Why do we form societies?

That was mine living text is somethign Idonotageree with because it completley destorys meaning.

Not entirely true. Too strict a reading of the Irish Constitution for example, would mean a complete ban on abortions in all cases, including any dissemination of information and the possibility of preventing anyone travelling for an abortion. The Constitution was written in 1937, and times have changed.

To see why this "Ultra-strict" reading is a bad idea; I'd suggest Googling "The X Case in Ireland".

Are "opression, bigotry, ineqauality, et cetera" a worse choice compared to a small overall population of humans, constantly living in fear of predators, just barely surviving? Plus, no society meas no division o labor, and everybody would be doing the same thing (i.e. gathering food for themselves), which feels like terribly underused potential.

Few things- The problem with the idea of Starting My Own is that larger companies will be able to crush their competition by virtue of being larger. Say I'm the only Troper in town, and already have $1,000,000, saved up from my Troping business, and you want to start your own Troping company. You're able to make a profit at the current market prices and still run your business. I don't like that there's someone else in town Troping, taking away my business, so what do I do? I undercut you and start selling my Tropes for cheaper. Even if I'm Troping at a loss, I already have money, so if it gets to the point where we're both losing money, I can stay in business longer, and once your Trope company goes bankrupt, I can jack the prices back up, because I've got a monopoly again.

Now, replace "Tropes" with something people need to survive, like "insulin" or "food". That's why Gov't intervention is sometimes necessary. What if after I ran you out of business, I jacked up my prices to double what they were before you were in town? Or triple? People have to buy it, so they're still going to.

I'm also seeing a a false dichotomy- It's not "Either people sell their goods at the prices they want" or "I'm forced to buy it at gunpoint"

And I'm going to join the chorus and say that you're purposely seeing nothing but the bad and ignoring all you get from society. Electricity, Water, Education, Medical help, hell, in the US, the ability to voice your disagreement with the government and not get dragged out into the street and shot.

Pretty much the point I was making with monopoly markets and inelastic goods, but the illustration's a good idea, I should've thought of that.

Sorry for being such an unreasonable prick I’ve been dealing with mold and headaches for the past while and it's clouding my thinking alot. Just sorry about that.

Amendment: God I need a new keyboard.

edited 15th Apr '11 9:43:42 AM by tnu1138

edited 25th Nov '12 3:52:18 PM by JosefBugman

Not at all. Everyone's entitled to freak out sometime and the fact you did it about the state of society rather than "Why don't girls like meeeee?!" is kind of interesting.

Also, Josef's right. We're not angry with you, or anything. Just pointing out flaws.

edited 15th Apr '11 9:39:55 AM by DanEile

i've been in a stable relatinship for the past six years I have no grounds tocomplain about that.

Good for you then.

I just meant I found your choice of topic refreshing.

Like I said very sorry I was a bit ofa prick because i've been kind ofout of it and unstable and in a horrid mood.

I'm sorry to hear that, then. I hope I wasn't too aggressive in trying to make my points.

Don't worry aboutit man. meh I just got int o a somewhat okay mood because Usht showed up.

I'd have to say it's more like people can't exist without oppression, bigotry, inequality, et cetera. There's plenty of good reasons for that-hardwired for greed, limited resources, fear, etc.

That's no reason to divorce yourself from the whole race though, much the same way that there's no reason to divorce yourself from a perfectly good government with some flaws.

Also, slippery slope fallacy is a fallacy for a reason. I know it's just how you feel but...it's not exactly a belief that corresponds with the real world. It almost sounds like a phobia: i.e. an irrational fear.

The trick with irrational fears is to realize they are irrational, and don't make any sense.

Then you try to reduce them to a level that actually makes sense.

"I'd have to say it's more like people can't exist without oppression, bigotry, inequality, et cetera. There's plenty of good reasons for that-hardwired for greed, limited resources, fear, etc.

That's no reason to divorce yourself from the whole race though, much the same way that there's no reason to divorce yourself from a perfectly good government with some flaws."

It's not about perfection. I don't think they're worried about us not being "perfect" gods. Yes, we have to deal with existing. Yes, it's probably healthier to accept the way things fundamentally are. But because the so-called "imperfections" are so devastatingly horrific, this is hard.

edited 15th Apr '11 3:58:35 PM by LoveHappiness

Well, nobody said life was easy.

But I'd rather you, or anyone else for that matter, didn't give up.

Why?

Because it would make other people feel bad. The exact same sort of feel bad caused by all those other horrible realities you don't like. Giving up would only make the world worse.

I agree. Even if that wasn't true, there's this [1].