History YMMV / TheMentalist

14th May '18 7:28:44 AM ACW
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* TheChrisCarterEffect: The Red John MythArc has become far more elaborate and convoluted than originally intended. While it appears that Bruno Heller always knew who Red John was going to be (although even that notion is contested by some) or at least picked his possible choices early on, the character went from a particularly devious SerialKiller who knew how to cover his tracks, to a SerialKiller who knew a few other killers, to a SerialKiller with a shadow army of fanatically devoted, loyal-unto-death brainwashed followers. In season 6 they took his catchphrase ("Tiger, Tiger") and decided to turn what looked like a cult into a sophisticated criminal organization that nobody had heard of, and made Red John a possible member, to a possible ''senior'' member, and finally into the apparent mastermind of the whole thing. Oh, and he's repeatedly performing "psychic" feats that make Jane look like an amateur, that are never explained. Beyond a certain point he's basically a supervillain and you have to start wondering why he ever resorted to anything as trivial as serial murder in the first place. TheReveal that he is [[spoiler: Sherriff [=McCallister=]]] only raised further issues, as many clues that were dropped about Red John turn out to be irrelevant (his height, for instance- the actor in question is taller than Red John was stated to be) while practically all of the clues that pointed to him were only dropped in the sixth season, the one he was revealed in; most clues from previous seasons were never mentioned again. There are also logistical questions that push it into FridgeLogic territory, such as how he can keep showing up and killing in Sacremento, where the team is based, especially in his last season, [[spoiler: when he's supposed to be a small-town sheriff from Santa Monica, hundreds of miles away.]]
* CompleteMonster: Of the many criminals Patrick Jane is tasked with going up against, these are the worst:

to:

* TheChrisCarterEffect: The Red John MythArc has become far more elaborate and convoluted than originally intended. While it appears that Bruno Heller always knew who Red John was going to be (although even that notion is contested by some) or at least picked his possible choices early on, the character went from a particularly devious SerialKiller who knew how to cover his tracks, to a SerialKiller who knew a few other killers, to a SerialKiller with a shadow army of fanatically devoted, loyal-unto-death brainwashed followers. In season 6 they took his catchphrase ("Tiger, Tiger") and decided to turn what looked like a cult into a sophisticated criminal organization that nobody had heard of, and made Red John a possible member, to a possible ''senior'' member, and finally into the apparent mastermind of the whole thing. Oh, and he's repeatedly performing "psychic" feats that make Jane look like an amateur, that are never explained. Beyond a certain point he's basically a supervillain and you have to start wondering why he ever resorted to anything as trivial as serial murder in the first place. TheReveal that he is [[spoiler: Sherriff [=McCallister=]]] only raised further issues, as many clues that were dropped about Red John turn out to be irrelevant (his height, for instance- the actor in question is taller than Red John was stated to be) while practically all of the clues that pointed to him were only dropped in the sixth season, the one he was revealed in; most clues from previous seasons were never mentioned again. There are also logistical questions that push it into FridgeLogic territory, such as how he can keep showing up and killing in Sacremento, Sacramento, where the team is based, especially in his last season, [[spoiler: when he's supposed to be a small-town sheriff from Santa Monica, hundreds of miles away.]]
* CompleteMonster: Of the many criminals [[GuileHero Patrick Jane Jane]] is tasked with going up against, these are the worst:
13th May '18 12:21:15 PM ACW
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* CompleteMonster:
** [[BigBad Red John]]--[[spoiler:Sheriff Thomas [=McAllister=]]]--is Patrick Jane's [[ArchEnemy nemesis]] and a [[TheSociopath sociopathic]] SerialKiller responsible for torturing and killing dozens of women. When Jane, then a phony psychic, insulted Red John while offering to help the police catch him, Red John [[DisproportionateRetribution murdered]] Jane's wife and [[WouldHurtAChild young daughter]]. Years later, Red John, although retired, commits a number of murders to [[HeKnowsTooMuch silence loose ends]] or [[CriminalMindGames torment Jane]]. Some of his worst crimes include [[MindRape kidnapping and brainwashing]] Kristina Frye into [[EmptyShell believing that she's dead]], trying to force Jane to kill his best friend and LoveInterest, Teresa Lisbon, killing a woman because [[EvilIsPetty Jane had a happy memory of her]], and [[OffWithHisHead beheading]] the therapist who helped Jane recover after his family's death. The mastermind of [[spoiler:the Blake Association, a criminal conspiracy and protection racket for corrupt law enforcement officials]], and leader of his [[PsychoSupporter own group of psychotics and serial killers]], Red John regularly [[BadBoss kills his minions]] or [[DrivenToSuicide drives them to suicide]] when [[YouHaveOutlivedYourUsefulness he has no further need of them]]. A raging {{narcissist}} driven by an [[AttentionWhore intense need for attention]], Red John revels in the power he feels by holding thousands of lives in his hands.
** [[PsychoForHire Cale Sylvan]], from season 2's "Blood Money", distinguishes himself as a [[TheSociopath sociopath]] and a SerialKiller who just enjoys killing people. He makes his living as a [[ProfessionalKiller hitman]] because, in the words of Jane, "If you love what you do, you never work a day in your life." Already connected by the police with the "[[MakeItLookLikeAnAccident mysterious]]" deaths of seven people (drowning, hit-and-run, etc.), his most recent victim is a DA, Kelly Flower. Sylvan breaks into her home and murders her, but not before videotaping her begging for her life to keep as a trophy. When Jane assesses hes a sociopath, the CBI arrange a sting operation and send Agent Van Pelt to act as a buyer interested in procuring his services. Once he agrees to kill her target and shows her the video of him killing Kelly as proof that he can do it, hes quickly arrested. When he is released, the CBI find him at his Murder House. Inside hes watching TV, laughing and drinking, and as hes doing so, a man is duct-taped to a table in the kitchen, gagged and screaming for his life. Eventually Sylvan gets up and plans to start cutting the guy up before the police arrest him. Before Sylvan can give any information on who hired him to kill Ms. Flower, hes sniped from far away. Following his death, we see the CBI excavating his house where eight bodies have already been discovered in the front yard alone.
** Tommy Volker, from season 5, is a CorruptCorporateExecutive responsible for the slaughter of over three hundred Amazonian tribesmen when they refused to relinquish their land so he could use it for development of his geothermal project. When a journalist finds evidence Volker was behind the massacre, he {{manipulat|iveBastard}}es an old friend into sabotaging her car. While his friend believed he was only pulling a prank, Volker intended her to die and had his assassin, Charles Milk, trail her. After her crash, Milk suffocated her, stole the evidence that implicated Volker, and Volker left his "friend" to serve as the fall guy for his scheme. At the same time, CBI Agent Teresa Lisbon convinced Volker's secretary, Rebecca Shaw, to provide evidence against him. In response, Volker visited Shaw that night with his assassin, and watched, [[PsychoticSmirk smiling]], as he strangled her to death. This apparently is a habit of Volker's, as he's also shown attending the strangulation of another employee who intended to reveal Volker's involvement in the Amazonian tribe massacre. Loyal employees fair little better with Volker as he has [[YouHaveOutlivedYourUsefulness Charles Milk assassinated in a drive-by shooting, along with two innocent bystanders, when Lisbon got too close to Milk]], and later promised to kill another of his hired goons [[BadBoss just because the man was interrogated by the police]]. When Volker discovered a little boy had witnessed one of his crimes, he had no reservations in personally trying to [[WouldHurtAChild execute him]] when [[EvenEvilHasStandards other hitmen of his refused to do so.]] A [[TheSociopath cold-blooded sociopath]], Volker was driven by nothing other than a disturbing mixture of {{greed}} and {{sadis|t}}m.

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* CompleteMonster:
CompleteMonster: Of the many criminals Patrick Jane is tasked with going up against, these are the worst:
** [[BigBad [[OverarchingVillain Red John]]--[[spoiler:Sheriff Thomas [=McAllister=]]]--is Patrick Jane's [[ArchEnemy nemesis]] and a [[TheSociopath sociopathic]] sociopathic SerialKiller responsible for torturing and killing dozens of women. When Jane, then a phony psychic, insulted Red John while offering to help the police catch him, Red John [[DisproportionateRetribution murdered]] murdered Jane's wife and [[WouldHurtAChild young daughter]]. daughter. Years later, Red John, although retired, commits a number of murders to [[HeKnowsTooMuch silence loose ends]] ends or [[CriminalMindGames torment Jane]]. Jane. Some of his worst crimes include [[MindRape kidnapping and brainwashing]] brainwashing Kristina Frye into [[EmptyShell believing that she's dead]], dead; trying to force Jane to kill his best friend and LoveInterest, Teresa Lisbon, Lisbon; killing a woman because [[EvilIsPetty Jane had a happy memory of her]], her; and [[OffWithHisHead beheading]] beheading the therapist who helped Jane recover after his family's death. The mastermind of [[spoiler:the Blake Association, a criminal conspiracy and protection racket for corrupt law enforcement officials]], and leader of his [[PsychoSupporter own group of psychotics and serial killers]], killers, Red John regularly [[BadBoss kills his minions]] minions or [[DrivenToSuicide drives them to suicide]] suicide when [[YouHaveOutlivedYourUsefulness he has no further need of them]]. them. A raging {{narcissist}} narcissist driven by an [[AttentionWhore [[FameThroughInfamy intense need for attention]], Red John revels in the power he feels by holding thousands of lives in his hands.
** [[PsychoForHire The sociopathic SerialKiller Cale Sylvan]], Sylvan, from season 2's "Blood Money", distinguishes himself as a [[TheSociopath sociopath]] and a SerialKiller who just enjoys killing people. He makes his living as a [[ProfessionalKiller [[PsychoForHire hitman]] because, in to get paid for his disgusting hobby. Connected to the words of Jane, "If you love what you do, you never work a day in your life." Already connected by the police with the "[[MakeItLookLikeAnAccident mysterious]]" "mysterious" deaths of seven people (drowning, hit-and-run, etc.), his people, Sylvan's most recent victim is a DA, District Attorney Kelly Flower. Sylvan breaks into her home and murders her, but not before videotaping her Flower, who he took the time to videotape begging for her life as a trophy to keep as a trophy. When Jane assesses hes a sociopath, the CBI arrange a sting operation and send Agent Van Pelt to act as a buyer interested in procuring his services. Once he agrees to kill her target and shows her the video of him killing Kelly as proof that he can do it, hes quickly arrested. When he is released, the CBI find him at his Murder House. Inside hes watching TV, laughing and drinking, and as hes doing so, a man is duct-taped to a table in the kitchen, gagged and screaming for his life. Eventually himself. Although arrested, Sylvan gets up is released and later found in his murder house, with a terrified captive man he plans to start cutting the guy up before the police arrest him. Before Sylvan can give any information on who hired him to kill Ms. Flower, hes sniped from far away. Following his kill, and after Sylvan's own death, we see the CBI excavating his house where eight multiple bodies have already been discovered are found in the front yard alone.
of the property.
** Tommy Volker, [[CorruptCorporateExecutive Thomas "Tommy" Volker]], from season 5, is a CorruptCorporateExecutive greedy executive responsible for the slaughter of slaughtering over three hundred 300 Amazonian tribesmen when they refused for refusing to relinquish their land so he could use it to be used for development of his geothermal project. When a journalist finds evidence Volker was behind links him to the massacre, he {{manipulat|iveBastard}}es Volker manipulates an old friend into sabotaging her car. While his friend believed he was only pulling a prank, Volker intended her to die and had his assassin, Charles Milk, trail her. After her crash, Milk suffocated her, stole car, having the journalist suffocated, the evidence that implicated Volker, stolen and Volker left his "friend" to serve left as the fall guy for his scheme. At the same time, guy. After CBI Agent Teresa Lisbon convinced convinces Volker's secretary, Rebecca Shaw, secretary to provide evidence against him. In response, him, Volker visited Shaw that night with has his assassin, and watched, [[PsychoticSmirk smiling]], as he strangled assassin strangle her to death. This apparently is a habit of Volker's, as he's also shown attending death while he looks on, smiling, and planning to have the strangulation of same done to another employee of his who intended planned to reveal go public with Volker's involvement in the Amazonian tribe massacre. Loyal employees fair little better with Volker as he has [[YouHaveOutlivedYourUsefulness Charles Milk assassinated crimes. Later having his own assassin killed in a drive-by shooting, along with two innocent bystanders, when Lisbon got too close to Milk]], and later promised for [[YouHaveOutlivedYourUsefulness becoming inconvenient]], Volker also plans to kill another of his hired own goons [[BadBoss just because the man was for being interrogated by the police]]. When Volker discovered police and attempts to personally [[WouldHurtAChild murder a little boy had young boy]] who witnessed one of his crimes, he had no reservations in personally trying to [[WouldHurtAChild execute him]] own crimes when [[EvenEvilHasStandards other hitmen of even his refused own hitman is too disgusted to do so.]] A [[TheSociopath cold-blooded sociopath]], so. Loyal to no one, Volker was driven by nothing other than is a disturbing mixture of {{greed}} and {{sadis|t}}m.disgusting man who embodies avarice.
12th May '18 9:24:42 AM miraculous
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* MagnificentBastard: Patrick Jane is the epitome of this trope. He is brilliant, charismatic and manipulative. He runs rings around poor Lisbon, the rest of the team and the criminals. Nobody ever knows the full plan except him and, on the rare occasion something goes wrong, he will get out somehow. The audience want Patrick to succeed in catching the murderers and to eventually get Red John even though his methods are often questionable.
19th Sep '17 10:23:45 PM Ferot_Dreadnaught
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* LikeYouWouldReallyDoIt: One very common reaction to the end of the season six premiere where [[spoiler:Red John captures and seemingly kills Lisbon, smearing his trademark smiley face on her face in blood as he calls Jane with her phone to taunt him]]. GenreSavvy fans were not amused.
* LoveItOrHateIt: Season 6's "Red John" is either the hands-down best episode of the series and a satisfying culmination of the show's MythArc, or an absolute travesty that fails to live up to the hype. There is no in-between with fans.
** There is of course the bipolar compromise of [[FanonDiscontinuity enjoying the episode in a vacuum]] yet despising it and everything that followed for what it did to the arc.

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* LikeYouWouldReallyDoIt: One very common reaction to the end of the season six premiere where [[spoiler:Red John captures and seemingly kills Lisbon, smearing his trademark smiley face on her face in blood as he calls Jane with her phone to taunt him]]. GenreSavvy fans were not amused.\n* LoveItOrHateIt: Season 6's "Red John" is either the hands-down best episode of the series and a satisfying culmination of the show's MythArc, or an absolute travesty that fails to live up to the hype. There is no in-between with fans. \n** There is of course the bipolar compromise of [[FanonDiscontinuity enjoying the episode in a vacuum]] yet despising it and everything that followed for what it did to the arc.
17th Sep '17 4:42:38 PM jameygamer
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** Although the show takes place (almost) entirely in California (occasionally having ventured into neighboring areas like Tijuana or Vegas), it is mostly filmed in Los Angeles (despite being based in Sacramento and most episodes taking place in NorCal as opposed to SoCal).

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** Although the show takes place (almost) entirely in California (occasionally having ventured into neighboring areas like Tijuana or Vegas), it is mostly filmed in Los Angeles (despite being based in Sacramento and most episodes taking place in NorCal [=NorCal=] as opposed to SoCal).[=SoCal=]).
17th Sep '17 4:41:42 PM jameygamer
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* BaseBreakingCharacter: Red John: the best MythArc since Series/TheXFiles, or the most annoying ArcFatigue since ''Series/HowIMetYourMother''?

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* BaseBreakingCharacter: Red John: the best MythArc since Series/TheXFiles, ''Series/TheXFiles'', or the most annoying ArcFatigue since ''Series/HowIMetYourMother''?
17th Sep '17 4:40:37 PM jameygamer
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* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: Is Jane a guy who likes to mess with people for the giggles and because it's fun, and does police work out of boredom and altruism? Or is he a guy warped beyond all repair by his family's murder who messes with people and hunts out murderers to inflict pain?
** Red John/[[spoiler: Sherriff [=McCallister=]]]. Just what are his backstory and motivations? What led him to become a serial killer? Why is it that he seems to have absolutely no remorse for actions, but instead views them as NecessarilyEvil? It's revealed throughout the course of the show that he does not view himself as weak, unhappy, evil or in need of redemption, and that he does not feel himself deserving of punishment for his deeds, so what does that make him? Is he some sort of KnightTemplar or WellIntentionedExtremist? Does he suffer from BlueandOrangeMorality, BlackAndWhiteInsanity, or a little bit of both? Or is he just plain bonkers with delusions of grandeur? And did he start killing people before or after he [[spoiler: became a sherriff]]?

to:

* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: AlternateCharacterInterpretation:
**
Is Jane a guy who likes to mess with people for the giggles and because it's fun, and does police work out of boredom and altruism? Or is he a guy warped beyond all repair by his family's murder who messes with people and hunts out murderers to inflict pain?
** Red John/[[spoiler: Sherriff [=McCallister=]]]. Just what are his backstory and motivations? What led him to become a serial killer? Why is it that he seems to have absolutely no remorse for actions, but instead views them as NecessarilyEvil? It's revealed throughout the course of the show that he does not view himself as weak, unhappy, evil or in need of redemption, and that he does not feel himself deserving of punishment for his deeds, so what does that make him? Is he some sort of KnightTemplar or WellIntentionedExtremist? Does he suffer from BlueandOrangeMorality, BlueAndOrangeMorality, BlackAndWhiteInsanity, or a little bit of both? Or is he just plain bonkers with delusions of grandeur? And did he start killing people before or after he [[spoiler: became a sherriff]]?sheriff]]?



* JerkAssWoobie: Patrick Jane, arguably, yes he is quite the jerk, but considering that his wife and daughter were murdered by a serial killer, you do have some sympathy with him.

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* JerkAssWoobie: JerkAssWoobie:
**
Patrick Jane, arguably, yes he is quite the jerk, but considering that his wife and daughter were murdered by a serial killer, you do have some sympathy with him.



* NarrowedItDownToTheGuyIRecognize: Subverted in an interesting way in both "Blood In, Blood Out" with Jon "Why squirrel hate me?" Sklaroff and "Red Letter" in Rick Hoffman. [[spoiler: Sklaroff's character is guilty of some drug charges and Cho pretends to kill him to get the real killer to confess. Hoffman's character isn't the killer, but is running a human trafficking ring through his anti-human trafficking organization.]]

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* NarrowedItDownToTheGuyIRecognize: NarrowedItDownToTheGuyIRecognize:
**
Subverted in an interesting way in both "Blood In, Blood Out" with Jon "Why squirrel hate me?" Sklaroff and "Red Letter" in Rick Hoffman. [[spoiler: Sklaroff's character is guilty of some drug charges and Cho pretends to kill him to get the real killer to confess. Hoffman's character isn't the killer, but is running a human trafficking ring through his anti-human trafficking organization.]]
17th Sep '17 4:39:07 PM jameygamer
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Added DiffLines:

* CaliforniaDoubling:
** Although the show takes place (almost) entirely in California (occasionally having ventured into neighboring areas like Tijuana or Vegas), it is mostly filmed in Los Angeles (despite being based in Sacramento and most episodes taking place in NorCal as opposed to SoCal).
** The opening scene of "Days of Wine and Roses" really takes the cake--it's said to take place in [[WretchedHive the Tenderloin]] in UsefulNotes/SanFrancisco, but the Tenderloin is considerably more built-up and dirty than the area depicted. [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenderloin,_San_Francisco There are only a small handful of parks in the area]], and none seem like a suitable place to sit and play chess.
** Now that the show's set in Austin, there is quite a bit of this.
19th Aug '17 9:57:43 AM Silverblade2
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* BaseBreaker: Red John: the best MythArc since Series/TheXFiles, or the most annoying ArcFatigue since ''Series/HowIMetYourMother''?

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* BaseBreaker: BaseBreakingCharacter: Red John: the best MythArc since Series/TheXFiles, or the most annoying ArcFatigue since ''Series/HowIMetYourMother''?



* TheScrappy: Red John was already a BaseBreakingCharacter (see BaseBreaker); but after he was revealed to be [[spoiler:[[AssPull Sheriff Thomas McAllister]] instead of any of the other, more-developed and more-interesting suspects]], he seemed to fall firmly into this territory.

to:

* TheScrappy: Red John was already a BaseBreakingCharacter (see BaseBreaker); ; but after he was revealed to be [[spoiler:[[AssPull Sheriff Thomas McAllister]] instead of any of the other, more-developed and more-interesting suspects]], he seemed to fall firmly into this territory.
12th Jul '17 9:30:00 AM Peridonyx
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** Thomas Volker one of the few villains to pull a KarmaHoudini.

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** Thomas Volker one of the few villains to pull a KarmaHoudini. [[spoiler:Which doesn't last, however.]]
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