German Politics Thread

People age 14 or older (the age of consent for sex between minors) can get morning after pills without an prescription in every pharmacy.

Both are pretty easy to obtain. For the anti-baby pill you simply need a receipt from your doctor, but that is very easy to obtain...in fact, you have nearly defend yourself against getting it if you don't want to. The morning after pill you can simply get from an apothecary, though pharmacists are not allowed to advertise the option.

That is another reason why I don't think that we need a loose abortion law, there are countless options to prevent a pregnancy and all of them are freely available since HIV became a thing. "Kondome schützen, gib AIDS keine chance" (Condoms protect, don't give Aids a chance) is an ongoing campaign.

Since it fits: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1EtCcb2NOI

Just to get an idea how Germany treats protection. The spot is such a classic, it got a remake:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-X2_lPyINaA

edited 19th Mar '17 2:53:23 PM by Swanpride

Age of consent between minors?

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman

As in: If two 14-year olds have (consentual) sex with each other, we don't prosecute either of them.

edited 19th Mar '17 2:53:59 PM by DrunkenNordmann

Welcome to Estalia, gentlemen.

some of europe has "banded" Ao C laws -that is, below a certain age, it is illegal for people significantly older than you to sleep with you, but perfectly legal to bang people your own age. This is because having a high age of consent criminalizes far to much perfectly normal behavior, - far more people loose their virginity before 18 than after, but it is also considered very bad for adults to to have relations with teens because those are more or less always predatory. There is still always an absolute "never okay" age of consent, but it's usually 15 or thereabouts.

edited 19th Mar '17 3:00:31 PM by Izeinsummer

See, in Switzerland there is no "never OK" rule. There is a rule about people over 3 years older having sexual intercourse with people under 16 and that is called "16". Italy has a similar rule but with 14 instead of 16. Austria and Germany also say "14" but I don't recall if it means the same thing as in the other two.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman

Apparently in Germany that age of consent extends to sex with majors, excluding tutors and others with power over the kid, but a major having sex with a minor is held to a much higher standard legally than otherwise, and punishments for misbehavior are draconian. Or so I heard.

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.

Well, one shouldn't forget that in Germany, 14 is an important age. 14 year olds are allowed to have sex and they can light alcohol with the permission of their parents. 16 year olds are allowed to marry if their parents permit, and they are allowed to drink alcohol. 18 year olds have nearly all the rights adults have, though they can still be tried as underage under certain circumstances.

"Mom, dad! Today I'm throwing my first Molotov cocktail!" *FWOOSH*

"WE ARE SO PROUD OF YOU!"

Was mir au die Nerfen geht, sind die stoltzen Eltern...

I know!

edited 19th Mar '17 3:22:14 PM by TheHandle

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.

sorry, I naturally meant they can DRINK light alcohol

Obligatory

So, about that question in my last post...

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman

That was a question?

If I understood it right we have our age of consent work like this:

14: Consensual sex between people age 14-20 (technically sex with 21+ people is allowed but the exploitation of mental immaturity can be easily assumed.)

16: Sex with anyone 14+ , unless the major holds authority over the minor (like a teacher or an Non-blood-related guardian)

18: You count as major and can do it with anyone 14+

21: You can no longer have sex with people under 16.(unless the 14 year old is deemed mentally mature enough)

So yeah, on one hand factoring in mental maturity is a good thing to avoid exploitations of minors that passed the age of consent. But on the other hand it kinda adds ambiguity to the whole subject. Technically a 14 years old and a 21+ years old can have sex but then the 14 year old can always decide that they have been exploited (and most Germans would still find this incredibly creepy)

...That is way more complicated than it ought to be, IMHO. But at least it's not different in different parts of the country, right? That's what it's like in the USA (some states have different ages of consent).

edited 20th Mar '17 3:11:22 AM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised

It is the same for all of Germany.

Oy. I remember that German law on the subject was complex but not that it was this complex. Yes, I am fairly certain that like in Switzerland AOC is solely a federal matter in Germany. Not like in the US where most states set it at 16 and the larger ones often at 17 or 18 (notably California and Florida, although I am not so sure about CA - that piece of text was rather dense. FL's has also been regularly misused if memory serves). Further a while ago the German government discussed changing it and backed off when they received a mass of complaints about over-criminalization.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman

Germany election: Martin Schulz stakes anti-populist bid Germany election: Martin Schulz stakes anti-populist bid

So, this is the intro I got to the German electoral field. To start off, is like France and the USA's (there's only one good option) or the Netherlands (there's one really bad option—support anyone else)?
Also, am I reading this right in that much of the energy in Germany is going into challenging its reactionaries from the left instead of the center?

edited 20th Mar '17 8:47:42 AM by CenturyEye

Look with century eyes... With our backs to the arch And the wreck of our kind We will stare straight ahead For the rest of our lives

Germany looks like it has a few good to okay options, and they will probably form a coalition together (just a question of who leads it) in any case.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.

Yeah, the way it goes atm, we're getting a Grand Coalition again, the only uncertainty in this if (maybe) the SPD is making up enough to actually be the Senior Partner this time around.

Lets wait and see.

"You can reply to this Message!"

Okay, first of all, the election system in Germany is very similar to the Netherlands, just with less parties involved. Because there are less parties, there is always a coalition between two parties. Winner is always either the CDU/CSU (Merkel's party) or the SPD (Schulz's party), but if you vote for someone else your vote is not "lost" even if whoever you voted for doesn't manage the 5% hurdle. Those votes still count in the overall percentage.

Minor parties which have enough support to skip the 5% hurdle are currently Die Linke (the extreme left, or as I like to call it, SED light), Die Grünen (the Greens, which are currently in the process to shift from the more leftist to the more moderate fraction within the party), Die FDP (the liberals, not to confuse with neo-liberals. There thing is currently mostly stuff like privacy rights, internet security aso. Due to infighting they fell out of the parliament during the last election, but they should make a come-back this time around), and the Af D (which will most likely skip the hurdle for the first time).

Nobody will go in coalition with the Af D (currently between 8 and 10 percent), so we can more or less forget about them.

The most likely outcome is a coalition between CDU/CSU and SPD, which is pretty much the same government we have now, the question is only if Merkel and Schulz will be chancellor.

There is a slim possibility that SPD/Die Linke and Die Grünen get enough votes together to form a so called "Linksbündnis" an entirely leftist coalition. Which would be a catastrophe in my honest opinion. Die Linke is very anti-European and I would loose a lot of respect for the SPD if they go in coalition with those fanatics.

And there is a very, very slim and very unlikely possibility that CDU/CSU, FDP and Die Grünen go together, but even if they get enough votes, Die Grünen would most likely not agree to this particular set-up.

So...it is less that there are only bad options, it is more that we currently have the same options every year, and some Germans simply would like to see a change in the government.

edited 20th Mar '17 9:28:02 AM by Swanpride

Aren't they basically like US libertarians? I'd rather have Die Linke in Germany's government than these clowns.

The FDP is classical liberal, ie pro-free market but also pro-personal freedoms and civil liberties. In fact their leader for a long time was the first openly gay man on the big political theater.

But the party sort of imploded the last election.

edited 20th Mar '17 9:40:33 AM by 3of4

"You can reply to this Message!"

No. The FDP is very economy-oriented, but like the CDU, it stands for a social economy. They also want less bureaucracy and an easier tax law. And the liberal in this case means exactly that, liberal towards everyone, with an emphasis on Civil Rights issues, though in a more realistic manner than the leftist parties usually are. Overall, the FDP is a little bit too open (they like TTIP) for my taste, but I wouldn't dismiss the idea of the party out hand. Plus, the FDP has been part of the government multiple times already, and it has usually done good work, no matter if it worked with the CDU or the SPD. (In a way, the FDP is a mix of both parties).

Die Linke is extremely anti-European and extremely pro-Russia. It is also one of those parties which want to give money to everyone, without really considering where the money is supposed to come from. They especially like to take it from the Mittelstand.

edited 20th Mar '17 9:47:57 AM by Swanpride

I wish the Dutch Liberals (VVD) had imploded the same way rather than the Labour party (Pvd A). Because, honestly, everything Labour's been blamed for is, at it's core, the Liberals' fault. And yeah, Labour pretty much compromised most of its principles to join the government, but in their defence the only other option was not joining the coalition and thus forcing the Liberals to court the Far-Right Populist (PVV) again. (Yes, Populist, singular. Wilders is the only official member of his party, all the other people involved get no vote on party policy).

edited 20th Mar '17 9:54:56 AM by Robrecht

Angry gets shit done.

Ugh yeah, Westerwelle the anti welfare state douche. I just got the impression of them as more like US libertarians, flat tax advocacy and all, but you make them sound more like the Swiss FDP if not better.