Why wouldn’t the Harbinger be careful? It isn’t like it wanted people to know what it was doing. The Charmed Ones discovered it was possessing Angela mostly by luck and these are the people tasked with sniffing out that stuff. The police would be utterly clueless.
And that’s even assuming any of this was for Angela’s benefit given how little Charity cared about killing her.
Edited by windleopard on Nov 6th 2018 at 11:43:48 AM
The Harbinger was holding a severed human head in her mini-fridge. And her entire purpose was the bring forth the Source of All Evil.
And unless the cops had probable cause to search Angela’s dorm, they likely would not have found it. Yes it wanted to raise the Source. It also didn’t want to get caught before going that.
She’ll freak out about it like any person would. Don’t know what else she’s supposed to do about it if it’s still there. Note that the head wasn’t brought up at all in the episode indicating they either didn’t know about it or they had gotten rid of the head. Either way, there is no reason to frame Trip to protect Angela. That’s assuming the Harbinger even left the head in there and didn’t get rid of it.
Again, the Harbinger wasn’t running around town yelling, “I am the Harbinger and you gotta deal with it”. It was trying to avoid getting caught while doing its job. It only reached the “so powerful no chains could hold it” level in this episode not the previous one. Meaning it had incentive to not get caught for a time.
Edited by windleopard on Nov 6th 2018 at 7:18:57 AM
The Harbinger may not have been waving their arms around declaring themselves to be a demon, but they weren't exactly being subtle. There could be plenty of forensic evidence showing that Angela was the one that killed those people. It was definitely a loose end that needed to be dealt with — Charity just dealt with it in the most morally gray way possible, by framing a dead man.
What else should they have done about the investigation?
Which goes back to my point: if the head was still her dorm, Angela is still screwed and framing Trip for the Harbinger’s murders is not only evil it’s pointless. If Angela goes back to her dorm and finds the head and calls the cops (and this is assuming she will call the cops) then the likely conclusion they will make is she committed the murders, framed Trip for them and then confessed out of guilt.
They didn’t have to do anything about the investigation at all. No one was looking to Angela as a suspect (which is the premise you’ve been arguing based on) and there was no need to frame Trip. We don’t even know specifically what type of evidence they used to tie him to the murders.
You are acting like they shouldn't have done anything about the police investigation, even though if they hadn't done anything, it would have likely resulted in Angela's arrest. Again: framing Trip was bad, but it doesn't actually hurt anyone aside from emotionally.
Edited by alliterator on Nov 6th 2018 at 8:28:09 AM
Then why frame Trip if the goal is to just keep Angela out of prison.
If they can't find any evidence, the investigation will become unsolved which happens all the time. Police drop cases when there is no evidence as to what really happened very often. With no evidence to tie Angela to the crime and no other reasonable suspects to look for there is nothing to investigate. No evidence, no suspects, no case.
It's not morally grey because it wasn't necessary. You yourself stated Charity got rid of any evidence tying Angela to the murders. With the closest thing to a chief suspect cleared and no other leads, what is there to investigate?
It leaves the murders unsolved, which is a loose end. If there is any trace evidence that they missed and that points back to Angela, again, that means an innocent woman goes to jail. If they, instead, close the case, then boom, no more looking for any trace evidence.
I'm not saying what they did was right, I'm just saying that it makes sense from their point of view.
If they can get rid of trace evidence to tie Angela to the murders there is no need to frame Trip. An unsolved murder is not a loose end if there are no other leads. And the police were not looking to Angela as a suspect.
I am not arguing from Charity’s point of view. I am arguing from the view point that framing an innocent man for a crime and tarring his family with the undeserved association with a murderer is objectively wrong. Especially when it wasn’t necessary.
Framing an innocent man would be objectively wrong...if he were alive. But Trip was already dead and if, by framing him, they are saving Angela from going to prison, then, again, that makes sense, even if it's extremely morally gray.
You seem to be thinking that there's no possibly way that the police could figure out that Angela was the killer if Charity hid the evidence, but we've already seen that the Elders aren't infallible. And if they let the investigation continue, there's no saying what other evidence they might uncover. To the Elders, it was easiest and safest to frame someone who was already dead. The only reason you think it's wrong is because Trip's family and friends will be emotionally hurt by it.
What is the trace evidence that can tie her to the crime? The only thing pointing to her guilt is the head and once they get rid of that, Angela is in the clear. There are no eye witnesses tying her to the crimes.
And no, Trip being dead does not make him being framed any better. If anything it’s even worse as he can’t defend himself.
You seem pretty casual about a man’s reputation being ruined in death for all your insistence that Angela shouldn’t go to jail for murder. I can just as easily dismiss the problems of that by saying she’d be the only one hurt by that so who cares. And at least it was Angela’s body that was being used for these crimes.
Also, any type of fingerprint or DNA that she might have left behind when the demon was possessing her (it wasn't exactly wearing gloves).
Edited by alliterator on Nov 7th 2018 at 6:53:12 AM
So I watched the original show as a guilty pleasure. Still, I enjoyed it. Is this one any good?
You lost!
It's flawed but it's finding its footing as the episodes go by.
I mean, I would have assumed the head was taken care of before the episode started. If Niko and Trip were investigating, I would assume they'd have searched Angela's apt long before interviewing the girls.
ANYWAY,
I like the episode. I think the writers running with "The Elders are Dicks" is a smart move and makes them more interesting than the original show where they were... generic vague assholes.
I just... wish this episode was a lot later in the season. I wish we had met Trip for a couple of episodes so I could care when he died. I feel like all the reason that I, as a viewer, care about his death is for ALL the reasons besides that someone died. I care because Niko is emotionally broken from the lie. I care because Mel now has this massive guilt complex. I care because the elders framed someone who was innocent.
I don't care that we lost a character. Admitedly, he was kind of an obvious red shirt since they never really gave him personality, but I wish we could have seen some personality from him first.
To contrast, Once Upon a Time introduced Sheriff Graham early in Season 1 and started building him as a romantic lead for the protagonist, Emma Swan. We got some of his backstory as he starts noticing the thread of the series' main plot, gets his backstory teased out, and even got a character focus episode. And, as soon as we think he's chosen Emma over Regina (who is using "Not" Mind Rape to... rape Graham... Its a long controvercy), Regina suddenly murders him and shit got real for the series. The plot was in full motion, the stakes had been set, and the tone was heard. The writers signaled that they were done with introductions and ready to move their pieces across the chess board.
I feel like THIS could have been that moment for Charmed 2018, but we got here too fast. I didn't even know Trip existed before this episode, so his death wasn't shocking and didn't have any punch to it. I need the stakes to be set up before we start threatening them, y'know?
Good episode, just wish it were later.
Also, Trip's death was, like, hilariously bad. He was randomly hit by a pipe.
Also, the episode had a much better example of a morally grey decision in whether or not they should kill Angela given there was seemingly no way to free her from the Harbinger. Instead we get a deus ex machina in the form of a spell that their mom just knew they'd need because of her precognitive powers that were never mentioned until now. Because, as Obscurus Lupa would say, "makes it easy".
Edited by windleopard on Nov 7th 2018 at 10:32:30 AM
Have you been listening to Lupa and Phelan's podcast for the new Charmed? It's called "Charmed Hard With a Vengeance" and they both agree that Niko is the new Darryl.
Nice. The CW is one of the few networks that doesn't seem to care about ratings — at least, not the usual Nielsen ratings, since Charmed's last episode got less than a million viewers per that standard. Perhaps it's their deal with Netflix that gives them the leeway to allow shows to breath like that — all I know is that Crazy Ex-Girlfriend is one of the lowest ratings shows on network TV and they still gave it four seasons.
In any case, this is actually the first time that the CW has had Sunday programming since it started, so even less than a million viewers is better than none at all.
Lucy: I Never wanna see your face again.
Yeah this line becomes unintentional comedy when you have her look back at Maggie as she’s walking away.
Edited by windleopard on Nov 12th 2018 at 5:30:06 AM
I would say tarnishing an innocent man's reputation and making his friends and family think he was a murderer are pretty big deals and go way beyond morally grey.
I could even understand just making his death look like a suicide and stopping at that. It's the framing him for the Harbinger's murders which is completely unnecessary especially as there's nothing to suggest they'd have gotten to Angela for the deaths.