History ScienceMarchesOn / WalkingWithDinosaurs

25th Jan '18 7:28:40 PM albertonykus
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* The evidence for female ''[[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs Tyrannosaurus]]'' being larger than males is inconclusive at best, although considering that this pattern of dimorphism is seen in most large carnivorous birds as well as the most primitive birds today, it isn't exactly improbable. Also, while recent papers suggest most of tyranosaurus was covered in scales(small amounts of feathers are still a possibility), the scales themselves where tiny, more akin to those seen of a bird's foot than the thicker, lizard-style scales seen in the show. The snout is also believed to have had thick keratainous scales on it, too, which was absent. Tyranosaurus is also believed to have lived in monogamous pairs, and mothers weren't single parents.

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* The evidence for female ''[[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs Tyrannosaurus]]'' being larger than males is inconclusive at best, although considering that this pattern of dimorphism is seen in most large carnivorous birds as well as the most primitive birds today, it isn't exactly improbable. Also, while recent papers suggest most of tyranosaurus was covered in scales(small amounts of feathers are still a possibility), the scales themselves where tiny, more akin to those seen of a bird's foot than the thicker, lizard-style scales seen in the show. The snout is also believed to have had thick keratainous scales on it, too, which was absent. Tyranosaurus is also believed to have lived in monogamous pairs, and mothers weren't single parents.
24th Jan '18 12:44:18 PM Michal
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* There were no [[UsefulNotes/PrehistoricLifeNonDinosaurianReptiles cynodonts]] of the size depicted in the program in the late Triassic[[note]]other than traversodonts. Given that some Mesozoic mammals reached similar sizes (such as the infamous ''Repenomamus''), cynodonts that big in that time period aren't strictly unlikely, but unknown from the area the episode took place[[/note]]. This is an example of ScienceMarchesOn rather than ArtisticLicensePaleontology because at the time the series was produced it was assumed that cynodonts of that size did live in Late Triassic in North America. This assumption was based on the discovery of [[http://chinleana.blogspot.com/2009/09/enigmatic-triassic-taxa.html two teeth]] from [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinle_Formation Chinle Formation]][[note]]though these teeth were assumed to belong to [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traversodontidae traversodont]] cynodonts, much different from ''Thrinaxodon'' that WWD-cynodonts were based on[[/note]]. However, [[http://socrates.berkeley.edu/~irmisr/chinleteeth.pdf post-WWD study]] indicate that these teeth can't be confidently referred to Cynodontia (or any other known group of Triassic amniotes, for that matter).

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* There were no [[UsefulNotes/PrehistoricLifeNonDinosaurianReptiles cynodonts]] of the size depicted in the program in the late Triassic[[note]]other than traversodonts. Given that some Mesozoic mammals reached similar sizes (such as the infamous ''Repenomamus''), cynodonts that big in that time period aren't strictly unlikely, but unknown from the area the episode took place[[/note]]. This is an example of ScienceMarchesOn rather than ArtisticLicensePaleontology because at the time the series was produced it was assumed that cynodonts of that size did live in Late Triassic in North America. This assumption was based on the discovery of [[http://chinleana.blogspot.com/2009/09/enigmatic-triassic-taxa.html two teeth]] from [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinle_Formation Chinle Formation]][[note]]though these teeth were assumed to belong to [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traversodontidae traversodont]] cynodonts, much different from ''Thrinaxodon'' that WWD-cynodonts were based on[[/note]]. However, [[http://socrates.berkeley.edu/~irmisr/chinleteeth.pdf [[https://www.researchgate.net/publication/228488767_Unusual_tetrapod_teeth_from_the_Upper_Triassic_Chinle_Formation_Arizona_USA post-WWD study]] indicate indicates that these teeth can't be confidently referred to Cynodontia (or any other known group of Triassic amniotes, for that matter).
24th Jan '18 9:50:03 AM AuspiciousWildcat
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* The evidence for female ''[[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs Tyrannosaurus]]'' being larger than males is inconclusive at best, although considering that this pattern of dimorphism is seen in most large carnivorous birds as well as the most primitive birds today, it isn't exactly improbable.

to:

* The evidence for female ''[[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs Tyrannosaurus]]'' being larger than males is inconclusive at best, although considering that this pattern of dimorphism is seen in most large carnivorous birds as well as the most primitive birds today, it isn't exactly improbable. Also, while recent papers suggest most of tyranosaurus was covered in scales(small amounts of feathers are still a possibility), the scales themselves where tiny, more akin to those seen of a bird's foot than the thicker, lizard-style scales seen in the show. The snout is also believed to have had thick keratainous scales on it, too, which was absent. Tyranosaurus is also believed to have lived in monogamous pairs, and mothers weren't single parents.
29th Dec '17 2:31:22 AM TrollMan
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* What was thought to be evidence for "cannibalistic ''[[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs Coelophysis]]''" has been discredited.

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* What was thought to be evidence for "cannibalistic ''[[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs Coelophysis]]''" has been discredited. Some of the evidence was cannibalism was later seen as adult ''Coelophysis'' simply having died on top of juveniles, while the stomach contents of other adult ''Coelophysis'' was determined to be that of small crocodilians, not younger ''Coelophysis''.



* ''Allosaurus'' was only one-fourth the size it was depicted. This may have resulted from confusion with a close relative called ''Saurophaganax'' which actually did grow to 6 tons. However, some scientists do consider the two to be the same animal.

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* ''Allosaurus'' was only one-fourth the size it was depicted. This may have resulted from confusion with a close relative called ''Saurophaganax'' which actually did grow to 6 tons. However, some scientists do consider the two to be the same animal.animal (although still as a separate species, ''Allosaurus maximus'', as opposed to the species most are familiar with, ''Allosaurus fragilis'').



* Recent studies suggest that ''[[UsefulNotes/PrehistoricLifeNonDinosaurianReptiles Anurognathus]]'' and its ilk were nocturnal and caught insects on the fly, like bats or swifts, making the "Mesozoic oxpecker" idea presented on the show highly unlikely.

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* Recent studies suggest that ''[[UsefulNotes/PrehistoricLifeNonDinosaurianReptiles Anurognathus]]'' and its ilk were nocturnal and caught insects on the fly, like bats or swifts, making the "Mesozoic oxpecker" idea presented on the show highly unlikely.unlikely (and that's not even mentioning that ''Anurognathus'' isn't even known from the same continent as ''Diplodocus'').



* [[StockDinosaursNonDinosaurs Plesiosaurs]] [[http://dx.doi.org/10.1126/science.1205689 gave birth to alive newborns]] just like the fish-like [[StockDinosaursNonDinosaurs ichthyosaurs]]; and they perhaps could not crawl onto land because the shape of their chest.

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* [[StockDinosaursNonDinosaurs Plesiosaurs]] [[http://dx.doi.org/10.1126/science.1205689 gave birth to alive newborns]] newborns in water]] just like the fish-like [[StockDinosaursNonDinosaurs ichthyosaurs]]; and they perhaps could not crawl onto land because the shape of their chest.



* Evidence of pliosaurs as large as the one in the episode has now been discredited. The largest known pliosaurs were probably "only" around 15 metres or so at the most. The fragmentary remains initially identified as that of ''Liopleurodon'' are now regarded as an unknown and yet unnamed genus. ''Liopleurodon'' itself was only about 21 feet long. Additionally, it should have a fluke on it's tail, as should the ''Cryptoclidus''.

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* Evidence of pliosaurs as large as the one in the episode has now been discredited. The largest known pliosaurs were probably "only" around 15 metres or so at the most.most, and even that's pushing it. The fragmentary remains initially identified as that of ''Liopleurodon'' are now regarded as an unknown and yet unnamed genus. ''Liopleurodon'' itself was only about 21 feet long. Additionally, it should have a fluke on it's its tail, as should the ''Cryptoclidus''.



* The species of ''Smilodon'' shown in the episode had not evolved yet when the show was set.
* ''Phorusrhacos'': At the time the episode was produced, scientists belived that sabertooths had displaced them as apex predators with their arrival, hence their depiction as scavengers. However, it is now considered more likely that the terror birds were still able to remain as apex predators in competition with the sabertooths. Also, the species would have been ''Titanis'' in reality, but a theory presented at the time was that ''Titanis'' was a synonym of ''Phorusrhacos'', which is mentioned in some supplementary material.

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* The species of ''Smilodon'' shown (''S. populator''} in the episode had not evolved yet when the show was set.
* ''Phorusrhacos'': At the time the episode was produced, scientists belived believed that sabertooths had displaced them as apex predators with their arrival, hence their depiction as scavengers. However, it is now considered more likely that the terror birds were still able to remain as apex predators in competition with the sabertooths. Also, the species would have been ''Titanis'' in reality, but a theory presented at the time was that ''Titanis'' was a synonym of ''Phorusrhacos'', which is mentioned in some supplementary material.



* The [[UsefulNotes/PrehistoricLifeOtherExtinctCreatures Giant Spider]] in the Carboniferous was based on ''Megarachne'', which ultimately turned out to be [[UsefulNotes/PrehistoricLifeOtherExtinctCreatures eurypterid]] ("sea scorpion") rather than spider.

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* The [[UsefulNotes/PrehistoricLifeOtherExtinctCreatures Giant Spider]] in the Carboniferous was based on ''Megarachne'', which ultimately turned out to be [[UsefulNotes/PrehistoricLifeOtherExtinctCreatures eurypterid]] ("sea scorpion") rather than spider. This was actually an error found out during production, but at that point it was too late to change the model (since the story hinged on ''Megarachne'' being a spider), so they just avoided naming the specific animal, opting instead to calling it a generic "mesothelae".



* The South American ''Iguanodon'' is now named ''Macrogryphosaurus''.

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* The South American ''Iguanodon'' is now named ''Macrogryphosaurus''.''Macrogryphosaurus'', which, similar to ''Giganotosaurus'', did not live at the same time as ''Argentinosaurus''.



* ''Mere days'' before the movie premiered, it was discovered that ''[[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs Edmontosaurus]]'' had a small fleshy crest on its head. Or at least one species, ''E. regalis'', did.

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* ''Mere days'' before the movie premiered, it was discovered that ''[[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs Edmontosaurus]]'' had a small fleshy crest on its head. Or at least one species, ''E. regalis'', did.did (this is the species most likely depicted in the film, as the other ''Edmontosaurus'' species, ''E. annectens'', is only known from fossil formations much younger than than the other dinosaur species in the movie).
* A 2016 study suggested that the Alaskan ''Edmontosaurus'' may be its own genus, ''Ugrunaaluk''; although a subsequent study in 2017 disputed this.
18th Dec '17 3:28:41 AM Spinosegnosaurus77
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* Most [[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs coelurosaurs]] certainly had feathers. The several [[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs dromaeosaurid species]] surely had them, but in the franchise they are all shown featherless, see further): this, rather than ScienceMarchesOn, might be interpreted more as RuleOfCool, or rather, ArtisticLicensePaleontology, since feathered raptors would have appeared "too cute"? In RealLife dromeosaurids had WINGS just like their famous relative, the "ur-bird" ''[[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs Archaeopteryx]]'' This might be nothing compared to what is seeming to come: ''most small-sized dinosaurs'' may well have had some sort of covering. This is a very recent theory led by the discover of the primitive herbivore ''[[UsefulNotes/PrehistoricLife Tianyulong]]'' in China: the theory is that some kind of covering was present in the last common ancestor of ''all'' dinosaurs and pterosaurs, and then it was partially lost by its largest descendants, possibly because of the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface-area-to-volume_ratio#Biology surface area to volume ratio]]. Some think the "spikes" on ''[[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs Diplodocus]]'' have the same common origin of feathers, as well as the quill of the small herbivore ''[[UsefulNotes/PrehistoricLifeHadrosaurPredecessors Psittacosaurus]]'' and even the horny bumps lined on the back of several [[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs hadrosaur mummies]]. See UsefulNotes/{{Dinosaurs}} for more infos about that. Whatever the case, the old "gigantic lizards" seem to have their days numbered now.

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* Most [[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs coelurosaurs]] certainly had feathers. The several [[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs dromaeosaurid species]] surely had them, but in the franchise they are all shown featherless, see further): featherless: this, rather than ScienceMarchesOn, might be interpreted more as RuleOfCool, or rather, ArtisticLicensePaleontology, since feathered raptors would have appeared "too cute"? In RealLife dromeosaurids had WINGS just like their famous relative, the "ur-bird" ''[[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs Archaeopteryx]]'' This might be nothing compared to what is seeming to come: ''most small-sized dinosaurs'' may well have had some sort of covering. This is a very recent theory led by the discover of the primitive herbivore ''[[UsefulNotes/PrehistoricLife Tianyulong]]'' in China: the theory is that some kind of covering was present in the last common ancestor of ''all'' dinosaurs and pterosaurs, and then it was partially lost by its largest descendants, possibly because of the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface-area-to-volume_ratio#Biology surface area to volume ratio]]. Some think the "spikes" on ''[[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs Diplodocus]]'' have the same common origin of feathers, as well as the quill of the small herbivore ''[[UsefulNotes/PrehistoricLifeHadrosaurPredecessors Psittacosaurus]]'' and even the horny bumps lined on the back of several [[UsefulNotes/StockDinosaursTrueDinosaurs hadrosaur mummies]]. See UsefulNotes/{{Dinosaurs}} for more infos about that. Whatever the case, the old "gigantic lizards" seem to have their days numbered now.
17th Dec '17 10:31:15 PM Naram-Sin
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* The '''Phorusrhacos''. At the time the episode was produced, scientists belived that sabertooths had displaced them as apex predators with their arrival, hence the depiction as scavengers. However, it is now considered more likely that the terror birds were still able to remain as apex predators in competition with the sabertooths. Also, the species would have been ''Titanis'' in reality, but a thoery presented at the time was that ''Titanis'' was a synonym of ''Phorusrhacos'', which is mentioned in some supplementary material.

to:

* The '''Phorusrhacos''. ''Phorusrhacos'': At the time the episode was produced, scientists belived that sabertooths had displaced them as apex predators with their arrival, hence the their depiction as scavengers. However, it is now considered more likely that the terror birds were still able to remain as apex predators in competition with the sabertooths. Also, the species would have been ''Titanis'' in reality, but a thoery theory presented at the time was that ''Titanis'' was a synonym of ''Phorusrhacos'', which is mentioned in some supplementary material.
17th Dec '17 6:30:25 AM Spinosegnosaurus77
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While generally accurate for when it was made, it's over 15 years old. New evidence regarding behavior, color and other details are always emerging. So, there are inaccuracies.

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While ''Walking With Dinosaurs'' was generally accurate for when it was made, it's over 15 years old. New evidence regarding behavior, color and other details are always emerging. So, there are inaccuracies.
16th Dec '17 10:34:38 PM Naram-Sin
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* There is increasing evidence that ''Australopithecus'' is not an ancestor of ''Homo'' at all, but a more vegetarian offshoot from a common ancestor, that eventually led to the specialist vegetarian genus ''Paranthropus''. The last common ancestor of ''Australopithecus'' and ''Homo'' might be ''Ardipithecus'' (named from fragmentary remains in 1995, a much more complete specimen, called "Ardi", was unveiled in 2009) or an even earlier genus. At any rate, the adaptation to bipedalism must have appeared already in the primitive East African jungle and was unrelated to its clearing and transformation in savanna. "Next of Kin" (as in Next ''to our'' Kin) still makes for a great description of ''Australopithecus'', though.
11th Dec '17 9:26:05 AM schoi30
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* The body shape of the ''Quetzalcoatlus'' is more akin to the [[http://dinodata.de/images/pterosaurs/ptero_q/~quetzalcoatlus/quetzalcoatlus-shiraishi.jpg old reconstructions]] of the species with a short neck, sprawled posture, a blunt beak, and ''Pteranodon''-like crest, very different from the [[http://s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/scifindr/articles/image3s/000/002/736/large/quetz.jpg?1481380203 modern view]], with a much flatter and frontal crest, erect stance, a sharp and pointed beak, and massive head mounted on a long neck.

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* The body shape of the ''Quetzalcoatlus'' is more akin to the [[http://dinodata.de/images/pterosaurs/ptero_q/~quetzalcoatlus/quetzalcoatlus-shiraishi.jpg old reconstructions]] of the species with a short neck, sprawled posture, a blunt beak, and ''Pteranodon''-like crest, very different from the [[http://s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/scifindr/articles/image3s/000/002/736/large/quetz.jpg?1481380203 modern view]], with a much flatter and frontal crest, erect stance, a sharp and pointed beak, and massive head mounted on a long neck.
11th Dec '17 9:23:00 AM schoi30
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* The body shape of the ''Quetzalcoatlus'' is more akin to the [[http://dinodata.de/images/pterosaurs/ptero_q/~quetzalcoatlus/quetzalcoatlus-shiraishi.jpg old reconstructions]] of the species with a short neck, sprawled posture, and ''Pteranodon''-like crest, very different from the [[http://s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/scifindr/articles/image3s/000/002/736/large/quetz.jpg?1481380203 modern view]], with a much flatter and frontal crest, erect stance, and massive head mounted on a long neck.

to:

* The body shape of the ''Quetzalcoatlus'' is more akin to the [[http://dinodata.de/images/pterosaurs/ptero_q/~quetzalcoatlus/quetzalcoatlus-shiraishi.jpg old reconstructions]] of the species with a short neck, sprawled posture, a blunt beak, and ''Pteranodon''-like crest, very different from the [[http://s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/scifindr/articles/image3s/000/002/736/large/quetz.jpg?1481380203 modern view]], with a much flatter and frontal crest, erect stance, a sharp and pointed beak, and massive head mounted on a long neck.
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