[ComplacentGamingSyndrome it's freaking everywhere]] and makes Mons like [[BreakoutCharacter Charizard]] bad, if not worse. Then there are people who like Stealth Rock because it wards off Pokemon that they dislike ''such as'' [[BaseBreakingCharacter/{{Pokemon}} Charizard]].

!!''HGSS''
* There's a huge drift in the fandom on whether Lyra is a SuspiciouslySimilarSubstitute or she simply is Kris redesigned.
* Voltorb Flip [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks replacing the slots, and more importantly, removing the ability to buy coins]]. What's even more infuriating is that the Game Corner was the same as usual in the Japanese version. The Voltorb Flip was essentially a Pokémon-themed Minesweeper with a very low reward rate that gave you coins at a slow trickle, making that Porygon (9999 Coins!) and those super-expensive [=TM=]s (+10,000 Coins!!) seem much, much more farther away. That being said, there ''are'' some people who like it, although most of them wish you could buy the coins as well.
* Sabrina's redesign. Either it is an unexpected but refreshing revamp of her or it takes away the [[EvilIsCool menacing charm]] given by her original design and the [[AdaptationalVillainy outright]] [[Anime/{{Pokemon}} malicious]] [[Manga/PokemonAdventures counterparts]] associated with them.
[[/folder]]


[[folder:Gen V]]

!!''BW''
* There have been serious debates over the designs of the [=PCs=], whether the starters are awesome or not, and the animations of the sprites. Some people hate the idea of triple battles.
* Also, some don't like the fact that there are no Pokémon from the older generations in the Regional Dex, whereas some think that it is a refreshing idea. Not helping matters is the fact that many fans feel that the Gen V newcomers contain some of the best[[note]]almost all the Legendary Pokémon have been well-received, Serperior and Samurott are fairly popular as starters (especially after Serperior's Hidden Ability was released in ''ORAS''), and many of the more powerful fully-evolved Pokémon such as Haxorus and Bisharp are praised for their designs, movepools, and typings[[/note]] ''and'' worst[[note]]Emboar is the third Fire/Fighting starter in a row, the elemental monkeys are seen as a waste of Dex space, and the Trubbish, Klink, and Vanillite lines have been infamously criticized[[/note]] concepts in the series.
* This extends to the postgame, where only a limited number of older Pokémon can be caught, and [[https://www.serebii.net/blackwhite/unobtainable.shtml a huge number of fan-favorites]] (including ''[[SeriesMascot Pikachu]]'') can't be found in the game. Does it matter in the first place, given that they only appear once the story is complete? Was it a consequence of trying to [[SequelDisplacement reinforce the newcomers as a new "baseline" for the franchise]], or does it just come across as neglectful towards the franchise's past?
* On the competitive side of things, there has been a backlash over the fact that when battling via Wi-Fi or console link, the opponent's entire team (and their nicknames) are all revealed, without an option to turn this feature off (in the manner of the ''VideoGame/PokemonStadium'' series). Some see it as a welcome addition to competitive tactics, and others believe that it will ruin the metagame forever. Also serves as a premature nerf to Zoroark, due to its unique ability becoming less effective.
* Seasons. They're not real-time-based: Spring is in January, May, and September, summer is February, June, and October, fall is March, July, and November, and winter is in April, August, and December. You can go to places in some seasons that you can't reach in others. Some fans love the idea, but a lot of people aren't wild about seeing snow in August and the fact that you sometimes have to wait ''months'' to get certain places. Messing around with the internal clock helps speed this up, but it can still be annoying.

!!''[=B2W2=]''
* Opinions on ''[=B2W2=]'' are all over the place, albeit not as vocally as their predecessors and the 3DS entries due to their lower profile. Are they among the best games in the series, if not ''the'' best? Do they have a lot of potential that is nonetheless [[BonusFeatureFailure squandered]] due to bizarre, arbitrary design and restrictions[[note]]most infamously with Challenge Mode and the Key System in general[[/note]] and the Nintendo WFC shutdown? Were they not that outstanding in the first place, with the thinner plot and mess of convoluted bonus features being evidence that the series was running dry? While it's easy to find large groups of fans that share one of the above opinions, there's by no means universal agreement on any of them.
* The revelation that the Shadow Triad are not the Striaton Trio. Some fans still insist that they are, despite the flashback that shows them all together. Some fans seem to believe that [[UnreliableExpositor the Striaton Trio were just lying]].
* The voice acting in the [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkTsd0iU97s&feature=player_embedded#! English version of the animated trailer]] has caused this. While some fans like the English dub just fine, others either found the dub too over dramatic or claim the dub gave characters awful voices and awful dialogue even to characters who got good voices. Others just wanted the male protagonist's voice actor to stay as [[Franchise/KingdomHearts Sora]].
* Iris, the gym leader in the first ''White'' game/Drayden's apprentice in ''Black'' is now the games' new champion, dressing like a fancy Franchise/DisneyPrincess and giving off a roar in her sprite animation before she battles you. There's a legion of fans who love this, while others argue that Iris is too bratty to actually deserve the title, claiming Alder, Marshal or even Drayden himself more fitting for the title. Her theme is either refreshingly upbeat compared to the intense themes of champions past or unfitting MagicalGirl anime music that serves as the worst Champion theme ever.
* For all the old fan-favorite Pokémon brought back for the New Unova Pokédex (including some previously unobtainable ones such as the Eeveelutions), there's a glaring omission - [[SeriesMascot the Pikachu line]]. As Pikachu itself is a BaseBreakingCharacter, some fans don't really mind and think that it allows Pikachu to not [[SpotlightStealingSquad hog the spotlight]] for once, while others find Pikachu's exclusion to be awkward and arbitrary, especially since Pikachu and now Pichu still have cameos as NPC's and background objects.
* N's backstory being revealed has also caused this in part of FanDislikedExplanation. While some fans feel that N being [[ConvenientlyAnOrphan an orphan who was abandoned by his parents]] and [[RaisedByWolves raised by Pokémon until Ghetsis took him in]] suits N (and, in addition, plays into how easily N was manipulated into believing that Pokémon trainers were evil), some feel it to be anti-climatic and were disappointed that Ghetsis really hadn't stolen him from his parents, nor was he his real child.
* The selection of older postgame Legendary Pokémon brings up some "quality vs. quantity" debates; apart from Latios and Latias, none of them are particularly popular or iconic, so there's some debate on how good the selection is and whether it would have been preferable to have more iconic legendaries such as the version mascots and Mewtwo.
* Pokéstar Studios. It's either a waste of time like the Pokémon Musical that players desperately try to get through in the main storyline as quickly as possible (even if it means completely butchering the mandatory first film and looking like a complete joke) and never return again, or it's an addicting side feature that the player will have a blast making movies with for amusement.

[[/folder]]


[[folder:Gen VI]]

!!''XY''
* [[VideoGame3DLeap The transition from 2D sprites to 3D models.]] While there's no denying that many of the models are pretty and many think they blend in well with the stereoscopic 3D, [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks some think they aren't as cool as the Gen V animations were]]; many Fire-types have SpecialEffectsFailure with their body flames, and many flying Pokémon with wings are showing hovering in place in a very {{Narm}}y way ([[http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-xy/277.shtml Swellow]] is probably the best/worst example of this one) since they have to use the same models for Sky Battles. There's also the fact that ''Franchise/{{Pokemon}}'' was ''Creator/{{Nintendo}}'''s only major IP that didn't make the VideoGame3DLeap yet (even ''Franchise/{{Kirby}}'' games had started to mostly use 3D models), and many 2D sprite fans found it refreshing they stuck to them for so long. Others think it was about time they did it and were happy with the results.
* Mega Evolution. The fact that it is a temporary evolution, the fact that only select Pokémon get the form (and on top of that [[PanderingToTheBase Mewtwo and Charizard getting two apiece]]), the designs of the forms, and some forms getting new typings has led to many arguments over the matter. Which Megas are [[GameBreaker broken]], and which are [[PowerUpLetdown outclassed by their base forms]], is greatly debated. Then of course, there are those who simply hate the designs of most or all the Mega Evolutions, seeing them as over-designing [[NostalgiaFilter perfectly-fine older Pokémon]] to try to match the design styles used in the later generations.
* The music. Some think ''Pokémon X'' and ''Y''[='=]s soundtrack a solid entry in the series, while others find it painfully bland compared to that of other games. The end credits song "KISEKI", in particular, is seen as either heartwarming and beautiful or pretentious and unfitting, particularly as its lyrics aren't actually sung; many fans agree that the concept of a Nintendo song with lyrics was built upon better with "[[VideoGame/FireEmblemFates Lost in Thoughts All Alone]]", "[[VideoGame/SuperMarioOdyssey Jump Up, Super Star!]]" and "[[VideoGame/SuperSmashBrosUltimate Lifelight]]", all of which have sung lyrics and varying moods.
* The main plot. On the one hand, there are those who consider it a step back from ''VideoGame/PokemonBlackAndWhite'' for various reasons, including flat characterisation, less involved Gym Leaders, less detailed (and [[spoiler:apart from AZ,]] [[TrueArtIsAngsty less tragic]]) backstories, and a smaller post-game. On the other, there are those who felt the story in ''Black'' and ''White'' was melodramatic and overblown (and point out that the post-game of the original ''Black'' and ''White'' was also small - not as much as ''X'' and ''Y'' but not as large as [[VideoGame/PokemonBlack2AndWhite2 their own sequels]]), and see ''X'' and ''Y'' as a nice step back to the more conventional plots of the series.
* The [[ItsEasySoItSucks low difficulty]] of the single-player game when using EXP Share. Some people think it makes the story battles too boring, others think it is great because it allows players to use whatever Pokémon they like rather than sticking to the best ones. However, if one doesn't use the EXP Share, they'll quickly find it's nowhere near as easy.
* The addition of the rollerblades; some find them to be RollerbladeGood and a nice way to get around quickly while others consider it a ScrappyMechanic, especially since it's impossible to remove them, unlike a bike.
* A common debate is whether these games or ''Omega Ruby'' and ''Alpha Sapphire'' are the superior Gen VI games. Supporters of ''X'' and ''Y'' tend to enjoy the hugely expanded Pokédex and the return of Gen I favorites, Trainer customization, the Friend Safari and the Kalos region itself. Supporters of ''ORAS'' cite the wider variety of features, more balanced difficulty, greater level of polish, more extensive postgame, wider variety of obtainable starters and legendaries, and the Delta Episode. Of note is the fact that both sets of games [[PanderingToTheBase attempt to pander to nostalgic fans]], albeit in different ways, and also have deeper and more involved plots than previous ''Pokémon'' games.

!!''ORAS''
* The Delta Episode. There are those who think it's a fantastic addition to the game, with an engaging story, and are happy that it focuses on a tragic and interesting character like Zinnia. Then there are those who think it's incredibly tedious - (not to mention the constant back and forth travels between locations, just for someone to tell you something they could have easily told you over the phone) - and that it should have focused on a character that is less irritating and creepy. [[TakeAThirdOption And some fans]] like the story, but still hate all the backtracking involved.
* A common debate is whether these games or ''X'' and ''Y'' are the superior Gen VI games. Supporters of ''X'' and ''Y'' tend to enjoy the hugely expanded Pokédex and the return of Gen I favorites, Trainer customization, the Friend Safari and the Kalos region itself. Supporters of ''ORAS'' cite the wider variety of features, more balanced difficulty, greater level of polish, more extensive postgame, wider variety of obtainable starters and legendaries, and the Delta Episode. Of note is the fact that both sets of games [[PanderingToTheBase attempt to pander to nostalgic fans]], albeit in different ways, and also have deeper and more involved plots than previous ''Pokémon'' games.
* Similarly, fans are divided on whether ''Emerald'' or ''ORAS'' are the definitive Hoenn games, thanks to the latter games not reflecting most of the changes from ''RS'' in the former outside of a few {{Mythology Gag}}s. The merged storyline, ability to get all three mascot Legendaries, higher difficulty, rematchable Gym Leaders, and, of course, the Battle Frontier are cited in ''Emerald'''s favor, while the separate but expanded storylines, later-generation improvements, expanded Dex, improved Pokénav, Secret Bases and Contests, enormous selection of postgame starters and Legendaries and Soaring are seen as the better trade-off for ''ORAS'' fans.
* Overall, fans are divided on whether ''ORAS'' are among the best games in the series for their sheer amount of features and content and for [[AdaptationExpansion expanding on the originals]] while retaining some of the better-received features from ''X'' and ''Y'', or still fall short due to retaining some flaws from ''Ruby'' and ''Sapphire'' and not having the beloved Battle Frontier from ''Emerald'', resulting in a decent but not amazing postgame unlike those of ''[[VideoGame/PokemonGoldAndSilver HGSS]]'' and ''[[VideoGame/PokemonBlack2AndWhite2 B2W2]]''.
* After the two were merged ever since ''Black and White'', Poké Marts are separate from Pokémon Centers again, resulting in conflicting opinions on whether this was justified due to this being the case in the originals or not justified since merging the two was a quality-of-life change.

[[/folder]]


[[folder:Gen VII]]

!!''SM''
* Fans from the Chinese-speaking communities are divided into a few parts: Some are overjoyed that Nintendo finally released a game in their mother language, some welcome the Chinese release but worry about the translated names in-game, and some [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks burst into outrage over the translators changing the name of their beloved franchise]] and ruining their decade-long nostalgia. [[note]]Hong Kong, Taiwan, ''and'' Mainland China have their respective (and recognized) names for the franchise used for ''decades'', not to mention some distinct translations for some of the Mons (''at least'' the first 251 are different for HK and Taiwan). The new franchise name in Chinese is unified with that used by Mainland since 2010, which ''still'' took flak from some players even now.[[/note]] [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWSCYwGkCkY Nintendo's exclusive video for Chinese fandom]] has little effect settling the anger for the latter. For fans in Hong Kong, the decision only adds fuel to the fire as some fans views Nintendo's decision as a move to assimilate Cantonese, the main spoken language in Hong Kong. It is such a SeriousBusiness that it [[http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-36414978 sparked a protest.]]
* The Gym-less gameplay has had some levels of this thrown at it. Many people liked the formula being shaken up a bit and bringing a new idea to the table. Others cried that [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks they changed the formula]] and [[ItsShortSoItSucks it makes the game feel even shorter]]. ''Others'' don't think enough changed, arguing that the Island Trials were still too similar to gyms (both involve beating a strong opponent of a certain type specialty and their underlings), aside from a few elements such as the Totem calling an ally Pokémon.
* Z-Moves are either a new and exciting feature that could help raise the profile of weaker mons or a boring and lazy addition. Before Mega Evolutions were confirmed to be back, some were worried they would replace the mechanic. And when the games came out and were revealed to lack new Megas (as well as many old ones), many put the blame on Z-Moves and Alolan forms.
** Also in dispute is how Z-Moves balance the game. Defenders claim that they help make many, many weaker Pokemon competitively useful, even in higher tier play, and unlike Megas, are a single use item that can turn the tides in interesting ways. Others claim, however, that they make offensively-minded Pokemon, especially those already powerful, become absolute beasts that can smash down even the StoneWall Pokemon meant to counter them, making more defensive Pokemon like Chansey struggle to find a use at all, and Arceus help you if they get a stat boost beforehand. It doesn't help that Z-Moves can break through protection moves.
* Tying into EnjoyTheStorySkipTheGame, the games' main campaign, ditching the ExcusePlot of previous games (aside from Gen 5) in favor of a more serious and overarching storyline and dialogue reminiscent of other [[EasternRPG JRPGs]], which notably reverses the Gen 5/Gen 6 rivalry. Many fans love it due to giving the plot more significance and fleshing out the characters and story more, particularly against ''VideoGame/PokemonXAndY'' which were often criticized for lacking in these regards. On the other hand, other fans find it a case of TheyChangedItNowItSucks, as the ExcusePlot was a keystone of Pokémon games in the past and they feel the design of Pokémon games does not facilitate serious stories well. The implementation of said story is also a frequent point of debate, with Pokémon threads on Twitter, reddit, and elsewhere constantly going back and forth about the long stretches of dialogue at each plot point (some of which is arguably unnecessary), the subsequent decreased focus on competitive battling improvements and map exploration (particularly from those who PlayTheGameSkipTheStory), the major players of the story's conflict being {{Base Breaking Character}}s (the biggest example being Lillie), and the questionable pacing of the campaign itself (particularly dealing with the third island). And that doesn't even get into the replacement of Gyms with trials...

!!''USUM''
* While the gameplay is seen as a marked improvement over ''VideoGame/PokemonSunAndMoon'', the story is regarded as a downgrade from the originals to some players, with Necrozma's plotline awkwardly melded in with the Aether family plotline (causing character motivations and even personality to be altered substantially, and [[PlotHole not always in a way that makes 100% sense]]) and the Ultra Recon Squad receiving very little development. And that's when it's not [[ItsTheSameNowItSucks simply repeating the originals almost verbatim]] until Necrozma appears. However, there are players whom, despite the story majorly being almost similar to the originals, find the stories an improvement due to several other factors, such as Hau being a much more characterized rival here in comparison to the originals, certain characters like Colress receiving more of a role, and the addition of side quests. [[TakeAThirdOption And there are also those who liked the story of both the originals and the Ultra games regardless]].

!!''[=LGP&E=]''
* Do '''not''' go onto a forum and ask people whether these games (and by extension Meltan and Melmetal, which made their core series debut in these games) are part of Generation 7 or Generation 8. Those who say the former often assert the game is a spin-off, citing the drastic changes made to the gameplay, the heavy inspiration from and integration with ''VideoGame/PokemonGO'', and the fact that no new Pokémon made their playable debut in these games (barring the tenuous nature of Meltan and Melmetal). Those claiming the latter note how the game is still a mostly authentic remake of Gen 1 for a modern audience, it preceded the debut of ''VideoGame/PokemonSwordAndShield'' on the Switch, and it retains enough of the core gameplay (including more than a few references to other mainline titles) to be an acceptable part of the mainline continuity, and even putting that all aside, it was still made by Game Freak, in contrast to other spinoffs, hoping to appeal to both mainline players and new ones. The debate is frequently marred by the controversy surrounding the game's simple and entry level nature, with many who don't like the games calling it Gen 7, and those who do calling it Gen 8. It certainly doesn't help that Game Freak seemingly has no interest in answering this question, seeing as Meltan and Melmetal are listed under "Unknown Origins" in ''Pokémon HOME'' as opposed to either Alola or Galar. Though [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpYtKRuKUXQ this video]] made for the 25th anniversary lists the games among the seventh generation right after ''VideoGame/PokemonUltraSunAndUltraMoon'', making it lean more on the 7th generation side.
[[/folder]]


[[folder:Gen VIII]]

!!''SWSH''
''Pokémon Sword and Shield'' proved themselves to be the most controversial titles in the entire franchise, thanks to a number of design choices that not only [[OldGuardVersusNewBlood greatly shifted the priorities of the games]], but [[FranchiseOriginalSin brought several long held problems with the series to a head]]. Really the only thing Pokémon fans can agree on is that these games completely shattered the fandom.
----
* The big one is the infamous decision to disallow the acquisition and subsequent use of Pokémon not in the game's regional Pokédex. Formerly one of the core pillars of the franchise (per the former series tagline "Gotta catch 'em all!"), this change in mindset already proved incredibly divisive from the onset of its announcement, what with the Treehouse stream where it was announced being slammed by thousands of dislikes, and the topic trending within hours and being a source of debate for the rest of the prerelease. But the game's release and the reveal that 465 Pokemon were completely unavailable, thus excising over half of what the roster totaled to then, added further fuel to the fire. Those opposed to the decision, especially those whose main directive in the games was to collect them all, argue that having them all is so fundamental that removing them is not only an insult to both the fans that cherish each creature and the people that made them, but led to many other parts of the game suffering (such as the Battle Tower, which was inevitably going to be far less compelling as a result of a Dex purge). Those who defend it say that they never cared to collect them all and that the work needed to bring them all in every game would be massive for very little payoff, especially when the series had been piling up baggage for so long, and "Dexit" gave them a chance to start fresh and reevaluate the series on the whole (though whether they succeeded or not is a subject of very heavy debate as well).
** The cited reasons for the Dex exclusions also proved extremely controversial. While there was a general understanding that continuing to maintain nearly 1000 unique entities was no easy task, many fans were skeptical of Game Freak being able to keep its promise on improving the graphics and game balance due to their history of failing with it. Come the game's release, and the game's central gimmick of Dynamaxing was seen as a total GameBreaker within the first few weeks. Smogon's decision to ban it was proof enough for many that Game Freak failed to keep their promise, even when keeping the increased scrutiny of the game as a result of the Dex exclusions and the much larger install base in mind. One side praises the smaller number of variables and the removal of many historic game breakers such as Therian Landorus and Mega Rayquaza, and the other side believes that it is far less entertaining and only further reinforces the ComplacentGamingSyndrome.
** The promise to put Pokémon that "fit" the game already raised some eyebrows from the beginning, but the Galar Pokédex itself proved quite divisive. Of particular note was the omission of many fan favorites, such as Garchomp, Absol, and Ampharos, and the inclusion of some very unpopular Pokemon, mostly from [[VideoGame/PokemonBlackAndWhite Generation 5]], such as Basculin, Garbodor, Klinklang, and Vanilluxe[[note]]It's thought that James Turner, the art director of the game who started with ''Black'' and ''White'', has a bias for the generation similar to Creator/MasahiroSakurai's bias for ''VideoGame/KirbySuperStar'' in ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBros''. There is also how every creature he designed sans Shadow Lugia and the Ultra Beasts were in the base game.[[/note]]. This is base-breaking because every Pokémon is someone's favorite. Those who [[NostalgiaFilter grew up with these mons]] look at them fondly (in a way making this a case of OldGuardVersusNewBlood depending on age groups), [=YouTubers=] like LetsPlay/{{Chuggaaconroy}} are fans of Garbodor, and even ''[[TierInducedScrappy Basculin]]'' has a small but strong fanbase.
* EXP Share being mandatory. The changes to the EXP Share after Generation 6 were already a contentious topic for how it made the already easy games even easier, but with this change, the most common refute to it ("just turn it off") was no longer valid. The officially mentioned workaround by Game Freak to simply deposit Pokémon to not have them get EXP felt clunky compared to a simple toggle, which the newly added autosave feature had (something that garnered flack even from those neutral on the matter). Those defending the change argue that many RPG's had given EXP to all party members for ages and never had a problem with it: the general response to this is that Pokémon plays so differently from other RPG's that, even if the game was balanced around it, there wouldn't be much mileage out of mandatory EXP share. Furthermore, this was a holdover from the ''Let's Go!'' games, which were also decried by veterans for their lack of difficulty: though it was generally given a pass then due to ''Let's Go!'' being a much more explicitly entry level game, the promise that the next games would cater to more serious players made this retention difficult to ignore. Whether the final game's easy difficulty is a direct result of this change or not is base breaking in and of itself as well.
* The main campaign, as well as the postgame. Few will deny that the games breathed new life into the "8 Gyms and Champion" formula that has persisted throughout the series, though the parts that surround it are seen as lacking. Hardcore battlers and even a few casual players appreciate it, particularly after Generation 7's divisive attempts to tell more serious and arguably more intrusive stories, as it helps [[PlayTheGameSkipTheStory reach the part they actually care for]] while evading some of the writing issues of Alola's stories, and the competitive scene for the game is considerably more active than in the past. Other players, while noting that the series is no stranger to the ExcusePlot, find this game's narrative even more egregious and poorly written than those of past, due to [[TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot all potential plot points not centered around the Gym Challenge being resolved offscreen]] until the very end of the game (a problem attributed to Leon and him averting AdultsAreUseless, which makes him a BaseBreakingCharacter); the [[NoSidepathsNoExplorationNoFreedom extremely linear progression of the campaign]], with no potential diversions outside of the Wild Area and no real shot to use the newly improved Escape Rope in the few dungeons the game has; and the postgame offering no substantial story development outside of (finally being able to) catch the box Legendary.
* The visuals. While from the onset the games were never seen as the most beautiful thing on the Switch, something that many expected owing to Game Freak's own inexperience with the modern home console, the statement that the National Pokédex cull allowed Game Freak to more fine tune the game's graphics immediately led to heavy scrutiny and criticism for seemingly not being worth the tradeoff. A now infamous meme comparing the trees in the Wild Area to the ones in ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaOcarinaOfTime'' became the poster child for graphics complaints. The claims that the Pokemon were made to be more "expressive" also drew many unsavory comparisons to other home console Pokémon titles such as ''VideoGame/PokemonStadium'' games and ''VideoGame/PokemonBattleRevolution'', which were seen as more "expressive" despite releasing years prior on much less powerful hardware. While many are turned off by the low resolution textures, the short draw distance, the poor scaling of monsters during battle, and the reuse of some of the worst animations from the 3DS days (particularly those from ''X and Y'''s Sky Battles), those who do not see it as a weak point cite how many other high profile first party Switch games, such as ''VideoGame/FireEmblemThreeHouses'' and ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBrosUltimate'', have similar graphical bugs and inconsistencies that do not incur any flack and thus by complainers' logic should not be exculpated for these problems (this usually devolves into a debate about the overall quality of ''those'' games in relation to ''Sword and Shield'' which is a whole other topic).
[[/folder]]

!Spinoffs

[[folder:''Mystery Dungeon'']]

* The idea that the protagonist always has to be an amnesic human turned into a Pokémon, especially in the later games. Some felt that it allows more emotional investment especially at the end where ButNowIMustGo comes into effect and is a need for immersion and bonding between the protagonists, others felt that it became an overused plot device to shoehorn in humans when there isn't a need, considering that the PMD world essentially averts HumanFocusedAdaptation and give the Pokémon as a whole much needed CharacterFocus.

[[/folder]]

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