Kingdom Hearts

"Whose Namine?"

I'm A Pervert not an Asshole!

Kairi's Naminé, obviously.

I have a message from another time...

...Does it bug anyone else when people claim that Naminé and Kairi are the same person (something I've seen on this very site). It's...if it's not wrong, then it's reductive. They have different memories, different life experiences, and rather different personalities as well. That, in my opinion, is what makes you your own person.

edited 4th May '15 10:48:23 PM by KarkatTheDalek

Oh God! Natural light!

Namine's supposed to be Kairi's Nobody. All ordinary named Nobodies that we've seen are basically just more antagonistic variants of their original forms. Not hard to make the mistake.

I also think that there may be a bit of unnecessary semantics tied into the issue, which isn't uncommon for this site.

"Tell them to shut up and have some faith in me." - dead flashback guy

Plus Kingdom Hearts II said she was Kairi until the whole Happy Ending Override.

I will never not be sore about that

Am I the only one who thinks it would have made more sense for Xion to be a part of the same basic group as Namine and Roxas? BBS proves that there should have been three hearts in Sora's body when he lost his hear and it's notable that neither Namine or Roxas really looks like Sora.

Basically it would explain why none of them are conventional Nobodies because all of them have combined influences from two of the three hearts in the same body. Namine could be mostly Kairi's nobody but with influences from Ventus (blond hair and memory related powers due to Ventus's amnesia). Roxas Ventus's Nobody with obvious Sora influences. And with that Xion would have been Sora's nobody with some influences from Kairi.

The sad part is that I'm not sure if this explanation is either more or less convulted than the explanation they actually used.

The Crystal Caverns A bird's gotta sing.

Dumb link. Anyway...

edited 4th May '15 11:37:53 PM by lycropath

Link broken lycko.

The Crystal Caverns A bird's gotta sing.

What I mean is, Roxas and Sora have the same face like Kairi/Namine/Xion◊. Left is their old model right is their new one.

edited 4th May '15 11:47:07 PM by lycropath

Isn't that true of like every character in their age bracket?

The Crystal Caverns A bird's gotta sing.

I think in this case its supposed to be intentional.

I wonder if Ansem's new face matches Xemnas now that I think about it.

edited 4th May '15 11:47:47 PM by lycropath

This says a lot about this series.

They had both turned into Heartless at the time too. I mean, okay, Riku wasn't a Heartless per se but his body was changed to look like a certain Heartless. A very specific one.

Debates about Nobodies.

With what little one can get from the KH 1 models, Ansem's face is closer to Terra's than to Xemnas'. I don't have the Bb S model of Ansem on my PC and can't be arsed to rip it from the game.

I'm not surprised to see this fandom getting things right early. There's been elaborate theories around that Xemnas is Terra since the first screenshots of Bb S were out.

I wouldn't mind that actually happening, just because a character merge has more story potential than the non-sense that Namine ended up with. That's also why I would merge Roxas, Ven and Vanitas and Terra and Xemnas, or at least bring up the possibilities.

Heck, KHIII really needs some character driven sub-plots. You can't just grind worlds that have nothing to do with actual story or spend all game hunting a MacGuffin, then drop a happy ending on everything after Xehanort goes down.

A bunch of possibillities coming from "merge with alter-ego" being possible, just from the top of my head:

• Kairi remembering some of the things Namine went through, forcing Axel to actually confront the shit he's done.
• Kairi gettin Namine's memory manipulation or just bringing Namine out at will, allowing to fix the mess in Sora's heart and make someone remember Xion.
• Someone, probably Riku, assuming Terra to be the one keyblade master on Xehanort's side because some traits he kept are interpreted that he's Xemnas in disguise. May either be foreshadowing or misleading the player for a bigger surprise with whatever MX is actually doing.
• Have Terra keep some memories of Xemnas, using his knowledge to catch up with MX or just to lead to the next world after saving Terra. Same thing with Ven/Vanitas
• Have Terra actually think that he was at least a part of Xemnas, genuinely wanting to help "his people" and there being another part "convincing" him that the dickery was necessary. Use that to show how Xehanort used psychological warfare to get out of the stalemate with Terra.
• Play it that Vanitas kept Ven's memories after the split so he thought that he was the original Ventus. Add to that all the shit Xehanort put him through while Ven had a family and all that. Now merge him with Ven for "Do I hate myself? Who the fuck am I loyal to?" or with Roxas for more "Fuck those assholes that I'm somehow supposed to sacrifice my life for".
• Ven and Roxas, mostly so that Roxas can walk around and punch people in the face. A lot of people deserve to be punched by Roxas.

Now this is much easier to pull of with Kairi and Namine, because they just got the least character development of the original characters, aside from those nameless guys in Traverse Town maybe.

None of the things I mentioned above will actually ever happen, but plotting exercises don't hurt anyone. Our best chance is getting a “Roxas punching people in the face” mobile game to push KHIII back another year. And in general, it would be nice to see having been a Nobody actually having a lasting effect on a person.

edited 5th May '15 3:38:09 AM by Serox

Terra being Xehanort wasn't that hard to figure out even after just the Final Mix+ sneak peak.

@KTD: I believe we had a discussion on the topic a while back. My stance was that it's reasonable to think of Lea and Axel as the same person, but the same doesn't apply for Sora/Roxas or Kairi/Namine.

Dopants: He meant what he said and he said what he meant, a Ninety is faithful 100%.

The hell was Xemnas's plan?

True name.

Theories.

I thought Nomura's reasoning was that Xemnas and Ansem SOD didn't know about Xehanort's plan except unconsciously? 'Cuz if they did know you could write an essay about the various ways their actions make no sense.

Xemnas was in a position to know about The Plan by way of Braig.

Of course, it seems that, for both of them, when things started going badly, they decided "well , whatever. I have a Kingdom Hearts here. Might as well become a god."

And then Xemnas, following in the grand tradition of Xehanorts everywhere, was all "no, I meant to do that. Honest."

I have a message from another time...

Baptized by the Dark.

Tifa.

Atlantica and Terra. With links to Aqua and Ven.

Back in the day, when one could reasonable expect the characters to be subject to the metaphysical laws established in the games.

My interpretation of that was that Xemnas' motives were his own. He wanted his heart back because being a nodoby sucked and then wanted to create his own world because what he remembered from working under Ansem told him that ruling the world is awesome.

The subconscious knowledge of MX's plans hijacked his ideas which is why he went for Kindgom Hearts, kept the meaningfull members at 13 and threw an X at everyone.

But then, my interest for continuity went out of the window with 3D, so I probably missed some details.

An actual fish tail! Moving around will look really awkward and probably give Terra horrible pain in the back.

edited 5th May '15 6:55:24 AM by Serox

There's something awfully unwholesome about having your fish half be almost the same colour as your human skin.

If he wanted his heart back... well, didn't Xemnas know that he'd grow it back eventually anyway? That's what he was hiding from his underlings, wasn't it? So what's the point, if that was ever his motivation?

And really, what "sucks" so much about being a Nobody? DDD and Days seem to establish that becoming a Nobody is at worst a temporary inconvenience, at best a pretty sweet deal that gives you a bunch of super powers with virtually no trade-off.

edited 5th May '15 7:03:44 AM by DrDougsh

Kinda Uncanny Valley.

Dopants: He meant what he said and he said what he meant, a Ninety is faithful 100%.

I dunno if it really gives you all that many powers. I once thought it did, and then I played BBS and saw Braig warping around like it ain't no thing.

I have a message from another time...

Well, we got no clue how their powers and weapons work. Welcome to the Organization, here's your weapon and element, have fun?

(Marluxia: Why do I get flower as an element?
Xaldin: Your hair is pink, you were asking for it.
Demyx: Hey, count your blessings. At least you got an actual weapon.)

Dopants: He meant what he said and he said what he meant, a Ninety is faithful 100%.

The animations are different! The effects! The wispy stuff!

And he warps around a lot more as Xigbar! A lot more!

And he does the "New backdrop" thingy!