History Main / MedievalMorons

25th Nov '17 7:42:04 AM Gowan
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* Leadership and occupation in medieval societies were much more dependent on random factors, like what family they were born into. In today's industrialized countries, people are generally are able to seek qualifications and apply for jobs they are talented in and that follow their interests. Therefore, in the everyday working world, the people you run into with skilled positions are more likely to be competent and skilled. Although in some areas, as academic requirements in certain fields become more and more expensive to achieve, the ones able to attain said qualifications are likely to already belong to the upper classes.

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* Leadership and occupation in medieval societies were much more dependent on random factors, like what family they were born into. In today's industrialized countries, people are generally are able to seek qualifications and apply for jobs they are talented in and that follow their interests. Therefore, in the everyday working world, the people you run into with skilled positions are more likely to be competent and skilled. Although in some areas, as academic requirements in certain fields become more and more expensive to achieve, the ones able to attain said qualifications are likely to already belong to the upper classes. On the flip side of the coin, in a world where occupation is determined by parentage, many people were likely to be overqualified for their jobs. Peasants and nobles would have had about an equal share of stupid people and geniuses.
5th Oct '17 8:42:08 PM Hemma
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* The best expression of this trope is the flat-earth myth. No, medieval Europeans didn't think the Earth was flat. Europeans learned that the Earth was round during the time of AncientGreece and that knowledge was never lost. The idea that belief in a flat Earth was widespread during the Middle Ages appears to have been invented during the 19th century, for the purpose of giving a HistoricalHeroUpgrade to UsefulNotes/ChristopherColumbus and casting him as a proto-Enlightenment thinker who achieved glory by challenging medieval superstition. In reality, it was Columbus who made a huge error over the size of the Earth, claiming one could sail directly from Spain to India. His detractors (including clergy members) rightly said it was far larger and this couldn't be done. His fleet almost ran out of food and the sailors had gotten to the edge of mutiny when they ran into the Americas.

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* The best expression of this trope FlatWorld myth is the flat-earth myth. a DeadUnicornTrope. No, medieval Europeans (at least the scholars) didn't think the Earth was flat. Europeans learned that the Earth was round during the time of AncientGreece and that knowledge was never lost. The idea that belief in a flat Earth was widespread during the Middle Ages appears to have been invented during the 19th century, for the purpose of giving a HistoricalHeroUpgrade to UsefulNotes/ChristopherColumbus and casting him as a proto-Enlightenment thinker who achieved glory by challenging medieval superstition. In reality, it was Columbus who made a huge error over the size of the Earth, claiming one could sail directly from Spain to India. His detractors (including clergy members) rightly said it was far larger and this couldn't be done. His fleet almost ran out of food and the sailors had gotten to the edge of mutiny when they ran into the Americas.
25th Sep '17 1:51:47 AM valar55
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[[folder: Tabletop Games ]]

* TabletopGame/{{Warhammer 40000}}: The average inhabitant of the Imperium is this IN SPACE. They consider the Emperor to be a god and the government to be his priesthood, and mutation is the new "witchcraft", with mutants persecuted widespread. What's more, the existence of the [[MachineWorship Mechanicus]] ensures that, while lasguns and starships are everywhere, nobody is actually qualified to build or repair them, and most believe that praying to them is what makes them work. [[note]] This does very a lot by depiction and planet, with the above description fitting the most flanderised versions or less advanced planets. The prayers and rites circulated by the mechanicus are mostly actual, if ritualised instructions to maintain the equipment and only the more prestigious tech is monopolized by the Priesthood of Mars. In a slightly lighter depiction, your typical Civilized World resident has an education on par with a modern first world country. [[/note]]

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[[folder: Tabletop Games ]]

Games]]

* TabletopGame/{{Warhammer 40000}}: The average inhabitant of the Imperium is this IN SPACE. They consider the Emperor to be a god and the government to be his priesthood, and mutation is the new "witchcraft", with mutants persecuted mutant persecution widespread. What's more, the existence of the [[MachineWorship Mechanicus]] ensures that, while lasguns and starships are everywhere, nobody is actually qualified to build or repair them, and most believe that praying to them is what makes them work. [[note]] This does very a lot by depiction and planet, with the above description fitting the most flanderised versions or less advanced planets. The prayers and rites circulated by the mechanicus Mechanicus are mostly actual, if ritualised instructions to maintain the equipment equipment, and only the more prestigious tech is monopolized by the Priesthood of Mars. In a slightly lighter depiction, your typical Civilized World resident has an education on par with a modern first world country. [[/note]]



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[[folder: Video Games ]]
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18th Jul '17 10:17:57 PM Fireblood
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* ''{{Film/Timeline}}'': {{Discussed}} when the group is trying to escape and Chris claims their modern knowledge is enough that they can surely outthink medieval people. It's quickly {{subverted}} however, since those people are no dumber than them and (being from the era) have a lot of ''advantages'' regarding knowledge. They only barely manage to escape.
16th Jun '17 10:41:42 PM nombretomado
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* ''BillAndTedsExcellentAdventure''. No matter where they went in history, no matter which historical figure they abducted, nobody really seemed to care that they'd fallen out of the sky in a phone booth and absconded with [[Music/LudwigVanBeethoven Beethoven]]. That is of course until they ended up in medieval England, where they were [[spoiler:put on the chopping block to the sound of a man screaming that they came from the sky, and just barely escaped with their skins.]] Also subverted in the fact that neither Bill nor Ted are the sharpest knives in the drawer...

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\n* ''BillAndTedsExcellentAdventure''.''Film/BillAndTedsExcellentAdventure''. No matter where they went in history, no matter which historical figure they abducted, nobody really seemed to care that they'd fallen out of the sky in a phone booth and absconded with [[Music/LudwigVanBeethoven Beethoven]]. That is of course until they ended up in medieval England, where they were [[spoiler:put on the chopping block to the sound of a man screaming that they came from the sky, and just barely escaped with their skins.]] Also subverted in the fact that neither Bill nor Ted are the sharpest knives in the drawer...
11th Jun '17 12:00:45 PM nombretomado
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* ''BillAndTedsExcellentAdventure''. No matter where they went in history, no matter which historical figure they abducted, nobody really seemed to care that they'd fallen out of the sky in a phone booth and absconded with [[LudwigVanBeethoven Beethoven]]. That is of course until they ended up in medieval England, where they were [[spoiler:put on the chopping block to the sound of a man screaming that they came from the sky, and just barely escaped with their skins.]] Also subverted in the fact that neither Bill nor Ted are the sharpest knives in the drawer...

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* ''BillAndTedsExcellentAdventure''. No matter where they went in history, no matter which historical figure they abducted, nobody really seemed to care that they'd fallen out of the sky in a phone booth and absconded with [[LudwigVanBeethoven [[Music/LudwigVanBeethoven Beethoven]]. That is of course until they ended up in medieval England, where they were [[spoiler:put on the chopping block to the sound of a man screaming that they came from the sky, and just barely escaped with their skins.]] Also subverted in the fact that neither Bill nor Ted are the sharpest knives in the drawer...
10th May '17 2:23:36 AM althesmith
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* Leadership and occupation in medieval societies were much more dependent on random factors, like what family they were born into. In today's industrialized countries, people are generally are able to seek qualifications and apply for jobs they are talented in and that follow their interests. Therefore, in the everyday working world, the people you run into with skilled positions are more likely to be competent and skilled.

to:

* Leadership and occupation in medieval societies were much more dependent on random factors, like what family they were born into. In today's industrialized countries, people are generally are able to seek qualifications and apply for jobs they are talented in and that follow their interests. Therefore, in the everyday working world, the people you run into with skilled positions are more likely to be competent and skilled. Although in some areas, as academic requirements in certain fields become more and more expensive to achieve, the ones able to attain said qualifications are likely to already belong to the upper classes.
13th Apr '17 2:24:27 AM Chabal2
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* ''Series/{{Kaamelott}}'' is based almost entirely on this, with KingArthur as the OnlySaneMan due to his Roman upbringing. His knights are forever bickering about finding the Grail instead of looking for it, his father-in-law builds a catapult in the main courtyard and wants to knock down the gate so it can be taken outside, and then you have Guethenoc and Roparzh, two peasants with a mutual case of SitcomArchNemesis who don't mind setting fire to half the land or poisoning most of the livestock to get back at each other despite it meaning starvation for them and the rest of the country.

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* ''Series/{{Kaamelott}}'' is based almost entirely on this, with KingArthur as the OnlySaneMan due to his Roman upbringing. His knights are forever bickering about finding the Grail instead of looking for it, his father-in-law builds a catapult in the main courtyard and wants to knock down the gate so it can be taken outside, and then you have Guethenoc and Roparzh, two peasants with a mutual case of SitcomArchNemesis who don't mind setting fire to half the land or poisoning most of the livestock to get back at each other despite it meaning starvation for them and the rest of the country.
country. Lancelot's betrayal isn't even due to kidnapping the queen [[spoiler:she leaves of her own accord, to Arthur's delight]], it's because the knights are as bad as the peasants so he sets up his own army. The fact that his soldiers are just as inept as Kaamelott's never seems to occur to him.




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* ''TabletopGame/WarhammerFantasy'': Peasants in the Empire and Bretonnia are seen as this by the nobles. Some of them are indeed this (whether through inbreeding, aristocratic oppression or superstitions that lead to burning the state-approved wizard because they can't read his papers and don't want to bother finding someone who can). It doesn't help that in some areas, the smarter peasants know that getting the nobs involved in matters of justice only leads to more trouble for everyone involved, so they ObfuscateStupidity, perpetuating the stereotype among aristocracy that peasants are clumsy oafs capable of accidentally stabbing themselves in the back with a scythe seventeen times.
23rd Mar '17 9:47:52 PM Fireblood
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\n* Averted in the short story ''Death in Vesunna'' by Creator/HarryTurtledove, where two time travelers in the late Roman Empire murder someone with a gun to steal a lost book worth millions which they can then sell to future collectors. They're confident none of the locals will be able to figure out how he died before they can go back. However, the local Roman equivalent of the police chief, along with his physician friend, successfully deduce what happened and catch them.
4th Mar '17 10:52:48 AM nombretomado
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* OlderThanRadio: ''Literature/AConnecticutYankeeInKingArthursCourt''. Of course, [[SeinfeldIsUnfunny the trope was new]] when MarkTwain used it, and he was trying to portray the [[AristocratsAreEvil evils of aristocracy]]. Still, it's exaggerated and unhistorical, with most of the characters just generally acting TooDumbToLive. He was also satirizing the excessively poetic and romantic portrayals of Arthurian legend that were popular at the time--by pointing out that, had Arthur and his knights actually behaved as they were typically portrayed, they would have had to have been absolutely childlike morons.

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* OlderThanRadio: ''Literature/AConnecticutYankeeInKingArthursCourt''. Of course, [[SeinfeldIsUnfunny the trope was new]] when MarkTwain Creator/MarkTwain used it, and he was trying to portray the [[AristocratsAreEvil evils of aristocracy]]. Still, it's exaggerated and unhistorical, with most of the characters just generally acting TooDumbToLive. He was also satirizing the excessively poetic and romantic portrayals of Arthurian legend that were popular at the time--by pointing out that, had Arthur and his knights actually behaved as they were typically portrayed, they would have had to have been absolutely childlike morons.
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