Naruto

Increasing competence across the board like that would turn everything into a hugely complex clusterfuck. How would clever Madara go about the moons eye plan? Scratch that, how would Black Zetsu fare? He can take over people, change text and move underground with impunity. Give him a thousand year head start, see what happens.

That's why you also make the heroes smarter, so that it takes that long because it's hard to do, not because everyone is insanely lazy.

And Madara would probably use the exact same tactics - overwhelming force. After all, there's a threshold of brute force after which all forms of tactics and strategy become meaningless, and that is when your enemy is an immortal zombie with unlimited chakra and the most broken powerset in the entire manga.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari

That's a bit of a pointless argument, if Madara's just going to bowl them over no matter how smart they are because he's Madara fucking Uchiha.

The most overpowered thing about the Uchiha is the plot excuses and conveniences they get, not any form of Sharingan.

That being said, while I do agree with the introduction of the Mangyekou Sharingan being the main reason the Uchiha became ridiculous powerwise it wasn't until Kamui was introduced that I though the Mangyekou Sharingan was getting out of hand.

Amaterasu and Tsukuyomi both made some amount of sense in regards to what we knew about the Uchiha clan up to the point Itachi was seen using them. Mind Rape via making eye contact isn't really out of place for a magic eye anymore than most of the Genjutsu in the series, and the Uchiha were established to have a fire affinity. When Kakashi showed up with his own Mangyekou Sharingan and Kamui? That's when the Mangyekou Sharingan starting getting nothing but "cool" powers and getting retconned.

edited 10th Oct '15 6:01:58 AM by VeryMelon

I'd argue against Kamui too, were it not for Kakashi figuring out "masked man's" weakness being the last cool moment in the manga.

I also have to defend (base, and only base) Susano'o. The Sasuke vs. Itachi fight would have been a lot less suspenseful were it not for Itachi revealing one more trump card that Sasuke had no way of countering.

Were I to rewrite Naruto, I'd just make it explicit that yeah, there's a hole in the bottom of Susano'o that subterranean attacks can get through, and chakra absorption can eat away at it.

edited 10th Oct '15 6:58:26 AM by DoctorDiabolical

How to make Susano-O powerful, but not overpowered: Limit its usability. Make it so that it takes a large amount of chakra to use, whether it be through unmanageably high upkeep costs or by having every hit it tanks take away some of your chakra in proportion to how much damage it did.

Incidentally, @Irony, there's really no way in hell Madara would succeed in a competent universe unless he was strong enough that everyone being smarter wouldn't matter... which he kinda is.

Incidentally, making everyone as smart and as competent as they're supposed to be would give a gigantic boost in powerlevel to just about everyone. To Naruto, in particular, given that his base stats are amazing and it's his laziness and stupidity that prevents him from being basically completely invincible throughout the entirety of the manga.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari

You forget, them being smarter doesn't help them know information they can't which a smart Madara would obviously conceal.

Madara also knows shadow clone, by the way.

Yes, that is true - but Madara's plan is very complex and complicated and the more parts a plan has the more chances it has to fail. Plus, a lot of it doesn't depend on him, but on the canonically incompetent Obito.

Namely, he would probably still succeed up to the point where he has to go into open confrontation, because he has to because there's no way in hell people won't see the tree, and Madara being Madara would try to make it as grand a statement as he possibly can. Remember, just because we're making them competent doesn't mean we get rid of their flaws, otherwise they'd be boring and flat characters.

So in the end, Madara has to either be strong enough to wtfstomp everyone or just... not be Madara.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari

By the time they see the tree it will be too late. They had time to mobilize in the manga and they still lost.

But that's because they're dumb and incompetent in the manga.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari

And then Jiraiya puts together a heist team...

Still the Susano'o as cool as t is, is a way bizarre technique. Especially with Itachi somehow gaining spirit weapons that are said to be impossible to get for that damn thing.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."

And ragged street urchin Naruto discovers he has a power only those in the highest echelons of society have, chakra, and joins his ragtag team of high class theives?

If all action shonen removed said techniques then things would get a lot duller methinks.

Also anyone else notice that Toneri's BFS at first has a shape similar to Hagoromo's in regards to it being a bit spiralled.

edited 10th Oct '15 5:58:07 PM by Archivist10

Ok disregard that defy physics comment I realized it dosnt make any sense & I just needed to word it better.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."

I think the MS could be kept, I think it's pretty cool. Just toned down a bit so it's not a Story-Breaker Power.

I like the idea that Obito's MS had, where each eye had a separate esoteric power that was related. Instead of the original idea that suggested that MS all accessed a set list of techniques, the esoteric powers fit the "Mangekyo (Kaledioscope)" idea better.

• Obito has two variations of Kamui (Kakashi's remote warping and his contact warping)
• Shisui, instead of having the same technique in both eyes, has the brainwashing technique in one eye and a brainwashing nullifier in the other eye
• Izanami and Izanagi would be paired abilities of an unnamed Uchiha's MS. Their users and effects would have to be completely rewritten though.
• Sasuke would have Amaterasu to cast the flames and Kagutsuchi to manipulate them.
• Itachi would have Tsukiyomi and another ability to replace Izanami.
• Madara could have two versions of Limbo as his MS techniques, or something new.

Susano'o would stay as the technique after unlocking both eyes but would be far less powerful and have less stages to it. I just think it's way too cool to remove.

Izanami doesn't even need to exist. You can effectively achieve the same thing using Tsukuyomi.

For the record, you can keep the Mangekyo Sharingan techniques just so long as you add limitations to them. Cooldowns, difficulty to use, Magic A Is Magic A, inflexibility - you can do lots of things to make seemingly overpowered techniques have enough drawbacks that they don't completely break the story.

It's just that the Mangekyo has too many powers with too few limitations.

edited 10th Oct '15 7:06:43 PM by IAmNotCreativeEnough

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari

The only reason to keep Izanami is because it forms a pair with Izanagi in mythology. It's just to preserve Theme Naming.

I'd think it does something different, and Itachi's other eye technique is a variant on Tsukuyomi.

The eye powers should reflect the users' personalities.

So far, only Sasuke's really do. I mean, he pretty much just wants to see the world burn for much of his screentime, so it kinda fits.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari

What, the powers of illusion and headfuck don't fit the personality of the guy who convinced his little brother he killed their family for giggles instead of on Danzo's orders?

Exactly! (Except, wait, it's Sasuke who's influenced by the will of his seemingly-sociopathic brother who really did love him after all. Hm.)

And then, generations in the future, Roughs lawfolk Salad and Bolt return to civilization...

Problem is, that's not really what Tsukuyomi's used for. Tsukuyomi's only ever used for torture, and that would kinda be against what Itachi is supposed to be like. On the other hand, what he is actually like... is a perfect fit, since he's a sick monster who should die for the good of everyone else.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari

May as well make Sasuke the main character and make Naruto from a secret order of monks who amass knowledge through ninshuu so they may one day share it with the world. Why, he can even teach Sasuke to dance with the rude yet charming Lady Sakura, heir to the strongest house in all the elemental dominance's.

That's the cinematic kiss of death, dood.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari

No, it's super ok. We can even have a lengthy sequence about Sasuke learning to love wearing suits.

Dunno,Kamui and Tsukuyomi shorta fit Obito and Itachi.Itachi's a lying liar that lies for THE GREATER GOOD,and Obito reeaally likes to escape reality.

And Mads's Limbo fits his dance obsession.Also his hax,since he beats you up with thin air.

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