Line #173 WMG/TheOrderOfTheStickTeamEvil


1	[[index]]
2	* [[WMG/TheOrderOfTheStickJossed Jossed Theories]]
3	* [[WMG/TheOrderOfTheStickConfirmed Confirmed Theories]]
4	* [[WMG/TheOrderOfTheStickTheOrderOfTheStick Theories on the Order]]
5	* [[WMG/TheOrderOfTheStickTeamEvil Theories on Team Evil]]
6	* [[WMG/TheOrderOfTheStickTheLinearGuild Theories on the Linear Guild]]
7	* [[WMG/TheOrderOfTheStickDivineBeings Theories on Divine Beings]]
8
9	[[/index]]
10
11	[[WMG: Xykon is aware that Redcloak is plotting against him.]]
12	* And he'll betray Redcloak before he betrays him.
13	* Or he knows it and he doesn't really care, [[ForTheEvulz so long as he's having fun doing it.]]
14
15	[[WMG: Jirix will be killed by the Snarl]]
16	* Considering that Jirix is resurrected every time he gets killed, what would be a better way for him to be KilledOffForReal?
17
18	[[WMG: The [=MiTD=] is the Snarl's creation.]]
19	* Yeah, I went there. The Snarl grabbed Loki randomly because he wanted a new plaything, and after somehow performing divine autopsy on Loki without killing him, the Snarl figured out how to make things so he's something that can use those reality threads.
20	* After collaborating to make Hilgya, the Snarl made the overpowered Monster In The Darkness, an extension of itself although a separate entity, but lost him after the [=MiTD=] walked through a dimension door in the Astral Plane into that jungle and hit its head as a newborn. This explains the "daddy ate a lot" comment, because what in the world could possibly eat more than all of existence except a few outer planes? Also explains the shock and awe of the audience in that circus because really, if seeing a practically non-Euclidean deity child doesn't drive you insane, it's quite scary looking. The [=MiTD=] favors telekinesis over using its reality threads and claws, because there's less chance of accidentally making way too many more rifts in reality by accidentally clawing the air wrong. It has insanely extreme magical powers reserved for deities and ridiculously epic-level casters, because it IS a deity. With a very high divine rank as it was made as the embodiment of ContinuitySnarl itself. As the [=MiTD=] is basically a very young child at this point, if anyone infuriates the [=MiTD=] too badly, it will become enraged just like daddy Snarl and blow reality up like they just don't care. The Azure City gate, which used to be the smallest, is incredibly huge and swallowing up the sky. Whatever wards Dorukan used which lasted beyond his death which destroyed the gate prevented the [=MiTD=]'s presence from expanding as the Snarl was trying to find his kid. Girard's Gate will probably explode in volume too.
21	** It is also worth noting that the Snarl does not understand the ordered system which imprisons it. Any "offspring" would likely have the same problem. Hence the Monster's frequent question "What gate?".
22	* [[http://www.enworld.org/forum/general-rpg-discussion/257742-speculation-monster-darkness-oots.html#post5100424 Actually the [=MiTD=] is very likely a Zodar]](spoilers), a monster from some obscure sourcebook, which is exactly what the WordOfGod said. Think about it. They are very strong suits of armor with just two eye slits, they are all muscle and they are very heavy and strong. They also do not speak normally, but it's mentioned that [=MiTD=] is kind of an oddball. They can cast a Limited Wish once in their lifetime and three times in their lifetime they can cause any spell to manifest as though they cast it, which what he/it did when it yelled ESCAPE!.
23	** Actually, it's unlikely the [=MiTD=] would waste the Limited Wish and 3 spells in its childhood, as it's obviously done more than that already.
24	** Zodars look like a guy in black armour. Who the hell would vomit at the sight of it? Why would someone say "I have never seen something like it" at the sight of one? Zodars fail to match the circus scene in [=SoD=].
25	** Rich has never said that [=MiTD=] is from "some obscure sourcebook".
26	** Zodars are immune to mind-control, and Xykon managed to mind-control the [=MiTD=] in ''Start of Darkness''. It's therefore not a Zodar.
27
28	[[WMG: The [=MiTD=] is the whole "Greek" Pantheon.]]
29	* Remember [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0273.html that strip]] (and the next few ones) where it is said that 4 pantheons originally existed (Norse, Southern, Classic D&D and Eastern, which is just Greek, but in the absence of Greece, can't be named as such) and that the entire Greek Pantheon fought the Snarl, dying in the process ? Well, maybe the whole Pantheon didn't as much as die than just disapear, reduced to a fraction of its immense power, shapeless and clueless. Or maybe they did die, but when the other pantheons restored order to the world, some fraction of the potential pantheon power was restored, unnoticed to the world-making gods. It probably hid/was enclosed someplace, having no-one to talk to untill Xykon stumbled upon it and decided to "subdue" it and use it for its own means, influencing it to become evil and since he had seemingly succeeded, not immagining the potential influence Mr Stiffy could have on its good side.
30	* In favour of this theory, the [=MiTD=] is exceptionally strong, resistent, has powers it itself dosen't understand, is (at least in the begining) partially/potentially evil but also capable of neutral and good acts. Story-wise, a whole fricking Pantheon would make a reveal so awesome that Xykon would keep it as a last resort, quite litteral "Deus Ex Machina".
31	** Also in favour, the [=MiTD=] said that it remembers its dad ate a lot - in Greek myth, Kronos, father of most of the major Olympians (Posidon, Zeus, Hera, Demeter, Hades, Hestia) ate his children to try and prevent them succeeding him. It makes sense that a somewhat amnesiac amalgamation of those six gods might see Kronos as their collective father, and remember that he ate them.
32	* In disfavour of this theory, Oona [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1037.html gazed under the umbrella]] and saw the [=MiTD=]'s true form, which she deems majestic...
33	** Given the shapechanger abilities of Zeus, it could also be a form assumed by the now growing wiser [=MiTD=] to fool any such atempt...
34
35	[[WMG: Team Evil will capture a gate, but not know where to go from there.]]
36	The overarching plan ''sounds'' simple: obtain a gate, be able to control it, and use it to threaten the gods. However, it's a hassle to get the gods to grant healing spells, let alone giving them demands. Considering the lack of ties to the human gods on the Team, it'll take a while for them to overcome that roadblock.
37	* I think you missed Redcloak's explanation to Tsukiko about what the ritual does. It's supposed to give the Dark One the power to shift the gate to the home plane of the gods themselves, allowing the Dark One to use the Snarl to blackmail the other gods into making goblinoids PC races as well or face annihilation.
38
39	[[WMG: Xykon and Redcloak gain staffs of power.]]
40	Xykon's staff will be a scythe, obviously, and Redcloak's will be a spear with a hole in the stabby bit for the phylactery to fit into.
41
42	[[WMG: The Monster in the Darkness is a Pokémon.]]
43	Rich Burlew says that it's not something that he made up. However, he does not say that it is something in the ''Dungeons & Dragons'' source books. Furthermore, we've seen the influence of ''Pokémon'' in how the Paladins summon their mounts. It's not unreasonable to assume that the monster could be a Pokémon. Based on the explosiveness of either its farts or burps, it would have to be either fire or dragon type, or at least have access to their move sets. It would also have to know either earthquake or fissure, as [[spoiler:it uses an attack that looks very much like those when Haley and Elan rescue Roy's corpse from it]]
44	* It might not be dragon OR fire type. might just know flamethrower, like it knows earthquake. added with the "My dad was really big and ate a lot" hint, I'd surmise he's almost certainly a munchlax getting almost big enough to evolve; mumchlax and snorlax both have access to those moves, albeit by TM. and given his friendliness to even major villains and his predilection towards finding things, I'd say he has a naive nature and the pickup ability.
45	** And, when you take into account [=MiTD=]'s appetite, being a Munchlax would make a lot of sense.
46	** Snorlax and Munchlax cannot learn Teleport, however.
47	*** They can learn metronome, though, which can imitate Teleport if the plot demands it.
48
49	[[WMG: The Monster in the Darkness is a fallen [[OurAngelsAreDifferent Solar]]]]
50	Solars have great strength, and [=DR15=]/epic, and they get earthquake as a spell-like ability. It might not remember much about why it fell or much of anything which could explain it's childishness. The "escape" thing could have been him casting miracle, and not knowing it.
51	* Miracle can't teleport things to another location on the same plane, only from one plane to another.
52	** Yes they can. They can "Duplicate any other spell of 7th level or lower" (second bullet point).
53	* Solars are embodiments of Good. Why would RC recruit one?
54	** Because this one's an idiot. Also, that would explain why it [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0549.html doesn't like eating babies]].
55	*** Solars are embodiments of the plane of good. Idiots or not, they can't do evil, and therefore ratehr unsuited for what RedCloak and Xykon want him to do.
56	* At 28 strength, Solars do not have "great strength" - that's a mere 2 points stronger than Roy
57
58	[[WMG:The Dark One isn't quite on the up and up.]]
59	Redcloak claims that goblins and the other monster races were created for the sole reason of grinding XP for the hero races. But then we have Kobolds and Lizardmen who have deific patrons (and the Kobold's deific patron is Tiamat, one of the original deities), which makes me wonder if the Dark One is conveniently ignoring things like, say, human bandits and roleplaying as sources of XP.
60	* Depends on your house rules as to whether "Good Acting" applies. Besides, it's not saying that the monster races are the only source of XP -- just that the only reason they EXIST is as one of the many sources of XP.
61	** Roleplaying XP clearly exists in the [[Webcomic/TheOrderOfTheStick Order of the Stick]] universe.
62	** I kinda get the whole ''[[Anime/Animatrix Animatrix]]'' "Second Renaissance" vibe where, despite being presented as fact, it just sounds too... propagandized, to really seem true. There's probably a good deal of truth, but a lot was exaggerated, and some details omitted.
63	* To me, the Dark One ''has'' to be evil- because the only thing that justifies fantasy heroes killing their enemies is when they are evil (or mindless). To think that Redcloak's story is true and humans just started killing goblins for its sake is taking morality issues a little too far (especially for a humorous strip.) In the early D&D editions, it was made clear that monsters CANNOT change their alignment, unlike humans and demihumans; goblins are just born evil and are always evil, which justifies killing them off. I dunno if this applies to the current edition, but it should. Sure, there can be rare exceptions (just as there monster mutations) so heroes cannot have to be careful, but in general, goblins deserve to die; the XP they give is inconsequential.
64	** And I say just having an Evil alignment isn't enough to deserve being killed if you're not doing anything actively evil. Which is presumably what happened to Redcloak's village: they were all Evil, but weren't doing anything evil.
65	*** And the Book of Exalted Deeds would agree with you. Besides, Burlew ''loves'' subverting tropes. AlwaysChaoticEvil is a trope.
66	*** Or the Dark One used to be just like Redcloak but never had a MyGodWhatHaveIDone Redloak had when a hobgoblin saved his life, as a result he became a KnightTemplar, as a result turned the monster races into the AlwaysChaoticEvil they are now, he enlist Redcloak to fix his mistakes (or finshed what he started aka kill all PC races)
67	*** We ''know'' the Dark One's backstory, though, and it's nothing like that.
68	*** Yes because we all know gods don't lie or history is never fudge or anything like that.
69	** I believe that line of thought is exactly what The Dark One wants to fight, and to change. He understands, on the same meta level that you do, that goblins were made weak and Always Chaotic Evil and thus kan be killed by adventurers without remorse, and that such an arrangement benefits adventurers and leaves all goblinkind holding the short end of the stick. And when you look at it, that's not right. Nobody should deserve to die just because of the way they were born, and the Dark One wishes to change just that. OOTS is not a purely entertaining comic, it has already touched dark themes and complex themes, and I believe this is one of them.
70	* Perhaps he was telling the truth about the origin of the monstrous humanoids, but unlike, say, the Iron Golems orc fans, the jungle island orcs, or the lizardfolk and kobolds of the Western Continent, he refuses to consider alternatives.
71	* According to Thor, the Dark One's claims aren't exactly true, but it's understandable that he might genuinely believe them.
72
73	[[WMG: Redcloak is, or will eventually become, Main/TheStarscream]]
74	Redcloak is clearly unhappy with Xykon's leadership skills, as clearly evidenced by Redcloak's [[Main/MyGodWhatHaveIDone "My God what have I done"]] moment. [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0451.html]] In that same strip, he admits that he hates all humans equally. Perhaps that also applies to former humans?
75	* Unlikely, given the prequel comic.
76	* I think Tsukikko is a more likely contender for TheStarscream position.
77	** Nope, [[spoiler:she's dead.]]
78	* I'm pretty sure this will happen. The author has clearly shifted preferences from Xykon to Red Cloak, as the latter now sounds smarter and more sympathetic than the former.
79	* Also, The "monster is charmed into attacking Redcloak if he betrays Xykon" plot point would never have been brought up if Redcloak is not going to betray Xykon. See TheLawOfConservationOfDetail.
80
81	[[WMG: The Monster in the Darkness is a gazebo.]]
82	Which, in the [[Webcomic/TheOrderOfTheStick Order of the Stick]] world, [[http://www.cs.berkeley.edu/~lorch/humor/gazebo.html is a terrifying monster]].
83	* [[ComicStrip/KnightsOfTheDinnerTable Order Of The Stick world?!]]
84	* [[TabletopGame/{{Munchkin}} Each of them must face the gazebo alone]].
85	* This is actually disturbingly plausible... it would explain why Belkar and Miko weren't able to crack him, it would explain "devouring" as the attack of choice, and it allows Rich to ascribe whatever the hell else he wants to him while still claiming it to be "pre-existing".
86	* User [=HotAndCold=] on the fan forums listed the possible points;
87	-->-A gazebo is obviously a powerful monster, devouring the story's PC without any chance of rebuttal.\
88	-It takes no damage from a +3 arrow, just as [=MitD=] apparently takes no damage from Miko's or Belkar's attacks.\
89	-Would you recognize a gazebo's tracks?\
90	-Or expect to find one in a jungle and even speaking in Common, for that matter?\
91	-It is, of course, a juvenile gazebo, explaining its roughly Medium size, rather than its being large enough for, y'know, people to hang out in it.\
92	-I... guess he could be a particularly ugly gazebo? Although technically speaking, the gazebo's never actually described in the story beyond its dimensions, color, and the pointiness of its top. So I guess one could argue the gazebo's horrific appearance.\
93	-The description states that the PC "awakened" the gazebo, implying that it was sleeping. Perhaps it had recently used one of its mighty and tiring abilities!\
94	-I'm bored and feel like justifying something completely silly!\
95
96	[[WMG: The Monster In The Darkness is Telekinetic]]
97	We never actually see it grabbing anything. In Start of Darkness, it's eating cotton candy and grabbing a steak. There is no reason for the two food items should not have whatever grabbing appendage shown, or at least obscuring part of the food. Instead, it is grabbing the food without anything shown. Even the umbrella in the main comic isn't obscured, it's just floating there. I believe it is using an at-will ability to grab various items (note, Mage Hand and its permutations will count as being telekinetic).
98	* And yet, he had to rock his cage to get to the bucket of stew. If he were telekinetic, why not just float the bucket?
99
100	[[WMG: Redcloak and Xykon are [=PCs=]]]
101	Redcloak is smarter than the average villain, uses knowledge that shouldn't be available in the setting (or at least, nobody else seems to know about), and seems to be on the same level of meta-awareness as the regular [=PCs=]. Xykon is so card-carryingly evil he's practically a parody of himself, and overall seems analogous to someone playing a villain just to screw around. The two of them aren't just NPC villains, they're a rival party playing the villainous campaign in the same setting.
102	* Or they could be played by The Antagonist - the GM's assistant who controls significant opposition [=NPCs=] during a campaign.
103	* At one point, they get to go on a PC-like dungeon crawl in which they clear out an infestation of Good-aligned creatures.
104
105	[[WMG:The Monster In the darkness is The Darkness]]
106	As in the magic missile target.
107	* He'll just probably be defeated with a magic missile.
108
109	[[WMG: The Monster in the Darkness is an Uberflumph.]]
110	Oh, the irony.
111
112	[[WMG: Sabine will be KilledOffForReal]]
113	In [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0399.html the aftermath]] of a fight with the Linear Guild, it was established the characters weren't aware of what happens when outsiders die.
114	* [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0603.html Later on]], it's confirmed that killing an outsider renders them DeaderThanDead. Knowing this, Haley will finally kill Sabine the next time she defeats her. (There's also the possibility that, since, WordOfGod states that the two are opposites in "a significant way which has yet to be revealed", Haley will be killed off for real as well. This clashes with the idea that Elan gets a happy ending, but maybe he'll eventually grow over it and find happiness somewhere else. However, this part is kind of a WMG/{{Poison Oak Epileptic Tree\|s}})
115	* Outsiders can be Resurrected. Raise Dead specifically excludes outsiders.
116	* Just checked the PHB: Raise Dead and Resurrection can't bring back outsiders, but True Resurrection can.
117
118	[[WMG: The [=MitD=] is TheChessmaster with ObfuscatingStupidity]]
119	He's gone undercover with the bad guys, but is quite noticably a good creature, allying with a paladin even. He will show himself and destroy Xykon just before the last of the gates is opened/destroyed. He will then use his TARDIS to go back in time and change the events he has seen while with Xykon so that none of the gates were ever destroyed.
120	* Actually that could make slight sense, he's actually having tea parties just to give the readers a false sense of security and that "Who can hit the lightest" game with Miko was actually him showing off his strength, not being stupid
121
122	[[WMG: Redcloak was kidding himself when he said he was not racist vs humans]]
123	He may hate all humans, but he has a special hatred for Azurites. Granted, it's pretty justified, but still, if given the choice between beating down Azurite humans and non-Azurite humans, he'd choose the Azurites if there wasn't some major difference in difficulty.
124
125	[[WMG: Xykon will become a demilich at some point in the series]]
126	* RuleOfCool, and it will be a good way to keep him the BigBad if the party gets too powerful. Though judging by recent events, he's still a little out of their league. It would also follow RuleOfFunny, since bodiless talking skulls ([[VideoGame/MonkeyIsland Murray]], [[VideoGame/PlanescapeTorment Mort]], etc.) can be pretty damn funny.
127	** [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0469.html Order of the Stick already had a talking skull.]] That being said, I fully support this theory.
128
129	[[WMG: Xykon is going to have a lot of people killed in the next few comics]]
130	To best look for his phylactery, he would want an army of skeletons or zombies since they are tireless, can see in the dark, and can withstand being underwater forever if the pressure is not too severe. Humans and goblinoids are bad for this. Mindless undead can be given simple instructions. He's going to get every zombie looking for the thing he can, and make as many zombies he can control look for it. And then he's going to kill a lot of people out of frustration.
131
132	[[WMG: Red Cloak is going to go insane]]
133	Because he has [[spoiler:one eye]] and will start hallucinating that [[spoiler:Right Eye]] is alive, and then [[spoiler:Right Eye]] will tell him to kill Xykon.
134
135	[[WMG: The Monster in the Darkness is a Howler from Animorphs.]]
136	One of those talking would certainly be a shock, they kill because they're childlike and think everything is a game. They are unaware of any evil or skill on their own part. The Monster's lifespan is a little longer than average, sure, but it's possible.
137	* Howlers have blue eyes.
138
139	[[WMG: Redcloak has some human ancestry.]]
140	''[=OotS=]'' goblins are drawn with three-toed, bird-like feet. Yet in [[StartOfDarkness Start Of]] [[TropeNamer Darkness]] his mother is consistently drawn with the standard L-shaped feet. Admittedly, we don't see her for very long, (two or three panels) but it seems odd that she alone would have human feet. Assuming she didn't have a bizarre, toe-slicing-off accident, some sort of non-goblinoid ancestry seems a likely suspect. We don't see any of her siblings, so this is hard to confirm or deny, but it would add yet another dimension to Redcloak as a character. (Incidentally, is it just me, or does he seem like the most well-developed character in the strip?)
141	* Either that, or she was wearing shoes.
142
143	[[WMG: The Monster In Darkness will kill Redcloak.]]
144	In [[StartOfDarkness Start Of]] [[TropeNamer Darkness]], Xykon uses mind control on the Monster, telling him/her that if Redcloak ever betrays Xykon, to kill and eat him. My guess is that Redcloak will finally find his limit, (perhaps via a MoralityPet) and will do a HeelFaceTurn, and will then be eaten unceremoniously, because RedemptionEqualsDeath.
145	* Except, unless I'm mistaken, those sorts of spells won't make someone do something against their nature. The [=MitD=] considers Redcloak a friend, and is about as vicious as a Carebear, making it unlikely the spell would work.
146	** "Monster, if Redcloak ever attacks me, give him a bear hug to 'calm him down' until he is asleep." As in dead.
147
148	[[WMG:The Monster in the Darkness is some variant of the "living shadow" archetype.]]
149	Because it fits this strip's brand of humor. The only question is what variant would have the capabilities the Monster has displayed.
150
151	[[WMG:Xyklon will turn out to be the BigBad]]
152	* He is "the Consequential", after all.
153	** Maybe he lost weight and became one of the three fiends.
154
155	[[WMG: The Monster in the Darkness is a Grue.]]
156	Why hasn't this been said before? It's pretty obvious, don't you think?
157	** Specifically, it's an orphaned Grue who was never taught to hate light. Having spent all its life in shadow or darkness by coincidence, should it ever achieve its ambition to be lit up, it will immediately recoil in pain.
158
159	[[WMG: The Monster in the Darkness is a young [[Franchise/CthulhuMythos Star-Spawn of Cthulhu]]]]
160	It was cribbed from the ''TabletopGame/CallOfCthulhu'' d20 variant and modified for the fact that it's not hundreds of thousands of years old. Its durability and strength would still be through the roof, and Dread Cthulhu is nothing if not a BigEater (to the tune of 1d6 investigators per round). Great Old Ones possess reality-warping abilities, and anyone who's read the proper sourcebook would recognize one with such an iconic design, but would be surprised to see it in a medieval knights-and-wizards setting. A young Star-Spawn would be far less likely than its father to drive men mad just by seeing it, and people who live in a setting where squid-headed man-things are no big deal would be even less likely to react with utter terror - although vomit-inducing disgust certainly isn't out of the question.
161
162	[[WMG:The Monster in the Darkness is [[http://www.giantitp.com/Images/RichBrandNew.gif this guy]]]]
163	>_> <_<
164	* That's a 403.
165	** Refresh from the URL bar. It worked for me.
166
167	[[WMG: The Monster in the Darkness is a smoke monster.]]
168	Possibly a young [[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/nightmare.htm cauchemar]], which would work since it's young for its species, and while still strong, probably not the size of a large warhorse (depending on Windstriker's size and breed). However, the guess was meant to be that it was a monster ''made of'' smoke, that just fits the clues about the [=MitD=] more than a proper smoke monster would (especially since the [=MitD=] is ''clearly'' surrounded by a cone of darkness or smoke [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0096.html here]], and not just standing in shadow. Perhaps sunlight affects the Monster's ability to produce smoke, as well as stay corporeal). And no, before anyone brings it up, it's ''not'' the one from ''Series/{{Lost}}''. That one was more dark grey.
169
170	[[WMG: Xykon is a [[Franchise/KingdomHearts Nobody]].]]
171	We have a near emotionless being with ElementalPowers. [[SignificantAnagram He has an]] [[LetXBeTheUnknown X]] in his name. He lost his heart at a very young age (pre StartOfDarkness) which is why he doesn't care about getting his heart back. And [[Literature/HaruhiSuzumiya I know where will is go.]]
172	* "Near-emotionless?" He sure seems to have the "enjoys the hell out of seeing others suffer" and "really, really pissed off" emotions pretty well covered.
173	** I said "near" emotionless. And the above gives him the exact same emotional range as Larxene.
174	* Wait, does this mean his name before he became a Nobody was [[Literature/HaruhiSuzumiya Kyon]]?
175	** He and Haruhi were playing D&D and then he wanted to play ''Kingdom Hearts'' and things spiralled out of control from there.
176
177	[[WMG: Xykon is planning to get rid of Redcloak]]
178	He's been having Tsukiko research what appears to be the Arcane half of the ritual to open one of the gates. At Durkon's gate, it seemed that they were all ready and raring to go, so they must have figured out both halves of the ritual by then. So why have Tsukiko study it?
179
180	Xykon is getting tired of fighting Redcloak over policy and how to do things. ''And'' he's pissed at him for losing his Phylactery. So he's looking for someone else who can figure out the spell he needs for power, so he can give Redcloak the boot down the road. And while the idea may sicken him, he'd have to admit, there's an advantage to giving your phylactery to someone who professes to ''love'' undead.
181
182	[[WMG: Alternatively, Xykon genuinely cares about Redcloak.]]
183	Hey, I've seen less likely [=WMGs=] on this page. Sure there was the whole "eye" thing, and StartOfDarkness showed Xykon as just plain sadistic towards Redcloak, but there was [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0462.html this strip]].
184	* Also, Xykon often makes comment's about having to show off something to Redcloak. Two prominent examples are when he noted having to tell Redcloak the symbol of insanity worked, and when he specifically sent a note to Redcloak about how he conducted an interview in the middle of a battle. Plus, Redcloak gets away with alot of things Xykon would kill a minion for without a second thought. In general, he's probably the closest thing to a friend Xykon has.
185
186	[[WMG: The Divine half of the gate-opening ritual requires the self-sacrifice of the caster, and the ritual cannot be stopped once the Arcane half is complete.]]
187	Xykon may genuinely care about Redcloak, or Redcloak may know enough about the ritual to not do it, but Xykon has no qualms about getting rid of Tsukiko the next time her death becomes useful.
188	* I'm sorry, you lost me at "Xykon may genuinely care about Redcloak".
189	** You lost me at "Xykon may genuinely care".
190	*** I said "''[[MillionToOneChance may]]''".
191
192	[[WMG: The Monster In The Darkness is a human child]]
193	Self Explanitory. It's just a very powerful reature that doesn't know any better, and consistently rolls very well. That's why it can't be harmed.
194
195	[[WMG: The Monster In The Darkness will be extremely cute.]]
196	This seems like something they would do. -shrug-
197	* It's ''already'' cute.
198
199	[[WMG: The Monster in the Darkness is invisible.]]
200	Xykon put an invisibility spell on it after ''Start of Darkness'' (hey, I just got that it references getting the [=MitD=], as well as the other things!) and didn't realize that it would ruin the [[TheReveal dramatic de-shadowing]].
201
202	[[WMG: Xykon will be thrown into one of the Gates, and there will be an ''Franchise/IndianaJones'' reference.]]
203	We already know they're [[MacGuffin MacGuffins]], so...
204	* ...What? Xykon ''was'' thrown into one of the gates. And what does Franchise/IndianaJones have to do with {{MacGuffin}}s specifically?
205
206	[[WMG: The Creature In The Darkness IS an aspect of the snarl, but it is inside the shell of an animal.]]
207	The same as the WMG above, but it dispells the reasoning that calls for it to be incorrect. I do not know if the snarl has this ability, but it makes a bit of sense.
208
209	[[WMG: The Monster in the Darkness is Ollie the Dragon.]]
210	From ''Kukla, Fran, and Ollie.'' Xykon found him in the arena and decided to use him for his evil plot.
211	* Except we saw where Xykon found him, during ''Start of Darkness''.
212
213	[[WMG: The Monster in the Darkness can channel touch spells through Xykon.]]
214	Consider: spellcasters can channel touch spells through their familiars. Dimension Hop is a touch spell that can teleport. Granted, the spell is short ranged, but this can be circumvented with homebrewed metamagic. The Monster in the Darkness channeled dimension hop/similar spell through Xykon and saved V/O-chul.
215
216	[[WMG: Xykon and Redcloak will succeed in finishing the ritual...]]
217	Only to fail in their ultimate goal becaus the snarl no longer exists.[[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0672.html As evidenced here.]] Redcloak will also reveal the ritual's true purpose moments after it is complete, leading Xykon to kill him out of frustration and boredom.
218
219	[[WMG: The Monster in the Darkness is a Polymorphed Wizard.]]
220	He lost his memory due to... let's say a head injury, but managed to retain his spellcasting abilities. Hence the "Stomping"(Earthquake spell), the mystery teleportation, and the fact that whatever creature he is isn't commonly found in the jungle or able to speak common.
221	* Question is, what did he Polymorph into
222
223	[[WMG: The [=MitD=] will destroy Xykon.]]
224	At some point in the future, Redcloak will seek to finally rid himself of Xykon, and they'll clash. The Monster, [[spoiler: thanks to Xykon's curse he put upon the monster in StartOfDarkness]], will be horribly conflicted, and decide to TakeAThirdOption and just [[LeeroyJenkins blindly leap into battle]]. His immense weight will smash Xykon into dust, and might even give the lich's soul a few bruises.
225
226	[[WMG: Monster in the Darkness, possible 8-bit image.]]
227	I wish I could remember where I read it, but I remember hearing that Rich himself stated that the go board in [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0651.html strip 651]] was more than a symbolic image of [=MitD=], but included a reference to his physical appearance. The slightly off-set go pieces, the tilt, I always had trouble looking at it until today. It hit me to convert the board into an 8-bit image. This is what you get [[https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/MonsterintheDarkness-GoBoard_3414.png :Linky!]]. The top row is as the go-board is with yellow eyes added for clarification's sake (explained below). The bottom row is inverting the colors just for a different perspective.
228
229	Keep in mind that this is a black and white image of a creature that could be easily purple and green so some imagination still is needed. Also, there are two ways of looking at this. First, the holes in the darkness are [=MitD=]'s eyes left blank. This would turn the entire go board into the [=MitD=]'s full body or upper body. The second possibility when you note the consistent use of perspective is the eye sockets are encased in white. This means that the Go-board, if my memory about what it is supposed to be is right, is only of the [=MitD=]'s head.
230
231	I don't play, nor have I, D&D so I don't know what monsters or creatures are considered canon. Rich did state it was a guessable creature that existed in 2004 and earlier. I hope this can help someone more knowledgeable than I am in this quest to guess [=MitD=].
232
233	* Good work there. I think the face is the rectangle with the eyes, down left part the right arm, down right part the belly, and between the belly and the face is the chest, composed of two parts. The rest is background. However I don't know what kind of creature it might be, I know D&D stuff enough to get the comic's jokes but not enough to make a good guess. Still I might add some info: the creature, whatever it is, must have arms in order to push Miko while playing "who can hit the slightless" and also to carry the umbrella, which adds the fact of it having prensile fingers (more proof: it can hold Go pieces and Monopoly money). Going from there it can be presumed to be humanoid, the umbrella can cover the [=MitD=] with no problem, and it seems bipedal.
234	** As an 8-bit spriter, I can say that the full body sprites bear more then a passing resemblance to Classic Megaman's jump sprite. I wouldn't be surprised if that's a hint as to it's physical form.
235	* Brilliant! Going off of this revelation, my own guess would have to be a giant [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0080.html hand]] [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0561.html puppet]].
236	** So the MITD is Banjo? The oracle ''did'' say that Elan would get his happy ending...
237
238	[[WMG: Redcloak will end up giving up on the Plan.]]
239	Back in Start of Darkness we learn Right-eye's daughter is still alive, and we can see too that Xykon charms the [=MitD=] so it will eat Redcloak the moment he betrays Xykon. Probably when the comic nears its end Redcloak will find his niece, safe and sound and maybe even living peacefully with a human family (Right-eye was worried about her living with humans), and will realize that his brother was right, even more if Xykon kills them all, or only her if she's alone.
240
241	There's also the possibility of Redcloak's niece making Redcloak have a VillainousBSOD when she blames him for the death of her father when he encounters her. Either way this will also be the time when we'll get to see what the Monster in the Darkness is, as it will try to eat Redcloak for disobeying Xykon. Bonus points if O'Chul's words make the [=MitD=] fight the charm in order to be what he wants to be and helps Redcloak survive and then both of them fight Xykon together, maybe even with help from the Order in a last battle against the undead sorcerer.
242	* Tsukiko's discovery regarding the critical spell [[spoiler: it's conjuration, so it most likely ''unleashes the [[EldritchAbomination Snarl]]'']], if true, effectively kills the plan on the spot, as Xykon (and just about anyone else who could work) doesn't want to destroy the world. It also means that the Dark One lied about the Plan and was actually cutting directly to plan B (i.e. [[spoiler: unmake reality and help rebuild it with his terms]].) Considering his successes so far, including forming a stable, fully functional and ''internationally recognized goblin civilization'', Redcloak might be rather displeased about this. Combined with something to knock him out of his comfort zone, like meeting Right-Eye's daughter, and Redcloak could very well walk out of the whole thing.
243	** Except Tsukiko got the context of the spell wrong, and Redcloak not only knew about it all along [[spoiler: (Hell, he's been actively ''lying'' to Xykon about it)]], but it doesn't affect his own efforts for goblin equality at all, so this isn't going to knock him out of his comfort zone. Given recent revelations, it's entirely possible that even if/when Right-Eye's daughter ''does'' show up, it won't be enough to convince Redcloak to abandon the Plan.
244
245	Because otherwise I can't see why Richard would put those [[ChekhovsGun Chekhov's Guns]] in the first place. Anyone wants to debate?
246	* Xykon's charm command could just be him being GenreSavvy. Right-Eye's daughter, on the other hand, is an obvious ChekhovsGun.
247
248	[[WMG: The Monster in the Darkness will have a HeelFaceTurn and destroy Xykon's Phylactery]]
249	In strip #147, Redcloak doesn't let the Monster hold Xykon's phylacetery because he says the Monster'll break it. The Monster's friendship with O-Chul starts the turn, and in the end the Monster will reveal themself -- to help destroy Xykon.
250
251	[[WMG: The [=MitD=] is an angel]]
252	Not the [good] outsider, but the [[Literature/TheBible real deal]]
253	* Hunter's reaction is a bit of a weak link, given most of them do speak, though doing it in "common" would be a surprise.
254	* Would explain the audience at the circus's reaction (A big step under a Seraph's "cause people to burst into flames and die", but still warranted with some descriptions in the book)
255	* God sends them to destroy cities, so they should be quite strong
256	* Depending on the writer, they do reproduce, so the dad comment works
257	* Would explain the [=MitD's=] naive but overall good nature.
258	* Redcloak knows what it is. Given he has alreddy made use of the real deal of something in place of fantasy versions (elementals) once. Also would be covered under a know skill that is a class skill for clerics.
259	* Easily fits into public domain.
260	* This would also explain how it knows of the Astral Plane, even if it cannot remember being there: It was BORN there.
261
262	[[WMG: Redcloak will ''try'' to abandon the Plan, but will have a HeelFaceDoorSlam.]]
263	This is related to the "Redcloak will give up on the Plan" one further up the page. The sequence of events described there will probably play out, but then something will happen that prevents him from completing the HeelFaceTurn. Perhaps:
264	* Tsukiko kills him for turning on Xykon
265	* The [=MitD's=] mind control forces it to kill him
266	* The Dark One performs a VillainOverride via the Crimson Mantle.
267
268	[[WMG: Xykon will attempt to take Kraagor's Gate first.]]
269	Because punishing Roy for being too specific once just wouldn't be enough. He asked for the first of the two gates Xykon would be within of first, not which one he'd actually attack. Xykon will approach Girard's gate first, but with both the Order and Linear Guild (which has access to the forces of at least 1, possibly 3, local empires, should Tarquin decide keeping Xykon from it is important enough) attempting to take it, he turns around and heads for the last gate.
270
271	[[WMG: The [=MiTD=] is an Atropal.]]
272	Think about this one for a minute. It's constantly surrounded by undead, it has a childlike disposition, absurd powers for its size, and is supposed to be utterly terrifying. What could be more terrifying than an undead god fetus?
273	* Atropals are undead. They don't eat while [=MiTD=] loves to eat.
274
275	[[WMG: Redcloak believes Xykon in [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0833.html panel 3 of this exchange]]]]
276	Not because Xykon is telling the truth or anything. Far from it. He's lying through his teeth. It's just that Xykon is an epic level character, estimated to be about 32nd level if his fire immunity comes from a self-crafted ring and not simply an abuse of the custom item creation table. If he is 32nd level, then with bluff as the only Charisma-based class skill of sorcerers, and assuming it is maxed out or nearly so, that means that he's got something like 35 ranks + massive Charisma vs. Redcloak's decent Wisdom + at most 10 ranks in Sense Motive (what with it being a cross-class skill), and him spending a lot of his skill points in various knowledge skills, Xykon merely did [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0767.html this comic]] with less humourous overtones. In other words, he can beat the +20 to deceive someone with an insane, outright unbelievable lie. Xykon has already bluffed other people, like [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0106.html the Order itself, even though he said out loud "wink, wink"]]
277
278	[[WMG: Redcloak has regenerated his eye.]]
279	Redcloak regenerated his eye shortly after getting the patch, but keeps it on to make Xykon believe that he is obeying his orders. Whenever he is alone, he takes the patch off so that he doesn't have eye problems.
280
281	Admit it, it would be totally cool: in the moment when Redcloak betrays Xykon (when the Plan gets carried on), he will take off the patch and say "Damn, I was fed up of this stupid patch", and by then Xykon will realise the size of his folly in trusting Redcloak's plan. Then, either Redcloak manages to pull off something that destroys Xykon (and the Monster in the Darkness attacks Redcloak due to his betrayal of Xykon), or Xykon could attempt to kill Redcloak but then the Dark God saves Redcloak by taking him away or by using something similar to Thor's Thunders to destroy Xykon. Alternatively, Xykon could get killed by the Snarl.
282
283	[[WMG: Xykon knows what Redcloak is really up to; he just doesn't care.]]
284
285	Xykon knows full well what Redcloak is planning to do with the Gate, but Xykon is fully confident that the Dark One's plan won't work because it basically relies on blackmail and a constant threat. Since the Snarl is basically dormant (and Xykon is fully capable of flying and seeing what was inside the rift; Redcloak isn't) there's no real danger of opening a Gate onto the realm of the gods. He's going to wait for Redcloak's plan to fail, call him an idiot, bully him into being properly loyal, and use the Gate to control the real world by tossing ordinary humans into God-knows-where. It doesn't actually change his plans if the world on the other side of the Gate isn't actually dangerous as long as he knows it can remove them from their lives and possibly their chosen deities.
286
287	[[WMG: The identity of the [=MitD=] will never be revealed.]]
288	As with a lot of mysteries which have been gradually built up to a big revelation, there's a chance that if we were to learn exactly what the [=MitD=] really was it would be something of an anti-climax no matter what it was. Ergo, we'll never learn precisely what it is. At most, if/when it's cover of darkness is broken, all that will be seen will be a blinding and all-obscuring bright light, and the reactions of various awestruck characters saying things along the lines of "What ''is'' that?!" and "Is ''that'' a...?" before being cut off.
289	* Jossed. Rich Burlew has said he has already planned the reveal of [=MiTD=]
290
291	[[WMG: Xykon knows what lies beyond the Gates.]]
292	* When he was being destroyed by the Gate rune, maybe he got a glimpse of the planet beyond. "Hey, this isn't so bad" may have simply been him realizing that the Gate didn't contain a god-killing abomination -- it contained an entire world for him to conquer.
293
294	[[WMG: Xykon knows Redcloak is lying about the Gate Ritual but doesn't know how.]]
295
296	Redcloak's major ace in the hole is that he knows something about the gate ritual he's not telling Xykon and he plans to use it against Xykon once the ritual is complete. Xykon, however, had a chance to figure out how much Redcloak was actually telling him, though - Tsukiko. He made sure his half of the gate ritual got to Tsukiko then sent the [=MiTD=] to tell her it's only half a ritual knowing she'd seek out Redcloak's half. He then sat back and watched how Redcloak would respond to that; when Redcloak killed Tsukiko that told Xykon Redcloak was hiding something. This would explain why Xykon wasn't at all upset at Tsukiko's death - By getting killed she told him more than she ever could have realistically figured out on her own.
297
298	[[WMG: Redcloak will betray Xykon once he's outlived his usefulness, but not before giving him an IronicEcho of Xykon's EvilerThanThou speech from ''Start of Darkness''.]]
299
300	Throw in a "dramatically smashing [[SoulJar Xykon's phylactery]]" scene, and the circle will be complete.
301	* Though given [[spoiler: what Xykon did to the MITD, namely cast a Suggestion that will cause him to eat Redcloak if Redcloak betrays Xykon, Xykon might give a MeaningfulEcho of his own "Oh Redcloak, don't confuse not caring with not knowing" line.]]
302	** Suggestion's effects aren't permanent, and that was years ago. Unless Xykon's been recasting it on a regular basis that's highly unlikely.
303	*** Xykon had enough forward thinking to get the positive energy ring. He'd probably find a sufficiently permanent way of enrapturing the MITD.
304
305	[[WMG: By switching out Holy Symbols, Redcloak doomed Xykon.]]
306	* Had everything gone as Xykon thought it went, the phylactery would be in the astral plane, where the heroes can't yet get to, and in the middle of a probably epic-level dungeon, and the heroes would be none the wiser. However, because Redcloak switched the symbols, now it's with Redcloak, where it is much less protected, and it's also ''exactly'' where the Order of the Stick thinks it is.
307
308	[[WMG: The Dark One's Plan will not be necessary]]
309	Goblins will achieve equality some other way. They already have their own city, Gobbotopia, why must that be the end of it?
310
311	[[WMG: Red cloak will get a series of natural 20s when he finally betrays Xykon.]]
312	When the goat turns red strikes true.
313	When the coat turns red strikes true.
314	When the Red coat turns the Red Mantle strikes true.
315	When Red Cloak turns coat the Red Mantle strikes true.
316	* So did you just skip over #60, or...?
317	** No I had forgotten enough details of 76 to pretend it could be another false alarm.
318
319	[[WMG: Goblin Dan will be far more instrumental in Goblinoid equality than Redcloak does]]
320	A big reason for the inequality is due to resource distribution. However, if there was a way to easily get food to people, a big reason for raiding will stop. So, instead of creating animosity like Redcloak does, Goblin Dan will build his people up instead of taking from others.
321	* There were a couple of goblins serving "[[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0705.html hydra burgers]]" at the Gobbotopia founding celebrations.
322
323	[[WMG: When Xykon meets with the Order again, he will remember who Vaarsuvius is.]]
324	Roy is not amused.
325	* Alternatively: Xykon will remember Vaarsuvius, but pretend that he doesn't. Acknowledging V would mean acknowledging that the elf has hurt him in ways the others haven't.
326
327	[[WMG: Redcloak will betray Xykon and the Order Of The Stick will join The Plan]]
328	In Xykon's MoralEventHorizon moment at the end of ''Start of Darkness,'' he breaks Redcloak; however, it is quite possible that he will eventually push Redcloak too far, causing him to come out of his denial and decide to get rid of Xykon. The Order may join in this fight, possibly leading to the death of Belkar. The Order may learn the full details of The Plan and come to the conclusion that it is, sort of, fair. Rather than allowing Redcloak to find another chaotic evil wizard, Redcloak and V will end up performing the plane shift of the last gate. Then things will somehow go horribly wrong, allowing the adventure to continue; possibly against the Dark One who abuses his power as soon as he's handed a gate and maybe a corrupt/controlled V and Redcloak. Roy will die and go to LG heaven, however since it was somebody outside the family that actually defeated Xykon, Eugene will not. Haley and Elan will somehow survive this ordeal, and get the happy ending, though it will not be what the think. Durkon's body will be returned to his homeland after having been killed by trees suffering from epilepsy.
329	* Bear in mind that Redcloak is a negative energy cleric, and sooner or later is going to be high enough level to rebuke/command Xykon...
330	** It's mentioned in the [[ContinuityLockout only sourcebook that ever went into any real detail about liches]] that one of the advantages of lichdom is fast level gain. Liches never have to sleep, never have to eat, they can just sit in their studies perfecting arcane arts... forever. Or fly across the countryside sweeping towns with Cloudkill for the XP. Xykon could quite easily get even further ahead of Redcloak whenever he feels like it.
331
332	[[WMG: Xykon will be the one to screw up the Three Fiends' plans]]
333	Xykon's group is the only one without an agent of the Three Fiends ready to act on their commands, whether they want to or not. ContractualGenreBlindness aside, Xykon is also one of the few characters powerful enough, and more importantly, unpredictable enough, to screw up a [[TheChessmaster Chessmaster's]] plans.
334	* I'm thinking Xykon, upon finding out these guys are trying to play him, will invade the netherworld and nuke them personally.
335
336	[[WMG: the final battle will be nine-sided and the roaches'll say ''see? we told yo so'']]
337	I'm not sure how will be in them, but my guess is that hilgya or right-eye's daughter (or both) coming back and forming their own groups
338	* or leeky and pompey
339	* Already confirmed by WordOfGod in the commentary from Don't Split The Party. There is one side we don't know about yet (or didn't know about at the end of the book).
340	** Let's see... sides that will probably be involved:
341	*** The Order of the Stick (obviously)
342	*** Xykon (again, this seems obvious)
343	*** The Linear Guild (another obvious one)
344	*** Hinjo's forces (not definite, they're friends/allies with the Order, so those two may be a single side)
345	*** Girard himself (...if he hasn't been confirmed dead)
346	*** Redcloak and an army of Goblins & Hobgoblins (seems reasonable that he'd split off from Xykon at some point)
347	*** Tarquin and his army
348	*** The other nobles of Azure City
349	*** [[RuleOfFunny The Flumphs]] maybe?
350	** (Sorry, breaking the nine) But may I add the archfiends?
351	[[WMG: The comics will end with an epic battle between the Dark One and Xykon about controlling the gate(s)]]
352	that will end when the Order of the Stick shows up and re-seals the gate(s).
353
354	[[WMG: Redcloak will reveal his backstory in an attempt to get sympathy points...]]
355	And no one will show any sympathy for him - BUT someone will express frustration with the Sapphire Guard. "You went and slaughtered a goblin village to eliminate the threat of the Crimson Mantle, and in the process, created the threat you were trying to eliminate! NiceJobBreakingItHero!"
356	** I don't see this one happening.
357
358	[[WMG:The spell that relocates Gates will be used to move Kraagor's to Xykon's Astral Plane- fortress- tomb- thingie.]]
359	This will force the Order to go through it to get the Gate. Which means that this series [[BookEnds ends with our heroes crawling through a dungeon, created by Xykon, with a Gate at the end.]]
360	* And the strip when they come in will be called [[CallBack Dungeon Crawlin' Fools]].
361	* Alternatively, maybe the ritual that moves the Gate will be weaponized for that purpose; Xykon retreats to his massive astral-plane stronghold, and either Redcloak or the Order [[EnemyMine or both]] decide they've had enough of his shenanigans and [[ThereIsNoKillLikeOverkill unleash the Snarl inside his fortress]].
362
363	[[WMG: At some point Xykon switched out the phylactery Redcloak has.]]
364	Xykon knows that Redcloak has his own plans even if he doesn't know what those plans are and he takes the safety of his phylactery very seriously. It seems reasonable he would have put his real phylactery somewhere safer than around the neck of somebody not completely loyal to him but feigns fear when the other is lost and such.
365
366	[[WMG: The Ancient Black Dragon will be brought back as a Dracolich by Redcloak.]]
367	Tiamat is one of the few deities on speaking terms with the Dark One and she might be in on the plan to use the gates. It's not that hard to believe she'll offer the soul of a skilled draconic arcane spellcaster with a grudge against the Order to replace Xykon.
368	* In addition, Redcloak will offer to perform a True Resurrection on her son.
369
370	[[WMG: The Monster In The Darkness is a dire Alkada]]
371	Let's see. Usually clueless? Check. Likely to get distracted when confronted with a shiny object? Check. [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0661.html Capable of random spells?]] '''''Check'''''.
372
373	[[WMG: The Monster in the Dark is a baby (or possibly reincarnated) Tarrasque]]
374	We know the [=MiTD=] is NighInvulnerable, a BigEater, vulnerable to MindControl, [[TokenGoodTeammate not evil]], very, extremely rare, and absurdly powerful. The Tarrasque checks off all these points:
375	* Its purpose is literally to eat the entire world (albeit small portions at a time), which would easily translate into a voracious appetite (and explain how the [=MiTD=] can eat things like moldy cheeseburgers without suffering any ill effects).
376	* Its carapace reflects spells and is obscenely difficult to penetrate by normal means: of course any attack directed its way would just "tickle".
377	* The Tarrasque has a long list of effects it's immune to (poison, disease, inclement weather, etc.) and is resistant to virtually every kind of damage: while the adult Tarrasque can't be charmed, the [=MiTD=] is still young (probably... being only Medium when the adult is Colossal would tend to imply it's an infant) and might be vulnerable to mind effects.
378	* Though created for destruction, the Tarrasque is TrueNeutral.
379	* The Tarrasque is a SingleSpecimenSpecies, which makes it hard to find any more anywhere.
380	* The adult Tarrasque is an Epic-level challenge, absurdly so in later versions.
381
382	[[WMG: Redcloak will be the one to [[spoiler: resurrect Durkon.]]]]
383	Roy specifically [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1029.html pointed out]] that it's very unlikely the team will have the time to swing back to the Godsmoot and get one of the clerics there to do it before they have to go confront Xykon at Kraagor's Gate. However, [[spoiler:leaving Durkon out of the final battle with Xykon]] isn't particularly narratively fulfilling, not to mention the Order needing all the help they can get if Xykon is actually to be defeated. It's clear from Redcloak's recent [[spoiler: phylactery substition]] that he's gearing up to actually turn on Xykon after all these years. Redcloak may choose to betray Xykon at a time when the Order happens to be watching, or in fact, betray Xykon by ''helping the Order'' since they're probably his best shot at seeing Xykon dead. If he aids the Order at a critical juncture in battle or even outright saves their lives, the Order is likely to help ''him'' if [[spoiler:the [=MiTD=] does in fact try to eat him, per Xykon's hypnosis orders in ''Start of Darkness'']], if only based on the fact that he could be a valuable asset in Xykon's ultimate defeat or in gaining more intel on the Gates. (This is assuming that Xykon would then survive the encounter and head off by himself.) Then if he and Roy actually talk at all, they ''might'' find some common ground or at least be able to tolerate each other enough to [[EnemyMine work together]]. In which case, Roy would [[spoiler:ask Redcloak to resurrect Durkon]], and, seeing that doing so would be tactically useful, and factoring in the fact that Redcloak [[spoiler:hates ''humans'', not ''dwarves'']], Redcloak would agree. There's also some potential foreshadowing as a Throw-Away Gag way in back the Greysky City Thieves' Guild arc, when Haley complains that they can't resurrect Roy without his body, [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0579.html not without a 17th level cleric]], whereupon Belkar states that he bets Redcloak is 17th level. And as of [[http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0826.html strip 826]], Redcloak is... 17th level.
384
385	[[WMG: Redcloak actually is fond of Xykon]]
386	Maybe it's that he's the only other man on OOTS Earth who's lived with him long enough to understand how he is since Right-Eye is gone. Maybe it's that part of him finds Xykon's open, shameless, Chaotic Evil refreshing instead of having to endlessly rationalize his atrocities. Whatever the case, Redcloak, even after all that Xykon has done, deep down has grown to hold Xykon as a genuine friend. This will play a role when Team Evil comes into conflict with itself as Xykon and Redcloak's clashing goals put the team in jeopardy. When Redcloak has a surefire shot to end or otherwise remove Xykon as a threat, he'll try... and hesitate. He won't have the heart to finish or remove the closest to the only man he can call a friend as opposed to an ally.
387
388	[[WMG: The Monster in the Darkness is a Paragon half-giant]]
389	Point the first: when the MitD teleported O-Chul and Vaarsuvius away, its eyes glowed. This implies that it was a psionic power, so we want to look at the psionic monsters. Point the second: the MitD once used an ability that seems an awful lot like a more powerful version of the half-giant's "stomp" ability. Point the third: the MitD says that his father was really big, much larger than the MitD himself is -- thus, possibly, a giant.
390	The Monster is obviously much more powerful than an ordinary half-giant, but he could be a Paragon (or double paragon, or somerthing).
391
392	[[WMG: Redcloak will be the deciding vote at the Godsmoot]]
393	The Dark One has as much right to vote as any other god. He's not strictly part of the Northern pantheon, but given that the other pantheons have already voted, this is his last chance to make his voice heard. Redcloak, unlike Elan, is certainly a powerful enough cleric to cast the contact spell. The Dark One shouldn't want the world to be destroyed, because it conflicts with the Plan. Also, Redcloak's betrayal of Xykon is all but guaranteed at this point. If he and the Order find themselves unlikely allies at the Godsmoot, it paves the way for Redcloak to help them get rid of Xykon.
394
395	[[WMG: [=MitD=]'s identity: "Quick, kids: figure out which monsters have 'trenchant political analysis' as a Special Attack!"]]
396	Really, when the demon-roaches put it like ''that'', there's only one thing he can be. That's right, the Monster in the Darkness is none other than [[spoiler: a [[https://www.themarysue.com/make-your-computer-auto-convert-any-mention-of-sjw-to-skeleton-for-maximum-spoopiness/ skeleton]]!]] [-[[HumorMode This theory is absolutely perfect and cannot possibly be flawed in any way.]]-]
397
398	[[WMG: Xykon ''WANTS'' to destroy the world.]]
399
400	Xykon has constantly demonstrated a love of causing pain and suffering. He has cited his main motivation for his evil deeds as his own amusement. What better way to amuse himself, cause so much pain and commit the ultimate act of sadism than just unleash the unspeakable god-killing abomination on the world?
401
402	* As others have theorized, he may be aware of Redcloak’s intended betrayals, and it doesn’t matter because using the Snarl to destroy the world (or at least enabling it and thus being responsible for its destruction) is his entire goal anyway.
403
404	* Most of all, it’s the ''simplest'' way to get what he wants, which is a cure for his boredom, victory over his enemies, and pain and suffering for him to enjoy. It lines up with his characterization perfectly.
405
406	* [[FridgeBrilliance That’s why he’s so chill about the fact that there’s only one Gate left to stop everything from going into the shitter for everyone, including himself. Because even though he wants to control the Snarl to destroy everything (which explains why he’s even bothered trying to use a ritual in the first place, he’s fine with it as long as his actions eventually lead to the world’s destruction.]]
407
408	* Xykon may also be banking on being powerful enough to ''survive'' it. Thor mentioned Xykon has a hidden fortress in the Astral Plane, and the monument graveyard shows the Snarl can't reach that far or the monuments would be destroyed too. Xykon may set the end of the world in motion then simply retreat to his astral stronghold and watch everything be destroyed on his Tivo while laughing, then be given a whole new world to torture.
409
410	* This could also be why he's keeping Redcloak busy or distracted - Xykon has been shown to hide brilliance behind his lazy facade before, and he knows that in keeping Redcloak away from the Godsmoot he can prevent anybody from figuring out how important Redcloak actually is, increasing the chances that the world is destroyed.
411
412	[[WMG: The one to destroy Xykon...]]
413	... will be Redcloak's niece, AKA Right-Eye's daughter.
414
415	[[WMG: Redcloak's niece will be the one to channel the purple qiddity to close the rifts]]
416
417	Redcloak will betray Xykon and be eaten by the MitD, but he will pass the crimson mantle onto his niece as a ghost, just as the previous high priest did with him, and then she'll close the rifts
418
419	[[WMG: Redcloak will agree to Thor's deal... and the Dark One will disown him for it.]]
420	Redcloak may be driven by SunkCostFallacy, but he is still a mortal and as such can still change and grow. The Dark One on the other hand, is a god, shaped by the beliefs of the goblin people. The stories of how he was unjustly betrayed may well have turned him into a god of vengeance, literally incapable of cutting deals with Thor in any way that doesn't at least partially involve getting back at him for the previous murder attempt. Redcloak will help seal Kraagor's Gate and lose his cleric powers as soon as the Dark One realizes what Redcloak has done, leaving Banjo, clown god of puppets to save the day and seal the other gates!
421
422	[[WMG: Redcloak will be deified]]
423	Redcloak has united the Goblin races, founded Gobbotopia, is closer than any before to carrying out the Dark Ones plans. He is on track to follow in the Dark Ones path & gain divinity from the Goblins worship at this rate.
424
425	[[WMG: Redcloak's fate is to be the Fiend Council's personal pit fiend]]
426	This is how it will happen.
427
428	The Dark One will engage in some off-screen negotiations with Thor without Redcloak's assistance. It will probably start with The Dark One attacking Thor, under the idea that Thor prevented him from learning about the Godsmoot. However, it happens, The Dark One's first personal message to Redcloak will be to give up on The Plan because it its objective has been achieved - full equality for goblins with other humanoids recognized by all the Pantheons.
429
430	Because this occured without him, and without him using Xykon, Redcloak will not accept it. He will twist reason and logic to argue that The Dark One, patron god of goblins, has given up on the goblins, and so he will have to become a god himself in order to ensure The Plan is a success. That is when the Fiend Council will arrive.
431
432	They will offer him a deal much like they did to V, power in exchange for certain control of his soul. They can't turn him into a full deity, but they will assure him that he will be ''close'' and in the perfect position to gain worship. They will make him into an arch demon/devil/daemon/etc. who will then make infernal pacts with mortals. If he makes enough, he might be able to become an evil god.
433	Just to screw with him, the pacts he makes will be with those who are self-righteous enough to delude themselves, or gamblers fallen prey to the SunkCostFallacy. So his fate will be to tempt people just like himself into selling their souls, but he will keep telling himself that it will all be worth it once he is a god and able to protect all goblins, as is the goal of The Plan.
434
435	[[WMG:Oona faked the tracking]]
436	Odd she didn't use her Warg to sniff out the two dwarves going into the entrance. Wargs don't need personal tracks. In addition, she likes the Monster, and one has to wonder what conversations she's had with it. She's playing a deeper game, and it took her a while to act while Redcloak and Durkon were fighting, instead of just leaping in.
437	* The Warg reveals he ''was'' confused by the smells not going in, and rushes in to tell Team Evil. Still not conclusive on whether it's Jossed or not.
438
439	[[WMG:Redcloak will die. Jirix will take his place as the Dark One's high priest and agree to Thor's plan.]]
440	Redcloak rather ''emphatically'' declined Thor's offer, and it's clear that he's gone full KnightTemplar - willing to sacrifice every living goblin for hypothetical future goblins. It's hard to picture him going back on that now. He's in too deep. Jirix, on the other hand, still has room to negotiate, and as the vested ruler of Gobbotopia, is probably much more attached to his people than Redcloak is. Team Evil will be defeated and Durkon will return to Azure City/Gobbotopia to negotiate, successfully, with Jirix.
441
442	[[WMG: Redcloak will die. Oona will take his place as the Dark One's high priest and agree to Thor's plan.]]
443	Jirix is just a mayor. Oona has shown that she has far more nuance and insight than either Redcloak or Jirix. She has already shown that she might be enthusiastic about fighting, but she's willing to listen to other ideas. In addition, ''she'' is the one who notes that The Dark One has been a lax god with other goblinoid races such as bugbears and nilbogs, and has conceded Durkon made good points.
444
445	[[WMG: Redcloak's niece will return leading one of the ninth sides]]
446	Redcloak's niece will appeared aged up due to a magic spell leading an army of Evil-Aligned Monsters and Humanoids. Her endgame is to use the vast size of her army to threaten the other nations into accepting the monsters as PC races and since the nations know what happened when the Dark One was killed they probably realise that if they kill Redcloak's Niece then the monster army will deal greater destruction so the human nations will have no choice to accept the monsters as PC races and the gods will have to agree to the Dark One's terms since if all of their followers are killed then the gods will cease to exist and the Snarl will destroy everything.
447
448	[[WMG: The MITD is some kind of creature with the Pseudonatural template.]]
449	Said template makes creatures both stronger and uglier.
450
451	[[WMG: Oona expects Redcloak to make the wrong choice.]]
452	On [[https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1262.html this page]], Oona explains to Redcloak that he seems to have two goals — on the one hand, doing what's best for the goblins; on the other hand, getting to feel like everything he's ever done was justified — and right now this isn't a problem because the goals aren't in conflict, but in the future they could conflict and he would have to make a choice.
453
454	Trying to get a grasp on what she's saying (she was using a weird metaphor), Redcloak asks "So you're worried that at some point, the goals I've been working toward might be incompatible with… what? My own ego?"
455
456	She replies, "Oona never said she was worried. Oona is pretty sure she knows what little caped man would choose."
457
458	Note that she does not say ''which'' choice she thinks he'll make.
459
460	[[WMG:Oona has a plan to stop Redcloak if he makes the wrong choice.]]
461	As a corollary to the above, if Oona expects Redcloak to make the wrong choice, that seems to be at odds with her implication that she isn't worried. It could be that she isn't worried because she has a plan to stop him if that happens.
462
463	[[WMG:Team Evil will be covered with Sunny's anti-magic cone]]
464	* MiTD will lose his magical shadow prematurely, pissing off Xykon, but will be covered by SceneryCensor.
465	* Xykon will fall apart like a pile of bones he is, but only briefly, immediately reconstructing himself afterwards.
466	* Red Cloack will come off from the Redcloack, and it'll turn out he's heavily brainwashed in a subtle way, noticeable only by contrast. Naturally, he himself will be horrified, but will have to put the cloack back.
467
468	[[WMG:The Disenchanters will screw Xykon over.]]
469
470	Xykon uses a ton of magic items, but one of his most important is the one that makes him immune to fire damage, as it allows him to spam his fire spells, often at point blank range. The Disenchanters will drain its enchantment off, and either he realizes it and thus knows he can't use some of his favorite spells as freely as he likes (which might make him even less composed than he normally is), or he won't realize it (possibly due to having so ''many'' he can't be sure which ones got drained) until he tries to use one and is damaged by it, cluing the Order into the fact he's no longer immune to fire.
471
472	[[WMG:The Monster in the Darkness is the Dark One with amnesia.]]
473
474	The MitD debuted in the Dungeon of Dorukan. Maybe the final, fiercest guardian of Dorukan's Gate was supposed to be an enslaved god and Xykon thought that kind of loot was too good to pass up. This could explain how Redcloak can't contact him.
475

Context WMG / TheOrderOfTheStickTeamEvil