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* Every Na'vi fighting on the ground is a Na'vi ''not'' riding a banshee to try and attack the Dragon. Since Quaritch has more ground troops than he has flyers to carry them all at once, he's busy using his surplus ground troops to present a second threat so the enemy splits his own forces into two groups to meet both threats, instead of being free to concentrate all their force against the one group of his that's actually essential to his plan. Or in short, Quaritch is making a diversionary attack on the ground to help the air mission's odds. Also, the Na'vi being a tribal warrior society its reasonable to assume that that [[AuthorityEqualsAsskicking the chiefs will lead their men from the front]], and so a ground battle of Na'vi vs. modern weapons might give him a chance to kill as many Na'vi tribal leaders as will charge at his guns, which if he pulls it off will improve the odds of his 'Break the Na'vi's will to resist' strategy that's his fundamental reason for bombing Hometree in the first place. Its not exactly Creator/SunTzu but neither is it the IdiotBall; his ground tactics are actually serving his overall strategy to at least some degree instead of being wasted effort.

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* Every Na'vi fighting on the ground is a Na'vi ''not'' riding a banshee to try and attack the Dragon. Since Quaritch has more ground troops than he has flyers to carry them all at once, he's busy using his surplus ground troops to present a second threat so the enemy splits his own forces into two groups to meet both threats, instead of being free to concentrate all their force against the one group of his that's actually essential to his plan. Or in short, Quaritch is making a diversionary attack on the ground to help the air mission's odds. Also, the Na'vi being a tribal warrior society its reasonable to assume that that [[AuthorityEqualsAsskicking the chiefs will lead their men from the front]], front, and so a ground battle of Na'vi vs. modern weapons might give him a chance to kill as many Na'vi tribal leaders as will charge at his guns, which if he pulls it off will improve the odds of his 'Break the Na'vi's will to resist' strategy that's his fundamental reason for bombing Hometree in the first place. Its not exactly Creator/SunTzu but neither is it the IdiotBall; his ground tactics are actually serving his overall strategy to at least some degree instead of being wasted effort.
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Removal of What An Idiot


* I just realised something. If you blow up the forests, [[WhatAnIdiot you risk blowing up the unobtanium under them]].

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* I just realised something. If you blow up the forests, [[WhatAnIdiot you risk blowing up the unobtanium under them]].them.
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*** And even the movie proper there's two scenes where she refuses to let him link up with his Avatar until he's had an actual meal.
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* They won this major battle, but yes, considering humans traveled light years for this substance, the Navi should definitely be wary of a return. Because of the distance involved, it could well be decades, but no, they can't really sleep easy.
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** The primary humans in charge see the natives as "blue monkeys", meaning animals that don't have any rights at all and thus aren't worthy of any real considerations. There's clearly a faction that is fighting that, the one Jake joins, but it's lost power for years when Jake shows up.
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[[folder: So why do the RDA go through the GIANT FRICKING BLACKOUT FIELD that allows only [=LoS=] firing?]]

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[[folder: So [[folder:So why do the RDA go through the GIANT FRICKING BLACKOUT FIELD that allows only [=LoS=] firing?]]



[[folder: Why isn't there an "Avatar Oversight Commitee"?]]

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[[folder: Why [[folder:Why isn't there an "Avatar Oversight Commitee"?]]



[[folder: The actions of the humans on the planet]]

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[[folder: The [[folder:The actions of the humans on the planet]]



[[folder: The humans leaving.]]

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[[folder: The [[folder:The humans leaving.]]



[[folder: What's going to happen wend the next ship full of humans shows up?]]

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[[folder: What's [[folder:What's going to happen wend the next ship full of humans shows up?]]



[[folder: The humans' failure to learn from history.]]

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[[folder: The [[folder:The humans' failure to learn from history.]]



[[folder: How is preemptively destroying a core religious site a good idea?]]

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[[folder: How [[folder:How is preemptively destroying a core religious site a good idea?]]



[[folder: Why are there no representatives from other countries aboard this mission?]]

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[[folder: Why [[folder:Why are there no representatives from other countries aboard this mission?]]



[[folder: Quaritch's unchecked power]]

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[[folder: Quaritch's [[folder:Quaritch's unchecked power]]



[[folder: Why didn't the mercs MacrossMissileMassacre attack the Tree of Souls with loads and loads of dumb rockets?]]

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[[folder: Why [[folder:Why didn't the mercs MacrossMissileMassacre attack the Tree of Souls with loads and loads of dumb rockets?]]



[[folder: RDA in general. Warning: This is a big one.]]

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[[folder: RDA [[folder:RDA in general. Warning: This is a big one.]]



[[folder: Why not strip mine one of the planets or moons closer to the star?]]

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[[folder: Why [[folder:Why not strip mine one of the planets or moons closer to the star?]]



[[folder: Combat?]]

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[[folder: Combat?]][[folder:Combat?]]



[[folder: Invisible Bad Press]]

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[[folder: Invisible [[folder:Invisible Bad Press]]
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** Many of you seem to be discounting one (or perhaps several) very important facts. The Valkyrie Shuttle is a space capable aircraft, ludicrously fast atmospheric flyer, and a stable VTOL with nigh infinite fuel. There is no reason why it couldn't have flown over the banshee's fight ceiling, used hardened GPS systems to fly directly over the tree, came to a hover, descended vertically, and then had the munitions tossed out of the back. If that failed, the scorpions could certainly launch a dumb-fire missile attack, and without a massive shuttle to wait for, they would be free to fly at top speed towards to objective and evade the banshees, which are shown to fly either as fast, or slightly slower than, the aircraft during the final battle. Ammo costs are irrelevant, as the RDA clearly has enough funding to procure a private army, massive mining equipment, AVATARs, space craft, and destroy Home Tree with a hilariously excessive amount of HE/incendiary Missiles.

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** Many of you seem to be discounting one (or perhaps several) very important facts. The Valkyrie Shuttle is a space capable aircraft, ludicrously fast atmospheric flyer, and a stable VTOL with nigh infinite fuel. There is no reason why it couldn't have flown over the banshee's fight ceiling, used hardened GPS systems to fly directly over the tree, came to a hover, descended vertically, and then had the munitions tossed out of the back. If that failed, the scorpions could certainly launch a dumb-fire missile attack, and without a massive shuttle to wait for, they would be free to fly at top speed towards to objective and evade the banshees, which are shown to fly either as fast, or slightly slower than, the aircraft during the final battle. Ammo costs are irrelevant, as the RDA clearly has enough funding to procure a private army, massive mining equipment, AVATARs, [=AVATARs=], space craft, and destroy Home Tree with a hilariously excessive amount of HE/incendiary Missiles.
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** Stop being deliberately dense. He meant sympathetic humans, not Na'vi. As I said earlier, the ISVs are NOT faster than light, it would be trivial to send communications ahead, even at light speed, particularly with the existence of the [[AllThereInTheManual Na'vi sympathisers' movement on Earth]], where is is OBVIOUS that the scientists would have had connections to even BEFORE leaving for Pandora.

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** Stop being deliberately dense. He meant sympathetic humans, not Na'vi. As I said earlier, the ISVs are NOT faster than light, it would be trivial to send communications ahead, even at light speed, particularly with the existence of the [[AllThereInTheManual Na'vi sympathisers' movement on Earth]], where is it is OBVIOUS that the scientists would have had connections to even BEFORE leaving for Pandora.
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Renamed tropes


*** An atmospheric entry versus a low altitude dive? YouFailPhysicsForever. The transition from orbital flight to hover happens over ''SEVERAL MILES'' at low speed in a clear area. Indeed, the fact that the hover is only at low altitudes perfectly proves your own point, that VTOL is an inefficient mode of travel, being far more effective closer to the ground, and therefore you have completely disproved your own point.

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*** An atmospheric entry versus a low altitude dive? YouFailPhysicsForever.[[ArtisticLicensePhysics You fail physics forever]]. The transition from orbital flight to hover happens over ''SEVERAL MILES'' at low speed in a clear area. Indeed, the fact that the hover is only at low altitudes perfectly proves your own point, that VTOL is an inefficient mode of travel, being far more effective closer to the ground, and therefore you have completely disproved your own point.



* There's an [[YouFailEconomicsForever economic]] side to this also: as soon as word gets back home that RDA has been sent packing, the price of unobtanium and anything made with it will skyrocket faster than you can say "oil embargo". If this stuff is half as useful as we're led to believe, this will create a powerful incentive for someone to go back with a full-fledged invasion force to take the now-worth-a-lot-more-than-$20M-a-kilo unobtainium. It's also going to create a powerful incentive for humanity, fed up with high prices, to look the other way as this happens. Jake and the Na'Vi should really be negotiating while they have the upper hand. "You can stay if you follow our rules - low-impact underground mining only at sites we approve, and your security force has to lose the firearms and learn archery" could be a long-term sustainable arrangement. "Yankee go home" will likely cause everything to end in tears.

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* There's an [[YouFailEconomicsForever [[ArtisticLicenseEconomics economic]] side to this also: as soon as word gets back home that RDA has been sent packing, the price of unobtanium and anything made with it will skyrocket faster than you can say "oil embargo". If this stuff is half as useful as we're led to believe, this will create a powerful incentive for someone to go back with a full-fledged invasion force to take the now-worth-a-lot-more-than-$20M-a-kilo unobtainium. It's also going to create a powerful incentive for humanity, fed up with high prices, to look the other way as this happens. Jake and the Na'Vi should really be negotiating while they have the upper hand. "You can stay if you follow our rules - low-impact underground mining only at sites we approve, and your security force has to lose the firearms and learn archery" could be a long-term sustainable arrangement. "Yankee go home" will likely cause everything to end in tears.



** Unobtanium is an element. YouFailPhysicsForever. And 'nuking' is just a paraphrase for 'blowing it all to hell.' Seriously, all it would take to wipe the biosphere of Pandora is for the RDA to "accidentally" eject a hunk of tungsten roughly the size of a fridge at precisely the right angle as they slow down their relativistically moving the ship. ''The size of a fridge''. And no more Na'vi.
*** YouFailPhsyicsForever. Structures, ESPECIALLY crystalline ones and some metals, can EASILY be damaged, altered or destroyed by extreme conditions. Superconductors even more so. Any chunk of tungsten would be captured by Polyphemus' gravity well.

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** Unobtanium is an element. YouFailPhysicsForever.[[ArtisticLicensePhysics You fail physics forever]]. And 'nuking' is just a paraphrase for 'blowing it all to hell.' Seriously, all it would take to wipe the biosphere of Pandora is for the RDA to "accidentally" eject a hunk of tungsten roughly the size of a fridge at precisely the right angle as they slow down their relativistically moving the ship. ''The size of a fridge''. And no more Na'vi.
*** YouFailPhsyicsForever.[[ArtisticLicensePhysics You fail physics forever]]. Structures, ESPECIALLY crystalline ones and some metals, can EASILY be damaged, altered or destroyed by extreme conditions. Superconductors even more so. Any chunk of tungsten would be captured by Polyphemus' gravity well.
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*** Not to mention how it actually fell, to Max ripping the control room open with mining equipment and the avatars running in and securing it - all in all, a real CrowningMomentOfAwesome that should have been included in the full theatrical cut.

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*** Not to mention how it actually fell, to Max ripping the control room open with mining equipment and the avatars running in and securing it - all in all, a real CrowningMomentOfAwesome SugarWiki/MomentOfAwesome that should have been included in the full theatrical cut.
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** The biggest source is under the village, thye can tunnel it out milkshake style but Na'vi would likely get wise about it when the ground is starting weaken under them and it's possible the trees connection won't like it.
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** An NDA in which the signatory agrees not to disclose illegal activities (murder and genocide being the most applicable here) is not legally enforceable, and abiding to such terms would constitute obstruction of justice.
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*** Yet, it is still more logic and cheaper to just send an investigative commision into Pandora to check what really happened, interview the natives, see if there's evidence of battle (which there are) and so on than sending an invasion force which would be incredibly expensive and if you get there and find that Jake was right all along (whether by remains of the battle, natives' testimonies, etc) then you really have a problem, especially as the issue is already polemic and the Na'va have their defenders on Earth.
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* Every Na'vi fighting on the ground is a Na'vi ''not'' riding a banshee to try and attack the Dragon. Since Quaritch has more ground troops than he has flyers to carry them all at once, he's busy using his surplus ground troops to present a second threat so the enemy splits his own forces into two groups to meet both threats, instead of being free to concentrate all their force against the one group of his that's actually essential to his plan. Or in short, Quaritch is making a diversionary attack on the ground to help the air mission's odds. Also, the Na'vi being a tribal warrior society its reasonable to assume that that [[AuthorityEqualsAsskicking the chiefs will lead their men from the front]], and so a ground battle of Na'vi vs. modern weapons might give him a chance to kill as many Na'vi tribal leaders as will charge at his guns, which if he pulls it off will improve the odds of his 'Break the Na'vi's will to resist' strategy that's his fundamental reason for bombing Hometree in the first place. Its not exactly SunTzu but neither is it the IdiotBall; his ground tactics are actually serving his overall strategy to at least some degree instead of being wasted effort.

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* Every Na'vi fighting on the ground is a Na'vi ''not'' riding a banshee to try and attack the Dragon. Since Quaritch has more ground troops than he has flyers to carry them all at once, he's busy using his surplus ground troops to present a second threat so the enemy splits his own forces into two groups to meet both threats, instead of being free to concentrate all their force against the one group of his that's actually essential to his plan. Or in short, Quaritch is making a diversionary attack on the ground to help the air mission's odds. Also, the Na'vi being a tribal warrior society its reasonable to assume that that [[AuthorityEqualsAsskicking the chiefs will lead their men from the front]], and so a ground battle of Na'vi vs. modern weapons might give him a chance to kill as many Na'vi tribal leaders as will charge at his guns, which if he pulls it off will improve the odds of his 'Break the Na'vi's will to resist' strategy that's his fundamental reason for bombing Hometree in the first place. Its not exactly SunTzu Creator/SunTzu but neither is it the IdiotBall; his ground tactics are actually serving his overall strategy to at least some degree instead of being wasted effort.
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rmvd link from folder


[[folder: Why didn't the mercs [[MacrossMissileMassacre attack the Tree of Souls with loads and loads of dumb rockets?]]]]

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[[folder: Why didn't the mercs [[MacrossMissileMassacre MacrossMissileMassacre attack the Tree of Souls with loads and loads of dumb rockets?]]]]rockets?]]
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** The flux vortex is likely similar to the one between Jupiter and most of its moons i.e. the "upper" end of the flux column is the gas giant itself.
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** Just because we don't see any reporters at Hell's Gate, doesn't mean they aren't there. And even if there aren't any reporters at Hell's Gate, all it takes is one slip up or one person's guilty conscience to tell people back on Earth about any atrocities they committed. It may take a while, but the truth will inevitably come out and the people back on Earth will be pissed when they learn about it.


** Despite this, the RDA acts more illogically than congress. The avatar project was a terrible idea from the start because the participants will inevitably go native. By the year 2154, there will be so many movies, books and TV shows about this sort of thing that the RDA should be DangerouslyGenreSavvy. But they follow every cliche in the book. This is why Genre Blindness is becoming a discredited trope.

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** Despite this, the RDA acts more illogically than congress. The avatar project was a terrible idea from the start because the participants will inevitably go native. By the year 2154, there will be so many movies, books and TV shows about this sort of thing that the RDA should be DangerouslyGenreSavvy.savvy to it. But they follow every cliche in the book. This is why Genre Blindness is becoming a discredited trope.
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[[folder: Invisible Bad Press]]
* So, the stated reason by Selfridge about the RDA's 'gentle' treatment of the Na'Vi are due to not wanting to have bad PR. However, never in the film do we see a reporter embedded on Pandora, and the humans don't have the technology to broadcast from Pandora to Earth. With everyone who works there being under the employment of the RDA, which could be quickly silenced by signed NDA agreements. The RDA controlling the information flow to and from Earth via ships that take five years. It's nonsensical, as no one from Earth can find out what you're doing unless you decide to tell them. Why worry about press at all, unless Selfridge is imagining that there are press there?
[[/folder]]
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** In short Quaritch intended the ground force to be both a diversion and a backup plan: If the Na'vi send a force to repel the ground assault, it's less Na'vi against the RDA airforce. If the Na'vi concentrate on the air assault, the ground forces can still do damage to the Tree of Souls, which means the Na'vi have no choice but to split their force to repel the assault entirely, which is a sound strategy.
Willbyr MOD

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**** I like to think that the network of interconnected flora is somehow [[NausicaaOfTheValleyOfTheWind purifying the Pandoran soil]], with Unobtanium as the byproduct, along with whatever other poisons the plants exhale. If the same process could be duplicated on Earth, with some way to control the poisons the plants give off and a short enough turnaround time, there would be no need to mine for the ore, plus you get the added bonus of repairing the Earth's biosphere. A mining concern should have on-site geologists; why didn't they team up with the biologists to see if there was a connection between the giant trees and the ore beyond "stuff grows big?"

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**** I like to think that the network of interconnected flora is somehow [[NausicaaOfTheValleyOfTheWind [[Manga/NausicaaOfTheValleyOfTheWind purifying the Pandoran soil]], with Unobtanium as the byproduct, along with whatever other poisons the plants exhale. If the same process could be duplicated on Earth, with some way to control the poisons the plants give off and a short enough turnaround time, there would be no need to mine for the ore, plus you get the added bonus of repairing the Earth's biosphere. A mining concern should have on-site geologists; why didn't they team up with the biologists to see if there was a connection between the giant trees and the ore beyond "stuff grows big?"
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*** Also, the entire ''point'' is to take advantage of the Navi's ProudWarriorRaceGuy tendencies -- given any not-blatantly-obviously-a-deathtrap chance to attack the enemy the Na'vi are going to take it, whether it ultimately serves a larger strategy or not. One of the best things you can do as a general is take advantage of any consistent habits your enemy is known to have, and Quaritch was doing exactly that.
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*** A lot of the ground troops were Horse Clan, who couldn't have been up in the air even if they wanted to. And the reason it's a diversion and works as such is because it is threatening--unchecked and left to roam, those ground troops could do damage themselves.

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[[Headscratchers/{{Avatar}} Click here]] to return to the main JustBugsMe page.

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[[Headscratchers/{{Avatar}} Click here]] to return to the main JustBugsMe Headscratchers page.


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** Makes sense from Quaritch's standpoint, then, but what about the Na'vi's? Presumably they've gotten alerted about the ground attack by Dr. Patel, since he told them about the air attack. But if Patel overheard about the ground attack, why wouldn't he also inform the natives that the ground RDA forces are just a diversion and just to have every warrior up in the air?
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* Every Na'vi fighting on the ground is a Na'vi ''not'' riding a banshee to try and attack the Dragon. Since Quaritch has more ground troops than he has flyers to carry them all at once, he's busy using his surplus ground troops to present a second threat so the enemy splits his own forces into two groups to meet both threats, instead of being free to concentrate all their force against the one group of his that's actually essential to his plan. Or in short, Quaritch is making a diversionary attack on the ground to help the air mission's odds. Also, the Na'vi being a tribal warrior society its reasonable to assume that that [[AuthorityEqualsAsskicking the chiefs will lead their men from the front]], and so a ground battle of Na'vi vs. modern weapons might give him a chance to kill as many Na'vi tribal leaders as will charge at his guns, which if he pulls it off will improvef improving odds of his 'Break the Na'vi's will to resist' strategy that's his fundamental reason for bombing Hometree in the first place. Its not exactly SunTzu but neither is it the IdiotBall; his ground tactics are actually serving his overall strategy to at least some degree instead of being wasted effort.

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* Every Na'vi fighting on the ground is a Na'vi ''not'' riding a banshee to try and attack the Dragon. Since Quaritch has more ground troops than he has flyers to carry them all at once, he's busy using his surplus ground troops to present a second threat so the enemy splits his own forces into two groups to meet both threats, instead of being free to concentrate all their force against the one group of his that's actually essential to his plan. Or in short, Quaritch is making a diversionary attack on the ground to help the air mission's odds. Also, the Na'vi being a tribal warrior society its reasonable to assume that that [[AuthorityEqualsAsskicking the chiefs will lead their men from the front]], and so a ground battle of Na'vi vs. modern weapons might give him a chance to kill as many Na'vi tribal leaders as will charge at his guns, which if he pulls it off will improvef improving improve the odds of his 'Break the Na'vi's will to resist' strategy that's his fundamental reason for bombing Hometree in the first place. Its not exactly SunTzu but neither is it the IdiotBall; his ground tactics are actually serving his overall strategy to at least some degree instead of being wasted effort.
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* Every Na'vi fighting on the ground is a Na'vi ''not'' riding a banshee to try and attack the Dragon. Since Quaritch has more ground troops than he has flyers to carry them all at once, he's busy using his surplus ground troops to present a second threat so the enemy splits his own forces into two groups to meet both threats, instead of being free to concentrate all their force against the one group of his that's actually essential to his plan. Or in short, Quaritch is making a diversionary attack on the ground to help the air mission's odds. Also, the Na'vi being a tribal warrior society its reasonable to assume that that [[AuthorityEqualsAsskicking the chiefs will lead their men from the front]], and so a ground battle of Na'vi vs. modern weapons might give him a chance to kill as many Na'vi tribal leaders as will charge at his guns, which if he pulls it off will improvef improving odds of his 'Break the Na'vi's will to resist' strategy that's his fundamental reason for bombing Hometree in the first place. Its not exactly SunTzu but neither is it the IdiotBall; his ground tactics are actually serving his overall strategy to at least some degree instead of being wasted effort.

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