Game of Thrones [Potential Book Spoilers]

I don't think there's anything unusual of a person crying about the prospect of being burned alive and being eaten by a dragon. :V

It kinda reaffirmed my stance that Daenerys isn't going to sit the Iron Throne.

You're too cynical. But better to be overly cynical than overly optimistic.

edited 10th May '15 9:52:41 PM by MadSkillz

I just realized something.

Daenerys: You will marry me.

Hizdahr Zo Lo Loraq: I don't want to marry you. You crucified my father.

Daenerys: I could've burned him alive and fed him to my dragons but I gave him a good, clean death.

Hizdahr: I hate you.

Daenerys: My brother told me I never should lay a finger on my betrothed. Daario Naharis.

-Daario steps up and double slaps him with his armored fist-

In this show, Cynical is the new normal.

I'd say it keep you alive, but that would be a lie.

There really is no way not to be killed in Game Of Thrones. You can die for sneezing the wrong way.

Grammar Stannazis.

I think Daenerys missed a spot check here. The fact that all the other masters were kneeling and watching Hizdahr as if they were asking for his opinion. Of course it easier to see when you know where to look, but I found the scene rather well done.

Also, Jorah hiding the greyscale is kind of proof that they will drop Aegon completely, which is not the worst news I heard this week.

edited 11th May '15 2:45:25 AM by Julep

Now I see how they're fitting things together.

Valyria becomes Chroyane so that the show can keep the Mists of Chroyane sequence, and then Jorah brings greyscale to Meereen rather than Meereen suffering from the pale mare (cholera or dysentery). That keeps events connected and fairly straightforward. I agree with the choices, because the Mists of Chroyane sequence in the books was impressive and something I'd hoped we could see in the show but thought would be absent given the abbreviation of Tyrion's journey. This was a good way to square the circle, even though it diminishes Old Valyria somewhat compared to its mystery and terror in the books.

Meanwhile, in the North, they've combined Jon making an agreement with the Wildlings with the Hardhome part of the story, which prevents things from getting repetetive. It also makes Jon's decision more contentious, because in the books the Widlings led by Tormund were just outside the Wall when he made the deal with them, so it was a clear choice between negotiation and needing to fight again. The Wildlings in Hardhome pose no immediate threat, so it's a more foresighted but also more easily-opposed decision.

Dany's storyline, on the other hand, is not going so well, unless they're trying to make her continual inconsistencies and changes of mind an indicator of Targaryen madness. She seems less stable and more wavering than Dany in the books. I'm not clear yet whether that's unintentional and poor writing; whether it's a deliberate change from the books; or whether it's an indicator of what's to come for Dany's storyline in future books, since the show-makers know the broad strokes of the ending.

Also, interestingly, this entire episode was variations on A Dance With Dragons material - all the North and Essos, absolutely nothing from King's Landing.

I was really floored with how stupid killing the master was. Most notably, it was just a couple episodes after executing her friend and adviser for killing a known Son of the Harpy without trial and dealing with the fallout for that. Not to mention last season killing the masters at random led to a minor My God, What Have I Done? moment when she realized the masters weren't all awful.

... and so she kills a master at random without any pretense of fairness. Way to undo all that, Dany. And then caves to the masters' demand anyway.

With Barristan dead, she no longer has anybody from Westeros to advise her.

I think that both in the series and in the books, they're doing a good job showing us that Dany made a mistake staying in Meereen. You can't just take over a foreign city, being totally ignorant of its customs and laws, and expect them to accept you as their leader, even if you have an army and dragons.

Sure, she fancies herself a queen, but if you think about it, has anything she's done actually improved the lives of anybody? She doesn't know how to rule, and ruling isn't exactly the kind of skill you just pick up on the fly.

Link here for more.

I give Dany a lot of flack but she did end slavery. Nominally in some places but she did.

I don't remember, did Dany ever find out why Mormont is in exile?

I'm pretty sure Dany thinks that was just a cover for him to spy on her at this point.

edited 12th May '15 12:22:35 PM by Kostya

Jorah gave some of his backstory to her in the Dothraki Sea way back when

I ctrl+fed through a perfectly legitimate ebook aGoT and found

Answer to a question about whether Book!Dany knew why Jorah was banished.

In one of Dany's early chapters in A Clash Of Kings (the second book) Jorah tells Dany the whole long story of his banishment (he married a young, beautiful, foolish wife, she wanted luxuries he couldn't provide, he increasingly went into debt, and he eventually sold poachers into slavery as a way of getting money. Ned Stark banished him for selling people into slavery, and then his wife left him for another man.)

Dany asks him what his wife looked like, and he says she looked a little like her. This is when Dany (in the books) cops to the fact that he's in love with her.

edited 12th May '15 4:43:28 PM by Galadriel

IRC Ned didn't banish him, he ran from justice.

Holy shit, that dinner scene with the Boltons. I loved Roose's faint-but-growing irritation then checkmating Ramsay in a few words. Even Sansa smiled. Plus, damn you Iwan Rheon. I shouldn't have laughed so hard at "that was getting tense."

edited 14th May '15 8:42:32 AM by Phoenixflame

Fat Walda seems like a sweet lady. I'm sure that nothing horrible will happen to her at all.

Oh man, Barristan's actor seems kinda pissed still.◊

I don't blame him. There wasn't really a point in killing him.

edited 14th May '15 8:01:15 PM by Kostya

I partially disagree. Dany's council is getting ungainly. With Tyrion and Jorah on the way and Hizdahr probably having more screentime, Barry's departure means one less character to write for. Also, it gets around the narrative problem of why Barry would let Jorah and Tyrion anywhere near Dany, let alone in a position to advise her.

But, I understand why Barristan fans are sad. I never cared much about the character so I'm biased.

I'm just hoping the Sand Snakes get cooler. Their introduction was pretty tepid.

edited 15th May '15 12:17:37 AM by Phoenixflame

What writing? They treated him as wallpaper for the most part. He might as well not even have been in the show.

Besides you can write around that. Just have him be wounded and be in bed for when Tyrion and Jorah meet up with Daenerys.

I can tell you now though that Hizdahr's going to bite it this season too so she'll actually have one less person on her council than she did last season.

Although I'm less sad about Barristan's departure than over how it was directed and the shape his death took.

But then again I love Barristan so I'm biased as well.

edited 15th May '15 12:47:05 AM by MadSkillz

See, I wanted to love Barry, but the show didn't give me much of a chance. After his badass entrance (and then looking up who he was), he pretty much just... was there, usually ignored by Dany. Plotwise... the only thing of importance I can think of him doing is getting Jorah reexiled.

But I do understand the value of his death. Dany needed to get taken down a peg (or several). Though this seemed to have the opposite effect and wound up making her smugger, so... yeah.

But even so, and even though he was a bit of a One-Man Army, the circumstances of his death bothered me. Taken out by nameless, faceless goons (not even soldiers) and dying off-screen between episodes? Sad. But as I've said before, the inexplicable effectiveness of the Sons of the Harpy really sticks in my craw.

Yeah, the amount of plot armour in this show is beginning to grate. First, it was shirtless Ramsay with knives fighting off a load of heavily armoured axemen, now a group of people in robes and masks can kill off a battalion of more-or-less hoplites who are meant to be the most single-minded killers in Essos.

Soldiers, not killers.

On a battlefield, they could make short work of any opponent, on Essos or Westeros. Here, it is a guerilla war they have to fight, and they do not know the field as well as their opponents. It is logical to see them being beaten (and even with this disadvantage, I am pretty sure we saw more Harpies dying than we saw Unsullied).

A small batallion of Unsullied would annihilate any of the guerilleros we encounter in the show - the Brotherhood, the Brave Companions, Gregor's men, etc... - if they fought in an open field. So far, Dany used them as a hammer, and it worked, but now she needs a more subtle tool to deal with her enemies (like Daario's men).

Plus, if Soldier = Killer, then the US Army would never have had any trouble in the Middle-East.