History Main / RedemptionDemotion

20th Nov '16 4:07:37 AM Morgenthaler
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** Double subverted with Siren. When she changes sides and becomes Cure Beat, she's quite {{Badass}} and crushes the MonsterOfTheWeek easily two or three times, even finishing them off herself! After a dozen or so episodes later, she's the one getting defeated by a single MonsterOfTheWeek and Cure Rhythm and Melody have to bail ''her'' out.
** Cure Muse is a neutral-to-good example, but otherwise she plays it awfully straight. She spends half the series being a MysteriousProtector and a {{Badass}}, but the very first battle she's in after joining the main girls, it ''begins'' with her getting punched off by the MonsterOfTheWeek. Then her Special Move is ineffective and is told she has to rely in others. She eventually kills the MonsterOfTheWeek on her ''second'' try, but not before making it clear this trope is in effect. At least Ellen ''was'' awesome for a while!

to:

** Double subverted with Siren. When she changes sides and becomes Cure Beat, she's quite {{Badass}} badass and crushes the MonsterOfTheWeek easily two or three times, even finishing them off herself! After a dozen or so episodes later, she's the one getting defeated by a single MonsterOfTheWeek and Cure Rhythm and Melody have to bail ''her'' out.
** Cure Muse is a neutral-to-good example, but otherwise she plays it awfully straight. She spends half the series being a MysteriousProtector and a {{Badass}}, badass, but the very first battle she's in after joining the main girls, it ''begins'' with her getting punched off by the MonsterOfTheWeek. Then her Special Move is ineffective and is told she has to rely in others. She eventually kills the MonsterOfTheWeek on her ''second'' try, but not before making it clear this trope is in effect. At least Ellen ''was'' awesome for a while!



* ''Anime/MobileSuitGundam'': Poor, poor, Char Aznable. As the infamous Red Comet of Zeon, he made many Federation soldiers wet their pants and was the only one to be able to go toe to toe with Amuro Ray. Once he took up the moniker of [[Anime/MobileSuitZetaGundam Quattro Bajina]], he was finding himself getting owned all over the place, culminating in Haman Karn nearly killing him. Come ''Anime/MobileSuitGundamCharsCounterattack'', Char's back to being evil and being a {{Badass}}. Though this mostly has to do with his available equipment. As Quattro in Zeta he's neither the main character nor the rival, and they get the flashy toys. As Quattro the only unit they had to give him was the decent but not especially powerful Hyaku Shiki while the titular Zeta Gundam went to main character Kamille, where as in Zeon he had access to their powerful mobile armors and high speed mobile suits. When he goes back to Zeon he's the rival again and he gets the Sazabi with extreme firepower and remote weapons as a result.

to:

* ''Anime/MobileSuitGundam'': Poor, poor, Char Aznable. As the infamous Red Comet of Zeon, he made many Federation soldiers wet their pants and was the only one to be able to go toe to toe with Amuro Ray. Once he took up the moniker of [[Anime/MobileSuitZetaGundam Quattro Bajina]], he was finding himself getting owned all over the place, culminating in Haman Karn nearly killing him. Come ''Anime/MobileSuitGundamCharsCounterattack'', Char's back to being evil and being a {{Badass}}.badass. Though this mostly has to do with his available equipment. As Quattro in Zeta he's neither the main character nor the rival, and they get the flashy toys. As Quattro the only unit they had to give him was the decent but not especially powerful Hyaku Shiki while the titular Zeta Gundam went to main character Kamille, where as in Zeon he had access to their powerful mobile armors and high speed mobile suits. When he goes back to Zeon he's the rival again and he gets the Sazabi with extreme firepower and remote weapons as a result.



* {{Lampshade|Hanging}}d by [[Wrestling/KevinNash Diesel]] after he got beat by Wrestling/BretHart for the [[http://www.wrestling-titles.com/wwe/wwe-h.html WWE World Heavyweight Title]]. Diesel claimed that he lost his edge while trying to be Wrestling/VinceMcMahon's latest reimagining of Wrestling/HulkHogan, and that he was going back to being the {{Badass}} that effortlessly cleared rings during battle royals. He then became a [[WildCard Tweener]] that gradually transitioned into a full-blown {{Heel}}.

to:

* {{Lampshade|Hanging}}d by [[Wrestling/KevinNash Diesel]] after he got beat by Wrestling/BretHart for the [[http://www.wrestling-titles.com/wwe/wwe-h.html WWE World Heavyweight Title]]. Diesel claimed that he lost his edge while trying to be Wrestling/VinceMcMahon's latest reimagining of Wrestling/HulkHogan, and that he was going back to being the {{Badass}} badass that effortlessly cleared rings during battle royals. He then became a [[WildCard Tweener]] that gradually transitioned into a full-blown {{Heel}}.



* Magus in ''VideoGame/ChronoTrigger'' was an incredibly {{Badass}} boss, but when he joins you, he has significantly less HP (going from 6666 to ''at most'' 999), and he has to relearn all but three of his spells. This could be explained by having his powers weakened by a Masamune beating and drained by [[BigBad Lavos]], while the discrepancy in the stats are explained by simple game mechanics and ratios: [[HealthDamageAsymmetry enemies and bosses have more HP, but the main characters do more damage]]. However, if you choose to fight him a second time, he uses all these awesome spells against you.

to:

* Magus in ''VideoGame/ChronoTrigger'' was an incredibly {{Badass}} badass boss, but when he joins you, he has significantly less HP (going from 6666 to ''at most'' 999), and he has to relearn all but three of his spells. This could be explained by having his powers weakened by a Masamune beating and drained by [[BigBad Lavos]], while the discrepancy in the stats are explained by simple game mechanics and ratios: [[HealthDamageAsymmetry enemies and bosses have more HP, but the main characters do more damage]]. However, if you choose to fight him a second time, he uses all these awesome spells against you.



* Similarly, in fellow Capcom game ''VideoGame/DevilMayCry 3'', the playable version of Vergil (accessible in the Special Edition) lacks moves that the boss version can do. However, playable Vergil does get some moves his boss incarnations don't, and the series also tends to make Dante, the hero, far more {{Badass}} than any evil counterpart.

to:

* Similarly, in fellow Capcom game ''VideoGame/DevilMayCry 3'', the playable version of Vergil (accessible in the Special Edition) lacks moves that the boss version can do. However, playable Vergil does get some moves his boss incarnations don't, and the series also tends to make Dante, the hero, far more {{Badass}} badass than any evil counterpart.
3rd Nov '16 6:21:34 PM Gamermaster
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** Vivio in ''[[Manga/MagicalGirlLyricalNanohaViVid ViVid]]''. In Strikers, she goes toe-to-toe with Nanoha an experienced solider wielding latest in technomagical hardware. When she gets her own series, she's struggling against juvenile civilians in martial arts tournaments. It's explained that Nanoha damaged her Linker Core when they fought but it comes across as a blatant nerf to stop Vivio from curbstomping everyone.

to:

** Vivio in ''[[Manga/MagicalGirlLyricalNanohaViVid ViVid]]''. In Strikers, she goes toe-to-toe with Nanoha Nanoha, an experienced solider wielding latest in technomagical hardware. When she gets her own series, she's struggling against juvenile civilians in martial arts tournaments. It's explained that Nanoha damaged her Linker Core when they fought but it comes across as a blatant nerf to stop Vivio from curbstomping everyone.
26th Oct '16 1:30:02 AM Sammettik
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* Averted in WesternAnimation/MyLittlePonyFriendshipIsMagic. Most, if not all the characters when they HeelFaceTurn keep the same power level and some [[Inverted get even MORE powered up]] [[RedemptionPromotion after their turn to good]]. Case in point, Discord and Starlight Glimmer. After their turn to good, they're still a RealityWarper and a powerful magician respectively. The only demotion anyone got was Babs Seed's [[ExactWords demotion]] [[DemotedToExtra to a mere background character with a very weak send off]].

to:

* Averted in WesternAnimation/MyLittlePonyFriendshipIsMagic. ''WesternAnimation/MyLittlePonyFriendshipIsMagic''. Most, if not all the characters when they HeelFaceTurn keep the same power level and some [[Inverted [[InvertedTrope get even MORE powered up]] [[RedemptionPromotion after their turn to good]]. Case in point, Discord and Starlight Glimmer. After their turn to good, they're still a RealityWarper and a powerful magician respectively. The only demotion anyone got was Babs Seed's [[ExactWords demotion]] [[DemotedToExtra to a mere background character with a very weak send off]].
16th Oct '16 12:49:50 PM AtticusOmundson
Is there an issue? Send a Message


-->-- '''Black Gryph0n''', ''[[WesternAnimation/MyLittlePonyFriendshipIsMagic Bronies React:]] [[https://youtu.be/xZ8KQEXC46I?t=2437 Season 6 Premiere]]''

to:

-->-- '''Black Gryph0n''', [=Gryph0n=]''', ''[[WesternAnimation/MyLittlePonyFriendshipIsMagic Bronies React:]] [[https://youtu.be/xZ8KQEXC46I?t=2437 Season 6 Premiere]]''
16th Oct '16 12:49:35 PM AtticusOmundson
Is there an issue? Send a Message

Added DiffLines:

->''"You were so cunning in the first episode. What, did you lose your brain when you became good? Seems to be what happens."''
-->-- '''Black Gryph0n''', ''[[WesternAnimation/MyLittlePonyFriendshipIsMagic Bronies React:]] [[https://youtu.be/xZ8KQEXC46I?t=2437 Season 6 Premiere]]''
6th Oct '16 11:48:15 AM Psyga315
Is there an issue? Send a Message

Added DiffLines:

* Averted in WesternAnimation/MyLittlePonyFriendshipIsMagic. Most, if not all the characters when they HeelFaceTurn keep the same power level and some [[Inverted get even MORE powered up]] [[RedemptionPromotion after their turn to good]]. Case in point, Discord and Starlight Glimmer. After their turn to good, they're still a RealityWarper and a powerful magician respectively. The only demotion anyone got was Babs Seed's [[ExactWords demotion]] [[DemotedToExtra to a mere background character with a very weak send off]].
5th Oct '16 1:51:57 PM Galacton
Is there an issue? Send a Message


# It lets you introduce a [[DarkerAndEdgier "darker, edgier"]] [[AntiHero hero]].

to:

# It lets you introduce add more [[GreyingMorality shades of morality]] to the story while introducing a [[DarkerAndEdgier "darker, edgier"]] [[AntiHero hero]].



# It prevents the WorthyOpponent from falling victim to WhatASenselessWasteOfHumanLife.

to:

# It prevents the WorthyOpponent or AntiVillain from falling victim to WhatASenselessWasteOfHumanLife.



Alternately, the villains may ''seem'' weaker, but it's just that the good guys have become stronger and that they along with their new allies are facing stronger opponents.

to:

Alternately, An alternative, especially in series where the villains may ''seem'' main characters are constantly getting stronger, is that the former villain only ''seems'' weaker, but it's just that because the good guys have become stronger [[SoLastSeason caught up to him in strength]] and that they he along with their his new allies are facing stronger opponents.
16th Sep '16 6:46:19 PM Elfkaiser
Is there an issue? Send a Message

Added DiffLines:

* As a boss, ISIC from ''VideoGame/{{Battleborn}}'' is more than a challenge. As a playable character, he's just on par with the rest of the Battleborn. The downgrade's justified though as the giant robot body he had as a boss was destroyed in the battle and he was given a new body.
25th Aug '16 7:36:48 AM StFan
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* While "redemption" is probably overstating the matter, Lady in the ''Literature/BlackCompany'' novels is a lot less powerful as a protagonist than she ever was as an EvilOverlord. Justified because her reign was ended by her being BroughtDownToNormal, meaning that she pretty much had to relearn all of her magical skills from scratch during the books where she was a main character. That said, once she regains a certain level of power she's ''still'' the most powerful individual protagonist, even if she's a lot less of a heavyweight than she was [[spoiler: though leeching power off Kina probably helped]].

to:

* While "redemption" is probably overstating the matter, Lady in the ''Literature/BlackCompany'' ''Literature/TheBlackCompany'' novels is a lot less powerful as a protagonist than she ever was as an EvilOverlord. Justified because her reign was ended by her being BroughtDownToNormal, meaning that she pretty much had to relearn all of her magical skills from scratch during the books where she was a main character. That said, once she regains a certain level of power she's ''still'' the most powerful individual protagonist, even if she's a lot less of a heavyweight than she was [[spoiler: though leeching power off Kina probably helped]].



[[folder:Live Action TV]]

to:

[[folder:Live Action [[folder:Live-Action TV]]
9th Aug '16 12:14:17 PM Ripburger
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* Inverted in the first two ''VideoGame/XCom'' games. Your mooks are inaccurate (even with training) and stupid... but when they get their brains sucked out and replaced with green alien goo they become much more capable, accurate and dangerous. "Durrr, I'm shooting at something I can't even see on the other side of a bookshelf, and ignoring the thing sneaking up on me." (wet slurping noises) "BoomHeadshot! BoomHeadshot! BoomHeadshot!"

to:

* Inverted in the first two ''VideoGame/XCom'' games.''[[{{VideoGame/XCOM}} X-COM]]'' games (''[[VideoGame/XCOMUFODefense UFO]]'' and ''[[VideoGame/XCOMTerrorFromTheDeep TFFD]]''). Your mooks are inaccurate (even with training) and stupid... but when they get their brains sucked out and replaced with green alien goo they become much more capable, accurate and dangerous. "Durrr, I'm shooting at something I can't even see on the other side of a bookshelf, and ignoring the thing sneaking up on me." (wet slurping noises) "BoomHeadshot! BoomHeadshot! BoomHeadshot!"
This list shows the last 10 events of 318. Show all.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Main.RedemptionDemotion