Shin Megami Tensei IV *SPOILERS ABOUND*

Due to the large number of spoilers flooding in from the game's Japanese release, I created this thread for those who don't care about spoilers. Everyone who does can remain in the General SMT Thread.

Carry on.

edited 27th May '13 2:34:00 PM by Pulse

Thanks Pulse.

I take it once the game comes out in the west (or maybe a little bit longer), this will be locked and discussion moved back to the normal thread?

I am usually not a fan of individual titles in series getting separate threads unless it's for the purposes of avoiding spoilers and all where folks don't want to see it, you know?

Yeah, I made this under the assumption that it'll be locked after the game comes out in the US, or at least, after the no spoilers grace period has ended.

that's neatbeneans

So who's the final boss?

Starting this off with the two Koga Saburo fights.

I heard depending on your alignment you don't fight him.

Merkabah for Chaos, Lucifer for Law.

No idea on who Neutral's is yet.

edited 27th May '13 2:45:41 PM by OmegaRadiance

...Who is that Chaos final boss?

I mentioned it in my above post.

... I like how the little demons in the Press icons give a thumbs up if they're half-used.

No, I mean who the hell is that? You gave a name, but you didn't say who that actually is.

From what I can tell, the Chaos final boss is someone who has never appeared in the series before. If you said Satan or YHVH or hell, even Metatron, I wouldn't be asking.

Indeed, I'm curious about Merkabah, too.

And this is an open spoiler thread. Don't worry about doing this.

...

Here's what the Other Wiki has to say on the subject. It's a somewhat abstract concept, though, so it can only help so much.

Alright then! So, essentially, another avatar of YHVH's, then.

edited 27th May '13 3:02:04 PM by Pulse

Merkabah is on the wiki. It's the Throne Chariot of God sent to rebuild Mikado for God.

The Wiki only has its Demikids appearance, with the SMTIV appearance just listed without any context.

So basically, it is YHVH's chariot, which is a superweapon that will rebuild Mikado into the Thousand Year Kingdom.

Obviously, when you go Chaos and Neutral, you don't want that.

edited 27th May '13 3:02:23 PM by Otherarrow

What they rebuilding Mikado into is unknown.

After the battle against Tayama and Yamato-Takeru they are sent to two different worlds. One representing Law as a dessert wasteland where Pluto and the robot demons rampage. While another looks like Tokyo and everyone is a a demon.

They're taken to both by the White Men who wanted Flynn to destroy everything. I've also heard they're bosses on Law and Chaos.

edited 27th May '13 3:07:34 PM by OmegaRadiance

Well, it's YHVH and the angels. It was either "Thousand Year Kingdom where everyone is brainwashed to worship God forever" or "man, just kill them."

I wouldn't be surprised if these "White Men" (whoever the hell they are) purposely showed Flynn and the crew settings that would motivate them to enact their goals of just killing everyone. Basically, show them worlds where both alignments basically destroyed everything to convince them that the world is doomed no matter what and not worth saving.

"THIS kind of extremism doesn't work, and THAT kind of extremism won't work, either... Guess we're boned".

Actually I think the choice happens before you get sent to these worlds and you aren't able to make the choice afterwards.

Not to mention the worlds match the dream he has at the beginning of Walter and Jonathan, who are in those very same places.

Also, they meet the founder of Mikado from 1500 years ago named Aquila. He's a demon in the demon world who wants to build a peaceful kingdom named Mikado, and in the desert world he wants to cooperate with demons to build a kingdom named Mikado now that the law ones that were poisoning them in the name of God were gone.

edited 27th May '13 3:20:54 PM by OmegaRadiance

I wouldn't be surprised if it was kinda a "scare them straight" thing. Basically telling them that even if they start with "good Law" or "good Chaos", it will eventually grow into this.

Of course, I wouldn't be surprised if Walter was the only one convinced by the Law world and Jonathan was the only one convinced by the Chaos world, and it just further pushes them down their own alignments.

Also, does Jonathan become an angel and/or messiah?

Wait...so the worlds are actually periods in the past? Alternate timelines that both lead to the present? I don't understand.

edited 27th May '13 3:23:33 PM by Otherarrow

Alternate worlds in the past or something else.

Believe me until we know more it's just as confusing. Especially when one of you're comrades is also from a alternate world and not the original that you knew, but was there when the Particle Accelerator was activated and is no longer with you in the current world.

edited 27th May '13 3:33:52 PM by OmegaRadiance

Speaking of the timeline mumbo jumbo, and sorry for harping on this, but are the SMTI parallels ever addressed, or is it just "oh, hey, we ramped up the parallels a bit more than usual this time. Nostalgia cash!"

Probably a continuity nod and nothing more. 2ch at least thinks the game is a sequel to SJ.

Also, the White Men take the form of Hugo, K, Issachar, and Isabeau. They also say this when you do it:

• "Finally, after the 5th try, we were finally able to release the world from suffering."

If you include SJ, this makes five games. Also, Lucifer says on the Chaos path that you only put them down temporarily. They'll eventually return.

I wouldn't say it's a continuity nod if there is no actual nodding, but hey.

I have given up on it being a bonafided plot point, but I think it might be nice if the Black Samurai, STEVEN, Hikaru, etc comment on how familiar Flynn and the crew are, much to their confusion.

...Wait, so does that imply that the White Men were working behind the scenes of the previous four "main" games, even if they failed? That's a pretty hefty retcon there.

I don't know about any of that. No one whose played the game has said such things. So they might not even be that similar.

Well it's /smtg/ theory, one that I like.

Also, when Tsugihagi turns out to indeed be Masakados on the Neutral route cause it's so obvious I am going to be amused, cause him and Hikaru were hanging out during the game.

edited 27th May '13 4:07:21 PM by OmegaRadiance

Tsugihagi is the guy with the stitched on face holding Masakado's sword, right?

Yeah, I am betting than not only is he Masakado, he doesn't even get a new design, just reusing the Soul Hackers design because that's where the sword comes from.

And it will look really out of place next to the other plot important demons.

edited 27th May '13 4:10:05 PM by Otherarrow

Plenty of the plot important demons already look out of place next to each other.

I mean Michael doesn't even fit the theme the Archangels have going on. Heck two demons are actually sculptures that are simply used in the game.

Four Archangels.