Series/Supernatural

I'm not sure why we're supposed to fear an organisation that didn't do shit against any of the worldwide threats until know (the seals and the Apocalypse, the Mother of All, Leviathans, angels locked out of Heaven and the Darkness). Either they didn't know about it, they couldn't do anything, or they were unwilling to act, which makes them incompetent at best and stupid at worst.

They did seem to collecting a lot of information on the Winchester brother's. Yeah they seem to be just out to collect dangerous artifacts now. At least that is the case for the English Branch of the men of letters since they also seemed not all that bothered about the end of the world.

Definitely not a threat when you previously had a connection with The Darkness. I wonder if she will make more appearances in the next season.

It was announced that there is a female regular joining the cast next season but I forgot the name so no idea if that was her. I did hear she was on Vampire Diaries, anybody recognize if that was her?

On the one hand it's about time for the boys to actually deal with some fallout for their actions (the Mo L chapters should be no more villains than the FBI were in previous seasons). On the other hand, I haven't been filled with confidence the last few season at the competence of the writers.

Plus now that Andrew Dabb is taking over as show runner (along with someone else), and he's the one that gave us Bloodlines, this could easily spiral into the politic plays of that failure.

I mean I've started Grimm and it seems to do well enough at the monster-politics angle, but that is that show. SPN is a different flavor.

One topic I wish had been covered more was the relationship between God and the angels. The whole Apocalypse storyline and Metatron's actions were driven by the angels desire for God to return...largely because God literally built it into them that they were supposed to serve him. I don't recall this every being really addressed aside from God's conversation with Lucifer. He just kind of returned and got the angels to work for him then left.

The big question I am left wondering is: Did God ever give a crap about the angels and archangels besides being his servants/slaves? Chuck spewed so much BS that I find it hard to tell.

Angels - God claims he was not supposed to have favorites and love creation equally, yet he ordered angels to bow before humanity and made it clear he regarded them as his favorites. He helps them when they are in danger, but not the angels.

Lucifer - God needed all the help he could get to take down Amara and did not bother to check up on Lucifer afterwords. Did he really mean his apology or was it a lie to get Lucifer's help?

Raphael and Castiel - Castiel slaughters countless angels while playing God and releases the Leviathans yet God rebuilds him time and again. Raphael remains dead.

Gabriel - Gabriel was killed by Lucfier while trying to protect humanity. Yet Lucfier is forgiven as if nothing had ever happened and Gabriel's death is not even mentioned.

Yes, Chuck claimed it would take time to rebuild them. He has had over five years. I guess he was too busy watching porn and resurrecting humans.

Michael - Poor Michael. All he ever wanted to be was a good son and make daddy proud. Instead, Chuck dumps on Michael to do the dirty work and clean up the mess the universe became. In the end, he abandons him in Lucifer's Cage and won't even talk with him. Given Michael's fanaticism I honestly wonder if God ever gave Michael a kind word or was too focused on Lucifer. Was Michael really so broken or was Chuck just looking for an excuse to have to explain himself and apologize to another archangel? Afterall, explaining himself to his "favorite" was hard enough.

Based on everything, did Chuck care at all about the angels and archangels besides Lucifer and maybe Castiel. He claims he does, but his actions speak otherwise. I really wish this had been addressed more.

While easily missed god did mention the other archangels in the next to last episode. It was along the lines of bringing them back would take more time then they had. He also mentioned reviving an angel was easier in comparison.

He obviously didn't care to much to do it in the past and mentioned the only reason he got off the sidelines was because of his sister.

Michael was mentioned to be in bad shape in the past also so I get the feeling that might be true. Though that is no reason to just leave him down there. It also raises the question of how Adam is doing considering he is down there in the cage also.

Eh, I thought I remembered something like that. Doesn't much explain why he never bothered to do so earlier.

I'm not sure how the writers wanted the audience to interpret God at the end of Season 11. Seasons 5-10 painted him in a very negative light. Season 11 ended on the high note of God making peace with Lucifer and his sister, but it totally disregards the other archangels or once again the mess God's absence made of things.

I know the series is human-centric with the idea that Humans Are Special to the point of being above all other intelligent beings. But trying to look at it more objectively it looks like the angels and archangels got as screwed over as much as humanity if not more so.

It did explain why he didn't decide to start sooner. He didn't feel the need to do so. If his sister was not released he probably wouldn't have gotten off of the sidelines at all.

The fact that Michael is still in the cage kinda makes it obvious that they are being screwed over really.

edited 28th May '16 3:24:40 PM by Darthwyn

Ugh, Michael's treatment bugs me this season. I don't know if they couldn't get Adam's actor or just decided they didn't want to bother. Instead of more Lucifer it would have been far more interesting to see a Michael released that might have been a little twisted... Maybe coming around to seeing Lucifer's side of things... Maybe turning around to amara's side to see if they can get Chuck's attention. It could have been something interesting.

Instead we get, "oh daddy was mean to you? then I guess the body count doesn't matter"

I am currently binge watching the show for the very first time. Here are my impression:

I think it looses a lot at one point...I am not sure exactly when, but the show goes down to a slippery slope in which human life suddenly doesn't count anything anymore. I have huge problems with the way the leads kill people left and right because they are unlucky enough to be possessed by demons. There is a disregard for human life in the show which really doesn't sit well with me. And then they pair it with what I hate the most, killing for a cheap shock effect. I don't think that death actually means a lot in this show, because what is perceived as "favourite characters" will come back one way or another anyway, while other characters are just introduced to die anyway.

It also becomes more and more unbelievable that the world as a whole is not aware what is going on.

All this said though...there is so much creativity in the show, I wish it were part of a more thought-out package. I love their version of Angles or the idea that a comic book writers creates the "Winchester Books" and their version of Death. When the show does stuff like this, it is really, really good. When it went for the cheap drama, it is pretty terrible.

Currently I would recommend watching the first 5 seasons and only watch more if your really, really love the characters.

On a different note, if the writers can't stop removing either Dean or Sam from earth in every second season finale, they should go full scale, put both of them in whatever and actually spend some time with them there instead of pulling one of them back in one episode. It's boring.

There are generally a couple of storylines I wish had lasted longer instead of being solved way too fast. For example "God Castiel" is something I would have preferred to see for at least half a season instead of five minutes and then spend a whole season on black goo. The whole arc was frankly terrible, and even worse when you consider what they could have done instead.

That couldn't have been a more standard fan response if it was made by a bot.

What? Why?

"literally everyone feels this way"

I think it was after season 2, in season 1 and more there is this unfeeling about fighting demons and how bad it is, even there is a moment where Dean and deamon are having a little chat about things and in the end Sam blast her with the colt, the act itself is portray as him going in the slippery road.

But Soon after demons grow in number, they just become monster of thw week that the brother can be shot with not reprecurtions

edited 31st May '16 10:14:35 PM by unknowing

And torture. Don't forget all the torture.

It's a real problem, though. One the show even addresses itself in the ghost episode, in which the first body of Meg accuses Sam and Dean of letting her die. She is kind of right.

Mmm...let me guess, the fandom also thinks that the first actress for Meg was the better one and that both Ruby's could have been better acted? But I take a stab in the dark and suspect that unlike me, most people didn't like Jo as a character (females really fare badly in the show).

Oh, there is something else I noticed...at one point the rating if the show changed...I actually think that it was better beforehand, because it went for the more subtle scare overall, instead of going all gory. I think the torture in general is very uncreative especially for hell. I loved when they changed it up in one episode and showed all those people having to stand in line.

Honestly, if they really want to shake the show up and keep it fresh, they should reveal the existence of the monsters and demons in-universe. That would be a truly profound shake-up of the status quo.

edited 31st May '16 1:00:00 PM by Swanpride

What did everyone think of the finale? I really really liked it. I liked that they took the season long theme of family and stuck to it as well as being true to their word that they would sacrifice themselves to save the world (even though they didn't have to!)

I hate that Sam doesn't know that Deans alive-Is Sam dead? Wounded? If he's dead is he in the empty? And I can't imagine what they are going to do with Mary! Please don't ruin the show by changing the backstory-that is the backbone of Supernatural.

I liked that they followed through with not just taking the killing option like Sam had addressed when the plague was first spreading. The Winchester brothers started saving lives again.

Though for anyone possesed by a demon that decides to go on a killing spree the host is better off dead since their life is pretty much over.

What I am interested in seeing is what comes about with Billy the new reaper head honcho. I assume if Sam is dying she already knows and would make good on her dead is dead stance and unlike with death Dean can't bribe her with greasy foods.

Currently Mary seems to be the gift the darkness was speaking of. I imagine there is more that will come from her revival and the exact nature of. I doubt the past has changed though. She does know how to hunt so the family dynamic has not changed to much

edited 31st May '16 3:18:29 PM by Darthwyn

" I take a stab in the dark and suspect that unlike me, most people didn't like Jo as a character (females really fare badly in the show)."

Yeah, supernatural fandom have somewhat of reputation of being creepy, posesive with the chararter and wanting everyone except the main trio(and bobby) dead and in general being a nasty bunch, granted the writing staff isnt much better(the show have been call out in queerbating) but so far female chararter dosent last long.

Except for Jodie

Oh, well, Netflix over here has 9 seasons which I think I will watch, but I doubt that I will seek out the two which aren't on yet on my own.

Meg's accusation was in S5.

Jus in Bello is probably the major mark for when they start caring less about life. They get the knife at the end of S3 and it becomes easier to then just stab demons rather than anything else (see also S5's "swap meat" where Dean almost stabbed himself a high school girl) to the point S&D have an argument over using it vs Sam's demon blood cheater power.

And yes, Ruby could have been a bit better written.

There is some irony that Charlie (a lesbian) was generally accepted by the fandom who took her death pretty hard.

Oh season 9... the season where the show got all meta and decided to try torturing the audience for once... (by Chuck's mug I hate that season so much)

As for S11 finale. Yeah it was great and all that the Darkness TM brought back Mama Winchester from the dead. What about all the people she killed through the season?

Part of me is hoping Billie the reaper isn't some leader or head honcho. For one thing, the increasing angelification of reapers grinds my gears and it would be nice for them to remain out of a hierarchy which everything else has had - reapers have always seemed more like anarchists. For another, that's all the boys have dealt with for awhile now. Somebody shows up, they end up being a leader of whatever. Heck they spent an entire season hunting alphas! It would just be funny (appropriate even) if being a reaper assigned to the Winchesters was seen as like... the worst job ever so it was given to like... the lowest reaper (if they did go with a hierarchy) who nobody liked or was new to the job or whatever. Plus it would close off possible plot holes of like, "we need this done?" via "So? I'm just a janitor."

I actually liked Jo and Ellen-I may have shed a tear when they died So far I'M not thrilled with this MOL storyline-they had just saved the world and here she comes with her little gun and her threats.

That's the nice thing about human protagonist; just because you kill an elephant doesn't mean a wolf can't kill you.

Aside from being more than a little illogical ( "Men of Letters? Where the fuck were you the last dozen times the world was ending?") it's such a step down. This season we have a being equal to God All Mighty. Next season, a club full of dopes who, once again seem to have been doing nothing for the last decade. Plus I bet the show's going to try to play this up as making Sam and Dean legitimately doubt whether they really are destructive forces the world's better without, but any moral high stance would be just hollow coming from these people.

I've always liked that about the show. Sure they fight off Archangels but one nutbag with a gun is still a threat.

edited 1st Jun '16 10:20:35 AM by thatindiantroper

Charlie gets killed off too? Urgh! Sorry, but what is the point if even if they do rescue someone, said someone will get killed off later down the line?