Did anyone ever take care of either the rewrite or the new Moral Defector trope?
Here's the actual definition of "decadence" for those who are still confused, and yes, it does necessitate luxury:
- moral or cultural decline as characterized by excessive indulgence in pleasure or luxury.
- luxurious self-indulgence.
edited 30th Oct '16 3:35:56 PM by MonaNaito
Reset the clock. The course of action here is so complex, that without a dedicated troper we are unlikely to do it.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Checked Thesaurus, nothing is said about luxury there.
- the act or process of falling into an inferior condition or state; deterioration; decay:
- moral degeneration or decay; turpitude.
- unrestrained or excessive self-indulgence.
- (often initial capital letter) the decadent movement in literature.
For bonus, here's "defector":
- verb (used without object)
So "defector from decadence" is a person who leaves their cause/group/place/etc because it has become decadent, i.e becoming inferior and degenerating, usually morally but can be for other reasons.
Thing is, the "becoming inferior and degenerating" part (as used in the trope) is usually in the perspective of the defector, which may not match the perspective of everyone else's. Should we use this "relative" idea or should we count only the cases when it's actually decadent?
We don't need justice when we can forgive. We don't need tolerance when we can love.
NaNo 4328 / 50,000
Why are you using a Thesaurus?
- https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/decadent
- https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/decadence
- https://www.vocabulary.com/dictionary/decadence
- http://www.wordreference.com/es/translation.asp?tranword=decadence
- https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/decadent
- https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/decadence
- http://www.thefreedictionary.com/decadent
Five different dictionary sites say it involve self-gratification/self-indulgence (both require luxury) and moral decay. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/self80%93indulgence
edited 10th Jan '17 5:23:30 AM by crazysamaritan
Link to TRS threads in project mode here.
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But then it also has another meaning (both in Thesaurus and the links you provided) that is "a state of decline" or "decay". And it's also used in contexts that doesn't have luxury, like "The decadence of the grand estate was a steady, sad process."
NaNo 4328 / 50,000
grand estate = luxury
You're doing a poor job of presenting your point.
Link to TRS threads in project mode here.
World's Toughest Milkman
It has two separate meanings. That is extremely clear from looking at the various links crazysamaritan posted. The word itself has undergone the real-life equivalent of what we call "trope decay". Originally derived from a Latin root meaning "to fall", it is actually related to words like "decay", and has a similar meaning, but has also come to be used to describe luxury (because of the belief that luxury leads to decay) in cases like "a decadent dessert".
Any claim that it must mean luxury is plainly wrong, but so is any claim that it doesn't mean luxury. It has more than one meaning. Which is fairly common for English. We even have a technical term for it: polysemy (loosely, "multiple semantics").
So, what we have here is honest, built-into-the-language ambiguity.
Speaking words of fandom: let it squee, let it squee.
Resetting clock.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Conclusion: we shouldn't use "decadence" for the name.
We don't need justice when we can forgive. We don't need tolerance when we can love.
Clock expired with no progress and it doesn't seem that the change is feasible; closing.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Crown Description:
Well, that name makes sense. That helps then.
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick