Follow TV Tropes

Following

History YMMV / TheLifeAndSufferingOfSirBrante

Go To

OR

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Reworded one bullet point to remove meta-political commentary


** Who is morally superior in the conflict between TheEmpire and LaResistance? Some players think the Empire is such a travesty that everything is acceptable to destroy it, up to and including mass murder and a full-scale genocide. Others take the opposite stance and declare the Revolt an unjustified, violent uprising of crooks and thugs (it should be noted that these players often project their own negative perceptions about real-world revolutions onto the game's events). Then there are those who commit to GreyAndGrayMorality of the setting and think both sides have a point, or just like to explore different paths regardless of their personal opinions.

to:

** Who is morally superior in the conflict between TheEmpire and LaResistance? Some players think the Empire is such a travesty that everything is acceptable to destroy it, up to and including mass murder and a full-scale genocide. Others take the opposite stance and declare the Revolt an unjustified, violent uprising of crooks and thugs (it should be noted that these players often project their own negative perceptions about real-world revolutions onto who go too far to see the game's events).world burn. Then there are those who commit to GreyAndGrayMorality of the setting and think both sides have a point, or just like to explore different paths regardless of their personal opinions.

Added: 1490

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:

Added DiffLines:

* CompleteMonster: [[AristocratsAreEvil Dorius Otton]], the military commander of the province of Magra, is corrupt even by the depthless standards of the Arknian nobility. Before Brante even reaches adulthood, Dorius is a [[RapeIsASpecialKindOfEvil rapist]] and abuser who first meets the player attempting to reclaim his runaway slave, a young commoner named Sophia. Age only refines Dorius's cruelty; as military commander of Magra, Dorius goes from village to village collecting an exorbitant tax from the commoners, [[RapePillageAndBurn pillaging and razing]] at his own merriment while brutally putting down any resistance. Should Brante's Justice rating fall too low, Dorius will order a mob of hundreds of disaffected villagers put down by force, leading to a horrible massacre should Brante be unable to or unwilling to stop it. Dorius's endgame for Magra is the "[[ThePurge Night of the Serpents]]", where on behalf of his benefactor Archduke Milanidas, Dorius will purge the province of any political rivals and their innocent families. [[BloodKnight Dorius]] also has a tendency to force people--[[BadBoss mostly his own men]]--to participate in lopsided duels to the death, often repeatedly challenging them after their resurrection until they meet their [[DeaderThanDead True Death]]. [[ZeroPercentApprovalRating Reviled]] not just by the peasantry but by almost all of his own Arknian allies, if convicted both sides will find Dorius Otton equally guilty of unremitting evil.

Changed: 180

Removed: 1604

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
not ymmv


* VillainProtagonist: Debatable, given the grey morality of the setting, but there are several options for Sir Brante to grow into someone that can reasonably be called "evil".
** In the Noble path, becoming an AmoralAttorney and screwing commoners over for personal gain. This path culminates in a DealWithTheDevil with Remy El Verman, which requires you to betray (and optionally murder) your father's close friend.
** In the Priest path, becoming Ulrich's disciple. You renounce your Gods' love and laws in a [[AGodAmI megalomaniacal]] quest for omnipotence, murdering the woman who loves you and torching people for far lesser crimes.
** In the Commoner/Lotless path, there are not one, but three different brands of evil. Firstly, there is an option to become a willing acomplice of [[SecretPolice Felipe]] and crush any hope for revolution in a devious scheme. Secondly, there is the Free Man option, which requires you to ruin numerous lives in order for your family to gain influence and save [[DirtyCoward your]] hide from the grip of Secret Chancellery. Lastly, there is an alliance with Remy El Verman, who proposes to save you from your plight... in exchange for destruction of one of few decent politicians in your province.
** In any path, remaining loyal to [[AxCrazy Sophia]] until the very end makes you this, unless you've redeemed her earlier. You willingly participate in mass murder, destroy any chance for peaceful resolution and ruin basically everybody's lives everywhere. Tellingly, this is the only path in the game where you can willingly cause a [[TheEndOfTheWorldAsWeKnowIt literal destruction of civilization]]. Yeah, you've heard it right: not even becoming a resident GodOfEvil leads to such disastrous consequences as supporting Sophia in her madness.

to:

* VillainProtagonist: Debatable, given the grey morality of the setting, but there are several options for Sir Brante to grow into someone that can reasonably be called "evil".
** In the Noble path, becoming an AmoralAttorney and screwing commoners over for personal gain. This path culminates in a DealWithTheDevil with Remy El Verman, which requires you to betray (and optionally murder) your father's close friend.
** In the Priest path, becoming Ulrich's disciple. You renounce your Gods' love and laws in a [[AGodAmI megalomaniacal]] quest for omnipotence, murdering the woman who loves you and torching people for far lesser crimes.
** In the Commoner/Lotless path, there are not one, but three different brands of evil. Firstly, there is an option to become a willing acomplice of [[SecretPolice Felipe]] and crush any hope for revolution in a devious scheme. Secondly, there is the Free Man option, which requires you to ruin numerous lives in order for your family to gain influence and save [[DirtyCoward your]] hide from the grip of Secret Chancellery. Lastly, there is an alliance with Remy El Verman, who proposes to save you from your plight... in exchange for destruction of one of few decent politicians in your province.
** In any path, remaining loyal to [[AxCrazy Sophia]] until the very end makes you this, unless you've redeemed her earlier. You willingly participate in mass murder, destroy any chance for peaceful resolution and ruin basically everybody's lives everywhere. Tellingly, this is the only path in the game where you can willingly cause a [[TheEndOfTheWorldAsWeKnowIt literal destruction of civilization]]. Yeah, you've heard it right: not even becoming a resident GodOfEvil leads to such disastrous consequences as supporting Sophia in her madness.
----
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Need to be approved by the Magnificent Bastard proposal thread.


* MagnificentBastard:
** Sir Brante can be played as one, using multiple parties for his own ends and always making the best out of any situation.
** Felipe El Ferro can become this in his winning scenario. Not only does he concoct an elaborate and risky scheme that saves the whole realm from a devastating civil war, he also acts with determination and valor, never losing his cool even in the face of direst dangers. He can also prove to be very charismatic, securing Sir Brante's loyalty with nothing but his eloquence and sincerity. In the end he fully proves his [[TheChessmaster Chessmaster]] capabilities and wins the main conflict of the game without fighting a single battle himself.

Added: 1123

Changed: 8162

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
cleanup


** The Twins may be the prime example in- and out of universe. Are they an example of [[GodIsGood God is Good]], stern but benevolent teachers who want people to live good and virtuous lives? Are they [[JerkassGods Jerkass Gods]] who enforce a cruel and oppressive social system and make people live in suffering? Do they operate on [[BlueAndOrangeMorality Blue and Orange Morality]] and therefore don't really understand puny humans under their care? There is enough evidence for multiple theories about Them, and it all comes down to what you (and Sir Brante) believe in.

to:

** The Twins may be the prime example in- and out of universe. Are they an example of [[GodIsGood God is Good]], GodIsGood, stern but benevolent teachers who want people to live good and virtuous lives? Are they [[JerkassGods Jerkass Gods]] JerkassGods who enforce a cruel and oppressive social system and make people live in suffering? Do they operate on [[BlueAndOrangeMorality Blue and Orange Morality]] BlueAndOrangeMorality and therefore don't really understand puny humans under their care? There is enough evidence for multiple theories about Them, and it all comes down to what you (and Sir Brante) believe in.



** Stephan Brante. A [[BigBrotherBully Big Brother Bully]] who only cares about his family when it helps him improve his social station? Or a [[JerkwithaHeartofGold Jerk with a Heart of Gold]] who just sees obtaining hereditary nobility as the best way to express his love and loyalty for the family?
** Gloria. Smart, passionate and spirited young woman whose main desire is to be accepted by the people she loves most? Or an insufferable [[SoapBoxSadie Soapbox Sadie]] with [[HolierThanThou Holier Than Thou]] attitude who does not help her family or her social cause in any meaningful way? Or maybe, a well-meaning person who wants to do good but is simply too naive to achieve anything significant?
* [[AntiClimaxBoss Anti-Climax Boss]]: Father Ulrich in the Priest path. He presents himself as a ruthless and intimidating mystic who can crush you with his bare willpower, but if Sir Brante simply refuses to become his disciple and doesn't strengthen the Inquisition too much, he is taken out in a non-interactive scene by a non-player character (Jeanne). Most embarassingly, Ulrich's glorified [[MindManipulation Mind Manipulation]] only allows him to barely escape with his life and go into hiding.
* BreatherLevel:

to:

** Stephan Brante. A [[BigBrotherBully Big Brother Bully]] BigBrotherBully who only cares about his family when it helps him improve his social station? Or a [[JerkwithaHeartofGold Jerk with a Heart of Gold]] JerkWithAHeartOfGold who just sees obtaining hereditary nobility as the best way to express his love and loyalty for the family?
** Gloria. Smart, passionate and spirited young woman whose main desire is to be accepted by the people she loves most? Or an insufferable [[SoapBoxSadie Soapbox Sadie]] SoapBoxSadie with [[HolierThanThou Holier Than Thou]] HolierThanThou attitude who does not help her family or her social cause in any meaningful way? Or maybe, a well-meaning person who wants to do good but is simply too naive to achieve anything significant?
* [[AntiClimaxBoss Anti-Climax Boss]]: AntiClimaxBoss: Father Ulrich in the Priest path. He presents himself as a ruthless and intimidating mystic who can crush you with his bare willpower, but if Sir Brante simply refuses to become his disciple and doesn't strengthen the Inquisition too much, he is taken out in a non-interactive scene by a non-player character (Jeanne). Most embarassingly, embarrassingly, Ulrich's glorified [[MindManipulation Mind Manipulation]] MindManipulation only allows him to barely escape with his life and go into hiding.
hiding.
* BreatherLevel: BreatherLevel:



** More like a Breather Lifepath; some players find the Priest Lot the easiest of three. Firstly, it all but guarantees good relationships with [[TheHeart Lydia and Nathan]] which makes it easier to maintain family unity. Secondly, the Priest very rarely comes under threat of death, and even his most powerful enemies rarely threaten to destroy his life completely. Thirdly, there is only one possible [[DealWIthTheDevil Deal with the Devil]], and rejecting it doesn't cost you that much compared to similar deals in other paths. And, last but not least, the Priest can achieve good results in situations where it's flat out impossible in any other path (such as [[spoiler: saving the life of Octavia Milanidas or avoiding the downfall of the Temple]]).
* [[BrokenBase Broken Base]]:
** Who is morally superior in the conflict between [[TheEmpire The Empire]] and [[LaResistance La Resistance]]? Some players think the Empire is such a travesty that everything is acceptable to destroy it, up to and including mass murder and a full-scale genocide. Others take the opposite stance and declare the Revolt an unjustified, violent uprising of crooks and thugs (it should be noted that these players often project their own negative perceptions about real-world revolutions onto the game's events). Then there are those who commit to [[GreyAndGrayMorality Grey-and-Gray Morality]] of the setting and think both sides have a point, or just like to explore different paths regardless of their personal opinions.

to:

** More like a Breather Lifepath; some players find the Priest Lot the easiest of three. Firstly, it all but guarantees good relationships with [[TheHeart Lydia and Nathan]] which makes it easier to maintain family unity. Secondly, the Priest very rarely comes under threat of death, and even his most powerful enemies rarely threaten to destroy his life completely. Thirdly, there is only one possible [[DealWIthTheDevil Deal with the Devil]], DealWithTheDevil, and rejecting it doesn't cost you that much compared to similar deals in other paths. And, last but not least, the Priest can achieve good results in situations where it's flat out impossible in any other path (such as [[spoiler: saving the life of Octavia Milanidas or avoiding the downfall of the Temple]]).
Temple]]).
* [[BrokenBase Broken Base]]:
BrokenBase:
** Who is morally superior in the conflict between [[TheEmpire The Empire]] TheEmpire and [[LaResistance La Resistance]]? LaResistance? Some players think the Empire is such a travesty that everything is acceptable to destroy it, up to and including mass murder and a full-scale genocide. Others take the opposite stance and declare the Revolt an unjustified, violent uprising of crooks and thugs (it should be noted that these players often project their own negative perceptions about real-world revolutions onto the game's events). Then there are those who commit to [[GreyAndGrayMorality Grey-and-Gray Morality]] GreyAndGrayMorality of the setting and think both sides have a point, or just like to explore different paths regardless of their personal opinions.



* [[DifficultySpike Difficulty Spike]]:
** The first three chapters - Childhood, Adolescense and Youth - are needed mainly to establish and develop your character's personality and skillset, and even "bad" choices don't cost you anything irreplaceable. But after them, comes the Peacetime chapter, and you discover that your decisions now matter HARD. Nearly every choice both in your career and family life now has lasting consequences, and it is painfully easy to fail in your goals and suffer devastating losses because you're one number short in some important stat. Moreover, you're now locked out of favorable options far more often, and conditions needed to unlock certain choices and trigger certain events become more and more demanding. Moreover still, you discover that you can't make certain "good" choices not because you've made a mistake in the Peacetime chapter itself, but because you did not grow into a right sort of person back in your childhood.

to:

* [[DifficultySpike Difficulty Spike]]:
DifficultySpike:
** The first three chapters - Childhood, Adolescense Adolescence and Youth - are needed mainly to establish and develop your character's personality and skillset, and even "bad" choices don't cost you anything irreplaceable. But after them, comes the Peacetime chapter, and you discover that your decisions now matter HARD. Nearly every choice both in your career and family life now has lasting consequences, and it is painfully easy to fail in your goals and suffer devastating losses because you're one number short in some important stat. Moreover, you're now locked out of favorable options far more often, and conditions needed to unlock certain choices and trigger certain events become more and more demanding. Moreover still, you discover that you can't make certain "good" choices not because you've made a mistake in the Peacetime chapter itself, but because you did not grow into a right sort of person back in your childhood.



* [[DracoInLeatherPants Draco In Leather Pants]]: Gregor Brante. Almost every scene he's in, the man uses every opportunity and then some to be an obnoxious, elitist, violent jerk, and only cares about those relatives who can fullfil his own ambitions. However, some players find said ambitions to be reasonable and worth pursuing, and some even declare that Gregor is justified in his hatred of Lydia and Gloria, because these two are the reason why the Brantes can't have nice things. To put it simply, while almost no one can say Gregor is a nice man, quite a few say that he is a wise and righteous one.

to:

* [[DracoInLeatherPants Draco In Leather Pants]]: DracoInLeatherPants: Gregor Brante. Almost every scene he's in, the man uses every opportunity and then some to be an obnoxious, elitist, violent jerk, and only cares about those relatives who can fullfil fulfil his own ambitions. However, some players find said ambitions to be reasonable and worth pursuing, and some even declare that Gregor is justified in his hatred of Lydia and Gloria, because these two are the reason why the Brantes can't have nice things. To put it simply, while almost no one can say Gregor is a nice man, quite a few say that he is a wise and righteous one.



* [[MagnificentBastard Magnificent Bastard]]: Sir Brante can be played as one, using multiple parties for his own ends and always making the best out of any situation.
** Felipe El Ferro can become this in his winning scenario. Not only does he concoct an elaborate and risky scheme that saves the whole realm from a devastating civil war, he also acts with determination and valor, never losing his cool even in the face of direst dangers. He can also prove to be very charismatic, securing Sir Brante's loyalty with nothing but his eloquence and sincerity. In the end he fully proves his [[TheChessmaster Chessmaster]] capabilities and wins the main conflict of the game without fighting a single battle himself.
* [[MisaimedFandom Misaimed Fandom]]: The game warns you right from the start, in the opening text, that Sir Brante can't and shouldn't live a perfect life and win every battle, and that [[BittersweetEnding Bittersweet Ending]] is the norm in this world. That doesn't stop some players from complaining how "good" endings are not good enough or how it's too hard to get a "perfect" lifepath.
** The family plotline generally revolves around one conflict: Ambition vs. Family Bonds. No matter what you choose, you can't make all your relatives happy and give them what they want; even the happiest resolutions come down to one or two family members giving up on their dreams for the family's sake. Some players were so discontent with this dramatic development that they edited game files to [[spoiler: reconcile the family, adopt Gloria and still pass conditions to be ennobled]]. Even in a game where tough choices and imperfect decisions are the main point, some people just have to get their [[HappilyEverAfter Happily Ever After]].

to:

* [[MagnificentBastard Magnificent Bastard]]: MagnificentBastard:
**
Sir Brante can be played as one, using multiple parties for his own ends and always making the best out of any situation.
situation.
** Felipe El Ferro can become this in his winning scenario. Not only does he concoct an elaborate and risky scheme that saves the whole realm from a devastating civil war, he also acts with determination and valor, never losing his cool even in the face of direst dangers. He can also prove to be very charismatic, securing Sir Brante's loyalty with nothing but his eloquence and sincerity. In the end he fully proves his [[TheChessmaster Chessmaster]] capabilities and wins the main conflict of the game without fighting a single battle himself.
himself.
* [[MisaimedFandom Misaimed Fandom]]: MisaimedFandom:
**
The game warns you right from the start, in the opening text, that Sir Brante can't and shouldn't live a perfect life and win every battle, and that [[BittersweetEnding Bittersweet Ending]] BittersweetEnding is the norm in this world. That doesn't stop some players from complaining how "good" endings are not good enough or how it's too hard to get a "perfect" lifepath.
** The family plotline generally revolves around one conflict: Ambition vs. Family Bonds. No matter what you choose, you can't make all your relatives happy and give them what they want; even the happiest resolutions come down to one or two family members giving up on their dreams for the family's sake. Some players were so discontent with this dramatic development that they edited game files to [[spoiler: reconcile the family, adopt Gloria and still pass conditions to be ennobled]]. Even in a game where tough choices and imperfect decisions are the main point, some people just have to get their [[HappilyEverAfter Happily Ever After]]. HappilyEverAfter.



** In Peace chapter, as a nobleman, you can kill your elder brother Stephan in a duel. However, if your Career drops to zero afterwards, it triggers a scene where Stephan takes you to a party where some stuffy nobles try to bully and intimidate you for your [[CrusadingLawyer Crusading Lawyer]] ways. If you trigger the scene earlier in the game, it feels like a natural progression of your antagonism with Stephan. Trigger it that late, and you get a darkly hilarious implication that your elder brother spontaneously came back from the dead just to be a traitorous shithead to you once more.
** Your love affair with Jeanne on the priest path can become this, as she is the only mandatory [[LoveInterests Love Interest]] in the game. It is highly possible not to care for Jeanne before, make every choice that lowers her opinion on you, vocally defend the New Faith (which she hates) and generally be on Very Bad Terms with her. That doesn't stop her from going full [[SexIsEvilandIAmHorny Judge Frollo]] and humping ever-loving beejesus out of you. Adding to hilarity, if your prior relationships were too bad, even Sir Brante himself can't properly answer why the hell he's just played nookie with the woman who despises him. All he can come up with is "I guess it was an illusion".
* [[RootingfortheEmpire Rooting for the Empire]]: In-game. It is totally possible for Sir Brante to work and prosper within the Empire and to protect it from the rebellion (or die trying), either to preserve his own priviliges, to avoid excessive bloodshed and/or the Wrath of the Gods, or because he genuinely sees the Empire as something worth saving. Justified in that the Blessed Arknian Empire, while corrupt and unjust, is not as clear cut "evil" as other fictional empires, and the rebels are not quite the plucky freedom fighters of modern pop culture.
** In the Revolt chapter, Sir Brante can optionally convince his father Robert to root for the Empire as well. A noble Sir Brante can do the same to his boss, Augustine El Borne.
** One scene set early in the Revolt offers Sir Brante several options to boost his military forces and people's support. Naturally, half of these options are to convince one particular estate (old nobility, Old Faith priests, or greedy commoners) to join your Imperial fandom.
** Happens among real life fans all the time. Although the game's title predicts the fall of the Empire, and the game encourages you to oppose the status quo in several subtle ways, many players find it more interesting and satisfying to rise above Sir Brante's humble beginnings and climb up the existing social ladder, e.g. getting an hereditary noble title. Justified again in that, while you do have to make moral compromises to achieve success in the Empire, you don't neccessarily have to descend into full-blown villainy.
* [[RontheDeathEater Ron the Death Eater]]: Gloria. While she is designed as [[TheLoad The Load]] in family's quest for nobility, and while she can act somewhat selfishly and irresponsibly at times, she never does anything purposefully cruel to people around her, protects her friends and relatives from harm and generally just wants to be treated like an equal and do what she loves (write poetry). Yet if you read some fans' opinions on her, she is pictured like either a dumb entitled bitch who ruins everyone's lives because of her sheer stupidity, or a cunning monster who manipulates her relatives into killing the family heir. Arguably, some part of this animosity comes from players who tried to gain nobility without making an active effort to get rid of Gloria, lost because of one particular event and decided to blame Gloria for their failure.
* [[TheyWastedaPerfectlyGoodPlot They Wasted a Perfectly Good Plot]]: For some players, the romantic route with Octavia Milanidas in the Noble path is sort of underwhelming. It starts strong, as you make a choice if you should submit to existing social standards and be subservient to Octavia, or defy said standards and become her equal lover (or defy them even more and flat out deny her a romance). No matter what you choose, you get one or two interesting scenes with Octavia, and the bond with her unlocks several beneficial choices later. However, this is the only romantic route in the game where you can't change the general outcome in any way and are [[{{Railroading}} railroaded]] to [[spoiler: lose your beloved to a mystical cult as she turns into an ancient magical creature]]. To add an insult to injury, the La Tari subplot, which takes up a big part of the route, is so far removed from the main conflicts of the Noble path (fight for justice/career doesn't match that well with arcane mysteries of the world) that some feel the romance itself is largely disconnected from the main plot.
* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: Gloria was written to be ultimately sympathetic, but a number of players found her to be too much of a SpannerInTheWorks for the family.

to:

** In Peace chapter, as a nobleman, you can kill your elder brother Stephan in a duel. However, if your Career drops to zero afterwards, it triggers a scene where Stephan takes you to a party where some stuffy nobles try to bully and intimidate you for your [[CrusadingLawyer Crusading Lawyer]] CrusadingLawyer ways. If you trigger the scene earlier in the game, it feels like a natural progression of your antagonism with Stephan. Trigger it that late, and you get a darkly hilarious implication that your elder brother spontaneously came back from the dead just to be a traitorous shithead to you once more.
** Your love affair with Jeanne on the priest path can become this, as she is the only mandatory [[LoveInterests Love Interest]] {{Love Interest|s}} in the game. It is highly possible not to care for Jeanne before, make every choice that lowers her opinion on you, vocally defend the New Faith (which she hates) and generally be on Very Bad Terms with her. That doesn't stop her from going full [[SexIsEvilandIAmHorny [[SexIsEvilAndIAmHorny Judge Frollo]] and humping ever-loving beejesus out of you. Adding to hilarity, if your prior relationships were too bad, even Sir Brante himself can't properly answer why the hell he's just played nookie with the woman who despises him. All he can come up with is "I guess it was an illusion".
* [[RootingfortheEmpire Rooting for RootingForTheEmpire:
** Although
the Empire]]: In-game. game's title predicts the fall of the Empire, and the game encourages you to oppose the status quo in several subtle ways, many players find it more interesting and satisfying to rise above Sir Brante's humble beginnings and climb up the existing social ladder, e.g. getting an hereditary noble title. Justified again in that, while you do have to make moral compromises to achieve success in the Empire, you don't necessarily have to descend into full-blown villainy.
** Also happens InUniverse.
It is totally possible for Sir Brante to work and prosper within the Empire and to protect it from the rebellion (or die trying), either to preserve his own priviliges, privileges, to avoid excessive bloodshed and/or the Wrath of the Gods, or because he genuinely sees the Empire as something worth saving. Justified in that the Blessed Arknian Empire, while corrupt and unjust, is not as clear cut "evil" as other fictional empires, and the rebels are not quite the plucky freedom fighters of modern pop culture.
** *** In the Revolt chapter, Sir Brante can optionally convince his father Robert to root for the Empire as well. A noble Sir Brante can do the same to his boss, Augustine El Borne.
** *** One scene set early in the Revolt offers Sir Brante several options to boost his military forces and people's support. Naturally, half of these options are to convince one particular estate (old nobility, Old Faith priests, or greedy commoners) to join your Imperial fandom.
** Happens among real life fans all the time. Although the game's title predicts the fall of the Empire, and the game encourages you to oppose the status quo in several subtle ways, many players find it more interesting and satisfying to rise above Sir Brante's humble beginnings and climb up the existing social ladder, e.g. getting an hereditary noble title. Justified again in that, while you do have to make moral compromises to achieve success in the Empire, you don't neccessarily have to descend into full-blown villainy.
* [[RontheDeathEater Ron the Death Eater]]: RonTheDeathEater: Gloria. While she is designed as [[TheLoad The Load]] TheLoad in family's quest for nobility, and while she can act somewhat selfishly and irresponsibly at times, she never does anything purposefully cruel to people around her, protects her friends and relatives from harm and generally just wants to be treated like an equal and do what she loves (write poetry). Yet if you read some fans' opinions on her, she is pictured like either a dumb entitled bitch who ruins everyone's lives because of her sheer stupidity, or a cunning monster who manipulates her relatives into killing the family heir. Arguably, some part of this animosity comes from players who tried to gain nobility without making an active effort to get rid of Gloria, lost because of one particular event and decided to blame Gloria for their failure.
* [[TheyWastedaPerfectlyGoodPlot They Wasted a Perfectly Good Plot]]: TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot: For some players, the romantic route with Octavia Milanidas in the Noble path is sort of underwhelming. It starts strong, as you make a choice if you should submit to existing social standards and be subservient to Octavia, or defy said standards and become her equal lover (or defy them even more and flat out deny her a romance). No matter what you choose, you get one or two interesting scenes with Octavia, and the bond with her unlocks several beneficial choices later. However, this is the only romantic route in the game where you can't change the general outcome in any way and are [[{{Railroading}} railroaded]] {{Railroaded}} to [[spoiler: lose your beloved to a mystical cult as she turns into an ancient magical creature]]. To add an insult to injury, the La Tari subplot, which takes up a big part of the route, is so far removed from the main conflicts of the Noble path (fight for justice/career doesn't match that well with arcane mysteries of the world) that some feel the romance itself is largely disconnected from the main plot.
* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: UnintentionallyUnsympathetic:
**
Gloria was written to be ultimately sympathetic, but a number of players found her to be too much of a SpannerInTheWorks for the family.



** [[CrusadingLawyer Augustin El Borne]] can be this for some. He was written as an honorable and caring civil servant, the best kind of nobleman the Empire can offer. However, without Sir Brante's help (especially in the Noble path), El Borne can act so sloppily and make so many errors of judgement that it is highly possible for him to die without making any lasting good in the world. More than a few players view El Borne as a highly incompetent politician, or at best, a decent man who is too naive to make his noble ideas a relity.

to:

** [[CrusadingLawyer Augustin El Borne]] can be this for some. He was written as an honorable and caring civil servant, the best kind of nobleman the Empire can offer. However, without Sir Brante's help (especially in the Noble path), El Borne can act so sloppily and make so many errors of judgement that it is highly possible for him to die without making any lasting good in the world. More than a few players view El Borne as a highly incompetent politician, or at best, a decent man who is too naive to make his noble ideas a relity.reality.



** In the Noble path, becoming an [[AmoralAttorney Amoral Attorney]] and screwing commoners over for personal gain. This path culminates in a [[DealwiththeDevil deal]] with Remy El Verman, which requires you to betray (and optionally murder) your father's close friend.

to:

** In the Noble path, becoming an [[AmoralAttorney Amoral Attorney]] AmoralAttorney and screwing commoners over for personal gain. This path culminates in a [[DealwiththeDevil deal]] DealWithTheDevil with Remy El Verman, which requires you to betray (and optionally murder) your father's close friend.



** In any path, remaining loyal to [[AxCrazy Sophia]] until the very end makes you this, unless you've redeemed her earlier. You willingly participate in mass murder, destroy any chance for peaceful resolution and ruin basically everybody's lives everywhere. Tellingly, this is the only path in the game where you can willingly cause a [[TheEndoftheWorldasWeKnowIt literal destruction of civilization]]. Yeah, you've heard it right: not even becoming a resident [[GodofEvil God of Evil]] leads to such disastrous consequences as supporting Sophia in her madness.

to:

** In any path, remaining loyal to [[AxCrazy Sophia]] until the very end makes you this, unless you've redeemed her earlier. You willingly participate in mass murder, destroy any chance for peaceful resolution and ruin basically everybody's lives everywhere. Tellingly, this is the only path in the game where you can willingly cause a [[TheEndoftheWorldasWeKnowIt [[TheEndOfTheWorldAsWeKnowIt literal destruction of civilization]]. Yeah, you've heard it right: not even becoming a resident [[GodofEvil God of Evil]] GodOfEvil leads to such disastrous consequences as supporting Sophia in her madness.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* [[AntiClimaxBoss Anti-Climax Boss]]: Father Ulrich in the Priest path. He presents himself as a ruthless and intimidating mystic who can crush you with his bare willpower, but if Sir Brante simply refuses to become his disciple and doesn't strengthen the Inquisition too much, he is taken out in a non-interactive scene by a non-player character (Jeanne). Most embarassingly, Ulrich's glorified [[MindManipulation Mind Manipulation]] only allows him to barely escape with his life and go into hiding.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** More like a Breather Lifepath; some players find the Priest Lot the easiest of three. Firstly, it all but guarantees good relationships with [[TheHeart Lydia and Nathan]] which makes it easier to maintain family unity. Secondly, the Priest very rarely comes under threat of death, and even his most powerful enemies rarely threaten to destroy his life completely. Thirdly, there is only one possible [[DealWIthTheDevil Deal with the Devil]], and rejecting it doesn't cost you that much compared to simular deals in other paths. And, last but not least, the Priest can achieve good results in situations where it's flat out impossible in any other path (such as [[spoiler: saving the life of Octavia Milanidas or avoiding the downfall of the Temple]]).

to:

** More like a Breather Lifepath; some players find the Priest Lot the easiest of three. Firstly, it all but guarantees good relationships with [[TheHeart Lydia and Nathan]] which makes it easier to maintain family unity. Secondly, the Priest very rarely comes under threat of death, and even his most powerful enemies rarely threaten to destroy his life completely. Thirdly, there is only one possible [[DealWIthTheDevil Deal with the Devil]], and rejecting it doesn't cost you that much compared to simular similar deals in other paths. And, last but not least, the Priest can achieve good results in situations where it's flat out impossible in any other path (such as [[spoiler: saving the life of Octavia Milanidas or avoiding the downfall of the Temple]]).
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Example Indentation. Also, the game really isn't pushing you in any one direction, so there's no Aesop there.


* [[DoNotDoThisCoolThing Do Not Do This Cool Thing]]: Nobility of the Sword. It is a possible goal to struggle towards, but the game subtly encourages you to forsake this quest and to realize that earning your place among snobbish and haughty nobles is not worth the cost, [[spoiler: as you have to get your sister out of the house to be ennobled, and take the risk of losing your mother to illness if your Unity is too low]]. Not to mention that the main proponent of this goal for your family is [[EvilOldFolks Gregor]], not exactly a pleasant example to follow. However, seeing as Nobility of the Sword brings you glory, favor of the Overseer, financial security and [[BloodMagic a form of immortality]], some players might as well think it's totally worth it.
** [[TrialbyCombat The Court of Honor]], even moreso. Several "good" characters are gonna tell you that this tradition of sacred duels is obsolete and barbaric and should be replaced by the secular law, equal for all. However, if you see (or even participate in) a proper Court, it's a show of pure badassery where noble warriors duke it out while their very blood empowers them with the strength of all their ancestors in an ultimate test of valor, honor and bravery. However obsolete it may be, it still looks and sounds far more epic and awesome than "civilized" court proceedings.

Added: 1862

Changed: 1853

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* BreatherLevel: The kaleidoscope event. It's a moment to get easy willpower before two events where the best options cost that resource. From a roleplay perspective, it's a very low-stakes event shortly before a high-stakes one.

to:

* BreatherLevel: BreatherLevel:
**
The kaleidoscope event. It's a moment to get easy willpower before two events where the best options cost that resource. From a roleplay perspective, it's a very low-stakes event shortly before a high-stakes one.



* [[BrokenBase Broken Base]]: Who is morally superior in the conflict between [[TheEmpire The Empire]] and [[LaResistance La Resistance]]? Some players think the Empire is such a travesty that everything is acceptable to destroy it, up to and including mass murder and a full-scale genocide. Others take the opposite stance and declare the Revolt an unjustified, violent uprising of crooks and thugs (it should be noted that these players often project their own negative perceptions about real-world revolutions onto the game's events). Then there are those who commit to [[GreyAndGrayMorality Grey-and-Gray Morality]] of the setting and think both sides have a point, or just like to explore different paths regardless of their personal opinions.

to:

* [[BrokenBase Broken Base]]: Base]]:
**
Who is morally superior in the conflict between [[TheEmpire The Empire]] and [[LaResistance La Resistance]]? Some players think the Empire is such a travesty that everything is acceptable to destroy it, up to and including mass murder and a full-scale genocide. Others take the opposite stance and declare the Revolt an unjustified, violent uprising of crooks and thugs (it should be noted that these players often project their own negative perceptions about real-world revolutions onto the game's events). Then there are those who commit to [[GreyAndGrayMorality Grey-and-Gray Morality]] of the setting and think both sides have a point, or just like to explore different paths regardless of their personal opinions.



* [[DifficultySpike Difficulty Spike]]: The first three chapters - Childhood, Adolescense and Youth - are needed mainly to establish and develop your character's personality and skillset, and even "bad" choices don't cost you anything irreplaceable. But after them, comes the Peacetime chapter, and you discover that your decisions now matter HARD. Nearly every choice both in your career and family life now has lasting consequences, and it is painfully easy to fail in your goals and suffer devastating losses because you're one number short in some important stat. Moreover, you're now locked out of favorable options far more often, and conditions needed to unlock certain choices and trigger certain events become more and more demanding. Moreover still, you discover that you can't make certain "good" choices not because you've made a mistake in the Peacetime chapter itself, but because you did not grow into a right sort of person back in your childhood.

to:

* [[DifficultySpike Difficulty Spike]]: Spike]]:
**
The first three chapters - Childhood, Adolescense and Youth - are needed mainly to establish and develop your character's personality and skillset, and even "bad" choices don't cost you anything irreplaceable. But after them, comes the Peacetime chapter, and you discover that your decisions now matter HARD. Nearly every choice both in your career and family life now has lasting consequences, and it is painfully easy to fail in your goals and suffer devastating losses because you're one number short in some important stat. Moreover, you're now locked out of favorable options far more often, and conditions needed to unlock certain choices and trigger certain events become more and more demanding. Moreover still, you discover that you can't make certain "good" choices not because you've made a mistake in the Peacetime chapter itself, but because you did not grow into a right sort of person back in your childhood.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Not YMMV, Example Indentation, and there isn't a single golden route - it all depends on what you want for Sir Brante and the world.


* [[GoldenPath Golden Path]]: More like "golden lifepath". Many players find these paths especially satisfying.
** The New Faith Priest, for its sheer heartwarming potential. On this path, Sir Brante can be played as a powerful combination of [[AllLovingHero All-Loving Hero]], [[GoodShepherd Good Shepherd]] and [[MoralityChain Morality Chain]], with nearly no need for moral compromises or dubious solutions. This path also makes it fairly easy to unite the family, allows you to keep your [[LoveInterest Love Interest]] close and happy, save your best friend from death with minimal effort, save [[spoiler: Octavia Milanidas from suicide]], [[spoiler: completely avert the downfall of the Silver Tree temple, which is unavoidable in almost any other path]] and [[VelvetRevolution win a peaceful victory for the Revolt fairly easily]].
** The Imperial Nobleman is this for fans of the Empire. Firstly, it puts Sir Brante in a position of power where he can not only drastically improve his own fortune, but to shape the state of his homeland however he sees fit. Secondly, it presents far more opportunities to obtain fame and power without resorting to unethical means (quite the opposite, in fact: a nobleman can often obtain fame and power through genuine displays of dignity and bravery). However, the quest for ennoblement and career advancement still throws you into a complicated and intense political game worthy of [[Literature/ASongOfIceAndFire Westeros]] and puts your moral limitations to the test, making it entertainingly challenging if you play Brante as someone who actually gives a damn about honor and noble principles. Last but not least, as in this path you're supposed to be a warrior, it contains some of the coolest action scenes in the game, potentially including [[spoiler: [[TheCavalry a fight against multiple assassins to save your best friend]]]], [[spoiler: [[CainAndAbel a tragic duel with your own elder brother]]]] and [[spoiler: [[FinalBattle an epic mano-a-mano against your sworn enemy in the last chapter]]]].
*** Adding to the last point, the Imperial Nobleman is the only path in the game where you can stay loyal to the Empire and still [[spoiler: lethally punish [[CompleteMonster Dorius Otton]]]].
** The Secret Chancellery Agent (aka "Glory to the Empire") is considered by many fans to be the best "evil" path in the game. It's a suspenseful, excellently written spy thriller which not only provides great moral ambiguity (to the point that some fans even hesitate to call it "evil"), but can turn into a great tragic arc about the loss of one's ideals and betrayal of oneself. Adding to its coolness is the fact that it is the only path in the game where [[spoiler: you can have a complete and satisfying conclusion to the story at the end of chapter 4, skipping the Revolt completely]].

Top