Line #161 Headscratchers/XiaolinShowdown


1	!!Omi's Selfishness and the punishment thereof
2	* At the end of "The Ring Of The Nine Dragons", Omi is punished for his selfishness. Even though he deserved the punishment, there's something about it that I don't get. Why does Omi have to use a single brush to clean the dirty cookware? Master Fung says he wants them spotless. Clearly, there is no way that one dry brush could completely remove all of those stains. Surely if Master Fung wanted Omi to do the job properly, he would have given him actual washing up supplies. What's even weirder about this is that Master Fung expects him to make significant progress in only one hour. Does anyone else see the problem here?
3	** Fung was impressed that he mastered the Ring of the Nine Dragons, but he was angry he lost it to Jack.
4	*** Uhm... that wasn't what I was asking. Read my question again. I find it weird that Master Fung gives Omi a punishment task that is virtually impossible to complete. He's told to clean the cookware and make them spotless with a dry brush and no washing up supplies. How can Omi be expected to do his time when he wasn't given any detergent, sponges, cloths, etc., and only in one hour? Perhaps Fung didn't expect Omi to actually make the cookware spotless and just did it to humiliate him.
5	*** Perhaps he could do it with one brush, it was just (and obviously so) hard work, just as Omi could have fixed his problems as one person, though it would have taken some minor sacrifices. Omi's hardheaded, so the punishment needed to drive this home...
6	*** Omi believed that using the [[MesACrowd Ring of the Nine Dragons]] would allow him to boost his overall efficiency. Omi is the type who'd rush in to try to handle everything on his own. Giving Omi such an impossible task with the odds against him was a way to force him to learn that he truly can't do everything on his own.
7	** Both to make the punishment more unpleasant and to extend the time it would take giving Omi more time to think on why he was being punished internalizing the rationale for it.
8	!!Reversin' Mirror and how it works
9	* How on Earth would the Reversing Mirror even work with certain Shen-Gong Wus? I understand "Changing Chopsticks makes you grow instead of shrink" and "Two-Ton Tunic makes you light and vulnerable instead of heavy and resilient". However, not all of them have a power with a discernible opposite. How would it work with, say, the Golden Tiger Claws? What is the reverse of "Creating a portal that transports you literally anywhere"? What about the the time-travel artifact or the sword that lets you control wind? What's the opposite of a giant baby that shoots golden diapers?
10	** Firstly, the reversed Golden Tiger Claws would probably make it so the user cannot travel at all (it would freeze them on the spot for a period of time) or probabyl send them to the last they would want to go (or end up going through a portal only to come back to the same spot). The reversed Sands Of Time would send you the opposite temporal direction (if you wanted to go to the future, you'd be sent to the past, and vice versa), the Sword of The Storm would remove winds, and as for the Sweet Baby Among Us, maybe it would shoot golden diapers not at the enemy but at the person who possesses it. You just have to use your imagination.
11	** The Reversing Mirror tends to reverse any projectiles headed to the wielder so the golden diapers would be bounced back and probably the same could be said for the winds.
12	** Aside from the above, general fan consensus is that the Mirror would be [[AntiMagic a generic nullifier]] against any Wu whose effect would be too "weird" to truly reverse. IIRC, we already saw this in "The Demon Seed", where Gigi uses the Mirror to cancel out the Gills of Hamachi.
13	!!Having the showdowns
14	* Why do the Xiaolin Showdowns even matter? Why do people just leave when they lose? What's stopping someone from just punching the other guy in the face and stealing all the Shen Gong Wu they just lost?
15	** Said opponent now has a shiny new Wu that they can use against them. Good luck trying to steal the Eye of Dashi from someone who's using it against you.
16	*** Yup. In fact a lot of the time when the good guys win, the first thing they do is use the new Wu to [[HumiliationConga rub some salt in Jack's wounds]]. Except for when it backfires by losing a showdown.
17	** We already know that Showdowns alter the landscape (and physics). Whose to say they don't bring down some kind of punishment on the one who tries to keep going after one?
18	!!Underused [=GTC=]'s
19	* Why do the Good Guys ''never'' use the Golden Tiger Claws when they have them? They're only used in their own episode, in the episode where [[spoiler:Raimundo turns evil]], against Mala Mala Jong, and a few others. I can forgive them for forgetting some Wu, whose uses have to be contrived most of the time, but the Golden Tiger Claws can warp them to ''any'' location. They could get the Wu in less time then it takes to tell it.
20	** Well one, it would destroy the point of Dojo's character. Two, given how many times that the Shen Gon Wu go from Xiaolin to Heylin and back, it wouldn't be a good thing if the Golden Tiger Claws got into the wrong hands. Three, the show would be less interesting to watch.
21	*** To add on to the part about the Shen Gon Wu constantly moving between sides, it would really suck for a character to teleport somewhere without Dojo, have the claws stolen, and then have no way to get back, contact their friends, or be traced.
22	*** Dojo sensed the location of a Shen Gon Wu like a metal detector. He leads them in the right direction, but he doesn't automatically know where the Shen Gon Wu are located to begin with. He just follows his senses.
23	** Was it impossible to build a weakness into those things, to make it more usable? For example, the optimal distance to warp is X feet, and if you try anything less or more than that you're dizzy and wobbly on arrival? You can only use them once every ten seconds to stop [[FlashStep Flash Steps]]? The possibilities are endless, but they decided to be lazy about it.
24	*** Or they didn't want to add in random weaknesses and opted to use them as a plot device rather than just another Wu.
25	!!!Also underused Helmet of Jong
26	* Similar to the above, why is the Helmet of Jong never used except to form Mala Mala Jong? Eyes in the back of one's head would be useful, but the Helmet is one of, if not the only Wu that is never used in the normal manner.
27	** Maybe the brain of an ordinary person finds it difficult to process getting information from four different eyes at once.
28	** It's ''magic.'' No doubt Dashi built a secondary spell into the thing to temporary rewire the wearer's brain to allow for the extra input.
29	*** ''[[TemptingFate No]]'' [[MagicAIsMagicA doubt]]?
30	** Probably for the whole "So that we don't wind up wagering it in a Showdown and letting Heylin get their hands on it" reason.
31	** It actually does see proper use in the Last Temptation of Raimundo, though only briefly. While the helmet is on backwards, Raimundo is able to see the oncoming attacks behind him. He eventually flips it around though.
32	** At a certain point, their natural awareness of their surroundings that increases with training may make the helmet redundant. You don't necessarily need to See behind you in order to know someone is coming if you can feel them doing so. Sort of like the Mantis Flip Coin. At the start of the series, it's a cool Wu that makes the characters able to do crazy jumps and flips. But after a while they can just do that on their own, so it becomes sort of just a slight boost, or only really useful to someone like Jack who doesn't have the body strength to pull it off.
33	!!More about the Reversing Mirror
34	* Why the hell didn't they use the reversing mirror with the ring of nine dragons? Combining up to 9 entities into one super bad being surely seems like a good idea.. Mastery over all 4 elements + dragon shape-shifting + a master monk's skills would ''surely'' be more than a match for ''any'' villain in the show.
35	** Maybe they liked being individuals more than they liked the idea of being super powerful. Such a merger would PROBABLY be permanent. The Ring of the Nine Dragons used properly just splits you into nine versions of yourself with your intellect split evenly. So at the end of the conflict you'd be screwed. I know I wouldn't take that deal.
36	** They wouldn't necessarily be stuck in one form. Reversing the changing chopsticks effect couldn't be undone without the reversing mirror a second time. So all it would take is the reversing mirror + the ring again.
37	** Then why did Omi need to use both against Dojo to return to normal size even though both him and Jack used it prior to return to normal size without the mirror?
38	** First, Omi needed to get out of Dojo. Second, he needed to challenge Dojo to a showdown.
39	!!Amazing Technicolor Population
40	* Why is Omi bright yellow? Just... why?
41	** It's a Chinese stereotype.
42	*** Exactly. So why?
43	** All the other monks are probably Chinese, yet none of them are yellow. I'm guessing that Omi got jaundice and somehow went blind. He finds his way around through chi, not ridiculous eyesight.
44	*** Or, it could be RuleOfFunny
45	*** Jossed. S1,E9 "My Homie Omi" has him using the Falcon's Eye to locate the Serpent's Tail. It's not a Wu you can use without eyesight. Chi energy doesn't cut it.
46	** Dashi used the tiger claws to go the Simpsons verse and bring in Omi's ancestor.
47	*** Headscratcher solved.
48	** Omi isn't the only one: Dashi is also yellow. Additionally, they share similar facial features. So I always thought that Omi and Dashi were ColorCodedForYourConvenience to indicate that Omi, who was ConvenientlyAnOrphan, was actually a descendant of Dashi.
49	** Presumably for the same reason that Jack is gray.
50	!!Where did those go?
51	* What exactly happened to ''all'' those Shen Gong Wu from "The Crystal Glasses?" You know, the ones that filled the cave the showdown took place? If the powers that be didn't have plans for them, they could have just not had so many activate...
52	** Some of them (like the sandals) show up later in the series.
53	!!That Dude is really long lived.
54	* Am I the only one wondered how Master Monk Guan survived for over 1500 years? Chase's longevity could be attributed to the Lao Mang Lone soup, but nobody's ever brought up Guan's age.
55	** You're not alone. And also, if Guan and Chase fought alongside Dashi against Wuya and none of them died in that battle, where the heck is Dashi?
56	*** If I remember correctly, his spirit or something came out of the new puzzle box used to reseal Wuya...which he gave to Omi himself...That just brings up a whole new set of problems.
57	*** Maybe the box had magic that allowed his soul to be sealed when he died. He HAD to die in order to help them in the future so he didn't go for immortality. Alternatively, he was philosophical. Maybe he just thought immortality was stupid.
58	** Read up "Chinese Immortals." Essentially a healthy/moral mind, diet, right meds, etc. in addition to CharlesAtlasSuperpower as far as Traditional Chinese Medicine is concerned is the key to immortality so let's just say Master Monk Guan ate his Wheaties, meditated and exercised to live that long and not age a day past his prime.
59	** Master Monk Guan became a master monk, and part of that is mastering the Xiaolin arts that preserve youth. As a result he has been able to maintain himself in a fit state for a very long time. But he hasn't yet ascended like Master Dashi.
60	*** Again, where does that leave Dashi, then, if he was even better than Monk Guan or Chase? Or better yet, considering Master Fung was a match for Chase Young in a body-cast, why on earth isn't HE ageless like Chase and Monk Guan are, in the BadFuture episode?
61	*** Well, Dashi was apparently Grand Master even back then, when Chase and Guan were still learning (a title which nobody else we know of has been around long enough to acquire). Who knows, Dashi could've been 1,500 ''himself'' at that time for all we know.
62	*** I just assumed Dashi made a HeroicSacrifice, so he'd be able to seal Wuya in the puzzle box in the future.
63	*** This troper always thought that Chase Young and Master Monk Guan's lives were inextricably tied together, that they were destined to be each other's opposite regardless of time, space, or even [[AlternateUniverse reality]]. This is supported in "Time After Time": when Omi stops Chase from becoming evil, Guan drinks the Lao Mang Lone Soup instead, and it is Chase who inexplicably lives for 1500 years. It seems that as long as one of them drinks the Lao Mang Lone Soup, the other will rise to challenge him as a Chinese Immortal.
64	*** The issue is that in the original episode, and every episode except the final two, Master Monk Guan was implied to be a regular mortal monk who happened to fight Chase Young at one point. There was no indication that they were ''both'' 1,500 years old and former friends, nor that they had anything to do with Wuya and Dashi (and if memory serves, Chase was only around 1,000 years old originally, making him too young to have been there). It's a retcon, done at the absolute last minute.
65	*** Except there was an indication that they were former friends. Guan saying "I see you now for what you are and not for what you pretend to be" refers to that he still saw Chase as the good Chase all this time; having to fight the dragon in Chase was a reminder that the Chase he knew is no longer there. It would explain why Guan and Chase were amicable all that time. Chase may not have had conflicts with Guan since he disappeared from the Xiaolin side. As for Dojo, Dojo is a big scaredy cat around people, yet seemed to be just fine with Chase (despite being afraid of the big cats). Even when he was being cooked in a pot of soup, Dojo was chill with Chase Young. He's likely remembering Chase as he remembered Chase all those years ago. It's only after Chase reveals he wants to eat Dojo that Dojo becomes afraid of Chase.
66	*** The best explanation i can think of for why Dashi isn't around is that the Chinese Immortal requires proper diet as well as mind and body, Dashi very much seemed like the type of person who would drink and party even knowing it would cost him eternal life.
67	** The goal of enlightenment in Buddhism is to escape the cycle of {{Reincarnation}} and AscendToAHigherPlaneOfExistence. Dashi is no longer alive because he's now one with the universe.
68	!!Couldn't he just train to be immortal?
69	* Assuming you accept the "Chinese Immortal" explanation above (which seems reasonable): Why would Chase Young need to bother with Lao Mang Lone soup if his training could make him immortal?
70	** IIRC, it wasn't just about being really powerful--it was about being ''the best'', even better than Guan. Hard work and training over time are all well and good, but at the end of the day one person is just going to be able to go harder, be stronger, etc. If Chase was doubting his abilities even a little and someone came along offering something that made him the most powerful being in the world in an instant, I can see how it'd be hard for him to say no.
71	** Additionally magic in the Xiaolin Showdown universe seems to work in that evil Haylin magic makes it easier to obtain power quickly but comes with drawbacks while Xiaolin magic is harder to master requiring more discipline but provides the same abilities without drawback. So Chase Young locked himself out of the Xiaolin method and made himself dependent on Lao Mang Lone soup when he first took it. It empowered him but crwsted a dependence such that he can't master the other Xiaolin option anymore.
72	!!Superhcharged Omi
73	* Remember how Omi became supercharged with the energy of all 4 elements after using those special Shen Gong Wu? In an earlier episode, there was the Sun Chi Lantern, a SGW that basically let him do the same thing. My question is: Why wasn't he all explody then?
74	** Different power levels between the two events. The Sun Chi Lantern was used in season one, where the heroes had no elemental powers to speak of. The latter event evolved powerups to their Wudai powers, which were stronger than their Apprentice powers. The first was just enough for Omi to CurbstompBattle Jack, Chameleonbot, Catnappe, and Tubbimura, whereas the second was just to much for him.
75	** Also, the Sun-Chi Lantern only allows for sharing of chi (life energy), not supernatural magic powers. He borrowed their energies so he would have enough to fight the whole LegionOfDoom Jack had assembled.
76	!!The need for Extras
77	* In Master Monk Guan's first appearance, he trades Dojo to Chase Young to get back his Spear of Guan. At the end of that episode, he gives it to Omi. Then, in his next appearance, he gives Raimundo the Spear of Guan -- and reveals that he has a bunch of them. If he had the extras, then why did he need to get the spear back from Chase Young before?
78	** If I remember correctly, he had all the extras made ''after'' the whole episode with Chase Young, just in case.
79	*** But then how could the one he gave Raimundo be his favorite? It's probably because the different Spears of Guan were pretty much different models and only Guan could use all of them. Any other person would only fit one particular spear.
80	*** It's not his favorite, it's ONE of his favorites.
81	!!Shouldn't they wear the full armor?
82	* Why do the heroes never wear the full suit? Mala Mala Jong is nothing special; anyone could put on the Jet Boot Su, Two Ton Tunic, Fist of Tebigong, Third Arm Sash, Helmet of Jong, and Eye of Dashi and be as effective, if not more, than Jong.
83	** I think wearing all that would be very heavy, not to mention the fact that you would have to shout the names of all of the Wu whenever you wanted to use them.
84	** Also, Mala Mala Jong demonstrated the ability to exert a magnetic pull on other Wu (like with Raimundo's Sword of the Storm), and he's also made of hellfire. ''Those'' qualities can't be duplicated by someone just wearing the Wu.
85	!!Fighting Mala Jong
86	* So, when they fight Mala Mala Jong, they HandWave not using the Serpent's Tail to get the Heart of Jong by saying the that even while intangible, the Eye of Dashi can still hurt you. So, why don't the heroes ever use it against Wuya when she's ghostly?
87	** Because, as a ghostly person, she has no nerve endings and therefore cannot feel pain?
88	** Wuya isn't a physical threat in ghost form. She can't touch people besides causing small discomfort, can't hold or use Wu (only exception seems to be able to activate the Reversing Mirror), and doesn't make herself a part of the struggles. No point in attacking her because unlike those she consorts with, she can't do anything to you.
89	!!The item time travels?
90	* There are some things that bother me about the whole timeline aspect of the 2-part finale. For one thing, how did the Sands of Time end up in that future? As stated in the SAME episode, there was no old Omi in that timeline, the old Omi from the episode before went back to an entirely different future. Secondly, why was the Omi in the good-Chase timeline frozen like the Omi we know? If the entire set of events were different in that timeline the whole quest thing would have never happened and that Omi would have no reason to freeze himself
91	** We can logically conclude that the aspects of Old Omi are removed from the timeline due to Omi freezing himself and never growing old. That means, while the monks were never forewarned to get the Sands of Time, the Wu still activated normally, with possibly a different result in regards to a Showdown. Old Omi, having not existed, did not attend, and did not hide the Sands of Time in the future afterwards. This could cause a mild paradox in that Omi (present) only got the idea to visit the future via freezing to talk to Old Omi.
92	** As for the frozen Omi post-past, Chase Young didn't become evil, but Guan did. Replace Guan in present Chase Young's role, throw in Bean not getting double crossed, and you have a worse scenario than original. The frozen Omi may have gotten the bright idea to reverse Guan's transformation as opposed to Chase's, and following the same logic as present Omi, froze himself.
93	** Speaking of the Sands of Time, how about when Omi was stuck in the past the first time? Dashi told Dojo to get the Sands of Time for the Xiaolin Showdown between him and Omi, but yet when Omi realized that he was stuck in the past with no way back, Dashi told Omi that they had hid the Sands of Time already. This troper had assumed that the Sands of Time in that episode was just a normal hourglass, but then it reappeared in the aptly named "The Sands of Time" episode, where it was the EXACT SAME HOURGLASS AS BEFORE. Did Dashi just hide the Sands of Time while Omi was freaking out?
94	*** Dashi may have had a second hourglass that looked like the relic. Alternatively, Dashi didn't want Omi to use the hourglass because that would mean the hourglass was never hidden in the past and therefore would never be found in the future, thus changing the future or causing a timp parado. Basically, Dashi was willing to screw Omi over to keep the timeline intact. He kept shushing Dojo when he claimed that he remembered where all the Wu were. Plus, Dashi WAS hiding the Wu. Why would he want some kid from the future running around with the Wu he wanted to keep out of the hands of people who could use them for wrong. On top of that, the hourglass may have already deactivated (not that Dashi couldn't reverse that).
95	!!The Mast of Magic could really be of help, y'all.
96	* Master Fung is a master of magic, right? Why did they never use that? They even introduced it at the beginning of a season as if it were going to be really important, then just ignored it.
97	!!The need for extras II
98	* Why in the holy hell did Dashi create so many... just plain random Sheng Gong Wu? The one that's stands out the most in my eyes is the Sweet Baby Among Us. A giant, golden super baby who shoots golden diapers by air humping. Just why?!
99	** A bigger offender would be the [[ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin Ants In The Pants.]] Dojo even says that "It's not much in a fight, but it's great at parties." Of course, it could just be Dashi was the definition of CrazyPrepared.
100	** One episode shows the warriors using the Sweet Baby as a sparring partner. Never know when you're going to run into some fifteen-foot tall opponent with annoyingly tough skin.
101	** Dashi was obviously stoned while creating these? Seriously, remember when Omi met Dashi in the past? The guy was just TOO calm.
102	** HEY! Dashi is a master of '''ZEN!!!''' Zen emphasizes wisdom and enlightenment. As such, it ''de-emphasizes'' theoretical knowledge in favor of direct self-realization through meditation. So don't call him stoned!!!
103	** O... kay, other than the dude above who is oddly offended on Dashi's behalf, the other answers above are quite likely. Dashi may have just made some of them to have fun, may have made some of them on the concept that people can often find a use for almost anything (maybe Ants In The Pant would be great for a distraction), they had some specific use that made perfect sense at the time but makes them effectively useless in any other context, or the most likely candidate: he made them so you could have something to wager in Showdowns without constantly losing your best stuff. Maybe he wanted to be able to have practice Showdowns against Guan and Chase (back before Chase was evil) without wagering combat-ready Wu all the time.
104	** Maybe Dashi just has a weird sence of humor.
105	*** My guess is that is he made extra, unnecessary sheng gong wu to through off anyone who might be after the more useful ones.
106	!!How did Mala Jong come to be and why?
107	* Who's idea was it to create Mala Mala Jong? You'd think Dashi wouldn't want that to happen. I mean if the Wu were created by Dashi, why on earth is Mala Mala automatically on the Heylin side? Don't you think He would be with the Xiaolin? It just doesn't make sense to me.
108	** Mala Mala may also be on the Heylin side because either 1. The Heart's affinity is based on who last handled it and/or the experiences it went through prior to deactivation, or 2. The Heart's affinity is naturally Heylin (which makes less sense). The Heart of Jong has always been seen used in evil hands. However, with the Dudebot, Dudebot wanted more 'good'-esque things and spoke like a good person while committing evil actions under the control of Jack Spicer. Dudebot was heartbroken by the Xiaolin monks showing nothing but hate for him, so he self-terminated. That heartbreak could have translated into malice, which made Raksha naturally evil when he first came to life. It may also indicate that the Heart of Jong retains memories of a sort, because Raksha made his way to Jack Spicer’s place before any other location. This means the Heart of Jong remembered where Jack and Dudebot had come from. The destruction could be from the negative emotions that filled the Heart of Jong.
109	** Pretty sure it was meant as a last resort, like the Sapphire Dragon. It's like a homing beacon for Wu, [[GodzillaThreshold so in the event that Wuya stole some Wu, Dashi could retrieve them with Mala Mala. If Wuya beat Dashi, he'd have a warrior of pure Wu for backup.]] Plus, I do believe there was a Wu created specifically to control Mala Mala.
110	*** The Emperor Scorpion wasn't created specifically for Mala, and that's not my point. Dashi made the thing, and it's specifically identified as being a Heylin warrior, that's always evil. He could never be used as a soldier, without the Emperor Scorpion. It confounds me that he let the Heart of Jong survive.
111	*** Who said Dashi had anything to do with Mala Mala? Here's a [[WildMassGuessing theory]]: Mala Mala once had a completely different body, but that ended up getting destroyed, but someone (Cough-Wuya-Cough) made a new body for him/it so it could be brought back to serve evil. He was defeated and scattered, but because the Wu weren't destroyed, it was bound to that form for eternity, or until all the Wu that make it up get destroyed permanently.
112	** Possibly the rule of unintended consequences. Dashi may have created the Wu that made up Mala Mala Jong, but when they were combined realized that they were in fact evil that way, through no intent of his. Basically AIIsACrapshoot.
113	!!Raimundo's Necklace
114	* I know this is pretty minor but Raimundo's necklace just bugs me, you know that spiral one he's always wearing. Of the like, dozen outfits he wears in the show it's only missing from about two and and I really want to know the story behind it.
115	** It might just be a purely aesthetic accessory, like Clay's hat.
116	!!Jack's Power level
117	* Jack's sinking power level. In season one he's competent and a legit threat. He's still a quality challenge for part of season two then Chase Young shows up rematerialized Wuya and Jack goes from semi-competent to just worthless. Heck he even won a good amount of Showdowns early on.
118	** There's several possibilities: A) [[DistractedByTheSexy Chase distracted him]]. He was so busy trying to win him over he didn't get anything evil done. B) Wuya helped him out a bit in the first season, so later he was supporting himself more. and C) When you think about in in a FridgeLogic sort of way, he probably was at the same level as he was in the beginning, and the ''monks'' got better. Think about it: From what we're shown, Jack only ever truly fights the monks on a regular basis, whereas the monks fight a crap load of regular villains ''and'' one shot villains. They even commented themselves about how fighting Jack had become norm and boring, meaning they'd gotten used to him and his tactics. Jack then seems much weaker in comparison.
119	*** In addition to the above point on the monks getting stronger, SortingAlgorithmofEvil. We even see this when Wuya first re-materializes, Jack is immediately rendered worthless because she's so powerful once she's physical again. After Chase is brought into play, Jack is once again outmatched because Chase is shown to be such a powerful, brutal villain from the outset. Chase's jungle cats happen to be more effective {{Mooks}} than Jack's robots which also ups the threat level. In general the thing which stops Chase killing the hell out of the monks is that he isn't interested at that point, whereas what stops Jack is that he plain isn't competent enough. It's worth noting that both Wuya and Chase managed to corrupt one of the monks, incidentally.
120	*** The idea of the Xiaolin warriors getting more powerful as opposed to Jack getting less competent is supported by Jack's numerous CMOA s [[spoiler:and the BadFuture in which he takes over the world]]. Think about it: if it weren't the Xiaolin warriors he was up against, Jack would definitely qualify as a BadassNormal. He's shown unexpected ingenuity in a number of his schemes, his skill with mechanics and robotics is unmatched, and he's tough enough to participate in, if not win, Xiaolin showdowns, which is still a feat that an ordinary {{Muggle}} couldn't manage. It's just that in comparison to the Xiaolin warriors, to Wuya, and to Chase, Jack simply doesn't measure up.
121	*** See also: NextTierPowerUp, which describes how said upgrades can also downgrade villains.
122	*** Being the butt monkey doesn't make Jack stronger, and his abusive relationship with Wuya from late season one on can't have helped him.
123	!!That part was never really addressed
124	* How exactly did Jack originally find out where the Xiaolin temple is to steal Shen Gong Wu from it? It is doubtful that he would've known where the Xiaolin warriors kept the Shen Gong Wu, let alone where the Xiaolin warriors basically lived. Wuya couldn't have helped Jack with this one, as she probably was too busy fighting Dashi to memorize where the temple was, plus the world probably changed too much in 1500 years for Wuya to locate the temple again.
125	** Wuya can sense the location of active Shen Gong Wu, remember?
126	*** Wuya and Dojo, actually. However, Dojo specifically points out it's ''really'' tough to track Wu once they've already been activated. With Wu being easiest to track immediately upon activation, this presents a problem in the above theory. Tracking down a Wu that was activated a long time ago would be particularily hard. Still, it's not even close to impossible for Jack to have tracked the warriors down with simple reconnasiance tech. So between Jack's tech finding the actual base and Wuya vaguely being able to point Jack in the right direction for the Wu themselves, Jack could actually raid the temple without any out of character knowledge.
127	*** Wuya wouldn't need to track down the long-deactivated Wu in the temple's vault. The young monks train with the Wu all the time. They're basically sending up a big magical beacon saying "SHEN GONG WU HERE!" every time they have a training session.
128	** Since it is based on the real-life, world famous ''Shao''lin Temple, most likely he found it because the location simply is not a secret. Wuya especially would know where it is since she fought the Grandmaster of the Temple 1,500 years ago, but the monks besides Omi are all international students sent by their parents so again it is probably well known, just out-of-the-way.
129	!!The Heart of Jong
130	* The Heart of Jong. Why on earth would Dashi make a Wu that's power is to give life to things and turn them ''evil''? Wasn't he a good guy? Sure, it seemed nice when Jack stuck it in his robot, but that robot was still beating up the heroes. Every time the heart acts on it's own it creates a monster. There's a difference between making something random and mostly useless and making something that's intent on killing you and the rest of the planet.
131	** The way this troper sees it there are a couple of possibilities
132	*** 1. Perhaps some of the Shen Gong Wu did not go the way Dashi intended them, it's never explicitly stated how he created them and it's likely that it was a very complicated thing. This first possibility would also explain the sapphire dragon.
133	*** 2. Mala Mala Jong was originally a human that Dashi fought against in his younger days but could not kill. Eventually Dashi defeated him by sealing him into the Heart of Jong. This second possibility would not also explain the sapphire dragon.
134	** I thought it had more to do with who was influencing the Heart at the time. Any time the heart did anything evil, it was being influenced by the Heylin side. Mala Mala Jong? Wuya used the Heart. Jack's robot? Jack used the Heart and programmed the robot to follow evil directives (which even then, the robot acted only because it had to, and did show a desire to be friendly and do non-evil acts). The Snow Goon was created after Jack dropped the Heart, so it still had Heylin influence. It would probably do good if a good guy used it, but you know the good guys are never going to use it because they're good guys and don't need to.
135	!!Jack's loss
136	* Okay, how did Jack lose the showdown in the first episode? Good for Omi, he beat the robots. Jack was still faster than him, and even when he stopped to cheat, he should still have been able to get to the Wu first. Seriously, the only reason he just stood there and let Omi pull down his pants and collect the Wu was so that the protagonists could close out their first episode with a victory.
137	** You just answered your own question.
138	!!These three defeated Dojo
139	* Season 2, Ep. 7. Omi used the Shroud of Shadows, Reversing Mirror and Changing Chopsticks all in 1 showdown against Dojo without wagering the Shroud or Mirror. This would certainly be cheating, and surprisingly Jack never did it before. Why did they break the rules for this?
140	** Maybe it's allowed and that's the first time anyone's thought to do something like that. Not to mention it was a small (but skilled) boy against a giant, two-headed dragon. Methinks it might even the playing field a little bit if he were allowed to use more than one in that situation.
141	** It is allowed as it is done in later episodes without much consequence. Of course, it's still weird that Kimiko mentions it as "cheating" even though Omi did it first. I'm guessing the writers caught on to it and wanted an explanation. My mistake, it just seemed so out of place to suddenly have it happen.
142	*** Just because Kimiko calls it "cheating" when the bad guys do it doesn't mean it is. Characters aren't immune from having a ProtagonistCenteredMorality mindset even if the work overall doesn't adhere to it... it's not cheating when Omi does it because Omi's a good guy and he's trying to save the world, obviously!
143	!!The Mermaid episode
144	* Season 2, Ep. 16. The Mermaid (can't remember her name) planned to flood the world by melting the polar ice caps from the center of the earth. They say normally it would be too hot but then the Black Beetle activates, which would allow her to go to the center. Forgetting about all the physic behind it (gravity), My question is, twice have the characters gone to the center of the earth, in the [[spoiler: first]] Mala Mala Jong episode and the Emperor Scorpion one, and the heat was a completely different issue in each of these. Omi found himself easily burned the first time but able to grab the Tiger Claws. The second time, all 4 dragons, Mala Mala and Jack were all in the earths core for a considerable amount of time. The dragons are apprentices and may be able to cope with the conditions (although things like intense cold in the Snowman episode and Raimundo going into a panic when Clay accidentally causes his robe to catch fire seem to contradict this), but Jack was perfectly fine outside of the Tunnel Armadillo, despite being...well, Jack. So why is the core suddenly an issue with the Mermaid? The only think I could think of would be something involving Jacks outfit or his constant exposure to Shen Gong Wu, but that is stretching it to atom-thin lengths.
145	** WMG on my part, but it could be that the "Center of the Earth" Omi and Dojo refer to aren't truly the planet's core, but close enough to be survivable. So to activate the volcanic activity the mermaid would have to go past the point of no return to cause the damage, where the temperatures would go from incredibly uncomfortable to lethal.
146	!!Shouldn't the battle be based on odds?
147	* While I know in a meta sense that it has to be something that the animators can turn the immediate area into: ''Why does no one ever pick a showdown they're all-but guaranteed to win?'' The closest we had was the "catch the bird" thing where Jack was betting on being faster than Clay, but as we've seen showdowns can ''literally'' be anything (they saved the world with soccer, for Pete's sake). Why not have Jack pick "make a functioning robot out of scrap" or Clay pick "bronco riding" or Kattnappe "who knows the most about cats?" You could at ''least'' bring it up and then have Dojo pull out an ancient thing saying showdowns must be fair (unlikely, given how the villains cheated in the finale).
148	** Heck, even when they use Shen Gon Wu in the showdowns they chose, it's often in a "oh, this can help me win" way instead of a "I picked this showdown specifically because that Wu gives me the advantage" way except for Jack's balance showdown with the Monkey staff...
149	*** Huh, so [[GeniusDitz Jack's]] the only one who thinks to do it?
150	*** Nooo... Raimundo once picked flashlight tag because he had the Golden Tiger Claws, Clay challenged Jack to find a needle in a haystack, Kimiko challenged Pandabubba to Goo Zombies (the game her dad's company DESIGNED)... It happens quite often, if you're looking for it, but not straight-out since the opponents tend to show some competence in the field as well (Jack dodging beams with the Lotus Twister or being surprisingly good with a flying saddle), Pandabubba being no slouch at video games, etc).
151	*** Also note that when Kimiko challenged Pandabubba to Goo Zombies for the Zing Zombone, the Wu dumped them into a game of Goo Zombies ''Four'', which she admitted that she'd never played. Seems like the Wu can manipulate the Showdowns themselves for a more balanced fight.
152	*** In fact this may be why they don't do it as often as they could. They may have occasional bursts of smartness that say that if they're too unfair in what they pick, some LaserGuidedKarma will insure that the enemy is actually better at the challenge than expected. (Like, say, if Raymundo was completely and utterly unfair and picked "Not being named Jack" as a Showdown, it would turn out that Jack Spicer's real name is Eugene, and Raymundo forgot that his own middle name is Jackson or something, as AnAesop about not being a jerk.)
153	** Actually, there's a surprisingly simple answer. The other person wouldn't accept. The person who issues the challenge must then name the contest, and only after the other person accepts does the Showdown begin. Try to pick a challenge the other person has no chance of winning (Jack's "Make a robot out of scrap", for example) and they refuse, forcing you to pick another challenge.
154	*** This is actually supported during Big As Texas, where Clay attempts to wager the Serpent's Tail against Jack's Orb of Tornami. Jack refuses to wager the orb and instead wagers the Sword of the Storm. While this had nothing to do with the fairness of the challenge, it does show that the side being challenged has the ability to negotiate.
155	** A few other pieces of evidence point toward magical enforcement of the contest being fair. In "Mala Mala Jong," Omi remarks that "the challenge should suit the environment" (in this case, they were in a forest, so he chose gathering acorns). Presumably this is one of the rules that Dashi enforced to make sure that people couldn't pick contests exceptionally loaded in their favor (unless the Wu ended up in an area where that would happen by accident). Secondly, the Wu themselves seem to have a mild degree of sentience, given that a few episodes have the Showdown ''not'' being selected by the opponents. In the episode where four Wu are activated at once, Kimiko and Katnappe end up gator-hopping for the Lotus Twister while Raimundo and Chameleon-Bot play "first to find the Longyi Kite." None of them chose those games; instead, the world warped around them and they had to figure out the rules as they went. All told, there seem to be several built-in safety precautions against people setting up a Showdown that exclusively plays to their own strengths.
156	** "The other person not accepting" actually does happen in "My Homey Omi". Jack challenges Omi to a game of basketball and Omi is reluctant since he doesn't know how to play. Jermaine offers to step in for Omi, which Jack refuses on the grounds that he's challenging Omi, not some random New York City kid.
157	!!Jack's Win
158	* In "Dreamscape," Jack Spicer wins the first Showdown. Not too unusual, though this time he happens to get the Shadow of Fear. That little old Wu that lets the user hop into others' minds and bring their fears to life. Then, of course, he sneaks into the Xiaolin Temple to use it on our unsuspecting heroes... Who aren't just unsuspecting; they're ASLEEP! Jack has a nightmare Wu, Master Fung's not at all surprised that it was used, and they did nothing to stop him. No sentries, no talismans, nada... after he's broken into the temple before and stolen every Wu in the vault. NO WONDER STUFF KEEPS GETTING STOLEN!!!
159	** FridgeBrilliance: All of them, including Master Fung, have bought into the "Jack Spicer's a loser" thing so thoroughly that even when he wins a Showdown or has successfully robbed them in the past, they just can't bring themselves to think he'd ever be an effective threat ''again'' going forward.
160	* When Raimundo got possessed by the Wu (The Last Temptation of Raimundo), why didn't they just use the Emperor Scorpion to take the Wu off of him/make the Wu stop controlling him? Unless I missed something, they should have the Emperor Scorpion with them and it does control the Shen Gong Wu. I know that it would take away the point of the episode, but gee, was it so hard for them to even consider it? Or (after the Heylin comet passed, obviously) to give a reason why they couldn't use it?
161	** ALL the Wu had a mind of their own while the comet was in range, either the Emperor Scorpion would have refused to work, or it would have just brought all the Wu along with Raimundo to attach itself to him as well.
162	!!Inconsistent antidotes
163	* The premise of a season two episode is that Omi uses the Changing Chopsticks to shrink himself down to nearly microscopic size, and without the Reversing Mirror, cannot reverse the effects and regrow to normal size. However, in previous episodes, and in later episodes, it's shown that the Changing Chopsticks can in fact revert the user to their default size after they've shrunk down.
164	** It was probably done for dramatic purposes. This is the same episode in which a time limit is unexpectedly tacked onto the Changing Chopsticks in accordance with NewPowersAsThePlotDemands. It seems the only reason the reverse function and time limit were imposed was to make that one episode more tense.
165	** If you want an in-story reason for the above, maybe Omi used them to shrink down much further than the Changing Chopsticks were intended to go, and that's what caused the problems.
166	*** Given Kimiko's comment about Omi needing to stop "while there's still something left" (paraphrased), that seems likely.
167	** Omi used them in combination with the Reversing Mirror to grow, before. Apparently, you have to use the Reversing Mirror a second time to make them work normal, again.
168	!!Shouldn't they not work together anymore?
169	* Why do Jack and Wuya team back up in season two? I mean, Wuya needs someone to gather Wu for her, but Jack doesn't get anything out of the deal, since he's shown to be capable of replicating the one purpose she serves (locating recently activated Wu). They even bring this up in the episode after she's reverted to ghost form, with Jack saying he's done dealing with her, but the next episode, they're teamed back up with no explanation.
170	** StatusQuoIsGod seems the most likely out-universe explanation. In-universe, it's hard to say. Maybe Wuya just stuck around. Jack couldn't get rid of her (what with her being an intangible ghost), so he simply adapted to having her around again.
171	** He also know that she's incredibly dangerous in her human form. If he stays on her good side, maybe she won't betray him again when she regains her powers?
172	** Defeating Wuya was problematic. It's the only answer since she'd had already proven that if she regained her human form she'd betray Jack and Jack actually had way around her for finding Wu. He was working on a third option and as much as he seems to like Chase Young there is no indication he liked Hannibal Bean. He hadn't figured out his plan (which if you watch the future episode he not only defeated them but seemed to have made Wuya into a sex slave.)
173	!!Huh?!
174	* In the first season finale, when the monks retrieved the Serpent's Tail from Raimundo, why did they stick around playing keep away just to mess with Rai and Wuya when they should've escaped?
175	** For shits and giggles?
176	*** Honestly, that's quite possible. The monks are kinda jerks.
177	!!Where did the Elder Monks go?
178	* In Season 2, what happened to the elder monks? I believe they were seen in "Sizing Up Omi", and they were shown at Master Monk Guan's temple in "Return of Master Monk Guan", but beyond that they were never seen again.
179	** They're probably off wandering (and doing good deeds and getting into action movie type situations), meditating, and in general leaving things to the main characters, like everyone does in these shows. (Or, for in-universe explanation, it's been foretold these four new students are the key to victory over Heylin, and any intervention on their part is unnecessary and possibly detrimental.)
180	!!Shouldn't dude be in school?
181	* One of the reasons Jack created Robot Jack is to do his homework, so why is Jack never in school?
182	** Maybe the series started in summer and when school period began, Jack sent Robot Jack to school in his place?
183	** Or maybe Jack is just too smart for school? After all, he is an evil genius...
184	*** The first theory is plausible, except for one problem. Robot Jack's not exactly loyal. He started out as the perfect partner for Jack during his debut in "The Shard of Lightning", but by the end of the episode, he betrayed Jack for no apparent reason other than a desire to go solo and in "The Apprentice", Robot Jack was disloyal right from the start despite Jack installing an obedience chip and once again betrayed him by locking him out of his own house. Given his lack of trustworthiness, Robot Jack would've either refused to go to school, or he would've eventually told Jack's teacher(s), although strangely by the end of "The Apprentice", Jack seems to have built an entire army of cooperative Robot Jacks. As for the second theory, yes, Jack's a genius, but it really only seems to apply to building machines. Jack doesn't seem to be much good at anything else and if Jack didn't go to school, he wouldn't have homework, which means one less reason to build his robot doppelganger.
185	** He's a villain. He ''skips school'' (muahahahaaaaa!) to show how evil he is. Either that, or he's in class while the monks are in training (between episodes).
186	!!About the Puzzle Box
187	* Regarding the magic puzzle box that Dashi used to seal Wuya, isn't the word "puzzle" kind of misleading? In order to release Wuya, all Jack and [[spoiler: Katnappe in season 2]] had to do was open it up as if it were a regular box.
188	** Actually, Jack solved the puzzle box like a Rubix cube before opening it, but they cut away from the box. It's possible that Dashi had to set it up that way and when Raimundo imprisoned Wuya nobody reset the puzzle or [[OffScreenMomentOfAwesome Katnappe solved it between episodes]].
189	!!Having different names?
190	* Shouldn't Omi and Raimundo's attack names be switched? It feels like it would make more sense for the WATER dragon to use "Typhoon Boom" and the WIND dragon to use "Tornado Strike", not the other way around.
191	** Probably, but attack names really don't always make sense. Besides, they named their own attacks, didn't they? Since they're kids it's probably lucky that the attacks didn't get named "Purple Nurple" and "Super Ultra Kaboomabam".
192	** Rai's attack doesn't generate a tornado shape, though. It's gale-force winds, which is more typhoon than tornado. Typhoon literally has the word "wind" in it if you write it in Chinese/Japanese.
193	!!About Ping-Pong
194	* Any news/ideas/ANYTHING on who is going to be the Omi-like character in the revival?
195	** His name is Ping Pong and his Xiaolin element is Wood who becomes the newest monk.
196	!!Wagering the Wu
197	* In Xiaolin Chronicles, does wagering a Shen Gong Wu even mean anything? We see Jack wager the Monkey Spear a couple times and lost, but has it back in later episodes without any sign of taking it back. And in Planet of Dragons, Clay wagered the Fist of the Iron Bear and lost to Jack, but is seen using it later when they only took back the Quantum Wand.
198	** No I'd wager my good looks on it. No my appearance won't change if I lose why do you ask?
199	!!Needing "absolute focus"
200	* Why is it the Tangle Web Comb requires "absolute focus" to use properly, when so many other Wu don't? What's so special about that Comb?
201	** Probably because the Tangle Web Comb is actively doing something the that needs controlling. Most Wu (Sword of Storms, Star of Hanabi, Fist of Tebigong, Orb of Tsunami) are single shot things that need to be activated each time you want to use them but do nothing after you use them. Another chunk are actively on but don't require any active control, (Two Ton Tunic and Monkey Staff). The Tangle Web Comb like the Lotus Twister is continuously doing something and much like a car becomes dangerous to the wielder the moment you take your eyes off the road.
202	*** A more mundane explanation is that, in general, detangling and doing hair requires a lot of focus (ask anyone in cosmetology), so a comb based shen gong wu is gonna need a lot of focus, even if you aren't using it for hair.
203	!!The Chameleon bot
204	* In the episode where Jack builds Chameleon Bot to replace Kimiko, the episode ends with him having every shen gong wu at the point (except for the Mantis Flip Coin and Golden Tiger Claws) which includes the Shroud of Shadows. A couple of episodes later, Omi wins the shroud back along with Jack's Jet Bootsu. Then in ''Mala Mala Jong'', Omi loses the Jet Bootsu to Jack over a showdown for the Heart of Jong. With Jack victorious, Wuya has everything she needs to summon Mala Mala Jong. However, when Jong is brought to life, you can see the shroud on its back. Kimiko even lampshades the plot hole when she quips "The Shroud of Shadows?! How'd they get that?"
205	** I always assumed that there was time "in between" episodes where Wu changed hands, either through Showdowns that we didn't see or straight-up theft on the part of the villains (even after Jack breaks into vault with Chameleon-Bot, the monks don't do much to increase their security). In the first episode, Wuya comments that there are "hundreds" of Shen Gong Wu, but the ones seen in the show never break seventy-five. It's possible that there were other Wu being discovered all the time, but they weren't mentioned.
206	!!Reviving Wuya
207	* How does Chase bring Wuya back without her powers? He used the Serpent's Tail and the Reversing Mirror, just like Raimundo did, so why would the effects be any different? Are we just hand-waving it as some unspecified Heylin magic?
208	** He probably prepared a specific ceremony or such beforehand. Considering how strong Wuya is, he wouldn't have tried to restore her unless he had a reliable method of ensuring she is weaker than him.
209	!!Surviving the Center of the Earth (again, maybe)
210	* In "Screams Of The Siren" Kimiko mentions no one can survive the heat down at the center of the Earth, but they've already visited it quite a few times before - first when Omi went to retrieve the Golden Tiger Claws, second to get the Emperor Scorpion and the third when they got sent there by the Black Vipers.
211	** I would say that no one can survive for a very long time down there. When Omi went there, he was only there for a short time. Also, the Xiaolin Warriors are all pretty powerful thanks to their training. I believe she meant that no regular person could survive down there without any special gear or powers.
212	!!What timer has ''THAT'' as a setting?
213	* So Omi freezes himself for 80 years in the grand finale. Which begs the questions: one, What looks like a normal kitchen timer has a setting that goes up to 80 years; two, no one went down there in those 80 years and noticed the three objects lying on the floor; and three, the cassette tape and player still worked perfectly after all that time?!?!
214	** It's a cartoon.
215	!!The Butter incident
216	* In the bad future, Jack has Chase restrained while a machine spreads butter on him. Why? just why? what is the point?
217	** It's a visual pun and insult. The butter (or possibly yellow paint) is being spread across his stomach. Jack is calling him a yellow belly, a term which means coward.
218	!!He could have called the Heylin
219	* So Jack tries using the Sands of Time to put together a dream team of the most evil people in history. So 1: why didn't he try recruiting a few Heylin masters and B:when he recruits his future self, why from the point where he's a senile old man?
220	** Possibly he was afraid anyone more intelligent/competent would double-cross him the first chance they got. The historical figures he ''did'' pick are pretty ruthless by any stretch, but they're also likelier to be unfamiliar (and thus easier to keep in line) with magic artifacts and superscience.
221	** As for recruiting himself from the point he was a senile old man, it probably comes down to Jack's arrogance and narcissism. He assumed that, much like the elderly Jack in the BadFuture in the series finale, he'd be an nigh unstoppable badass that had successfully conquered the world in the future and thus would be able to easily handle the monks. Sadly for him in this timeline Jack stays the loser he is now decades into the future.
222	!!Why did Jack need the mirror?
223	* In "Sizing Up Omi," after Clay loses his Showdown with Cyclops, Jack gains the Reversing Mirror. I may be remembering wrong, but didn't Jack already have the Serpent's Tail in his possession at the time? If so, wouldn't Wuya have been demanding that he immediately use it to turn her human again? I would understand if Jack refused since the last time she got a body she instantly betrayed him, but you'd expect there would at least be a scene explaining that.
224	!!How do the Crystal Glasses work?
225	* We were shown in "The Crystal Glasses" that when the Shen Gong Wu of the same name is combined with the Reversing Mirror, it will instead show a false future. Wouldn't it actually show the past?
226	** That's the fun thing about some of these Shen Gong Wu--being magical items of unclear origin, the rules for their abilities can be fudged a bit. After all, the opposite of seeing the future is really open-ended. You can see the past, or you can see the opposite of the true future; the writers just decided on one path for that particular plot point, so that's how it works.
227	** The timing of the Shen gong wu usage might play a part. Vlad could've activated the reversing mirror after Omi activated the crystal glasses.
228	!!Using a Yo-yo
229	* Why do the Monks never just force an enemy into and out of the Ying-Yang World with only a single yo-yo? Chase proved that it can be done by simply wrapping the yo-yo around a person while activating it, so they wouldn't even need to actively push them into the portal. And it's not like they refuse to pull HeelFaceBrainwashing due to ethical concerns. Their biggest problem with Jack turning good is that he becomes obnoxiously nice, not that it's screwing with his free will.
230	** A single yo-yo would only send an enemy into the Ying-Yang World. In order to bring them back and make them good, somebody would need to enter the world themselves and then yo-yo their enemies a second time, which is too risky as what makes you think the villains are just going to let themselves get magically reformed and not fight back to get the monks Heylin-fied instead. Chase only managed to trap Master Fung because it was believed that Jack had the yo-yo, thus catching the monks by surprise. Also they didn't convert Jack. He left the Ying-Yang World with the Reversing Mirror and by leaving through a portal manufactured by both yo-yos, converted to the opposite side.
231	!!Random hiding places
232	* Some of the Shen Gong Wu hiding places don't make much sense. Take the Eye of Dashi, for example (hanging from a tree branch), or the Changing Chopsticks (Hanging out of the nostrils of an Easter Island head). Are we supposed to believe those Wu remained where they were, unnoticed and undisturbed, for 1500 years? Perhaps the worst offender is the Mikado Arm, which was on top of a skyscraper in mid-construction (What, did someone just carry it up there on a whim?)
233	** Some of them got found by people that didn't know what they were, like with the Star of Hanabi. Just imagine that every Wu has a story behind how it got there.

Context Headscratchers / XiaolinShowdown