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Renamed tropes
Changed line(s) 27 (click to see context) from:
* OnlyTheCreatorDoesItRight: Technically Gail Simone didn't create the book, but she did create much of what made the book great, from the characters it includes to the concept of "girl squad" after previously just been an ActionDuo. Every run since hers has been less-than-well-received due to [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks making changes from Gail's version]] and a general lack of quality, and many fans are ''not'' fond of attempts to adapt the franchise. So far the only positively received adaptations are a few episodes of ''WesternAnimation/JusticeLeagueUnlimited'' and ''WesternAnimation/BatmanTheBraveAndTheBold'' that were a SpiritualAdaptation of the book; unsurprisingly, those episodes were penned by Simone.
to:
* OnlyTheCreatorDoesItRight: Technically Gail Simone didn't create the book, but she did create much of what made the book great, from the characters it includes to the concept of "girl squad" after previously just been an ActionDuo. Every run since hers has been less-than-well-received due to [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks making changes from Gail's version]] and a general lack of quality, and many fans are ''not'' fond of attempts to adapt the franchise. So far the only positively received adaptations are a few episodes of ''WesternAnimation/JusticeLeagueUnlimited'' and ''WesternAnimation/BatmanTheBraveAndTheBold'' that were a SpiritualAdaptation SpiritualSuccessor of the book; unsurprisingly, those episodes were penned by Simone.
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Foe Yay has been cut
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* FoeYay:
** Huntress and Catman (he was doing well until he licked her).
** Oracle and Calculator once met without knowing each other and immediately began flirting.
** Shiva is never really the Birds' enemy, though she's still far from heroic. Yet, her relationship with Dinah still reeks of UnresolvedSexualTension and Dinah is pretty much Shiva's MoralityPet.
** Huntress and Catman (he was doing well until he licked her).
** Oracle and Calculator once met without knowing each other and immediately began flirting.
** Shiva is never really the Birds' enemy, though she's still far from heroic. Yet, her relationship with Dinah still reeks of UnresolvedSexualTension and Dinah is pretty much Shiva's MoralityPet.
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Changed line(s) 37 (click to see context) from:
** Cassandra Cain and Stephanie Brown have both operated in the same circles as the Birds, have a working relationship with them, and are generally liked by the same fans. So it's glaring that they've never been members, not even in an unofficial capacity.
to:
** Cassandra Cain and Stephanie Brown have both operated in the same circles as the Birds, have a working relationship with them, and are generally liked by the same fans. So it's glaring that they've never been members, not even in an unofficial capacity. Gail Simone wanted to use Cass, but was denied.
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Added DiffLines:
** Dinah and Shiva had some of this in their interactions prior to this series, but it got amped up severely as their frienemy dynamic is upped. Dinah is probably Shiva's OnlyFriend, repeatedly gushes in awe at her skill, and is very eager to see Shiva redeem. Shiva for her part ''really'' wants Dinah to become her apprentice, takes special interest in her health and diet, and is willing to forgo her usual tactics for her sake.
** Dinah ''also'' gets this with Ev Crawford, AKA Starling, in the New 52 rebooted series. At one point she comments about pulling a SorryImGay with Starling to avoid being hit on, the two flirt constantly, and the #0 issue establishes that Starling was hitting on her from their very first meeting. Unlike most other examples, this one can't be blamed on Simone.
** Dinah ''also'' gets this with Ev Crawford, AKA Starling, in the New 52 rebooted series. At one point she comments about pulling a SorryImGay with Starling to avoid being hit on, the two flirt constantly, and the #0 issue establishes that Starling was hitting on her from their very first meeting. Unlike most other examples, this one can't be blamed on Simone.
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Changed line(s) 16,17 (click to see context) from:
* FriendlyFandom:
** Fans of the Birds of Prey tend to also really like the ''ComicBook/GothamCitySirens'' due to their status as basically a VillainousCounterpart (which is ironic as they've rarely fought despite the obvious appeal in that). So much so that all three of the Sirens have spent time either teamed up with the Birds or actively as a member of their line-up, for a time.
** Fans of the Birds of Prey tend to also really like the ''ComicBook/GothamCitySirens'' due to their status as basically a VillainousCounterpart (which is ironic as they've rarely fought despite the obvious appeal in that). So much so that all three of the Sirens have spent time either teamed up with the Birds or actively as a member of their line-up, for a time.
to:
* FriendlyFandom:
FriendlyFandoms:
** Fans of the Birds of Prey tend to also really like the ''ComicBook/GothamCitySirens'' due to their status as basicallya VillainousCounterpart an EvilCounterpart (which is ironic as they've rarely fought despite the obvious appeal in that). So much so that all three of the Sirens have spent time either teamed up with the Birds or actively as a member of their line-up, for a time.
** Fans of the Birds of Prey tend to also really like the ''ComicBook/GothamCitySirens'' due to their status as basically
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%% * BaseBreakingCharacter: Misfit. According to Gail she was intentionally created to be Oracle's Bat-Mite.
to:
** The fanservice, particularly from issues drawn by Ed Benes. For some it was an awkward and sexist distraction that detracts from the genuinely strongly written women, and plays a large part in dissuading readers from taking it seriously. For others, it's an acceptable and easily ignorable issue, or even genuinely part of the appeal of the book either for attracting male readers or serving as part of the WishFulfilment. Simone has often defended it as she doesn't think sexuality should be seen as a negative, especially as the artwork was never afraid to glamorise men as well as women.
* FandomRivalry: With fans of Judd Winnick's Green Arrow run, due to the completely opposing depictions of Black Canary. Canary was a CreatorsPest for Winnick and thus he wrote her with significantly less skill and character, yet meanwhile Birds of Prey saw Dinah undergo a massive TookALevelInBadass while being billed as one of the top fighters in the DCU. Naturally, BOP fans don't have a high opinion of Winnick's treatment of Dinah, while many fans of Winnick's GA in turn have never read BOP, have zero interest in it and Black Canary, and don't care enough about her character to mind how she's treated.
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* IAmNotShazam: "Birds of Prey" is not the team's official name, and was not even mentioned until issue #86. In later issues the characters also ''specifically said'' that it was not their team name when Zinda Blake continues to use it. However, the writers themselves often seem to forget this point, as numerous characters (Both on and off the team) refer to them as 'the birds' on a semi-regular basis, and the full "Birds of Prey" title makes an occasional appearance.
to:
** Shiva is never really the Birds' enemy, though she's still far from heroic. Yet, her relationship with Dinah still reeks of UnresolvedSexualTension and Dinah is pretty much Shiva's MoralityPet.
* FriendlyFandom:
** Fans of the Birds of Prey tend to also really like the ''ComicBook/GothamCitySirens'' due to their status as basically a VillainousCounterpart (which is ironic as they've rarely fought despite the obvious appeal in that). So much so that all three of the Sirens have spent time either teamed up with the Birds or actively as a member of their line-up, for a time.
** Also with the Batgirls, especially the [[ComicBook/Batgirl2000 Cassandra Cain]] and [[ComicBook/Batgirl2009 Stephanie Brown]] runs (Barbara Gordon's [[ComicBook/Batgirl2011 New 52]] and [[ComicBook/BatgirlRebirth Rebirth]] runs less so, due to how different Babs is as Oracle vs her as Batgirl, and a lot of discourse about which version of her is better). In their cases, the fact they regularly had Oracle as their mentor and lead supporting figure combined with Cass' occasional team-ups with the Birds and Steph's fangirl status both help with it. As noted above, many people would prefer either/both of them as the Birds' KidAppealCharacter to Misfit.
* IAmNotShazam: "Birds of Prey" is not the team's official name, and was not even mentioned until issue #86. In later issues the characters also ''specifically said'' that it was not their team name when Zinda Blake continues to use it. However, the writers themselves often seem to forget this point, as numerous characters (Both on and off the team) refer to them as 'the birds' on a semi-regular basis, and the full "Birds of Prey" title makes an occasional appearance. As of 2011, it's now just became commonplace to treat it as their name, and they've long since stopped objecting to it.
* FriendlyFandom:
** Fans of the Birds of Prey tend to also really like the ''ComicBook/GothamCitySirens'' due to their status as basically a VillainousCounterpart (which is ironic as they've rarely fought despite the obvious appeal in that). So much so that all three of the Sirens have spent time either teamed up with the Birds or actively as a member of their line-up, for a time.
** Also with the Batgirls, especially the [[ComicBook/Batgirl2000 Cassandra Cain]] and [[ComicBook/Batgirl2009 Stephanie Brown]] runs (Barbara Gordon's [[ComicBook/Batgirl2011 New 52]] and [[ComicBook/BatgirlRebirth Rebirth]] runs less so, due to how different Babs is as Oracle vs her as Batgirl, and a lot of discourse about which version of her is better). In their cases, the fact they regularly had Oracle as their mentor and lead supporting figure combined with Cass' occasional team-ups with the Birds and Steph's fangirl status both help with it. As noted above, many people would prefer either/both of them as the Birds' KidAppealCharacter to Misfit.
* IAmNotShazam: "Birds of Prey" is not the team's official name, and was not even mentioned until issue #86. In later issues the characters also ''specifically said'' that it was not their team name when Zinda Blake continues to use it. However, the writers themselves often seem to forget this point, as numerous characters (Both on and off the team) refer to them as 'the birds' on a semi-regular basis, and the full "Birds of Prey" title makes an occasional appearance. As of 2011, it's now just became commonplace to treat it as their name, and they've long since stopped objecting to it.
Added DiffLines:
** Though it often gets less attention than Babs/Dinah, Helena and Dinah spend a lot of time together, playfully teasing one another in a way that looks like flirting, and in general Dinah has always been much more accepting of Helena than anyone else in the superhero community.
Added DiffLines:
* OnlyTheCreatorDoesItRight: Technically Gail Simone didn't create the book, but she did create much of what made the book great, from the characters it includes to the concept of "girl squad" after previously just been an ActionDuo. Every run since hers has been less-than-well-received due to [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks making changes from Gail's version]] and a general lack of quality, and many fans are ''not'' fond of attempts to adapt the franchise. So far the only positively received adaptations are a few episodes of ''WesternAnimation/JusticeLeagueUnlimited'' and ''WesternAnimation/BatmanTheBraveAndTheBold'' that were a SpiritualAdaptation of the book; unsurprisingly, those episodes were penned by Simone.
Added DiffLines:
** Cassandra Cain and Stephanie Brown have both operated in the same circles as the Birds, have a working relationship with them, and are generally liked by the same fans. So it's glaring that they've never been members, not even in an unofficial capacity.
** Sin brought so much potential to Dinah, giving her a chance at motherhood, never mind the fact the girl was a TykeBomb Dinah was working to diffuse and had a genuinely adorable relationship with the Birds. Naturally, Green Arrow had to fake the girl's death and send her away because she'd always be in danger if she was in Dinah's care, for some reason.
** Sin brought so much potential to Dinah, giving her a chance at motherhood, never mind the fact the girl was a TykeBomb Dinah was working to diffuse and had a genuinely adorable relationship with the Birds. Naturally, Green Arrow had to fake the girl's death and send her away because she'd always be in danger if she was in Dinah's care, for some reason.
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!!The comic books provide examples of:
to:
For examples from the 2020 film, go [[YMMV/BirdsOfPrey2020 here]].
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!!The live-action show provides examples of:
* CommonKnowledge: In the lead-up to the show's debut, it was reported that Bruce Thomas would reprise his role from the ''Advertising/BatmanOnStarCommercials'' as Batman for the pilot. [[http://www.batpodcast.com/bruce_thomas.php Thomas himself however rebuked this, saying that it wasn't him.]]
* CompleteMonster:
** ''Prey for the Hunter'': [[KillerCop Detective Claude Morton]] is a transfer cop from Bludhaven's PD who in actuality is a SerialKiller of Metas. Morton copies his victim's mutative powers before turning them against his victims and horribly killing them, racking up a sizable victim count of criminals and innocents alike. When he's ousted by Huntress, Morton derides his partner as a "disappointment" for refusing to shoot Huntress and reveals that not only is he a Meta as well, but he's seeking to [[BoomerangBigot commit genocide on his own kind]] simply so he can live in a world free of "freaks".
** ''Gladiatrix'': [[HeManWomanHater Malcolm]] is the misogynistic owner of the titular [[GladiatorGames illegal fighting club]]. To keep his club running, Malcolm has Metahuman woman kidnapped and uses a drug to give them uncontrollable rage to make them fight to the death for the amusement of both him and his customers. Any fighters who don't strike the killing blow on their opponent are tortured to death for disobeying him. A ControlFreak of the highest order, Malcolm also uses electric {{shock collar}}s which inflict horrific pain to keep his fighters docile and under his control.
* FanPreferredCouple: Despite the fact that Helena Kyle ultimately gets together with Detective Jesse Reese towards the end of the show, most fans prefer to pair her with her friend and mentor, Barbara Gordon. This is mostly due to the chemistry between the two's actresses, the fact that Reese doesn't exist in the comics, and the LesYay between them. As well as the absence of Barbara's canon love interest, Dick Grayson. This only increased following ''Series/CrisisOnInfiniteEarths'', where the two were the only ones from the show to return. The pairing dominates what little shipping fanfiction there is of the show on both Website/FanfictionDotNet and Website/ArchiveOfOurOwn.
* FoeYay: Huntress/Harley in the finale.
* FunnyAneurysmMoment: The entire storyline with Dinah and her mother becomes uncomfortable to watch after Lori Loughlin's arrest in 2019 following her allegedly having her daughter cheat on College entrance exams.
* HilariousInHindsight:
** In one episode, Creator/MitchPileggi plays a crime boss. Come [[WesternAnimation/TheBatman the next Batman series he's in]], he's the voice of [[TheCommissionerGordon Jim Gordon]].
** Joe Flanigan (who played Sheppard in ''Series/StargateAtlantis'') guest starred as Detective Claude Morton. He and Reese are walking along discussing meta-humans and Morton says "I've seen perps who can shoot lightning from their fingertips, drop from ten stories, or turn into bugs." Reese replies "One big bug, or lots of small ones?" Morton just says "Both." Amusing in context, but if you're a ''{{Franchise/Stargate|Verse}}'' fan, hilarious. In the ''Atlantis'' episode "Conversion", Sheppard gets infected by a virus and starts to turn into a big Iratus bug. In the ''SG-1'' episode "Bane", Teal'c gets infected by a parasite and his body slowly turns into a cocoon for hundreds of similar parasites. So, now, he really has seen both.
** Sixteen years after the series' conclusion, Creator/RachelSkarsten went on to play Alice in ''Series/{{Batwoman 2019}}''. Alice is a PracticallyJoker character with AliceAllusion.
** Harley Quinn is, more-or-less, the BigBad in this series and the top crime lord in Gotham. Come the next live-action adaptation, ''Film/BirdsOfPrey2020'', the roles are exactly the opposite: Harley Quinn is the ''main character'' (despite having little to do with the actual Birds of Prey in the comics) helping to form the Birds of Prey as she goes against Gotham's top crime lord.
** Here, Creator/ShemarMoore plays Jesse Resse, a cop confused by the weirdness, including Helena, going on in Gotham City, including not knowing who Batman is. In the WesternAnimation/DCAnimatedMovieUniverse, he voiced ComicBook/{{Cyborg}}, who'd technically be a part of said weirdness and given it's based on the ComicBook/New52, sees Cyborg replace the ComicBook/MartianManhunter as a founding member of the League and thus frequently works alongside Batman.
* JustHereForGodzilla: Creator/MarkHamill dubs over the actor playing the Joker in a flashback. Some people will have only heard of this series because of this.
* LesYay: This time leaning FAR more towards Huntress/Oracle.
* MoralEventHorizon: Harley Quinn crosses this in this continuity with the whole Guy plot.
* {{Narm}}:
** The OpeningNarration to some.
** The FinalBattle is supposed to be intense, but the constant flipping and jumping makes it hard to take seriously.
* OneSceneWonder: "Knock, knock. Who's there? Batgirl... Past tense!" *EvilLaugh*
* RetroactiveRecognition:
** [[Creator/ShemarMoore Jesse Reese]], the cop we see throughout the show, is also [[Series/CriminalMinds Derek Morgan]].
** Creator/AaronPaul, aka [[Series/BreakingBad Jesse Pinkman]], attempted to rape Dinah in the pilot.
* SacredCow: Creator/DinaMeyer got the most love of the three leads due to her character being TruerToTheText the most. She's also by far seen as the best live-action ComicBook/{{Oracle}}, by which we mean [[OverlyNarrowSuperlative only]], as other live-action depictions of Barbara Gordon stick to her Batgirl days.
* TheScrappy: Dinah got the least love of all three leads due to being a whiny teenage girl filled with {{Wangst}}. Her being the least accurate to her comic counterpart doesn't help her case either.
* TheyChangedItNowItSucks: The show received a heavy dose of this from fans.
** The InNameOnly aspects of many of the characters, notably Dinah and Lady Shiva, both of whom received a heavy dose of AdaptationalWimp compared to their comic counterparts.
** Harley Quinn as the series main villain being turned into [[AdaptationPersonalityChange a more sinister long-term planner]] who is out to control Gotham and gain revenge for the Joker's imprisonment and does't ever wear the trademark costume (until the finale, and even then it was only remotely similar) or possess the bubbly personality associated with her was not exactly what fans of the character were hoping for the character's live-action debut.
** The backstory of the series including the death of Catwoman and Batman abandoning the city to go into exile. The first part was seen as [[StuffedInTheFridge fridging]] at best and the latter significantly OutOfCharacter for Batman, as despite the trauma of his long-time lover being murdered, ''trauma'' and loss tends to ''drive'' Batman, not cause him to shut down. Stranger still is the fact that he apparently left Gotham completely undefended in his absence, as Helena was a teenager at the time and Barbara had recently been crippled, meaning no-one was protecting Gotham until Helena became an adult. This gets even stranger when one considers this Batman trained at least three Robins, yet they're completely absent too.
** The focus on metahumans in the series was seen as [[FollowTheLeader taking too much]] after shows like ''Series/{{Smallville}}'' as whilst they have existed in Gotham they aren't a particularly heavy focus of most stories in the setting. The fact that Catwoman, traditionally a BadassNormal, was made a metahuman in this series is also a point of contention.
** TheMasquerade nature of the series and its past events was a little hard to swallow for a lot of viewers, mainly in how it seemed to stretch the WillingSuspensionOfDisbelief for such a thing. People not knowing metahumans existed is one thing. The ''entire'' city not knowing Batman ever existed despite the series continually showing more and more elements of his traditional mythos were present? Significantly harder to swallow.
* TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot: Some believed that the show got Dinah and Helena's roles mixed-up. Essentially, if the show had been following a more traditional approach to the characters, ''Dinah'' as the Black Canary should have been the older experienced hero, whilst Helena should have been the youngest of the group and the one in desperate need of training. The fact that Dinah actually is a metahuman in the comics means they could have kept Helena's status as a metahuman in this series unchanged and made Dinah into a mentor figure for her.
!!The live-action show provides examples of:
* CommonKnowledge: In the lead-up to the show's debut, it was reported that Bruce Thomas would reprise his role from the ''Advertising/BatmanOnStarCommercials'' as Batman for the pilot. [[http://www.batpodcast.com/bruce_thomas.php Thomas himself however rebuked this, saying that it wasn't him.]]
* CompleteMonster:
** ''Prey for the Hunter'': [[KillerCop Detective Claude Morton]] is a transfer cop from Bludhaven's PD who in actuality is a SerialKiller of Metas. Morton copies his victim's mutative powers before turning them against his victims and horribly killing them, racking up a sizable victim count of criminals and innocents alike. When he's ousted by Huntress, Morton derides his partner as a "disappointment" for refusing to shoot Huntress and reveals that not only is he a Meta as well, but he's seeking to [[BoomerangBigot commit genocide on his own kind]] simply so he can live in a world free of "freaks".
** ''Gladiatrix'': [[HeManWomanHater Malcolm]] is the misogynistic owner of the titular [[GladiatorGames illegal fighting club]]. To keep his club running, Malcolm has Metahuman woman kidnapped and uses a drug to give them uncontrollable rage to make them fight to the death for the amusement of both him and his customers. Any fighters who don't strike the killing blow on their opponent are tortured to death for disobeying him. A ControlFreak of the highest order, Malcolm also uses electric {{shock collar}}s which inflict horrific pain to keep his fighters docile and under his control.
* FanPreferredCouple: Despite the fact that Helena Kyle ultimately gets together with Detective Jesse Reese towards the end of the show, most fans prefer to pair her with her friend and mentor, Barbara Gordon. This is mostly due to the chemistry between the two's actresses, the fact that Reese doesn't exist in the comics, and the LesYay between them. As well as the absence of Barbara's canon love interest, Dick Grayson. This only increased following ''Series/CrisisOnInfiniteEarths'', where the two were the only ones from the show to return. The pairing dominates what little shipping fanfiction there is of the show on both Website/FanfictionDotNet and Website/ArchiveOfOurOwn.
* FoeYay: Huntress/Harley in the finale.
* FunnyAneurysmMoment: The entire storyline with Dinah and her mother becomes uncomfortable to watch after Lori Loughlin's arrest in 2019 following her allegedly having her daughter cheat on College entrance exams.
* HilariousInHindsight:
** In one episode, Creator/MitchPileggi plays a crime boss. Come [[WesternAnimation/TheBatman the next Batman series he's in]], he's the voice of [[TheCommissionerGordon Jim Gordon]].
** Joe Flanigan (who played Sheppard in ''Series/StargateAtlantis'') guest starred as Detective Claude Morton. He and Reese are walking along discussing meta-humans and Morton says "I've seen perps who can shoot lightning from their fingertips, drop from ten stories, or turn into bugs." Reese replies "One big bug, or lots of small ones?" Morton just says "Both." Amusing in context, but if you're a ''{{Franchise/Stargate|Verse}}'' fan, hilarious. In the ''Atlantis'' episode "Conversion", Sheppard gets infected by a virus and starts to turn into a big Iratus bug. In the ''SG-1'' episode "Bane", Teal'c gets infected by a parasite and his body slowly turns into a cocoon for hundreds of similar parasites. So, now, he really has seen both.
** Sixteen years after the series' conclusion, Creator/RachelSkarsten went on to play Alice in ''Series/{{Batwoman 2019}}''. Alice is a PracticallyJoker character with AliceAllusion.
** Harley Quinn is, more-or-less, the BigBad in this series and the top crime lord in Gotham. Come the next live-action adaptation, ''Film/BirdsOfPrey2020'', the roles are exactly the opposite: Harley Quinn is the ''main character'' (despite having little to do with the actual Birds of Prey in the comics) helping to form the Birds of Prey as she goes against Gotham's top crime lord.
** Here, Creator/ShemarMoore plays Jesse Resse, a cop confused by the weirdness, including Helena, going on in Gotham City, including not knowing who Batman is. In the WesternAnimation/DCAnimatedMovieUniverse, he voiced ComicBook/{{Cyborg}}, who'd technically be a part of said weirdness and given it's based on the ComicBook/New52, sees Cyborg replace the ComicBook/MartianManhunter as a founding member of the League and thus frequently works alongside Batman.
* JustHereForGodzilla: Creator/MarkHamill dubs over the actor playing the Joker in a flashback. Some people will have only heard of this series because of this.
* LesYay: This time leaning FAR more towards Huntress/Oracle.
* MoralEventHorizon: Harley Quinn crosses this in this continuity with the whole Guy plot.
* {{Narm}}:
** The OpeningNarration to some.
** The FinalBattle is supposed to be intense, but the constant flipping and jumping makes it hard to take seriously.
* OneSceneWonder: "Knock, knock. Who's there? Batgirl... Past tense!" *EvilLaugh*
* RetroactiveRecognition:
** [[Creator/ShemarMoore Jesse Reese]], the cop we see throughout the show, is also [[Series/CriminalMinds Derek Morgan]].
** Creator/AaronPaul, aka [[Series/BreakingBad Jesse Pinkman]], attempted to rape Dinah in the pilot.
* SacredCow: Creator/DinaMeyer got the most love of the three leads due to her character being TruerToTheText the most. She's also by far seen as the best live-action ComicBook/{{Oracle}}, by which we mean [[OverlyNarrowSuperlative only]], as other live-action depictions of Barbara Gordon stick to her Batgirl days.
* TheScrappy: Dinah got the least love of all three leads due to being a whiny teenage girl filled with {{Wangst}}. Her being the least accurate to her comic counterpart doesn't help her case either.
* TheyChangedItNowItSucks: The show received a heavy dose of this from fans.
** The InNameOnly aspects of many of the characters, notably Dinah and Lady Shiva, both of whom received a heavy dose of AdaptationalWimp compared to their comic counterparts.
** Harley Quinn as the series main villain being turned into [[AdaptationPersonalityChange a more sinister long-term planner]] who is out to control Gotham and gain revenge for the Joker's imprisonment and does't ever wear the trademark costume (until the finale, and even then it was only remotely similar) or possess the bubbly personality associated with her was not exactly what fans of the character were hoping for the character's live-action debut.
** The backstory of the series including the death of Catwoman and Batman abandoning the city to go into exile. The first part was seen as [[StuffedInTheFridge fridging]] at best and the latter significantly OutOfCharacter for Batman, as despite the trauma of his long-time lover being murdered, ''trauma'' and loss tends to ''drive'' Batman, not cause him to shut down. Stranger still is the fact that he apparently left Gotham completely undefended in his absence, as Helena was a teenager at the time and Barbara had recently been crippled, meaning no-one was protecting Gotham until Helena became an adult. This gets even stranger when one considers this Batman trained at least three Robins, yet they're completely absent too.
** The focus on metahumans in the series was seen as [[FollowTheLeader taking too much]] after shows like ''Series/{{Smallville}}'' as whilst they have existed in Gotham they aren't a particularly heavy focus of most stories in the setting. The fact that Catwoman, traditionally a BadassNormal, was made a metahuman in this series is also a point of contention.
** TheMasquerade nature of the series and its past events was a little hard to swallow for a lot of viewers, mainly in how it seemed to stretch the WillingSuspensionOfDisbelief for such a thing. People not knowing metahumans existed is one thing. The ''entire'' city not knowing Batman ever existed despite the series continually showing more and more elements of his traditional mythos were present? Significantly harder to swallow.
* TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot: Some believed that the show got Dinah and Helena's roles mixed-up. Essentially, if the show had been following a more traditional approach to the characters, ''Dinah'' as the Black Canary should have been the older experienced hero, whilst Helena should have been the youngest of the group and the one in desperate need of training. The fact that Dinah actually is a metahuman in the comics means they could have kept Helena's status as a metahuman in this series unchanged and made Dinah into a mentor figure for her.
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Changed line(s) 39 (click to see context) from:
** Here, Creator/ShemarMoore plays a cop confused by the weirdness, including Helena, going on in Gotham City, including not knowing who Batman is. In the WesternAnimation/DCAnimatedMovieUniverse, he voiced ComicBook/{{Cyborg}}, who'd technically be a part of said weirdness and given it's based on the ComicBook/New52, sees Cyborg replace the ComicBook/MartianManhunter as a founding member of the League and thus works alongside Batman.
to:
** Here, Creator/ShemarMoore plays Jesse Resse, a cop confused by the weirdness, including Helena, going on in Gotham City, including not knowing who Batman is. In the WesternAnimation/DCAnimatedMovieUniverse, he voiced ComicBook/{{Cyborg}}, who'd technically be a part of said weirdness and given it's based on the ComicBook/New52, sees Cyborg replace the ComicBook/MartianManhunter as a founding member of the League and thus frequently works alongside Batman.
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Changed line(s) 39 (click to see context) from:
** Here, Creator/ShemarMoore plays a cop confused by the weirdness, including Helena going on in Gotham City. In the WesternAnimation/DCAnimatedMovieUniverse, he voiced ComicBook/{{Cyborg}}, who'd technically be a part of said weirdness.
to:
** Here, Creator/ShemarMoore plays a cop confused by the weirdness, including Helena Helena, going on in Gotham City. City, including not knowing who Batman is. In the WesternAnimation/DCAnimatedMovieUniverse, he voiced ComicBook/{{Cyborg}}, who'd technically be a part of said weirdness.weirdness and given it's based on the ComicBook/New52, sees Cyborg replace the ComicBook/MartianManhunter as a founding member of the League and thus works alongside Batman.
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Changed line(s) 35 (click to see context) from:
** In one episode, Mitch Pileggi plays a crime boss. Come [[WesternAnimation/TheBatman the next Batman series he's in]], he's the voice of [[TheCommissionerGordon Jim Gordon]].
to:
** In one episode, Mitch Pileggi Creator/MitchPileggi plays a crime boss. Come [[WesternAnimation/TheBatman the next Batman series he's in]], he's the voice of [[TheCommissionerGordon Jim Gordon]].
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** Here, Creator/ShemarMoore plays a cop confused by the weirdness, including Helena going on in Gotham City. In the WesternAnimation/DCAnimatedMovieUniverse, he voiced ComicBook/{{Cyborg}}, who'd technically be a part of said weirdness.
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** [[KillerCop Detective Claude Morton]], from ''Prey for the Hunter'', is a transfer cop from Bludhaven's PD who in actuality is a SerialKiller of Metas. Morton copies his victim's mutative powers before turning them against his victims and horribly killing them, racking up a sizable victim count of criminals and innocents alike. When he's ousted by Huntress, Morton derides his partner as a "disappointment" for refusing to shoot Huntress and reveals that not only is he a Meta as well, but he's seeking to [[BoomerangBigot commit genocide on his own kind]] simply so he can live in a world free of "freaks".
** [[HeManWomanHater Malcolm]], from ''Gladiatrix'', is the misogynistic owner of the titular [[GladiatorGames illegal fighting club]]. To keep his club running, Malcolm has Metahuman woman kidnapped and uses a drug to give them uncontrollable rage to make them fight to the death for the amusement of both him and his customers. Any fighters who don't strike the killing blow on their opponent are tortured to death for disobeying him. A ControlFreak of the highest order, Malcolm also uses electric {{shock collar}}s which inflict horrific pain to keep his fighters docile and under his control.
** [[HeManWomanHater Malcolm]], from ''Gladiatrix'', is the misogynistic owner of the titular [[GladiatorGames illegal fighting club]]. To keep his club running, Malcolm has Metahuman woman kidnapped and uses a drug to give them uncontrollable rage to make them fight to the death for the amusement of both him and his customers. Any fighters who don't strike the killing blow on their opponent are tortured to death for disobeying him. A ControlFreak of the highest order, Malcolm also uses electric {{shock collar}}s which inflict horrific pain to keep his fighters docile and under his control.
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** ''Prey for the Hunter'': [[KillerCop Detective Claude Morton]], from ''Prey for the Hunter'', Morton]] is a transfer cop from Bludhaven's PD who in actuality is a SerialKiller of Metas. Morton copies his victim's mutative powers before turning them against his victims and horribly killing them, racking up a sizable victim count of criminals and innocents alike. When he's ousted by Huntress, Morton derides his partner as a "disappointment" for refusing to shoot Huntress and reveals that not only is he a Meta as well, but he's seeking to [[BoomerangBigot commit genocide on his own kind]] simply so he can live in a world free of "freaks".
** ''Gladiatrix'': [[HeManWomanHaterMalcolm]], from ''Gladiatrix'', Malcolm]] is the misogynistic owner of the titular [[GladiatorGames illegal fighting club]]. To keep his club running, Malcolm has Metahuman woman kidnapped and uses a drug to give them uncontrollable rage to make them fight to the death for the amusement of both him and his customers. Any fighters who don't strike the killing blow on their opponent are tortured to death for disobeying him. A ControlFreak of the highest order, Malcolm also uses electric {{shock collar}}s which inflict horrific pain to keep his fighters docile and under his control.
** ''Gladiatrix'': [[HeManWomanHater
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Hindsight misuse
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* HarsherInHindsight: [[spoiler:Huntress and Barbara return 16 years later at Arrowverse's crossover ''Crisis on Infinite Earths''... only to die and have their universe disintegrated.]]
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* FanPreferredCouple: Despite the fact that Helena Kyle ultimately gets together with Detective Jesse Reese towards the end of the show, most fans prefer to pair her with her friend and mentor, Barbara Gordon. This is mostly due to the chemistry between the two's actresses, the fact that Reese doesn't exist in the comics, and the LesYay between them. As well as the absence of Barbara's canon love interest, Dick Grayson. This only increased following ''Series/CrisisOnInfiniteEarths'', where the two were the only ones from the show to return. The pairing dominates what little shipping fanfiction there is of the show on both Website/FanfictionDotNet and Website/ArchiveOfOurOwn.
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* Harley Quinn is, more-or-less, the BigBad in this series and the top crime lord in Gotham. Come the next live-action adaptation, ''BirdsOfPrey2020'', the roles are exactly the opposite: Harley Quinn is the ''main character'' (despite having little to do with the actual Birds of Prey in the comics) helping to form the Birds of Prey as she goes against Gotham's top crime lord.
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* Harley Quinn is, more-or-less, the BigBad in this series and the top crime lord in Gotham. Come the next live-action adaptation, ''BirdsOfPrey2020'', the roles are exactly the opposite: Harley Quinn is the ''main character'' (despite having little to do with the actual Birds of Prey in the comics) helping to form the Birds of Prey as she goes against Gotham's top crime lord.
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* HarsherInHindsight: [[spoiler:Huntress and Barbara return 16 years later at Arrowverse's crossover ''Crisis on Infinite Earths''... only to die and have their universe disintegrated.]]
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Approved by the thread
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*CompleteMonster: See [[Monster/{{Batman}} here]].
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I think this fits better.
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* FoeYay: Huntress/Harley in the finale
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* FoeYay: Huntress/Harley in the finalefinale.
* FunnyAneurysmMoment: The entire storyline with Dinah and her mother becomes uncomfortable to watch after Lori Loughlin's arrest in 2019 following her allegedly having her daughter cheat on College entrance exams.
* FunnyAneurysmMoment: The entire storyline with Dinah and her mother becomes uncomfortable to watch after Lori Loughlin's arrest in 2019 following her allegedly having her daughter cheat on College entrance exams.
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** Sixteen years after the series' conclusion, Creator/RachelSkarsten was cast as BigBad Red Alice in ''Series/{{Batwoman 2019}}''.
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** Sixteen years after the series' conclusion, Creator/RachelSkarsten was cast as BigBad Red went on to play Alice in ''Series/{{Batwoman 2019}}''.2019}}''. Alice is a PracticallyJoker character with AliceAllusion.
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* SacredCow: Creator/DinaMeyer got the most love of the three leads due to her character being TruerToTheText the most. She's also by far seen as the best live-action ComicBook/{{Oracle}}, by which we mean [[OverlyNarrowSuperlative only]], as other live-action depictions of Barbara Gordon stick to her Batgirl days.
* TheScrappy: Dinah got the least love of all three leads due to being a whiny teenage girl filled with {{Wangst}}. Her being the least accurate to her comic counterpart doesn't help her case either.
* TheScrappy: Dinah got the least love of all three leads due to being a whiny teenage girl filled with {{Wangst}}. Her being the least accurate to her comic counterpart doesn't help her case either.
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Z Ero context Example.
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* TheScrappy: Dinah.
** RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap: Dinah as the show went on.
** RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap: Dinah as the show went on.
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Main stars cant be EDH.
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* EnsembleDarkhorse: Creator/DinaMeyer got the most love of the three leads due to her character being TruerToTheText the most. She's also by far the best live-action Oracle, by which we mean [[OverlyNarrowSuperlative only]], as other live-action depictions of Barbara Gordon stick to her Batgirl days.
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** Harley Quinn as the series main villain being turned into [[AdaptationPersonalityChange a more sinister long-term planner]] who is out to control Gotham and gain revenge for the Joker's imprisonment and does't ever wear the trademarkostume (until the finale, and even then it was only remotely similar) or possess the bubbly personality associated with her was not exactly what fans of the character were hoping for the character's live-action debut.
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** Harley Quinn as the series main villain being turned into [[AdaptationPersonalityChange a more sinister long-term planner]] who is out to control Gotham and gain revenge for the Joker's imprisonment and does't ever wear the trademarkostume trademark costume (until the finale, and even then it was only remotely similar) or possess the bubbly personality associated with her was not exactly what fans of the character were hoping for the character's live-action debut.
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** Harley Quinn as the series main villain being turned into [[AdaptationPersonalityChange a more sinister long-term planner]] who is out to control Gotham and gain revenge for the Joker's imprisonment and does't ever wear the trademark costume (until the finale, but still without headgear) or possess the bubbly personality associated with her was not exactly what fans of the character were hoping for the character's live-action debut.
to:
** Harley Quinn as the series main villain being turned into [[AdaptationPersonalityChange a more sinister long-term planner]] who is out to control Gotham and gain revenge for the Joker's imprisonment and does't ever wear the trademark costume trademarkostume (until the finale, but still without headgear) and even then it was only remotely similar) or possess the bubbly personality associated with her was not exactly what fans of the character were hoping for the character's live-action debut.
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** Harley Quinn as the series main villain being turned into [[AdaptationPersonalityChange a more sinister long-term planner]] who is out to control Gotham and gain revenge for the Joker's imprisonment and does't ever wear the trademark costume or possess the bubbly personality associated with her was not exactly what fans of the character were hoping for the character's live-action debut.
to:
** Harley Quinn as the series main villain being turned into [[AdaptationPersonalityChange a more sinister long-term planner]] who is out to control Gotham and gain revenge for the Joker's imprisonment and does't ever wear the trademark costume (until the finale, but still without headgear) or possess the bubbly personality associated with her was not exactly what fans of the character were hoping for the character's live-action debut.
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* InternetBackdraft
** Before it was revealed to be a fakeout, the supposed deaths of [[spoiler: Savant and Creote]]. In the same arc, Black Canary's initial theory that White Canary was secretly [[ComicBook/{{Batgirl 2000}} Cassandra Cain]] did not go over well with many fans as she had already famously been turned evil in the past with disastrous results.
** Another was when Ryan Sohmer of ''The Gutters'' [[http://www.the-gutters.com/comic/127-tyler-walpole made a comment]] about the series "constantly re-launching" and "hoping it would find an audience"... only it has been relaunched as an ongoing ''once'' (not counting a couple of mini series and one-shots before the first ongoing) and the initial run lasted over 10 years and 100 issues and gained a devoted fanbase who made the new series a bestseller when it relaunched. [[FlameWar You can guess how said fans reacted to being told they don't exist by Sohmer]], especially once Sohmer's YesMan started fighting back. Sohmer did eventually admit that he was wrong.
** Before it was revealed to be a fakeout, the supposed deaths of [[spoiler: Savant and Creote]]. In the same arc, Black Canary's initial theory that White Canary was secretly [[ComicBook/{{Batgirl 2000}} Cassandra Cain]] did not go over well with many fans as she had already famously been turned evil in the past with disastrous results.
** Another was when Ryan Sohmer of ''The Gutters'' [[http://www.the-gutters.com/comic/127-tyler-walpole made a comment]] about the series "constantly re-launching" and "hoping it would find an audience"... only it has been relaunched as an ongoing ''once'' (not counting a couple of mini series and one-shots before the first ongoing) and the initial run lasted over 10 years and 100 issues and gained a devoted fanbase who made the new series a bestseller when it relaunched. [[FlameWar You can guess how said fans reacted to being told they don't exist by Sohmer]], especially once Sohmer's YesMan started fighting back. Sohmer did eventually admit that he was wrong.
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* TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot: Some believed that the show got Dinah and Helena's roles mixed-up.
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* TheyChangedItNowItSucks: The show received a heavy dose of this from fans.
** The InNameOnly aspects of many of the characters, notably Dinah and Lady Shiva, both of whom received a heavy dose of AdaptationalWimp compared to their comic counterparts.
** Harley Quinn as the series main villain being turned into [[AdaptationPersonalityChange a more sinister long-term planner]] who is out to control Gotham and gain revenge for the Joker's imprisonment and does't ever wear the trademark costume or possess the bubbly personality associated with her was not exactly what fans of the character were hoping for the character's live-action debut.
** The backstory of the series including the death of Catwoman and Batman abandoning the city to go into exile. The first part was seen as [[StuffedInTheFridge fridging]] at best and the latter significantly OutOfCharacter for Batman, as despite the trauma of his long-time lover being murdered, ''trauma'' and loss tends to ''drive'' Batman, not cause him to shut down. Stranger still is the fact that he apparently left Gotham completely undefended in his absence, as Helena was a teenager at the time and Barbara had recently been crippled, meaning no-one was protecting Gotham until Helena became an adult. This gets even stranger when one considers this Batman trained at least three Robins, yet they're completely absent too.
** The focus on metahumans in the series was seen as [[FollowTheLeader taking too much]] after shows like ''Series/{{Smallville}}'' as whilst they have existed in Gotham they aren't a particularly heavy focus of most stories in the setting. The fact that Catwoman, traditionally a BadassNormal, was made a metahuman in this series is also a point of contention.
** TheMasquerade nature of the series and its past events was a little hard to swallow for a lot of viewers, mainly in how it seemed to stretch the WillingSuspensionOfDisbelief for such a thing. People not knowing metahumans existed is one thing. The ''entire'' city not knowing Batman ever existed despite the series continually showing more and more elements of his traditional mythos were present? Significantly harder to swallow.
* TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot: Some believed that the show got Dinah and Helena's roles mixed-up. Essentially, if the show had been following a more traditional approach to the characters, ''Dinah'' as the Black Canary should have been the older experienced hero, whilst Helena should have been the youngest of the group and the one in desperate need of training. The fact that Dinah actually is a metahuman in the comics means they could have kept Helena's status as a metahuman in this series unchanged and made Dinah into a mentor figure for her.
** The InNameOnly aspects of many of the characters, notably Dinah and Lady Shiva, both of whom received a heavy dose of AdaptationalWimp compared to their comic counterparts.
** Harley Quinn as the series main villain being turned into [[AdaptationPersonalityChange a more sinister long-term planner]] who is out to control Gotham and gain revenge for the Joker's imprisonment and does't ever wear the trademark costume or possess the bubbly personality associated with her was not exactly what fans of the character were hoping for the character's live-action debut.
** The backstory of the series including the death of Catwoman and Batman abandoning the city to go into exile. The first part was seen as [[StuffedInTheFridge fridging]] at best and the latter significantly OutOfCharacter for Batman, as despite the trauma of his long-time lover being murdered, ''trauma'' and loss tends to ''drive'' Batman, not cause him to shut down. Stranger still is the fact that he apparently left Gotham completely undefended in his absence, as Helena was a teenager at the time and Barbara had recently been crippled, meaning no-one was protecting Gotham until Helena became an adult. This gets even stranger when one considers this Batman trained at least three Robins, yet they're completely absent too.
** The focus on metahumans in the series was seen as [[FollowTheLeader taking too much]] after shows like ''Series/{{Smallville}}'' as whilst they have existed in Gotham they aren't a particularly heavy focus of most stories in the setting. The fact that Catwoman, traditionally a BadassNormal, was made a metahuman in this series is also a point of contention.
** TheMasquerade nature of the series and its past events was a little hard to swallow for a lot of viewers, mainly in how it seemed to stretch the WillingSuspensionOfDisbelief for such a thing. People not knowing metahumans existed is one thing. The ''entire'' city not knowing Batman ever existed despite the series continually showing more and more elements of his traditional mythos were present? Significantly harder to swallow.
* TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot: Some believed that the show got Dinah and Helena's roles mixed-up. Essentially, if the show had been following a more traditional approach to the characters, ''Dinah'' as the Black Canary should have been the older experienced hero, whilst Helena should have been the youngest of the group and the one in desperate need of training. The fact that Dinah actually is a metahuman in the comics means they could have kept Helena's status as a metahuman in this series unchanged and made Dinah into a mentor figure for her.
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** Sixteen years after the series' conclusion, Creator/RachelSkarsten was cast as BigBad Red Alice in ''Series/{{Batwoman 2019}}''.
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* EnsembleDarkhorse: Creator/DinaMeyer got the most love of the three leads due to her character being TruerToTheText the most.
to:
* EnsembleDarkhorse: Creator/DinaMeyer got the most love of the three leads due to her character being TruerToTheText the most. She's also by far the best live-action Oracle, by which we mean [[OverlyNarrowSuperlative only]], as other live-action depictions of Barbara Gordon stick to her Batgirl days.
