History YMMV / MaxPayne

17th Jul '16 12:43:57 AM IvanovTroping97
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** The two nightmare levels in the first ''Max Payne''. They each start off cool and creepy, and then tack on an infuriating maze. The first maze has you running down featureless hallways endlessly until you take the right combination of turns (or you can blow grenades to ease your orientation). The second has you running around a maze of bloodtrails in otherwise featureless blackness. Every time you reach a dead end, a scream plays that exactly mirrors your own. It's even worse on the console, owing to the imprecise controller movement and use of checkpoints instead of quicksaves.

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** The two nightmare levels in the first ''Max Payne''. They each start off cool and creepy, and then tack on an infuriating maze. The first maze has you running down featureless hallways endlessly until you take the right combination of turns (or you can blow grenades to ease your orientation). The second has you running around a maze of bloodtrails in otherwise featureless blackness. Every time you reach a dead end, a scream plays that exactly mirrors your own. It's even worse on the console, owing to the imprecise controller movement and use of checkpoints in the Playstation 2 version instead of quicksaves.quicksaves like in the PC and Xbox versions.
3rd Jul '16 1:31:17 PM Kytseo
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Added DiffLines:

** With the [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIhjtSY-nxg Kung Fu mod]] installed, the first game is the best [[Film/TheMatrix Matrix]] game ever made.
30th May '16 5:41:51 AM ACW
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** [[NonActionBigBad Nicole Horne]] from the first game is the [[CorruptCorporateExecutive CEO of Aesir Corporation]]. As a member of [[TheIlluminati the Inner Circle]], she was responsible for Project Valhalla, a program that was developing a highly addictive psychotropic SuperSerum when it turned out to be a madness-inducing poison. In response to this discovery, she decided to market it through the mob as [[FantasticDrug Valkyr]] to the public, thereby becoming an untouchable corporate crime lord who directly and indirectly killed thousands. When Michelle Payne inadvertently received information that would expose the Valkyr Conspiracy, Nicole had a trio of drugged-up maniacs slaughter both Michelle and her [[WouldHurtAChild baby daughter]]. Over the following years, Horne went on to control the entire criminal underworld of New York through her pawn, [[TheDon Angelo Punchinello]], and made a play into politics by putting a hit on the Mayor; she also blackmailed Inner Circle member Alfred Woden. When she first personally encounters Max, she has Angelo murdered for [[YouHaveOutlivedYourUsefulness outliving his usefulness]], then tries to kill Max by giving him an overdose of Valkyr and leaving him to burn alive in Angelo's mansion. She eventually resorts to mass murder to cover up her crime, initiating "Operation Dead Eyes" to murder all her personnel involved in Valkyr's creation, and sends men to wipe out the Inner Circle. Through all of this Horne has no clear motivations, no enlightened intent, no emotion; she is just pure evil, even claiming that the deaths of Max wife and daughter were "[[LackOfEmpathy necessary]]".

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** [[NonActionBigBad Nicole Horne]] from the first game is the [[CorruptCorporateExecutive CEO of Aesir Corporation]]. As a member of [[TheIlluminati the Inner Circle]], she was responsible for Project Valhalla, a program that was developing a highly addictive psychotropic SuperSerum when it turned out to be a madness-inducing poison. In response to this discovery, she decided to market it through the mob as [[FantasticDrug Valkyr]] to the public, thereby becoming an untouchable corporate crime lord who directly and indirectly killed thousands. When Michelle Payne inadvertently received information that would expose the Valkyr Conspiracy, Nicole had a trio of drugged-up maniacs slaughter both Michelle and her [[WouldHurtAChild baby daughter]]. Over the following years, Horne went on to control the entire criminal underworld of New York through her pawn, [[TheDon Angelo Punchinello]], and made a play into politics by putting a hit on the Mayor; she also blackmailed Inner Circle member Alfred Woden.Woden, preventing him from stopping her machinations himself. When she first personally encounters Max, she has Angelo murdered for [[YouHaveOutlivedYourUsefulness outliving his usefulness]], then tries to kill Max by giving him an overdose of Valkyr and leaving him to burn alive in Angelo's mansion. She eventually resorts to mass murder to cover up her crime, initiating "Operation Dead Eyes" to murder all her personnel involved in Valkyr's creation, and sends men to wipe out the Inner Circle. Through all of this Horne has no clear motivations, no enlightened intent, no emotion; she is just pure evil, even claiming that the deaths of Max wife and daughter were "[[LackOfEmpathy necessary]]".
29th May '16 8:23:24 AM ACW
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** [[BigBad Nicole Horne]] from the first game is the [[CorruptCorporateExecutive CEO of Aesir Corporation]]. As a member of [[TheIlluminati the Inner Circle]], she was responsible for Project Valhalla, a program that was developing a highly addictive psychotropic SuperSerum when it turned out to be a psychosis-inducing poison. In response to this discovery, she decided to market it as Valkyr to the public, thereby becoming an untouchable corporate crime lord who directly and indirectly killed thousands. When Michelle Payne inadvertently received information that would expose the Valkyr Conspiracy, Nicole had a horde of drugged-up maniacs slaughter both Michelle and her baby daughter. Over the following years, Horne went on to control the entire criminal underworld of New York through her pawn, Angelo Punchinello, and made a play into politics by putting a hit on the Mayor. Through all of this Horne has no clear motivations, no enlightened intent, no emotion; she is just pure evil. The worst part is when she tells Max: "The deaths of your wife and daughter were necessary, inevitable; it is DONE. You cannot bring them back. Nothing you do will make it any better."

to:

** [[BigBad [[NonActionBigBad Nicole Horne]] from the first game is the [[CorruptCorporateExecutive CEO of Aesir Corporation]]. As a member of [[TheIlluminati the Inner Circle]], she was responsible for Project Valhalla, a program that was developing a highly addictive psychotropic SuperSerum when it turned out to be a psychosis-inducing madness-inducing poison. In response to this discovery, she decided to market it through the mob as Valkyr [[FantasticDrug Valkyr]] to the public, thereby becoming an untouchable corporate crime lord who directly and indirectly killed thousands. When Michelle Payne inadvertently received information that would expose the Valkyr Conspiracy, Nicole had a horde trio of drugged-up maniacs slaughter both Michelle and her [[WouldHurtAChild baby daughter. daughter]]. Over the following years, Horne went on to control the entire criminal underworld of New York through her pawn, [[TheDon Angelo Punchinello, Punchinello]], and made a play into politics by putting a hit on the Mayor. Mayor; she also blackmailed Inner Circle member Alfred Woden. When she first personally encounters Max, she has Angelo murdered for [[YouHaveOutlivedYourUsefulness outliving his usefulness]], then tries to kill Max by giving him an overdose of Valkyr and leaving him to burn alive in Angelo's mansion. She eventually resorts to mass murder to cover up her crime, initiating "Operation Dead Eyes" to murder all her personnel involved in Valkyr's creation, and sends men to wipe out the Inner Circle. Through all of this Horne has no clear motivations, no enlightened intent, no emotion; she is just pure evil. The worst part is when she tells Max: "The evil, even claiming that the deaths of your Max wife and daughter were necessary, inevitable; it is DONE. You cannot bring them back. Nothing you do will make it any better." "[[LackOfEmpathy necessary]]".
24th May '16 11:30:40 AM Infection
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* BestLevelEver: [[BrokenBase As divisive as the third game is]], most players really enjoyed Chapters IV and VIII, mainly because they're the flashback levels that take place entirely in New York and capture the tone of the first two games.

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* BestLevelEver: BestLevelEver:
**
[[BrokenBase As divisive as the third game is]], most players really enjoyed Chapters IV and VIII, mainly because they're the flashback levels that take place entirely in New York and capture the tone of the first two games.games.
** For those who don't find it to be ThatOneLevel, the airport level in the third game is also seen as a highlight for players, especially the lobby shootout.



* GoodBadBugs: In 3 it's possible to edge up on a corner, aim at foes around it and shoot them through whatever the wall is made of as long as the reticle is red and the weapon is an adequate distance from the wall. This makes 70% percent of gun fights trivially easy, not to mention making the cover system largely redundant.

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* GoodBadBugs: In 3 ''3'' it's possible to edge up on a corner, aim at foes around it and shoot them through whatever the wall is made of as long as the reticle is red and the weapon is an adequate distance from the wall. This makes 70% percent of gun fights trivially easy, not to mention making the cover system largely redundant.



* InMemoriam: The first game was dedicated to Gathering of Developers [[labelnote:*]]The company that published the game in North America, later folded into Take-Two[[/labelnote]] founder Doug Myres, who died a couple months before the game's release.



** How some people feel about the addition of [[TakeCover cover]] in the third game. In addition to slowing down the pace of the game, it's a rudimentary system that doesn't even let you round corners without getting out of cover. The third also removes ability to skip the cutscenes, due to many of them being used to hide loading sequences (though only in the console release, as the PC version was eventually patched with the ability to skip several cutscenes, although many remain unskippable for reasons unknown).
** Arcade mode actually has an "Old School Mode" which prevents the player from using the cover system or weapon zoom. However, enemies can still use the cover system without incident and their AI is not altered in any way to benefit this style of play, making the addition seem more like a spiteful slap in the face to the fans who complained.

to:

** How some people feel about the addition of [[TakeCover cover]] in the third game. In addition to slowing down the pace of the game, it's a rudimentary system that doesn't even let you round corners without getting out of cover. The third also removes ability to skip the cutscenes, due to many of them being used to hide loading sequences (though only in the console release, as the PC version was eventually patched with the ability to skip several cutscenes, although many remain unskippable for reasons unknown).
**
unknown). Arcade mode actually has an "Old School Mode" which prevents the player from using the cover system or weapon zoom. However, enemies can still use the cover system without incident and their AI is not altered in any way to benefit this style of play, making the addition seem more like a spiteful slap in the face to the fans who complained.play.



* TheyChangedItNowItSucks: Max's body and especially face received a Hollywood makeover for the sequel. YMMV on whether this was a good thing.

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* TheyChangedItNowItSucks: Max's body and especially face received a Hollywood makeover for the sequel.second game. YMMV on whether this was a good thing. This got worse for the third game, but once Rockstar showed off what Max looks like in the New York levels plus annoucing that he would look like his VA James [=McCaffrey=], the fanbase calmed down and was fine with his change in looks.



* {{Wangst}}:
** Most of Max's inner monologues delve into this in ''3''. On the one hand, over the years, he's developed a completely justified level of SurvivorGuilt. He may be able to [[OneManArmy singlehandedly kill hundreds of mooks]] (which, as a former law enforcer, isn't something he'd be proud of to begin with), but not before said mooks have killed everyone he's either cared about or tasked to protect. On the other, he ''just won't shut up about it'', taking every opportunity to mention how much he sucks. In the first two games, he avoided this by snarking and occasionally making light of his situation, but here, his snarks have an overly-caustic undercurrent that only makes it worse.
** ''WebVideo/ExtraCredits'' argued that, while Max was cynical in the first games, he had something worth fighting for, allowing his perseverance to shine through, and was self-aware about the situation at hand. In the third, however, Max's nihilism is all he has, making him one-dimensional. Combined with the stereotyped side characters, the entire world comes off as overly shallow and uninteresting.

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* {{Wangst}}:
**
{{Wangst}}: Most of Max's inner monologues delve into this in ''3''. On the one hand, over the years, he's developed a completely justified level of SurvivorGuilt. He may be able to [[OneManArmy singlehandedly kill hundreds of mooks]] (which, as a former law enforcer, isn't something he'd be proud of to begin with), but not before said mooks have killed everyone he's either cared about or tasked to protect. On the other, he ''just won't shut up about it'', taking every opportunity to mention how much he sucks. In the first two games, he avoided this by snarking and occasionally making light of his situation, but here, his snarks have an overly-caustic undercurrent that only makes it worse.
** ''WebVideo/ExtraCredits'' argued that, while Max was cynical in
worse. This is actually lampshaded as far as the first games, he had something worth fighting for, allowing his perseverance to shine through, and was self-aware about second game, during Vlad's VillainousBreakdown.
--> '''Vlad'''': What
the situation at hand. In the third, however, Max's nihilism fuck is all he has, making him one-dimensional. Combined wrong with you, Max? Why don't you just die? You hate life, you're miserable all the stereotyped side characters, the entire world comes off time, afraid to enjoy yourself even a little! Face it, you might as overly shallow and uninteresting.well be dead already. Do yourself a favor, give up!
19th May '16 12:53:45 PM Aiguille
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** [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBFfJtOVwTE&hd=1 Late Goodbye]] which was actually made by the band Music/PoetsOfTheFall!

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** [[http://www."[[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBFfJtOVwTE&hd=1 com/watch?v=AzsiE44Lz_w Late Goodbye]] Goodbye]]" which was actually made by the band Music/PoetsOfTheFall!
15th May '16 3:47:47 AM appealus
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** In-universe, the games play with the idea that it was Max himself who murdered his wife including his outright statements of such on occasion, making him a VillainProtagonist. However, a lot of the hints come from Max's dream sequences which are designed to MindScrew the player, while the rest may just be Max's guilt over everything that's happened. The belief traces back to him brushing off his wife when she mentions the Valkyr files she's investigating too him, and his negligence got her killed, but even for Max that's taking his SurvivorGuilt a bit far.

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** In-universe, the games play with the idea that it was Max himself who murdered his wife including his outright statements of such on occasion, making him a VillainProtagonist. However, a lot of the hints come from Max's dream sequences which are designed to MindScrew the player, while the rest may just be Max's guilt over everything that's happened. The belief traces back to him brushing off his wife when she mentions the Valkyr files she's investigating too to him, and his negligence got her killed, but even for Max that's taking his SurvivorGuilt a bit far.
13th May '16 10:09:40 PM Infection
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** And if you disregard the [[NoProblemWithLiscenedGames decent]] [[VideoGame/ThePunisher game]] it got several years ago, the series as a whole could pass for a pretty solid ''ComicBook/ThePunisher'' video game due to the almost [[{{Expy}} identical]] traits Max shares with Frank, its edgy noir tone, and brutal violence (especially in the third game).

to:

** And if you disregard the [[NoProblemWithLiscenedGames [[NoProblemWithLicensedGames decent]] [[VideoGame/ThePunisher game]] it got several years ago, the series as a whole could pass for a pretty solid ''ComicBook/ThePunisher'' video game due to the almost [[{{Expy}} identical]] traits Max shares with Frank, its edgy noir tone, and brutal violence (especially in the third game).



** The third game is also absolutely gorgeous - especially on PC - thanks in part to Rockstar's RAGE engine which has proved to provide [[VideoGame/GrandTheftAutoFour very]] [[VideoGame/RedDeadRedemption pretty looking]] [[VideoGame/GrandTheftAutoFive games]].

to:

** The third game is also absolutely gorgeous - especially on PC - thanks in part to Rockstar's RAGE engine which has proved to provide [[VideoGame/GrandTheftAutoFour [[VideoGame/GrandTheftAutoIV very]] [[VideoGame/RedDeadRedemption pretty looking]] [[VideoGame/GrandTheftAutoFive [[VideoGame/GrandTheftAutoV games]].
13th May '16 10:05:26 PM Infection
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* MoralEventHorizon: Nicole Horne, a.k.a. "Ms. Valkyr," is catapulted straight over this line when it's revealed she was the one behind the murder of Max's family at the very start of the game.
** Victor Branco and the UFE from the third game cross this when it's discovered that the people they kidnap from the favelas are being used in illegal organ trafficking.

to:

* MoralEventHorizon: MoralEventHorizon:
**
Nicole Horne, a.k.a. "Ms. Valkyr," is catapulted straight over this line when it's revealed she was the one behind the murder of Max's family at the very start of the game.
** Victor Branco [[spoiler:Victor Branco]] and the UFE from the third game cross this when it's discovered that the people they kidnap from the favelas are being used in illegal organ trafficking.



** The Last Chance mechanic is a concept that can work as proven by the likes of VideoGame/{{Borderlands}} and GuildWars 2, but it's implementation in 3 leaves a lot to be desired. When put into the "Downed" state Max cannot move or reload, so that if he can't hit the enemy due to them being behind cover or his gun being empty, the player has no choice but to wait until he dies, which can be agonizing due to the bullet time the mode operates in. What's more, if Max goes into the state while behind cover, he has almost no chance to fire over his cover and will instead empty his clip into it rather than the foe the player is targeting. Another problem is that the mechanic defers to hitting the foe who downed Max, forcing the player to aim only at that one enemy. This is even if it would be easier to hit another, easier target that would glean the same result.
* ScrappyWeapon: Weapons with laser sight attachments from ''3''. Grabbing a weapon with one removes your crosshair and replaces it with a laser sight that bounces around as you move and fire. This makes aiming significantly more difficult, if not impossible.

to:

** The Last Chance mechanic is a concept that can work as proven by the likes of VideoGame/{{Borderlands}} ''VideoGame/{{Borderlands}}'' and GuildWars 2, ''VideoGame/GuildWarsTwo'', but it's implementation in 3 leaves a lot to be desired. When put into the "Downed" state Max cannot move or reload, so that if he can't hit the enemy due to them being behind cover or his gun being empty, the player has no choice but to wait until he dies, which can be agonizing due to the bullet time the mode operates in. What's more, if Max goes into the state while behind cover, he has almost no chance to fire over his cover and will instead empty his clip into it rather than the foe the player is targeting. Another problem is that the mechanic defers to hitting the foe who downed Max, forcing the player to aim only at that one enemy. This is even if it would be easier to hit another, easier target that would glean the same result.
* ScrappyWeapon: Weapons with laser sight attachments from ''3''. Grabbing a weapon with one removes your crosshair and replaces it with a laser sight that bounces around as you move and fire. This makes aiming significantly more difficult, if not impossible. Luckily, you can turn it off if you so please.



** The Max Payne games are some of the best JohnWoo games ever made before ''{{Stranglehold}}''. Also Max Payne 3 seems to be heavily inspired by ''Film/ManOnFire''. Just look at the first trailer of the game when Max describes his situation and you will notice the similarities instantaneously. It's to the point where it's {{lampshaded}} in the first game, the password for one early part in John Woo, and Max said soon after that he'd need to make like ChowYunFat.
** Fans have been known to joke that 3 is a surprisingly good KaneAndLynch sequel.

to:

** The Max Payne games are some of the best JohnWoo Creator/JohnWoo games ever made before ''{{Stranglehold}}''. Also Max Payne 3 seems to be heavily inspired by ''Film/ManOnFire''. Just look at the first trailer of the game when Max describes his situation and you will notice the similarities instantaneously. It's to the point where it's {{lampshaded}} in the first game, the password for one early part in John Woo, and Max said soon after that he'd need to make like ChowYunFat.Creator/ChowYunFat.
** Fans have been known to joke that 3 ''3'' is a surprisingly good KaneAndLynch sequel.''VideoGame/KaneAndLynch'' sequel. In a more serious note, the game almost seems to be taking some pages out of ''[[Film/ManOnFire Man on Fire's]]'' book. Just look at the first trailer of the game when Max describes his situation and you will notice the similarities instantaneously.
** And if you disregard the [[NoProblemWithLiscenedGames decent]] [[VideoGame/ThePunisher game]] it got several years ago, the series as a whole could pass for a pretty solid ''ComicBook/ThePunisher'' video game due to the almost [[{{Expy}} identical]] traits Max shares with Frank, its edgy noir tone, and brutal violence (especially in the third game).



* VisualEffectsOfAwesome: Max Payne 2. Remedy had been given a higher budget and access to Rockstar's production resources thanks to the success of the first game, and it shows. The entire engine was given a graphical overhaul, with characters given full facial expressions and more fluid animation while the engine was also upgraded with shaders and greatly improved particle effects. The game managed to do all this a full year before the release of ''VideoGame/HalfLife2''.

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* VisualEffectsOfAwesome: VisualEffectsOfAwesome:
**
Max Payne 2. Remedy had been given a higher budget and access to Rockstar's production resources thanks to the success of the first game, and it shows. The entire engine was given a graphical overhaul, with characters given full facial expressions and more fluid animation while the engine was also upgraded with shaders and greatly improved particle effects. The game managed to do all this a full year before the release of ''VideoGame/HalfLife2''. ''VideoGame/HalfLife2''.
** The third game is also absolutely gorgeous - especially on PC - thanks in part to Rockstar's RAGE engine which has proved to provide [[VideoGame/GrandTheftAutoFour very]] [[VideoGame/RedDeadRedemption pretty looking]] [[VideoGame/GrandTheftAutoFive games]].
30th Apr '16 8:29:50 PM ACW
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** ''Max Payne 3'': [[spoiler:[[BigBad Victor Branco]]]] is an aspiring but {{corrupt politician}} of São Paulo, and a son of the [[spoiler:wealthy Branco family]]. [[TheManBehindTheMan He is also the hidden leader of the UFE]], a law enforcement group he uses for his own ends, and the Cracha Preto death squad and the mastermind behind the assassinations on [[spoiler:his brothers (one by [[ManOnFire burning alive]], and the abduction of his sister-in-law]]. He is motivated by [[{{greed}} control of the family fortune]] and [[WoundedGazelleGambit gaining sympathy]] for the [[SleazyPolitician election]]. He recruits Max as a bodyguard but really plans on making Max a fall guy for his criminal enterprises, which includes a secret ring where the poor of Brazil are kidnapped, held hostage and are harvested for their organs for the black market organ trade.

to:

** ''Max Payne 3'': [[spoiler:[[BigBad Victor Branco]]]] is an aspiring but {{corrupt politician}} of São Paulo, and a son of the [[spoiler:wealthy Branco family]]. [[TheManBehindTheMan He is also the hidden leader of the UFE]], a law enforcement group he uses for his own ends, and the Cracha Preto death squad and the mastermind behind the assassinations on [[spoiler:his brothers (one by [[ManOnFire burning alive]], alive]]), and the abduction of his sister-in-law]]. He is motivated by [[{{greed}} control of the family fortune]] and [[WoundedGazelleGambit gaining sympathy]] for the [[SleazyPolitician election]]. He recruits Max as a bodyguard but really plans on making Max a fall guy for his criminal enterprises, which includes a secret ring where the poor of Brazil are kidnapped, held hostage and are harvested for their organs for the black market organ trade.
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=YMMV.MaxPayne