Manga/Dragon Ball

The entire Saiyan race is rolling in their graves.

Your Prince of all Saiyans ladies and Gentlemen. This is the person Vegeta's father died trying to rescue.

To be fair the movie had an insane Godzilla Threshold. Vegeta did what he had to, to save the world. That makes me appreciate Vegeta more if anything, because he realized that weighing against your pride against the fate of the world is not a good thing to do. If this was any version of Vegeta prior to the Buu Arc, he would have just let Beerus remain agitated and eventually destroy the world because... "Fuck this! I'm price of all Saiyans. The safety world ain't worth me throwing away my pride!"

edited 17th Jul '14 8:05:48 PM by FireShadow

Toriyama saying more things

As usual with Toriyama's exposition, there's a major retcon and bit of interesting information which opens to the door to a lot of unique concepts.

The recton: Babidi is not Bibidi's son. Babidi is Bibidi's doppelganger

The interesting information: There are many different types of Fusion and the kind Goku learned is the one for increasing battle power.

As Mr Satan wife is Miguel. Which is Toriyama trolling at his best because not only is the name Miguel originated from "God-like" which obviously goes against the Devil-theme naming of Mr Satan's family, but Miguel is mostly a boys name. Only Toriyama can come with this sort of stuff.

edited 17th Jul '14 6:50:07 PM by FireShadow

Wasn't all that posted before though?

Well, whatever the case, what is with Toriyama suddenly giving out all this new info (and often outright ret-conning previous info) for the series?

I mean, what the hell?

Just double checked posts made over the last day or two, and nope, this information was not posted, so you could say this one slipped under the radar. I mean this was posted by Kanzenshuu on the 16th, so I don't know how no one knew about this until now.

And as far as Toriyama giving out information which retcons previous facts, it can attributed to three things:

• Toriyama not having great memory
• Being asked on the spot to come up with information on Dragon Ball he had never thought about prior
• Toriyama just trolling for the sake of it and not giving a fuck

edited 17th Jul '14 7:54:53 PM by FireShadow

The man didn't even have that great of a memory when he was writing this; I doubt it's gotten any better with age.

Well shucks, you got me there. Funny. Vegeta really does make this film, doesn't he? Stands up for Bulma, and stands up for the entire human race while Goku does, what, ditches his family while they're all at a birthday party so that he can train with King Kai?

...GAAARRRAAHHH.

edited 17th Jul '14 7:40:38 PM by FOFD

What's the Kazekage got to do with this?

Well Goku was trying to come with a strategy of defeating Beerus. I mean wouldn't you want to try to come up with a strategy if you were a Super Saiyan 3 that just got effortlessly defeated?

And in the end Goku didn't even win. He got his ass kicked in the movie twice, while in the second occasion he put up more of a fight, he still lost, and hell, he flat out pulled a Cell Games and gave up, realizing he had no chance of winning. But Beerus respected him for knowing his limit and accepting when he was beaten. And if that didn't happen there would be very chance that Beerus would have blown up Earth. But when Goku gave up, Beerus realized that Earth not only has genuinely good fighters but genuinely good people.

Aren't biological doppelgangers of yourself essentially your child?

edited 17th Jul '14 9:22:16 PM by Rinsankajugin

More like your clone.

Which would be more like your sibling than offspring.

edited 17th Jul '14 9:26:57 PM by BaconManiac5000

@Shlugo But the Majin thing just drew out his hidden power, after that and for the rest of the arc they're dead even in Super Saiyan 2.

I'm on Namek. Gotta love Freezer's casual evilness. He murders 'em dead, as if it was his morning routine.

Question...Reading the manga, and it really doesn't live up to its status as "Drag-on Ball", since since the beginning, things have been pretty fast paced. Do things become as dragging in Namek as the jokes lead me to believe?

Nope. It got that name and reputation because of the anime.

Ah...it's a shame, since the anime did do some stuff better than the manga, from what I saw.

Chi chi getting whooped vs Goku was done a lot better. Goku comes clean about his slip up, which was hilarious, yet sticks to his promise anyway, which is adorable.

There's also the Dead Z Fighters VS the Ginyu. That might be The biggest contribution the Z Fighters made.

edited 18th Jul '14 4:52:29 AM by Mrsunshinesprinkles

No, that's definitely an example of the anime doing worse. First of all they're not contributing in any way whatsoever - the Ginyu are only there because they were allowed to be there so they can lose. Secondly it's just bullshit that tops Dragon Ball's flimliest power ups with the humans outdoing basically every other character's progression rate given that they've been there six damn days.

First of all, it was entertaining, and didn't hurt the story whatsoever.

Secondly, the humans started with power levels roughly 5 times higher than Goku did when they began training on King Kai's planet. Although the short timespan it took for them to reach the level they did is rather iffy, it makes sense that they would ultimately end up significantly stronger than Goku's Saiyan Saga power level.

Throw the Dog a Bone for God's sake. It's not as though any of them so much as did mortal damage to their respective opponents...

That is true.

I do wonder why they were all stronger than Goku was when he trained with Kami when they only trained for a year, and her trained for three?

I do think that them winning is a little odd, unless they were more used to being dead or something.

I admit, even if it is bullshit, I don't care. Like it was said above, those guys needed a bone thrown to them.

Especially You know who.

...Chiaotzu?

Anyway, I'm on team b here. Logic be damned, great to see them actually hurt decently strong not Saibaman things.

It's a needless distraction that contributes nothing to the story.

• It contributes nothing towards the Ginyu arc because the Ginyus are already dead and were only involved in this to begin with because King Kai brought them there.
• It contributes nothing to the story of the humans' training because they've only been there six days and they learn absolutely nothing in their time, coming away from the Kai training empty-handed.
• It doesn't even contribute anything to the humans' advancement as fighters, setting them up for their next challenges in the real story, because none of these characters will ever contribute anything in combat again, save for Tien's occasional five-second "Stall a villain infinitely stronger than me for five seconds while more important characters accomplish things!" moments.

It's empty filler starring characters who have lost all relevance to the plot, accomplishing nothing and advancing nobody's character or story in any way.

I can be okay with filler when it helps advance someone's character or story, fleshes out characterization, addresses old plot threads and characters that have been dropped, etc. When it contributes something of substance to the story in some way.

This doesn't. This is just bad. All it does is establish that they may be down and out right now, but they're still FIGHTERS, they still have value and are capable and dangerous combatants who can pull their weight in the field.

But they're not. They haven't been for a long time, and they never will be again. The story has long since left them behind, and trying to suggest that they're strong enough to defeat the Ginyu Force just makes it all the more disappointing when the actual plot picks back up and they return to being useless.

edited 18th Jul '14 10:05:40 AM by TobiasDrake

Add "...but are nonetheless fun to watch in a decent action sequence, for once" after "characters who have lost all relevance to the plot," and you get the appeal. I only started watching DBZ as a kid because I thought the Ginyu Squad looked cool, and it was a real treat seeing them return after their relatively short stint, even if they got their asses kicked (with a little more effort this time).

EDIT: The Ginyu Force were still miles behind Dr. Gero, as to why the human fighters were still useless after the arc... however, the training could explain how they were able to see the Androids' motions, when Vegeta, Gohan and Krillin were failing to keep up with those of Frieza .

edited 18th Jul '14 10:19:08 AM by DoctorDiabolical

Fair enough.

The official tagline of Battle Of Gods 2/Toriyama's Crazy Cool Random Fantasies: The Whole Universe Has Been Waiting. A Godly Dimension of Battle Begins.... That's certainly a mouthful.

The "Future Warrior" of Dragon Ball Xeneoverse going Super Saiyan. The scan also hints to free roaming despite DIMPS claiming there wouldn't be in a recent interview.

Some dubbed Battle Of Gods footage...

I like how every time Z fighters tried something the audience was cheering.... only for nothing to work.