History Headscratchers / TheThickOfIt

31st Jan '16 12:48:18 PM TommyR01D
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* Who is the new Sir Humphrey? We see directors of communications and plenty of special advisor but the Permanent Under-secretary of State for Social Affairs and Citizenship never appears (nor, for that matter, do there ever seem to by any junior ministers at DoSAC prior to the coalition).

to:

* Who is the new Sir Humphrey? We see directors of communications and plenty of special advisor advisors but the Permanent Under-secretary of State for Social Affairs and Citizenship never appears (nor, for that matter, do there ever seem to by any junior ministers at DoSAC prior to the coalition).



** There's also apathy to consider. Humphrey might not have have many convictions, but the few he did have mainly centred around the idea that the Civil Service as represented by him -- i.e. an elite of well-bred and privileged upper-to-middle class Oxbridge types with classical education, knowledge of Latin and plenty of gongs -- were the best people to govern Britain. He was, for all his cynicism, strangely idealistic in a way, since he genuinely seemed to believe -- or at least had deluded himself -- that his actions, no matter how self-serving, weren't just right, but were necessary for Britain. Hence, he was more dedicated and devoted, and thus was a bigger part of the story. Terri, however, lacks these convictions / delusions. She's got the self-interest bit, but she is under no pretensions that she's in it for Britain -- she's in it because she wants a decent civil service position with excellent security and benefits which she can basically kill time in until retirement, at which point she gets a decent pension. While the Civil Service might have had more Humphreys back in the day, in the 21st century environment of corporate-management-bullshit-style government I'm willing to bet that most civil servants are generally more like Terri, who are just happy to keep their heads down, muddle through, not cause any huge cock-ups or scandals and basically just ride the gravy train as long as they can. Hence, they're more in the background.

to:

** There's also apathy to consider. Humphrey might not have have many convictions, but the few he did have mainly centred around the idea that the Civil Service as represented by him -- i.e. an elite of well-bred and privileged upper-to-middle class Oxbridge types with classical education, knowledge of Latin and plenty of gongs -- were the best people to govern Britain. He was, for all his cynicism, strangely idealistic in a way, since he genuinely seemed to believe -- or at least had deluded himself -- that his actions, no matter how self-serving, weren't just right, but were necessary for Britain. Hence, he was more dedicated and devoted, and thus was a bigger part of the story. Terri, however, lacks these convictions / delusions. She's got the self-interest bit, but she is under no pretensions that she's in it for Britain -- she's in it because she wants a decent civil service position with excellent security and benefits which she can basically kill time in until retirement, at which point she gets a decent pension. While the Civil Service might have had more Humphreys back in the day, in the 21st century environment of corporate-management-bullshit-style government I'm willing to bet that most civil servants are generally more like Terri, who are just happy to keep their heads down, muddle through, not cause any huge cock-ups or scandals and basically just ride the gravy train as long as they can. Hence, they're more in the background.background.
**
***I understand, but my real concern was that there didn't even seem to ''be'' a Permanent Secretary. It's not that the character is in the background, or even that the job has been left vacant for a long time (as I know to happen in some government departments), it's that the position doesn't seem to exist at all!
25th Oct '15 7:19:41 AM DoctorNemesis
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** The "thesis" of ''Yes, Minister'' was that unelected career civil servants (like Sir Humphrey) were too powerful because they held an information advantage over elected legislators/cabinet ministers (like Jim Hacker), and that was why the latter could never get anything done. The "thesis" of ''The Thick of It'' is different: It's that, in the new media environment, both permanent civil servants (like Terri) and elected legislators/cabinet ministers (like Cliff Lawton, Hugh, and Nicola) are at the mercy of spin doctors and image-makers (like Malcolm, Jamie, initially Stewart, and "the Fucker"). Terri is the closest equivalent to Sir Humphrey in this new scenario, and like him, she has job security, isn't accountable to the electorate for getting things done, and can be a "blockage" (or at least the ministers and advisors find it easy to scapegoat her for this). But in terms of power to set things in motion (or stop them), she's obviously got much less than Malcolm.

to:

** The "thesis" of ''Yes, Minister'' was that unelected career civil servants (like Sir Humphrey) were too powerful because they held an information advantage over elected legislators/cabinet ministers (like Jim Hacker), and that was why the latter could never get anything done. The "thesis" of ''The Thick of It'' is different: It's that, in the new media environment, both permanent civil servants (like Terri) and elected legislators/cabinet ministers (like Cliff Lawton, Hugh, and Nicola) are at the mercy of spin doctors and image-makers (like Malcolm, Jamie, initially Stewart, and "the Fucker"). Terri is the closest equivalent to Sir Humphrey in this new scenario, and like him, she has job security, isn't accountable to the electorate for getting things done, and can be a "blockage" (or at least the ministers and advisors find it easy to scapegoat her for this). But in terms of power to set things in motion (or stop them), she's obviously got much less than Malcolm.Malcolm.
** There's also apathy to consider. Humphrey might not have have many convictions, but the few he did have mainly centred around the idea that the Civil Service as represented by him -- i.e. an elite of well-bred and privileged upper-to-middle class Oxbridge types with classical education, knowledge of Latin and plenty of gongs -- were the best people to govern Britain. He was, for all his cynicism, strangely idealistic in a way, since he genuinely seemed to believe -- or at least had deluded himself -- that his actions, no matter how self-serving, weren't just right, but were necessary for Britain. Hence, he was more dedicated and devoted, and thus was a bigger part of the story. Terri, however, lacks these convictions / delusions. She's got the self-interest bit, but she is under no pretensions that she's in it for Britain -- she's in it because she wants a decent civil service position with excellent security and benefits which she can basically kill time in until retirement, at which point she gets a decent pension. While the Civil Service might have had more Humphreys back in the day, in the 21st century environment of corporate-management-bullshit-style government I'm willing to bet that most civil servants are generally more like Terri, who are just happy to keep their heads down, muddle through, not cause any huge cock-ups or scandals and basically just ride the gravy train as long as they can. Hence, they're more in the background.
25th Aug '15 8:23:49 AM molesborough
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** Was this really out of character? OK, Glenn is the most moral character on the show in the sense that he actually HAS some principles (which many TTOI characters, e.g. Ollie and Adam, plainly lacked). But he wasn't above lying or insincerity, and his principles always took a back seat to the priority of keeping his job, at least until [[spoiler: he resigns in the last episode and delivers his [[http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheReasonYouSuckSpeech "The Reason You Suck" Speech]] to his colleagues]]. His switch to a new party in Season 4 is seemingly motivated by job security concerns. At the time of the e-mail scandal, keeping his own job meant helping Hugh keep his, even if it meant shifting blame for something Hugh said to someone like Terri, whose reputation he didn't have a stake in. He didn't even stay mad at Hugh for cynically using his own son as an example to get out of a tight spot at an inquiry; in the Specials, he's right back in Hugh's corner, trying to secure a place for him in the new cabinet. If he's willing to make moral compromises like this in matters affecting his own family, why should we expect him to go out of his way (or defy Hugh) for Terri? In later seasons, we see him shamelessly sucking up to Nicola, Fergus, and the Goolding inquisitors, [[spoiler: and even lying under oath.]] He may have enough scruples to feel remorse about these compromises of integrity, but still goes through with them.

to:

** Was this really out of character? OK, Glenn is the most moral character on the show in the sense that he actually HAS some principles (which many TTOI characters, e.g. Ollie and Adam, plainly lacked). But he wasn't above lying or insincerity, and his principles always took a back seat to the priority of keeping his job, at least until [[spoiler: he resigns in the last episode and delivers his [[http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheReasonYouSuckSpeech "The Reason You Suck" Speech]] to his colleagues]]. His switch to a new party in Season 4 is seemingly motivated by job security concerns. At the time of the e-mail scandal, keeping his own job meant helping Hugh keep his, even if it meant shifting blame for something Hugh said to someone like Terri, whose reputation he didn't have a stake in. He didn't even stay mad at Hugh for cynically using his own son as an example to get out of a tight spot at an inquiry; during the Select Committee's questioning; in the Specials, he's right back in Hugh's corner, trying to secure a place for him in the new cabinet. If he's willing to make moral compromises like this in matters affecting his own family, why should we expect him to go out of his way (or defy Hugh) for Terri? In later seasons, we see him shamelessly sucking up to Nicola, Fergus, and the Goolding inquisitors, [[spoiler: and even lying under oath.]] He may have enough scruples to feel remorse about these compromises of integrity, but still goes through with them.
15th Aug '15 2:07:02 AM molesborough
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** That's not ''quite'' correct: Nicola never specifically said the ''inquiry'' would fuck Malcolm over, just that he and Dan would find out what it was like to have her "pissing into your tent." Even at the time, when she still might have thought she had a chance to regain power, it was a vague, empty threat. And even though Malcolm eventually did end up [[spoiler: getting fucked by the inquiry]], that was none of Nicola's doing. [[spoiler: By the end, they'd both basically been beaten beyond hope of any recovery.]]

to:

** That's not ''quite'' correct: Nicola never specifically said the ''inquiry'' would fuck Malcolm over, just that he and Dan would find out what it was like to have her "pissing into your [their] tent." Even at the time, when she still might have thought she had a chance to regain power, it was a vague, empty threat. And even though although Malcolm eventually did end up [[spoiler: getting fucked by the inquiry]], that was none of Nicola's doing. [[spoiler: By the end, they'd both basically been beaten beyond hope of any recovery.]]
15th Aug '15 2:05:21 AM molesborough
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** Although he almost definitely leaked the records, Malcolm probably wasn't expecting to face punishment. He justifiably took it for granted that others summoned to the inquiry bore a more direct responsibility for [[spoiler: Tickel's death]]. True, he leaked the guy's private medical info, but is that really as bad as selling his home out from under him, ignoring him, ridiculing him, and then evicting him from the place where he was squatting in protest? Compared to Peter (whose policy created Tickel's problems) and Nicola (who refused to criticize the Coalition for this until Malcolm had her cornered), Malcolm was practically Tickel's ally--certainly the only political figure who advocated making an issue out of the Government's appalling treatment of him. True, it was insensitive to leak Tickel's private medical history to score political points, and Malcolm's motives were probably cynical. But by leaking his records, Malcolm was arguably doing more to draw attention to Tickel's plight than anyone else in the Government or Opposition (and you could even defensibly say that, Malcolm really WAS using the leak to "show up hypocrisy... corruption... idiocy" in the Government, not to attack a "civilian" victimized by this Government). Moreover, the timing makes it pretty clear that Tickel's eviction, not the leak of his health records, was what [[spoiler: drove him to suicide]]. Maybe Malcolm got careless out of cockiness, but it's also possible that he considered the health records leak insignificant next to how the Coalition had been treating Tickel, and the last thing he expected was that the inquiry would pursue the matter, let alone use it to pin the blame for Tickel's [[spoiler: suicide]] on him.

to:

** Although he almost definitely leaked the records, Malcolm probably wasn't expecting to face punishment. He justifiably took it for granted that others summoned to the inquiry bore a more direct responsibility for [[spoiler: Tickel's death]]. True, he leaked the guy's private medical info, but is that really as bad as selling his home out from under him, ignoring him, ridiculing him, and then evicting him from the place where he was squatting in protest? Compared to Peter (whose policy created Tickel's problems) and Nicola (who refused to criticize the Coalition for this until Malcolm had her cornered), Malcolm was practically Tickel's ally--certainly the only political figure who advocated making an issue out of the Government's appalling treatment of him. True, it was insensitive to leak Tickel's private medical history to score political points, and Malcolm's motives were probably cynical. But by leaking his records, Malcolm was arguably doing more to draw attention to Tickel's plight than anyone else in the Government or Opposition (and you could even defensibly say that, that Malcolm really WAS using the leak to "show up hypocrisy... corruption... idiocy" in the Government, not to attack a "civilian" victimized by this that Government). Moreover, the timing makes it pretty clear that Tickel's eviction, not the leak of his health records, was what [[spoiler: drove him to suicide]]. Maybe Malcolm got careless out of cockiness, but it's also possible that he considered the health records leak insignificant next to how the Coalition had been treating Tickel, and the last thing he expected was that the inquiry would pursue the matter, let alone use it to pin the blame for Tickel's [[spoiler: suicide]] on him.
15th Aug '15 1:54:31 AM molesborough
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** Although he almost definitely leaked the records, Malcolm probably wasn't expecting to face punishment. He justifiably took it for granted that others summoned to the inquiry bore a more direct responsibility for [[spoiler: Tickel's death]]. True, he leaked the guy's private medical info, but is that really as bad as selling his home out from under him, ignoring him, ridiculing him, and then evicting him from the place where he was squatting in protest? Compared to Peter (whose policy created Tickel's problems) and Nicola (who refused to criticize the Coalition for this until Malcolm had her cornered), Malcolm was practically Tickel's ally--certainly the only political figure who advocated making an issue out of the Government's appalling treatment of him. True, it was insensitive to leak Tickel's private medical history to score political points, and Malcolm's motives were probably cynical. But by leaking his records, Malcolm was arguably doing more to draw attention to Tickel's plight than anyone else in the Government or Opposition (and you could even say that, compared with the other characters, Malcolm really WAS using the leak to "show up hypocrisy... corruption... idiocy" in the Government, rather than to attack a "civilian" victimized by this Government). Moreover, the timing makes it pretty clear that Tickel's eviction, not the leak of his health records, was what [[spoiler: drove him to suicide]]. Maybe Malcolm got careless out of cockiness, but it's also possible that he considered the health records leak a non-issue compared to how the Coalition had been treating Tickel, and the last thing he expected was that the inquiry would pursue the matter, let alone use it to pin the blame for Tickel's [[spoiler: suicide]] on him.

to:

** Although he almost definitely leaked the records, Malcolm probably wasn't expecting to face punishment. He justifiably took it for granted that others summoned to the inquiry bore a more direct responsibility for [[spoiler: Tickel's death]]. True, he leaked the guy's private medical info, but is that really as bad as selling his home out from under him, ignoring him, ridiculing him, and then evicting him from the place where he was squatting in protest? Compared to Peter (whose policy created Tickel's problems) and Nicola (who refused to criticize the Coalition for this until Malcolm had her cornered), Malcolm was practically Tickel's ally--certainly the only political figure who advocated making an issue out of the Government's appalling treatment of him. True, it was insensitive to leak Tickel's private medical history to score political points, and Malcolm's motives were probably cynical. But by leaking his records, Malcolm was arguably doing more to draw attention to Tickel's plight than anyone else in the Government or Opposition (and you could even defensibly say that, compared with the other characters, Malcolm really WAS using the leak to "show up hypocrisy... corruption... idiocy" in the Government, rather than not to attack a "civilian" victimized by this Government). Moreover, the timing makes it pretty clear that Tickel's eviction, not the leak of his health records, was what [[spoiler: drove him to suicide]]. Maybe Malcolm got careless out of cockiness, but it's also possible that he considered the health records leak a non-issue compared insignificant next to how the Coalition had been treating Tickel, and the last thing he expected was that the inquiry would pursue the matter, let alone use it to pin the blame for Tickel's [[spoiler: suicide]] on him.
14th Aug '15 11:32:56 PM molesborough
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** That's not ''quite'' correct: Nicola never specifically said the ''inquiry'' would fuck Malcolm over, just that he and Dan would find out what it was like to have her "pissing into your tent." Even at the time, when she may still have thought she had a chance to regain power, it was a pretty vague and empty threat. And even though Malcolm eventually did end up [[spoiler: getting fucked by the inquiry]], that really had nothing to do with Nicola. [[spoiler: By the end, they'd both basically been beaten beyond hope of any recovery.]]
** At the time Nicola and Malcolm had that exchange, the inquiry was ONLY supposed to be about Tickel. It would only have implicated anyone who supported the key worker housing selloff and generally treated Tickel like crap [[spoiler: and drove him to suicide]]: definitely Peter and possibly Nicola, Fergus, and the Coalition advisors. Malcolm didn't predict that Peter would try to deflect blame from himself by saying "the real story" was the leaking of Tickel's medical records ([[spoiler: a ploy that ended up working out perfectly for him; the Goolding Inquiry spent more time on leaking than the Coalition's policy or treatment of Tickel, so Peter came out of it smelling like roses]]). And Malcolm also didn't know the PM would broaden the inquiry to encompass the whole "culture of leaking"--which potentially implicated Malcolm along with everyone else ([[spoiler: and eventually brought about his downfall]]). It's hard to see how he could have predicted it; this broader version of the inquiry took everyone by surprise.

to:

** That's not ''quite'' correct: Nicola never specifically said the ''inquiry'' would fuck Malcolm over, just that he and Dan would find out what it was like to have her "pissing into your tent." Even at the time, when she may still might have thought she had a chance to regain power, it was a pretty vague and vague, empty threat. And even though Malcolm eventually did end up [[spoiler: getting fucked by the inquiry]], that really had nothing to do with Nicola.was none of Nicola's doing. [[spoiler: By the end, they'd both basically been beaten beyond hope of any recovery.]]
** At the time Nicola and Malcolm had that exchange, the inquiry was ONLY supposed to be about Tickel. It would only have implicated anyone who supported the key worker housing selloff and or generally treated Tickel like crap [[spoiler: and drove him to suicide]]: definitely Peter and possibly Nicola, Fergus, and the Coalition advisors. Malcolm didn't predict never predicted that Peter would try to deflect blame from himself by saying "the real story" was the leaking of Tickel's medical records ([[spoiler: a ploy that ended up working out perfectly for him; the Goolding Inquiry spent more time on leaking than the Coalition's policy or treatment of Tickel, so Peter came out of it smelling like roses]]). And Malcolm also didn't know the PM would broaden the inquiry to encompass the whole "culture of leaking"--which potentially implicated Malcolm along with everyone else ([[spoiler: and eventually brought about his downfall]]). It's hard to see how he could have predicted it; this broader version of the inquiry took everyone by surprise.




to:

** Was this really out of character? OK, Glenn is the most moral character on the show in the sense that he actually HAS some principles (which many TTOI characters, e.g. Ollie and Adam, plainly lacked). But he wasn't above lying or insincerity, and his principles always took a back seat to the priority of keeping his job, at least until [[spoiler: he resigns in the last episode and delivers his [[http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheReasonYouSuckSpeech "The Reason You Suck" Speech]] to his colleagues]]. His switch to a new party in Season 4 is seemingly motivated by job security concerns. At the time of the e-mail scandal, keeping his own job meant helping Hugh keep his, even if it meant shifting blame for something Hugh said to someone like Terri, whose reputation he didn't have a stake in. He didn't even stay mad at Hugh for cynically using his own son as an example to get out of a tight spot at an inquiry; in the Specials, he's right back in Hugh's corner, trying to secure a place for him in the new cabinet. If he's willing to make moral compromises like this in matters affecting his own family, why should we expect him to go out of his way (or defy Hugh) for Terri? In later seasons, we see him shamelessly sucking up to Nicola, Fergus, and the Goolding inquisitors, [[spoiler: and even lying under oath.]] He may have enough scruples to feel remorse about these compromises of integrity, but still goes through with them.
14th Aug '15 9:54:23 PM molesborough
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** At the time Nicola and Malcolm had that exchange, the inquiry was ONLY supposed to be about Tickel. It would only have implicated anyone who supported the key worker housing selloff and generally treated Tickel like crap [[spoiler: and drove him to suicide]]: definitely Peter and possibly Nicola, Fergus, and the Coalition advisors. Malcolm didn't predict that Peter would try to deflect blame from himself by saying "the real story" was the leaking of Tickel's medical records ([[spoiler: a ploy that ended up working out perfectly for him; the Goolding Inquiry spent more time asking about leaks than Tickel, and Peter came out of it smelling like roses]]). And Malcolm also didn't know the PM would broaden the inquiry to encompass the whole "culture of leaking"--which potentially implicated Malcolm along with everyone else ([[spoiler: and eventually brought about his downfall]]). It's hard to see how he could have predicted it; this broader version of the inquiry took everyone by surprise.

to:

** At the time Nicola and Malcolm had that exchange, the inquiry was ONLY supposed to be about Tickel. It would only have implicated anyone who supported the key worker housing selloff and generally treated Tickel like crap [[spoiler: and drove him to suicide]]: definitely Peter and possibly Nicola, Fergus, and the Coalition advisors. Malcolm didn't predict that Peter would try to deflect blame from himself by saying "the real story" was the leaking of Tickel's medical records ([[spoiler: a ploy that ended up working out perfectly for him; the Goolding Inquiry spent more time asking about leaks on leaking than the Coalition's policy or treatment of Tickel, and so Peter came out of it smelling like roses]]). And Malcolm also didn't know the PM would broaden the inquiry to encompass the whole "culture of leaking"--which potentially implicated Malcolm along with everyone else ([[spoiler: and eventually brought about his downfall]]). It's hard to see how he could have predicted it; this broader version of the inquiry took everyone by surprise.



** It's pretty clear that Malcolm DID leak Tickel's records. There's not really a plausible reason for his having Tickel's NHS number if that weren't his intention. Besides, we know what his motive would have been for leaking the records: Exposing how Mannion was "picking on a man with a history of depression" and generally making the Government look bad. I suppose it could have been cockiness that made Malcolm so careless, but I think it's more likely that he never even expected the inquiry committee to look into the leak of Tickel's records. You have to remember that at the time he forced Nicola into calling for an inquiry, he was expecting it to be focused entirely on the housing selloff ([[spoiler: and everything else the government had done to drive Tickel to suicide]]) not on the "culture of leaking."
** Although he almost definitely DID leak Tickel's records, he probably wasn't expecting to be held to account for it because many other people who went before that inquiry bore a more direct responsibility for [[spoiler: Tickel's death]]. Sure, he leaked Tickel's private medical info, but is that really as bad as selling is home out from under him, ignoring him, ridiculing him, and then evicting him? The irony is that Malcolm ended up taking the rap for [[spoiler: Tickel's suicide]] when Sure, it was wrong to go public with Tickel's private medical history to score political points. But is that worse than what the Coalition did? Selling off his home in the first place, then ignoring his protests (something both the Coalition and Nicola were guilty of), and finally trying to shut him up by evicting him? There's also little reason to think that having his records leaked was what provoked [[spoiler: the suicide]]; Tickel only did it when he was about to be evicted, a while after it became common knowledge that he was clinically depressed. Malcolm may have been lying when he said he wouldn't go after civilians, but he treated this particular civilian better than anyone else around him. Malcolm was arguably the closest thing to an ally Tickel had in politics; the Coalition treated him appallingly and Nicola refused to mention him until Malcolm had her cornered. Leaking the records was insensitive on Malcolm's part, and his motives were probably cynical, but if you think about it, he was the only political figure (in either the Opposition or the Coalition) who ever tried to draw attention to Tickel or his plight.

to:

** It's pretty clear that Malcolm DID leak Tickel's records. There's not It's the only really a plausible reason for his having Tickel's NHS number if that weren't his intention. number. Besides, we know what his motive would have been for leaking the records: been: Exposing how Mannion was "picking on a man with a history of depression" and generally making the Government look bad. I suppose it could have been cockiness that made Malcolm so careless, but I think it's more likely that he never even expected the inquiry committee to look into the leak of Tickel's records. You have to remember that at the time he forced Nicola into calling for an inquiry, he was expecting it to be focused entirely on the housing selloff ([[spoiler: and everything else the government had done to drive Tickel to suicide]]) not on the "culture of leaking."
bad.
** Although he almost definitely DID leak Tickel's leaked the records, he Malcolm probably wasn't expecting to be held to account face punishment. He justifiably took it for it because many other people who went before granted that others summoned to the inquiry bore a more direct responsibility for [[spoiler: Tickel's death]]. Sure, True, he leaked Tickel's the guy's private medical info, but is that really as bad as selling is his home out from under him, ignoring him, ridiculing him, and then evicting him? The irony is that Malcolm ended up taking him from the rap for [[spoiler: place where he was squatting in protest? Compared to Peter (whose policy created Tickel's suicide]] when Sure, problems) and Nicola (who refused to criticize the Coalition for this until Malcolm had her cornered), Malcolm was practically Tickel's ally--certainly the only political figure who advocated making an issue out of the Government's appalling treatment of him. True, it was wrong insensitive to go public with leak Tickel's private medical history to score political points. But is that worse than what the Coalition did? Selling off his home in the first place, then ignoring his protests (something both the Coalition points, and Nicola were guilty of), and finally trying to shut him up by evicting him? There's also little reason to think that having his records leaked was what provoked [[spoiler: the suicide]]; Tickel only did it when he was about to be evicted, a while after it became common knowledge that he was clinically depressed. Malcolm may have been lying when he said he wouldn't go after civilians, but he treated this particular civilian better than anyone else around him. Malcolm was arguably the closest thing to an ally Tickel had in politics; the Coalition treated him appallingly and Nicola refused to mention him until Malcolm had her cornered. Leaking the records was insensitive on Malcolm's part, and his motives were probably cynical, but if you think about it, he cynical. But by leaking his records, Malcolm was the only political figure (in either the Opposition or the Coalition) who ever tried arguably doing more to draw attention to Tickel Tickel's plight than anyone else in the Government or Opposition (and you could even say that, compared with the other characters, Malcolm really WAS using the leak to "show up hypocrisy... corruption... idiocy" in the Government, rather than to attack a "civilian" victimized by this Government). Moreover, the timing makes it pretty clear that Tickel's eviction, not the leak of his plight.health records, was what [[spoiler: drove him to suicide]]. Maybe Malcolm got careless out of cockiness, but it's also possible that he considered the health records leak a non-issue compared to how the Coalition had been treating Tickel, and the last thing he expected was that the inquiry would pursue the matter, let alone use it to pin the blame for Tickel's [[spoiler: suicide]] on him.
14th Aug '15 8:30:24 PM molesborough
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** That's not entirely correct: Nicola never specifically said the ''inquiry'' would fuck Malcolm over, just that he and Dan would find out what it was like to have her "pissing into your tent." Even at the time, when she may still have thought she had a chance to regain power, it was a pretty vague and empty threat. And even though Malcolm eventually did end up [[spoiler: getting fucked by the inquiry]], that really had nothing to do with Nicola. [[spoiler: By the end, they'd both basically been beaten beyond hope of any recovery.]]
** At the time this exchange between Nicola and Malcolm took place, the inquiry was ONLY supposed to be about Tickel. It would only have implicated the people who supported the housing selloff and generally treated Tickel like crap [[spoiler: and drove him to suicide]]: definitely Peter and possibly Nicola, Fergus, and the Coalition advisors. Malcolm didn't predict that Peter would try to deflect blame from himself by saying "the real story" was the leaking of Tickel's medical records. And he didn't know the PM would broaden the inquiry to encompass the whole "culture of leaking"--which potentially implicated EVERYONE, including Malcolm. It's hard to see how Malcolm could have predicted this; it took everyone by surprise. And ultimately, Peter's ploy to deflect blame [[spoiler: ended up working out perfectly for him. The Goolding Inquiry spent more time asking about leaks than about Tickel.]] Peter was arguably much more responsible for what happened to Tickel than Malcolm was. Peter's policy was the reason Tickel was protesting in the first place, and Tickel only [[spoiler: commited suicide]] when the Government tried to get him evicted from his tent. But Peter [[spoiler: managed to throw all the blame on Malcolm for leaking the medical records, and came out of the inquiry smelling like roses.]]

to:

** That's not entirely ''quite'' correct: Nicola never specifically said the ''inquiry'' would fuck Malcolm over, just that he and Dan would find out what it was like to have her "pissing into your tent." Even at the time, when she may still have thought she had a chance to regain power, it was a pretty vague and empty threat. And even though Malcolm eventually did end up [[spoiler: getting fucked by the inquiry]], that really had nothing to do with Nicola. [[spoiler: By the end, they'd both basically been beaten beyond hope of any recovery.]]
** At the time this exchange between time Nicola and Malcolm took place, had that exchange, the inquiry was ONLY supposed to be about Tickel. It would only have implicated the people anyone who supported the key worker housing selloff and generally treated Tickel like crap [[spoiler: and drove him to suicide]]: definitely Peter and possibly Nicola, Fergus, and the Coalition advisors. Malcolm didn't predict that Peter would try to deflect blame from himself by saying "the real story" was the leaking of Tickel's medical records. records ([[spoiler: a ploy that ended up working out perfectly for him; the Goolding Inquiry spent more time asking about leaks than Tickel, and Peter came out of it smelling like roses]]). And he Malcolm also didn't know the PM would broaden the inquiry to encompass the whole "culture of leaking"--which potentially implicated EVERYONE, including Malcolm. Malcolm along with everyone else ([[spoiler: and eventually brought about his downfall]]). It's hard to see how Malcolm he could have predicted this; it it; this broader version of the inquiry took everyone by surprise. And ultimately, Peter's ploy to deflect blame [[spoiler: ended up working out perfectly for him. The Goolding Inquiry spent more time asking about leaks than about Tickel.]] Peter was arguably much more responsible for what happened to Tickel than Malcolm was. Peter's policy was the reason Tickel was protesting in the first place, and Tickel only [[spoiler: commited suicide]] when the Government tried to get him evicted from his tent. But Peter [[spoiler: managed to throw all the blame on Malcolm for leaking the medical records, and came out of the inquiry smelling like roses.]]
surprise.
14th Aug '15 1:57:46 PM molesborough
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** It's pretty clear that Malcolm DID leak Tickel's records. There's not really a plausible reason for his having Tickel's NHS number if that weren't his intention. Besides, we know what his motive would have been for leaking the records: Exposing how Mannion was "picking on a man with a history of depression" and generally making the Government look bad. The irony is that Malcolm ended up taking the rap for Tickel's [[spoiler: suicide]] when everyone else arguably bore more responsibility for it. Sure, it was wrong to go public with Tickel's private medical history to score political points. But is that worse than what the Coalition did? Selling off his home in the first place, then ignoring his protests (something both the Coalition and Nicola were guilty of), and finally trying to shut him up by evicting him? There's also little reason to think that having his records leaked was what provoked [[spoiler: the suicide]]; Tickel only did it when he was about to be evicted, a while after it became common knowledge that he was clinically depressed. Malcolm may have been lying when he said he wouldn't go after civilians, but he treated this particular civilian better than anyone else around him. Malcolm was arguably the closest thing to an ally Tickel had in politics; the Coalition treated him appallingly and Nicola refused to mention him until Malcolm had her cornered. Leaking the records was insensitive on Malcolm's part, and his motives were probably cynical, but if you think about it, he was the only political figure (in either the Opposition or the Coalition) who ever tried to draw attention to Tickel or his plight.

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** It's pretty clear that Malcolm DID leak Tickel's records. There's not really a plausible reason for his having Tickel's NHS number if that weren't his intention. Besides, we know what his motive would have been for leaking the records: Exposing how Mannion was "picking on a man with a history of depression" and generally making the Government look bad. I suppose it could have been cockiness that made Malcolm so careless, but I think it's more likely that he never even expected the inquiry committee to look into the leak of Tickel's records. You have to remember that at the time he forced Nicola into calling for an inquiry, he was expecting it to be focused entirely on the housing selloff ([[spoiler: and everything else the government had done to drive Tickel to suicide]]) not on the "culture of leaking."
** Although he almost definitely DID leak Tickel's records, he probably wasn't expecting to be held to account for it because many other people who went before that inquiry bore a more direct responsibility for [[spoiler: Tickel's death]]. Sure, he leaked Tickel's private medical info, but is that really as bad as selling is home out from under him, ignoring him, ridiculing him, and then evicting him?
The irony is that Malcolm ended up taking the rap for [[spoiler: Tickel's [[spoiler: suicide]] when everyone else arguably bore more responsibility for it. when Sure, it was wrong to go public with Tickel's private medical history to score political points. But is that worse than what the Coalition did? Selling off his home in the first place, then ignoring his protests (something both the Coalition and Nicola were guilty of), and finally trying to shut him up by evicting him? There's also little reason to think that having his records leaked was what provoked [[spoiler: the suicide]]; Tickel only did it when he was about to be evicted, a while after it became common knowledge that he was clinically depressed. Malcolm may have been lying when he said he wouldn't go after civilians, but he treated this particular civilian better than anyone else around him. Malcolm was arguably the closest thing to an ally Tickel had in politics; the Coalition treated him appallingly and Nicola refused to mention him until Malcolm had her cornered. Leaking the records was insensitive on Malcolm's part, and his motives were probably cynical, but if you think about it, he was the only political figure (in either the Opposition or the Coalition) who ever tried to draw attention to Tickel or his plight.
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Headscratchers.TheThickOfIt