History OlderThanTheyThink / ComicBooks

22nd Aug '17 7:53:48 AM GrammarNavi
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* [[Comicbook/{{Batgirl 2000}} Cassandra Cain]] was the first Asian-American member of the Batfamily (and the Batfamily's first hero of color in general), as well as DC's first Asian character to have her own ongoing series. About a year or so before she debuted, JohnByrne pitched an idea for a new Asian-American Batgirl, though it never came to fruition.

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* [[Comicbook/{{Batgirl 2000}} Cassandra Cain]] was the first Asian-American member of the Batfamily (and the Batfamily's first hero of color in general), as well as DC's first Asian character to have her own ongoing series. About a year or so before she debuted, JohnByrne Creator/JohnByrne pitched an idea for a new Asian-American Batgirl, though it never came to fruition.
10th Aug '17 2:40:21 PM JulianLapostat
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* Some fans have accused Spider-Man ArchEnemy ComicBook/NormanOsborn (aka the Green Goblin) of being a rip off of ComicBook/LexLuthor, because both are [[CorruptCorporateExecutive Corrupt Corporate Executives]]. Thing is, Norman's been an evil businessman since he debuted in 1966 (his Goblin alter ego debuted two years before he did, interestingly enough), while Luthor was a traditional MadScientist from his appearance in 1940 until his reinvention as a businessman in 1986.

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* Some fans have accused Spider-Man ArchEnemy ComicBook/NormanOsborn (aka the Green Goblin) of being a rip off of ComicBook/LexLuthor, because both are [[CorruptCorporateExecutive Corrupt Corporate Executives]]. Thing is, Executives]], TheManBehindTheMan who have political aspirations:
**
Norman's been an evil businessman since he debuted in 1966 (his Goblin alter ego debuted two years before he did, interestingly enough), while Luthor was a traditional MadScientist from his appearance in 1940 until his reinvention as a businessman in 1986.1986.
** Luthor's revision from MadScientist criminal mastermind to a king of corrupt corporate businessman who is untouchable by the law was inspired by Creator/FrankMiller's take on ComicBook/TheKingpin which was popular in TheEighties (where corporations and big business became AcceptableTargets and remain so to this very day). Creator/NeilGaiman hung a {{Lampshade}} by calling Post-Crisis Luthor "skinny-Kingpin".
** Of course the modern concept of Osborn as this Marvel-wide villain (Head of HAMMER, SHIELD, Thunderbolts) who enters high political office despite being a villain MadBomber is certainly heavily inspired by Luthor's time as PresidentEvil in the Late-'90s, early-'00s, and even then, the concept of villain as head-of-state with diplomatic immunity is more or less something that ''ComicBook/DoctorDoom'' has copyright on, and don't you forget it, RIIICHAAAAAARDSS!
10th Aug '17 1:38:42 PM JulianLapostat
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* Creator/WillEisner's ''ComicBook/TheSpirit'' is considered one of the most innovative comics in the medium and a touchstone for Creator/AlanMoore, Creator/FrankMiller, Creator/NeilGaiman and Creator/BruceTimm.
** Miller noted that his take on ''ComicBook/{{Daredevil}}'' was inspired by ''The Spirit'' and noting that stuff like the gritty crime drama nature of the stories, the real-life setting of New York City, a mysterious TheManBehindTheMan type villain (The Kingpin [=/=] The Octopus) and the FemmeFatale who have DarkAndTroubledPast connection to the hero (Elektra [=/=]Sand Saref) can be sourced there.
** Creator/NeilGaiman during his run on ''ComicBook/TheSandman'' also cited The Spirit, namely the fact that most of the stories in Eisner's run kept the protagonist a SupportingProtagonist, with many of the stories focusing on one-shot characters who are HeroOfAnotherStory, and likewise a few having ADeathInTheLimelight. He cited this as a justification for his run on The Sandman where a few of the Story Arc and one-shot tended not to focus on Morpheus [=/=] Dream at all.
** Creator/AlanMoore also cited Eisner's humanism in his balance of Muggle and Superhero stories in ''ComicBook/VForVendetta'' (where V, like the Spirit, is largely a StaticCharacter and as symbol, and the real drama is in the supporting characters and villains) as well as ''ComicBook/{{Watchmen}}'' where the supporting characters like Malcolm Long and the Street Vendor have prominent arcs.
** Creator/BruceTimm describes the LowerDeckEpisode in ''WesternAnimation/BatmanTheAnimatedSeries'' such as ''Joker's Favour'' and ''The Man Who Killed Batman'' as {{Homage}} to Eisner in that Batman barely shows up in these stories and the plots focus on average nobodies in the crazy world of Gotham.



* One of the biggest accusations towards ''ComicBook/SecretEmpire'' was that turning [[ComicBook/CaptainAmerica Steve Rogers]], a Jewish man, into an unapologetic fascist character was a slap in the face towards his co-creator Jack Kirby, who was also Jewish. As others have pointed out, there was already a story years before where Captain America was turned into a fascist character. By Jack Kirby.

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* One of the biggest accusations towards ''ComicBook/SecretEmpire'' was that turning [[ComicBook/CaptainAmerica Steve Rogers]], a Jewish man, into an unapologetic fascist character was a slap in the face towards his co-creator Jack Kirby, who was also Jewish. As others have pointed out, there was already a story years before where Captain America was turned into a fascist character. By Jack Kirby.Kirby, except Kirby did that for a short moment and not an extended event title.
4th Jul '17 9:52:27 PM JulianLapostat
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** Creator/AlanMoore generally cited Creator/JackKirby as his main inspiration and in interviews said that the whole concept of reviving forgotten superheroes and giving them a contemporary update and darker take (as he did on ''ComicBook/SwampThing'' and ''ComicBook/{{Miracleman}}'' was based on how Kirby brought Namor, a GoldenAge Timely era AntiHero into the ''ComicBook/FantasticFour'' citing the sequence where Johnny Storm runs into a random hobo and then shaves his PermaStubble to reveal him as Namor in a FallenOnHardTimesJob as one of his all-time favorite panels. Kirby also got the idea of bringing ComicBook/CaptainAmerica to modern times and invented the out-of-time thawed origin that we know and love.

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** Creator/AlanMoore generally cited Creator/JackKirby as his main inspiration and in interviews said that the whole concept of reviving forgotten superheroes and giving them a contemporary update and darker take (as he did on ''ComicBook/SwampThing'' and ''ComicBook/{{Miracleman}}'' ''ComicBook/{{Miracleman}}'') was based on how Kirby brought Namor, a GoldenAge Timely era AntiHero into the ''ComicBook/FantasticFour'' citing the sequence where Johnny Storm runs into a random hobo and then shaves his PermaStubble to reveal him as Namor in a FallenOnHardTimesJob as one of his all-time favorite panels. Kirby also got the idea of bringing ComicBook/CaptainAmerica to modern times and invented the out-of-time thawed origin that we know and love.
4th Jul '17 9:51:49 PM JulianLapostat
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** Creator/AlanMoore generally cited Creator/JackKirby as his main inspiration and in interviews said that the whole concept of reviving forgotten superheroes and giving them a contemporary update and darker take (as he did on ''ComicBook/SwampThing'' and ''ComicBook/{{Miracleman}}'' was based on how Kirby brought Namor, a GoldenAge Timely era AntiHero into the ''ComicBook/FantasticFour'' citing the sequence where Johnny Storm runs into a random hobo and then shaves his PermaStubble to reveal him as Namor in a FallenOnHardTimesJob as one of his all-time favorite panels. Kirby also got the idea of bringing ComicBook/CaptainAmerica to modern times and invented the out-of-time thawed origin that we know and love.
** Moore also cited Harvey Kurtzmann's ''Superduperman'' as his all-time favorite comic. This ''Magazine/{{MAD}}'' magazine parody had Clark Bent in a TwoPersonLoveTriangle with Lois Pain, and who after finding out his secret identity dumps him because "once a creep, always a creep". Superduperman also battled Captain Marbles causing much property damage, and Captain Marbles (a ComicBook/{{Shazam}} {{Expy}}) was a former superhero who posed as a businessman and whose antics were driven to make money. Moore said that ''ComicBook/{{Miracleman}}'' and ''ComicBook/{{Watchmen}}'' were Superduperman PlayedForDrama, taking the same {{Deconstruction}} approach but making it dramatic and poignant rather than hilarious and parodic.
21st Jun '17 5:32:30 AM Doug86
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* Comicbook/{{Deadshot}} is commonly thought to have debuted in the '70s or '80s due to his reinventions in 1977, and having become a prominent member of the Comicbook/SuicideSquad during that time. He actually debuted in ''1950'' as a one-off Comicbook/{{Batman}} villain, and was [[CharacterizationMarchesOn damn near unrecognizable]] to the Deadshot we know today.

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* Comicbook/{{Deadshot}} is commonly thought to have debuted in the '70s or '80s due to his reinventions in 1977, and having become a prominent member of the Comicbook/SuicideSquad during that time. He actually debuted in ''1950'' as a one-off Comicbook/{{Batman}} Franchise/{{Batman}} villain, and was [[CharacterizationMarchesOn damn near unrecognizable]] to the Deadshot we know today.
2nd Jun '17 4:45:01 AM MagiMecha
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* One of the biggest accusations towards ''ComicBook/SecretEmpire'' was that turning [[ComicBook/CaptainAmerica Steve Rogers]], a Jewish man, into an unapologetic fascist character was a slap in the face towards his co-creator Jack Kirby, who was also Jewish. As others have pointed out, there was already a story years before where Captain America was turned into a fascist character. By Jack Kirby.
13th May '17 10:46:53 AM nombretomado
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** Ming the Merciless (1934) has been referred to as "a cheap Ra's al Ghul clone" as well. Ra's and Ming are knockoffs of FuManchu, who wasn't the first YellowPeril villain either.

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** Ming the Merciless (1934) has been referred to as "a cheap Ra's al Ghul clone" as well. Ra's and Ming are knockoffs of FuManchu, Literature/FuManchu, who wasn't the first YellowPeril villain either.
25th Apr '17 6:45:08 PM nombretomado
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* [[RetCanon Synergy]] between comics and their adaptations. The practice really came to prominence (and controversy) in TheNewTens, when Marvel began aggressively trying to sync their comics up with the movies and shows of the [[MarvelCinematicUniverse MCU]], but it was already around way before that. Not only was it already a thing with ''previous'' Marvel movies [[note]]Among MANY other examples, Comicbook/{{Blade}}'s enhanced strength comes from the [[Film/BladeTrilogy Wesley Snipes movies]], while both Mystique and Toad got redesigned to resemble their counterparts from the [[Film/XMen1 first X-Men film]], with Toad's prehensile tongue also coming from the flick[[/note]], but it has arguably been going on as long as adaptations of comic books have. Superman's flight came from the [[WesternAnimation/SupermanTheatricalCartoons Fleischer cartoons]], while both Comicbook/JimmyOlsen and Kryptonite originated in the [[Radio/TheAdventuresOfSuperman radio show]].

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* [[RetCanon Synergy]] between comics and their adaptations. The practice really came to prominence (and controversy) in TheNewTens, when Marvel began aggressively trying to sync their comics up with the movies and shows of the [[MarvelCinematicUniverse [[Franchise/MarvelCinematicUniverse MCU]], but it was already around way before that. Not only was it already a thing with ''previous'' Marvel movies [[note]]Among MANY other examples, Comicbook/{{Blade}}'s enhanced strength comes from the [[Film/BladeTrilogy Wesley Snipes movies]], while both Mystique and Toad got redesigned to resemble their counterparts from the [[Film/XMen1 first X-Men film]], with Toad's prehensile tongue also coming from the flick[[/note]], but it has arguably been going on as long as adaptations of comic books have. Superman's flight came from the [[WesternAnimation/SupermanTheatricalCartoons Fleischer cartoons]], while both Comicbook/JimmyOlsen and Kryptonite originated in the [[Radio/TheAdventuresOfSuperman radio show]].
20th Apr '17 12:57:32 PM comicwriter
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* Speaking of Kamala, she's also not the first teen hero to follow Carol Danvers' footsteps. Ultragirl filled a similar role in ''Comicbook/AvengersTheInitiative'' and was even given Carol's old Comicbook/MsMarvel costume, before ''Comicbook/DarkReign'' cut that plot thread short.
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