History NeverLiveItDown / ComicBooks

27th Nov '16 7:03:42 PM TheNewBig
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** And while we're on that subject, former head writer Ken Penders, despite being on the title for over 15 years and creating some memorable (and not-so-memorable) characters and stories, will forever be remembered as the man who decided to try to take back ''each and every one'', then declare that he was going to make better stories with them from his own company. Despite, y'know... each and every one being derivatives of our heroes and villains?

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** And while we're on that subject, former head writer Ken Penders, despite being on the title for over 15 years and creating some memorable (and not-so-memorable) characters and stories, will forever be remembered as the man who decided to try to take back ''each and every one'', then declare that he was going to make better stories with them from his own company. Despite, y'know... each Given he'd been working for Archie Comics for 15 years, and every one being derivatives basically chose to end his tenure with this supreme act of our heroes and villains?spite, ''and'' now as a result many beloved characters have been made off limits to the Sonic comics it's pretty understandable.
27th Nov '16 6:33:11 AM dmcreif
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* Karen Page will be forever remembered as the girl who sold out Matt for a drug fix and got killed off that kick start the famous ''ComicBook/DaredevilBornAgain'' storyline. This got so bad that she instantly got some hate in the [[Series/{{Daredevil2015}} Netflix TV series]] for this storyline, ''even though it hasn't been adapted yet''. Her actress even had to make a statement that she'd been promised the MCU's Karen would ''never'' do it, and in fact the BroadStrokes of the story involving her drug use and criminal actions have been moved into her ''past''.

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* Karen Page will be forever remembered as the girl who sold out Matt for a drug fix and got killed off that kick start the famous ''ComicBook/DaredevilBornAgain'' storyline. This got so bad that she instantly got some hate in the [[Series/{{Daredevil2015}} Netflix TV series]] for this storyline, ''even though it hasn't been adapted yet''. Her actress Creator/DeborahAnnWoll even had to make a statement that she'd been promised the MCU's Karen would ''never'' do it, and in fact the BroadStrokes of the story involving her drug use and criminal actions have been moved into her ''past''.
20th Nov '16 1:20:29 PM StFan
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* Whether as a ShoutOut, coincidence, or someone involved in the comic actually having something to do with the site, ''Witch Girls'' had two characters named Denora [=DeSade=] and Claudia who are quite similar to characters with the same names from the long-defunct transformation fetish site "The Shrinking Sorceress." Cue detractors of the recent, better-known RPG spinoff ''WitchGirlsAdventures'' (which features the same characters and a rather large amount of artwork dedicated to witches transforming helpless victims into various objects) ranting about how it's a BleachedUnderpants version of the site and nearly every adult character is lifted from it.
** MANGA GRAPHIX, the company that publishes ''Witch Girls'', is mentioned in the copyright blurb on ''[[http://web.archive.org/web/20010411183322/www.geocities.com/gotiger_1999/Sorc1.html Shrinking Sorceress]]''. [[http://www.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Malcolm/Harris Malcolm Harris]], the author of ''Witch Girls'' and the owner of Channel M (which owns WGA), lists himself as a writer for MANGA GRAPHIX in his resume.
* In issue #134 of ''Comicbook/{{Sonic the Hedgehog}}'', Princess Sally slapped Sonic across the face. Since then, some fans have used it as "evidence" that Sally has always been a bitch. However, that one instance was terribly out of character (per editorial order), and since then she's been restored to her old self. More than a few call backs have been made to this moment in universe in the comic (usually with Sally shown to be highly remorseful about it) something that is almost certainly an attempt to fix this treatment with fans.

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* Whether as a ShoutOut, coincidence, or someone involved in the comic actually having something to do with the site, ''Witch Girls'' had has two characters named Denora [=DeSade=] and Claudia who are quite similar to characters with the same names from the long-defunct transformation fetish site "The Shrinking Sorceress." Sorceress". Cue detractors of the recent, better-known RPG spinoff ''WitchGirlsAdventures'' ''TabletopGame/WitchGirlsAdventures'' (which features the same characters and a rather large amount of artwork dedicated to witches transforming helpless victims into various objects) ranting about how it's a BleachedUnderpants version of the site and nearly every adult character is lifted from it.
**
it. MANGA GRAPHIX, the company that publishes ''Witch Girls'', is mentioned in the copyright blurb on ''[[http://web.archive.org/web/20010411183322/www.geocities.com/gotiger_1999/Sorc1.html Shrinking Sorceress]]''. [[http://www.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Malcolm/Harris Malcolm Harris]], the author of ''Witch Girls'' and the owner of Channel M (which owns WGA), lists himself as a writer for MANGA GRAPHIX in his resume.
* In issue #134 of ''Comicbook/{{Sonic the Hedgehog}}'', ''Comicbook/SonicTheHedgehog'', Princess Sally slapped Sonic across the face. Since then, some fans have used it as "evidence" that Sally has always been a bitch. However, that one instance was terribly out of character (per editorial order), and since then she's been restored to her old self. More than a few call backs have been made to this moment in universe in the comic (usually with Sally shown to be highly remorseful about it) something that is almost certainly an attempt to fix this treatment with fans.



** Some fans, especially those who hated the character, will never live down the fact that Antoine used to be a [[CheeseEatingSurrenderMonkeys Cheese Eating Surrender Monkey]], completely ignoring that he TookALevelInBadass. It doesn't help that some Sonic fans only watched the ''SonicSatAm'' cartoon, where he didn't get any CharacterDevelopment.

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** Some fans, especially those who hated the character, will never live down the fact that Antoine used to be a [[CheeseEatingSurrenderMonkeys Cheese Eating Surrender Monkey]], completely ignoring that he TookALevelInBadass. It doesn't help that some Sonic fans only watched the ''SonicSatAm'' ''WesternAnimation/SonicSatAm'' cartoon, where he didn't get any CharacterDevelopment.
14th Nov '16 7:36:22 PM Seraphine
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* Pictured above: The [[IHaveManyNames many-monikered]] [[ComicBook/AntMan Dr. Hank Pym]], a founding member of Comicbook/TheAvengers, who once hit his wife Janet Van Dyne (TheWasp) during a [[FreakOut mental-breakdown-induced]] FaceHeelTurn. (This storyline also included attacking the Avengers with a giant robot, just so that he could look like a hero when he stopped it. The whole thing would be a DorkAge if it didn't end with Pym [[HesBack recovering]], then [[CrowningMomentOfAwesome single-handedly beating the Masters of Evil]].) Writers have explored the issue with various levels of grace since then, but more than once, his hitting Wasp has devolved into a crude running gag which still colors newer depictions of him. In particular, the [[ComicBook/UltimateMarvel Ultimate version of Hank Pym]] ''is'' an outright wife-beater. The real kicker? It's actually ''Jan'' if anyone, who was the abuser in the relationship as seen [[http://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Janet_van_Dyne_(Earth-616) here]] Despite it being obvious he ''wasn't'' in his right mind when he proposed, she not only accepted, but did absolutely nothing about his increasingly worsening mental state which she later admits she might have exacerbated when forced to take him down when he was BrainwashedAndCrazy. To a therapist she got exclusively to ''herself''.

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* Pictured above: The [[IHaveManyNames many-monikered]] [[ComicBook/AntMan Dr. Hank Pym]], a founding member of Comicbook/TheAvengers, who once hit his wife Janet Van Dyne (TheWasp) during a [[FreakOut mental-breakdown-induced]] FaceHeelTurn. (This storyline also included attacking the Avengers with a giant robot, just so that he could look like a hero when he stopped it. The whole thing would be a DorkAge if it didn't end with Pym [[HesBack recovering]], then [[CrowningMomentOfAwesome single-handedly beating the Masters of Evil]].) Writers have explored the issue with various levels of grace since then, but more than once, his hitting Wasp has devolved into a crude running gag which still colors newer depictions of him. In particular, the [[ComicBook/UltimateMarvel Ultimate version of Hank Pym]] ''is'' an outright wife-beater. The real kicker? It's actually ''Jan'' if anyone, who was the abuser in the relationship as seen [[http://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Janet_van_Dyne_(Earth-616) here]] here]]. Despite it being obvious he ''wasn't'' in his right mind when he proposed, she not only accepted, but did absolutely nothing about his increasingly worsening mental state which she later admits she might have exacerbated when forced to take him down when he was BrainwashedAndCrazy. To a therapist she got exclusively to ''herself''.
14th Nov '16 7:20:52 PM Seraphine
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*** It seems to be played straight in WesternAnimation/BatmanBeyond, where Bane is a cripple on life support due to the Venom use, but once you take into account that he's in his eighties and the condition of other users after mere ''weeks''...

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*** It seems to be played straight in WesternAnimation/BatmanBeyond, ''WesternAnimation/BatmanBeyond'', where Bane is a cripple on life support due to the Venom use, but once you take into account that he's in his eighties and the condition of other users after mere ''weeks''...



* Pictured at the right: The [[IHaveManyNames many-monikered]] [[ComicBook/AntMan Dr. Hank Pym]], a founding member of Comicbook/TheAvengers, who once hit his wife Janet Van Dyne (TheWasp) during a [[FreakOut mental-breakdown-induced]] FaceHeelTurn. (This storyline also included attacking the Avengers with a giant robot, just so that he could look like a hero when he stopped it. The whole thing would be a DorkAge if it didn't end with Pym [[HesBack recovering]], then [[CrowningMomentOfAwesome single-handedly beating the Masters of Evil]].) Writers have explored the issue with various levels of grace since then, but more than once, his hitting Wasp has devolved into a crude running gag which still colors newer depictions of him. In particular, the [[ComicBook/UltimateMarvel Ultimate version of Hank Pym]] ''is'' an outright wife-beater. The real kicker? It's actually ''Jan'' if anyone, who was the abuser in the relationship as seen here: http://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Janet_van_Dyne_(Earth-616) Despite it being obvious he ''wasn't'' in his right mind when he proposed, she not only accepted, but did absolutely nothing about his increasingly worsening mental state which she later admits she might have exacerbated when forced to take him down when he was BrainwashedAndCrazy. To a therapist she got exclusively to ''herself''.

to:

* Pictured at the right: above: The [[IHaveManyNames many-monikered]] [[ComicBook/AntMan Dr. Hank Pym]], a founding member of Comicbook/TheAvengers, who once hit his wife Janet Van Dyne (TheWasp) during a [[FreakOut mental-breakdown-induced]] FaceHeelTurn. (This storyline also included attacking the Avengers with a giant robot, just so that he could look like a hero when he stopped it. The whole thing would be a DorkAge if it didn't end with Pym [[HesBack recovering]], then [[CrowningMomentOfAwesome single-handedly beating the Masters of Evil]].) Writers have explored the issue with various levels of grace since then, but more than once, his hitting Wasp has devolved into a crude running gag which still colors newer depictions of him. In particular, the [[ComicBook/UltimateMarvel Ultimate version of Hank Pym]] ''is'' an outright wife-beater. The real kicker? It's actually ''Jan'' if anyone, who was the abuser in the relationship as seen here: http://marvel.[[http://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Janet_van_Dyne_(Earth-616) here]] Despite it being obvious he ''wasn't'' in his right mind when he proposed, she not only accepted, but did absolutely nothing about his increasingly worsening mental state which she later admits she might have exacerbated when forced to take him down when he was BrainwashedAndCrazy. To a therapist she got exclusively to ''herself''.



* Comicbook/{{Rogue}} and Comicbook/{{Gambit}}: Antarctica. Neither character will ''ever'' live that down. Captured in Antartica, Gambit was put on trial and it was revealed that he was hired by Mr. Sinister to get the [[PsychoForHire Marauders]] together and lead them into the Morlock Tunnels without knowing what they were there for. That was the extent of his involvement, but every character (and many writers) treat this as an unforgivable sin. As part of said "trial," Rogue was forced to kiss him, and absorbed his memories of the incident, as well as the [[HeroicBSOD nearly suicidal self-loathing and guilt]] he was feeling over it at the time. Later, during the escape, Rogue drops Gambit onto the arctic tundra and leaves him there to face UncertainDoom. This was the point where their relationship drama leapt from CantHaveSexEver to a mutual LoveHateRelationship, and it has never fully recovered.

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* Comicbook/{{Rogue}} and Comicbook/{{Gambit}}: Antarctica. Neither character will ''ever'' live that down. Captured in Antartica, Antarctica, Gambit was put on trial and it was revealed that he was hired by Mr. Sinister to get the [[PsychoForHire Marauders]] together and lead them into the Morlock Tunnels without knowing what they were there for. That was the extent of his involvement, but every character (and many writers) treat this as an unforgivable sin. As part of said "trial," Rogue was forced to kiss him, and absorbed his memories of the incident, as well as the [[HeroicBSOD nearly suicidal self-loathing and guilt]] he was feeling over it at the time. Later, during the escape, Rogue drops Gambit onto the arctic tundra and leaves him there to face UncertainDoom. This was the point where their relationship drama leapt from CantHaveSexEver to a mutual LoveHateRelationship, and it has never fully recovered.
11th Oct '16 6:03:43 AM LondonKdS
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* The aforementioned ''ComicBook/TheKillingJoke'' is the cause of a character example of this as well, with many Barbara Gordon fans being upset that broader DC fans and some creators still seem to consider the defining incident of her life to be that time the Joker paralysed, tortured, and sexually humiliated her solely to [[StuffedIntoTheFridge troll her father and Batman]], both in-universe and in storytelling terms. It got particular backlash when an alternate cover for the relatively light-hearted Stewart/Fletcher/Tarr run on [[ComicBook/{{Batgirl2011}} her solo title]] showed her tied up and crying while the Joker pointed a gun directly at her crotch.

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* The aforementioned ''ComicBook/TheKillingJoke'' is the cause of a character example of this as well, for Barbara Gordon, with many Barbara Gordon of her personal fans being upset that broader DC fans and some creators still seem to consider the defining incident of her life to be that time the Joker paralysed, tortured, and sexually humiliated her solely to [[StuffedIntoTheFridge troll her father and Batman]], both in-universe and in storytelling terms. It got particular backlash when an alternate cover for the relatively light-hearted Stewart/Fletcher/Tarr run on [[ComicBook/{{Batgirl2011}} her solo title]] showed her tied up and crying with terror while the Joker pointed a gun directly at her crotch.
10th Oct '16 11:41:13 PM timotaka
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** In addition, his fight against Superman is often one of the most cited examples of "Batman always defeating Superman", never mind the measures that Batman had to take just to hold him down for periods, the fact that Superman was constantly holding back, and that he had outside help.

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** In addition, his fight against Superman is often one of the most cited examples of "Batman always defeating Superman", never mind the measures that Batman had to take just to hold him down for periods, the fact that Superman was constantly holding back, and that he had outside help. Oh yeah, and ultimately ''Batman lost'' that fight. (And used it to help fake his death.)
28th Sep '16 2:05:46 PM TheNewBig
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* Similarly, Umar will (again, understandably)never live down the fact she once raped the ComicBook/IncredibleHulk. It doesn't help that this instance was played for laughs when Hulk had been the victim of both an attempted ''and'' a succesful rape before, and they were rightfully shown to be the horrible, traumatizing events they were.



* Umar was always a pretty intimidating enemy of ComicBook/DoctorStrange and first to make him consider rejecting his ThouShaltNotKill principle, back in the middle of UsefulNotes/TheSilverAgeOfComicBooks, no less, and later was often an important player in the struggle between Strange and Dormammu. However, she will never live down the fact she once raped the ComicBook/IncredibleHulk.
27th Sep '16 3:44:49 PM TheNewBig
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* Pictured at the right: The [[IHaveManyNames many-monikered]] [[ComicBook/AntMan Dr. Hank Pym]], a founding member of Comicbook/TheAvengers, who once hit his wife Janet Van Dyne (TheWasp) during a [[FreakOut mental-breakdown-induced]] FaceHeelTurn. (This storyline also included attacking the Avengers with a giant robot, just so that he could look like a hero when he stopped it. The whole thing would be a DorkAge if it didn't end with Pym [[HesBack recovering]], then [[CrowningMomentOfAwesome single-handedly beating the Masters of Evil]].) Writers have explored the issue with various levels of grace since then, but more than once, his hitting Wasp has devolved into a crude running gag which still colors newer depictions of him. In particular, the [[ComicBook/UltimateMarvel Ultimate version of Hank Pym]] ''is'' an outright wife-beater.

to:

* Pictured at the right: The [[IHaveManyNames many-monikered]] [[ComicBook/AntMan Dr. Hank Pym]], a founding member of Comicbook/TheAvengers, who once hit his wife Janet Van Dyne (TheWasp) during a [[FreakOut mental-breakdown-induced]] FaceHeelTurn. (This storyline also included attacking the Avengers with a giant robot, just so that he could look like a hero when he stopped it. The whole thing would be a DorkAge if it didn't end with Pym [[HesBack recovering]], then [[CrowningMomentOfAwesome single-handedly beating the Masters of Evil]].) Writers have explored the issue with various levels of grace since then, but more than once, his hitting Wasp has devolved into a crude running gag which still colors newer depictions of him. In particular, the [[ComicBook/UltimateMarvel Ultimate version of Hank Pym]] ''is'' an outright wife-beater. The real kicker? It's actually ''Jan'' if anyone, who was the abuser in the relationship as seen here: http://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Janet_van_Dyne_(Earth-616) Despite it being obvious he ''wasn't'' in his right mind when he proposed, she not only accepted, but did absolutely nothing about his increasingly worsening mental state which she later admits she might have exacerbated when forced to take him down when he was BrainwashedAndCrazy. To a therapist she got exclusively to ''herself''.
27th Sep '16 3:40:03 PM TheNewBig
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** Ironically, fans who ''hate'' this treatment of Hank do the ''exact same thing'' with Janet. As Janet only married Hank during his Yellow Jacket identity, many fans have exaggerated the situation to the point its treated like she emotionally abused him and was the cause of the mental breakdown, which borders on victim blaming. In actuality, Janet didn't 'trick' him into marrying her, but merely accepted the proposal without really thinking too much about his sudden change of personality, and the issue where they wed clearly shows Hank in a lucid phase when he does so; though Hank was having mental problems, he wasn't incapable of making decisions, yet many fans act like he was barely sane enough to operate by himself and Janet knowingly took advantage of it.
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