Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice

Until I see otherwise, I'm gonna believe that the words spoken are due to the power armor.

No he didn't like Christian Bale as Batman. He thought he was phoning it in a lot and that he made a lousy Bruce Wayne.

Fucking AMAZING.

edited 19th Apr '15 7:11:13 PM by higherbrainpattern

That shot of those soldiers kneeling to Superman makes me think of the Regime soldiers from Injustice Gods Among Us though.

Why does Wikipedia still claim that it will be two movies? Also, what would keep Clark from just leaving the fight?

Maybe Clark just wants to humor Bruce that is why he doesn't leave the fight.

The fight is a risky test of Bruce's hypothesis that if Superman is genuinely helpful and not an evil threat, fighting him won't be fatal.

The fight choreographer said the movie takes pains to ensure that Superman has an investment in the fight, preventing him from just flying out of arms reach once it escalates. Presumably, that could be that he thinks Batman has something of value or is responsible for something bad, making him want to actually take Batman down instead of leave him alone.

As for Bale's Batman voice, in Begins he was either screaming at the bad guy or whispering from the shadows. In the scene where he interrogates Flass that voice felt like a demon. In TDK he was having extended, "equal footing" conversations with Gordon, Dent, Fox, even the Joker (in the interrogation room, before he just started punching him), making the extremely scratchy voice come across as someone trying to sound scary rather than actually BEING scary. In TDKR his attitude was a lot more curt and the voice sounded more tired, making it feel a little more natural. I'm certain the Affleck voice is augmented by the suit, but not that much.

Why is Batman asking Superman if he bleeds? Is he trying to get Clark annoyed at him? What card does Bruce have up his sleeve?

You can't just look at the "Do you bleed?" question. Bats is doing pre-fight intimidation. "Do you bleed? You will." The "you will" is just as important as the first part, and is Batman saying "I don't care if you're Superman, I'm going to beat the everloving shit out of you."

I think the point of that was along the line of "gods can't bleed"...reminded me immediately of Whiplash's little speech in Iron Man 2 about making a god bleed, though he meant showing the world how vulnerable Iron Man actually is. This sounds more along the line of showing that Superman is just a man.

Responding to some things from a little while ago:

@Son of Sharknado

I liked Man of Steel a lot and think most of the fan complaints are silly. This trailer makes it appear as if this movie is built around those fan complaints.

@Soble

The Dark Knight Returns is a "notable" Superman vs Batman fight alright, but it's also one of the worst portrayals of Superman ever put to page, rendering him as a completely out-of-character moron and government stooge. To be fair, it's also an incredibly awful portrayal of Batman, turning him into a raving fascist, and that's not a term I throw around lightly.

How about a Light-Hearted Rematch at the end?

So having watched Man of Steel again yesterday, my confidence is pretty shaken. It's not a terrible movie, but the main issue is that I as a viewer have no idea who Clark is as a person. Like I get that he's the savior of the human race because that's all anyone says about and to him but outside of that...like what does he believe in? What does he want? How does he feel? I don't know. Maybe I'm expected to know because he's Superman; maybe I'm supposed to infer all these morality and beliefs and stuff.

The back and forth of flashbacks and stuff is really choppy so the narrative structure is really wonky. I can respect it for trying to be different than a standard three-act structure or something but...it tried too hard and all of a sudden there's a conflict a third of the way through and apparently the whole film was building up to it? There's absolutely no basis whatsoever for Lois and Clark to have any romantic interest in each other other than the script said so.

Visually, it's not as dark and gritty as people seem to think - but that's about the only criticism I see as unfounded. The neck-snap was fine I guess. I like it being the basis for the "no killing" rule but it deserved more acknowledgement after the fact.

I'm just hoping Dawn of Justice will actually give Clark an identity I guess. Fortunately, Batman can get by as this ominous shadowy figure so characterizing him (from a purely narrative perspective) hopefully won't be that big of a priority or an issue.

Do you know the review of the Nostalgia Critic? He summons up the problems with the movie pretty well. Also Renegate Cut.

Yeah, it's one of my favorite reviews for being pretty balanced between his views and Joe's. I'm generally in the Critic's corner in that while I see and appreciate the film's intentions the execution is just pretty weak in terms of character and story.

Dawn of Justice looks like it has a more cohesive narrative and considering it's actually written to set up a universe (whereas Mo S was written to set up a trilogy) I have slightly more faith in it.

I kinda wish Zack Snyder was writing in addition to directing.

How would Clark have learned how to not accidentally hurt someone? Is that a superpower?

HOORRRRNNNSS. BWWAAAAAAHHHH.

Yeah, that's well worded. The intentions are not bad, there are some good elements in it (I actually like the scene when Clark freaks out as a child), but the execution is really, really bad. I think my biggest problem is the combination of not developing the characters combine with them making them do stuff which makes no sense just to get a specific shot or move the plot in a certain, contrived direction.

edited 20th Apr '15 12:14:30 PM by Swanpride

If we're worried that Man of Steel didn't spend enough time developing its one main character, I fear for the quality of the Justice League movie...

edited 20th Apr '15 12:15:33 PM by spashthebandragon

That's actually my main worry. They didn't manage to develop any of the Superman characters in one long movie. Now they throw in Batman and company as well as Wonder Woman into the next. It's not like it is impossible to introduce a team-up at once, after all, Marvel did it with Got G, too. But I have to trust the guy behind the project that he knows how important the characters are above everything else.

Ensemble films work if you manage to organize the plot and the character development.

All of the problems with Man of Steel - Clark's lacking characterization, the lack of chemistry, over-reliance on exposition, jumbled out-of-order plot, and a villain whose actions make no sense, to name some - all boil down to one core issue: David S. Goyer is not a good screenwriter.

edited 20th Apr '15 12:35:17 PM by Pannic

See, I don't think that any of the problems you just mentioned even exist. I mean "villain whose actions make no sense?" Zod has the simplest of motivations—he wants a new piece of real estate to live on, there are already people living there, so he'll kill them all. Same story that's repeated a thousand times across human history.

I hated the Honest Teaser it seems that everyone at screen junkies hates DC just to hate them.

If you go into a movie thinking it will sick your opinion wouldn't change and you would be finding reasons to hate on it.

I guess that is why I have never been disappointed with a movie because you have to be optimistic when you watch a movie.

So you're a military commander from a civilization that'd big on eugenics. In attempting to save your people, you come across a place where your people miraculously have super-senses, strength, durability, flight, and heat vision. You have an opportunity to breed a civilization of super-beings. It's every eugenicist's wet dream.

Instead, you decide to terraform the planet so that you and your people don't have superpowers. Your reason? Having super-senses is unpleasant.