Millennials/Generation Y discussion

My complaint about trigger warnings is they get outright misused too often. /disgruntled X-gen psychologist mode.

Safe spaces and trigger warnings have real uses. Getting to not listen to a point of view you dislike at work is not one of them. -_-

edited 15th May '16 4:00:00 PM by Euodiachloris

I mean I'm not sure how a trigger warning is actually different from any other kind of content warning other then that we've become used to ignoring general content warnings.

But yeah, the missus of the term "safe space" is annoying, safe spaces are important, but they're also not places for intellectual growth, debate or discussion, as such some places should be one and some places should be the other.

I mean, I personally think that debates should be well moderated, so that the discussion doesn't veer into territories that are traumatic to the participants and quite frankly have no place in said debate. I don't see any problem with that.

Unless you actually have an anxiety disorder, a little trauma is normal: shying away from it whenever it comes up isn't healthy. :/

Come to think of it, is it wise to shy away from trauma in a discussion? Those who aren't ready for such trauma could switch to another discussion, which is what trigger warnings are for - to let readers decide if it's time for them to face the trauma. It's not healthy to constantly shy away from and never ever face trauma, but it's also not healthy to force sufferers to face trauma without letting them choose. We can guide them, comfort them, encourage the, but not force them.

Presumbly, the source of trauma is actually relevant to the discussion. Debates should be moderated so that they don't degrade into uselessness or even discrimination ("You sympathize with single mothers? You must be a slut who sleeps around and kills her own babies!" "You think the internet isn't harming the human race? You must be one of those self-rightous millennials with the attention span of a goldfish!").

edited 16th May '16 12:34:11 AM by hellomoto

I'm fine with trigger warnings, as long as the post actually contains the thing being tagged.

People who slap "scopophobia" on any picture where the subject's eyes are visible and "epilepsy warning" on every looping gif do annoy me though.

I essentially agree with this - by all means, people should be able to face their trauma, but it has to be their own choice, and debates shouldn't force anyone to have to do this unnecessarily.

Debates should be moderated, but that doesn't make them safe spaces. Take OTC, we're a heavily moderated debate space, but we're sure as hell not a safe space in the technical sense. We might be a secure space, a happy space, a polite space or whatever, but we're not a safe space. Why? Because we engage in debate and discussion, we dissect cause and effect, we disagree and argue against each other. A safe space is all about not doing that, not having any ideas challenged, disagreed with or debated, a safe space is about healing and being made to feel good.

A safe space is a battered women's/men's shelter, it's where you go to be safe from the rest of the world. We've had debates about the mechanics behind battered women's/men's shelters before, that's a discussion we have here because this is a place for such debate, you don't have such discussion in said shelter because the shelter is a safe space, where such topics are shelved so that people can feel safe and heal.

If a given subject is traumatic enough for the person that it becomes too difficult for them to discuss, then they should probably not participate in that debate at that point in time for their own sake. Their priority should be taking care of their own well-being and coming to terms with their own pain, not participating in a discussion that's not going to be conducive to that process.

Correct, that's why you make safe spaces that people can go to and not have debates, rather then try and turn debate spaces into safe spaces.

Now that makes sense!

Come to think of it, isn't every place a safe space in some fashion? For examples, we typically don't talk about rape so casually in public, or try to promote atheism in a church. Safe spaces are usually safe against a certain type of idea, depending on the place.

What makes a safe space different from a 'typical' space? The ability to arrest someone for saying something in the space?

Controversial statements alone aren't arrestable offenses (in America, anyway) but there's definitely a social expectation I think (you look more like you're doing it to be a jerk than actually looking for a discussion).

From what I understand, free speech doesn't apply on private property to the extent that it does on public property. This is due to the fact that you don't really have a right to be on someone else's property. Also, schools have the ability to censor their students.

Other than that, my personal rule of thumb is that "it's legal to be a jerk, but it's also legal for people to point out that you're an asshole". In general, the proper response to "bad speech" is by drowning it out with "good speech".

Define in public. In academic circles on the subject we certainly do, likewise you'd probably discuss atheism during a theology or religion course. Likewise it's not such much not bring up atheism during Church as it's not telling everyone that heaven doesn't exist at a funeral. You could certainly have a debate about the tangibility of theology with a priest at a church, now during a service it'd be rude as you'd be interrupting, but that's separate.

Generally that it's codified that everyone can expect to not have the banned subject broached in that place. It's not so much being arrested as kicked out.

I read an op-ed piece from the New York Times (dated March 20, 2015) that pulled no punches and used terms like "self-infantilizing" to describe college students who make use of safe spaces.

The author described a safe-space room at Brown University as "literally the kind of thing you could imagine a four-year-old enjoying."

Is this what we've come to? Are these supposed adults so easily traumatized by differing opinions and viewpoints that they must turn an institute of higher education into the world's most expensive day-care center?

Meh, I mean the girl appears to have gone though some trauma and have issues dealing with it and be in a precarious psychological space where her ability to deal with criticism and debate is limited. That happens, if it's a good way for her to deal with her trauma then fair enough, what works works.

The girl wasn't traumatised by "by differing opinions and viewpoints", she was traumatised by rape and is finding differing opinions and viewpoints hard to deal with currently due to still being traumatised by rape.

Also how have they turned "an institute of higher education into the world's most expensive day-care center?", it's one dam room for people suffering trauma. You have a medical room for people suffering from a fall, why is a room for people recovering from a psychological injury such a crazy idea?

I fail to see an issue.

edited 17th May '16 4:10:44 PM by Silasw

macho culture I'd say, the idea that people should just "get over it" when they experience trauma, and that showing emotions and feelings is bad, the fact the current generation lives in a period of relative comfort and peace means we're "soft" according to a lot of people

That s what I was thinking but I think it has as much to do with the 'kids these days' mentality alongside the macho culture.

yeah, there is a lot of "THE WORLD DOSENT GIVE A SHIT, SO YOU MUST FACE ON YOUR OWN!" I have seen around in a lot of anti-feminist page in facebook, there is this idea of "the world is shit, deal with it" which is excuse to be a shitty person in general

So I just found out about this thread. Hmm, so it covers from mid 80s to 2000s-born people. I guess that makes me a millenial, then.

What can I say about my generation? Well, the only objective thing I can say is probably that we are living in what is possibly the safest and prosperous time in human history, and all that comes with it.

the world is shit, and we have to all band together to make it less shit

My stance is that, yes, the world definitely is shitty, but hey, it got significantly less shittier.

*glances at Fascism Redux: We Swear It's Ironic*

OK, hopefully it stays that way.

Op-eds: I recall an article noting that such op-eds are most probably pushing an agenda. At the very least, they're still being useful idiots for the part of the American Far Right that wants funding for institutions of higher education cut so that American youth are kept away from that inconvenient critical thinking business and easily shepherded into the American Far Right's fact-proof safe space bubble.

The fact that this is probably the nicest, most tolerant time we've ever had is sort of depressing, but I guess we can be optimistic that we're sitting on an upward trajectory.

but people don't like niceness or tolerance! it doesn't make them feel like a big man! BIG MAN!