History Main / ArmchairMilitary

17th Sep '16 10:38:12 AM LtFedora
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* General Colin Powell had a run-in with then-Secretary of State Madeline Albright during the planning for the first Gulf War after Iraq's invasion of Kuwait. Powell kept stressing the need for a specific endgame and exit strategy ''before'' any military force was applied, having learned this bitter lesson during his combat service in Vietnam. Albright angrily asked him why bother having such a powerful military if it wasn't going to be used. Powell later stated that he had to take a moment to rein in his emotions. Albright simply did not understand that the United States military could have curb-stomped Iraq's armed forces in just a few days, but the resultant power vacumn and loss of infrastructure and leadership in Iraq would have meant the current underending occupation in Iraq and American military presence in the Middle East would have occurred fifteen years earlier.
** Really? Madeline Albright? That would be a neat trick considering that she didn't become Secretary of State until 1997, over six years after the end of the Gulf War. In 1991 she was a professor at Georgetown University.

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* General Colin Powell had a run-in with then-Secretary of State Madeline Albright during the planning for the first Gulf War after Iraq's invasion of Kuwait.intervention in Bosnia and Herzegovina. Powell kept stressing the need for a specific endgame and exit strategy ''before'' any military force was applied, having learned this bitter lesson during his combat service in Vietnam. Albright angrily asked him why bother having such a powerful military if it wasn't going to be used. Powell later stated that he had to take a moment to rein in his emotions. Albright simply did not understand that the United States military could have curb-stomped Iraq's armed forces in just a few days, but the resultant power vacumn and loss of infrastructure and leadership in Iraq would have meant the current underending occupation in Iraq and American military presence in the Middle East would have occurred fifteen years earlier.
** Really? Madeline Albright? That would be a neat trick considering that she didn't become Secretary of State until 1997, over six years after the end of the Gulf War. In 1991 she was a professor at Georgetown University.
13th Sep '16 11:54:30 AM ShorinBJ
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* Anyone perceived as armchair military by ''Series/{{Mash}}'' character Hawkeye was in for an interesting time.

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* Anyone perceived as armchair military by ''Series/{{Mash}}'' ''Series/{{MASH}}'' character Hawkeye was in for an interesting time.
11th Sep '16 8:57:32 PM KeithM
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** The Solarians are revealed to have a massive case of this when they are finally forced to go into battle against professional opponents instead of random pirates or beating up on isolated, underdeveloped and helpless planets. [[spoiler: Attacking the ''allied'' Manticoran and Havenite forces, who by the end of their war have cleaned out almost all their bad commanders by the simple expedient of getting themselves killed or captured]], and who have spent 20-odd years in a LensmanArmsRace that the Solarians have been blissfully oblivious to suddenly makes it terrifyingly clear to them that the proper designation for their huge fleet is "targets".
11th Sep '16 8:44:55 PM PaulA
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* Played with in ''Literature/EndersGame'' by OrsonScottCard. Ender realizes he was [[spoiler: sending real pilots into battle while he himself stayed safe, thinking it was all a simulation.]] It's both a plot point and the basis of the sequel that, had he known, he couldn't have done it. ''Literature/SpeakerForTheDead'' is spent trying to make up for what he has done.

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* Played with in ''Literature/EndersGame'' by OrsonScottCard. Creator/OrsonScottCard. Ender realizes he was [[spoiler: sending [[spoiler:sending real pilots into battle while he himself stayed safe, thinking it was all a simulation.]] simulation]]. It's both a plot point and the basis of the sequel that, had he known, he couldn't have done it. ''Literature/SpeakerForTheDead'' is spent trying to make up for what he has done.
6th Sep '16 8:23:26 AM jeez
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** While there is an element of truth in some cases, especially General Phull (who could not even be bothered to learn Russian despite living there for five years before the 1812 invasion), the somewhat xenophobic Leo Tolstoy does tend to tar all "Germans" (some of whom were actually from the Baltic provinces of Russia) with the same brush, even maligning some of those who made the sensible suggestion that the Russian army should retreat in front of Napoleon's until the latter was reduced through lack of supplies, sicknesses etc. Many of the germanophobe Russian officers on the other hand advocated trying to stop Napoleon's army in pitched battles, even in the early phases of the campaign when it heavily outnumbered and was better led than the Russian one.

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** While there is an element of truth in some cases, especially General Phull (who could not even couldn't be bothered to learn Russian despite living there for five years before the 1812 invasion), invasion, as the language at the court was French anyway), the somewhat xenophobic Leo Tolstoy does tend to tar all "Germans" (some of whom were actually from the Baltic provinces of Russia) with the same brush, even maligning some of those who made the sensible suggestion that the Russian army should retreat in front of Napoleon's until the latter was reduced through lack of supplies, sicknesses etc. Many of the germanophobe Russian officers on the other hand advocated trying to stop Napoleon's army in pitched battles, even in the early phases of the campaign when it heavily outnumbered and was better led than the Russian one.
20th Aug '16 9:50:53 PM Kalmbach
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** Really? Madeline Albright? That would be a neat trick considering that she didn't become Secretary of State until 1997, over six years after the end of the Gulf War.

to:

** Really? Madeline Albright? That would be a neat trick considering that she didn't become Secretary of State until 1997, over six years after the end of the Gulf War. In 1991 she was a professor at Georgetown University.



* President UsefulNotes/DwightDEisenhower never actually served in combat. He did face criticism for that from military leaders at the time (including George S. Patton), but he's still one of the most decorated military leaders in modern history and served in the military for over forty years, both before and after his presidency.

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* President UsefulNotes/DwightDEisenhower never actually served in combat. He did face criticism for that from military leaders at the time (including George S. Patton), but he's still one of the most decorated military leaders in modern history and served in the military for over forty years, both before and after his presidency. This is justified, though, in that his position as Supreme Allied Commander required more skill in politics (getting headstrong commanders from numerous countries to work together) than leading troops.
20th Aug '16 9:41:23 PM Kalmbach
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* Prior to the US-led [[{{War On Terror}} invasion of Iraq]], the clash of ideals between General Eric Shinseki and Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld was like this. Shinseki's ideas were based on established military doctrine on how to control a country such as Iraq while Rumsfeld's thoughts were [[AssPull pulled out of his ass]]. Rumsfeld simply didn't understand that defeating Iraq's military was the easy part, controlling Iraq's people enough so Iraq could be rebuilt was the difficult part. Rumsfeld also either fully believed in (or actually helped create, depending on your viewpoint) the Bush Administration's view that a war against Iraq would be quick and easy, much to the ignorance of military men who remembered [[VietnamWar the last time]] the United States invaded a country and had to deal with hostile locals.

to:

* Prior to the US-led [[{{War On Terror}} invasion of Iraq]], the clash of ideals between General Eric Shinseki and Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld was like this. Shinseki's ideas were based on established military doctrine on how to control a country such as Iraq while Rumsfeld's thoughts were [[AssPull pulled out of his ass]]. Rumsfeld simply didn't understand that defeating Iraq's military was the easy part, controlling Iraq's people enough so Iraq could be rebuilt was the difficult part. Rumsfeld also either fully believed in (or actually helped create, depending on your viewpoint) the Bush Administration's view that a war against Iraq would be quick and easy, much to the ignorance annoyance of military men who remembered [[VietnamWar the last time]] the United States invaded a country and had to deal with hostile locals.
20th Aug '16 9:33:09 PM Kalmbach
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* Prior to the US-led [[{{War On Terror}} invasion of Iraq]], the clash of ideals between General Eric Shinseki and Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld was like this. Shinseki's ideas were based on established military doctrine on how to control a country such as Iraq while Rumsfeld's thoughts were [[AssPull pulled out of his ass]]. Rumsfeld simply didn't understand that defeating Iraq's military was the easy part, controlling Iraq's people enough so Iraq could be rebuilt was the difficult part.
* General Colin Powell had a run-in with then-Secretary of State Madeline Albright during the planning for the first Gulf War after Iraq's invasion of Kuwait. Powell kept stressing the need for a specific endgame and exit strategy ''before'' any military force was applied, having learned this bitter lesson during his combat service in Vietnam. Albright angrily asked him why bother having such a powerful military if it wasn't going to be used. Powell later stated that he had to take a moment to rein in his emotions. Albright simply did not understand that the United States military could have curb-stomped Iraq's armed forces in just a few days, but the resultant power vacumn and loss of infrastructure and leadership in Iraq would have meant the current underending occupation in Iraq and American military presence in the Middle East would have occurred fifteen years earlier. Really? Madeline Albright? That would be a neat trick considering that she didn't become Secretary of State until 1997, over six years after the end of the Gulf War.

to:

* Prior to the US-led [[{{War On Terror}} invasion of Iraq]], the clash of ideals between General Eric Shinseki and Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld was like this. Shinseki's ideas were based on established military doctrine on how to control a country such as Iraq while Rumsfeld's thoughts were [[AssPull pulled out of his ass]]. Rumsfeld simply didn't understand that defeating Iraq's military was the easy part, controlling Iraq's people enough so Iraq could be rebuilt was the difficult part.
part. Rumsfeld also either fully believed in (or actually helped create, depending on your viewpoint) the Bush Administration's view that a war against Iraq would be quick and easy, much to the ignorance of military men who remembered [[VietnamWar the last time]] the United States invaded a country and had to deal with hostile locals.
* General Colin Powell had a run-in with then-Secretary of State Madeline Albright during the planning for the first Gulf War after Iraq's invasion of Kuwait. Powell kept stressing the need for a specific endgame and exit strategy ''before'' any military force was applied, having learned this bitter lesson during his combat service in Vietnam. Albright angrily asked him why bother having such a powerful military if it wasn't going to be used. Powell later stated that he had to take a moment to rein in his emotions. Albright simply did not understand that the United States military could have curb-stomped Iraq's armed forces in just a few days, but the resultant power vacumn and loss of infrastructure and leadership in Iraq would have meant the current underending occupation in Iraq and American military presence in the Middle East would have occurred fifteen years earlier. Really? earlier.
**Really?
Madeline Albright? That would be a neat trick considering that she didn't become Secretary of State until 1997, over six years after the end of the Gulf War.
20th Aug '16 6:20:35 PM celtictwilight
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* General Colin Powell had a run-in with then-Secretary of State Madeline Albright during the planning for the first Gulf War after Iraq's invasion of Kuwait. Powell kept stressing the need for a specific endgame and exit strategy ''before'' any military force was applied, having learned this bitter lesson during his combat service in Vietnam. Albright angrily asked him why bother having such a powerful military if it wasn't going to be used. Powell later stated that he had to take a moment to rein in his emotions. Albright simply did not understand that the United States military could have curb-stomped Iraq's armed forces in just a few days, but the resultant power vacumn and loss of infrastructure and leadership in Iraq would have meant the current underending occupation in Iraq and American military presence in the Middle East would have occurred fifteen years earlier.

to:

* General Colin Powell had a run-in with then-Secretary of State Madeline Albright during the planning for the first Gulf War after Iraq's invasion of Kuwait. Powell kept stressing the need for a specific endgame and exit strategy ''before'' any military force was applied, having learned this bitter lesson during his combat service in Vietnam. Albright angrily asked him why bother having such a powerful military if it wasn't going to be used. Powell later stated that he had to take a moment to rein in his emotions. Albright simply did not understand that the United States military could have curb-stomped Iraq's armed forces in just a few days, but the resultant power vacumn and loss of infrastructure and leadership in Iraq would have meant the current underending occupation in Iraq and American military presence in the Middle East would have occurred fifteen years earlier. Really? Madeline Albright? That would be a neat trick considering that she didn't become Secretary of State until 1997, over six years after the end of the Gulf War.
14th Aug '16 12:59:28 PM Kereea1
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* The Watcher's Council on ''Series/BuffyTheVampireSlayer'' is this at its worst. Many see themselves as the real heroes fighting the real fight and Slayers as just the tools they use. The fact that a new Slayer will be called whenever one dies does not help, as it enforces the mentality of WeHaveReserves to the point where they treat the girls as wholly expendable.
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