Skullgirls Thread

/old man

Back in my day, we didn't have patches. We had to fight in arcades, which ate up our quarters. And when one of us found something that was "OP", as the hip kids say, we didn't complain, we didn't make them stop, we found a way around it. Kids these days, with their "balance patches" and "DLC" and....

/normal

On a more serious note, what about Hornet Bomber made it so good against "scrubs"?

edited 21st May '12 7:29:18 PM by MetaSkipper

Artificial Intelligence is no match for Natural Stupidity.

Learning to deal with a problem doesn't make it any less of a problem - that's why game balance is so finicky, you have to discern between things that are actual issues, even if someone can learn to live with it, and challenging things that are actually beneficial and necessary to a general progression of skill.

To one extent you can't always rely on the most skilled players for advice on game balance, because they often don't perceive issues in a totally open light - the issue of "you should just deal with it and if you can't well it's your fault" is too prevalent there. It's the same problem, though to the opposite extreme with less skilled players - who will see more things things as debilitating problems than there actually are: the "this game is broken raaargh!" when it's not is common there.

That's another problem. You can't always listen to the players, and have to use discretion to decide what should and shouldn't be listened to. I'm vaguely interested as to where the creators of this game's discretion took them.

But in general, when it comes to fighting games I've run into situations where there were serious issues that hardcore players insisted were just things people should just deal with to not take that sort of talk with a grain of salt.

edited 21st May '12 7:31:34 PM by KnownUnknown

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.

Apparently, Double's near untouchable while she's flying through the air, and it hits a bunch of times. However, I don't consider that to be nearly the most enraging thing Double can do (goddamned frame-perfect Bandwagon)

I have a message from another time...

I'd assume it's a block/hitstun issue, coupled with the invincibility and large hitbox which means you can't counter it - as an assist it does admittedly seems fairly powerful.

If you play Mv C 3 think Tron Bonne's flamethrower assist, but covering a wider area and keeping the opponent locked in place.

edited 21st May '12 7:40:27 PM by KnownUnknown

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.

It's also a pain to get hit with it at the end of one of Double's combos.

I just hate fighting Double in general. It's hard to gauge her range at any given moment, due to her shapeshifting, and that Bandwagon is always on tap.

I have a message from another time...

The extra unintentional invincibility frames made it a bit difficult to punish the conventional ways. Course there were other ways of getting around it, like push blocking or super jumping over it. And people who spam the move are incredibly predictable, and can be punished accordingly. Peacock was a very good character to use the Hornet Bomber assist with, making DoubleCock an aggravating strategy, and are why people complain. Honestly, when used on point, Hornet Bomber doesn't draw ire, it's when it's used as an assist.

Some things I've learned are that players will complain about everything, and I mean everything, so you And Hornet Bomber honestly, isn't that hard to deal with. You have to get out of your comfort zone a bit, and think outside the box, something some players are unwilling to do. And honestly, I couldn't care if Hornet Bomber had the extra invincibility frames, but the publishers and MikeZ giving into peer pressure like that doesn't really bode well for the game. I'm okay with balance patches coming out, but let's not go Mortal Kombat 9 with them, and have them come out like very often and stint the game's growth.

edited 21st May '12 7:43:37 PM by Marioguy128

You got some dirt on you. Here's some more!

He did clarify that Hornet Bomber was the only thing in that patch that he didn't personally think needed tweaking, even if some of the changes were also things that were being hollered about, it was coincidence that he also thought they needed to happen.

I watched a bit of it, and he's also now going to fix a bug where Fenrir Dive doesn't hit another Filia if it's used as the Blockbuster Sequel to the last blow of EKG Flatliner.

Also, I think I'd prefer to use BBS instead of DHC, when talking about Skullgirls. I like the "movie" lingo used here.

I have a message from another time...

There's a fine line between "think outside the box" and "totally disrupt gameplay in order to deal with a specific threat." Both can be done well if you know how do deal with it, but one is an organic part of gameplay and the other is a problem.

Blanka forces the former, and is always a welcome if frustrating challenge. Dark Phoenix used to do the latter and got nerfed.

Nerfs to characters who blend the two categories - where innovative thought is helpful to counter but which you don't necessarily require to know the trick to beating them - are also often welcome imo: for example, Sentinel. Nowhere near as bad as people claimed, but irritating enough to merit a nerf.

---

I love the general feel of Skull Girls' atmosphere. "Noir-style" nowadays makes me wary, because often you see people looking like they're trying too hard to embody it rather than actually do so. Not here.

The music is great - they succeeded at doing what Mv C 2 failed hard at. The stages are very interestingly designed. It's just a nice feel.

Also, Peacock being a one woman Fleischer Studios (among others) homage made me grin ear to ear. Still one of my mains.

edited 21st May '12 8:00:39 PM by KnownUnknown

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.

And frankly, Hornet Bomber does not fall into the latter category. There are plenty of ways to deal with it, and it's not something you have to go far out of your way for to learn. (Snapbacks are another example. Players using the Double Assist, generally don't really know how to use her on point. But seriously, comparing it to Dark Phoenix, really?)

I can see why players would have issues with that move, but it's not something that desperately needs to be nerfed. I don't exactly care if the move itself is nerfed, but rather why.

Also, players were crying out for nerfs on like week 1 of the game. I mean, let the game sit out there and grow for a few months, before applying knee-jerk nerfs to it. (And for the record, I do think that sometimes, some things do need to be patched immediately.)

edited 21st May '12 8:14:39 PM by Marioguy128

You got some dirt on you. Here's some more!

Because people whose perception you don't agree with - people you seem to be generalizing, by the way - called for it's alteration?

Anyways, Dark Pheonix was merely the best example of the latter category I could think of (just like Blanka was the best example of the former), and admittedly not the best example due to being an entire character rather than a single move.

Say possible compare to dive-kicks in Street Fighter X Tekken instead.

edited 21st May '12 8:16:17 PM by KnownUnknown

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.

I'd think Auto-Block/tech/Ultimate Defence/etc. gems are closer.

Artificial Intelligence is no match for Natural Stupidity.

This needs to be the voice for Panzerfaust!

http://generalivan.tumblr.com/post/21348183578/panzerfaust-recording-i-did-hope-hes-a-dlc-for

"Everything is so much easier when you have a tank for a hand!"

edited 3rd Jun '12 3:14:34 PM by ROTHY

"It's just like... a series of overlapping curses..." - Flower Knight Dakini

I completely and heartily agree.

Lampshade Hanging: It's a lifestyle.

This game has become the first fighting game I've cared enough about to actually attempt to get good at.

Yeah, the gameplay is really fine tuned, and most of the kinks were ironed out. (Except for lack of movelists, and lack of input display in training, and a bunch of other stuff.)

You got some dirt on you. Here's some more!

Yeah, the fact that I couldn't look up my movelist was the only thing I really didn't like. I hated how I kept losing Peacock's fight against Double because she always opened with that undodgeable lazer thing I still haven't figured out how to do.

Well, some of those will be fixed in the PC port. The movelist, for example.

Anyone know when the story release/patch/whatever it is is coming out? Kinda hard to write a fanfic when you don't have much to go on.

In other news, how 'bout that 3% movement speed?

edited 3rd Jun '12 4:07:23 PM by MetaSkipper

Artificial Intelligence is no match for Natural Stupidity.

Like years later. They'll wait until the roster's big enough for it. Oh, and it takes like one month to make a character apparently. So it'll be awhile.

I voted yes for it. Gameplay could afford to be a bit faster.

You got some dirt on you. Here's some more!

Well. That puts my fic on Valve Time, I suppose.

Artificial Intelligence is no match for Natural Stupidity.

I don't think I like Valentine very much, seeing as how her attack range makes it near impossible for me to beat people who play as her with anyone else.

Courtesy of Alex Ahad

I love this team.

So. Let's all pause for a moment to smell what the Rock was, is, and forever will be... cooking.—Cave Johnson

Woah, never knew Double can do THAT much chip damage!!

edited 4th Jun '12 2:39:07 PM by SeveredKhan

That is absurd.

So. Let's all pause for a moment to smell what the Rock was, is, and forever will be... cooking.—Cave Johnson

Personally I think Double's bandwagon super is more annoying. Curse its easy setup!

I'm actually really interested to try out Umbrella.