Bleach

So the accuracy is currently at 3:1. Anyone else want to join in?

I got bored and stopped reading!

It all seemed right to me but I did just skim a lot of it.

Seemed pretty accurate to me, especially when considering that Urahara is a sneaky git that hid away and bullshitted around many important things right from the start.

edited 23rd Nov '15 11:02:21 PM by Adannor

I'm surprised people think it's accurate, given that its very first statement was a giant assumption (that parts of the manga can potentially refute), and it just got worse from there. Look at what it says about how Urahara stabilised Masaki's Hollowfication. It's almost completely wrong, and the bits that aren't wrong are only not wrong because that's where the speculation enters.

edited 24th Nov '15 12:54:11 PM by Wyldchyld

There ain't no other explanation for Orihime, even while Chad was foreshadowed into Fullbringer.

Oh yeah also random minor power demonstrations by Don Kanonji and Tatsuki

edited 24th Nov '15 12:57:36 PM by Adannor

The first statement is an assumption but it's one that's very easy to argue for and makes a lot of sense. It shows the explanation for where hollows masks and individual powers come from. Since all pluses have the potential to become hollows it makes sense that they'd all have those own internal powers or at least the potential for them.

And as far as Soul Reapers go we have the zanapakutou which are pretty self-explanatory with regards to this issue.

Edit: I also don't see anything wrong with their explanation for Ichigo. The stuff they're treating as concrete is basically how I remember it (I should probably go reread it) and the rest is admitted speculation.

edited 24th Nov '15 1:01:44 PM by LSBK

No other explanation for Orihime... what? That every single human can develop powers when exposed to the same triggers?

The trouble is, other humans have been exposed to the same triggers - and they either didn't develop special powers, or they did develop spiritual sight but didn't develop any special powers beyond that. Orihime and Chad are the only two humans exposed to either Ichigo's shinigami power or the Hougyoku that went on to develop any powers at all.

Urahara said that Orihime and Chad were born with powers that were locked in their soul until awakened by Ichigo's shinigami form (Aizen claims the Hougyoku in Rukia was involved - but since Ichigo and Rukia were running around together, that's not a problem). Ginjo says Fullbringers are born with their power (and explains why), so that fits with what Urahara said - and Aizen didn't contradict that bit.

So, yeah, fans can speculate that all humans are capable of having powers unlocked, but bear in mind that despite several humans being exposed to the same triggers, only two humans actually have. So, yes, it's a big assumption to make, with some big questions to answer - and it didn't even try.

We don't know anything about Don Kanon'ji, so any theory can fit him - including the theory that he's a Fullbringer. Tatsuki hasn't displayed any spiritual abilities. She has spirit sight, that's all. Same as Keigo, Mizuiro and Chizuru. As far as we know, they're the only other classmates to have obtained any degree of spiritual awareness. There's an entire class that's been exposed to Ichigo and Rukia that - as far as we know - didn't develop anything.

edited 24th Nov '15 1:05:01 PM by Wyldchyld

I actually agree with some of the speculation in that article. But I would never call it accurate, which is why I said it was fine as someone's speculation about how the manga's working. Some of it does contradict the story though.

The story claims there are four different soul types - Shinigami, Hollow, Human and Quincy. So Human and Quincy souls aren't the same thing. Urahara claims the opposing pairs are Shinigami/Quincy and Hollow/Human.

Masaki was a Quincy/Hollow that needed a Shinigami/Human (Isshin) to balance her out. Urahara said Isshin's Shinigami soul could balance her Quincy soul, but that he would need to lock himself into a special humanising gigai to gain the Human part that was necessary to balance the Hollow in Masaki's soul. She was not Quincy/Hollow/Shinigami and Isshin was not Shinigami/Quincy. That part of his theory does contradict the story.

There's a lot of speculation about how the reishi bond got from Masaki to Ichigo and whether it occurred before he was born, when he was born or when Masaki died, so that's fine. However, we were told that the bond would have to break for Isshin to regain his power. Isshin did not regain his power when Masaki died, so we may not know what did happen when Masaki died, but we know what didn't happen - the reishi bond didn't break at that point (a lot of the Ichigo speculation I've seen in the fandom is linked to trying to understand this point, there are lots of theories around).

As to when the bond did break - some fans speculate it was very first time the hollow took over, which was the Byakuya fight, and other fans speculate it was during Ichigo's first Hollow transformation (the Vaizard training). So, that speculation is fine (this is one of the places where I agree with this article - Kubo uses a flashback panel to the Shirosaki fight, and I figure he wouldn't do that unless that's what made the reishi bond break).

edited 24th Nov '15 1:24:49 PM by Wyldchyld

I don't think Kubo has ever claimed Quincies to be entirely separate from ordinary humans. Like, their soul ribbons are white just like all other humans. Quincies have certain special qualities about them that make hollows even more dangerous but as far as the reincarnation cycle goes, they're like everyone else.

Well, I said the Human soul and Quincy soul has been stated to be two of the four different soul types. How humans and Quincies relate to each other makes for fun conversation - their souls are apparently different, however.

They might be, but Kubo could easily say they're not without contradicting himself. Uryu didn't talk about his spirit ribbon. Only the spirit ribbons of humans and Shinigami. It's very easy to assume Uryu's spirit ribbon is white, but Kubo didn't say it was.

Maybe. Maybe not. We do know they retain their Quincy power after they die - at least, Mayuri's experiments indicate they do. Then again, Ukitake implied Chad and Orihime would retain their power after death, too.

edited 24th Nov '15 1:35:14 PM by Wyldchyld

I don't get why people think there isn't an explanation for Orihime. We got one like five hundred chapters ago with Don Kanonji. One in ten thousand humans just has spiritual capabilities.

Because people like specifics, which I get but everything is going to get specified and not everything needs one.

It's the same reason a lot of people think she's a fullbringer even though that possibility was never mentioned in regards to her in the Fullbring Arc or beyond.

Speaking of, where the hell are Ginjou, Tsukishima, and Kutsuzawa?

edited 24th Nov '15 2:37:26 PM by LSBK

I don't have any problem at all with that as a theory.

Ginjo took them to meet Aizen, and they're reminiscing over a pot of tea about the good old days when Aizen was a respectable lieutenant and Ginjo a respectable Substitute.

edited 24th Nov '15 4:23:43 PM by Wyldchyld

It ain't a theory. Nobody had any reason to think that wasn't the case until Chad when 'oh, I guess I have hollows powers'.

Yeah, but we know why Chad's powers are hollow-like now and there's been nothing to indicate Orihime's are the same.

At this point, the original explanation probably just sticks with her.

edited 24th Nov '15 9:16:24 PM by LSBK

My crack theory is that Orihime is what happens when a human is attacked by a shinigami and manages to survive to have a child. Her Shun Shun Rikka are sentient, like Zanpakutou spirits, and completely unlike any Fullbring we have seen.

There's still some relation between both, given that Zanpakuto are hollow-derived as well.

But generally there's just the underlying thing that souls have power in them, which can be brought out in different ways - angry ghosts burst it out as Hollow abilities, ghosts training in the afterlife can utilise it as Kido even before asauchi shenanigans come in, still-living humans can have it brought out in various ways - Quincy (awakened by Yhwach's bloodline), Fullbring (awakened by a tiny bit of Hollow) are two stable traditions, but there are also one-offs like Don Kanonji and Orihime, and even Chad, though he had Fullbring in nature, he had it awakened through different approach.

I can not remember where it was said that Zanpakutou's were Hollow derived. Can you point me to a chapter?

edited 24th Nov '15 10:47:38 PM by Galeros

Uh, lets check the wiki...

Okay apparently misremembered, Oetsu does forge Asauchi from a bunch of shinigami souls. I mixed up the similarities between Asauchi and Shiro.

edited 25th Nov '15 12:50:14 AM by Adannor

Really? I've seen a lot of theories around the fandom over the years about what Urahara meant when he talked about their natural born powers. There seems to have been plenty in the story for people to get their teeth into long before the Fullbringer storyline came along. Unless you're talking about his Hueco Mundo fight - but even then people were speculating about hollow powers before Hueco Mundo happened.

You're not alone. I've seen that one crop up a lot over the years.

Chapter 540 is what you want, but it won't say "hollow-derived". Ouetsu says that Aizen's method for creating White by layering shinigami souls together seems very similar to his own method for creating Asauchi. The hollow mixed with Ichigo's shinigami powers to become his Zanpakutou.

edited 25th Nov '15 1:49:05 PM by Wyldchyld

This is an interesting experiment

Looks like another anti climatic villain death except with even less consequences for the shinigami side.

Though Lille does give you a big tell which Angel he is suppose to be

Bleach gets its own version of Dragon Ball Heroes?

What death? Lille seemed fine at the end, despite the damage he took, and he even figured out the whole "reflecting his power back at him" thing... Overall he's been a lot more impressive than I expected.