The Social Media Thread

Oh yeah, I forgot that Vine was a thing...

Wait… did Twitter own Vine?

Update: I looked it up and yes they did.

Edited by BigBadShadow25 on Apr 25th 2024 at 10:15:38 AM

Was Vine any different from Tiktok?

In terms of tech, I think each video was constrained to about 6 seconds. That affected the culture too, since the (successful) Vine stars were the ones who put the effort in to refine their jokes and videos. Think of it like that Mark Twain truism about how a 3-page story is much harder than a 30-page story.

Tellingly, once Vine died a lot of them moved to platforms like Tiktok and without the time constraint, their jokes got a lot less polished and a lot less funny.

ProZD is the only former Vine star I know of, and his post-Vine sketches are still good (if extremely infrequent).

Imagining how badly a Vine comeback would be botched, really.

Especially with how different things are today from when Vine first came out.

Imagining an internet without TikTok The potential Tik Tok ban is now law. What happens next?

Two days ago, the bill to force Tik Tok to separate from its Chinese parent company or face a nationwide ban had been signed into law by President Biden. Byte Dance now has 9 months (or one year, if Biden wishes to, just once extend the deadline) to sell Tik Tok and though the ban could be avoided with a successful sale or court challenge, Vox notes that Americans might want to start imagining an online world without Tik Tok.

Now, the article notes that the push to either ban or excise the platform from its owner has been around for years. For example, the Toilet Tantrum Tyrant announced plans to ban in the app in 2020 though, predictably, the bugger flipped and now thinks banning it is a bad idea (and that people should be mad at Biden about it, you get the drill). The threat of a ban, the article says, has always been "a little weird and complicated, drawing from a mixture of valid concerns and questionable moral panics about the ills of social media." The writer ( A.W. Ohlheiser) has even previously written that Tik Tok's moderation failures and data privacy concerns are hardly unique, "even as some lawmakers seem to persist in holding Tik Tok uniquely responsible for perpetuating them."

However, if you've paid attention to politics, something being signed to law doesn't mean that's the end of the story. Tik Tok CEO Shou Chew has said that "Tik Tok isn't going anywhere" and that he intends to challenge the law in the courts, on the basis of it being unconstitutional for violating the First Amendment. The U.S government would have to meet a high standard to prove that a ban is necessary to protect the nation's security and privacy to keep the law (which means nothing like "Yes, Tik Tok is not alone in what it does that has many people's concerns but you can't regulate the CCP"). Montana's statewide ban of Tik Tok (the almost childishly-easy to circumvent one, you remember that) was blocked by a federal judge last year as a likely violation of the First Amendment. 

"Why is this happening", the article asks. "Great question", the article answers. The lawmakers leading the charge have cited national security concerns stemming from the app's Chinese ownership-specifically, the possibility of the Chinese government accessing the data of American users and spreading propaganda or influencing foreign elections. Members of Congress refer to information they learned in security briefings about Tik Tok's potential to harm American interests "but the contents of those briefings are not public".An article by Bloomberg might be helpful for the quote. Critics, however, have noticed that the Chinese government could access a lot of the same data by simply buying it from a data broker. This linked article should better explain that.

The Vox article does note another angle, another driving force behind it. As the writer says that Vox had previously noted, the current push for a ban in Congress gained a lot of attention after a "viral but unfounded accusation" spread that Tik Tok was brainwashing America's youth with anti-Israel content in the first days of the October 7th War, a narrative that seemed to rekindle a lot of fears about Tik Tok's power as a propaganda tool.

"What changes if Tik Tok goes away in the U.S"? The next section starts off by noting that this isn't the first time a major force in internet culture has faced extinction ("rip Vine") but Tik Tok, arguably, is the most influential online platform in the U.S and won't be easily replaced, though other platforms will try to fill in the void. "As the Washington Post’s Will Oremus wrote," a Tik Tok ban would provide more space for the Meta formerly known as Facebook and Google to move in, as Meta has already adapted a lot of Tik Tok's features via Reels and Google has You Tube's Shorts but neither have quite the cultural force behind them that Tik Tok enjoys.The aforementioned article linked here.

A lot of bigger creators-those with resources, managers, and huge followings- would be able to jump onto another ship, if they haven't already, but everybody else is going to have a much rougher and more dramatic time. Earlier this year, Zari A. Taylor, a NC doctoral candidate who studies media and culture, explained "that the biggest loss to online culture if Tik Tok goes away will be in the uniqueness of how the platform promotes videos into user feeds." Tik Tok is good at recommending videos by accounts with small followings and makers who are often not professional content creators and they are most likely to lose their audience with the ban since they don't have the pull that could "help them evolve into other areas of the entertainment industry", Taylor says.

In some ways, the constant threat of a ban has already taken it's toll: after the first wave of ban threats back in 2020, Ohlheiser spoke with Ryan Beard, a creator who had nearly 2 million Tik Tok followers but the threat of a ban sent his livelihood into a spiral and forced him to accelerate his efforts to get views and followers on other apps. These days, he's all about stopped posting on Tik Tok and has instead become a commentary You Tuber.

"When Tik Tok rose in influence, it was better than any other app at showing users what they wanted to see, for better or for worse." While short, vertical-format videos might be available on any old platform these days, it's not the format that keeps people scrolling. 

The article concludes on a somber note: While some, like Beard, can turn their Tik Tok success into views on another platform, for many others, even the threat of a ban "is a harsh reminder of the realities of making content on the internet: Your livelihood is tied to the success and attention of platforms you don’t control".

When you say Toilet Tantrum Tyrant, you mean Trump?

I saw their wall of text and panicked

yes they meant Trump

Got it in one. I’m still imitating Colbert’s attempt before 2024 to not say the bugger’s name when making a reference.

Edited by fredhot16 on Apr 26th 2024 at 9:44:35 AM

I think adding "Golden" to the moniker would have been an easier clue since Trump loves gold

I wonder how the kids are gonna react if this ban goes through…

They'll find something else to gravitate towards.

I’m not sure about that…

The article mentions that while the likes of Google and Meta can take advantage, they don’t really have the same cultural force nor the ability to promote people that would normally get buried under other algorithms. To gravitate towards something else requires there to be something that can fill a similar purpose or fill a similar need.

Also, kids and content creators aren’t the only people who use Tik Tok.

I'm pretty certain that kids would avoid Google and meta like the plague due to one crucial factor...age.

It's more likely they hop onto a new startup that would arise from TikTok's ashes instead. Something more hip, more trendy and not associated with the stuff their parents' generations dósent use.

Google has You Tube and I don’t think it’s become a kid-free zone.

A new startup? Well, it can’t just be trendy, it has to be able to appeal and fulfill desires in a way that other platforms don’t or couldn’t, even if by a difference of degrees, if it wants to be successful. As the article noted, Google and Meta have similar formats at hand but it is not the FORMAT that keeps people on.

There is a difference between You Tube and You Tube Shorts.

Granted that does seem to be a possible exception, but that is more due to nigh monopoly that would get closer to shedding the nigh part with Tiktok gone.

x6 Their hatred of old people will certainly be hardened.

Edited by HotelCalifornia on Apr 26th 2024 at 11:07:04 AM

Young Man yells at cloud. Grade-schooler throws temper tantrum on street in the wake of TikTok's ban. Reporters heard him yelling about "geezers" ruining everything, unaware he is behaving like those same people

I think we both agree that Google and Meta, as they are, are not likely to swoop in and pick up Tik Tok’s audience and creators with the greatest of ease but I think the question still bears asking: what, fundamentally, is the difference between You Tube and You Tube Shorts?

Specifically, in factors of the system of creator and viewer recommendations such as “being better than any other app at showing users what they wanted to see, for better or for worse” or “being good at recommending videos by accounts with small followings and makers who are often not professional content creators”?

Does the former work under a different algorithm than the latter? Does the latter have the capability to “Ti K Tokify” itself? Can it attract those lesser-known creators? What do we know about which demographic goes where?

Edited by fredhot16 on Apr 26th 2024 at 11:49:36 AM

Instagram Reels seem reasonably popular, although certainly not to the level of TikTok. You Tube Shorts... well, someone has to be watching them.

I'm gonna be honest, I fully expect a lot of what's left of Biden's youth support to crumble after this. Sure Tiktok technically isn't banned yet, but I've long list faith in people knowing/caring about the details of these things. All they're gonna see on their feeds is "BIDEN BANS TIKTOK" and say "screw him".

Actually, the opposite's been happening, as Biden's support has actually increased in the past few weeks.

But anymore, and this will get into US Politics that is still banned here for now, so thats all from me.

Edited by Demongodofchaos2 on Apr 26th 2024 at 4:01:31 AM

I question whether young people who wouldn't vote for Biden over this were ever going to vote for Biden.