So is it late enough to declare the results of the "Arab spring"

I wouldn't compare Pakistani's secession to CSA's since Brits let more or less the division based on religion, which admittedly was idiotic move since for centuries Hindus and Muslims got along more or less and this division gave reason to separate "them" from "us".

I doubt India would be ok with annexing Pakistan because bear in mind that they supported themselves CSA-esque secession of East Pakistan.

Hmm, if Islamist fundamentalists as tame as those in Turkey, who are more similar to conservative right, there would be no issue with democracy. Polish social conservatists with Christian bent ruled for two years and no major breach of democracy happened, though few people got persecuted by the state in pursuit of eradicating the issue of bribery.

I know it's kinda derogatory in the UK, but I've never heard "Paki" being spoke of in the US. It's always Pakistani as the proper noun.

For centuries the Muslims put the Indians under humility tax, the highest form of tolerance under the theocracy of submission if by that you mean "got along". The Hindus got along much better with the Jews. Their mutual respect and coexistence despite the vast gap in their religions by rights should be highlighted more. Considering how Jews historically did not gel with Christians and Muslims despite supposedly venerating most of the same prophets.

Or to put it in another perspective, have you ever heard of the Hindu Kush? It means "Hindu Slaughter", a point none of the liberals want to acknowledge is that the area used to full of Hindus who were slaughtered by Caliphate soldiers. This is not about fundamentalism or religious extremism. This is about a form of government that advocates the butchering, humiliation and expelling of anyone who refuses to submit to it that uses the Islamic trilogy as justification for its policy. Nobody will argue with it because it speaks of the metaphysical, the things beyond our understanding, making Sharia the perfect tool for Saudi imperialism.

Well except that the Turks did it better. Then the Europeans proved to be better imperialists motivated by their racist pseudoscience. Thing is, the White Man Burden is dead, Europeans have cut back, if not stopped entirely, on distributing poorly (or maliciously) translated Bibles trying to justify the slave trade.

Unfortunately for the Muslims out there, their faith is going to have to be taken to task if this thing is ever going to go away. We are going to have to argue with it and Islam is likely going to look bad as a result. They may have to throw out a few Hadith or alter the Qu'ran but the Christians managed to survive with four books removed from their canon right? And those were not even particularly strong cases for political action of the times.

As for India's history with the "Muslimin" take a gander.

And if you think I am being too hard on the Muslims please remember Muslims are the first victims of the barbaric Sharia government, especially in Pakistan. Most Indian professors rely on Wikipedia because they cannot afford authentic university texts, resort to file sharing because they cannot afford subscriptions to prestigious academic sites and the four richest of them are still worth more than Pakistan's GDP. If this faith is to persevere into the coming millennium the religion of submission is going to have to submit to reform.

...

I'll put this in the nicest of ways and say that I think your picture of events seems kind of one-sided.

Tom: It would be fine if it wasn't for... context.

Well do not be nice, be mean because I do not understand what you are saying. Be respectful and please feel free to point out where I was not but feel free to be mean to Cider here, just in this topic. There may even be a reason why I am being one sided in certain areas.

There's an Arab Spring topic here if you're interested in in-depth input.

Okay and it is fifteen hundred pages long. Have I asked anything addressed there? That seems to be commenting on events as they happen, this topic is declaring the whole thing or at least majority of the spring a humanist failure and further argues it was probably doomed to be from beginning.

Agree disagree, comments? Got some? My reasoning for why I feel the way I do? Agree, disagree, have your own opinion, comments?

What? That topic is a general discussion about the Arab Spring. It's not just a news dump; if you have a serious analysis of the events, it's welcome there.

And you don't have to read all 623 pages. You can just start from the last page or two and post your response there.

So you have nothing to say on this topic, has it all been addressed there? Well fine, maybe I will go elsewhere.