New crowner 01/06/12: Heroic Sociopath

SUPER UBER ULTRA BUMP. Requesting a clock to get this done.

Here is the sandbox of the new Heroic Sociopath disambiguation page.

Here is the sandbox of the Played for Laughs version.

Here is the sandbox of the Played for Drama version.

edited 22nd Sep '11 8:07:27 PM by Discar

We should do a rename crowner on the second trope; I think Comedic Heroic Sociopath would work better than Heroic Comedic Sociopath.

The definitions also sound too much like Type IV and Type V Anti Heroes, which are both in YKTTW at the moment as seperate tropes. The definitions don't sound exactly the same, but they can be misleading to someone that isn't as familiar with the subtle distinctions between them.

Here are the YKTTWs for Type IV and Type V, if anyone's interested.

edited 22nd Sep '11 8:21:29 PM by tropetown

None of the names (except the disambig, obviously) are final. I think they work, but if people disagree we can do more crowners.

And I whole-heartedly agree that Sociopathic Hero (and to a lesser extent, Heroic Comedic Sociopath) isn't reasonably different from Type IV/Type V Anti-Hero, but that option got voted down. I guess they would be supertropes to both of these. Would that work?

I don't think so; I know they are different; a Sociopathic Hero, for example, could either be a Type IV or a Type V, depending on his motivation.

• Type IV Sociopathic Hero: Truly fighting for a heroic cause, but enjoys the mayhem he causes, to the distress of his teammates.

• Type V Sociopathic Hero: Only fighting for the heroic cause for the opportunity to cause mayhem (or for a completely unrelated goal altogether), to the distress of his teammates.

I don't know what to call it, exactly; perhaps these are just one of those tropes that will remain subtly different, like Knight Templar and Well-Intentioned Extremist.

On another note, I think Sociopathic Hero is a perfect name. I'm a little iffy on the other one, though.

EDIT: I see what you mean by supertropes. Yes, you're absolutely correct.

edited 22nd Sep '11 8:49:57 PM by tropetown

Bump again. Is there anyone against making Heroic Comedic Sociopath and Sociopathic Hero both subtropes of the currently in YKTTW tropes Unscrupulous Hero and Hero In Name Only?

Also, should these be taken to YKTTW or just launched?

Just launch it. Based on the responses we've been getting here, people are overwhelmingly in favor of a split, but don't seem to care enough to contribute to the creation of the tropes. If we YKTTW them, chances are that it would take forever for the new tropes to go anywhere.

I'd be careful about making them subtropes; I can see what you meant when you said that, but since Sociopathic Heroes and Heroic Comedic Sociopaths can be either Type IV or Type V, it might cause confusion.

edited 25th Sep '11 7:40:13 PM by tropetown

What's holding up the show on this thing?

Also I'm all for naming the Heroic Comedic Sociopath trope Lovable Psycho.

edited 25th Oct '11 3:52:47 PM by NoirGrimoir

I was waiting for the anti-hero tropes to be launched. Did that happen?

And Lovable Psycho doesn't imply the heroic part, unfortunately.

They don't appear to have been.

Unless the point is that the characters are the protagonist (and I don't see why we should limit it to that), then I don't think the trope really requires that the character be heroic. They just do really bad things without remorse and we love them anyway, usually because they are funny. Like the Lovable Rogue, who we like because he's charming despite being amoral.

Hm... I actually like Lovable Psycho as a name. I don't think there's any point waiting for the Anti-Hero tropes; they've been in YKTTW for months now, with no progress.

Have they? I don't see them at all when I search. I think no one ever did anything with them at all.

I also like Lovable Psycho, and favor an alt-titles crowner for the Played for Laughs version.

I think Sociopathic Hero (the non-comedic version) has pretty universal approval, though.

They never got launched, but they're still in YKTTW... it's been ages, though, so I don't think they're getting launched any time soon.

If someone finds me a link for them I'll see what I can do about it.

I linked Type IV and Type V higher up on this page. I'll try and find Type III in a sec.

EDIT: Here it is.

edited 25th Oct '11 5:36:35 PM by tropetown

Three is almost launched as Pragmatic Hero. Four and Five are still getting updates and discussion.

Well, let's start trying to figure out alt-titles for the two new tropes. Here is the crowner for the Played for Laughs version.

Hooked.

Bump for more votes.

While Lovable Psycho is certainly the more catchy name, I think it may lead to confusion. There isn't a strong connotation of either playing it for laughs or being on the side of the good guys.

That makes no sense, since the definition for the trope is "Sociopath is Played for Laughs and on the side of good".

edited 7th Dec '11 5:12:55 PM by NoirGrimoir

She means the name Lovable Psycho doesn't suggest that, though I don't really agree.

I see. Sorry.

I think it does in the sense that it's a sociopath character portrayed with the same implications as immoral characters/criminals are in the trope Lovable Rogue.

edited 7th Dec '11 7:08:38 PM by NoirGrimoir

Calling crowner for Heroic Comedic Sociopath.

So...should I just launch the sandboxes, or is there still some debate on the Sociopathic Hero name?