History YMMV / Wicked

27th Sep '17 10:14:44 PM JMQwilleran
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Added DiffLines:

* {{Squick}}: As explained in the Stephen Schwartz biography book, ''Defying Gravity: The Creative Career of Stephen Schwartz from Godspell to Wicked'', in the song "For Good," the line "You'll be with me like a handprint on my heart" was originally written as "footprint on my heart" but changed because it was felt that the former would be this. His wife, Carole, was the first person he presented the song too and she said "It's just icky, it's like someone stepping on my heart."
10th Sep '17 8:33:20 PM Pichu-kun
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* DesignatedHero: Elphaba is considered important by pretty much everyone she meets and everyone who hears of her, yet accomplishes nothing of note the entire book. Promising student turned dropout; domestic terrorist who doesn't get her target; nun being a nurse; and recluse living in a castle in a remote village. When the Wizard stations an army detachment to watch her and brings a hostage to "protect himself from her", the main thing that comes to mind is "Why would he even know who she is?"
** [[DudeWheresMyRespect On the other hand]], at the beginning of the book, why is Elphaba, who for all intents and purposes is the crown princess of Munchkinland, not treated with respect and fawned over as befits her station? Even if she hates it and was raised poor, anyone who knows her family line should treat her at least marginally courteously just our of respect for her grandfather. Instead, she's treated just like the child of a poor preacher would be without her family line.

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* DesignatedHero: Elphaba is considered important by pretty much everyone she meets and everyone who hears of her, yet accomplishes nothing of note the entire book. Promising student turned dropout; domestic terrorist who doesn't get her target; nun being a nurse; and recluse living in a castle in a remote village. When the Wizard stations an army detachment to watch her and brings a hostage to "protect himself from her", the main thing that comes to mind is "Why would he even know who she is?"
** [[DudeWheresMyRespect
is?"[[DudeWheresMyRespect On the other hand]], at the beginning of the book, why is Elphaba, who for all intents and purposes is the crown princess of Munchkinland, not treated with respect and fawned over as befits her station? Even if she hates it and was raised poor, anyone who knows her family line should treat her at least marginally courteously just our of respect for her grandfather. Instead, she's treated just like the child of a poor preacher would be without her family line.



** The LesYay carries over into Son of a Witch, when Glinda flips out when she sees Liir has Elphaba's cape and refers to her as 'My Elphie.'

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** The LesYay carries over into Son ''Son of a Witch, Witch'', when Glinda flips out when she sees Liir has Elphaba's cape and refers to her as 'My Elphie.'



* TheWoobie: Elphaba obviously had a rotten childhood, but ''A Lion Among Men'' reveals that life hasn't exactly been a picnic for Dorothy either. Going from having your parents drowned in a freak storm at sea to being stuck in an orphanage to adopted by a farm couple who imply that she wasn't exactly what they wanted to having an aunt who suffers from sciatica and generally seems to be pretty bad-tempered would make anyone want to go over the rainbow after a while. [[spoiler: In the last book, she is sentenced to death for the murder of Elphaba and Nessarose in a show trial in Munchkinland.]]

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* TheWoobie: TheWoobie:
**
Elphaba obviously had a rotten childhood, but ''A Lion Among Men'' reveals that life hasn't exactly been a picnic for Dorothy either. Going from having your parents drowned in a freak storm at sea to being stuck in an orphanage to adopted by a farm couple who imply that she wasn't exactly what they wanted to having an aunt who suffers from sciatica and generally seems to be pretty bad-tempered would make anyone want to go over the rainbow after a while. [[spoiler: In the last book, she is sentenced to death for the murder of Elphaba and Nessarose in a show trial in Munchkinland.]]



* WhatDoYouMeanItsNotForKids: The book is much saucier than the musical. In Gregory Maguire's world, EveryoneIsBi until proven otherwise.
** To say nothing of the violence, occultism, and Elphaba being a domestic terrorist.
*** And the sex. So much sex.
*** [[{{Squick}} Add Maguire's fascination]] [[NauseaFuel for bodily waste on top of it.]] (see {{Narm}} for one of many examples)

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* WhatDoYouMeanItsNotForKids: Anyone who thinks this is a kid's series should know better by a few paragraphs into the prologue. The book is much saucier than the musical. In Gregory Maguire's world, EveryoneIsBi until proven otherwise.
**
otherwise. To say nothing of the violence, occultism, and Elphaba being a domestic terrorist.
***
terrorist. And the sex. So much sex. \n*** [[{{Squick}} Add Maguire's fascination]] [[NauseaFuel for bodily waste on top of it.]] (see {{Narm}} for one of many examples)



* AccidentalInnuendo: From As Long As You're Mine: "If it turns out it's [[JizzedInMyPants over too fast]]..."
** To the point where we're not sure it ''was'' [[GettingCrapPastTheRadar accidental]].
* ActorShipping: Thanks to the high amount of LesYay in the script, supplemented by their professed adoration of each other in interviews, many fans have shipped original Elphie and Glinda actress Idina Menzel and Kristin Chenoweth. Ironically, these rumours probably are matched only by the rumours that the two hated each other.
** The latter are Jossed and largely never heard of anymore. Both have confirmed they are friends. [[RomanticTwoGirlFriendship Very nice friends]].
* AdaptationDisplacement: Part of why fans of the book are so nervous about a movie version of the musical being made is that it will further cement into peoples minds that ''this'' is the official Wicked story, and people will continue to forget about and ignore the books.

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* AccidentalInnuendo: From As "As Long As You're Mine: Mine": "If it turns out it's [[JizzedInMyPants over too fast]]..."
**
" To the point where we're not sure it ''was'' [[GettingCrapPastTheRadar accidental]].
* ActorShipping: Thanks to the high amount of LesYay in the script, supplemented by their professed adoration of each other in interviews, many fans have shipped original Elphie and Glinda actress Idina Menzel and Kristin Chenoweth. Ironically, these rumours probably are matched only by the rumours that the two hated each other.
**
other. The latter are Jossed and largely never heard of anymore. Both have confirmed they are friends. [[RomanticTwoGirlFriendship Very nice friends]].
* AdaptationDisplacement: Part of why fans of the book are so nervous about a movie version of the musical being made is that it will further cement into peoples minds that ''this'' is the official Wicked ''Wicked'' story, and people will continue to forget about and ignore the books.



* CanonDefilement[=/=]BetterThanCanon: Just like ''Wicked'' the book is to the original movie and Oz novels, so is this in turn to that book. Some [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks don't like it]] while others [[PragmaticAdaptation prefer the changes]].

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* CanonDefilement[=/=]BetterThanCanon: Just like ''Wicked'' the book is to the original movie and Oz ''Oz'' novels, so is this in turn to that book. Some [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks don't like it]] while others [[PragmaticAdaptation prefer the changes]].


Added DiffLines:

*** In "What Is This Feeling?", Elphaba pins Galinda's personality down to one word: "[[DumbBlonde Blonde]]". What is Elsa? A blonde (though it's implied if not for her powers she'd be either a redhead or a raven).
28th Aug '17 11:54:25 AM annieholmes
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* HilariousInHindsight: There's a lot of stuff about Elphaba that becomes this thanks to the release of ''Disney/{{Frozen}}'', given that Creator/IdinaMenzel was the original Elphaba and also the voice of Queen Elsa:
** In ''Wicked'', Elphaba is a misunderstood older sibling, has magical powers, has a dramatic IAmBecomingSong ("Defying Gravity"), and stars alongside a blonde-haired actress whose first name is [[Creator/KristinChenoweth Kristin]]. In ''Frozen'', Queen Elsa is a misunderstood older sibling, [[AnIcePerson has magical powers]], has a dramatic IAmBecomingSong ("Let it Go"), and starring alongside a blonde-haired actress whose first name is [[Creator/KristenBell Kristen]]. [[WesternAnimation/TheIncredibles Coincidence?]] Well, maybe, but that doesn't stop it from being both hilarious and awesome.
** When Glinda confronts Elphaba near the end and says "I mean they're just shoes... let it go!". Try to hear that now without mentally playing "Let It Go" in your head.
*** Savannah Stevenson at one point [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzGeniwUpQc sang a few seconds of "Let It Go"]] during that scene. It certainly helps bring some levity to an otherwise quite sad scene.
** One part of "No Good Deed" goes, ''Is that all good deeds are/When looked at with an ice-cold eye''.
** Elphaba has black hair and green skin. [[WhatCouldHaveBeen One of the earliest concept designs]] depicted Elsa as having [[http://www.imgur.com/a/ea2Zt black hair and blue skin.]] When you get right down to it, Elsa can be summed up as "Elphaba as AnIcePerson, and no LoveInterest or FaceHeelTurn".

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* HilariousInHindsight: HilariousInHindsight:
**
There's a lot of stuff about Elphaba that becomes this thanks to the release of ''Disney/{{Frozen}}'', given that Creator/IdinaMenzel was the original Elphaba and also the voice of Queen Elsa:
** *** In ''Wicked'', Elphaba is a misunderstood older sibling, has magical powers, has a dramatic IAmBecomingSong ("Defying Gravity"), and stars alongside a blonde-haired actress whose first name is [[Creator/KristinChenoweth Kristin]]. In ''Frozen'', Queen Elsa is a misunderstood older sibling, [[AnIcePerson has magical powers]], has a dramatic IAmBecomingSong ("Let it Go"), and starring alongside a blonde-haired actress whose first name is [[Creator/KristenBell Kristen]]. [[WesternAnimation/TheIncredibles Coincidence?]] Well, maybe, but that doesn't stop it from being both hilarious and awesome.
** *** When Glinda confronts Elphaba near the end and says "I mean they're just shoes... let it go!". Try to hear that now without mentally playing "Let It Go" in your head.
*** **** Savannah Stevenson at one point [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzGeniwUpQc sang a few seconds of "Let It Go"]] during that scene. It certainly helps bring some levity to an otherwise quite sad scene.
** *** One part of "No Good Deed" goes, ''Is that all good deeds are/When looked at with an ice-cold eye''.
** *** Elphaba has black hair and green skin. [[WhatCouldHaveBeen One of the earliest concept designs]] depicted Elsa as having [[http://www.imgur.com/a/ea2Zt black hair and blue skin.]] When you get right down to it, Elsa can be summed up as "Elphaba as AnIcePerson, and no LoveInterest or FaceHeelTurn".FaceHeelTurn".
** The German-language productions deliver some gems.
*** Fiyero swings into the scene on a vine in a cornfield. Two years prior to assuming the role for Wicked Oberhausen, Anton Zetterholm originated the titular role in ''Tarzan'' the musical in Hamburg. His predecessor in Wicked Stuttgart (2008), Mark Seibert, also auditioned for the role of Tarzan and lost.
*** Willemijn Verkaik (incidentally, the Dutch and German voice for Elsa, and has played Elphaba in the English, German, and Dutch-language productions) made her premiere as Elphaba alongside Mark Seibert's Fiyero in Stuttgart. Her last show in Oberhausen was played with Anton Zetterholm as Fiyero.
*** The German-language, and European in general, theatre scene is ''tiny'', leading to Fiyeros going on to play either Elphabas' lover or son in ''Theatre/{{Elisabeth}}''. Just using the actors named above: Mark Seibert went on to play Death, and Anton Zetterholm Rudolf, opposite Roberta Valentini's Sisi. Willemijn Verkaik did play Sisi, but only in Switzerland.
21st Jun '17 7:19:45 PM Pamina
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* LesYay: Fairly prevalent in the book, particularly on Galinda's side. Note the part where she catches her breath as she realises how beautiful Elphaba is, and that their relationship seems to have been the most meaningful one in Galinda's life. Arguable interpretation. Although she does dwell on how nervous Elphie makes her feel, and remembers sharing a bed with her. It should be noted that the only thing Glinda could remember about the Emerald City trip was that they shared a bed.

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* LesYay: Fairly prevalent in the book, particularly on Galinda's side. side: her relationship with Elphaba is arguably the most important one in her life. Gregory Maguire has [[WordOfGod confirmed]] that he wrote them as sharing a subconscious mutual attraction.
**
Note the part where she Galinda catches her breath as she realises how beautiful Elphaba is, and that their relationship seems to have been the most meaningful one in Galinda's life. Arguable interpretation. Although she does dwell is. She also dwells on how nervous Elphie makes her feel, and remembers sharing a bed with her. It should be noted that the only thing Glinda could remember about the Emerald City trip was that they shared a bed.
4th Jun '17 11:56:30 AM Theatre_Maven_3695
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** Some of Idina Menzel's successors in the role have their [[FanDumb rabid, overly-defensive fans]] as well. Let's just say "Who's the best Elphaba?" is about as dangerous a question as "[[Series/MysteryScienceTheater3000 Mike or Joel?]]".

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** Some of Idina Menzel's successors in the role have their [[FanDumb rabid, overly-defensive fans]] fans as well. Let's just say "Who's the best Elphaba?" is about as dangerous a question as "[[Series/MysteryScienceTheater3000 Mike or Joel?]]".
4th Jun '17 11:50:54 AM Theatre_Maven_3695
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* HilariousInHindsight: At one point in the book, Elphaba walks onto the water and it freezes beneath her feet so that she doesn't fall in and melt. That should remind you that Idina Menzel was the first Elphaba, and her ''Disney/{{Frozen}}'' character, Elsa, crosses a fjord by doing the same thing. Not to mention the throwaway line from Glinda to Elphaba in Act II, "They're just shoes! ''Let it go!'')

to:

* HilariousInHindsight: At one point in the book, Elphaba walks onto the water and it freezes beneath her feet so that she doesn't fall in and melt. That should remind you that Idina Menzel was the first Elphaba, and her ''Disney/{{Frozen}}'' character, Elsa, crosses a fjord by doing the same thing. Not to mention the throwaway line from Glinda to Elphaba in Act II, "They're just shoes! ''Let it go!'')
4th Jun '17 11:49:52 AM Theatre_Maven_3695
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* HilariousInHindsight: At one point in the book, Elphaba walks onto the water and it freezes beneath her feet so that she doesn't fall in and melt. That should remind you that Idina Menzel was the first Elphaba, and her ''Disney/{{Frozen}}'' character, Elsa, crosses a fjord by doing the same thing.

to:

* HilariousInHindsight: At one point in the book, Elphaba walks onto the water and it freezes beneath her feet so that she doesn't fall in and melt. That should remind you that Idina Menzel was the first Elphaba, and her ''Disney/{{Frozen}}'' character, Elsa, crosses a fjord by doing the same thing. Not to mention the throwaway line from Glinda to Elphaba in Act II, "They're just shoes! ''Let it go!'')
8th Feb '17 11:36:26 PM Anddrix
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* TheScrappy: Liir gets a lot of flak for [[ReplacementScrappy not being as compelling a character as Elphaba]] and having a lot of CommonMarySueTraits.

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* TheScrappy: Liir gets a lot of flak for [[ReplacementScrappy not being as compelling a character as Elphaba]] and having a lot of CommonMarySueTraits.Mary Sue traits.
15th Oct '16 1:46:36 AM WolfThunder
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* TakeThat: That bit about [[UsefulNotes/RonaldReagan 'Great Communicators']] not having brains or knowledge but succeeding because they're popular...
15th Oct '16 1:45:12 AM WolfThunder
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* WordOfGay: Maguire has stated that "something" was going on between Elphaba and Glinda, but he [[ShrugOfGod doesn't specify what]].
** [[http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lu7tvoxiqL1qhlx07o1_500.png Until he did specify it.]]

to:

* WordOfGay: Maguire has stated that "something" was going on between Elphaba and Glinda, but he [[ShrugOfGod doesn't specify what]].
** [[http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lu7tvoxiqL1qhlx07o1_500.png Until he did specify it.]]
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