LGBTQ+ Rights and Religion

I find it ironic that you blanket generalize all Catholics as uber conservative (They'd be in the Charismatic category though I resent that fact that we're considered a watered down Pentacostal rather than Pentacostals contrating our beliefs) when I just spent the last half hour explaining that Catholics are not forced to abide by the churches dogma and a significant portion do not.

edited 7th May '13 1:10:21 PM by RhymeBeat

The Crystal Caverns A bird's gotta sing.

Who said all Catholics were ultra-conservative? Or even just plain vanilla conservative?

It was an honor

@Ninety: Dominionism is the term that's applied to denominations that are pushing for Christian theocracy, and/or the breakdown of Separation of Church and State.

Not sure if talking to me?

edited 7th May '13 1:14:47 PM by DrunkGirlfriend

"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -Drunkscriblerian

Drunk Girlfriend treated Pentacostal/Charasmatic as an inherent sign of uber conservatives Roman Catholocism in that category.

"Charismatics are members of Catholic, Orthodox and some Protestant denominations, who engage in some spiritual practices associated with Pentecostalism."

So apparently Holy Spirit = Conservatism. Even though the Espiscolpaleons fall under that category because they heavily include the Holy Spirit in their worship.

The Crystal Caverns A bird's gotta sing.

Wait, what? Holy Spirit =/= "spiritual gifts". Unless the Orthodoxy has suddenly started speaking in tongues, being "slain in the spirit", and having prophetic visions, that's not what I'm talking about at all.

I even said that it was the dominionism angle that pushes it into extremism.

edited 7th May '13 1:21:54 PM by DrunkGirlfriend

"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -Drunkscriblerian

I would add "It's okay to wait; it's not okay to have sex if you feel pressured, even if that pressure comes from outside." Peer pressure to have sex is a big issue with adolescents. While sexual feelings are natural, that's between a person and their libido. Telling teens that they're "not real men" or "are only little girls" if they haven't had sex is not okay.

Share it so that people can get into this conversation, 'cause we're not the only ones who think like this.

That's where the "feel good about what you're doing" comes in.

But you're right, and our society has a long way to go on how sex is treated in general.

Which is present in those dominions not universal within them.

You misunderstand how a lot of these dominations see the "gifts of the Holy Spirit." Those are virtues or talents, not miracle working. Probably some sects see it that way, but not Roman Catholiism or most Anglican sects.

The point is the 1/4 statistic applies to a wide group of Christians, and not all of such a wide group could share political beliefs.

The Crystal Caverns A bird's gotta sing.

Er, that's the definition of Pentecostals. Sorry if you don't like it?

"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -Drunkscriblerian

[Citation needed]

We're going nowhere without a shared definition.

And the one thing you did cite disagrees with your definition.

edited 7th May '13 1:38:56 PM by thatonedude

As a part of the "Pentocostal" definition (even then I must note that it say "may"). That study lumped together "Charismatic" Christians too. Which heavily believe in the Holy Spirit as a force that guides humanity not as something that grants you magic powers.

The Crystal Caverns A bird's gotta sing.

Like other forms of evangelical Protestantism, Pentecostalism adheres to the inerrancy of scripture and the necessity of accepting Christ as personal lord and savior. It is distinguished by belief in the baptism with the Holy Spirit as an experience separate from conversion that enables a Christian to live a Holy Spirit–filled and empowered life. This empowerment includes the use of spiritual gifts such as speaking in tongues and divine healing—two other defining characteristics of Pentecostalism.

Happy?

Because it's similar enough that it's hard to tell them apart sometimes.

"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -Drunkscriblerian

Okay then, I may have misinterpreted your meaning.

That said, what does this have to do with the subject of the thread?

edited 7th May '13 1:43:50 PM by thatonedude

What does a discussion of religious subsets have to do with a thread about homosexuality and religion? I haven't the foggiest notion.

edited 7th May '13 1:46:20 PM by DrunkGirlfriend

"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -Drunkscriblerian

OK then. The study is even more flawed by counting Catholocism as Charismatic as opposed to a denomination that contains Charismatics. It sounds like this is a particular outlook on one's faith rather than a faith of its own.

Which just highlights the difficulties of making generalizations with such a diverse religion as Christianity.

The Crystal Caverns A bird's gotta sing.

Oh yes, religion definitely, but nothing about homosexuals.

edited 7th May '13 1:46:20 PM by thatonedude

Okay, I give up. There's no arguing facts with apologetics.

"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -Drunkscriblerian

if you actually cited something relevant, I could analyze that.

edited 7th May '13 1:51:55 PM by thatonedude

Have you ever listened to a single Catholic IRL DG? At best they tend to believe miracles happen "extremely rarely".

And the Wikipedia page itself mentions Charasmatics as an offshoot of other Christian sects rather than something that retroactively makes the sect all charismatic. Plus it mentions "the inerrant word of God" which is pretty far from the tradition based Catholocism.

The Crystal Caverns A bird's gotta sing.

The original title of this thread was "Homosexuality Vs. Religion", not "Homosexuality And Religion." That original choice of thread title spoke volumes.

This is important because while no shortage of ink (or keystrokes) is spilled to discuss how religion affects homosexuality (read: how Christianity hinders homosexuality), there needs to be more effort spent in understanding exactly what we even mean by religion.

As we've seen, people don't even agree on what makes a Pentecostal or what the Bible means when it condemns homosexuality, if at all. It stands to reason that if our definition of our so called 'adversary' is so wrong, how can we even properly oppose them??

Should we even be opposing them?

edited 7th May '13 1:53:11 PM by TheStarshipMaxima

It was an honor

Your post seems to assume everyone here is on the same side.

I'm just trying to dispel stereotypes, hopefully of all groups involved.

edited 7th May '13 1:57:03 PM by thatonedude

Everyone here on the same side?? Hell, it seems the more two tropers fit in the same category the more they'll argue.

I mean, this discussion of religions belief and definition is necessary if we are truly going to understand the question of 'homosexuality and religion.'

It was an honor

I am however, of the belief that there can never be a consensus because people can't be lumped into groups so easily.

Essentially, What I've been trying to point was that this is more of an individual scale thing than a group scale thing.

Don't ever change, Robertson. Keep being a detriment to your anti-LGBT lobby.

In what is most certianlly not related news, a gay couple is beaten by basketball fans in New York.

There's a rant here about hate breading hate, and a culture that allows a justification for violence against a group for no other reason then being against your religious beliefs. But it would be redundant at this point.

"You are never taller then when standing up for yourself"