History Main / DoingInTheWizard

23rd Jul '17 10:46:10 PM johnnye
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Compare and contrast with HowUnscientific. See also {{Demythtification}}, TheMagicGoesAway, and MagicVersusScience, and MaybeMagicMaybeMundane. Compare {{Jossed}}. Contrast MagicAIsMagicA and TheMagicComesBack. [[IThoughtItMeant Has nothing to do with]] [[BurnTheWitch the execution of magic users.]] Related to SufficientlyAdvancedAlien. The full {{inver|tedTrope}}sion of this trope is a trope unto itself, DoingInTheScientist.

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Compare and contrast with HowUnscientific. See also SufficientlyAdvancedAlien, {{Demythtification}}, TheMagicGoesAway, and MagicVersusScience, and MaybeMagicMaybeMundane. Compare {{Jossed}}. Contrast MagicAIsMagicA and TheMagicComesBack. [[IThoughtItMeant Has nothing to do with]] [[BurnTheWitch the execution of magic users.]] Related to SufficientlyAdvancedAlien. users,]] or [[ShootTheMageFirst targeting them in combat situations]].

The full {{inver|tedTrope}}sion of this trope is a trope unto itself, DoingInTheScientist.
11th Jul '17 1:41:22 AM Dontfollowmeman
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* Most of the main cast of ''Webcomic/AliceGrove'' has superpowers. But while two of them get their powers from nanomachines, the others go unexplained for a long time, leaving fans to wonder if there is an explanation at all. Turns out there is: [[spoiler: [[http://www.alicegrove.com/image/162825065129 They are powered by black holes and can control entropy, making them a kind of]] RealityWarper]].
--> [[BadassBoast We are Maxwell's Demons. We are powered by black holes, and the laws of physics are optional for us.]]
5th Jul '17 7:18:25 AM YourMomma
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* ''VisualNovel/NewDanganRonpaV3'': [[spoiler: Himiko Yumeno becomes a major suspect in the second case due to Ryoma's corpse being discovered during her magic show. Unfortunately for her, clearing her of suspicion also means uncovering the method she used to escape the water tank, even though she claims she used real magic and not tricks.]]
30th Jun '17 3:05:31 PM UmbrellasWereAwesome
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* Ever since the Temple of Time was introduced in ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaOcarinaOfTime'', the series has featured TimeTravel made possible by magic. In ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaSkywardSword'', the properties of the Temple of Time are revealed to stem from the Timeshift Stones, which the robots of Lanayru Desert dig up. It's not nearly as extreme as other examples on this page, as the properties of the Timeshift Stones are harnessed through {{Magitek}} rather than straight-forward tech, and time travel is still possible through purely magical means.

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* Ever since the Temple of Time was introduced in ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaOcarinaOfTime'', the ''Franchise/TheLegendOfZelda'' series has featured TimeTravel made possible by magic. In ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaSkywardSword'', the properties of the Temple of Time are revealed to stem from the Timeshift Stones, which the robots of Lanayru Desert dig up. It's not nearly as extreme as other examples on this page, as the properties of the Timeshift Stones are harnessed through {{Magitek}} rather than straight-forward tech, and time travel is still possible through purely magical means.
30th Jun '17 3:04:00 PM UmbrellasWereAwesome
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* ''VideoGame/MetalGearSolid2SonsOfLiberty'' (the ultimate king of correcting itself) does this forwards and backwards. Fortune, who has luck-based powers, causes every shot fired against her to miss (Hint: Don't stand next to her). It then explains much later that she merely has a "sufficiently advanced" bit of technology (that she didn't know about) which makes her ImmuneToBullets. This is demonstrated by the owner of the device shooting her in the chest, proving he controls the device and she is powerless. Shortly after this he tries shooting rockets at her, and she deflects them with her mind. [[note]] She is also revealed to have survived the aforementioned chest wound because of a rare birth defect that put her heart on the right side of her body, suggesting that her luck-based abilities sometimes work in more subtle ways.[[/note]] Seems in this case, the wizard was NotQuiteDead.
** There's actually a logical theory to this. Snake was the main ace in the hole for Ocelot's GambitRoulette. Snake needed to live but Ocelot needed to keep his cover up to keep the Patriots blinded. He may have somehow reactivated Fortune's abilities in order to keep the charade going.
** Unless he was outright lying [[spoiler:which in the case of a man bleeding to death and questioning the believes that defined his horrible life is rather unlikely]], Psycho Mantis was an actual telepath who developed psychic on his own and kept it hidden for years before he was discovered by soviet scientists. Also Vulcan Raven seemed to have actual magic powers. While it's very hard to tell what things are magic and which are not (as pretty much everything that happens in the games could possibly be a deception), the evidence strongly suggests that there is some kind of magic that exists, which is often enhanced by technology.
** Then there's the character of Vamp, who is to all evidence an actual supernatural vampire. In a milieu with psychics, an immortal woman and a man [[BeeBeeGun COVERED IN BEES]], this isn't so strange it couldn't be pulled off with [[RefugeInAudacity sheer chutzpah]]. In ''[=MGS4=]'' [[spoiler:we find out his healing abilities are natural... but augmented by nanomachines. His fighting and knife skills are {{Charles Atlas Superpower}}s... but the rest is technology]].
** ''Metal Gear Solid'', at least by the fourth game, is pretty consistent with respect to there being both magic (or, at least, very peculiar abilities obtained through training and practice) and technology. Most nanomachine based abilities either enhance innate abilities (Psycho Mantis and Vamp being the most blatant examples, as both have innate abilities that are cranked UpToEleven by the nanomachines) or are abilities that have been studied or cultivated and passed on through nanomachines (Screaming Mantis). And pretty much every particularly questionable point can be summed up with the mantra ``Ocelot is a Dick who is screwing with us''
* Occurs often in the ''Franchise/{{Wild ARMs}}'' games, where the villains or {{Precursors}} will {{Technobabble}} away magical events. Some of these are justified, and some are ridiculously silly.

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* ''VideoGame/MetalGear'':
**
''VideoGame/MetalGearSolid2SonsOfLiberty'' (the ultimate king of correcting itself) does this forwards and backwards. Fortune, who has luck-based powers, causes every shot fired against her to miss (Hint: Don't stand next to her). It then explains much later that she merely has a "sufficiently advanced" bit of technology (that she didn't know about) which makes her ImmuneToBullets. This is demonstrated by the owner of the device shooting her in the chest, proving he controls the device and she is powerless. Shortly after this he tries shooting rockets at her, and she deflects them with her mind. [[note]] She is also revealed to have survived the aforementioned chest wound because of a rare birth defect that put her heart on the right side of her body, suggesting that her luck-based abilities sometimes work in more subtle ways.[[/note]] Seems in this case, the wizard was NotQuiteDead.
**
NotQuiteDead. There's actually a logical theory to this. Snake was the main ace in the hole for Ocelot's GambitRoulette. Snake needed to live but Ocelot needed to keep his cover up to keep the Patriots blinded. He may have somehow reactivated Fortune's abilities in order to keep the charade going.
** Unless he was outright lying [[spoiler:which in the case of a man bleeding to death and questioning the believes beliefs that defined his horrible life is rather unlikely]], Psycho Mantis was an actual telepath who developed psychic on his own and kept it hidden for years before he was discovered by soviet scientists. Also Vulcan Raven seemed to have actual magic powers. While it's very hard to tell what things are magic and which are not (as pretty much everything that happens in the games could possibly be a deception), the evidence strongly suggests that there is some kind of magic that exists, which is often enhanced by technology.
** Then there's the character of Vamp, who is to all evidence an actual supernatural vampire. In a milieu with psychics, an immortal woman and a man [[BeeBeeGun COVERED IN BEES]], this isn't so strange it couldn't be pulled off with [[RefugeInAudacity sheer chutzpah]]. In ''[=MGS4=]'' ''VideoGame/MetalGearSolid4GunsOfThePatriots'' [[spoiler:we find out his healing abilities are natural... but augmented by nanomachines. His fighting and knife skills are {{Charles Atlas Superpower}}s... but the rest is technology]].
** ''Metal Gear Solid'', at least by In general, the fourth game, series is pretty consistent with respect to there being both magic (or, at least, very peculiar abilities obtained through training and practice) and technology. Most nanomachine based nanomachine-based abilities either enhance innate abilities (Psycho Mantis and Vamp being the most blatant examples, as both have innate abilities that are cranked UpToEleven by the nanomachines) or are abilities that have been studied or cultivated and passed on through nanomachines (Screaming Mantis). And pretty much every particularly questionable point can be summed up with the mantra ``Ocelot "Ocelot is a Dick dick who is screwing with us''
us".
* Occurs often in the ''Franchise/{{Wild ARMs}}'' ''Franchise/WildArms'' games, where the villains or {{Precursors}} will {{Technobabble}} away magical events. Some of these are justified, and some are ridiculously silly.
26th Jun '17 11:59:41 AM Generality
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** The "Hammerchlorians" arc does this on a somewhat meta level, explaining that the ability of some characters to summon {{Hyperspace Mallet}}s is the result of a specific enchantment, rather than a generic comedy convention inherent to the comic's universe. The strip hangs lampshades by comparing this revelation to the "midi-chlorians" explanation in ''Franchise/StarWars''. Ultimately, this is more like bringing in the wizard to replace a more esoteric explanation.
14th Jun '17 10:11:29 PM merotoker
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Compare and contrast with HowUnscientific. See also {{Demythtification}}, TheMagicGoesAway, and MagicVersusScience, and MaybeMagicMaybeMundane. Compare {{Jossed}}. Contrast MagicAIsMagicA and TheMagicComesBack. [[IThoughtItMeant Has nothing to do with]] [[BurnTheWitch the execution of magic users.]] Related to SufficientlyAdvancedAlien. The full {{Inversion}} of this trope is a trope unto itself, DoingInTheScientist.

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Compare and contrast with HowUnscientific. See also {{Demythtification}}, TheMagicGoesAway, and MagicVersusScience, and MaybeMagicMaybeMundane. Compare {{Jossed}}. Contrast MagicAIsMagicA and TheMagicComesBack. [[IThoughtItMeant Has nothing to do with]] [[BurnTheWitch the execution of magic users.]] Related to SufficientlyAdvancedAlien. The full {{Inversion}} {{inver|tedTrope}}sion of this trope is a trope unto itself, DoingInTheScientist.



* The early 1960s ''Comicbook/BlueBeetle'', Dan Garrett, gained superpowers from a magical beetle-shaped amulet from Ancient Egypt. The third Blue Beetle, Jaime Reyes, also gets his power from the Scarab, but about seven issues in, it's revealed to actually be a long-lost bit of ImportedAlienPhlebotinum. {{Justified}} in that the alien race behind it, the Reach, have disguised many of their plans and weapons as "magic" so that no one would ask questions. And of course, since this is the DC Universe, nobody denies that magic exists; in fact, Garret used magic to activate his. This was inverted in ''Comicbook/DCRebirth'', which seems to have decided [[DoingInTheScientist it really IS magic, after all]].

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* The early 1960s ''Comicbook/BlueBeetle'', Dan Garrett, gained superpowers from a magical beetle-shaped amulet from Ancient Egypt. The third Blue Beetle, Jaime Reyes, also gets his power from the Scarab, but about seven issues in, it's revealed to actually be a long-lost bit of ImportedAlienPhlebotinum. {{Justified}} {{Justified|Trope}} in that the alien race behind it, the Reach, have disguised many of their plans and weapons as "magic" so that no one would ask questions. And of course, since this is the DC Universe, nobody denies that magic exists; in fact, Garret used magic to activate his. This was inverted in ''Comicbook/DCRebirth'', which seems to have decided [[DoingInTheScientist it really IS magic, after all]].



* Not a single one of [[Film/TheFantasticFour the]] [[Film/FantasticFour2005 three]] [[Film/FantasticFour2015 attempts]] at making a ''Comicbook/FantasticFour'' film franchise have actually included DoctorDoom's sorcery abilities, instead always opting to make his powers a side effect of the scientific accident that disfigured his face.

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* Not a single one of [[Film/TheFantasticFour the]] [[Film/FantasticFour2005 three]] [[Film/FantasticFour2015 attempts]] at making a ''Comicbook/FantasticFour'' film franchise have actually included DoctorDoom's ComicBook/DoctorDoom's sorcery abilities, instead always opting to make his powers a side effect of the scientific accident that disfigured his face.



* Some of Creator/DeanKoontz's works prefer to settle for a paranormal solution over a supernatural one, and ''The Servants of Twilight'' is a particularly heavy-handed example. The main character's son is pursued by the followers of a religious fanatic throughout, who's had visions that paint the child as the Antichrist. In the final confrontation, [[spoiler: the fanatic is attacked and killed by a horde of bats]], and this, along with other strange occurrences, lead the mother to think her kid might really ''be'' the Antichrist. [[spoiler: And that's when the fanatic's top mook -- who has been mostly silent throughout and shown no signs of higher thinking -- goes into a two-page explanation about how the two characters were most likely psychic and picking up on one another, before walking out of the book entirely]].

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* Some of Creator/DeanKoontz's works prefer to settle for a paranormal solution over a supernatural one, and ''The Servants of Twilight'' is a particularly heavy-handed example. The main character's son is pursued by the followers of a religious fanatic throughout, who's had visions that paint the child as the Antichrist. In the final confrontation, [[spoiler: the fanatic is attacked and killed by a horde of bats]], and this, along with other strange occurrences, lead the mother to think her kid might really ''be'' the Antichrist. [[spoiler: And that's when the fanatic's top mook -- who has been mostly silent throughout and shown no signs of higher thinking -- goes into a two-page explanation about how the two characters were most likely psychic and picking up on one another, before walking out of the book entirely]].entirely.]]



** Subverted in [[Recap/DoctorWhoS29E2TheShakespeareCode "The Shakespeare Code"]], where the Doctor explains a man's sudden death to the witnesses in the terms of then-popular humoral theory, later clarifying that if he tried to tell them the truth, it would make them think it was witchcraft. When asked by Martha what was the cause in fact, the Doctor replies, "Witchcraft." Though then explained as an alternate form of science which uses the power of spoken language rather than mathematics to operate. Therefore, the pseudo-Shakespearean speech of the witches is in fact their version of technology. The plot revolves around Shakespheare himself being able to do it by accident.

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** Subverted in [[Recap/DoctorWhoS29E2TheShakespeareCode "The Shakespeare Code"]], where the Doctor explains a man's sudden death to the witnesses in the terms of then-popular humoral theory, later clarifying that if he tried to tell them the truth, it would make them think it was witchcraft. When asked by Martha what was the cause in fact, the Doctor replies, "Witchcraft." Though then explained as an alternate form of science which uses the power of spoken language rather than mathematics to operate. Therefore, the pseudo-Shakespearean speech of the witches is in fact their version of technology. The plot revolves around Shakespheare Shakespeare himself being able to do it by accident.






** As stated on DoingInTheScientist, in Mage, the Wizard and the Scientist are metaphorically the same person, whom we could call Humanity. Humanity uses the lab coat, the abacus, and the computer some days, the cloak, the chicken entrails, and prayer the next, all in a pointless argument with itself. The most common resolution to the game's MetaPlot is that the Wizard and Scientist got it together and Humanity AscendedToAHigherPlaneOfExistence.

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** As stated on DoingInTheScientist, in Mage, the Wizard and the Scientist are metaphorically the same person, whom we could call Humanity. Humanity uses the lab coat, the abacus, and the computer some days, the cloak, the chicken entrails, and prayer the next, all in a pointless argument with itself. The most common resolution to the game's MetaPlot is that the Wizard and Scientist got it together and Humanity AscendedToAHigherPlaneOfExistence.[[AscendToAHigherPlaneOfExistence ascended to a higher plane of existence.]]



** The Tau have little to no Warp presence, meaining they have no psychics and therefore no way of being influenced by the Warp. Unfortunately, they've taken this to mean that the Warp ''doesn't exist'', and that everything humans have to say on the subject are the fevered delusions of madmen (that the forces of Chaos who are much more at home in the Warp ''are'' universally madmen doesn't help). They once vanquished a Chaos army containing a Greater Daemon of Slaanesh and prided themselves on the propaganda value of having killed one of the Dark Gods. [[SarcasmMode Much the way destroying the treads on an Abrams tank means the U.S.' total military capacity has dropped to zero.]]
** One of the appeals of the setting is that a lot of things MayBeMagicMayBeMundane. The giant AwesomePersonnelCarrier with several batteries of laser cannons and twin [[GatlingGood gatling guns as support]], which transports 12 {{Super Soldiers}}s in ancient PowerArmor may be able to work even after its crew is dead due to a magical "machine spirit"... or the machine spirit may just be a highly advanced AI from another, more enlightened age and simply poorly understood due to the regression of society and technology over 10,000 years of galaxy-wide war. The faction that is explicitedly stated to use AI (and no magic) are the aforementioned Tau, and the Necrons who are stated to have mastered all physical science the normal universe has to offer. For everyone else, it might be this trope, it might be pure magic, MagiTek or something else entirely.

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** The Tau have little to no Warp presence, meaining meaning they have no psychics and therefore no way of being influenced by the Warp. Unfortunately, they've taken this to mean that the Warp ''doesn't exist'', and that everything humans have to say on the subject are the fevered delusions of madmen (that the forces of Chaos who are much more at home in the Warp ''are'' universally madmen doesn't help). They once vanquished a Chaos army containing a Greater Daemon of Slaanesh and prided themselves on the propaganda value of having killed one of the Dark Gods. [[SarcasmMode Much the way destroying the treads on an Abrams tank means the U.S.' total military capacity has dropped to zero.]]
** One of the appeals of the setting is that a lot of things MayBeMagicMayBeMundane.MaybeMagicMaybeMundane. The giant AwesomePersonnelCarrier with several batteries of laser cannons and twin [[GatlingGood gatling guns as support]], which transports 12 {{Super Soldiers}}s in ancient PowerArmor may be able to work even after its crew is dead due to a magical "machine spirit"... or the machine spirit may just be a highly advanced AI from another, more enlightened age and simply poorly understood due to the regression of society and technology over 10,000 years of galaxy-wide war. The faction that is explicitedly stated to use AI (and no magic) are the aforementioned Tau, and the Necrons who are stated to have mastered all physical science the normal universe has to offer. For everyone else, it might be this trope, it might be pure magic, MagiTek or something else entirely.



** As revealed in ''VideoGame/DreamfallTheLongestJourney'', after the new Guardian restored the Balance and corrected the flows of magic and science, anything in Stark that was based on magic ([[ArtificialGravity Anti-Gravity]], FasterThanLightTravel, etc.) stopped working, as the laws of physics took over. This also explained why there were so many anti-gravity crashes mentioned in ''The Longest Journey'', as magic is inherently chaotic. On the other hand, in Arcadia, anything more advanced than MiddleAges can only work via {{Magitek}}, which includes steam engines and airships of the [[AntimagicalFaction Azadi]] [[TheEmpire Empire]].

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** As revealed in ''VideoGame/DreamfallTheLongestJourney'', after the new Guardian restored the Balance and corrected the flows of magic and science, anything in Stark that was based on magic ([[ArtificialGravity Anti-Gravity]], FasterThanLightTravel, etc.) stopped working, as the laws of physics took over. This also explained why there were so many anti-gravity crashes mentioned in ''The Longest Journey'', as magic is inherently chaotic. On the other hand, in Arcadia, anything more advanced than MiddleAges TheMiddleAges can only work via {{Magitek}}, which includes steam engines and airships of the [[AntimagicalFaction Azadi]] [[TheEmpire Empire]].
31st May '17 10:54:14 AM TheDocCC
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** As stated on DoingInTheScientist, in Mage, the Wizard and the Scientist are metaphorically the same person, whom we could call Humanity. Humanity uses the lab coat, the abacus, and the computer some days, the cloak, the chicken entrails, and prayer the next, all in a pointless argument with itself. The most common resolution to the game's MetaPlot is that the Wizard and Scientist got it together and Humanity AscendedToAHigherPlane.

to:

** As stated on DoingInTheScientist, in Mage, the Wizard and the Scientist are metaphorically the same person, whom we could call Humanity. Humanity uses the lab coat, the abacus, and the computer some days, the cloak, the chicken entrails, and prayer the next, all in a pointless argument with itself. The most common resolution to the game's MetaPlot is that the Wizard and Scientist got it together and Humanity AscendedToAHigherPlane.AscendedToAHigherPlaneOfExistence.
31st May '17 10:53:34 AM TheDocCC
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** As stated on DoingInTheScientist, in Mage, the Wizard and the Scientist are metaphorically the same person, whom we could call Humanity. Humanity uses the lab coat, the abacus, and the computer some days, the cloak, the chicken entrails, and prayer the next, all in a pointless argument with itself. The most common resolution to the game's MetaPlot is that the Wizard and Scientist got it together and Humanity AscendedToAHigherPlane.
29th May '17 12:20:25 PM rafi
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* Officially, Mephisto is not literally the devil in Marvel's comics; he just gets off on convincing people that he is. Magic is a very real, very prominent force in Marvel stories...sometimes. Depending on the writer and the tone of the series, seemingly magical elements may be written off as fantastic technology and demons may in fact be interdimensional aliens...or not. It's all quite confusing, really, but the go-to solution seems to be simply not to worry about it too much. Mephisto is one of several evil extradimensional beings who claim or have claimed to be ''the'' Devil, Satan Merkratang. They all rule their own Hell dimensions, and all claim to be the real deal. Canonicly, they're all liars and know it. The '''real''' Satan hasn't been seen in so long, even in Hell, that many (even among the rulers) don't believe he actually exists. It doesn't mean they're going to take the chance and sit on his empty throne.

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* Officially, Mephisto ComicBook/{{Mephisto}} is not literally the devil in Marvel's comics; he just gets off on convincing people that he is. Magic is a very real, very prominent force in Marvel stories...sometimes. Depending on the writer and the tone of the series, seemingly magical elements may be written off as fantastic technology and demons may in fact be interdimensional aliens...or not. It's all quite confusing, really, but the go-to solution seems to be simply not to worry about it too much. Mephisto is one of several evil extradimensional beings who claim or have claimed to be ''the'' Devil, Satan Merkratang. They all rule their own Hell dimensions, and all claim to be the real deal. Canonicly, they're all liars and know it. The '''real''' Satan hasn't been seen in so long, even in Hell, that many (even among the rulers) don't believe he actually exists. It doesn't mean they're going to take the chance and sit on his empty throne.
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