History Headscratchers / TheLegendOfKorra

12th Jul '14 4:19:24 PM Discar
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* [[Headscratchers/TheLegendOfKorraEqualists The Equalists]] (including the Lieutenant and Hiroshi Sato)

to:

* [[Headscratchers/TheLegendOfKorraEqualists The Equalists]] (including the Lieutenant and Hiroshi Sato)Equalists]]
11th Jul '14 6:47:34 PM TheRoguePenguin
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* [[Headscratchers/TheLegendOfKorraEqualists The Equalists]] (including the Lieutenant and [[spoiler:Hiroshi Sato]])

to:

* [[Headscratchers/TheLegendOfKorraEqualists The Equalists]] (including the Lieutenant and [[spoiler:Hiroshi Sato]])Hiroshi Sato)



19th Oct '13 4:18:50 AM WhiteCrane
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* [[Headscratchers/TheLegendOfKorraEqualists The Equalists]] (including the Lieutenant and Hiroshi Sato)

to:

* [[Headscratchers/TheLegendOfKorraEqualists The Equalists]] (including the Lieutenant and Hiroshi Sato)[[spoiler:Hiroshi Sato]])
14th Aug '12 2:17:17 PM ccoa
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[[/index]]

to:

[[/index]][[/index]]

----
14th Aug '12 2:17:07 PM ccoa
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* [[Headscratchers/TheLegendOfKorraEqualists The Equalists (including the Lieutenant and Hiroshi Sato)]]

to:

* [[Headscratchers/TheLegendOfKorraEqualists The Equalists Equalists]] (including the Lieutenant and Hiroshi Sato)]]Sato)



[[/index]]


[[foldercontrol]]



[[folder: Seventy years later and there are only five Airbenders in the world?]]
...Three of whom are children and the fourth is the Avatar? Not a single bender emerged outside of Aang's bloodline or the Avatar cycle? Really?
* Five Airbenders known to the world, anyway. Maybe there's a kid out there with Air Nomad ancestry (or the bending gene and an Airbending disposition, or however it works) who's amusing his village blowing wind at people, and no one's connected the dots and informed Tenzin yet.
** Well, Aang was the last one for a reason. If they could just emerge, then this storyline would have been pointless. Also, the sixth airbender is about to be born.
** If there were any descendents of the Air Nomads they would have emerged during the 100 years Aang was frozen. One can assume the Fire Nation was thorough in their genocide and/or the Air Nomads were fairly insular.
*** I imagine that if there were any survivors and descendents, they would just stay hidden on account of, you know, the concerted effort to wipe them off the face of the planet.
** It's also established, time and again, that bending is just as much a discipline as a genetic thing. If there's no one to pass on the teachings, it's gone forever. For comparison, when the [[CommieNazis Commie Nazi]] [[PolPot Khmer Rouge]] were kicked out of Cambodia, you could count the number of people who knew how to perform an ancient type of ballet on one hand. Everyone on Earth is, theoretically, capable of performing this dance, but if there's no one left to show you, how are you going to know the moves? Scrolls burn and people die.
*** That's the point: In the the decades Aang was alive and active, only one Airbender - his son - emerged? For that matter, that son and his family are the only ones in the world who live the traditional Air Nomad lifestyle? I find that statistically implausible. Hell, even with dead languages, someone is still studying and learning it.
*** Most dead languages haven't had a whole nation trying to hunt down anyone who might have spoken that language, starting with a concerted effort to wipe them all off the face of the planet.\\\
The Fire Nation was, apparently, very thorough.
*** I has been proven that a culture didn't need to have benders for someone with bending potential to learn the art, Katara was completely self taught in the benderless Southern Water Tribe before Aang showed up, but [[WordOfGod all air nomads were air benders]] so when all the air nomads were wiped out there wasn't anyone left with the potential to air bend because unlike the other nations they never had anyone with a "hidden potential" for bending that could be passed down.Only Aang could continue the legacy and of the three children he had with Katara [[WordOfGod Kya was a waterbender and Bumi couldn't bend so only Tenzin was comfirmed to be able to continue the line.]] Apparently any children Kya or Bumi had didn't inherit the ability to airbend.
*** And not only was Katara self taught- she didn't become a master waterbender until they got to the north pole, where they had lessons with master Pakku. So it only takes a potential for bending for a child to discover she can bend an element, but without learning from an external source (the scroll, Pakku) it would stay at the same level (so a child being born an airbender is not enough for him to be a full grown airbender, if there's no one to teach him how to bend).
*** Which ignores Toph being self-taught, as her Earthbending instructor intentionally never showed her anything other than the very basics. (Stuff she already knew at that point.)
**** Toph wasn't self-taught, she learned earthbending from the badger-moles. While it isn't explicitly stated, the implication is that this is why she was such a skilled bender at such an early age. Like Zuko and Aang later did with firebending, Toph discovered the source of earthbending and learned its purest form from them.
* In the episode, "A Leaf In the Wind," we see that Tenzin and his family aren't the only ones on Air Temple Island. I assume that at least some of them are learning airbending. It probably doesn't come as naturally to them as it does with Tenzin's kids .
** They're presumably not benders (as bending's been pointed out above to be a mix of genetics and spirituality), but at the very least they can help preserve the remnants of Air Nomad culture, as well as the airbending teachings themselves. Even if the airbenders remain rare for a few more decades, the Air Nomads are certainly returning.
* However implausible it may be, the series itself does sort of answer this on its own. Its an established fact that all Air Nomads are born benders naturally through sheer level of spirituality amongst its peoples; so one would be correct to assume that Aang would automatically have airbending children. However, perhaps his intermarriage caused a hiccup in the lineage. It's not a jab at Katara mind you, a powerful master Waterbender, but because she didn't have the same innate understanding and enlightened spirituality of her husband (which is NOT to say she wasn't spiritual, just not the same level) it took a little bit (two kids in their case) for the kink to work itself out. Case in point, Tenzin and Pema's children; after Pema wholly embraced the Air Nomad culture - and all the spiritual focus it demands...all of their children (thus far) are natural Airbenders. Mind you, this works only if Aang really truly was the last Airbender post genocide, which all hints from the series seem to support, as well as that one simply can't find a Sky Bison and learn Airbending as it was originally founded.
[[/folder]]


[[folder: Why doesn't anyone learn some sort of defense against the chi-blockers?]]
* In the original series we had one person use this technique on a few people, two of whom had never had professional training (Katara and Toph) and one (Azula) who she took completely by surprise. Maybe there is no defense, but that ought to be said. Maybe this will be adressed, and some sort of defense can be constructed.
** There is no defense. Pressure points can't be moved, nor can the effects of hitting them changed. The Metalbenders should be immune thanks to their armor, though, since the force of the blows won't get through properly.
*** It should be possible to develop a style specifically to avoid being hit. A master air or water bender would probably be very difficult to stop with chi-blocking if they knew what they were getting into.
*** Not getting hit isn't much of a style. The trick is fighting back without being being hit.
*** "Not getting hit isn't much of a style"? Isn't that a big part of what Airbending is all about? Remember the training with the swiveling gates? Aang certainly was good at avoiding getting hit in the original series (and Ty Lee never managed to chi-block him). And it fits thematically, seeing as Korra is still struggling with attempts to learn Airbending now.
*** As I said, not getting hit, in itself, is not much of a style. You need to be able to fight back. Aang never fought Ty Lee up close, and chi-benders are all about close combat. Just dodging isn't going to help unless Korra can do damage at range, too.
*** "Not getting hit" is a pretty good summary of the airbending style as a whole, actually. Airbending does not have any purely offensive moves.
* It should be said that the original does showcase how to fight chi-blockers...by relying on hand to hand combat. This was best displayed by Suki in The Boiling Rock finale. The trick here Is that most of the benders we've been shown seemingly either aren't versed in it (like Katara previously) or are capable but aren't quite good enough (Korra herself in this case; who is a capable close quarters figher but doesn't quite measure up).
* Chief Beifong comments in [[Recap/TheLegendOfKorraS1E6AndTheWinnerIs And The Winner Is...]], that metalbender's armor blocks chi blocking, as justification for why they should defend against them, and they seem to be the only one with a solid defense.
** Which led to a bit of FridgeBrillance: The metal armor protects them from The Equalists' chi-blocking... but makes them doubly-vulnerable to The Equalists' shock weapons.
*** Which could theoretically be solved by making the armor as such that it forms a Faraday cage for the wearer. Or if the counter intuitive physics are a bit too much, have them use some non conductive padding underneath.
** Related to the above: Why doesn't someone simply develop close fitting ceramic armor? Ceramics are generally lighter than metal so it wouldn't be too heavy, they're completely non-conductive so electricity is out and given the presence and abilities of earthbenders shaping and mass manufacturing the armor would be incredibly easy. A single solid plate for the chest and back and segmented plates for the sides of the chest, legs and arms would basically render a person immune to chi blockers. Slap a decent helmet on there and a bender could basically tank anything the average equalist could throw out. It wouldn't even have to be large, say a quarter inch thick. Just strong enough to deflect a single person's blows. With that in mind it could even be worn under clothes as a nasty surprise to any chiblockers. It would be pretty funny to see them do the whole elaborate series of punches only to have the person step back completely unfazed.
*** Aren't really durable ceramics a fairly recent invention? With all the acrobatics involved in bending simple pottery would break.
*** The composite ceramics used in things like tank armor and semi conductors are fairly new, yes. But silicon carbide, the stuff they make the plates in bulletproof vests out of, has been mass produced since the early 1890's. And all of this isn't accounting for cermets (Ceramics mixed with metals). There are many examples of those that are nonconductive, flexible, light and strong as well.
*** Also, wrapping yourself in earthenware is a horrible idea in a world with people who can control earth. Of course, a person in metal plate going against an metalbender is in the same position, but it seems that metalbending is much rarer and largely contained to the police force.
[[/folder]]

[[folder: Why don't non-benders learn chi-blocking?]]
* And for that matter if the metal-bending police force is a special force for benders stopping thier ability would be a uch better idea. But if a substantial number of people learn to stop benders from abusing thier powers for a short term, and then can report them to the police, I would think that would address the problem, without interfering with the society's infastructure.
** Why doesn't every real life person learn karate to stop muggers, or carry a gun for that matter? You should be able to see where this logic leads.
*** Having lived in a place where there was a firearm of some kind in almost every house, open carry was legal without a permit and CCWs were issued to anyone who wasn't a convicted felon, and having personally trained in the martial arts, something that convinced me everyone should do it, I'm having trouble seeing the negative implications here. '''I'm kind of bothered that the non-benders in this show jumped from living in fear of the triads who abuse their power, to supporting a violent revolutionary who wants to rid the world of bending altogether.''' You would think someone would have simply said, '''in regards to the triads''', " I don't want this to continue. Do you guys want this to continue? That's what I thought. Let's work something out." Then, get armed and organized.
*** You do realize that's exactly what the Equalists have done, and that it is emphatically a ''bad thing''? There's a reason governments hire and train personnel to defend the public. The Equalists formed in response to exactly that sort of problem, but demonstrate how it, very easily, escalates to something worse.
*** Yeah, because this is how all organized crime fell in RealLife, right? Lets face it, in reality citizen militias have rarely solved any problems, at best keeping old ones from escalating further.
*** There's also the fact that even if armed militias and vigilantes are able to defeat their enemies, they have often by that point [[HeWhoFightsMonsters turned into the very thing they were trying to destroy.]]
** Assuming the Equalist narrative about Republic City is true their membership (though obviously not all non-benders) is severely impoverished. The old, sick, starving, emotionally destroyed, and crippled don't make much of an army against people who can punch you across a football field. The limited pool of potential fighters ones would constantly be trying to make ends meet, leaving little time or energy to learn martial arts.
*** The task force bust in "A Voice in the Night" seems to imply that it may be illegal to learn chi-blocking in Republic City. (Of course, it could also just be that Tarlokk was overstepping his bounds in ordering the raid.)
*** The bust isn't about chi-blocking being illegal, it's about shutting down a training camp for insurgents who have publicly declared war on part of the population. It's not what they're teaching, it's why.
*** But it still sends a very violent and agressive message to non-benders; you are not allowed to defend yourself. Since non-bending methods of fighting seem to be rare and slightly elite, chi-blocking is probably the only option for non-benders who want protection. Violently assaulting arresting people for wanting a self-defence method is bad, no matter the intent. It just tells non-benders that Amon was right and the Council doesn't want them to fight back.
*** No, it sends the message that if you want to take the risk of training with the wanted criminals, you get what you deserve. Now, if they were shutting down a dojo that is being run with city approval, it'd be an entirely different story. This training area was meant to be a secret and is explicitly training soldiers. The only message it sends is that the city won't tolerate a growing revolutionary presence in its midst.
*** So? You are still illegalizing the only really effective method for non-benders to defend themselves (And there is absolutely no indication the government of Republic City allows dojo's to teach it), by doing so you are saying that Amon is right to oppose the city government as they are directly stopping attempts by non-benders to defend themselves.
*** There's no indication that it is illegal to be taught. The chi-blockers obviously learned from someone before they turned violent. I don't understand how you keep failing to grasp a simple concept. '''This is a training camp for insurgents.''' What part of that are you not understanding? It's not "free chi-blocking classes", it's "help overthrow the bending establishment." Would you join a terrorist group for shooting lessons, then act offended when you got arrested? Of course not, that'd be your own damn fault. If they want to defend themselves, they can take a class from people who haven't waged war on an entire section of the population. Seriously, stop trying to act like it's the material being targeted. It is nothing of the sort. It is the people doing the teaching and why that is under fire, and nothing more than that.
*** Amon's people are the only ones who teach chi-blocking (that we know of) and its hard to believe that any group teaching chi-blocking wouldn't be immediately grouped with them as a result. My real question is when it started being legal to take down Equalist cells, their advocate in the first episode didn't seem to worry about getting arrested.
*** Freedom of speech is a far cry from militarization, and Amon very recently declared war on bending itself. The training camp was training recruits for battle. The protestor is just talking.
*** The Equalists can argue, accurately even, that chi-blocking is a purely defensive despite all of Amon's rhetoric about a revolution (lots of real world countries have politicians who use that kind of talk without their followers being hunted down).
*** What they claim is ''can'' be used for doesn't change what they ''are'' using it for. They've already attacked several benders. Criminals or not, they've proven their intentions to be less than noble. That kind of spin-doctoring doesn't work for revolutionaries. Politicians can only get away with it because they have the clout. Amon doesn't have that.
*** Whether any of this is correct is probably beside the point. Anyone who is at all sympathetic to the Equalist position is going to see jackbooted benders taking away their constitutional right to bear electro-sticks, and Amon will be spinning it as exactly that.
*** I was under the impression that the camp was attacked because of the amon posters, indicating them as members of the equalists, not because they were learning chi-blocking.
[[/folder]]









[[folder: Why doesn't anyone use armor or padding?]]
It's pretty clear that chi blocking uses strikes to specific parts of the body. Why has no one, thus far, thought to wear any sort of protection over those body parts? ESPECIALLY someone like Korra, who has been taken down by Equalists more than once AND is a high-profile target?
* Look again. Tarrlok's entire taskforce, including Korra, indeed wear padded armour on the job. It's just that ArmorIsUseless; maybe the important pressure points are in the areas of the body that can't be covered with too dense material without sacrificing vital mobility? Wearing armour in everyday life is incredibly uncomfortable and over time even physically debilitating. It's better to stay agile and learn not to be hit.
** The task force units looked more fancy than useful. And note that, where they actually are wearing what could be armor, not a single Seperatist lands a blow, not even with their shock batons. And even assuming that the task force suits are armored... why didn't Korra wear it when going to confront Amon in "The Voice in the Dark." Of course, Korra was carrying a giant IdiotBall during that part, so that might have been the point of not wearing it.
*** Korra may of felt the armor was limiting her mobility, and she was expecting a one on one fight with Amon. A bit of an idiot ball for thinking he would be dumb enough to go alone, but still it might of not of been for not wearing armor.
*** Either way, Ty Lee's chi-blocking worked fine on Earth Kingdom soldiers in the original series. ArmorIsUseless, so better to preserve mobility.
*** However, in Episode 6, it's explicitly stated that the Metalbender police's armor is capable of blocking chi-blocker attacks, though they're essentially wearing plate armor.
** It's actually a bit of FridgeBrilliance, since most bends need to be extremely mobile and need a wide range of movement in order to fully take advantage of their bending abilities. Heavy armor would merely impair their movements and therefore directly impact their bending ability.
* The Metalbending Police ''do'' wear armor that guards the chakras. That's why the Equalists also carry electro-sticks. That said, waterbending or especially airbending in armor is probably next to impossible unless you're skilled enough to [[AssJokeAproposOfNothing bend by flexing your butt cheeks]] or something similar.
[[/folder]]



[[folder: What happens when a non-Bender dies?]]
The Avatar is explicitly reincarnated, and there is a Spirit World that I presume holds the rest of the dead people in some form or another, but bending is also a spiritual connection as well as a power. Non-Benders don't have that. So do they still end up in the same place as Benders when they die?
* The Avatar is a special case. Aside from animals, we've never seen a single human in the spirit world that wasn't an Avatar. It stands to reason the afterlife is all-inclusive, and Avatars are the ones being short-changed.
** I figured that everyone was reincarnated, and only the Avatar has access to his/her past lives.
[[/folder]]









[[folder: What happened to the spectators in the stadium?]]
We have a stadium full of excited spectators. In many cases, fans of sports teams are willing to literally kill you if their team loses. Why on earth, spectators stood still? We are talking about people who can shoot fire from their hands and they are watching their favorite team being tortured right before their eyes Are they so frightened by a lot of tasers that are not able to defend their team?

The second strange thing that happens is that when Korra ends her fight on the roof and back into the stadium there's nobody left. Is it possible to evacuate a building of that size so quickly? It's almost as if the writers were not sure what the hell to do with those people.
* Korra's fight lasts a while, long enough for everyone to pour out the exits. As for the behavior, they may not be at the "riot over a loss" stage of sports devotion.
** Large buildings are also designed with lots of exits (which we know the arena has, the Equalists are shown getting through them). You can evacuate enormous stadiums in less than a minute. Still you'd think the Equalists would want witnesses.
*** They did. The audience was forced to stay there while Amon was giving his speech. Only when the Equalists were making their exit did the audience flee.
* The creators are Americans, we don't have deadly riots over sports as a regular occurrence over here. You're also underestimating how scared of the Equalists people are. Amon has spent a long time building up his revolution.
* Tenzin didn't join Lin and Korra in the battle against Amon, so I assumed he was helping to evacuate the crowd. Mako and Bolin may also have assisted; Mako would certainly have wanted to make sure Asami was safe.
* We aren't talking about a group of people who stormed the ring because they hated a team or something. This was a terrorist organization! Most people aren't going to exactly be leaping to try and take on a threat like Amon, especially when he can take away their bending so easily.
* How would they access the arena? If they just shoot fire from where they're sitting, they'd risk hitting the team members, not to mention other spectators. Maybe the waterbenders could have conjured a flood, but again, risk of injuring the team, not to mention that a coordinated attack would have been difficult, not to mention that the guys with the gloves would have stopped any such attempt in a second. And would you really like to be the one person that Amon singles out from the crowd? Also, don't forget the police force. Most likely, people relied on them and considered themselves safe. Once all policemen started dropping like flies, they probably realised that their chances aren't strong. ALSO, most of them probably don't know how to fight. Remember, it's a time of peace. I'd imagine that most of them are as capable as someone who's been to some self-defence classes. You might be able to fight off a mugger, but it's not exactly a case of MuggingTheMonster.
* Not all pro-bending fans are benders. In fact, that was the whole reason for Amon's attack. Non-benders were lifting up benders as sports heroes.
[[/folder]]





[[folder: Why were all these people killed by firebenders?]]
Supposedly, Mako and Bolin's parents, Amon's family, and Sato's wife were all murdered by firebenders. Other benders can be killers too, so why have the writers used firebenders for each of them? Something's not adding up.
* Probably simply because the previous generation was still suffering from the aftereffects of the 100-Year War, and because the United Republic consists of the former Fire Kingdom colonies. It makes sense that the Firebenders were the most common type of Bender in the region until the recent times.
** Compare the many movie villains that have a German accent. A firebending is probably still seen as more evil than other forms of bending. This, I think, is why Amon says that his parents were murdered by a firebender. For the rest... It could be a plot point in the coming series, or a red herring.
* Firebenders can kill a lot easier, and cleaner, than other benders can.
** Not really...creative benders could find plenty of ways to kill quickly and easily. A clever and malicious water bender could easily drown their opponent, and then take the water with them afterwards, leaving no evidence afterwards; no mess. Earthbending probably would be messier, but a rock at full speed applied to just the right spot on the head will still kill instantly. It seems strange that firebenders are still the only rampant killers these days...unless, of course, all the attacks are connected somehow.
*** Drowning takes a lot longer than killing with fire would, and it's doubtful every earthbender could kill so efficiently.
*** Or they could make a spear or a blade out of water. Ice can have sharp edges, and can cut with them (I should know, I cut my finger on a jagged piece of ice once)
*** Smashing people in the head with rocks is a vastly easier method of murder than causing them to die of severe burns. If Zuko had taken a fist sized chunk of stone to the head rather than a blast of fire he would have been brain damaged or dead rather than scarred.
*** Or maybe they just electrocuted them, given that lightning bending is so much more widespread these days. That would be the easiest and fastest method. Nobody said anything about using fire.
*** A powerful waterbender could easily kill someone by [[NightmareFuel by clotting or freezing the blood in their veins or arteries]], which if done in the right place (e.g., the brain) could kill the victim within seconds or minutes, and leave no evidence behind (or plenty of space to plant false evidence).
*** But that's bloodbending. Yakone may well have done that a few times, but overall almost no one has that ability.
* You have to remember that Fire is the one element that is based almost entirely on offensive moves. Also Water and Earth, while they certainly can kill you, don't strike fear into the hearts of people the way Fire does so Fire is the logical choice, not to mention there is still the stigma from 100-Year War as previously mentioned
* As a whole, Firebenders tend to be more aggressive and more prone to resorting to violence to solve their problems, since that's part of the philosophy of their training. Also, since the Fire Nation technically lost the previous war, and Zuko has made attempts to make it a more peaceful nation, you can bet that there are thousands of disenfranchised Fire Nation soldiers who were suddenly out of a job, and their bitterness carried on to the next generation.
* Seemed to me like foreshadowing. Chances are we'll find out at some later point in the show that it was the same firebender in all cases.
* I read a theory on a message board that in fact all of these murders are the work of a waterbender called Alfred Firebender, and he is just commonly referred to as A. Firebender.
* That's only three instances. It is not statistically significant.
** If we were talking about real life then that would absolutely be the case. But this a story, and when events repeat themselves in a story it's usually for a reason.
*** The incidents are also removed from each other in time. Twelve years ago an unspecified number of Agni Kai Triad firebenders broke into the Sato mansion and killed Mrs. Sato. Ten years ago, a firebender mugged Mako and Bolin's parents. Depending on the veracity of Amon's statements, the incident that forced him to wear a mask could be anywhere from twenty to forty years ago. If the writers are attempting to lace these facts with any sort of meaning, they are burying it very deep indeed.
* We also donít know the details of how all these incidents happened (correct me if Iím wrong; Iíve only seen all the episodes once), so itís possible that one or more of these murders were done not by firebenders but by others who took advantage of residual anti-Fire Nation sentiment to make it look like a firebending incident.
* It turns out that [[spoiler:Only two of those attacks actually happened Amon's backstory was a complete fabrication, he was actually secretly a bender]]
* Which leads to another question, Hiroshi lost his wife to a Firebender but why did he blamed Earthbenders and Waterbenders as well? Instead of generalizing that all benders are bad, he should've developed a hatred towards Firebenders only.
** Remember: This is the guy who went on a MotiveRant about how Amon was going to end bender oppression and make things a better, more just world for Asami and everybody (who isn't a bender), while apparently forgetting that he's the richest person in the biggest, most advanced city in the world. Oppressing him would take some doing.
*** Considering how he started out in poverty and became something of a self-made man in spite of it, it wouldn't be hard to imagine that Sato might have had the bender grudge from much earlier in life. The murder of his wife would have just pushed him over the edge.
[[/folder]]


[[folder: Power Level Math does not work out at all.]]
So...thus far we have two EliteMooks who defeat Mako + Korra in a straight-up fight. One Equalist Lieutenant who defeats Mako + Bolin in a straight-up fight before getting blindsided by Korra. And now, as of Episode 7, Asami can defeat the Equalist LT in a straight-up fight? How does that power differential even work? Sure, there was a "self-defense classes" handwave, but the LT would very likely have had just as much training if not more, and it's not like bending moves (being the exact same movements as several real-life martial arts) are much different from h2h combat when you remove the elemental part of it, so how exactly is Asami that much better than Mako, Bolin, or Korra at melee?
* The Lieutenant likely assumed that Asami was just a normal girl and would be easy to take down. She proved him wrong. Basically, when he fought Mako and Bolin, he was fighting for real. When he attacked Asami, he just expected to quickly incapacitate her in a single strike.
* Anyone can make the same motions as a professional boxer that doesn't mean they can actually fight like one. Mako, Bolin, and Korra know how to stop bending from hurting them not fists, the defenses are completely different.
* "Power Level Math" is an utterly, completely false premise, for a start. Unlike Dragonball Z, no, there is no definite scale that determines who will or will not win a given fight of ''any'' kind. There are any number of factors that will tilt the odds in the favor of one side or another in any kind of conflict, regardless of who they are. Just boiling it down to who's fighting doesn't mean a damn thing.\\\
Because the Lieutenant beat Mako and Bolin once doesn't mean he always will. Nor does it mean he will automatically beat anyone those two have beaten. All it means is that he beat Mako and Bolin once. Him getting [=KOed=] by Asami doesn't mean Asami is an unstoppable badass who's better than the rest of the cast; all it means is he got [=KOed=] by Asami.
* And lets not forget that the Lieutnant has been trained exclusively to fight against Benders, as indeed are Mako, Bolin and Korra. Asami, on the other hand, seems to be trained to fight against martial artists in general.
** That was my thought as well. The Equalists are specifically trained to contend against bending-style martial arts; of course they have an advantage over the cast's benders. But Asami has been getting general martial arts training from a very young age, likely from multiple different teachers--and probably from Equalist teachers, as well, since I see no reason Sato wouldn't want her to have a head-start on that for when and if she was ever brought into the fold. She probably has more sustained martial arts experience than a number of the normal Equalists. Beating the Lieutenant can probably be explained as a combination of his surprise, her speed, and possible unwillingness on his part to use especially harsh force against the daughter of the dude who just built you all these big mecha that are standing around.
* Asami attacked him with electricity -- something none of his other opponents were seen using against him. It was as effective when used against him as it was when he used it against the other opponents we saw.
* ''And'' you have to factor in that the Krew just isn't very good at actual combat. Spectator sport brawling? They're beast. Actual life-or-death struggle? They're meat.
[[/folder]]





[[folder: Why did they not take out the mechas with more powerful Earthbending, or Airbending? They were all holding back except Lin.]]
They were in an underground bunker, the floor was all earth and some powerful earthbending moves like the ones Toph used would have sent the mecha into the walls or buried them in the ground, with enough force to knock out their drivers. A large boulder shot used in the last series could have smashed one of them to pieces. Air was powerful enough to rattle Sato's mecha and very powerful air blast/explosion or a cutting move like the one Aang used could have severely damaged a mech or toppled it. But since Airbenders always fight defensively, they never fight without inhibitions. Lin was devastating when it comes to fighting and was the only one who took out a mech, because she was really fighting to kill. It didn't occur to anybody but her that the Mecha's glass canopy is easily damaged. It appears that the metalbender cops are overly reliant on their cables and the Equalists took advantage of their weakness.

Doesn't it really seem like all the benders are holding back their best moves?
* I attribute it to surprise and not knowing what they were dealing with, so they stuck with the techniques familiar to them, then didn't last long enough to get their thoughts together and pull out the big guns. For example, Korra started out by throwing fire as she usually does. When that proved ineffective she switched to earth, but got taken out before she could do much with it. Next time they face the mechas they'll be better prepared.
** There were a lot of them as well, and they had the heroes flanked. Big fancy moves are best suited to fighting a single opponent who's counter attacks you can closely guard against. As for Korra's firebending, that was stupid yes, but she always opens up with firebending. At least she quickly worked out that wasn't working very well. As for the metal benders, they're just not trained in those sort of moves. That's like training cops in anti tank weaponry, expensive and pointless.
** I can buy them getting caught flatfooted by an unexpected enemy... But seriously, we've all seen footage of cops pulling out the stops when faced with that kind of firepower. That their training inhibited them to that degree in the heat of battle, in a place where cutting loose was not only justified, but mandated? In a situation where basic earthbending moves like pilar raising would've served them far better? Ruling on the field stands: ForgotAboutHisPowers[=/=]IdiotBall combo.
** Oooooorrrrr, the cops just aren't very good at regular Earthbending on the fly. Their training might, in fact, be almost entirely metalbending, given how much they rely on it.\\\
Also, don't discount training. Do you know what training is really for? It's not just techniques and protocols. It's conditioning. It's training your body such that when your mind is scared and you're unable to think, you can keep acting on what has become instinct. I.e., when you're scared and facing something like those mecha, chances are that you are going to be doing the rote techniques that you've had drilled into you for years instead of getting creative and fancy. That is how armies have worked for pretty much all of human history.\\\
It's not IdiotBall, it's people who have been trained for years falling back on that training when they're in a tense situation and borderline panicking.
** You don't want to inadvertently cause a cave-in and wind up killing yourselves in the process. Earthbenders might be most dangerous underground, but they are also vulnerable to being buried with the enemy in the process.
[[/folder]]










[[folder: Episodes? Season Finale?]]
I may have heard wrong, but according to the commercial, the Season Finale is next week, a One-Hour season finale. Cool, i'm excited, don't get me wrong, but one hour? that's two episodes, right? which means, after next week, the series will be at 11 episodes. I thought it was supposed to be twelve. I guess its possible to fit three episodes in an hour, but it doesn't seem likely given how many commercials will be involved. So, was an episode cancelled, did Nick just screw up, or did i just miscount?
* No, the season finale is being advertised coming out in 23rd of June, two weeks from now. Next week is still business as usual. They're just advertising early.
* Good, thanks for clearing that up for me. I think i'd go through withdraws if they cut an episode.
** At least I ''think'' this is the case. I got no confirmation either, but at least there has been no hint of leaving out next week's episode in any source I know. Our own wiki tells that Turning the Tides will come out in June 16th.
** Many people seem to believe there won't be an episode next week. Good job, Nick. I think that promo was more harmful than no promo at all like the last couple of weeks.
[[/folder]]





[[folder: Why is everybody so lightly dressed?]]
The only thing coming close to a reasonable outfit is Lin's coat.
* She had time to change, they did not.
** It's less about that, it's their choice of wardrobe in the first place. It's winter, and they're wearing the same things they are wearing all the time. Korra, of course, is the worst offender, leaving the house like that. The Satomobiles aren't exactly warm and cozy either, which would have explained why Bolin and Mako don't put on more clothes.
* Korra use to live in the South Pole. She's probably use to the cold. Mako, Bolin, And Asami didn't have time to change what with breaking out of jail and all. Tenzin's cloths seem pretty warm. (Don't quite remember what he was wearing.)
* Tenzin has the excuse of being an airbender. Aang seemed just fine in both Poles with his regular clothes; fandom is that he used airbending to insulate himself. Tenzin would have learned the technique from his father. As for Mako and Bolin, remember they lived as orphans on the streets; they know how to deal with being in winter weather without proper clothing.
* Korra and Mako are firebenders; they don't need heavy clothing to keep warm. Asami and Bolin are reasonably well dressed; judging from the copious snowfall, it can't be much below freezing, if at all. Thick snow only falls in relatively warm winter weather.
[[/folder]]




[[folder: Why wasn't Yakone in solitary after that stunt he pulled?]]
He somehow had the opportunity to beget Tarrlok 4 years later, despite receiving a life sentence for 12 counts of bloodbending and proceeding to bloodbend the entire courtroom to resist being sent to jail, and then bloodbends the Avatar with intent to kill. That seems like it merits the sentence being upgraded to life in prison with no human contact (and only because they don't have the death penalty out of respect for Aang), except the people who will bring his meals, who are in turn forbidden to speak to him.
* Sounds like you're expecting Republic City prisons to be as cruel as Fire Nation prisons in the original series. It's not unlikely that the influence of Aang/Katara/etc made the retributive system in Republic City more humane, and things like conjugal visits were allowed in their prisons, which would've made Tarrlok's conception possible. Since Aang took Yakone's bending away, he wasn't considered dangerous anymore, so he wouldn't have needed to be kept in solitary. That, or Yakone simply escaped from prison, and catching him wasn't a high priority anymore because he'd lost his bloodbending, so he managed to find a wife and live the rest of his life in hiding.
* Because they're not evil scum who want to drive their prisoners insane? Even Ozai wasn't given such treatment.
* Aang says he's 40 years old in the flashback which means that as stated it is 42 years ago, he dies 26 years later and Korra is now 16. According to the Welcome to Republic City game Tarrlok is 37. He was born when his father was in prison.
** Or Tarrlok's listed age is wrong or represents a lie he's told. A fit man in his forties could pass as 37, especially one as vain as Tarrlock.
** Could easily be a lie. Tarrlock does bare a resemblance to Yakone after all...if anyone brought attention to it, he could just make an offhand comment that he was born after Yakone was already in jail and the matter would drop.
** Or maybe Yakone was broken out of prison. He did have a criminal empire.
** It's possible that the background people, like JK Rowling, can't do math, and Tarrlock isn't supposed to have been born after Yakone went to prison.
** The math assumes the Avatar is reborn right away, which may not be the case. Alternatively, considering the catastrophic emotional consequences of removing someone's bending, the council may have amended his sentence on the grounds that he has "suffered enough" and is no longer a threat.
*** A previous episode specifically states that Yakone was defeated 42 years ago.
**** Considering the fact that nobody knew Tarrlock was Yakone's son, I would say that Tarrlock is older than 42 and lied about his age along with his parentage.
**** Same troper as above, I stay corrected. The real answer is that Yakone escaped.
[[/folder]]
















[[folder: How did Shiro Shinobi know Tarrlok was the one who kidnapped Korra?]]
And if he had used his old IntrepidReporter skills to find out, how did Tarrlok's cover story work? Would the truth not have been broadcast on the radio for all to hear?
* The "Previously On" segments are clearly not happening in-universe. I'm simply amazed that someone could have come to the conclusion they were. Just...''wow'', I seriously cannot understand how this is being asked for a second time.
* The confusion probably stems from the fact that, in the preview of the seventh episode, Tarrlok was the voice over and in the previous episode Shiro was attack, and Tarrlok's voice over is clearly in-universe. So to be fair, it's not completely unbelievable that someone would be confused.
** It is also the only time that the voice over has mentioned information that wouldn't have realistically be available to the public.
*** So who Mako and Korra have crushes on--that they've never told anyone about--is information available to the public, too?
**** [[EveryoneCanSeeIt There's a trope for that.]]
[[/folder]]












[[folder:Yakone's escape]]
* Forget solitary, how did Yakone get out of jail in order to start a new life in the North Pole?
** They explicitly said that some of his criminal buddies broke him out. He was the head of a vast criminal empire. Exactly why they broke him out when he was stripped of his bending abilities, who knows? Maybe he had assets that the next gang leader could use, and only he knew where to get them, or maybe he simply possessed a level of fanatical devotion in his subordinates (maybe its in the blood) that they didn't care about his bending status.
[[/folder]]







[[folder: Was Korra originally meant to be a six-hour long movie?]]
Is it me, or unlike ATLA, they've pretty much wrapped it up here, with Korra becoming a Fully realized Avatar? Was it actually meant to go on for only one season until late in production?
* Yes. It was originally supposed to be a one season miniseries, but they got a second season while the first one was alredy in production.
[[/folder]]



















[[folder:What happened to the North Pole?]]
More specifically, the Northern Water Tribe. The first series showed it to be a relatively large place with a design similar to Venice, Italy. Yet when we see it in Taarlok's flashback story, it's comparable to what we saw of the Southern Water Tribe back in "The Boy in the Iceberg". And considering it's only ever referred to as ''the'' Northern Water Tribe, there seems to be no indication it would be some sort of outpost town or settlement.
* Is there any actual reason to believe it ''wasn't'' some sort of outpost town or settlement?
* Yeah. The Northern Water Tribe is just the name of the whole tribe, like the Zulu. Just because the Zulu are referred by a common tribe name doesn't mean they all live in the same city.
* The Northern Water Tribe we saw was one after 100 years of war--a fortification made for defense. At the time, yes, that was probably where the entire Tribe lived--but after the war ended and the danger of Fire Nation soldiers attacking and abducting people was gone, it makes sense that they would expand into other settlements.
[[/folder]]













----

to:

[[/index]]


[[foldercontrol]]



[[folder: Seventy years later and there are only five Airbenders in the world?]]
...Three of whom are children and the fourth is the Avatar? Not a single bender emerged outside of Aang's bloodline or the Avatar cycle? Really?
* Five Airbenders known to the world, anyway. Maybe there's a kid out there with Air Nomad ancestry (or the bending gene and an Airbending disposition, or however it works) who's amusing his village blowing wind at people, and no one's connected the dots and informed Tenzin yet.
** Well, Aang was the last one for a reason. If they could just emerge, then this storyline would have been pointless. Also, the sixth airbender is about to be born.
** If there were any descendents of the Air Nomads they would have emerged during the 100 years Aang was frozen. One can assume the Fire Nation was thorough in their genocide and/or the Air Nomads were fairly insular.
*** I imagine that if there were any survivors and descendents, they would just stay hidden on account of, you know, the concerted effort to wipe them off the face of the planet.
** It's also established, time and again, that bending is just as much a discipline as a genetic thing. If there's no one to pass on the teachings, it's gone forever. For comparison, when the [[CommieNazis Commie Nazi]] [[PolPot Khmer Rouge]] were kicked out of Cambodia, you could count the number of people who knew how to perform an ancient type of ballet on one hand. Everyone on Earth is, theoretically, capable of performing this dance, but if there's no one left to show you, how are you going to know the moves? Scrolls burn and people die.
*** That's the point: In the the decades Aang was alive and active, only one Airbender - his son - emerged? For that matter, that son and his family are the only ones in the world who live the traditional Air Nomad lifestyle? I find that statistically implausible. Hell, even with dead languages, someone is still studying and learning it.
*** Most dead languages haven't had a whole nation trying to hunt down anyone who might have spoken that language, starting with a concerted effort to wipe them all off the face of the planet.\\\
The Fire Nation was, apparently, very thorough.
*** I has been proven that a culture didn't need to have benders for someone with bending potential to learn the art, Katara was completely self taught in the benderless Southern Water Tribe before Aang showed up, but [[WordOfGod all air nomads were air benders]] so when all the air nomads were wiped out there wasn't anyone left with the potential to air bend because unlike the other nations they never had anyone with a "hidden potential" for bending that could be passed down.Only Aang could continue the legacy and of the three children he had with Katara [[WordOfGod Kya was a waterbender and Bumi couldn't bend so only Tenzin was comfirmed to be able to continue the line.]] Apparently any children Kya or Bumi had didn't inherit the ability to airbend.
*** And not only was Katara self taught- she didn't become a master waterbender until they got to the north pole, where they had lessons with master Pakku. So it only takes a potential for bending for a child to discover she can bend an element, but without learning from an external source (the scroll, Pakku) it would stay at the same level (so a child being born an airbender is not enough for him to be a full grown airbender, if there's no one to teach him how to bend).
*** Which ignores Toph being self-taught, as her Earthbending instructor intentionally never showed her anything other than the very basics. (Stuff she already knew at that point.)
**** Toph wasn't self-taught, she learned earthbending from the badger-moles. While it isn't explicitly stated, the implication is that this is why she was such a skilled bender at such an early age. Like Zuko and Aang later did with firebending, Toph discovered the source of earthbending and learned its purest form from them.
* In the episode, "A Leaf In the Wind," we see that Tenzin and his family aren't the only ones on Air Temple Island. I assume that at least some of them are learning airbending. It probably doesn't come as naturally to them as it does with Tenzin's kids .
** They're presumably not benders (as bending's been pointed out above to be a mix of genetics and spirituality), but at the very least they can help preserve the remnants of Air Nomad culture, as well as the airbending teachings themselves. Even if the airbenders remain rare for a few more decades, the Air Nomads are certainly returning.
* However implausible it may be, the series itself does sort of answer this on its own. Its an established fact that all Air Nomads are born benders naturally through sheer level of spirituality amongst its peoples; so one would be correct to assume that Aang would automatically have airbending children. However, perhaps his intermarriage caused a hiccup in the lineage. It's not a jab at Katara mind you, a powerful master Waterbender, but because she didn't have the same innate understanding and enlightened spirituality of her husband (which is NOT to say she wasn't spiritual, just not the same level) it took a little bit (two kids in their case) for the kink to work itself out. Case in point, Tenzin and Pema's children; after Pema wholly embraced the Air Nomad culture - and all the spiritual focus it demands...all of their children (thus far) are natural Airbenders. Mind you, this works only if Aang really truly was the last Airbender post genocide, which all hints from the series seem to support, as well as that one simply can't find a Sky Bison and learn Airbending as it was originally founded.
[[/folder]]


[[folder: Why doesn't anyone learn some sort of defense against the chi-blockers?]]
* In the original series we had one person use this technique on a few people, two of whom had never had professional training (Katara and Toph) and one (Azula) who she took completely by surprise. Maybe there is no defense, but that ought to be said. Maybe this will be adressed, and some sort of defense can be constructed.
** There is no defense. Pressure points can't be moved, nor can the effects of hitting them changed. The Metalbenders should be immune thanks to their armor, though, since the force of the blows won't get through properly.
*** It should be possible to develop a style specifically to avoid being hit. A master air or water bender would probably be very difficult to stop with chi-blocking if they knew what they were getting into.
*** Not getting hit isn't much of a style. The trick is fighting back without being being hit.
*** "Not getting hit isn't much of a style"? Isn't that a big part of what Airbending is all about? Remember the training with the swiveling gates? Aang certainly was good at avoiding getting hit in the original series (and Ty Lee never managed to chi-block him). And it fits thematically, seeing as Korra is still struggling with attempts to learn Airbending now.
*** As I said, not getting hit, in itself, is not much of a style. You need to be able to fight back. Aang never fought Ty Lee up close, and chi-benders are all about close combat. Just dodging isn't going to help unless Korra can do damage at range, too.
*** "Not getting hit" is a pretty good summary of the airbending style as a whole, actually. Airbending does not have any purely offensive moves.
* It should be said that the original does showcase how to fight chi-blockers...by relying on hand to hand combat. This was best displayed by Suki in The Boiling Rock finale. The trick here Is that most of the benders we've been shown seemingly either aren't versed in it (like Katara previously) or are capable but aren't quite good enough (Korra herself in this case; who is a capable close quarters figher but doesn't quite measure up).
* Chief Beifong comments in [[Recap/TheLegendOfKorraS1E6AndTheWinnerIs And The Winner Is...]], that metalbender's armor blocks chi blocking, as justification for why they should defend against them, and they seem to be the only one with a solid defense.
** Which led to a bit of FridgeBrillance: The metal armor protects them from The Equalists' chi-blocking... but makes them doubly-vulnerable to The Equalists' shock weapons.
*** Which could theoretically be solved by making the armor as such that it forms a Faraday cage for the wearer. Or if the counter intuitive physics are a bit too much, have them use some non conductive padding underneath.
** Related to the above: Why doesn't someone simply develop close fitting ceramic armor? Ceramics are generally lighter than metal so it wouldn't be too heavy, they're completely non-conductive so electricity is out and given the presence and abilities of earthbenders shaping and mass manufacturing the armor would be incredibly easy. A single solid plate for the chest and back and segmented plates for the sides of the chest, legs and arms would basically render a person immune to chi blockers. Slap a decent helmet on there and a bender could basically tank anything the average equalist could throw out. It wouldn't even have to be large, say a quarter inch thick. Just strong enough to deflect a single person's blows. With that in mind it could even be worn under clothes as a nasty surprise to any chiblockers. It would be pretty funny to see them do the whole elaborate series of punches only to have the person step back completely unfazed.
*** Aren't really durable ceramics a fairly recent invention? With all the acrobatics involved in bending simple pottery would break.
*** The composite ceramics used in things like tank armor and semi conductors are fairly new, yes. But silicon carbide, the stuff they make the plates in bulletproof vests out of, has been mass produced since the early 1890's. And all of this isn't accounting for cermets (Ceramics mixed with metals). There are many examples of those that are nonconductive, flexible, light and strong as well.
*** Also, wrapping yourself in earthenware is a horrible idea in a world with people who can control earth. Of course, a person in metal plate going against an metalbender is in the same position, but it seems that metalbending is much rarer and largely contained to the police force.
[[/folder]]

[[folder: Why don't non-benders learn chi-blocking?]]
* And for that matter if the metal-bending police force is a special force for benders stopping thier ability would be a uch better idea. But if a substantial number of people learn to stop benders from abusing thier powers for a short term, and then can report them to the police, I would think that would address the problem, without interfering with the society's infastructure.
** Why doesn't every real life person learn karate to stop muggers, or carry a gun for that matter? You should be able to see where this logic leads.
*** Having lived in a place where there was a firearm of some kind in almost every house, open carry was legal without a permit and CCWs were issued to anyone who wasn't a convicted felon, and having personally trained in the martial arts, something that convinced me everyone should do it, I'm having trouble seeing the negative implications here. '''I'm kind of bothered that the non-benders in this show jumped from living in fear of the triads who abuse their power, to supporting a violent revolutionary who wants to rid the world of bending altogether.''' You would think someone would have simply said, '''in regards to the triads''', " I don't want this to continue. Do you guys want this to continue? That's what I thought. Let's work something out." Then, get armed and organized.
*** You do realize that's exactly what the Equalists have done, and that it is emphatically a ''bad thing''? There's a reason governments hire and train personnel to defend the public. The Equalists formed in response to exactly that sort of problem, but demonstrate how it, very easily, escalates to something worse.
*** Yeah, because this is how all organized crime fell in RealLife, right? Lets face it, in reality citizen militias have rarely solved any problems, at best keeping old ones from escalating further.
*** There's also the fact that even if armed militias and vigilantes are able to defeat their enemies, they have often by that point [[HeWhoFightsMonsters turned into the very thing they were trying to destroy.]]
** Assuming the Equalist narrative about Republic City is true their membership (though obviously not all non-benders) is severely impoverished. The old, sick, starving, emotionally destroyed, and crippled don't make much of an army against people who can punch you across a football field. The limited pool of potential fighters ones would constantly be trying to make ends meet, leaving little time or energy to learn martial arts.
*** The task force bust in "A Voice in the Night" seems to imply that it may be illegal to learn chi-blocking in Republic City. (Of course, it could also just be that Tarlokk was overstepping his bounds in ordering the raid.)
*** The bust isn't about chi-blocking being illegal, it's about shutting down a training camp for insurgents who have publicly declared war on part of the population. It's not what they're teaching, it's why.
*** But it still sends a very violent and agressive message to non-benders; you are not allowed to defend yourself. Since non-bending methods of fighting seem to be rare and slightly elite, chi-blocking is probably the only option for non-benders who want protection. Violently assaulting arresting people for wanting a self-defence method is bad, no matter the intent. It just tells non-benders that Amon was right and the Council doesn't want them to fight back.
*** No, it sends the message that if you want to take the risk of training with the wanted criminals, you get what you deserve. Now, if they were shutting down a dojo that is being run with city approval, it'd be an entirely different story. This training area was meant to be a secret and is explicitly training soldiers. The only message it sends is that the city won't tolerate a growing revolutionary presence in its midst.
*** So? You are still illegalizing the only really effective method for non-benders to defend themselves (And there is absolutely no indication the government of Republic City allows dojo's to teach it), by doing so you are saying that Amon is right to oppose the city government as they are directly stopping attempts by non-benders to defend themselves.
*** There's no indication that it is illegal to be taught. The chi-blockers obviously learned from someone before they turned violent. I don't understand how you keep failing to grasp a simple concept. '''This is a training camp for insurgents.''' What part of that are you not understanding? It's not "free chi-blocking classes", it's "help overthrow the bending establishment." Would you join a terrorist group for shooting lessons, then act offended when you got arrested? Of course not, that'd be your own damn fault. If they want to defend themselves, they can take a class from people who haven't waged war on an entire section of the population. Seriously, stop trying to act like it's the material being targeted. It is nothing of the sort. It is the people doing the teaching and why that is under fire, and nothing more than that.
*** Amon's people are the only ones who teach chi-blocking (that we know of) and its hard to believe that any group teaching chi-blocking wouldn't be immediately grouped with them as a result. My real question is when it started being legal to take down Equalist cells, their advocate in the first episode didn't seem to worry about getting arrested.
*** Freedom of speech is a far cry from militarization, and Amon very recently declared war on bending itself. The training camp was training recruits for battle. The protestor is just talking.
*** The Equalists can argue, accurately even, that chi-blocking is a purely defensive despite all of Amon's rhetoric about a revolution (lots of real world countries have politicians who use that kind of talk without their followers being hunted down).
*** What they claim is ''can'' be used for doesn't change what they ''are'' using it for. They've already attacked several benders. Criminals or not, they've proven their intentions to be less than noble. That kind of spin-doctoring doesn't work for revolutionaries. Politicians can only get away with it because they have the clout. Amon doesn't have that.
*** Whether any of this is correct is probably beside the point. Anyone who is at all sympathetic to the Equalist position is going to see jackbooted benders taking away their constitutional right to bear electro-sticks, and Amon will be spinning it as exactly that.
*** I was under the impression that the camp was attacked because of the amon posters, indicating them as members of the equalists, not because they were learning chi-blocking.
[[/folder]]









[[folder: Why doesn't anyone use armor or padding?]]
It's pretty clear that chi blocking uses strikes to specific parts of the body. Why has no one, thus far, thought to wear any sort of protection over those body parts? ESPECIALLY someone like Korra, who has been taken down by Equalists more than once AND is a high-profile target?
* Look again. Tarrlok's entire taskforce,
[[Headscratchers/TheLegendOfKorraMisc Misc Headscratchers]] (currently including Korra, indeed wear padded armour on chi-blockers, the job. It's just that ArmorIsUseless; maybe the important pressure points are in the areas of the body that can't be covered with too dense material without sacrificing vital mobility? Wearing armour in everyday life is incredibly uncomfortable show's format, and over time even physically debilitating. It's better to stay agile and learn not to be hit.
** The task force units looked more fancy than useful. And note that, where they actually are wearing what could be armor, not a single Seperatist lands a blow, not even with their shock batons. And even assuming that the task force suits are armored... why didn't Korra wear it when going to confront Amon in "The Voice in the Dark." Of course, Korra was carrying a giant IdiotBall during that part, so that might have been the point of not wearing it.
*** Korra may of felt the armor was limiting her mobility, and she was expecting a one on one fight with Amon. A bit of an idiot ball for thinking he would be dumb enough to go alone, but still it might of not of been for not wearing armor.
*** Either way, Ty Lee's chi-blocking worked fine on Earth Kingdom soldiers in the original series. ArmorIsUseless, so better to preserve mobility.
*** However, in Episode 6, it's explicitly stated that the Metalbender police's armor is capable of blocking chi-blocker attacks, though they're essentially wearing plate armor.
** It's actually a bit of FridgeBrilliance, since most bends need to be extremely mobile and need a wide range of movement in order to fully take advantage of their bending abilities. Heavy armor would merely impair their movements and therefore directly impact their bending ability.
* The Metalbending Police ''do'' wear armor that guards the chakras. That's why the Equalists also carry electro-sticks. That said, waterbending or especially airbending in armor is probably next to impossible unless you're skilled enough to [[AssJokeAproposOfNothing bend by flexing your butt cheeks]] or something similar.
[[/folder]]



[[folder: What happens when a non-Bender dies?]]
The Avatar is explicitly reincarnated, and there is a Spirit World that I presume holds the rest of the dead people in some form or another, but bending is also a spiritual connection as well as a power. Non-Benders don't have that. So do they still end up in the same place as Benders when they die?
* The Avatar is a special case. Aside from animals, we've never seen a single human in the spirit world that wasn't an Avatar. It stands to reason the afterlife is all-inclusive, and Avatars are the ones being short-changed.
** I figured that everyone was reincarnated, and only the Avatar has access to his/her past lives.
[[/folder]]









[[folder: What happened to the spectators in the stadium?]]
We have a stadium full of excited spectators. In many cases, fans of sports teams are willing to literally kill you if their team loses. Why on earth, spectators stood still? We are talking about people who can shoot fire from their hands and they are watching their favorite team being tortured right before their eyes Are they so frightened by a lot of tasers that are not able to defend their team?

The second strange thing that happens is that when Korra ends her fight on the roof and back into the stadium there's nobody left. Is it possible to evacuate a building of that size so quickly? It's almost as if the writers were not sure what the hell to do with those people.
* Korra's fight lasts a while, long enough for everyone to pour out the exits. As for the behavior, they may not be at the "riot over a loss" stage of sports devotion.
** Large buildings are also designed with lots of exits (which we know the arena has, the Equalists are shown getting through them). You can evacuate enormous stadiums in less than a minute. Still you'd think the Equalists would want witnesses.
*** They did. The audience was forced to stay there while Amon was giving his speech. Only when the Equalists were making their exit did the audience flee.
* The creators are Americans, we don't have deadly riots over sports as a regular occurrence over here. You're also underestimating how scared of the Equalists people are. Amon has spent a long time building up his revolution.
* Tenzin didn't join Lin and Korra in the battle against Amon, so I assumed he was helping to evacuate the crowd. Mako and Bolin may also have assisted; Mako would certainly have wanted to make sure Asami was safe.
* We aren't talking about a group of people who stormed the ring because they hated a team or something. This was a terrorist organization! Most people aren't going to exactly be leaping to try and take on a threat like Amon, especially when he can take away their bending so easily.
* How would they access the arena? If they just shoot fire from where they're sitting, they'd risk hitting the team members, not to mention other spectators. Maybe the waterbenders could have conjured a flood, but again, risk of injuring the team, not to mention that a coordinated attack would have been difficult, not to mention that the guys with the gloves would have stopped any such attempt in a second. And would you really like to be the one person that Amon singles out from the crowd? Also, don't forget the police force. Most likely, people relied on them and considered themselves safe. Once all policemen started dropping like flies, they probably realised that their chances aren't strong. ALSO, most of them probably don't know how to fight. Remember, it's a time of peace. I'd imagine that most of them are as capable as someone who's been to some self-defence classes. You might be able to fight off a mugger, but it's not exactly a case of MuggingTheMonster.
* Not all pro-bending fans are benders. In fact, that was the whole reason for Amon's attack. Non-benders were lifting up benders as sports heroes.
[[/folder]]





[[folder: Why were all these people killed by firebenders?]]
Supposedly, Mako and Bolin's parents, Amon's family, and Sato's wife were all murdered by firebenders. Other benders can be killers too, so why have the writers used firebenders for each of them? Something's not adding up.
* Probably simply because the previous generation was still suffering from the aftereffects of the 100-Year War, and because the United Republic consists of the former Fire Kingdom colonies. It makes sense that the Firebenders were the most common type of Bender in the region until the recent times.
** Compare the many movie villains that have a German accent. A firebending is probably still seen as more evil than other forms of bending. This, I think, is why Amon says that his parents were murdered by a firebender. For the rest... It could be a plot point in the coming series, or a red herring.
* Firebenders can kill a lot easier, and cleaner, than other benders can.
** Not really...creative benders could find plenty of ways to kill quickly and easily. A clever and malicious water bender could easily drown their opponent, and then take the water with them afterwards, leaving no evidence afterwards; no mess. Earthbending probably would be messier, but a rock at full speed applied to just the right spot on the head will still kill instantly. It seems strange that firebenders are still the only rampant killers these days...unless, of course, all the attacks are connected somehow.
*** Drowning takes a lot longer than killing with fire would, and it's doubtful every earthbender could kill so efficiently.
*** Or they could make a spear or a blade out of water. Ice can have sharp edges, and can cut with them (I should know, I cut my finger on a jagged piece of ice once)
*** Smashing people in the head with rocks is a vastly easier method of murder than causing them to die of severe burns. If Zuko had taken a fist sized chunk of stone to the head rather than a blast of fire he would have been brain damaged or dead rather than scarred.
*** Or maybe they just electrocuted them, given that lightning bending is so much more widespread these days. That would be the easiest and fastest method. Nobody said anything about using fire.
*** A powerful waterbender could easily kill someone by [[NightmareFuel by clotting or freezing the blood in their veins or arteries]], which if done in the right place (e.g., the brain) could kill the victim within seconds or minutes, and leave no evidence behind (or plenty of space to plant false evidence).
*** But that's bloodbending. Yakone may well have done that a few times, but overall almost no one has that ability.
* You have to remember that Fire is the one element that is based almost entirely on offensive moves. Also Water and Earth, while they certainly can kill you, don't strike fear into the hearts of people the way Fire does so Fire is the logical choice, not to mention there is still the stigma from 100-Year War as previously mentioned
* As a whole, Firebenders tend to be more aggressive and more prone to resorting to violence to solve their problems, since that's part of the philosophy of their training. Also, since the Fire Nation technically lost the previous war, and Zuko has made attempts to make it a more peaceful nation, you can bet that there are thousands of disenfranchised Fire Nation soldiers who were suddenly out of a job, and their bitterness carried on to the next generation.
* Seemed to me like foreshadowing. Chances are we'll find out at some later point in the show that it was the same firebender in all cases.
* I read a theory on a message board that in fact all of these murders are the work of a waterbender called Alfred Firebender, and he is just commonly referred to as A. Firebender.
* That's only three instances. It is not statistically significant.
** If we were talking about real life then that would absolutely be the case. But this a story, and when events repeat themselves in a story it's usually for a reason.
*** The incidents are also removed from each other in time. Twelve years ago an unspecified number of Agni Kai Triad firebenders broke into the Sato mansion and killed Mrs. Sato. Ten years ago, a firebender mugged Mako and Bolin's parents. Depending on the veracity of Amon's statements, the incident that forced him to wear a mask could be anywhere from twenty to forty years ago. If the writers are attempting to lace these facts with any sort of meaning, they are burying it very deep indeed.
* We also donít know the details of how all these incidents happened (correct me if Iím wrong; Iíve only seen all the episodes once), so itís possible that one or more of these murders were done not by firebenders but by others who took advantage of residual anti-Fire Nation sentiment to make it look like a firebending incident.
* It turns out that [[spoiler:Only two of those attacks actually happened Amon's backstory was a complete fabrication, he was actually secretly a bender]]
* Which leads to another question, Hiroshi lost his wife to a Firebender but why did he blamed Earthbenders and Waterbenders as well? Instead of generalizing that all benders are bad, he should've developed a hatred towards Firebenders only.
** Remember: This is the guy who went on a MotiveRant about how Amon was going to end bender oppression and make things a better, more just world for Asami and everybody (who isn't a bender), while apparently forgetting that he's the richest person in the biggest, most advanced city in the world. Oppressing him would take some doing.
*** Considering how he started out in poverty and became something of a self-made man in spite of it, it wouldn't be hard to imagine that Sato might have had the bender grudge from much earlier in life. The murder of his wife would have just pushed him over the edge.
[[/folder]]


[[folder: Power Level Math does not work out at all.]]
So...thus far we have two EliteMooks who defeat Mako + Korra in a straight-up fight. One Equalist Lieutenant who defeats Mako + Bolin in a straight-up fight before getting blindsided by Korra. And now, as of Episode 7, Asami can defeat the Equalist LT in a straight-up fight? How does that power differential even work? Sure, there was a "self-defense classes" handwave, but the LT would very likely have had just as much training if not more, and it's not like bending moves (being the exact same movements as several real-life martial arts) are much different from h2h combat when you remove the elemental part of it, so how exactly is Asami that much better than Mako, Bolin, or Korra at melee?
* The Lieutenant likely assumed that Asami was just a normal girl and would be easy to take down. She proved him wrong. Basically, when he fought Mako and Bolin, he was fighting for real. When he attacked Asami, he just expected to quickly incapacitate her in a single strike.
* Anyone can make the same motions as a professional boxer that doesn't mean they can actually fight like one. Mako, Bolin, and Korra know how to stop bending from hurting them not fists, the defenses are completely different.
* "Power Level Math" is an utterly, completely false premise, for a start. Unlike Dragonball Z, no, there is no definite scale that determines who will or will not win a given fight of ''any'' kind. There are any number of factors that will tilt the odds in the favor of one side or another in any kind of conflict, regardless of who they are. Just boiling it down to who's fighting doesn't mean a damn thing.\\\
Because the Lieutenant beat Mako and Bolin once doesn't mean he always will. Nor does it mean he will automatically beat anyone those two have beaten. All it means is that he beat Mako and Bolin once. Him getting [=KOed=] by Asami doesn't mean Asami is an unstoppable badass who's better than the rest of the cast; all it means is he got [=KOed=] by Asami.
* And lets not forget that the Lieutnant has been trained exclusively to fight against Benders, as indeed are Mako, Bolin and Korra. Asami, on the other hand, seems to be trained to fight against martial artists in general.
** That was my thought as well. The Equalists are specifically trained to contend against bending-style martial arts; of course they have an advantage over the cast's benders. But Asami has been getting general martial arts training from a very young age, likely from multiple different teachers--and probably from Equalist teachers, as well, since I see no reason Sato wouldn't want her to have a head-start on that for when and if she was ever brought into the fold. She probably has more sustained martial arts experience than a number of the normal Equalists. Beating the Lieutenant can probably be explained as a combination of his surprise, her speed, and possible unwillingness on his part to use especially harsh force against the daughter of the dude who just built you all these big mecha that are standing around.
* Asami attacked him with electricity -- something none of his other opponents were seen using against him. It was as effective when used against him as it was when he used it against the other opponents we saw.
* ''And'' you have to factor in that the Krew just isn't very good at actual combat. Spectator sport brawling? They're beast. Actual life-or-death struggle? They're meat.
[[/folder]]





[[folder: Why did they not take out the mechas with more powerful Earthbending, or Airbending? They were all holding back except Lin.]]
They were in an underground bunker, the floor was all earth and some powerful earthbending moves like the ones Toph used would have sent the mecha into the walls or buried them in the ground, with enough force to knock out their drivers. A large boulder shot used in the last series could have smashed one of them to pieces. Air was powerful enough to rattle Sato's mecha and very powerful air blast/explosion or a cutting move like the one Aang used could have severely damaged a mech or toppled it. But since Airbenders always fight defensively, they never fight without inhibitions. Lin was devastating when it comes to fighting and was the only one who took out a mech, because she was really fighting to kill. It didn't occur to anybody but her that the Mecha's glass canopy is easily damaged. It appears that the metalbender cops are overly reliant on their cables and the Equalists took advantage of their weakness.

Doesn't it really seem like all the benders are holding back their best moves?
* I attribute it to surprise and not knowing what they were dealing with, so they stuck with the techniques familiar to them, then didn't last long enough to get their thoughts together and pull out the big guns. For example, Korra started out by throwing fire as she usually does. When that proved ineffective she switched to earth, but got taken out before she could do much with it. Next time they face the mechas they'll be better prepared.
** There were a lot of them as well, and they had the heroes flanked. Big fancy moves are best suited to fighting a single opponent who's counter attacks you can closely guard against. As for Korra's firebending, that was stupid yes, but she always opens up with firebending. At least she quickly worked out that wasn't working very well. As for the metal benders, they're just not trained in those sort of moves. That's like training cops in anti tank weaponry, expensive and pointless.
** I can buy them getting caught flatfooted by an unexpected enemy... But seriously, we've all seen footage of cops pulling out the stops when faced with that kind of firepower. That their training inhibited them to that degree in the heat of battle, in a place where cutting loose was not only justified, but mandated? In a situation where basic earthbending moves like pilar raising would've served them far better? Ruling on the field stands: ForgotAboutHisPowers[=/=]IdiotBall combo.
** Oooooorrrrr, the cops just aren't very good at regular Earthbending on the fly. Their training might, in fact, be almost entirely metalbending, given how much they rely on it.\\\
Also, don't discount training. Do you know what training is really for? It's not just techniques and protocols. It's conditioning. It's training your body such that when your mind is scared and you're unable to think, you can keep acting on what has become instinct. I.e., when you're scared and facing something like those mecha, chances are that you are going to be doing the rote techniques that you've had drilled into you for years instead of getting creative and fancy. That is how armies have worked for pretty much all of human history.\\\
It's not IdiotBall, it's people who have been trained for years falling back on that training when they're in a tense situation and borderline panicking.
** You don't want to inadvertently cause a cave-in and wind up killing yourselves in the process. Earthbenders might be most dangerous underground, but they are also vulnerable to being buried with the enemy in the process.
[[/folder]]










[[folder: Episodes? Season Finale?]]
I may have heard wrong, but according to the commercial, the Season Finale is next week, a One-Hour season finale. Cool, i'm excited, don't get me wrong, but one hour? that's two episodes, right? which means, after next week, the series will be at 11 episodes. I thought it was supposed to be twelve. I guess its possible to fit three episodes in an hour, but it doesn't seem likely given how many commercials will be involved. So, was an episode cancelled, did Nick just screw up, or did i just miscount?
* No, the season finale is being advertised coming out in 23rd of June, two weeks from now. Next week is still business as usual. They're just advertising early.
* Good, thanks for clearing that up for me. I think i'd go through withdraws if they cut an episode.
** At least I ''think'' this is the case. I got no confirmation either, but at least there has been no hint of leaving out next week's episode in any source I know. Our own wiki tells that Turning the Tides will come out in June 16th.
** Many people seem to believe there won't be an episode next week. Good job, Nick. I think that promo was more harmful than no promo at all like the last couple of weeks.
[[/folder]]





[[folder: Why is everybody so lightly dressed?]]
The only thing coming close to a reasonable outfit is Lin's coat.
* She had time to change, they did not.
** It's less about that, it's their choice of wardrobe in the first place. It's winter, and they're wearing the same things they are wearing all the time. Korra, of course, is the worst offender, leaving the house like that. The Satomobiles aren't exactly warm and cozy either, which would have explained why Bolin and Mako don't put on more clothes.
* Korra use to live in the South Pole. She's probably use to the cold. Mako, Bolin, And Asami didn't have time to change what with breaking out of jail and all. Tenzin's cloths seem pretty warm. (Don't quite remember what he was wearing.)
* Tenzin has the excuse of being an airbender. Aang seemed just fine in both Poles with his regular clothes; fandom is that he used airbending to insulate himself. Tenzin would have learned the technique from his father. As for Mako and Bolin, remember they lived as orphans on the streets; they know how to deal with being in winter weather without proper clothing.
* Korra and Mako are firebenders; they don't need heavy clothing to keep warm. Asami and Bolin are reasonably well dressed; judging from the copious snowfall, it can't be much below freezing, if at all. Thick snow only falls in relatively warm winter weather.
[[/folder]]




[[folder: Why wasn't Yakone in solitary after that stunt he pulled?]]
He somehow had the opportunity to beget Tarrlok 4 years later, despite receiving a life sentence for 12 counts of bloodbending and proceeding to bloodbend the entire courtroom to resist being sent to jail, and then bloodbends the Avatar with intent to kill. That seems like it merits the sentence being upgraded to life in prison with no human contact (and only because they don't have the death penalty out of respect for Aang), except the people who will bring his meals, who are in turn forbidden to speak to him.
* Sounds like you're expecting Republic City prisons to be as cruel as Fire Nation prisons in the original series. It's not unlikely that the influence of Aang/Katara/etc made the retributive system in Republic City more humane, and things like conjugal visits were allowed in their prisons, which would've made Tarrlok's conception possible. Since Aang took Yakone's bending away, he wasn't considered dangerous anymore, so he wouldn't have needed to be kept in solitary. That, or Yakone simply escaped from prison, and catching him wasn't a high priority anymore because he'd lost his bloodbending, so he managed to find a wife and live the rest of his life in hiding.
* Because they're not evil scum who want to drive their prisoners insane? Even Ozai wasn't given such treatment.
* Aang says he's 40 years old in the flashback which means that as stated it is 42 years ago, he dies 26 years later and Korra is now 16. According to the Welcome to Republic City game Tarrlok is 37. He was born when his father was in prison.
** Or Tarrlok's listed age is wrong or represents a lie he's told. A fit man in his forties could pass as 37, especially one as vain as Tarrlock.
** Could easily be a lie. Tarrlock does bare a resemblance to Yakone after all...if anyone brought attention to it, he could just make an offhand comment that he was born after Yakone was already in jail and the matter would drop.
** Or maybe Yakone was broken out of prison. He did have a criminal empire.
** It's possible that the background people, like JK Rowling, can't do math, and Tarrlock isn't supposed to have been born after Yakone went to prison.
** The math assumes the Avatar is reborn right away, which may not be the case. Alternatively, considering the catastrophic emotional consequences of removing someone's bending, the council may have amended his sentence on the grounds that he has "suffered enough" and is no longer a threat.
*** A previous episode specifically states that Yakone was defeated 42 years ago.
**** Considering the fact that nobody knew Tarrlock was Yakone's son, I would say that Tarrlock is older than 42 and lied about his age along with his parentage.
**** Same troper as above, I stay corrected. The real answer is that Yakone escaped.
[[/folder]]
















[[folder: How did Shiro Shinobi know Tarrlok was the one who kidnapped Korra?]]
And if he had used his old IntrepidReporter skills to find out, how did Tarrlok's cover story work? Would the truth not have been broadcast on the radio for all to hear?
* The "Previously On" segments are clearly not happening in-universe. I'm simply amazed that someone could have come to the conclusion they were. Just...''wow'', I seriously cannot understand how this is being asked for a second time.
* The confusion probably stems from the fact that, in the preview of the seventh episode, Tarrlok was the voice over and in the previous episode Shiro was attack, and Tarrlok's voice over is clearly in-universe. So to be fair, it's not completely unbelievable that someone would be confused.
** It is also the only time that the voice over has mentioned information that wouldn't have realistically be available to the public.
*** So who Mako and Korra have crushes on--that they've never told anyone about--is information available to the public, too?
**** [[EveryoneCanSeeIt There's a trope for that.]]
[[/folder]]












[[folder:Yakone's escape]]
* Forget solitary, how did Yakone get out of jail in order to start a new life in the North Pole?
** They explicitly said that some of his criminal buddies broke him out. He was the head of a vast criminal empire. Exactly why they broke him out when he was stripped of his bending abilities, who knows? Maybe he had assets that the next gang leader could use, and only he knew where to get them, or maybe he simply possessed a level of fanatical devotion in his subordinates (maybe its in the blood) that they didn't care about his bending status.
[[/folder]]







[[folder: Was Korra originally meant to be a six-hour long movie?]]
Is it me, or unlike ATLA, they've pretty much wrapped it up here, with Korra becoming a Fully realized Avatar? Was it actually meant to go on for only one season until late in production?
* Yes. It was originally supposed to be a one season miniseries, but they got a second season while the first one was alredy in production.
[[/folder]]



















[[folder:What happened to the North Pole?]]
More specifically, the Northern Water Tribe. The first series showed it to be a relatively large place with a design similar to Venice, Italy. Yet when we see it in Taarlok's flashback story, it's comparable to what we saw of the Southern Water Tribe back in "The Boy in the Iceberg". And considering it's only ever referred to as ''the'' Northern Water Tribe, there seems to be no indication it would be some sort of outpost town or settlement.
* Is there any actual reason to believe it ''wasn't'' some sort of outpost town or settlement?
* Yeah. The Northern Water Tribe is just the name of the whole tribe, like the Zulu. Just because the Zulu are referred by a common tribe name doesn't mean they all live in the same city.
* The Northern Water Tribe we saw was one after 100 years of war--a fortification made for defense. At the time, yes, that was probably where the entire Tribe lived--but after the war ended and the danger of Fire Nation soldiers attacking and abducting people was gone, it makes sense that they would expand into other settlements.
[[/folder]]













----
misc. cosmology)
[[/index]]
14th Aug '12 2:08:24 PM ccoa
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* [[Headscratchers/TheLegendOfKorraGovernmentAndLaw Government and Law]]














[[folder: Are we ever going to see Republic City call for help in dealing with The Equalists?]]
This would seem to be a situation tailor-made for a group of non-bender combatants to at least come in and consult with Republic City's law enforcement. Like, say... the Kyoshi Warriors (assuming they're still around, of course). For that matter, wouldn't word have gotten out about the Equalists by now, and the other three nations would've probably made inquiries about how they could help (if for no other reason than to keep the Equalist movement from spreading to their territories)?
* It's mostly a matter of politics and perception. The Equalists are the United Republic's mess, and having to call in foreign countries to bail them out of that mess would be deeply politically embarrassing. It would at the ''very least'' destroy the council's reputation, painting members like Tarrlok as failures. It would also run the risk of boosting the standing of the Equalists among the Republic's citizenry. Internal domestic disputes are one thing, but foreign troops would sharpen the battle lines: "The Equalists might be scum, but they're OUR scum."
* One has to remember that while the Equalists were being taken seriously they were not seen as something that couldn't be contained in the city, it was only in the last two episodes that they realized just how big of a threat the Equalists truly are.
* It is mentioned in the Welcome to Republic City interactive game that the Kyoshi Warriors are still around.
* Yes. In "Turning the Tides," Tenzin calls the United Forces fleet to help them.

to:










[[folder: Are we ever going Episodes? Season Finale?]]
I may have heard wrong, but according
to see Republic City call for help in dealing with The Equalists?]]
This would seem
the commercial, the Season Finale is next week, a One-Hour season finale. Cool, i'm excited, don't get me wrong, but one hour? that's two episodes, right? which means, after next week, the series will be at 11 episodes. I thought it was supposed to be a situation tailor-made twelve. I guess its possible to fit three episodes in an hour, but it doesn't seem likely given how many commercials will be involved. So, was an episode cancelled, did Nick just screw up, or did i just miscount?
* No, the season finale is being advertised coming out in 23rd of June, two weeks from now. Next week is still business as usual. They're just advertising early.
* Good, thanks
for a group of non-bender combatants to clearing that up for me. I think i'd go through withdraws if they cut an episode.
** At least I ''think'' this is the case. I got no confirmation either, but
at least there has been no hint of leaving out next week's episode in any source I know. Our own wiki tells that Turning the Tides will come out in and consult with Republic City's law enforcement. Like, say... the Kyoshi Warriors (assuming they're still around, of course). For June 16th.
** Many people seem to believe there won't be an episode next week. Good job, Nick. I think
that matter, wouldn't word have gotten out about the Equalists by now, and the other three nations would've probably made inquiries about how they could help (if for no other reason promo was more harmful than to keep the Equalist movement from spreading to their territories)?
* It's mostly a matter of politics and perception. The Equalists are the United Republic's mess, and having to call in foreign countries to bail them out of that mess would be deeply politically embarrassing. It would
no promo at the ''very least'' destroy the council's reputation, painting members all like Tarrlok as failures. It would also run the risk of boosting the standing of the Equalists among the Republic's citizenry. Internal domestic disputes are one thing, but foreign troops would sharpen the battle lines: "The Equalists might be scum, but they're OUR scum."
* One has to remember that while the Equalists were being taken seriously they were not seen as something that couldn't be contained in the city, it was only in
the last two episodes that they realized just how big couple of a threat the Equalists truly are.
* It is mentioned in the Welcome to Republic City interactive game that the Kyoshi Warriors are still around.
* Yes. In "Turning the Tides," Tenzin calls the United Forces fleet to help them.
weeks.









[[folder: The ruling council of Republic City... Really?]]
A city of the size and importance of Republic City only as a five-member ruling council? Mayberry had more councilors than that! Not to mention there doesn't seem to be any non-bender on the council. That's a serious oversight in the best of times. And this is beside the fact that the members other than Tarrlok and Tenzin don't seem to have a collective spine between the three of them.
* I think that's kind of the point. The republic of nations was set up as the representation of an ideal, rather than as an actual, practical government. It symbolizes the nations coming together, so all the nations should get a representative. All nations should be treated equally, so they got an equal amount of representation (and Katara and Sokka probably insisted that they shouldn't be lumped in with the northern water tribe). I doubt anyone in the gaang actually considered any long-term consequences when they were organising the city. It's indeed a stupid way to organise a country, but it is one I can see the gaang, especially aang making.
* The size of the ruling Council is not unrealistic. The Swiss equivalent, the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_Federal_Council Swiss Federal Council]] is not much larger.
* Um...OP, that's the point. The Equalists aren't completely wrong. Everyone on the council is a bender, they're not elected officals, not to mention, since they're each from a different nation presumably most of them lived in that nation until chosen as a council member (the exception being Tenzin). They're bringing in values and opinions that may not work in a place Republic City. It's like if the Governor of Texas was from Alaska.
* Remember that Republic City is just that, a city, and it has inhereted its politics from three monarchies and the loose confederation of tribes in the South. Five people sharing ultimate descision making power is probably quite large enormous by their standards.
* In the flashbacks, City Hall is full of people, with Aang sitting at one of the lower tables, occupying no special place. In the current time, five people sit in the middle of the giant, conspicuously empty hall, with no one around, not even a secretary to record minutes. Something seems to have happened that drastically altered the structure of government after the city's founding.
** Actually, it's more likely that the flashbacks are part of a trial. Specifically, Yakone's trial. The big room with the lines of benches that Korra threw Tarlok into before he started bloodbending? Yeah, it's that room.
* Did we ever actually get confirmation that everyone on the council is a bender?
** Tarrlok's speech in The Voice in the Night wouldn't be as effective if his audience had contained non-benders.
** And it's hard to imagine non-benders voting for the non-bender curfew law.
** It seems likely that the current Council only has benders on it but flashbacks indicate that it isn't a requirement, otherwise [[spoiler:Sokka]] could never have been a member.
*** Added to that, look two seats to the right of Sokka--there's someone wearing Air Nomad robes, who also couldn't be a bender.
*** Being the brother-in-law and chosen proxy (If he'd wanted to, Aang could've been on the Council) of a borderline deity (The Avatar) probably helped in that regard, and it's certainly possible that things have become more pro-bender and anti-nonbender since Aang's death.
* What's so wrong with there being only 5 councilors? Republic city isn't all that big (Well, compared to most other cities it is very large, but not when compared with nations, which are ruled by 1 person (Earth King, Fire Lord, Water... umm.... King). Omashu, which is of fairly comparable size, was ruled by Bumi all by himself. That said, I do agree that they should likely include a non-bender or two (to make the number odd to prevent deadlock) to the council. If Amon wasn't... well, Amon and the equalists had had a proper leader, that would have been a more likely course of action for them.
** What's so wrong with there being only five councilors is that The United Republic isn't just Republic City. The council is supposed to be passing laws for an entire nation, not just one city, and five people isn't enough for that sort of task.

to:

\n\n\n\n\n\n[[folder: Why is everybody so lightly dressed?]]
The ruling council of Republic City... Really?]]
A city of the size and importance of Republic City
only as a five-member ruling council? Mayberry had more councilors than that! Not to mention there doesn't seem to be any non-bender on the council. That's a serious oversight in the best of times. And this is beside the fact that the members other than Tarrlok and Tenzin don't seem to have a collective spine between the three of them.
* I think that's kind of the point. The republic of nations was set up as the representation of an ideal, rather than as an actual, practical government. It symbolizes the nations
thing coming together, so all the nations should get close to a representative. All nations should be treated equally, so reasonable outfit is Lin's coat.
* She had time to change,
they got an equal amount of representation (and Katara and Sokka probably insisted that they shouldn't be lumped in with the northern water tribe). I doubt anyone in the gaang actually considered any long-term consequences when they were organising the city. did not.
**
It's indeed a stupid way to organise a country, but it is one I can see less about that, it's their choice of wardrobe in the gaang, especially aang making.
* The size of the ruling Council is not unrealistic. The Swiss equivalent, the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_Federal_Council Swiss Federal Council]] is not much larger.
* Um...OP, that's the point. The Equalists aren't completely wrong. Everyone on the council is a bender,
first place. It's winter, and they're not elected officals, not to mention, since they're each from a different nation presumably most of them lived in that nation until chosen as a council member (the exception being Tenzin). They're bringing in values and opinions that may not work in a place Republic City. It's like if the Governor of Texas was from Alaska.
* Remember that Republic City is just that, a city, and it has inhereted its politics from three monarchies and the loose confederation of tribes in the South. Five people sharing ultimate descision making power is probably quite large enormous by their standards.
* In the flashbacks, City Hall is full of people, with Aang sitting at one of the lower tables, occupying no special place. In the current time, five people sit in the middle of the giant, conspicuously empty hall, with no one around, not even a secretary to record minutes. Something seems to have happened that drastically altered the structure of government after the city's founding.
** Actually, it's more likely that the flashbacks are part of a trial. Specifically, Yakone's trial. The big room with the lines of benches that Korra threw Tarlok into before he started bloodbending? Yeah, it's that room.
* Did we ever actually get confirmation that everyone on the council is a bender?
** Tarrlok's speech in The Voice in the Night wouldn't be as effective if his audience had contained non-benders.
** And it's hard to imagine non-benders voting for the non-bender curfew law.
** It seems likely that the current Council only has benders on it but flashbacks indicate that it isn't a requirement, otherwise [[spoiler:Sokka]] could never have been a member.
*** Added to that, look two seats to the right of Sokka--there's someone
wearing Air Nomad robes, who also couldn't be a bender.
*** Being
the brother-in-law and chosen proxy (If he'd wanted to, Aang could've been on the Council) of a borderline deity (The Avatar) probably helped in that regard, and it's certainly possible that same things have become more pro-bender they are wearing all the time. Korra, of course, is the worst offender, leaving the house like that. The Satomobiles aren't exactly warm and anti-nonbender since Aang's death.
* What's so wrong with there being only 5 councilors? Republic city isn't all that big (Well, compared to most other cities it is very large, but not when compared with nations,
cozy either, which are ruled by 1 person (Earth King, Fire Lord, Water... umm.... King). Omashu, which is of fairly comparable size, was ruled by Bumi all by himself. That said, I do agree that they should likely include a non-bender or two (to make the number odd to prevent deadlock) to the council. If Amon wasn't... well, Amon and the equalists had had a proper leader, that would have been a explained why Bolin and Mako don't put on more likely course of action for them.
** What's so wrong
clothes.
* Korra use to live in the South Pole. She's probably use to the cold. Mako, Bolin, And Asami didn't have time to change what
with there breaking out of jail and all. Tenzin's cloths seem pretty warm. (Don't quite remember what he was wearing.)
* Tenzin has the excuse of
being only five councilors an airbender. Aang seemed just fine in both Poles with his regular clothes; fandom is that The United Republic isn't just Republic City. The council is supposed he used airbending to be passing laws insulate himself. Tenzin would have learned the technique from his father. As for an entire nation, not just one city, Mako and five people isn't enough for that sort of task.Bolin, remember they lived as orphans on the streets; they know how to deal with being in winter weather without proper clothing.
* Korra and Mako are firebenders; they don't need heavy clothing to keep warm. Asami and Bolin are reasonably well dressed; judging from the copious snowfall, it can't be much below freezing, if at all. Thick snow only falls in relatively warm winter weather.



[[folder: Why is there only one Earthbending councilor?]]
Much like the the Headscracther above, I also question why the council is set up the way it is. But for me I have to wonder why the earthbenders only have one representative? It is understandable why fire and air only have one. (Both have small populations.) And it is also understandable why the water tribes have two representatives. They are two nations and thus they need representatives from each nation. But the Earth Kingdom is a massive country with many different regions and probably the largest population out of all the nations. Plus, they even have a population of water benders (the swamp folks) and firebenders (those who came during the war and never left). You'd think they'd at least have two representatives like the water tribes?
* The Earth Kingdom is evidently still a kingdom, with a single ruler, so the representative is a representative of the Earth King.
** The Earth Kingdom probably doesn't recognize any Earth Kingdom territory that wasn't reorganized into the United Republic of nations as a separate entity, and any would-be independent Earth nations probably don't have the strength or influence to get a seat on the Council, as they probably would be hedged out by the Earth Kingdom. The Southern Water Tribe meanwhile probably gained a huge amount of influence due to two of their members being major players in ending the war, allowing them to be independently represented.
** Unlike the isolationist Northern Water Tribe, the South ''helped'' the Earth Kingdom during the war by providing it with a small but effective naval force. Perhaps the Earth Kingdom went ''quid pro quo'' post-war, repaying the debt by lobbying for the South to get a seat.
* Also the Fire Nation members who came and never left were formed into the United Republic of Nations, which Republic City was the capital of.
* The US Senate has two representatives for each state - the same number for Wyoming (568K people) and California (38M people, over 66 times as many) - and they have several exclusive powers the House does not. At the time the US Constitution was drafted, none of the less populated states would settle for a pure proportional representation scheme, due to fear of being marginalized by more populated areas with very different political interests. I think the analogy is appropriate here.
** The US also created the House of Representatives because the Senate system alone was completely unacceptable, although including that would make their politics much more complex without adding anything to the show.

to:




[[folder: Why is there only one Earthbending councilor?]]
Much like the the Headscracther above, I also question why the council is set up the way it is. But for me I have to wonder why the earthbenders only have one representative? It is understandable why fire and air only have one. (Both have small populations.) And it is also understandable why the water tribes have two representatives. They are two nations and thus they need representatives from each nation. But the Earth Kingdom is a massive country with many different regions and probably the largest population out of all the nations. Plus, they even have a population of water benders (the swamp folks) and firebenders (those who came during the war and never left). You'd think they'd at least have two representatives like the water tribes?
* The Earth Kingdom is evidently still a kingdom, with a single ruler, so the representative is a representative of the Earth King.
** The Earth Kingdom probably doesn't recognize any Earth Kingdom territory that
wasn't reorganized into Yakone in solitary after that stunt he pulled?]]
He somehow had
the United Republic opportunity to beget Tarrlok 4 years later, despite receiving a life sentence for 12 counts of nations as a separate entity, bloodbending and any would-be independent Earth nations probably proceeding to bloodbend the entire courtroom to resist being sent to jail, and then bloodbends the Avatar with intent to kill. That seems like it merits the sentence being upgraded to life in prison with no human contact (and only because they don't have the strength or death penalty out of respect for Aang), except the people who will bring his meals, who are in turn forbidden to speak to him.
* Sounds like you're expecting Republic City prisons to be as cruel as Fire Nation prisons in the original series. It's not unlikely that the
influence to get a seat on of Aang/Katara/etc made the Council, as they probably would be hedged out by the Earth Kingdom. The Southern Water Tribe meanwhile probably gained a huge amount of influence due to two of retributive system in Republic City more humane, and things like conjugal visits were allowed in their members being major players in ending the war, allowing them prisons, which would've made Tarrlok's conception possible. Since Aang took Yakone's bending away, he wasn't considered dangerous anymore, so he wouldn't have needed to be independently represented.
** Unlike
kept in solitary. That, or Yakone simply escaped from prison, and catching him wasn't a high priority anymore because he'd lost his bloodbending, so he managed to find a wife and live the isolationist Northern Water Tribe, the South ''helped'' the Earth Kingdom during the war by providing it with a small but effective naval force. Perhaps the Earth Kingdom went ''quid pro quo'' post-war, repaying the debt by lobbying for the South rest of his life in hiding.
* Because they're not evil scum who want
to get a seat.drive their prisoners insane? Even Ozai wasn't given such treatment.
* Also Aang says he's 40 years old in the Fire Nation members who came and never left were formed into the United Republic of Nations, flashback which means that as stated it is 42 years ago, he dies 26 years later and Korra is now 16. According to the Welcome to Republic City game Tarrlok is 37. He was born when his father was in prison.
** Or Tarrlok's listed age is wrong or represents a lie he's told. A fit man in his forties could pass as 37, especially one as vain as Tarrlock.
** Could easily be a lie. Tarrlock does bare a resemblance to Yakone after all...if anyone brought attention to it, he could just make an offhand comment that he was born after Yakone was already in jail and
the capital of.
* The US Senate has two representatives for each state -
matter would drop.
** Or maybe Yakone was broken out of prison. He did have a criminal empire.
** It's possible that
the same number for Wyoming (568K people) and California (38M background people, over 66 times as many) - like JK Rowling, can't do math, and they Tarrlock isn't supposed to have several exclusive powers been born after Yakone went to prison.
** The math assumes
the House does not. At Avatar is reborn right away, which may not be the time case. Alternatively, considering the US Constitution was drafted, none catastrophic emotional consequences of removing someone's bending, the less populated council may have amended his sentence on the grounds that he has "suffered enough" and is no longer a threat.
*** A previous episode specifically
states that Yakone was defeated 42 years ago.
**** Considering the fact that nobody knew Tarrlock was Yakone's son, I
would settle for a pure proportional representation scheme, due to fear of being marginalized by more populated areas say that Tarrlock is older than 42 and lied about his age along with very different political interests. his parentage.
**** Same troper as above,
I think the analogy is appropriate here.
**
stay corrected. The US also created the House of Representatives because the Senate system alone was completely unacceptable, although including real answer is that would make their politics much more complex without adding anything to the show.Yakone escaped.



[[folder: Episodes? Season Finale?]]
I may have heard wrong, but according to the commercial, the Season Finale is next week, a One-Hour season finale. Cool, i'm excited, don't get me wrong, but one hour? that's two episodes, right? which means, after next week, the series will be at 11 episodes. I thought it was supposed to be twelve. I guess its possible to fit three episodes in an hour, but it doesn't seem likely given how many commercials will be involved. So, was an episode cancelled, did Nick just screw up, or did i just miscount?
* No, the season finale is being advertised coming out in 23rd of June, two weeks from now. Next week is still business as usual. They're just advertising early.
* Good, thanks for clearing that up for me. I think i'd go through withdraws if they cut an episode.
** At least I ''think'' this is the case. I got no confirmation either, but at least there has been no hint of leaving out next week's episode in any source I know. Our own wiki tells that Turning the Tides will come out in June 16th.
** Many people seem to believe there won't be an episode next week. Good job, Nick. I think that promo was more harmful than no promo at all like the last couple of weeks.

to:


[[folder: Episodes? Season Finale?]]
I may
How did Shiro Shinobi know Tarrlok was the one who kidnapped Korra?]]
And if he had used his old IntrepidReporter skills to find out, how did Tarrlok's cover story work? Would the truth not
have heard wrong, but according been broadcast on the radio for all to hear?
* The "Previously On" segments are clearly not happening in-universe. I'm simply amazed that someone could have come
to the commercial, the Season Finale is next week, a One-Hour season finale. Cool, i'm excited, don't get me wrong, but one hour? that's two episodes, right? which means, after next week, the series will be at 11 episodes. conclusion they were. Just...''wow'', I thought it was supposed to be twelve. I guess its possible to fit three episodes in an hour, but it doesn't seem likely given seriously cannot understand how many commercials will be involved. So, was an episode cancelled, did Nick just screw up, or did i just miscount?
* No, the season finale
this is being advertised coming out in 23rd of June, two weeks asked for a second time.
* The confusion probably stems
from now. Next week is still business as usual. They're just advertising early.
* Good, thanks for clearing that up for me. I think i'd go through withdraws if they cut an episode.
** At least I ''think'' this is
the case. I got no confirmation either, but at least there has been no hint fact that, in the preview of leaving out next week's the seventh episode, Tarrlok was the voice over and in the previous episode in any source I know. Our own wiki tells Shiro was attack, and Tarrlok's voice over is clearly in-universe. So to be fair, it's not completely unbelievable that Turning someone would be confused.
** It is also
the Tides will come out in June 16th.
** Many people seem to believe there won't be an episode next week. Good job, Nick. I think
only time that promo was more harmful than no promo at all like the last couple of weeks. voice over has mentioned information that wouldn't have realistically be available to the public.
*** So who Mako and Korra have crushes on--that they've never told anyone about--is information available to the public, too?
**** [[EveryoneCanSeeIt There's a trope for that.]]



[[folder: Why is everybody so lightly dressed?]]
The only thing coming close to a reasonable outfit is Lin's coat.
* She had time to change, they did not.
** It's less about that, it's their choice of wardrobe in the first place. It's winter, and they're wearing the same things they are wearing all the time. Korra, of course, is the worst offender, leaving the house like that. The Satomobiles aren't exactly warm and cozy either, which would have explained why Bolin and Mako don't put on more clothes.
* Korra use to live in the South Pole. She's probably use to the cold. Mako, Bolin, And Asami didn't have time to change what with breaking out of jail and all. Tenzin's cloths seem pretty warm. (Don't quite remember what he was wearing.)
* Tenzin has the excuse of being an airbender. Aang seemed just fine in both Poles with his regular clothes; fandom is that he used airbending to insulate himself. Tenzin would have learned the technique from his father. As for Mako and Bolin, remember they lived as orphans on the streets; they know how to deal with being in winter weather without proper clothing.
* Korra and Mako are firebenders; they don't need heavy clothing to keep warm. Asami and Bolin are reasonably well dressed; judging from the copious snowfall, it can't be much below freezing, if at all. Thick snow only falls in relatively warm winter weather.

to:

[[folder: Why is everybody so lightly dressed?]]
The only thing coming close to a reasonable outfit is Lin's coat.







[[folder:Yakone's escape]]
* She had time to change, they Forget solitary, how did not.
** It's less about that, it's their choice
Yakone get out of wardrobe jail in order to start a new life in the first place. It's winter, and they're wearing North Pole?
** They explicitly said that some of his criminal buddies broke him out. He was
the same things head of a vast criminal empire. Exactly why they are wearing all broke him out when he was stripped of his bending abilities, who knows? Maybe he had assets that the time. Korra, of course, is the worst offender, leaving the house like that. The Satomobiles aren't exactly warm next gang leader could use, and cozy either, which would have explained why Bolin and Mako don't put on more clothes.
* Korra use
only he knew where to live get them, or maybe he simply possessed a level of fanatical devotion in his subordinates (maybe its in the South Pole. She's probably use to the cold. Mako, Bolin, And Asami blood) that they didn't have time to change what with breaking out of jail and all. Tenzin's cloths seem pretty warm. (Don't quite remember what he was wearing.)
* Tenzin has the excuse of being an airbender. Aang seemed just fine in both Poles with
care about his regular clothes; fandom is that he used airbending to insulate himself. Tenzin would have learned the technique from his father. As for Mako and Bolin, remember they lived as orphans on the streets; they know how to deal with being in winter weather without proper clothing.
* Korra and Mako are firebenders; they don't need heavy clothing to keep warm. Asami and Bolin are reasonably well dressed; judging from the copious snowfall, it can't be much below freezing, if at all. Thick snow only falls in relatively warm winter weather.
bending status.



[[folder: Why wasn't Yakone in solitary after that stunt he pulled?]]
He somehow had the opportunity to beget Tarrlok 4 years later, despite receiving a life sentence for 12 counts of bloodbending and proceeding to bloodbend the entire courtroom to resist being sent to jail, and then bloodbends the Avatar with intent to kill. That seems like it merits the sentence being upgraded to life in prison with no human contact (and only because they don't have the death penalty out of respect for Aang), except the people who will bring his meals, who are in turn forbidden to speak to him.
* Sounds like you're expecting Republic City prisons to be as cruel as Fire Nation prisons in the original series. It's not unlikely that the influence of Aang/Katara/etc made the retributive system in Republic City more humane, and things like conjugal visits were allowed in their prisons, which would've made Tarrlok's conception possible. Since Aang took Yakone's bending away, he wasn't considered dangerous anymore, so he wouldn't have needed to be kept in solitary. That, or Yakone simply escaped from prison, and catching him wasn't a high priority anymore because he'd lost his bloodbending, so he managed to find a wife and live the rest of his life in hiding.
* Because they're not evil scum who want to drive their prisoners insane? Even Ozai wasn't given such treatment.
* Aang says he's 40 years old in the flashback which means that as stated it is 42 years ago, he dies 26 years later and Korra is now 16. According to the Welcome to Republic City game Tarrlok is 37. He was born when his father was in prison.
** Or Tarrlok's listed age is wrong or represents a lie he's told. A fit man in his forties could pass as 37, especially one as vain as Tarrlock.
** Could easily be a lie. Tarrlock does bare a resemblance to Yakone after all...if anyone brought attention to it, he could just make an offhand comment that he was born after Yakone was already in jail and the matter would drop.
** Or maybe Yakone was broken out of prison. He did have a criminal empire.
** It's possible that the background people, like JK Rowling, can't do math, and Tarrlock isn't supposed to have been born after Yakone went to prison.
** The math assumes the Avatar is reborn right away, which may not be the case. Alternatively, considering the catastrophic emotional consequences of removing someone's bending, the council may have amended his sentence on the grounds that he has "suffered enough" and is no longer a threat.
*** A previous episode specifically states that Yakone was defeated 42 years ago.
**** Considering the fact that nobody knew Tarrlock was Yakone's son, I would say that Tarrlock is older than 42 and lied about his age along with his parentage.
**** Same troper as above, I stay corrected. The real answer is that Yakone escaped.

to:




[[folder: Why wasn't Yakone in solitary after that stunt he pulled?]]
He somehow had the opportunity to beget Tarrlok 4 years later, despite receiving a life sentence for 12 counts of bloodbending and proceeding to bloodbend the entire courtroom to resist being sent to jail, and then bloodbends the Avatar with intent to kill. That seems like it merits the sentence being upgraded to life in prison with no human contact (and only because they don't have the death penalty out of respect for Aang), except the people who will bring his meals, who are in turn forbidden to speak to him.
* Sounds like you're expecting Republic City prisons
Was Korra originally meant to be as cruel as Fire Nation prisons in the original series. It's not unlikely that the influence of Aang/Katara/etc made the retributive system in Republic City more humane, and things like conjugal visits were allowed in their prisons, which would've made Tarrlok's conception possible. Since Aang took Yakone's bending away, he wasn't considered dangerous anymore, so he wouldn't have needed to be kept in solitary. That, a six-hour long movie?]]
Is it me,
or Yakone simply escaped from prison, and catching him wasn't a high priority anymore because he'd lost his bloodbending, so he managed to find a wife and live the rest of his life in hiding.
* Because they're not evil scum who want to drive their prisoners insane? Even Ozai wasn't given such treatment.
* Aang says he's 40 years old in the flashback which means that as stated
unlike ATLA, they've pretty much wrapped it is 42 years ago, he dies 26 years later and up here, with Korra is now 16. According becoming a Fully realized Avatar? Was it actually meant to the Welcome to Republic City game Tarrlok is 37. He go on for only one season until late in production?
* Yes. It
was born when his father was in prison.
** Or Tarrlok's listed age is wrong or represents a lie he's told. A fit man in his forties could pass as 37, especially one as vain as Tarrlock.
** Could easily be a lie. Tarrlock does bare a resemblance to Yakone after all...if anyone brought attention to it, he could just make an offhand comment that he was born after Yakone was already in jail and the matter would drop.
** Or maybe Yakone was broken out of prison. He did have a criminal empire.
** It's possible that the background people, like JK Rowling, can't do math, and Tarrlock isn't
originally supposed to have been born after Yakone went to prison.
** The math assumes
be a one season miniseries, but they got a second season while the Avatar is reborn right away, which may not be the case. Alternatively, considering the catastrophic emotional consequences of removing someone's bending, the council may have amended his sentence on the grounds that he has "suffered enough" and is no longer a threat.
*** A previous episode specifically states that Yakone
first one was defeated 42 years ago.
**** Considering the fact that nobody knew Tarrlock was Yakone's son, I would say that Tarrlock is older than 42 and lied about his age along with his parentage.
**** Same troper as above, I stay corrected. The real answer is that Yakone escaped.
alredy in production.



[[folder: How did Shiro Shinobi know Tarrlok was the one who kidnapped Korra?]]
And if he had used his old IntrepidReporter skills to find out, how did Tarrlok's cover story work? Would the truth not have been broadcast on the radio for all to hear?
* The "Previously On" segments are clearly not happening in-universe. I'm simply amazed that someone could have come to the conclusion they were. Just...''wow'', I seriously cannot understand how this is being asked for a second time.
* The confusion probably stems from the fact that, in the preview of the seventh episode, Tarrlok was the voice over and in the previous episode Shiro was attack, and Tarrlok's voice over is clearly in-universe. So to be fair, it's not completely unbelievable that someone would be confused.
** It is also the only time that the voice over has mentioned information that wouldn't have realistically be available to the public.
*** So who Mako and Korra have crushes on--that they've never told anyone about--is information available to the public, too?
**** [[EveryoneCanSeeIt There's a trope for that.]]

to:

[[folder: How did Shiro Shinobi know Tarrlok was the one who kidnapped Korra?]]
And if he had used his old IntrepidReporter skills to find out, how did Tarrlok's cover story work? Would the truth not have been broadcast on the radio for all to hear?
* The "Previously On" segments are clearly not happening in-universe. I'm simply amazed that someone could have come



[[folder:What happened
to the conclusion they were. Just...''wow'', I seriously cannot understand how this is being asked for a second time.
*
North Pole?]]
More specifically, the Northern Water Tribe.
The confusion probably stems from the fact that, in the preview of the seventh episode, Tarrlok was the voice over and in the previous episode Shiro was attack, and Tarrlok's voice over is clearly in-universe. So first series showed it to be fair, a relatively large place with a design similar to Venice, Italy. Yet when we see it in Taarlok's flashback story, it's not completely unbelievable that someone comparable to what we saw of the Southern Water Tribe back in "The Boy in the Iceberg". And considering it's only ever referred to as ''the'' Northern Water Tribe, there seems to be no indication it would be confused.
** It
some sort of outpost town or settlement.
* Is there any actual reason to believe it ''wasn't'' some sort of outpost town or settlement?
* Yeah. The Northern Water Tribe
is also just the only time name of the whole tribe, like the Zulu. Just because the Zulu are referred by a common tribe name doesn't mean they all live in the same city.
* The Northern Water Tribe we saw was one after 100 years of war--a fortification made for defense. At the time, yes,
that was probably where the voice over has mentioned information entire Tribe lived--but after the war ended and the danger of Fire Nation soldiers attacking and abducting people was gone, it makes sense that wouldn't have realistically be available to the public.
*** So who Mako and Korra have crushes on--that they've never told anyone about--is information available to the public, too?
**** [[EveryoneCanSeeIt There's a trope for that.]]
they would expand into other settlements.



[[folder:Yakone's escape]]
* Forget solitary, how did Yakone get out of jail in order to start a new life in the North Pole?
** They explicitly said that some of his criminal buddies broke him out. He was the head of a vast criminal empire. Exactly why they broke him out when he was stripped of his bending abilities, who knows? Maybe he had assets that the next gang leader could use, and only he knew where to get them, or maybe he simply possessed a level of fanatical devotion in his subordinates (maybe its in the blood) that they didn't care about his bending status.
[[/folder]]







[[folder: Was Korra originally meant to be a six-hour long movie?]]
Is it me, or unlike ATLA, they've pretty much wrapped it up here, with Korra becoming a Fully realized Avatar? Was it actually meant to go on for only one season until late in production?
* Yes. It was originally supposed to be a one season miniseries, but they got a second season while the first one was alredy in production.
[[/folder]]



















[[folder:What happened to the North Pole?]]
More specifically, the Northern Water Tribe. The first series showed it to be a relatively large place with a design similar to Venice, Italy. Yet when we see it in Taarlok's flashback story, it's comparable to what we saw of the Southern Water Tribe back in "The Boy in the Iceberg". And considering it's only ever referred to as ''the'' Northern Water Tribe, there seems to be no indication it would be some sort of outpost town or settlement.
* Is there any actual reason to believe it ''wasn't'' some sort of outpost town or settlement?
* Yeah. The Northern Water Tribe is just the name of the whole tribe, like the Zulu. Just because the Zulu are referred by a common tribe name doesn't mean they all live in the same city.
* The Northern Water Tribe we saw was one after 100 years of war--a fortification made for defense. At the time, yes, that was probably where the entire Tribe lived--but after the war ended and the danger of Fire Nation soldiers attacking and abducting people was gone, it makes sense that they would expand into other settlements.
[[/folder]]








[[folder: The "Balance Patch" that is the Law in Republic City]]
* The Avatar is a focal point of balance towards goodness and the right choices in the world at large, which includes the city. Because of this, and the major role she plays in restoring balance and order to the world as they are fated to do, they are given a great deal of leeway. This is no longer the case, and that severely gimps Korra's overall effectiveness for very pedantic reasons. Benders should have the right to defend themselves, as should non-benders. So I'm not entirely seeing the law as helpful or beneficial to the long-run to the city, much less to her job. They would only serve to get in her way.
** That worked back in the old days. In an industrialized nation, Korra's antics are nearly as harmful as helpful, and she is not omniscient. The police are there to cover what she can't, which is basically everything except the occasional random incident.
*** Of course, but if they are putting their foot down and preventing the Avatar from doing what the Avatar does, they're as much a threat to the balance as they could be a help. I'm not speaking about stopping mafia here-which Korra, as the Avatar and a lot of precedent behind her from Kiyoshi and Aang, should be allowed to do-this can get much worse; what if they decide that restoring balance would cause too much instability within the city?
*** If Korra's keeping with the law, which should be entirely reasonable, then they have no reason to object. Tenzin could also extend some political protection if he needs to.
*** Um, where's it ever said that the law prohibits bending in any way? Or that benders can't defend themselves? The problem with Korra's actions in the first episode is more that she wrecked up the street, and that she was acting as a vigilante, not just that she was acting as a bender or the Avatar.
*** Precisely. Tenzin and the White Lotus may be sitting on museum pieces, but if Korra were allowed to inflict property damage at her own vigilante discretion, she'd deplete their operating budget in a matter of weeks...heck, the lack of HeroInsurance could be mined for a subplot.
*** It's all part of the deconstruction that is going on. As of now, there is no need for Avatar-involvement. Having Korra wreck the place is not necessary. It's an era of peace. I am sure that as the plot progresses, there will be a need for Korra to act as the Avatar to the world. But as of now, there isn't.
** This is hilarious. Its exactly the sort of political insanity that probably exists in the setting. The crime wasn't "bending" (though benders might well think of it that way) it was "blowing up other people's stuff and attacking the police". You shouldn't get away with destroying buildings just because you happened to do it with superpowers. I imagine that's exactly the mentality that has Equalist sympathizers scared.
*** I wouldn't be surprised to see merchants whose property she destroyed at an Equalist rally in the future, given that the reason anyone pays protection money is out of fear for their lives and livelihoods. Ironically, Korra may have done by accident what the Triple Threat Triads [[ShameIfSomethingHappened threaten to do]] when they go unpaid, and as a result some struggling business owners might just find themselves looking for a nice bush to sleep under.
*** The perfect opportunity for the return of the [[RunningGag Cabbage Seller]]!
*** Actually, Tenzin said that he would pay for the damages.
[[/folder]]

[[folder: The United Republic of Nations isn't very republican]]
* I'm using "republican" in the way that it's used in the US Constitution "The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government..." For the sake of clarity, I'll add [[http://www.constitution.org/fed/federa10.htm Federalist no. 10]], where Madison outlines the idea of a republic as I am used to using it. As far as I can tell, the government is chosen by the original four nations, not the people of the city. It's as if Wales was jointly governed by a representative of Ireland, Scotland and England. Such a government couldn't be called republican in any sense of the word, let alone the one I was thinking of. Now, it is true that no other government has been shown, meaning it is possible that the council is only in charge of Republic City. This led me to believe that it was the only game in town, and that the council is in charge of the entire nation.
** The US doesn't have a monopoly on the term. Seeing as how we've only seen the one city, one can hardly say the identified form of government cannot be considered a republic.
** I think your assumption of republic being "What the US defined it as is" is a bit of an oversimplification of a form of government that has had dozens of variants amongst them oligarchies very similar to the one in show. It should also be remembered that this government was designed for a different world than the one its in right now, back when the city was founded it made complete sense to have the city intended to be a melting pot be governed by representatives of each major group in the world, unfortunately this is now pretty obsolete as Republic City has developed its own unique culture.
*** I'm wondering what Republics you're thinking of that have oligarchies similar to the one on the show? The closest things I can think of would be Florence and Venice in the Renaissance. However, given that the Florentine republic included about a thousand citizens in its census for who counted as a citizen who could participate in government (circa 1500) and the Venetian aristocracy was abnormally large (which resulted in frequent problems of aristocratic poverty) and could could be bought into, I'm not sure they should count either since there is a big difference between around a thousand people sitting in a senate and five people ruling in a council. Remember, Venice's Council of Ten answered to a much larger senate and the Doge and Florence's Eight Saints were a war time necessity (and they were tax assessors).
* I don't think we know enough about it. Or could you clarify what doesn't seem republican to you? It doesn't seem to be a monarchy, so I guess republic in the meaning of "res publica" isn't so far off.
** Republic as a term is far older than the United States, and even today it has numerous definitions around the world. At core it simply means a nation ruled by an elected council. The election does not have to be democratic as we understand it, nor does the position of electee have to be open for everyone. Pre-Imperial Rome was a non-democratic Republic, for example. The United Republic does seem to be a democracy however, though how it functions is unknown. It seems that the representatives have to include members from the four Nations, and that Benders are overpresented compared to non-Benders. Tenzin is an influential member in spite of the near-extinction of the Air Nomads, for example.
*** Tenzin's father was one of the founders of Republic City. He's probably doing it as a legacy thing, not to represent the almost non-existent Air Nomads.
*** Except that the Council, or at least its leaders apart from Tenzin consist of representatives of Fire Nation, Earth Kingdom, and Southern and Northern Water Tribes. It seems fairly clear that the city is lead by the representatives of the four Bending cultures, even the near-extinct Air Nomads.
* I think the source of the confusion here is that we're assuming Republic City is an independent state, which may not be the case. It's possible Republic City is a kind of "neutral ground" that all four nations have limited control over. If this is the case, the representatives that control Republic city may very well be elected...by the total populations of the nations they hail from. So it's less like Wales being governed by representatives from Ireland, Scotland, and England and more like if everyone in the United States was able to vote for the mayor and city council of New York City.
** So Republic City is basically [[WashingtonDC Washington, DC]]. Limited home rule and all that.
** It's more like the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_International_Settlement Shanghai-that-Was]].
* Republic in its most basic sense means "state without monarchy." The council is made up entirely (I understand) by representatives of monarchies. So I honestly believe that the creators did not know what the word republic means. It is a common mistakes, I remember a couple of occasions where Jorge Luis Borges made ​​the same mistake.
** I'm sure they know exactly what it means. It means a state not ruled by a monarchy. It doesn't mean a state without any influence from any monarchies whatsoever. Republic City is ruled, as you said, by a council--not by a monarchy. That the councilmen represent monarchies doesn't matter.
** Also, the council isn't made up ''entirely'' of representatives of monarchies. The Air Nomads most certainly aren't a monarchy, they don't even have a state of their own, and nothing indicates Tenzin is considered to be their "king". The reason he seems to be the highest authority figure among them could simply be because he's the oldest, most experienced Airbender alive. Historically the Airbenders appear to have been ruled by councils of elders, one in each Air Temple, but we don't know what their current system is. As for the Southern Water Tribe, while they have a chief, there's no canon evidence that he's their sole leader, or that the position of the chief is inhereditary; for all we know he could be chosen by a tribe meeting, or by some other democratic process.
*** If Tenzin gets to be one of the most powerful people in the world just because he's the best Airbender that would be a real problem. Nepotism is honestly more likely.
*** Being a council person in one city makes you "one of the most powerful people in the world"? Just because the series takes place there doesn't mean it's the most important place in the world.
*** But being the world's only Master Airbender probably would make you "one of the most powerful people in the world" by default.
** Since when does "Republic" mean a "state without monarchy"? By that definition, fascist, democratic, anarchist, and theocratic governments would be republican. A better defintion of a "republic" would be a state with a mixed constitution, incorporating elements of democracy, aristocracy, and (elected) monarchy. By this definition, we could include Rome, Florence, Venice, and the US. France might be harder to fit, since it seemed to include only democracy and (elected) monarchy, as far as I'm aware. And, of course, this does not work as well for the 20th century when it seemed to become the fashion to style everything a "republic" regardless of its actual form. Also, keep in mind that I'm using the term monarch losely to refer to a small executive branch (like the consuls, Doge, Signoria, or president), the way Roman and Renaissance political theorists did.
*** You define the entire Western world as being ruled by monarchs? (because pretty much every nation has a president or prime minister)
*** "Since when does 'Republic' mean 'a state without monarchy'?" Basically since the term was coined in the classical world. Although modern developments have complicated the matter, that's still the most basic way to define the term, and essential to every other definition that incorporates other aspects. "By that definition, fascist, democratic, anarchist and theocratic governments would be republican." Yes. You treat these terms as opposed to either monarchy or republic while they aren't (except anarchism which is opposed to both). Iran can be described as a theocratic republic, Saudi-Arabia as a theocratic monarchy. The UK is a democratic monarchy, the US a democratic republic and so on. "A better definition ..." What follows is a pretty meaningless definition that has no descriptive purpose and no historical background. In general, people seem to be misled by the meaning of the word "Republican" in a US-American context, where it has a wider meaning, including rule of law, balance of power, democracy, equality before the law etc. and also carries a lot of historical and political baggage (there is a major party that derives its name from this word after all). This meaning comes from American history, not academic categorization of governments. And no, an elected head of the executive is not a monarch.
*** As to the idea of an elected head being a monarch, this is exactly how Polybius uses the term. Polybius defines Rome as a state with a mixed constitution, one that has elements of monarchy, aristocracy, and democracy. He equates the monarchical elements with the consuls, an elected office with one year in office. I am doing the same (note: a prime minister is not a head of state but a head of government, and thus would not represent a monarchic element). The definition of a republic as a state with a mixed constitution also comes from Polybius's understanding - he holds up Rome's Republic as an example of government to be contrasted with the democracy of Athens and various principates. I would argue that in most of the greatest historical examples, a balance of powers is an essential aspect of a republic, as it was in antique Rome and renaissance Florence and Venice. Aristotle would seem to agree given that he considers a mixed constitution as an alternative form of government to monarchy/tyranny, aristocracy/oligarchy, and democracy. Now, Machiavelli does seem to include all non-principate states in the category of "Republic", but given his historical environment, where the only non-monarchic states had mixed constitutions, states like Florence, Venice, and Bologna, I would hesitate to agree with his assessment, given that his analysis of Rome and the classical world was often heavily colored by his experience of politics in his own time. You say that classically this is how a republic was defined, but I'm not sure which classical authors you are refering to. As I said above, Polybius and Aristotle did not make such a division. Plato divided his types of government much more broadly, defining five types of states based on the values of the ruler/ruling class (kallipolis, timocracy, oligarchy, democracy, and tyranny). To Thucydides, your division would not make sense, since part of his history is devoted to comparing the sort of governments Sparta and Athens had and to equate them as of the same sort would be counter to his efforts. Since the term, however, comes from Latin, we could look at Latin authors, but they tended to defer to Polybius and Aristotle on this matter. And if we are going to defer to the term "res publica", then even the Roman Empire would be a republic, since for the first century or so of its existence it was still called a "res publica". So, I do not see where your definition comes from, aside from perhaps Machiavelli or the French Revolution, neither of whom/which are classical sources and both of whom/which existed in periods where a more nuanced view was unnecessary. And as to theocracy - you said you can have theocratic republics and theocratic monarchies, but what would the bishopric of Rome be? A republic, given the prominence of the college of cardinals? A monarchy, given that it has a single head? Also, you seem to be lax on what a monarchy is - is it simply a state with a king? would a tyranny without a king be a republic? It would seem unfair to call Cuba a republic just because its head of state does not call himself king. It would seem unfair to call Sparta a monarchy just because its heads of state were kings.
* At the very least we can say that Republic City does not seem very republican. A ruling body of five people who represent only a "bending aristocracy" (my term) is much more oligarchic than it is republican. And since this small ruling body seems to make policy decisions without consulting anyone outside of themselves (there's no mention of having a vote in the senate on what to do about the rebel problem or what to do about terrorist threats), I feel it's safe to say that just these five are governing Republic City. So... yeah. Sounds like an oligarchy - more like the Thirty Tyrants than the Council of Ten.
** That does fit within some definitions of Republic since those five are "the body of citizens entitled to vote", if they were elected to those positions in some way it fits most definitions. What Republic City is clearly not is a democracy, the general population has little to no say in the general affairs of government.
*** But size does matter in this. If you were simply going to say that a republic has a "body of citizens entitled to vote" a tyranny would be a republic where that body numbered one. The voting base needs to be broader than five, even if it does not have to include a majority of people. If you were to ask me to define how broad it needs to be, I would probably say at least 1% of the population. Though, there are other aspects of republic aside from having a voting base, namely the separation of powers - they tend to have at least an executive or executive body and a legislative body, but can also include bodies that propose legislation (like Rome's Senate) or various bodies that oversee economic or military concerns.
*** Represents a "bending aristocracy"? The councilmembers represent the different NATIONS, not the types of benders. We know that Tarrlok and Tenzin are benders, but it's never been shown about the others. True, Amon had them kidnapped, but that could be just as much to disrupt the current government as to target them as benders.
**** The way Tarrlok addresses them when he introduces his non-bender curfew certainly implies they are benders. And it seems unlikely they would have voted for the curfew if they were non-benders themselves.
* People have used the word "republic" to mean a lot of different things over the course of history. It is a usefully vague term, almost to the point of being meaningless, in a fictional setting.
[[/folder]]




to:

[[folder:Yakone's escape]]
* Forget solitary, how did Yakone get out of jail in order to start a new life in the North Pole?
** They explicitly said that some of his criminal buddies broke him out. He was the head of a vast criminal empire. Exactly why they broke him out when he was stripped of his bending abilities, who knows? Maybe he had assets that the next gang leader could use, and only he knew where to get them, or maybe he simply possessed a level of fanatical devotion in his subordinates (maybe its in the blood) that they didn't care about his bending status.
[[/folder]]







[[folder: Was Korra originally meant to be a six-hour long movie?]]
Is it me, or unlike ATLA, they've pretty much wrapped it up here, with Korra becoming a Fully realized Avatar? Was it actually meant to go on for only one season until late in production?
* Yes. It was originally supposed to be a one season miniseries, but they got a second season while the first one was alredy in production.
[[/folder]]



















[[folder:What happened to the North Pole?]]
More specifically, the Northern Water Tribe. The first series showed it to be a relatively large place with a design similar to Venice, Italy. Yet when we see it in Taarlok's flashback story, it's comparable to what we saw of the Southern Water Tribe back in "The Boy in the Iceberg". And considering it's only ever referred to as ''the'' Northern Water Tribe, there seems to be no indication it would be some sort of outpost town or settlement.
* Is there any actual reason to believe it ''wasn't'' some sort of outpost town or settlement?
* Yeah. The Northern Water Tribe is just the name of the whole tribe, like the Zulu. Just because the Zulu are referred by a common tribe name doesn't mean they all live in the same city.
* The Northern Water Tribe we saw was one after 100 years of war--a fortification made for defense. At the time, yes, that was probably where the entire Tribe lived--but after the war ended and the danger of Fire Nation soldiers attacking and abducting people was gone, it makes sense that they would expand into other settlements.
[[/folder]]








[[folder: The "Balance Patch" that is the Law in Republic City]]
* The Avatar is a focal point of balance towards goodness and the right choices in the world at large, which includes the city. Because of this, and the major role she plays in restoring balance and order to the world as they are fated to do, they are given a great deal of leeway. This is no longer the case, and that severely gimps Korra's overall effectiveness for very pedantic reasons. Benders should have the right to defend themselves, as should non-benders. So I'm not entirely seeing the law as helpful or beneficial to the long-run to the city, much less to her job. They would only serve to get in her way.
** That worked back in the old days. In an industrialized nation, Korra's antics are nearly as harmful as helpful, and she is not omniscient. The police are there to cover what she can't, which is basically everything except the occasional random incident.
*** Of course, but if they are putting their foot down and preventing the Avatar from doing what the Avatar does, they're as much a threat to the balance as they could be a help. I'm not speaking about stopping mafia here-which Korra, as the Avatar and a lot of precedent behind her from Kiyoshi and Aang, should be allowed to do-this can get much worse; what if they decide that restoring balance would cause too much instability within the city?
*** If Korra's keeping with the law, which should be entirely reasonable, then they have no reason to object. Tenzin could also extend some political protection if he needs to.
*** Um, where's it ever said that the law prohibits bending in any way? Or that benders can't defend themselves? The problem with Korra's actions in the first episode is more that she wrecked up the street, and that she was acting as a vigilante, not just that she was acting as a bender or the Avatar.
*** Precisely. Tenzin and the White Lotus may be sitting on museum pieces, but if Korra were allowed to inflict property damage at her own vigilante discretion, she'd deplete their operating budget in a matter of weeks...heck, the lack of HeroInsurance could be mined for a subplot.
*** It's all part of the deconstruction that is going on. As of now, there is no need for Avatar-involvement. Having Korra wreck the place is not necessary. It's an era of peace. I am sure that as the plot progresses, there will be a need for Korra to act as the Avatar to the world. But as of now, there isn't.
** This is hilarious. Its exactly the sort of political insanity that probably exists in the setting. The crime wasn't "bending" (though benders might well think of it that way) it was "blowing up other people's stuff and attacking the police". You shouldn't get away with destroying buildings just because you happened to do it with superpowers. I imagine that's exactly the mentality that has Equalist sympathizers scared.
*** I wouldn't be surprised to see merchants whose property she destroyed at an Equalist rally in the future, given that the reason anyone pays protection money is out of fear for their lives and livelihoods. Ironically, Korra may have done by accident what the Triple Threat Triads [[ShameIfSomethingHappened threaten to do]] when they go unpaid, and as a result some struggling business owners might just find themselves looking for a nice bush to sleep under.
*** The perfect opportunity for the return of the [[RunningGag Cabbage Seller]]!
*** Actually, Tenzin said that he would pay for the damages.
[[/folder]]

[[folder: The United Republic of Nations isn't very republican]]
* I'm using "republican" in the way that it's used in the US Constitution "The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government..." For the sake of clarity, I'll add [[http://www.constitution.org/fed/federa10.htm Federalist no. 10]], where Madison outlines the idea of a republic as I am used to using it. As far as I can tell, the government is chosen by the original four nations, not the people of the city. It's as if Wales was jointly governed by a representative of Ireland, Scotland and England. Such a government couldn't be called republican in any sense of the word, let alone the one I was thinking of. Now, it is true that no other government has been shown, meaning it is possible that the council is only in charge of Republic City. This led me to believe that it was the only game in town, and that the council is in charge of the entire nation.
** The US doesn't have a monopoly on the term. Seeing as how we've only seen the one city, one can hardly say the identified form of government cannot be considered a republic.
** I think your assumption of republic being "What the US defined it as is" is a bit of an oversimplification of a form of government that has had dozens of variants amongst them oligarchies very similar to the one in show. It should also be remembered that this government was designed for a different world than the one its in right now, back when the city was founded it made complete sense to have the city intended to be a melting pot be governed by representatives of each major group in the world, unfortunately this is now pretty obsolete as Republic City has developed its own unique culture.
*** I'm wondering what Republics you're thinking of that have oligarchies similar to the one on the show? The closest things I can think of would be Florence and Venice in the Renaissance. However, given that the Florentine republic included about a thousand citizens in its census for who counted as a citizen who could participate in government (circa 1500) and the Venetian aristocracy was abnormally large (which resulted in frequent problems of aristocratic poverty) and could could be bought into, I'm not sure they should count either since there is a big difference between around a thousand people sitting in a senate and five people ruling in a council. Remember, Venice's Council of Ten answered to a much larger senate and the Doge and Florence's Eight Saints were a war time necessity (and they were tax assessors).
* I don't think we know enough about it. Or could you clarify what doesn't seem republican to you? It doesn't seem to be a monarchy, so I guess republic in the meaning of "res publica" isn't so far off.
** Republic as a term is far older than the United States, and even today it has numerous definitions around the world. At core it simply means a nation ruled by an elected council. The election does not have to be democratic as we understand it, nor does the position of electee have to be open for everyone. Pre-Imperial Rome was a non-democratic Republic, for example. The United Republic does seem to be a democracy however, though how it functions is unknown. It seems that the representatives have to include members from the four Nations, and that Benders are overpresented compared to non-Benders. Tenzin is an influential member in spite of the near-extinction of the Air Nomads, for example.
*** Tenzin's father was one of the founders of Republic City. He's probably doing it as a legacy thing, not to represent the almost non-existent Air Nomads.
*** Except that the Council, or at least its leaders apart from Tenzin consist of representatives of Fire Nation, Earth Kingdom, and Southern and Northern Water Tribes. It seems fairly clear that the city is lead by the representatives of the four Bending cultures, even the near-extinct Air Nomads.
* I think the source of the confusion here is that we're assuming Republic City is an independent state, which may not be the case. It's possible Republic City is a kind of "neutral ground" that all four nations have limited control over. If this is the case, the representatives that control Republic city may very well be elected...by the total populations of the nations they hail from. So it's less like Wales being governed by representatives from Ireland, Scotland, and England and more like if everyone in the United States was able to vote for the mayor and city council of New York City.
** So Republic City is basically [[WashingtonDC Washington, DC]]. Limited home rule and all that.
** It's more like the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_International_Settlement Shanghai-that-Was]].
* Republic in its most basic sense means "state without monarchy." The council is made up entirely (I understand) by representatives of monarchies. So I honestly believe that the creators did not know what the word republic means. It is a common mistakes, I remember a couple of occasions where Jorge Luis Borges made ​​the same mistake.
** I'm sure they know exactly what it means. It means a state not ruled by a monarchy. It doesn't mean a state without any influence from any monarchies whatsoever. Republic City is ruled, as you said, by a council--not by a monarchy. That the councilmen represent monarchies doesn't matter.
** Also, the council isn't made up ''entirely'' of representatives of monarchies. The Air Nomads most certainly aren't a monarchy, they don't even have a state of their own, and nothing indicates Tenzin is considered to be their "king". The reason he seems to be the highest authority figure among them could simply be because he's the oldest, most experienced Airbender alive. Historically the Airbenders appear to have been ruled by councils of elders, one in each Air Temple, but we don't know what their current system is. As for the Southern Water Tribe, while they have a chief, there's no canon evidence that he's their sole leader, or that the position of the chief is inhereditary; for all we know he could be chosen by a tribe meeting, or by some other democratic process.
*** If Tenzin gets to be one of the most powerful people in the world just because he's the best Airbender that would be a real problem. Nepotism is honestly more likely.
*** Being a council person in one city makes you "one of the most powerful people in the world"? Just because the series takes place there doesn't mean it's the most important place in the world.
*** But being the world's only Master Airbender probably would make you "one of the most powerful people in the world" by default.
** Since when does "Republic" mean a "state without monarchy"? By that definition, fascist, democratic, anarchist, and theocratic governments would be republican. A better defintion of a "republic" would be a state with a mixed constitution, incorporating elements of democracy, aristocracy, and (elected) monarchy. By this definition, we could include Rome, Florence, Venice, and the US. France might be harder to fit, since it seemed to include only democracy and (elected) monarchy, as far as I'm aware. And, of course, this does not work as well for the 20th century when it seemed to become the fashion to style everything a "republic" regardless of its actual form. Also, keep in mind that I'm using the term monarch losely to refer to a small executive branch (like the consuls, Doge, Signoria, or president), the way Roman and Renaissance political theorists did.
*** You define the entire Western world as being ruled by monarchs? (because pretty much every nation has a president or prime minister)
*** "Since when does 'Republic' mean 'a state without monarchy'?" Basically since the term was coined in the classical world. Although modern developments have complicated the matter, that's still the most basic way to define the term, and essential to every other definition that incorporates other aspects. "By that definition, fascist, democratic, anarchist and theocratic governments would be republican." Yes. You treat these terms as opposed to either monarchy or republic while they aren't (except anarchism which is opposed to both). Iran can be described as a theocratic republic, Saudi-Arabia as a theocratic monarchy. The UK is a democratic monarchy, the US a democratic republic and so on. "A better definition ..." What follows is a pretty meaningless definition that has no descriptive purpose and no historical background. In general, people seem to be misled by the meaning of the word "Republican" in a US-American context, where it has a wider meaning, including rule of law, balance of power, democracy, equality before the law etc. and also carries a lot of historical and political baggage (there is a major party that derives its name from this word after all). This meaning comes from American history, not academic categorization of governments. And no, an elected head of the executive is not a monarch.
*** As to the idea of an elected head being a monarch, this is exactly how Polybius uses the term. Polybius defines Rome as a state with a mixed constitution, one that has elements of monarchy, aristocracy, and democracy. He equates the monarchical elements with the consuls, an elected office with one year in office. I am doing the same (note: a prime minister is not a head of state but a head of government, and thus would not represent a monarchic element). The definition of a republic as a state with a mixed constitution also comes from Polybius's understanding - he holds up Rome's Republic as an example of government to be contrasted with the democracy of Athens and various principates. I would argue that in most of the greatest historical examples, a balance of powers is an essential aspect of a republic, as it was in antique Rome and renaissance Florence and Venice. Aristotle would seem to agree given that he considers a mixed constitution as an alternative form of government to monarchy/tyranny, aristocracy/oligarchy, and democracy. Now, Machiavelli does seem to include all non-principate states in the category of "Republic", but given his historical environment, where the only non-monarchic states had mixed constitutions, states like Florence, Venice, and Bologna, I would hesitate to agree with his assessment, given that his analysis of Rome and the classical world was often heavily colored by his experience of politics in his own time. You say that classically this is how a republic was defined, but I'm not sure which classical authors you are refering to. As I said above, Polybius and Aristotle did not make such a division. Plato divided his types of government much more broadly, defining five types of states based on the values of the ruler/ruling class (kallipolis, timocracy, oligarchy, democracy, and tyranny). To Thucydides, your division would not make sense, since part of his history is devoted to comparing the sort of governments Sparta and Athens had and to equate them as of the same sort would be counter to his efforts. Since the term, however, comes from Latin, we could look at Latin authors, but they tended to defer to Polybius and Aristotle on this matter. And if we are going to defer to the term "res publica", then even the Roman Empire would be a republic, since for the first century or so of its existence it was still called a "res publica". So, I do not see where your definition comes from, aside from perhaps Machiavelli or the French Revolution, neither of whom/which are classical sources and both of whom/which existed in periods where a more nuanced view was unnecessary. And as to theocracy - you said you can have theocratic republics and theocratic monarchies, but what would the bishopric of Rome be? A republic, given the prominence of the college of cardinals? A monarchy, given that it has a single head? Also, you seem to be lax on what a monarchy is - is it simply a state with a king? would a tyranny without a king be a republic? It would seem unfair to call Cuba a republic just because its head of state does not call himself king. It would seem unfair to call Sparta a monarchy just because its heads of state were kings.
* At the very least we can say that Republic City does not seem very republican. A ruling body of five people who represent only a "bending aristocracy" (my term) is much more oligarchic than it is republican. And since this small ruling body seems to make policy decisions without consulting anyone outside of themselves (there's no mention of having a vote in the senate on what to do about the rebel problem or what to do about terrorist threats), I feel it's safe to say that just these five are governing Republic City. So... yeah. Sounds like an oligarchy - more like the Thirty Tyrants than the Council of Ten.
** That does fit within some definitions of Republic since those five are "the body of citizens entitled to vote", if they were elected to those positions in some way it fits most definitions. What Republic City is clearly not is a democracy, the general population has little to no say in the general affairs of government.
*** But size does matter in this. If you were simply going to say that a republic has a "body of citizens entitled to vote" a tyranny would be a republic where that body numbered one. The voting base needs to be broader than five, even if it does not have to include a majority of people. If you were to ask me to define how broad it needs to be, I would probably say at least 1% of the population. Though, there are other aspects of republic aside from having a voting base, namely the separation of powers - they tend to have at least an executive or executive body and a legislative body, but can also include bodies that propose legislation (like Rome's Senate) or various bodies that oversee economic or military concerns.
*** Represents a "bending aristocracy"? The councilmembers represent the different NATIONS, not the types of benders. We know that Tarrlok and Tenzin are benders, but it's never been shown about the others. True, Amon had them kidnapped, but that could be just as much to disrupt the current government as to target them as benders.
**** The way Tarrlok addresses them when he introduces his non-bender curfew certainly implies they are benders. And it seems unlikely they would have voted for the curfew if they were non-benders themselves.
* People have used the word "republic" to mean a lot of different things over the course of history. It is a usefully vague term, almost to the point of being meaningless, in a fictional setting.
[[/folder]]



14th Aug '12 2:03:48 PM ccoa
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[[folder: Misc.]]
* Why did Korra stop Naga from stealing food from the food stand, but immediately tried to procure something to eat without payment? Stealing was probably the lesser of two evils, but trying to buy something without any money was just as foolish.
** "Lesser" of two evils? I'd say that asking first is better than stealing. In any case, the point was most likely to subtly show Korra's reckless personality to the audience; she most likely remembered she didn't have any money the moment she was asked for payment.
** Well, maybe she thought that everybody would give her food because she's the Avatar, but the old lady drove her away before she could play that card. Don't forget, Korra is insanely sheltered and probably never had to worry about food or a place to stay.
** As mentioned above Korra was provided with everything she needed by White Lotus so she has no concept of money and its value. (It was also common with Real Life royalty who could see the big picture (state economy) but were helpless in small since they never had to personally buy their everyday needs.)
** Also, the next course of action Korra takes is to fish. Most likely, it never occurred to her that there would be rules against hunting because the South Pole is too harsh to avoid it.
** She probably thought she could do some work in exchange for the food- surely there was something the merchant needed done that the Avatar could do fast.
* Korra thought the fish-from-a-lake was hunting/fishing, not stealing.
* So the whole reveal with Amon at the end. I can buy that groupthink could reasonably lead to "He has a scar, just like he said, this proves his entire backstory true," but then it just ends up being face paint? Really, Amon? Couldn't be bothered to spend 30 seconds actually scarring your face?
** Do you really, seriously think that "30 seconds" is all the inconvenience there's going to be from '''''burning your face off'''''? That is really, ''really'' not how it works. Burning his face off would have been one of the stupidest things Amon could have possibly done. You're saying he should have ''crippled himself for life''.\\\
Let's start from the top--his eyes. If he wants a scar that would justify wearing a mask, we're talking a really bad scar covering his face. This would mean ''cooking his face'', and you may not realize it but fire isn't a precision tool. There's no way he's going to get that big, that horrific a scar without burning out his own eyes.\\\
Next, his nose and lips--he's saying goodbye to his sense of smell at best, and without lips he's not going to be much of a public speaker. Then there's the recovery--maybe Amon is capable of healing, but could he concentrate on that when he's in maddening pain from literally cooking his own face?\\\
Facial burn scars aren't just some cosmetic thing you can just slap on and move on with your life. They're a crippling disfigurement.
*** Fire may not be precise, but this is also a world with firebenders (Which granted fire's uncontrollable nature is one of the key points of it, but they're able to achieve SOME level of precision with it). And obviously it would hurt, but I dunno, there's something decidedly disappointing about a villain who's not willing to go through excruciating pain for his cause (Death to the benders! I just hope none of those firebenders hit me, cause that stuff is like seriously hot, you gaiz). Hell, it doesn't even have to be that disfiguring, he just needs a scar to be like "See, that thing I said totally happened." Or he could have made up a different backstory that would be less painful to corroborate. I'm just saying, even if the villain is supposed to be wrong, it'd be nice if he'd at least commit (Even springing for face paint that isn't going to come off in water, especially given how large crowds plus underground steam vents generally equals wet).
**** He needs to have some alleged facial disfigurement to justify the mask. If he said he just wore it to avoid being recognised, or to hide a small scar, his fellow equalists may get suspicious if they NEVER see him with the mask off. That way, he has a sympathetic reason for this. Furthermore, actually hurting himself would be very impractical. Not only for the reasons mentioned above; without his mask, he can just disappear in a crowd. Nobody knows what he really looks like, and nobody expects him to not be disfigured. If something goes wrong, he removes the mask and the make-up and he's gone. I'll give you that, though, the face paint did come off rather easily.
***** I dunno, one of my friends did a Joker style cosplay for a con, and based on how long it took him to do the relatively tiny mouth scars, I would think that creating such a detailed and convincing scar every morning as part of a Xanatos Roulette (Not only on the off chance that someone calls him out on it, but even then banking on his followers being frothy enough to not actually stop and think about it) doesn't seem all that practical. Though I guess the ability to disappear in a crowd makes sense.
*** He's not going to use a Firebender, because that's either one person alive who knows the truth (which is one more than he would want), or someone he's going to have to kill to prevent loose ends--both of which are still more work and complications ''on top of'', once again, cooking his own face.\\\
And his make-up wasn't "detailed and convincing." If anyone had taken more than a cursory look at it, especially someone who had seen real facial scars, like Zuko's, they'd have been able to tell it was false. For one, his nose isn't at all misshapen, his eyebrows are still there, the skin itself isn't deformed at all except for upper lip--it was enough make-up to fool people from 15 or so feet away for 30 seconds before he put the mask back on. And more importantly, to fool people who were largely inclined to believe him in the first place--it was what they expected and wanted to see. Notice how the one person close enough to see the real details--the Lieutenant--actually does apparently begin to suspect immediately.

to:


[[folder: Misc.]]
*
Why did Korra stop Naga from stealing food from the food stand, but immediately tried to procure something to eat without payment? Stealing was probably the lesser of two evils, but trying to buy something without any money was just as foolish.
** "Lesser" of two evils? I'd say that asking first is better than stealing. In any case, the point was most likely to subtly show Korra's reckless personality to the audience; she most likely remembered she didn't have any money the moment she was asked for payment.
** Well, maybe she thought that everybody would give her food because she's the Avatar, but the old lady drove her away before she could play that card. Don't forget, Korra is insanely sheltered and probably never had to worry about food or a place to stay.
** As mentioned above Korra was provided with everything she needed by White Lotus so she has no concept of money and its value. (It was also common with Real Life royalty who could see the big picture (state economy) but were helpless in small since they never had to personally buy their everyday needs.)
** Also, the next course of action Korra takes is to fish. Most likely, it never occurred to her that there would be rules against hunting because the South Pole is too harsh to avoid it.
** She probably thought she could do some work in exchange for the food- surely there was something the merchant needed done that the Avatar could do fast.
* Korra thought the fish-from-a-lake was hunting/fishing, not stealing.
* So the whole reveal with Amon at the end. I can buy that groupthink could reasonably lead to "He has a scar, just like he said, this proves his entire backstory true," but then it just ends up being face paint? Really, Amon? Couldn't be bothered to spend 30 seconds actually scarring your face?
** Do you really, seriously think that "30 seconds" is all the inconvenience there's going to be from '''''burning your face off'''''? That is really, ''really'' not how it works. Burning his face off would have been one of the stupidest things Amon could have possibly done. You're saying he should have ''crippled himself for life''.\\\
Let's start from the top--his eyes. If he wants a scar that would justify wearing a mask, we're talking a really bad scar covering his face. This would mean ''cooking his face'', and you may not realize it but fire isn't a precision tool. There's no way he's going to get that big, that horrific a scar without burning out his own eyes.\\\
Next, his nose and lips--he's saying goodbye to his sense of smell at best, and without lips he's not going to be much of a public speaker. Then there's the recovery--maybe Amon is capable of healing, but could he concentrate on that when he's in maddening pain from literally cooking his own face?\\\
Facial burn scars aren't just some cosmetic thing you can just slap on and move on with your life. They're a crippling disfigurement.
*** Fire may not be precise, but this is also a world with firebenders (Which granted fire's uncontrollable nature is one of the key points of it, but they're able to achieve SOME level of precision with it). And obviously it would hurt, but I dunno, there's something decidedly disappointing about a villain who's not willing to go through excruciating pain for his cause (Death to the benders! I just hope none of those firebenders hit me, cause that stuff is like seriously hot, you gaiz). Hell, it
doesn't even have anyone learn some sort of defense against the chi-blockers?]]
* In the original series we had one person use this technique on a few people, two of whom had never had professional training (Katara and Toph) and one (Azula) who she took completely by surprise. Maybe there is no defense, but that ought
to be said. Maybe this will be adressed, and some sort of defense can be constructed.
** There is no defense. Pressure points can't be moved, nor can the effects of hitting them changed. The Metalbenders should be immune thanks to their armor, though, since the force of the blows won't get through properly.
*** It should be possible to develop a style specifically to avoid being hit. A master air or water bender would probably be very difficult to stop with chi-blocking if they knew what they were getting into.
*** Not getting hit isn't much of a style. The trick is fighting back without being being hit.
*** "Not getting hit isn't much of a style"? Isn't
that disfiguring, he just needs a scar big part of what Airbending is all about? Remember the training with the swiveling gates? Aang certainly was good at avoiding getting hit in the original series (and Ty Lee never managed to chi-block him). And it fits thematically, seeing as Korra is still struggling with attempts to learn Airbending now.
*** As I said, not getting hit, in itself, is not much of a style. You need
to be like "See, that thing I said totally happened." Or he could have made able to fight back. Aang never fought Ty Lee up a different backstory that would be less painful to corroborate. I'm just saying, even if the villain is supposed to be wrong, it'd be nice if he'd at least commit (Even springing for face paint that close, and chi-benders are all about close combat. Just dodging isn't going to come off in water, especially given how large crowds plus underground steam vents generally equals wet).
**** He needs to have some alleged facial disfigurement to justify
help unless Korra can do damage at range, too.
*** "Not getting hit" is a pretty good summary of
the mask. If he said he just wore it to avoid being recognised, or to hide a small scar, his fellow equalists may get suspicious if they NEVER see him with the mask off. That way, he has a sympathetic reason for this. Furthermore, actually hurting himself would be very impractical. Not only for the reasons mentioned above; without his mask, he can just disappear in a crowd. Nobody knows what he really looks like, and nobody expects him to not be disfigured. If something goes wrong, he removes the mask and the make-up and he's gone. I'll give you that, though, the face paint did come off rather easily.
***** I dunno, one of my friends did a Joker
airbending style cosplay for as a con, and based on how long it took him to do the relatively tiny mouth scars, I would think whole, actually. Airbending does not have any purely offensive moves.
* It should be said
that creating such a detailed and convincing scar every morning as part of a Xanatos Roulette (Not only on the off chance original does showcase how to fight chi-blockers...by relying on hand to hand combat. This was best displayed by Suki in The Boiling Rock finale. The trick here Is that someone calls him out on it, most of the benders we've been shown seemingly either aren't versed in it (like Katara previously) or are capable but even then banking on his followers being frothy aren't quite good enough to not actually stop and think about it) (Korra herself in this case; who is a capable close quarters figher but doesn't quite measure up).
* Chief Beifong comments in [[Recap/TheLegendOfKorraS1E6AndTheWinnerIs And The Winner Is...]], that metalbender's armor blocks chi blocking, as justification for why they should defend against them, and they
seem all that practical. Though I guess to be the ability only one with a solid defense.
** Which led
to disappear in a crowd bit of FridgeBrillance: The metal armor protects them from The Equalists' chi-blocking... but makes sense.
them doubly-vulnerable to The Equalists' shock weapons.
*** He's not going to Which could theoretically be solved by making the armor as such that it forms a Faraday cage for the wearer. Or if the counter intuitive physics are a bit too much, have them use a Firebender, because that's either one person alive who knows some non conductive padding underneath.
** Related to
the truth (which is one more than he would want), or above: Why doesn't someone he's going simply develop close fitting ceramic armor? Ceramics are generally lighter than metal so it wouldn't be too heavy, they're completely non-conductive so electricity is out and given the presence and abilities of earthbenders shaping and mass manufacturing the armor would be incredibly easy. A single solid plate for the chest and back and segmented plates for the sides of the chest, legs and arms would basically render a person immune to chi blockers. Slap a decent helmet on there and a bender could basically tank anything the average equalist could throw out. It wouldn't even have to be large, say a quarter inch thick. Just strong enough to deflect a single person's blows. With that in mind it could even be worn under clothes as a nasty surprise to any chiblockers. It would be pretty funny to see them do the whole elaborate series of punches only to have to kill to prevent loose ends--both of which are still more work and complications ''on top of'', once again, cooking his own face.\\\
And his make-up wasn't "detailed and convincing." If anyone had taken more than
the person step back completely unfazed.
*** Aren't really durable ceramics
a cursory look at it, especially someone who had seen real facial scars, fairly recent invention? With all the acrobatics involved in bending simple pottery would break.
*** The composite ceramics used in things
like Zuko's, they'd have tank armor and semi conductors are fairly new, yes. But silicon carbide, the stuff they make the plates in bulletproof vests out of, has been able to tell it was false. For one, his nose mass produced since the early 1890's. And all of this isn't at all misshapen, his eyebrows accounting for cermets (Ceramics mixed with metals). There are still there, the skin itself isn't deformed at all except for upper lip--it was enough make-up to fool people from 15 or so feet away for 30 seconds before he put the mask back on. And more importantly, to fool many examples of those that are nonconductive, flexible, light and strong as well.
*** Also, wrapping yourself in earthenware is a horrible idea in a world with
people who were can control earth. Of course, a person in metal plate going against an metalbender is in the same position, but it seems that metalbending is much rarer and largely inclined contained to believe him in the first place--it was what they expected and wanted to see. Notice how the one person close enough to see the real details--the Lieutenant--actually does apparently begin to suspect immediately.police force.













[[folder: Bullying A Dragon]]
* Okay, so once again, there's that "We hate the people with superpowers!" plot going on. Now, I understand the concerns of the non-Benders, and I get that not every Bender is a good-hearted soul who won't abuse it, but here is my issue: With all the "Let's permanently block their ability to bend!" talk, you'd think that someone would say, "Hey, uh...let's not give them a good reason to hate us!" Especially if said person is the AVATAR (aka, the one who could turn Republic City into a smoldering wasteland if he/she so chose.) Are they just asking for Korra to find a reason to go apecrap on them and the city in general? Plus, don't they remember Aang? The previous Avatar who saved their collective asses from the Fire Nation? If they know she's the new Avatar (and likely the reincarnation of Aang) why are they pissing her off? [[TooDumbToLive Are they just trying to get her angry enough to go apeshit and Avatar-State the crap out of them and the city in general?]]
** If i were an Anti-Bender? That is EXACTLY what i'd want. The Avatar using her godlike powers to slaughter a bunch of people? that's exactly the kind of press that proves every single thing that Amon is spewing. Martyrs make for good press. I'm willing to bet that this will be a plot point in future episodes, especially if Amon is smart enough to organize a situation wherein Korra goes Apeshit on some peaceful protesters.
** A large part of the Equalist's rhetoric seems to be that people ''shouldn't have to'' live in fear of offending a Bender just because of what that Bender might do in retaliation. Amon's story paints a nice little picture of this, with his family being oppressed by a Bender, and then them all being killed when his father tries standing up to said Bender. The people of the city suffering under the gangs aren't going to think "Gee, let's try to be as inoffensive as possible and maybe they'll leave us alone", because they know that there is no possible way that that could ever work. With the way he presents it, Amon's power seems like it's a perfect 'solution' to the problem of Bending; i.e. "Standing up to the Benders will just get us killed, but this guy can take away their Bending, and so we'll have nothing to fear from them anymore".
** And about Aang having saved them from the Fire Nation, the Equalist view is that a war wouldn't even HAPPEN if Fire Benders didn't exist to begin with, so the Avatar saving their asses would be unnecessary. It's a flawed point of view, sure, but one can see it working as propaganda.

to:

\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n[[folder: Bullying A Dragon]]
Why don't non-benders learn chi-blocking?]]
* Okay, so once again, there's And for that "We hate matter if the people with superpowers!" plot going on. Now, I understand the concerns of the non-Benders, and I get that not every Bender metal-bending police force is a good-hearted soul who won't abuse it, but here is my issue: With all the "Let's permanently block their special force for benders stopping thier ability would be a uch better idea. But if a substantial number of people learn to bend!" talk, you'd stop benders from abusing thier powers for a short term, and then can report them to the police, I would think that would address the problem, without interfering with the society's infastructure.
** Why doesn't every real life person learn karate to stop muggers, or carry a gun for that matter? You should be able to see where this logic leads.
*** Having lived in a place where there was a firearm of some kind in almost every house, open carry was legal without a permit and CCWs were issued to anyone who wasn't a convicted felon, and having personally trained in the martial arts, something that convinced me everyone should do it, I'm having trouble seeing the negative implications here. '''I'm kind of bothered that the non-benders in this show jumped from living in fear of the triads who abuse their power, to supporting a violent revolutionary who wants to rid the world of bending altogether.''' You would think
someone would say, "Hey, uh...let's not give them a good reason have simply said, '''in regards to hate us!" Especially if said person is the AVATAR (aka, the one who could turn Republic City into a smoldering wasteland if he/she so chose.) Are they just asking for Korra to find a reason to go apecrap on them and the city in general? Plus, triads''', " I don't they remember Aang? The previous Avatar who saved their collective asses from the Fire Nation? If they know she's the new Avatar (and likely the reincarnation of Aang) why are they pissing her off? [[TooDumbToLive Are they just trying want this to get her angry enough continue. Do you guys want this to go apeshit and Avatar-State the crap out of them and the city in general?]]
** If i were an Anti-Bender? That is EXACTLY
continue? That's what i'd want. The Avatar using her godlike powers to slaughter a bunch of people? that's exactly the kind of press that proves every single thing that Amon is spewing. Martyrs make for good press. I'm willing to bet that this will be a plot point in future episodes, especially if Amon is smart enough to organize a situation wherein Korra goes Apeshit on some peaceful protesters.I thought. Let's work something out." Then, get armed and organized.
*** You do realize that's exactly what the Equalists have done, and that it is emphatically a ''bad thing''? There's a reason governments hire and train personnel to defend the public. The Equalists formed in response to exactly that sort of problem, but demonstrate how it, very easily, escalates to something worse.
*** Yeah, because this is how all organized crime fell in RealLife, right? Lets face it, in reality citizen militias have rarely solved any problems, at best keeping old ones from escalating further.
*** There's also the fact that even if armed militias and vigilantes are able to defeat their enemies, they have often by that point [[HeWhoFightsMonsters turned into the very thing they were trying to destroy.]]
** A large Assuming the Equalist narrative about Republic City is true their membership (though obviously not all non-benders) is severely impoverished. The old, sick, starving, emotionally destroyed, and crippled don't make much of an army against people who can punch you across a football field. The limited pool of potential fighters ones would constantly be trying to make ends meet, leaving little time or energy to learn martial arts.
*** The task force bust in "A Voice in the Night" seems to imply that it may be illegal to learn chi-blocking in Republic City. (Of course, it could also just be that Tarlokk was overstepping his bounds in ordering the raid.)
*** The bust isn't about chi-blocking being illegal, it's about shutting down a training camp for insurgents who have publicly declared war on
part of the Equalist's rhetoric seems population. It's not what they're teaching, it's why.
*** But it still sends a very violent and agressive message to non-benders; you are not allowed to defend yourself. Since non-bending methods of fighting seem
to be that rare and slightly elite, chi-blocking is probably the only option for non-benders who want protection. Violently assaulting arresting people ''shouldn't have to'' live in fear of offending for wanting a Bender self-defence method is bad, no matter the intent. It just because tells non-benders that Amon was right and the Council doesn't want them to fight back.
*** No, it sends the message that if you want to take the risk
of training with the wanted criminals, you get what you deserve. Now, if they were shutting down a dojo that Bender might do in retaliation. Amon's story paints a nice little picture of this, with his family is being oppressed by run with city approval, it'd be an entirely different story. This training area was meant to be a Bender, secret and then them all being killed when his father tries standing up to said Bender. is explicitly training soldiers. The people of only message it sends is that the city suffering under won't tolerate a growing revolutionary presence in its midst.
*** So? You are still illegalizing
the gangs aren't going only really effective method for non-benders to think "Gee, let's try to be as inoffensive as possible and maybe they'll leave us alone", because they know that defend themselves (And there is absolutely no possible way indication the government of Republic City allows dojo's to teach it), by doing so you are saying that Amon is right to oppose the city government as they are directly stopping attempts by non-benders to defend themselves.
*** There's no indication
that could ever work. With it is illegal to be taught. The chi-blockers obviously learned from someone before they turned violent. I don't understand how you keep failing to grasp a simple concept. '''This is a training camp for insurgents.''' What part of that are you not understanding? It's not "free chi-blocking classes", it's "help overthrow the way he presents it, Amon's power seems bending establishment." Would you join a terrorist group for shooting lessons, then act offended when you got arrested? Of course not, that'd be your own damn fault. If they want to defend themselves, they can take a class from people who haven't waged war on an entire section of the population. Seriously, stop trying to act like it's a perfect 'solution' to the problem of Bending; i.e. "Standing up to the Benders will just get us killed, but this guy can take away their Bending, and so we'll have material being targeted. It is nothing to fear from them anymore".
** And about Aang having saved them from
of the Fire Nation, sort. It is the Equalist view is people doing the teaching and why that a war is under fire, and nothing more than that.
*** Amon's people are the only ones who teach chi-blocking (that we know of) and its hard to believe that any group teaching chi-blocking
wouldn't even HAPPEN if Fire Benders be immediately grouped with them as a result. My real question is when it started being legal to take down Equalist cells, their advocate in the first episode didn't exist seem to begin with, so the Avatar saving worry about getting arrested.
*** Freedom of speech is a far cry from militarization, and Amon very recently declared war on bending itself. The training camp was training recruits for battle. The protestor is just talking.
*** The Equalists can argue, accurately even, that chi-blocking is a purely defensive despite all of Amon's rhetoric about a revolution (lots of real world countries have politicians who use that kind of talk without
their asses would followers being hunted down).
*** What they claim is ''can''
be unnecessary. It's a flawed point used for doesn't change what they ''are'' using it for. They've already attacked several benders. Criminals or not, they've proven their intentions to be less than noble. That kind of view, sure, but one spin-doctoring doesn't work for revolutionaries. Politicians can only get away with it because they have the clout. Amon doesn't have that.
*** Whether any of this is correct is probably beside the point. Anyone who is at all sympathetic to the Equalist position is going to
see jackbooted benders taking away their constitutional right to bear electro-sticks, and Amon will be spinning it working as propaganda.exactly that.
*** I was under the impression that the camp was attacked because of the amon posters, indicating them as members of the equalists, not because they were learning chi-blocking.



[[folder: Why doesn't anyone learn some sort of defense against the chi-blockers?]]
* In the original series we had one person use this technique on a few people, two of whom had never had professional training (Katara and Toph) and one (Azula) who she took completely by surprise. Maybe there is no defense, but that ought to be said. Maybe this will be adressed, and some sort of defense can be constructed.
** There is no defense. Pressure points can't be moved, nor can the effects of hitting them changed. The Metalbenders should be immune thanks to their armor, though, since the force of the blows won't get through properly.
*** It should be possible to develop a style specifically to avoid being hit. A master air or water bender would probably be very difficult to stop with chi-blocking if they knew what they were getting into.
*** Not getting hit isn't much of a style. The trick is fighting back without being being hit.
*** "Not getting hit isn't much of a style"? Isn't that a big part of what Airbending is all about? Remember the training with the swiveling gates? Aang certainly was good at avoiding getting hit in the original series (and Ty Lee never managed to chi-block him). And it fits thematically, seeing as Korra is still struggling with attempts to learn Airbending now.
*** As I said, not getting hit, in itself, is not much of a style. You need to be able to fight back. Aang never fought Ty Lee up close, and chi-benders are all about close combat. Just dodging isn't going to help unless Korra can do damage at range, too.
*** "Not getting hit" is a pretty good summary of the airbending style as a whole, actually. Airbending does not have any purely offensive moves.
* It should be said that the original does showcase how to fight chi-blockers...by relying on hand to hand combat. This was best displayed by Suki in The Boiling Rock finale. The trick here Is that most of the benders we've been shown seemingly either aren't versed in it (like Katara previously) or are capable but aren't quite good enough (Korra herself in this case; who is a capable close quarters figher but doesn't quite measure up).
* Chief Beifong comments in [[Recap/TheLegendOfKorraS1E6AndTheWinnerIs And The Winner Is...]], that metalbender's armor blocks chi blocking, as justification for why they should defend against them, and they seem to be the only one with a solid defense.
** Which led to a bit of FridgeBrillance: The metal armor protects them from The Equalists' chi-blocking... but makes them doubly-vulnerable to The Equalists' shock weapons.
*** Which could theoretically be solved by making the armor as such that it forms a Faraday cage for the wearer. Or if the counter intuitive physics are a bit too much, have them use some non conductive padding underneath.
** Related to the above: Why doesn't someone simply develop close fitting ceramic armor? Ceramics are generally lighter than metal so it wouldn't be too heavy, they're completely non-conductive so electricity is out and given the presence and abilities of earthbenders shaping and mass manufacturing the armor would be incredibly easy. A single solid plate for the chest and back and segmented plates for the sides of the chest, legs and arms would basically render a person immune to chi blockers. Slap a decent helmet on there and a bender could basically tank anything the average equalist could throw out. It wouldn't even have to be large, say a quarter inch thick. Just strong enough to deflect a single person's blows. With that in mind it could even be worn under clothes as a nasty surprise to any chiblockers. It would be pretty funny to see them do the whole elaborate series of punches only to have the person step back completely unfazed.
*** Aren't really durable ceramics a fairly recent invention? With all the acrobatics involved in bending simple pottery would break.
*** The composite ceramics used in things like tank armor and semi conductors are fairly new, yes. But silicon carbide, the stuff they make the plates in bulletproof vests out of, has been mass produced since the early 1890's. And all of this isn't accounting for cermets (Ceramics mixed with metals). There are many examples of those that are nonconductive, flexible, light and strong as well.
*** Also, wrapping yourself in earthenware is a horrible idea in a world with people who can control earth. Of course, a person in metal plate going against an metalbender is in the same position, but it seems that metalbending is much rarer and largely contained to the police force.

to:





[[folder: Why doesn't anyone learn some use armor or padding?]]
It's pretty clear that chi blocking uses strikes to specific parts of the body. Why has no one, thus far, thought to wear any
sort of defense against protection over those body parts? ESPECIALLY someone like Korra, who has been taken down by Equalists more than once AND is a high-profile target?
* Look again. Tarrlok's entire taskforce, including Korra, indeed wear padded armour on
the chi-blockers?]]
* In the original series we had one person use this technique on a few people, two of whom had never had professional training (Katara and Toph) and one (Azula) who she took completely by surprise. Maybe there is no defense, but
job. It's just that ought to be said. Maybe this will be adressed, and some sort of defense can be constructed.
** There is no defense. Pressure
ArmorIsUseless; maybe the important pressure points are in the areas of the body that can't be moved, nor can the effects of hitting them changed. covered with too dense material without sacrificing vital mobility? Wearing armour in everyday life is incredibly uncomfortable and over time even physically debilitating. It's better to stay agile and learn not to be hit.
**
The Metalbenders should task force units looked more fancy than useful. And note that, where they actually are wearing what could be immune thanks to their armor, though, since not a single Seperatist lands a blow, not even with their shock batons. And even assuming that the task force of suits are armored... why didn't Korra wear it when going to confront Amon in "The Voice in the blows won't get through properly.
Dark." Of course, Korra was carrying a giant IdiotBall during that part, so that might have been the point of not wearing it.
*** It should be possible to develop Korra may of felt the armor was limiting her mobility, and she was expecting a style specifically to avoid being hit. one on one fight with Amon. A master air or water bender bit of an idiot ball for thinking he would probably be very difficult dumb enough to stop with go alone, but still it might of not of been for not wearing armor.
*** Either way, Ty Lee's
chi-blocking if they knew what they were getting into.
*** Not getting hit isn't much of a style. The trick is fighting back without being being hit.
*** "Not getting hit isn't much of a style"? Isn't that a big part of what Airbending is all about? Remember the training with the swiveling gates? Aang certainly was good at avoiding getting hit
worked fine on Earth Kingdom soldiers in the original series (and Ty Lee never managed series. ArmorIsUseless, so better to chi-block him). And it fits thematically, seeing as Korra is still struggling with attempts to learn Airbending now.
preserve mobility.
*** As I said, not getting hit, However, in itself, is not much of a style. You need to be able to fight back. Aang never fought Ty Lee up close, and chi-benders are all about close combat. Just dodging isn't going to help unless Korra can do damage at range, too.
*** "Not getting hit" is a pretty good summary of the airbending style as a whole, actually. Airbending does not have any purely offensive moves.
* It should be said
Episode 6, it's explicitly stated that the original does showcase how to fight chi-blockers...by relying on hand to hand combat. This was best displayed by Suki in The Boiling Rock finale. The trick here Is that most of the benders we've been shown seemingly either aren't versed in it (like Katara previously) or are Metalbender police's armor is capable but aren't quite good enough (Korra herself in this case; who is a capable close quarters figher but doesn't quite measure up).
* Chief Beifong comments in [[Recap/TheLegendOfKorraS1E6AndTheWinnerIs And The Winner Is...]], that metalbender's armor blocks chi blocking, as justification for why they should defend against them, and they seem to be the only one with a solid defense.
** Which led to a bit
of FridgeBrillance: The metal armor protects them from The Equalists' chi-blocking... but makes them doubly-vulnerable to The Equalists' shock weapons.
*** Which could theoretically be solved by making the armor as such that it forms a Faraday cage for the wearer. Or if the counter intuitive physics are a bit too much, have them use some non conductive padding underneath.
** Related to the above: Why doesn't someone simply develop close fitting ceramic armor? Ceramics are generally lighter than metal so it wouldn't be too heavy,
blocking chi-blocker attacks, though they're completely non-conductive so electricity is out essentially wearing plate armor.
** It's actually a bit of FridgeBrilliance, since most bends need to be extremely mobile
and given the presence and abilities need a wide range of earthbenders shaping and mass manufacturing the movement in order to fully take advantage of their bending abilities. Heavy armor would be incredibly easy. A single solid plate for merely impair their movements and therefore directly impact their bending ability.
* The Metalbending Police ''do'' wear armor that guards
the chest and back and segmented plates for chakras. That's why the sides of the chest, legs and arms would basically render a person immune Equalists also carry electro-sticks. That said, waterbending or especially airbending in armor is probably next to chi blockers. Slap a decent helmet on there and a bender could basically tank anything the average equalist could throw out. It wouldn't even have to be large, say a quarter inch thick. Just strong impossible unless you're skilled enough to deflect a single person's blows. With that in mind it could even be worn under clothes as a nasty surprise to any chiblockers. It would be pretty funny to see them do the whole elaborate series of punches only to have the person step back completely unfazed.
*** Aren't really durable ceramics a fairly recent invention? With all the acrobatics involved in bending simple pottery would break.
*** The composite ceramics used in things like tank armor and semi conductors are fairly new, yes. But silicon carbide, the stuff they make the plates in bulletproof vests out of, has been mass produced since the early 1890's. And all of this isn't accounting for cermets (Ceramics mixed with metals). There are many examples of those that are nonconductive, flexible, light and strong as well.
*** Also, wrapping yourself in earthenware is a horrible idea in a world with people who can control earth. Of course, a person in metal plate going against an metalbender is in the same position, but it seems that metalbending is much rarer and largely contained to the police force.
[[AssJokeAproposOfNothing bend by flexing your butt cheeks]] or something similar.



[[folder: Why don't non-benders learn chi-blocking?]]
* And for that matter if the metal-bending police force is a special force for benders stopping thier ability would be a uch better idea. But if a substantial number of people learn to stop benders from abusing thier powers for a short term, and then can report them to the police, I would think that would address the problem, without interfering with the society's infastructure.
** Why doesn't every real life person learn karate to stop muggers, or carry a gun for that matter? You should be able to see where this logic leads.
*** Having lived in a place where there was a firearm of some kind in almost every house, open carry was legal without a permit and CCWs were issued to anyone who wasn't a convicted felon, and having personally trained in the martial arts, something that convinced me everyone should do it, I'm having trouble seeing the negative implications here. '''I'm kind of bothered that the non-benders in this show jumped from living in fear of the triads who abuse their power, to supporting a violent revolutionary who wants to rid the world of bending altogether.''' You would think someone would have simply said, '''in regards to the triads''', " I don't want this to continue. Do you guys want this to continue? That's what I thought. Let's work something out." Then, get armed and organized.
*** You do realize that's exactly what the Equalists have done, and that it is emphatically a ''bad thing''? There's a reason governments hire and train personnel to defend the public. The Equalists formed in response to exactly that sort of problem, but demonstrate how it, very easily, escalates to something worse.
*** Yeah, because this is how all organized crime fell in RealLife, right? Lets face it, in reality citizen militias have rarely solved any problems, at best keeping old ones from escalating further.
*** There's also the fact that even if armed militias and vigilantes are able to defeat their enemies, they have often by that point [[HeWhoFightsMonsters turned into the very thing they were trying to destroy.]]
** Assuming the Equalist narrative about Republic City is true their membership (though obviously not all non-benders) is severely impoverished. The old, sick, starving, emotionally destroyed, and crippled don't make much of an army against people who can punch you across a football field. The limited pool of potential fighters ones would constantly be trying to make ends meet, leaving little time or energy to learn martial arts.
*** The task force bust in "A Voice in the Night" seems to imply that it may be illegal to learn chi-blocking in Republic City. (Of course, it could also just be that Tarlokk was overstepping his bounds in ordering the raid.)
*** The bust isn't about chi-blocking being illegal, it's about shutting down a training camp for insurgents who have publicly declared war on part of the population. It's not what they're teaching, it's why.
*** But it still sends a very violent and agressive message to non-benders; you are not allowed to defend yourself. Since non-bending methods of fighting seem to be rare and slightly elite, chi-blocking is probably the only option for non-benders who want protection. Violently assaulting arresting people for wanting a self-defence method is bad, no matter the intent. It just tells non-benders that Amon was right and the Council doesn't want them to fight back.
*** No, it sends the message that if you want to take the risk of training with the wanted criminals, you get what you deserve. Now, if they were shutting down a dojo that is being run with city approval, it'd be an entirely different story. This training area was meant to be a secret and is explicitly training soldiers. The only message it sends is that the city won't tolerate a growing revolutionary presence in its midst.
*** So? You are still illegalizing the only really effective method for non-benders to defend themselves (And there is absolutely no indication the government of Republic City allows dojo's to teach it), by doing so you are saying that Amon is right to oppose the city government as they are directly stopping attempts by non-benders to defend themselves.
*** There's no indication that it is illegal to be taught. The chi-blockers obviously learned from someone before they turned violent. I don't understand how you keep failing to grasp a simple concept. '''This is a training camp for insurgents.''' What part of that are you not understanding? It's not "free chi-blocking classes", it's "help overthrow the bending establishment." Would you join a terrorist group for shooting lessons, then act offended when you got arrested? Of course not, that'd be your own damn fault. If they want to defend themselves, they can take a class from people who haven't waged war on an entire section of the population. Seriously, stop trying to act like it's the material being targeted. It is nothing of the sort. It is the people doing the teaching and why that is under fire, and nothing more than that.
*** Amon's people are the only ones who teach chi-blocking (that we know of) and its hard to believe that any group teaching chi-blocking wouldn't be immediately grouped with them as a result. My real question is when it started being legal to take down Equalist cells, their advocate in the first episode didn't seem to worry about getting arrested.
*** Freedom of speech is a far cry from militarization, and Amon very recently declared war on bending itself. The training camp was training recruits for battle. The protestor is just talking.
*** The Equalists can argue, accurately even, that chi-blocking is a purely defensive despite all of Amon's rhetoric about a revolution (lots of real world countries have politicians who use that kind of talk without their followers being hunted down).
*** What they claim is ''can'' be used for doesn't change what they ''are'' using it for. They've already attacked several benders. Criminals or not, they've proven their intentions to be less than noble. That kind of spin-doctoring doesn't work for revolutionaries. Politicians can only get away with it because they have the clout. Amon doesn't have that.
*** Whether any of this is correct is probably beside the point. Anyone who is at all sympathetic to the Equalist position is going to see jackbooted benders taking away their constitutional right to bear electro-sticks, and Amon will be spinning it as exactly that.
*** I was under the impression that the camp was attacked because of the amon posters, indicating them as members of the equalists, not because they were learning chi-blocking.

to:



[[folder: Why don't non-benders learn chi-blocking?]]
* And for that matter if the metal-bending police force is
What happens when a special force for benders stopping thier ability would be a uch better idea. But if a substantial number of people learn to stop benders from abusing thier powers for a short term, and then can report them to the police, I would think that would address the problem, without interfering with the society's infastructure.
** Why doesn't every real life person learn karate to stop muggers, or carry a gun for that matter? You should be able to see where this logic leads.
*** Having lived in a place where there was a firearm of some kind in almost every house, open carry was legal without a permit and CCWs were issued to anyone who wasn't a convicted felon, and having personally trained in the martial arts, something that convinced me everyone should do it, I'm having trouble seeing the negative implications here. '''I'm kind of bothered that the non-benders in this show jumped from living in fear of the triads who abuse their power, to supporting a violent revolutionary who wants to rid the world of bending altogether.''' You would think someone would have simply said, '''in regards to the triads''', " I don't want this to continue. Do you guys want this to continue? That's what I thought. Let's work something out." Then, get armed and organized.
*** You do realize that's exactly what the Equalists have done, and that it is emphatically a ''bad thing''? There's a reason governments hire and train personnel to defend the public.
non-Bender dies?]]
The Equalists formed in response to exactly that sort of problem, but demonstrate how it, very easily, escalates to something worse.
*** Yeah, because this is how all organized crime fell in RealLife, right? Lets face it, in reality citizen militias have rarely solved any problems, at best keeping old ones from escalating further.
*** There's also the fact that even if armed militias and vigilantes are able to defeat their enemies, they have often by that point [[HeWhoFightsMonsters turned into the very thing they were trying to destroy.]]
** Assuming the Equalist narrative about Republic City is true their membership (though obviously not all non-benders) is severely impoverished. The old, sick, starving, emotionally destroyed, and crippled don't make much of an army against people who can punch you across a football field. The limited pool of potential fighters ones would constantly be trying to make ends meet, leaving little time or energy to learn martial arts.
*** The task force bust in "A Voice in the Night" seems to imply that it may be illegal to learn chi-blocking in Republic City. (Of course, it could also just be that Tarlokk was overstepping his bounds in ordering the raid.)
*** The bust isn't about chi-blocking being illegal, it's about shutting down a training camp for insurgents who have publicly declared war on part of the population. It's not what they're teaching, it's why.
*** But it still sends a very violent and agressive message to non-benders; you are not allowed to defend yourself. Since non-bending methods of fighting seem to be rare and slightly elite, chi-blocking is probably the only option for non-benders who want protection. Violently assaulting arresting people for wanting a self-defence method is bad, no matter the intent. It just tells non-benders that Amon was right and the Council doesn't want them to fight back.
*** No, it sends the message that if you want to take the risk of training with the wanted criminals, you get what you deserve. Now, if they were shutting down a dojo that is being run with city approval, it'd be an entirely different story. This training area was meant to be a secret and
Avatar is explicitly training soldiers. The only message it sends is that the city won't tolerate a growing revolutionary presence in its midst.
*** So? You are still illegalizing the only really effective method for non-benders to defend themselves (And
reincarnated, and there is absolutely no indication the government of Republic City allows dojo's to teach it), by doing so you are saying a Spirit World that Amon is right to oppose I presume holds the city government rest of the dead people in some form or another, but bending is also a spiritual connection as they are directly stopping attempts by non-benders to defend themselves.
*** There's no indication that it is illegal to be taught. The chi-blockers obviously learned from someone before they turned violent. I
well as a power. Non-Benders don't understand how you keep failing to grasp a simple concept. '''This have that. So do they still end up in the same place as Benders when they die?
* The Avatar
is a training camp for insurgents.''' What part of special case. Aside from animals, we've never seen a single human in the spirit world that are you not understanding? It's not "free chi-blocking classes", it's "help overthrow wasn't an Avatar. It stands to reason the bending establishment." Would you join a terrorist group for shooting lessons, then act offended when you got arrested? Of course not, that'd be your own damn fault. If they want to defend themselves, they can take a class from people who haven't waged war on an entire section of the population. Seriously, stop trying to act like it's the material being targeted. It afterlife is nothing of the sort. It is the people doing the teaching all-inclusive, and why that is under fire, and nothing more than that.
*** Amon's people
Avatars are the only ones who teach chi-blocking (that we know of) and its hard to believe that any group teaching chi-blocking wouldn't be immediately grouped with them as a result. My real question is when it started being legal to take down Equalist cells, their advocate in the first episode didn't seem to worry about getting arrested.
*** Freedom of speech is a far cry from militarization, and Amon very recently declared war on bending itself. The training camp was training recruits for battle. The protestor is just talking.
*** The Equalists can argue, accurately even,
short-changed.
** I figured
that chi-blocking is a purely defensive despite all of Amon's rhetoric about a revolution (lots of real world countries have politicians who use that kind of talk without their followers being hunted down).
*** What they claim is ''can'' be used for doesn't change what they ''are'' using it for. They've already attacked several benders. Criminals or not, they've proven their intentions to be less than noble. That kind of spin-doctoring doesn't work for revolutionaries. Politicians can
everyone was reincarnated, and only get away with it because they have the clout. Amon doesn't have that.
*** Whether any of this is correct is probably beside the point. Anyone who is at all sympathetic
Avatar has access to the Equalist position is going to see jackbooted benders taking away their constitutional right to bear electro-sticks, and Amon will be spinning it as exactly that.
*** I was under the impression that the camp was attacked because of the amon posters, indicating them as members of the equalists, not because they were learning chi-blocking.
his/her past lives.



[[folder: Why doesn't anyone use armor or padding?]]
It's pretty clear that chi blocking uses strikes to specific parts of the body. Why has no one, thus far, thought to wear any sort of protection over those body parts? ESPECIALLY someone like Korra, who has been taken down by Equalists more than once AND is a high-profile target?
* Look again. Tarrlok's entire taskforce, including Korra, indeed wear padded armour on the job. It's just that ArmorIsUseless; maybe the important pressure points are in the areas of the body that can't be covered with too dense material without sacrificing vital mobility? Wearing armour in everyday life is incredibly uncomfortable and over time even physically debilitating. It's better to stay agile and learn not to be hit.
** The task force units looked more fancy than useful. And note that, where they actually are wearing what could be armor, not a single Seperatist lands a blow, not even with their shock batons. And even assuming that the task force suits are armored... why didn't Korra wear it when going to confront Amon in "The Voice in the Dark." Of course, Korra was carrying a giant IdiotBall during that part, so that might have been the point of not wearing it.
*** Korra may of felt the armor was limiting her mobility, and she was expecting a one on one fight with Amon. A bit of an idiot ball for thinking he would be dumb enough to go alone, but still it might of not of been for not wearing armor.
*** Either way, Ty Lee's chi-blocking worked fine on Earth Kingdom soldiers in the original series. ArmorIsUseless, so better to preserve mobility.
*** However, in Episode 6, it's explicitly stated that the Metalbender police's armor is capable of blocking chi-blocker attacks, though they're essentially wearing plate armor.
** It's actually a bit of FridgeBrilliance, since most bends need to be extremely mobile and need a wide range of movement in order to fully take advantage of their bending abilities. Heavy armor would merely impair their movements and therefore directly impact their bending ability.
* The Metalbending Police ''do'' wear armor that guards the chakras. That's why the Equalists also carry electro-sticks. That said, waterbending or especially airbending in armor is probably next to impossible unless you're skilled enough to [[AssJokeAproposOfNothing bend by flexing your butt cheeks]] or something similar.

to:

[[folder: What happened to the spectators in the stadium?]]
We have a stadium full of excited spectators. In many cases, fans of sports teams are willing to literally kill you if their team loses.
Why doesn't anyone use armor or padding?]]
on earth, spectators stood still? We are talking about people who can shoot fire from their hands and they are watching their favorite team being tortured right before their eyes Are they so frightened by a lot of tasers that are not able to defend their team?

The second strange thing that happens is that when Korra ends her fight on the roof and back into the stadium there's nobody left. Is it possible to evacuate a building of that size so quickly?
It's pretty clear that chi blocking uses strikes to specific parts of almost as if the body. Why has no one, thus far, thought writers were not sure what the hell to wear any sort of protection over do with those body parts? ESPECIALLY someone like Korra, who has been taken down by people.
* Korra's fight lasts a while, long enough for everyone to pour out the exits. As for the behavior, they may not be at the "riot over a loss" stage of sports devotion.
** Large buildings are also designed with lots of exits (which we know the arena has, the
Equalists more are shown getting through them). You can evacuate enormous stadiums in less than once AND is a high-profile target?
* Look again. Tarrlok's entire taskforce, including Korra, indeed wear padded armour on
minute. Still you'd think the job. It's just that ArmorIsUseless; maybe the important pressure points are in the areas of the body that can't be covered with too dense material without sacrificing vital mobility? Wearing armour in everyday life is incredibly uncomfortable and over time even physically debilitating. It's better Equalists would want witnesses.
*** They did. The audience was forced
to stay agile there while Amon was giving his speech. Only when the Equalists were making their exit did the audience flee.
* The creators are Americans, we don't have deadly riots over sports as a regular occurrence over here. You're also underestimating how scared of the Equalists people are. Amon has spent a long time building up his revolution.
* Tenzin didn't join Lin
and learn Korra in the battle against Amon, so I assumed he was helping to evacuate the crowd. Mako and Bolin may also have assisted; Mako would certainly have wanted to make sure Asami was safe.
* We aren't talking about a group of people who stormed the ring because they hated a team or something. This was a terrorist organization! Most people aren't going to exactly be leaping to try and take on a threat like Amon, especially when he can take away their bending so easily.
* How would they access the arena? If they just shoot fire from where they're sitting, they'd risk hitting the team members,
not to mention other spectators. Maybe the waterbenders could have conjured a flood, but again, risk of injuring the team, not to mention that a coordinated attack would have been difficult, not to mention that the guys with the gloves would have stopped any such attempt in a second. And would you really like to be hit.the one person that Amon singles out from the crowd? Also, don't forget the police force. Most likely, people relied on them and considered themselves safe. Once all policemen started dropping like flies, they probably realised that their chances aren't strong. ALSO, most of them probably don't know how to fight. Remember, it's a time of peace. I'd imagine that most of them are as capable as someone who's been to some self-defence classes. You might be able to fight off a mugger, but it's not exactly a case of MuggingTheMonster.
** The task force units looked more fancy than useful. And note that, where they actually * Not all pro-bending fans are wearing what could be armor, not a single Seperatist lands a blow, not even with their shock batons. And even assuming benders. In fact, that was the task force suits are armored... why didn't Korra wear it when going to confront Amon in "The Voice in the Dark." Of course, Korra was carrying a giant IdiotBall during that part, so that might have been the point of not wearing it.
*** Korra may of felt the armor was limiting her mobility, and she was expecting a one on one fight with Amon. A bit of an idiot ball
whole reason for thinking he would be dumb enough to go alone, but still it might of not of been for not wearing armor.
*** Either way, Ty Lee's chi-blocking worked fine on Earth Kingdom soldiers in the original series. ArmorIsUseless, so better to preserve mobility.
*** However, in Episode 6, it's explicitly stated that the Metalbender police's armor is capable of blocking chi-blocker attacks, though they're essentially wearing plate armor.
** It's actually a bit of FridgeBrilliance, since most bends need to be extremely mobile and need a wide range of movement in order to fully take advantage of their bending abilities. Heavy armor would merely impair their movements and therefore directly impact their bending ability.
* The Metalbending Police ''do'' wear armor that guards the chakras. That's why the Equalists also carry electro-sticks. That said, waterbending or especially airbending in armor is probably next to impossible unless you're skilled enough to [[AssJokeAproposOfNothing bend by flexing your butt cheeks]] or something similar.
Amon's attack. Non-benders were lifting up benders as sports heroes.



[[folder: Why doesn't the Avatar State trigger when Korra is captured by Amon?]]
If the Avatar State is supposed to be a defense mechanism, intended to protect the Avatar when he or she is in mortal danger, why doesn't it activate at the end of "The Voice in the Night?" It certainly seemed like Korra was in danger of death, if not in the literal sense, then in the spiritual and metaphorical sense.[[hottip:*:Korra likely views the loss of her bending as something tantamount to death.]] She was also obviously in the throes of severe emotional distress, as her subsequent breakdown and admission indicate. Why then, when it would be most reasonable to do so, does the Avatar State not activate?
* 1) The Avatar State is a back-seat until a handle on the other elements is acquired. It isn't meant to be A defense mechanism but THE defense mechanism. Even more-so, if the avatar is defeated in it, bye-bye Avatar forever. If it activated every time things got stressful, that would be horrible. 2) Korra is not really spiritually active, instead relying on matter over mind. Since the Avatar State requires spirituality, it would be difficult for someone not spiritual to use it. 3) The most powerful emotion to activate it, barring spirituality, is anger. Korra doesn't restrain her emotions that much so it wouldn't be active that much - she might even be in a mini-avatar-state. Aang put aside his anger even when he was justified to be any amount of angry so he would go into it frequently as that emotion built and then exploded out.
* Aang's almost universally been angry when the Avatar State was triggered. Korra was frightened, but she was also trying to keep it in check. There's also Korra's lack of spirituality to consider. Aang was spiritual to begin with, which may have made his transitions more natural. Korra may be so grounded (so to speak) that she might not be able to access it without a really big push.
** True. Remember how after she was captured she had those Aang flashes. Maybe it was the Avatar state trying to be triggered only she didn't/couldn't let it take over. She did seemed for a moment to think she was saved by Aang, which is exactly what would have happened if he would have taken control
* I think it would have been triggered if he'd tried to take her bending away. When Aang took Ozai's bending, their spirits were basically fighting. When Amon took Lightning Bolt Zold's bending, this fight presumably happened too. Or not, if we assume that his "energybending" is not genuine. The point is, though, that it takes a bit of time, it doesn't happen within a second. So before he'll be able to take away her bending completely, the state would be triggered and he'll be flying across the room. However, since he didn't even try, it wasn't enough to trigger the state.
** This may well be one of the reasons he ''didn't'' do it - he wasn't sure if he would be successful if the avatar state triggered and he found himself in a battle of wills against the entire collective memory of all the Avatars that have ever lived (especially the last Avatar would actually knew energy bending, Aang). Far more effective to soften up Korra with some psychological manipulations.
** Remember what kept Aang from going Avatar State for the third season? His chi was blocked by a locked chakra. When Korra's tied up, she's just been chi blocked. If the chi paths have to be opened and flowing for the Avatar State to occur, then it makes sense if being chi blocked would prevent it.
*** But Aang had specifically gone through a process that would leave him without the Avatar State if any of his chakra were locked. Far as anyone can tell, Korra has gone through no such process. We don't know for sure if chi blocking is enough to block the Avatar State from triggering. Which makes me wonder if a fully-realized Avatar could resist chi blocking?
* The real question for me is why it didn't activate while she was being bloodbent by Tarrlok. Tarrlok had been seen by her past lives as a big enough threat that Aang was sending her visions, and Aang knows that (one of) the only things that can resist bloodbending is the Avatar State. Yakone was a big enough threat to require it, his (more intelligent) son isn't?
* As noted, with it all wrapped up for now, I think it really was just as simple as her lacking a spiritual connection as well as already being quite capable in and of herself. Aang prior his session with Guru Pathik went into the Avatar State involuntarily, generally out of anger. Being already of the most spiritual of the nations, he had no issues forming a connection at all; however he also was forced into many situations where he couldn't get by with just Airbending alone. As I see it, the Avatar State more or less picked up the slack for him until he could get by, and had Azula not shot him when she did - he could've reached full realization one element short (this is going by, realization = ability to blink in a out of the state at Will). For Korra, this wasn't necessary until the grand finale as she already has near mastery over every other element and for all intents and purposes didn't really need the State at all. Once everything had essentially hit rock bottom for her, it was then that she was able not only make a connection; I'd almost reason to say that the Avatar Spirit helped her bring out her own ability to Airbend as proof. Aang himself points this out to her, now that she finally faced something she truly could not get out of, her spirit called out for help; and in turn she became fully realized without having to have lapsed into the Avatar State unwillingly. Perhaps the Avatar Spirit has a minor degree of omniscience.

to:





[[folder: Why doesn't the Avatar State trigger when Korra is captured were all these people killed by Amon?]]
If the Avatar State is supposed to
firebenders?]]
Supposedly, Mako and Bolin's parents, Amon's family, and Sato's wife were all murdered by firebenders. Other benders can
be a defense mechanism, intended to protect the Avatar when he or she is in mortal danger, killers too, so why doesn't it activate at the end of "The Voice in the Night?" It certainly seemed like Korra was in danger of death, if not in the literal sense, then in the spiritual and metaphorical sense.[[hottip:*:Korra likely views the loss of her bending as something tantamount to death.]] She was also obviously in the throes of severe emotional distress, as her subsequent breakdown and admission indicate. Why then, when it would be most reasonable to do so, does the Avatar State not activate?
* 1) The Avatar State is a back-seat until a handle on the other elements is acquired. It isn't meant to be A defense mechanism but THE defense mechanism. Even more-so, if the avatar is defeated in it, bye-bye Avatar forever. If it activated every time things got stressful, that would be horrible. 2) Korra is not really spiritually active, instead relying on matter over mind. Since the Avatar State requires spirituality, it would be difficult for someone not spiritual to use it. 3) The most powerful emotion to activate it, barring spirituality, is anger. Korra doesn't restrain her emotions that much so it wouldn't be active that much - she might even be in a mini-avatar-state. Aang put aside his anger even when he was justified to be any amount of angry so he would go into it frequently as that emotion built and then exploded out.
* Aang's almost universally been angry when the Avatar State was triggered. Korra was frightened, but she was also trying to keep it in check. There's also Korra's lack of spirituality to consider. Aang was spiritual to begin with, which may
have made his transitions more natural. Korra may be so grounded (so to speak) that she might the writers used firebenders for each of them? Something's not be able to access it without a really big push.
** True. Remember how after she was captured she had those Aang flashes. Maybe it was the Avatar state trying to be triggered only she didn't/couldn't let it take over. She did seemed for a moment to think she was saved by Aang, which is exactly what would have happened if he would have taken control
* I think it would have been triggered if he'd tried to take her bending away. When Aang took Ozai's bending, their spirits were basically fighting. When Amon took Lightning Bolt Zold's bending, this fight presumably happened too. Or not, if we assume that his "energybending" is not genuine. The point is, though, that it takes a bit of time, it doesn't happen within a second. So before he'll be able to take away her bending completely, the state would be triggered and he'll be flying across the room. However, since he didn't even try, it wasn't enough to trigger the state.
** This may well be one of the reasons he ''didn't'' do it - he wasn't sure if he would be successful if the avatar state triggered and he found himself in a battle of wills against the entire collective memory of all the Avatars that have ever lived (especially the last Avatar would actually knew energy bending, Aang). Far more effective to soften up Korra with some psychological manipulations.
adding up.
** Remember what kept Aang * Probably simply because the previous generation was still suffering from going Avatar State for the third season? His chi was blocked by a locked chakra. When Korra's tied up, she's just been chi blocked. If aftereffects of the chi paths have to be opened 100-Year War, and flowing for because the Avatar State to occur, then it United Republic consists of the former Fire Kingdom colonies. It makes sense if being chi blocked would prevent it.
*** But Aang had specifically gone through a process
that would leave him without the Avatar State if any of his chakra Firebenders were locked. Far as anyone can tell, Korra has gone through no such process. We don't know for sure if chi blocking is enough to block the Avatar State from triggering. Which makes me wonder if most common type of Bender in the region until the recent times.
** Compare the many movie villains that have
a fully-realized Avatar could resist chi blocking?
* The real question for me
German accent. A firebending is probably still seen as more evil than other forms of bending. This, I think, is why it didn't activate while she was being bloodbent by Tarrlok. Tarrlok had been seen by her past lives as a big enough threat Amon says that Aang was sending her visions, his parents were murdered by a firebender. For the rest... It could be a plot point in the coming series, or a red herring.
* Firebenders can kill a lot easier,
and Aang knows cleaner, than other benders can.
** Not really...creative benders could find plenty of ways to kill quickly and easily. A clever and malicious water bender could easily drown their opponent, and then take the water with them afterwards, leaving no evidence afterwards; no mess. Earthbending probably would be messier, but a rock at full speed applied to just the right spot on the head will still kill instantly. It seems strange
that (one of) firebenders are still the only things rampant killers these days...unless, of course, all the attacks are connected somehow.
*** Drowning takes a lot longer than killing with fire would, and it's doubtful every earthbender could kill so efficiently.
*** Or they could make a spear or a blade out of water. Ice can have sharp edges, and can cut with them (I should know, I cut my finger on a jagged piece of ice once)
*** Smashing people in the head with rocks is a vastly easier method of murder than causing them to die of severe burns. If Zuko had taken a fist sized chunk of stone to the head rather than a blast of fire he would have been brain damaged or dead rather than scarred.
*** Or maybe they just electrocuted them, given
that can resist bloodbending lightning bending is so much more widespread these days. That would be the easiest and fastest method. Nobody said anything about using fire.
*** A powerful waterbender could easily kill someone by [[NightmareFuel by clotting or freezing the blood in their veins or arteries]], which if done in the right place (e.g., the brain) could kill the victim within seconds or minutes, and leave no evidence behind (or plenty of space to plant false evidence).
*** But that's bloodbending. Yakone may well have done that a few times, but overall almost no one has that ability.
* You have to remember that Fire
is the Avatar State. Yakone was a big enough threat to require it, his (more intelligent) son isn't?
* As noted, with it all wrapped up for now, I think it really was just as simple as her lacking a spiritual connection as well as already being quite capable in and of herself. Aang prior his session with Guru Pathik went into the Avatar State involuntarily, generally out of anger. Being already of the most spiritual of the nations, he had no issues forming a connection at all; however he also was forced into many situations where he couldn't get by with just Airbending alone. As I see it, the Avatar State more or less picked up the slack for him until he could get by, and had Azula not shot him when she did - he could've reached full realization
one element short (this that is going by, realization = ability based almost entirely on offensive moves. Also Water and Earth, while they certainly can kill you, don't strike fear into the hearts of people the way Fire does so Fire is the logical choice, not to blink in mention there is still the stigma from 100-Year War as previously mentioned
* As
a whole, Firebenders tend to be more aggressive and more prone to resorting to violence to solve their problems, since that's part of the philosophy of their training. Also, since the Fire Nation technically lost the previous war, and Zuko has made attempts to make it a more peaceful nation, you can bet that there are thousands of disenfranchised Fire Nation soldiers who were suddenly out of a job, and their bitterness carried on to the state next generation.
* Seemed to me like foreshadowing. Chances are we'll find out
at Will). For Korra, this wasn't necessary until some later point in the grand finale as she already has near mastery over every other element and for all intents and purposes didn't really need the State at all. Once everything had essentially hit rock bottom for her, show that it was the same firebender in all cases.
* I read a theory on a message board that in fact all of these murders are the work of a waterbender called Alfred Firebender, and he is just commonly referred to as A. Firebender.
* That's only three instances. It is not statistically significant.
** If we were talking about real life
then that she was able not would absolutely be the case. But this a story, and when events repeat themselves in a story it's usually for a reason.
*** The incidents are also removed from each other in time. Twelve years ago an unspecified number of Agni Kai Triad firebenders broke into the Sato mansion and killed Mrs. Sato. Ten years ago, a firebender mugged Mako and Bolin's parents. Depending on the veracity of Amon's statements, the incident that forced him to wear a mask could be anywhere from twenty to forty years ago. If the writers are attempting to lace these facts with any sort of meaning, they are burying it very deep indeed.
* We also donít know the details of how all these incidents happened (correct me if Iím wrong; Iíve
only seen all the episodes once), so itís possible that one or more of these murders were done not by firebenders but by others who took advantage of residual anti-Fire Nation sentiment to make it look like a connection; I'd almost reason to say firebending incident.
* It turns out
that the Avatar Spirit helped her bring out her own ability [[spoiler:Only two of those attacks actually happened Amon's backstory was a complete fabrication, he was actually secretly a bender]]
* Which leads
to Airbend another question, Hiroshi lost his wife to a Firebender but why did he blamed Earthbenders and Waterbenders as proof. Aang himself points this out to her, now well? Instead of generalizing that she finally faced all benders are bad, he should've developed a hatred towards Firebenders only.
** Remember: This is the guy who went on a MotiveRant about how Amon was going to end bender oppression and make things a better, more just world for Asami and everybody (who isn't a bender), while apparently forgetting that he's the richest person in the biggest, most advanced city in the world. Oppressing him would take some doing.
*** Considering how he started out in poverty and became
something she truly could not get out of, her spirit called out for help; and of a self-made man in turn she became fully realized without having spite of it, it wouldn't be hard to imagine that Sato might have lapsed into had the Avatar State unwillingly. Perhaps bender grudge from much earlier in life. The murder of his wife would have just pushed him over the Avatar Spirit has a minor degree of omniscience. edge.



[[folder: What happens when a non-Bender dies?]]
The Avatar is explicitly reincarnated, and there is a Spirit World that I presume holds the rest of the dead people in some form or another, but bending is also a spiritual connection as well as a power. Non-Benders don't have that. So do they still end up in the same place as Benders when they die?
* The Avatar is a special case. Aside from animals, we've never seen a single human in the spirit world that wasn't an Avatar. It stands to reason the afterlife is all-inclusive, and Avatars are the ones being short-changed.
** I figured that everyone was reincarnated, and only the Avatar has access to his/her past lives.

to:




[[folder: What happens Power Level Math does not work out at all.]]
So...thus far we have two EliteMooks who defeat Mako + Korra in a straight-up fight. One Equalist Lieutenant who defeats Mako + Bolin in a straight-up fight before getting blindsided by Korra. And now, as of Episode 7, Asami can defeat the Equalist LT in a straight-up fight? How does that power differential even work? Sure, there was a "self-defense classes" handwave, but the LT would very likely have had just as much training if not more, and it's not like bending moves (being the exact same movements as several real-life martial arts) are much different from h2h combat
when a non-Bender dies?]]
you remove the elemental part of it, so how exactly is Asami that much better than Mako, Bolin, or Korra at melee?
*
The Avatar is explicitly reincarnated, Lieutenant likely assumed that Asami was just a normal girl and would be easy to take down. She proved him wrong. Basically, when he fought Mako and Bolin, he was fighting for real. When he attacked Asami, he just expected to quickly incapacitate her in a single strike.
* Anyone can make the same motions as a professional boxer that doesn't mean they can actually fight like one. Mako, Bolin, and Korra know how to stop bending from hurting them not fists, the defenses are completely different.
* "Power Level Math" is an utterly, completely false premise, for a start. Unlike Dragonball Z, no,
there is a Spirit World no definite scale that I presume holds determines who will or will not win a given fight of ''any'' kind. There are any number of factors that will tilt the odds in the favor of one side or another in any kind of conflict, regardless of who they are. Just boiling it down to who's fighting doesn't mean a damn thing.\\\
Because the Lieutenant beat Mako and Bolin once doesn't mean he always will. Nor does it mean he will automatically beat anyone those two have beaten. All it means is that he beat Mako and Bolin once. Him getting [=KOed=] by Asami doesn't mean Asami is an unstoppable badass who's better than
the rest of the dead people cast; all it means is he got [=KOed=] by Asami.
* And lets not forget that the Lieutnant has been trained exclusively to fight against Benders, as indeed are Mako, Bolin and Korra. Asami, on the other hand, seems to be trained to fight against martial artists
in some form or another, but bending is also a spiritual connection general.
** That was my thought
as well as a power. Non-Benders don't well. The Equalists are specifically trained to contend against bending-style martial arts; of course they have that. So do they still end up in an advantage over the same place as Benders when they die?
* The Avatar is a special case. Aside
cast's benders. But Asami has been getting general martial arts training from animals, we've never seen a single human in the spirit world that wasn't an Avatar. It stands to very young age, likely from multiple different teachers--and probably from Equalist teachers, as well, since I see no reason the afterlife is all-inclusive, and Avatars are the ones being short-changed.
** I figured
Sato wouldn't want her to have a head-start on that everyone for when and if she was reincarnated, ever brought into the fold. She probably has more sustained martial arts experience than a number of the normal Equalists. Beating the Lieutenant can probably be explained as a combination of his surprise, her speed, and only possible unwillingness on his part to use especially harsh force against the Avatar has access daughter of the dude who just built you all these big mecha that are standing around.
* Asami attacked him with electricity -- something none of his other opponents were seen using against him. It was as effective when used against him as it was when he used it against the other opponents we saw.
* ''And'' you have
to his/her past lives. factor in that the Krew just isn't very good at actual combat. Spectator sport brawling? They're beast. Actual life-or-death struggle? They're meat.







[[folder: What happened to the spectators in the stadium?]]
We have a stadium full of excited spectators. In many cases, fans of sports teams are willing to literally kill you if their team loses. Why on earth, spectators stood still? We are talking about people who can shoot fire from their hands and they are watching their favorite team being tortured right before their eyes Are they so frightened by a lot of tasers that are not able to defend their team?

The second strange thing that happens is that when Korra ends her fight on the roof and back into the stadium there's nobody left. Is it possible to evacuate a building of that size so quickly? It's almost as if the writers were not sure what the hell to do with those people.
* Korra's fight lasts a while, long enough for everyone to pour out the exits. As for the behavior, they may not be at the "riot over a loss" stage of sports devotion.
** Large buildings are also designed with lots of exits (which we know the arena has, the Equalists are shown getting through them). You can evacuate enormous stadiums in less than a minute. Still you'd think the Equalists would want witnesses.
*** They did. The audience was forced to stay there while Amon was giving his speech. Only when the Equalists were making their exit did the audience flee.
* The creators are Americans, we don't have deadly riots over sports as a regular occurrence over here. You're also underestimating how scared of the Equalists people are. Amon has spent a long time building up his revolution.
* Tenzin didn't join Lin and Korra in the battle against Amon, so I assumed he was helping to evacuate the crowd. Mako and Bolin may also have assisted; Mako would certainly have wanted to make sure Asami was safe.
* We aren't talking about a group of people who stormed the ring because they hated a team or something. This was a terrorist organization! Most people aren't going to exactly be leaping to try and take on a threat like Amon, especially when he can take away their bending so easily.
* How would they access the arena? If they just shoot fire from where they're sitting, they'd risk hitting the team members, not to mention other spectators. Maybe the waterbenders could have conjured a flood, but again, risk of injuring the team, not to mention that a coordinated attack would have been difficult, not to mention that the guys with the gloves would have stopped any such attempt in a second. And would you really like to be the one person that Amon singles out from the crowd? Also, don't forget the police force. Most likely, people relied on them and considered themselves safe. Once all policemen started dropping like flies, they probably realised that their chances aren't strong. ALSO, most of them probably don't know how to fight. Remember, it's a time of peace. I'd imagine that most of them are as capable as someone who's been to some self-defence classes. You might be able to fight off a mugger, but it's not exactly a case of MuggingTheMonster.
* Not all pro-bending fans are benders. In fact, that was the whole reason for Amon's attack. Non-benders were lifting up benders as sports heroes.

to:

\n\n\n\n[[folder: What happened to Why did they not take out the spectators mechas with more powerful Earthbending, or Airbending? They were all holding back except Lin.]]
They were
in an underground bunker, the stadium?]]
We
floor was all earth and some powerful earthbending moves like the ones Toph used would have a stadium full of excited spectators. In many cases, fans of sports teams are willing to literally kill you if their team loses. Why on earth, spectators stood still? We are talking about people who can shoot fire from their hands and they are watching their favorite team being tortured right before their eyes Are they so frightened by a lot of tasers that are not able to defend their team?

The second strange thing that happens is that when Korra ends her fight on
sent the roof and back mecha into the stadium there's nobody left. Is it possible to evacuate a building of that size so quickly? It's almost as if walls or buried them in the writers were not sure what the hell to do ground, with those people.
* Korra's fight lasts a while, long
enough for everyone force to pour knock out their drivers. A large boulder shot used in the exits. As for last series could have smashed one of them to pieces. Air was powerful enough to rattle Sato's mecha and very powerful air blast/explosion or a cutting move like the behavior, one Aang used could have severely damaged a mech or toppled it. But since Airbenders always fight defensively, they may not be at never fight without inhibitions. Lin was devastating when it comes to fighting and was the "riot over only one who took out a loss" stage of sports devotion.
** Large buildings
mech, because she was really fighting to kill. It didn't occur to anybody but her that the Mecha's glass canopy is easily damaged. It appears that the metalbender cops are also designed with lots of exits (which we know the arena has, overly reliant on their cables and the Equalists are shown getting through them). You can evacuate enormous stadiums in less than a minute. Still you'd think the Equalists would want witnesses.
*** They did. The audience was forced to stay there while Amon was giving his speech. Only when the Equalists were making
took advantage of their exit did weakness.

Doesn't it really seem like all
the audience flee.
* The creators
benders are Americans, we don't have deadly riots over sports as a regular occurrence over here. You're also underestimating how scared of holding back their best moves?
* I attribute it to surprise and not knowing what they were dealing with, so they stuck with
the Equalists people are. Amon has spent a long time building up his revolution.
* Tenzin
techniques familiar to them, then didn't join Lin last long enough to get their thoughts together and pull out the big guns. For example, Korra in the battle against Amon, so I assumed he was helping started out by throwing fire as she usually does. When that proved ineffective she switched to evacuate the crowd. Mako and Bolin may also have assisted; Mako would certainly have wanted to make sure Asami was safe.
* We aren't talking about a group of people who stormed the ring because
earth, but got taken out before she could do much with it. Next time they hated a team or something. This was a terrorist organization! Most people aren't going to exactly face the mechas they'll be leaping to try better prepared.
** There were a lot of them as well,
and take on a threat like Amon, especially when he can take away their bending so easily.
* How would
they access had the arena? If they just shoot fire from where heroes flanked. Big fancy moves are best suited to fighting a single opponent who's counter attacks you can closely guard against. As for Korra's firebending, that was stupid yes, but she always opens up with firebending. At least she quickly worked out that wasn't working very well. As for the metal benders, they're sitting, they'd risk hitting just not trained in those sort of moves. That's like training cops in anti tank weaponry, expensive and pointless.
** I can buy them getting caught flatfooted by an unexpected enemy... But seriously, we've all seen footage of cops pulling out
the team members, not to mention other spectators. Maybe the waterbenders could have conjured a flood, but again, risk of injuring the team, not to mention stops when faced with that a coordinated attack would have been difficult, not kind of firepower. That their training inhibited them to mention that degree in the guys with the gloves would have stopped any such attempt heat of battle, in a second. And would you really place where cutting loose was not only justified, but mandated? In a situation where basic earthbending moves like to be pilar raising would've served them far better? Ruling on the one person that Amon singles out from field stands: ForgotAboutHisPowers[=/=]IdiotBall combo.
** Oooooorrrrr,
the crowd? cops just aren't very good at regular Earthbending on the fly. Their training might, in fact, be almost entirely metalbending, given how much they rely on it.\\\
Also, don't forget the police force. Most likely, people relied on them discount training. Do you know what training is really for? It's not just techniques and considered themselves safe. Once all policemen started dropping protocols. It's conditioning. It's training your body such that when your mind is scared and you're unable to think, you can keep acting on what has become instinct. I.e., when you're scared and facing something like flies, they probably realised that their those mecha, chances aren't strong. ALSO, most are that you are going to be doing the rote techniques that you've had drilled into you for years instead of them probably getting creative and fancy. That is how armies have worked for pretty much all of human history.\\\
It's not IdiotBall, it's people who have been trained for years falling back on that training when they're in a tense situation and borderline panicking.
** You
don't know how want to fight. Remember, it's inadvertently cause a time of peace. I'd imagine that most of them are as capable as someone who's been to some self-defence classes. You cave-in and wind up killing yourselves in the process. Earthbenders might be able to fight off a mugger, most dangerous underground, but it's not exactly a case of MuggingTheMonster.
* Not all pro-bending fans
they are benders. In fact, that was also vulnerable to being buried with the whole reason for Amon's attack. Non-benders were lifting up benders as sports heroes.enemy in the process.







[[folder: Why were all these people killed by firebenders?]]
Supposedly, Mako and Bolin's parents, Amon's family, and Sato's wife were all murdered by firebenders. Other benders can be killers too, so why have the writers used firebenders for each of them? Something's not adding up.
* Probably simply because the previous generation was still suffering from the aftereffects of the 100-Year War, and because the United Republic consists of the former Fire Kingdom colonies. It makes sense that the Firebenders were the most common type of Bender in the region until the recent times.
** Compare the many movie villains that have a German accent. A firebending is probably still seen as more evil than other forms of bending. This, I think, is why Amon says that his parents were murdered by a firebender. For the rest... It could be a plot point in the coming series, or a red herring.
* Firebenders can kill a lot easier, and cleaner, than other benders can.
** Not really...creative benders could find plenty of ways to kill quickly and easily. A clever and malicious water bender could easily drown their opponent, and then take the water with them afterwards, leaving no evidence afterwards; no mess. Earthbending probably would be messier, but a rock at full speed applied to just the right spot on the head will still kill instantly. It seems strange that firebenders are still the only rampant killers these days...unless, of course, all the attacks are connected somehow.
*** Drowning takes a lot longer than killing with fire would, and it's doubtful every earthbender could kill so efficiently.
*** Or they could make a spear or a blade out of water. Ice can have sharp edges, and can cut with them (I should know, I cut my finger on a jagged piece of ice once)
*** Smashing people in the head with rocks is a vastly easier method of murder than causing them to die of severe burns. If Zuko had taken a fist sized chunk of stone to the head rather than a blast of fire he would have been brain damaged or dead rather than scarred.
*** Or maybe they just electrocuted them, given that lightning bending is so much more widespread these days. That would be the easiest and fastest method. Nobody said anything about using fire.
*** A powerful waterbender could easily kill someone by [[NightmareFuel by clotting or freezing the blood in their veins or arteries]], which if done in the right place (e.g., the brain) could kill the victim within seconds or minutes, and leave no evidence behind (or plenty of space to plant false evidence).
*** But that's bloodbending. Yakone may well have done that a few times, but overall almost no one has that ability.
* You have to remember that Fire is the one element that is based almost entirely on offensive moves. Also Water and Earth, while they certainly can kill you, don't strike fear into the hearts of people the way Fire does so Fire is the logical choice, not to mention there is still the stigma from 100-Year War as previously mentioned
* As a whole, Firebenders tend to be more aggressive and more prone to resorting to violence to solve their problems, since that's part of the philosophy of their training. Also, since the Fire Nation technically lost the previous war, and Zuko has made attempts to make it a more peaceful nation, you can bet that there are thousands of disenfranchised Fire Nation soldiers who were suddenly out of a job, and their bitterness carried on to the next generation.
* Seemed to me like foreshadowing. Chances are we'll find out at some later point in the show that it was the same firebender in all cases.
* I read a theory on a message board that in fact all of these murders are the work of a waterbender called Alfred Firebender, and he is just commonly referred to as A. Firebender.
* That's only three instances. It is not statistically significant.
** If we were talking about real life then that would absolutely be the case. But this a story, and when events repeat themselves in a story it's usually for a reason.
*** The incidents are also removed from each other in time. Twelve years ago an unspecified number of Agni Kai Triad firebenders broke into the Sato mansion and killed Mrs. Sato. Ten years ago, a firebender mugged Mako and Bolin's parents. Depending on the veracity of Amon's statements, the incident that forced him to wear a mask could be anywhere from twenty to forty years ago. If the writers are attempting to lace these facts with any sort of meaning, they are burying it very deep indeed.
* We also donít know the details of how all these incidents happened (correct me if Iím wrong; Iíve only seen all the episodes once), so itís possible that one or more of these murders were done not by firebenders but by others who took advantage of residual anti-Fire Nation sentiment to make it look like a firebending incident.
* It turns out that [[spoiler:Only two of those attacks actually happened Amon's backstory was a complete fabrication, he was actually secretly a bender]]
* Which leads to another question, Hiroshi lost his wife to a Firebender but why did he blamed Earthbenders and Waterbenders as well? Instead of generalizing that all benders are bad, he should've developed a hatred towards Firebenders only.
** Remember: This is the guy who went on a MotiveRant about how Amon was going to end bender oppression and make things a better, more just world for Asami and everybody (who isn't a bender), while apparently forgetting that he's the richest person in the biggest, most advanced city in the world. Oppressing him would take some doing.
*** Considering how he started out in poverty and became something of a self-made man in spite of it, it wouldn't be hard to imagine that Sato might have had the bender grudge from much earlier in life. The murder of his wife would have just pushed him over the edge.

to:

\n\n\n\n[[folder: Why were all these people killed by firebenders?]]
Supposedly, Mako
Are we ever going to see Republic City call for help in dealing with The Equalists?]]
This would seem to be a situation tailor-made for a group of non-bender combatants to at least come in
and Bolin's parents, Amon's family, and Sato's wife were all murdered by firebenders. Other benders can be killers too, so why have consult with Republic City's law enforcement. Like, say... the writers used firebenders for each of them? Something's not adding up.
* Probably simply because the previous generation was
Kyoshi Warriors (assuming they're still suffering around, of course). For that matter, wouldn't word have gotten out about the Equalists by now, and the other three nations would've probably made inquiries about how they could help (if for no other reason than to keep the Equalist movement from the aftereffects spreading to their territories)?
* It's mostly a matter
of the 100-Year War, politics and because perception. The Equalists are the United Republic consists Republic's mess, and having to call in foreign countries to bail them out of the former Fire Kingdom colonies. It makes sense that the Firebenders were the most common type of Bender in the region until the recent times.
** Compare the many movie villains that have a German accent. A firebending is probably still seen as more evil than other forms of bending. This, I think, is why Amon says that his parents were murdered by a firebender. For the rest... It could be a plot point in the coming series, or a red herring.
* Firebenders can kill a lot easier, and cleaner, than other benders can.
** Not really...creative benders could find plenty of ways to kill quickly and easily. A clever and malicious water bender could easily drown their opponent, and then take the water with them afterwards, leaving no evidence afterwards; no mess. Earthbending probably
mess would be messier, but a rock at full speed applied to just the right spot on the head will still kill instantly. deeply politically embarrassing. It seems strange that firebenders are still the only rampant killers these days...unless, of course, all the attacks are connected somehow.
*** Drowning takes a lot longer than killing with fire would, and it's doubtful every earthbender could kill so efficiently.
*** Or they could make a spear or a blade out of water. Ice can have sharp edges, and can cut with them (I should know, I cut my finger on a jagged piece of ice once)
*** Smashing people in the head with rocks is a vastly easier method of murder than causing them to die of severe burns. If Zuko had taken a fist sized chunk of stone to the head rather than a blast of fire he
would have been brain damaged or dead rather than scarred.
*** Or maybe they just electrocuted them, given that lightning bending is so much more widespread these days. That
at the ''very least'' destroy the council's reputation, painting members like Tarrlok as failures. It would be also run the easiest and fastest method. Nobody said anything about using fire.
*** A powerful waterbender could easily kill someone by [[NightmareFuel by clotting or freezing
risk of boosting the blood in their veins or arteries]], which if done in standing of the right place (e.g., Equalists among the brain) could kill Republic's citizenry. Internal domestic disputes are one thing, but foreign troops would sharpen the victim within seconds or minutes, and leave no evidence behind (or plenty of space to plant false evidence).
*** But that's bloodbending. Yakone may well have done that a few times,
battle lines: "The Equalists might be scum, but overall almost no one they're OUR scum."
* One
has that ability.
* You have
to remember that Fire is the one element that is based almost entirely on offensive moves. Also Water and Earth, while the Equalists were being taken seriously they certainly can kill you, don't strike fear into the hearts of people the way Fire does so Fire is the logical choice, not to mention there is still the stigma from 100-Year War as previously mentioned
* As a whole, Firebenders tend to be more aggressive and more prone to resorting to violence to solve their problems, since that's part of the philosophy of their training. Also, since the Fire Nation technically lost the previous war, and Zuko has made attempts to make it a more peaceful nation, you can bet that there are thousands of disenfranchised Fire Nation soldiers who
were suddenly out of a job, and their bitterness carried on to the next generation.
* Seemed to me like foreshadowing. Chances are we'll find out at some later point in the show that it was the same firebender in all cases.
* I read a theory on a message board that in fact all of these murders are the work of a waterbender called Alfred Firebender, and he is just commonly referred to as A. Firebender.
* That's only three instances. It is
not statistically significant.
** If we were talking about real life then that would absolutely be the case. But this a story, and when events repeat themselves in a story it's usually for a reason.
*** The incidents are also removed from each other in time. Twelve years ago an unspecified number of Agni Kai Triad firebenders broke into the Sato mansion and killed Mrs. Sato. Ten years ago, a firebender mugged Mako and Bolin's parents. Depending on the veracity of Amon's statements, the incident that forced him to wear a mask could be anywhere from twenty to forty years ago. If the writers are attempting to lace these facts with any sort of meaning, they are burying it very deep indeed.
* We also donít know the details of how all these incidents happened (correct me if Iím wrong; Iíve only
seen all the episodes once), so itís possible that one or more of these murders were done not by firebenders but by others who took advantage of residual anti-Fire Nation sentiment to make it look like a firebending incident.
* It turns out that [[spoiler:Only two of those attacks actually happened Amon's backstory was a complete fabrication, he was actually secretly a bender]]
* Which leads to another question, Hiroshi lost his wife to a Firebender but why did he blamed Earthbenders and Waterbenders
as well? Instead of generalizing that all benders are bad, he should've developed a hatred towards Firebenders only.
** Remember: This is the guy who went on a MotiveRant about how Amon was going to end bender oppression and make things a better, more just world for Asami and everybody (who isn't a bender), while apparently forgetting that he's the richest person in the biggest, most advanced city in the world. Oppressing him would take some doing.
*** Considering how he started out in poverty and became
something that couldn't be contained in the city, it was only in the last two episodes that they realized just how big of a self-made man threat the Equalists truly are.
* It is mentioned
in spite of it, it wouldn't be hard the Welcome to imagine Republic City interactive game that Sato might have had the bender grudge from much earlier in life. The murder of his wife would have just pushed him over Kyoshi Warriors are still around.
* Yes. In "Turning
the edge.Tides," Tenzin calls the United Forces fleet to help them.



[[folder: Power Level Math does not work out at all.]]
So...thus far we have two EliteMooks who defeat Mako + Korra in a straight-up fight. One Equalist Lieutenant who defeats Mako + Bolin in a straight-up fight before getting blindsided by Korra. And now, as of Episode 7, Asami can defeat the Equalist LT in a straight-up fight? How does that power differential even work? Sure, there was a "self-defense classes" handwave, but the LT would very likely have had just as much training if not more, and it's not like bending moves (being the exact same movements as several real-life martial arts) are much different from h2h combat when you remove the elemental part of it, so how exactly is Asami that much better than Mako, Bolin, or Korra at melee?
* The Lieutenant likely assumed that Asami was just a normal girl and would be easy to take down. She proved him wrong. Basically, when he fought Mako and Bolin, he was fighting for real. When he attacked Asami, he just expected to quickly incapacitate her in a single strike.
* Anyone can make the same motions as a professional boxer that doesn't mean they can actually fight like one. Mako, Bolin, and Korra know how to stop bending from hurting them not fists, the defenses are completely different.
* "Power Level Math" is an utterly, completely false premise, for a start. Unlike Dragonball Z, no, there is no definite scale that determines who will or will not win a given fight of ''any'' kind. There are any number of factors that will tilt the odds in the favor of one side or another in any kind of conflict, regardless of who they are. Just boiling it down to who's fighting doesn't mean a damn thing.\\\
Because the Lieutenant beat Mako and Bolin once doesn't mean he always will. Nor does it mean he will automatically beat anyone those two have beaten. All it means is that he beat Mako and Bolin once. Him getting [=KOed=] by Asami doesn't mean Asami is an unstoppable badass who's better than the rest of the cast; all it means is he got [=KOed=] by Asami.
* And lets not forget that the Lieutnant has been trained exclusively to fight against Benders, as indeed are Mako, Bolin and Korra. Asami, on the other hand, seems to be trained to fight against martial artists in general.
** That was my thought as well. The Equalists are specifically trained to contend against bending-style martial arts; of course they have an advantage over the cast's benders. But Asami has been getting general martial arts training from a very young age, likely from multiple different teachers--and probably from Equalist teachers, as well, since I see no reason Sato wouldn't want her to have a head-start on that for when and if she was ever brought into the fold. She probably has more sustained martial arts experience than a number of the normal Equalists. Beating the Lieutenant can probably be explained as a combination of his surprise, her speed, and possible unwillingness on his part to use especially harsh force against the daughter of the dude who just built you all these big mecha that are standing around.
* Asami attacked him with electricity -- something none of his other opponents were seen using against him. It was as effective when used against him as it was when he used it against the other opponents we saw.
* ''And'' you have to factor in that the Krew just isn't very good at actual combat. Spectator sport brawling? They're beast. Actual life-or-death struggle? They're meat.

to:

[[folder: Power Level Math does The ruling council of Republic City... Really?]]
A city of the size and importance of Republic City only as a five-member ruling council? Mayberry had more councilors than that! Not to mention there doesn't seem to be any non-bender on the council. That's a serious oversight in the best of times. And this is beside the fact that the members other than Tarrlok and Tenzin don't seem to have a collective spine between the three of them.
* I think that's kind of the point. The republic of nations was set up as the representation of an ideal, rather than as an actual, practical government. It symbolizes the nations coming together, so all the nations should get a representative. All nations should be treated equally, so they got an equal amount of representation (and Katara and Sokka probably insisted that they shouldn't be lumped in with the northern water tribe). I doubt anyone in the gaang actually considered any long-term consequences when they were organising the city. It's indeed a stupid way to organise a country, but it is one I can see the gaang, especially aang making.
* The size of the ruling Council is not unrealistic. The Swiss equivalent, the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_Federal_Council Swiss Federal Council]] is not much larger.
* Um...OP, that's the point. The Equalists aren't completely wrong. Everyone on the council is a bender, they're not elected officals, not to mention, since they're each from a different nation presumably most of them lived in that nation until chosen as a council member (the exception being Tenzin). They're bringing in values and opinions that may
not work out in a place Republic City. It's like if the Governor of Texas was from Alaska.
* Remember that Republic City is just that, a city, and it has inhereted its politics from three monarchies and the loose confederation of tribes in the South. Five people sharing ultimate descision making power is probably quite large enormous by their standards.
* In the flashbacks, City Hall is full of people, with Aang sitting
at all.]]
So...thus far we
one of the lower tables, occupying no special place. In the current time, five people sit in the middle of the giant, conspicuously empty hall, with no one around, not even a secretary to record minutes. Something seems to have two EliteMooks who defeat Mako + happened that drastically altered the structure of government after the city's founding.
** Actually, it's more likely that the flashbacks are part of a trial. Specifically, Yakone's trial. The big room with the lines of benches that
Korra in a straight-up fight. One Equalist Lieutenant who defeats Mako + Bolin in a straight-up fight threw Tarlok into before getting blindsided by Korra. And now, as of Episode 7, Asami can defeat the Equalist LT in a straight-up fight? How does he started bloodbending? Yeah, it's that power differential even work? Sure, there was a "self-defense classes" handwave, but room.
* Did we ever actually get confirmation that everyone on
the LT would very council is a bender?
** Tarrlok's speech in The Voice in the Night wouldn't be as effective if his audience had contained non-benders.
** And it's hard to imagine non-benders voting for the non-bender curfew law.
** It seems
likely that the current Council only has benders on it but flashbacks indicate that it isn't a requirement, otherwise [[spoiler:Sokka]] could never have had just as much training if not more, been a member.
*** Added to that, look two seats to the right of Sokka--there's someone wearing Air Nomad robes, who also couldn't be a bender.
*** Being the brother-in-law and chosen proxy (If he'd wanted to, Aang could've been on the Council) of a borderline deity (The Avatar) probably helped in that regard,
and it's not like bending moves (being the exact same movements as several real-life martial arts) are much different from h2h combat when you remove the elemental part of it, so how exactly is Asami that much better than Mako, Bolin, or Korra at melee?
* The Lieutenant likely assumed that Asami was just a normal girl and would be easy to take down. She proved him wrong. Basically, when he fought Mako and Bolin, he was fighting for real. When he attacked Asami, he just expected to quickly incapacitate her in a single strike.
* Anyone can make the same motions as a professional boxer that doesn't mean they can actually fight like one. Mako, Bolin, and Korra know how to stop bending from hurting them not fists, the defenses are completely different.
* "Power Level Math" is an utterly, completely false premise, for a start. Unlike Dragonball Z, no, there is no definite scale that determines who will or will not win a given fight of ''any'' kind. There are any number of factors that will tilt the odds in the favor of one side or another in any kind of conflict, regardless of who they are. Just boiling it down to who's fighting doesn't mean a damn thing.\\\
Because the Lieutenant beat Mako and Bolin once doesn't mean he always will. Nor does it mean he will automatically beat anyone those two have beaten. All it means is that he beat Mako and Bolin once. Him getting [=KOed=] by Asami doesn't mean Asami is an unstoppable badass who's better than the rest of the cast; all it means is he got [=KOed=] by Asami.
* And lets not forget that the Lieutnant has been trained exclusively to fight against Benders, as indeed are Mako, Bolin and Korra. Asami, on the other hand, seems to be trained to fight against martial artists in general.
** That was my thought as well. The Equalists are specifically trained to contend against bending-style martial arts; of course they have an advantage over the cast's benders. But Asami has been getting general martial arts training from a very young age, likely from multiple different teachers--and probably from Equalist teachers, as well, since I see no reason Sato wouldn't want her to have a head-start on that for when and if she was ever brought into the fold. She probably has more sustained martial arts experience than a number of the normal Equalists. Beating the Lieutenant can probably be explained as a combination of his surprise, her speed, and
certainly possible unwillingness on his part to use especially harsh force against the daughter of the dude who just built you all these big mecha that are standing around.
things have become more pro-bender and anti-nonbender since Aang's death.
* Asami attacked him What's so wrong with electricity -- something none of his other opponents were seen using against him. It was as effective when used against him as it was when he used it against the other opponents we saw.
* ''And'' you have to factor in that the Krew just
there being only 5 councilors? Republic city isn't all that big (Well, compared to most other cities it is very good at actual combat. Spectator sport brawling? They're beast. Actual life-or-death struggle? They're meat.large, but not when compared with nations, which are ruled by 1 person (Earth King, Fire Lord, Water... umm.... King). Omashu, which is of fairly comparable size, was ruled by Bumi all by himself. That said, I do agree that they should likely include a non-bender or two (to make the number odd to prevent deadlock) to the council. If Amon wasn't... well, Amon and the equalists had had a proper leader, that would have been a more likely course of action for them.
** What's so wrong with there being only five councilors is that The United Republic isn't just Republic City. The council is supposed to be passing laws for an entire nation, not just one city, and five people isn't enough for that sort of task.





[[folder: Why did Shiro, the pro-bending announcer, get electrocuted by the Equalists?]]
According to WordofGod, he was also a non-bender.
* Amon probably didn't want anyone's voice going out on the airwaves except his own.
* The Equalists are violent, ideological revolutionaries. Non-benders opposing their agenda would be the equivalent of class traitors and treated as such.
** [[HarryPotter "If you ask me, a blood tratior's as bad as a mudblood."]]

to:

\n\n[[folder: Why did Shiro, is there only one Earthbending councilor?]]
Much like
the pro-bending announcer, get electrocuted by the Equalists?]]
According to WordofGod, he was
Headscracther above, I also question why the council is set up the way it is. But for me I have to wonder why the earthbenders only have one representative? It is understandable why fire and air only have one. (Both have small populations.) And it is also understandable why the water tribes have two representatives. They are two nations and thus they need representatives from each nation. But the Earth Kingdom is a non-bender.
* Amon
massive country with many different regions and probably didn't want anyone's voice going the largest population out of all the nations. Plus, they even have a population of water benders (the swamp folks) and firebenders (those who came during the war and never left). You'd think they'd at least have two representatives like the water tribes?
* The Earth Kingdom is evidently still a kingdom, with a single ruler, so the representative is a representative of the Earth King.
** The Earth Kingdom probably doesn't recognize any Earth Kingdom territory that wasn't reorganized into the United Republic of nations as a separate entity, and any would-be independent Earth nations probably don't have the strength or influence to get a seat
on the airwaves except his own.
* The Equalists are violent, ideological revolutionaries. Non-benders opposing their agenda
Council, as they probably would be hedged out by the equivalent Earth Kingdom. The Southern Water Tribe meanwhile probably gained a huge amount of class traitors influence due to two of their members being major players in ending the war, allowing them to be independently represented.
** Unlike the isolationist Northern Water Tribe, the South ''helped'' the Earth Kingdom during the war by providing it with a small but effective naval force. Perhaps the Earth Kingdom went ''quid pro quo'' post-war, repaying the debt by lobbying for the South to get a seat.
* Also the Fire Nation members who came
and treated never left were formed into the United Republic of Nations, which Republic City was the capital of.
* The US Senate has two representatives for each state - the same number for Wyoming (568K people) and California (38M people, over 66 times
as such.
many) - and they have several exclusive powers the House does not. At the time the US Constitution was drafted, none of the less populated states would settle for a pure proportional representation scheme, due to fear of being marginalized by more populated areas with very different political interests. I think the analogy is appropriate here.
** [[HarryPotter "If you ask me, a blood tratior's as bad as a mudblood."]]The US also created the House of Representatives because the Senate system alone was completely unacceptable, although including that would make their politics much more complex without adding anything to the show.



[[folder: Why did they not take out the mechas with more powerful Earthbending, or Airbending? They were all holding back except Lin.]]
They were in an underground bunker, the floor was all earth and some powerful earthbending moves like the ones Toph used would have sent the mecha into the walls or buried them in the ground, with enough force to knock out their drivers. A large boulder shot used in the last series could have smashed one of them to pieces. Air was powerful enough to rattle Sato's mecha and very powerful air blast/explosion or a cutting move like the one Aang used could have severely damaged a mech or toppled it. But since Airbenders always fight defensively, they never fight without inhibitions. Lin was devastating when it comes to fighting and was the only one who took out a mech, because she was really fighting to kill. It didn't occur to anybody but her that the Mecha's glass canopy is easily damaged. It appears that the metalbender cops are overly reliant on their cables and the Equalists took advantage of their weakness.

Doesn't it really seem like all the benders are holding back their best moves?
* I attribute it to surprise and not knowing what they were dealing with, so they stuck with the techniques familiar to them, then didn't last long enough to get their thoughts together and pull out the big guns. For example, Korra started out by throwing fire as she usually does. When that proved ineffective she switched to earth, but got taken out before she could do much with it. Next time they face the mechas they'll be better prepared.
** There were a lot of them as well, and they had the heroes flanked. Big fancy moves are best suited to fighting a single opponent who's counter attacks you can closely guard against. As for Korra's firebending, that was stupid yes, but she always opens up with firebending. At least she quickly worked out that wasn't working very well. As for the metal benders, they're just not trained in those sort of moves. That's like training cops in anti tank weaponry, expensive and pointless.
** I can buy them getting caught flatfooted by an unexpected enemy... But seriously, we've all seen footage of cops pulling out the stops when faced with that kind of firepower. That their training inhibited them to that degree in the heat of battle, in a place where cutting loose was not only justified, but mandated? In a situation where basic earthbending moves like pilar raising would've served them far better? Ruling on the field stands: ForgotAboutHisPowers[=/=]IdiotBall combo.
** Oooooorrrrr, the cops just aren't very good at regular Earthbending on the fly. Their training might, in fact, be almost entirely metalbending, given how much they rely on it.\\\
Also, don't discount training. Do you know what training is really for? It's not just techniques and protocols. It's conditioning. It's training your body such that when your mind is scared and you're unable to think, you can keep acting on what has become instinct. I.e., when you're scared and facing something like those mecha, chances are that you are going to be doing the rote techniques that you've had drilled into you for years instead of getting creative and fancy. That is how armies have worked for pretty much all of human history.\\\
It's not IdiotBall, it's people who have been trained for years falling back on that training when they're in a tense situation and borderline panicking.
** You don't want to inadvertently cause a cave-in and wind up killing yourselves in the process. Earthbenders might be most dangerous underground, but they are also vulnerable to being buried with the enemy in the process.

to:















[[folder: Why did they not take out the mechas with more powerful Earthbending, or Airbending? They were all holding back except Lin.]]
They were in an underground bunker, the floor was all earth and some powerful earthbending moves like the ones Toph used would
Episodes? Season Finale?]]
I may
have sent heard wrong, but according to the mecha into commercial, the walls or buried them in the ground, with enough force to knock out their drivers. A large boulder shot used in the last series could have smashed one of them to pieces. Air was powerful enough to rattle Sato's mecha and very powerful air blast/explosion or a cutting move like the one Aang used could have severely damaged a mech or toppled it. But since Airbenders always fight defensively, they never fight without inhibitions. Lin was devastating when it comes to fighting and was the only one who took out a mech, because she was really fighting to kill. It didn't occur to anybody but her that the Mecha's glass canopy Season Finale is easily damaged. It appears that the metalbender cops are overly reliant on their cables and the Equalists took advantage of their weakness.

Doesn't it really seem like all the benders are holding back their best moves?
* I attribute it to surprise and not knowing what they were dealing with, so they stuck with the techniques familiar to them, then didn't last long enough to get their thoughts together and pull out the big guns. For example, Korra started out by throwing fire as she usually does. When that proved ineffective she switched to earth, but got taken out before she could do much with it. Next time they face the mechas they'll be better prepared.
** There were
next week, a lot of them as well, and they had the heroes flanked. Big fancy moves are best suited to fighting a single opponent who's counter attacks you can closely guard against. As for Korra's firebending, that was stupid yes, but she always opens up with firebending. At least she quickly worked out that wasn't working very well. As for the metal benders, they're just not trained in those sort of moves. That's like training cops in anti tank weaponry, expensive and pointless.
** I can buy them getting caught flatfooted by an unexpected enemy... But seriously, we've all seen footage of cops pulling out the stops when faced with that kind of firepower. That their training inhibited them to that degree in the heat of battle, in a place where cutting loose was not only justified, but mandated? In a situation where basic earthbending moves like pilar raising would've served them far better? Ruling on the field stands: ForgotAboutHisPowers[=/=]IdiotBall combo.
** Oooooorrrrr, the cops just aren't very good at regular Earthbending on the fly. Their training might, in fact, be almost entirely metalbending, given how much they rely on it.\\\
Also,
One-Hour season finale. Cool, i'm excited, don't discount training. Do you know what training is really for? It's not just techniques and protocols. It's conditioning. It's training your body such that when your mind is scared and you're unable to think, you can keep acting on what has become instinct. I.e., when you're scared and facing something like those mecha, chances are that you are going get me wrong, but one hour? that's two episodes, right? which means, after next week, the series will be at 11 episodes. I thought it was supposed to be doing twelve. I guess its possible to fit three episodes in an hour, but it doesn't seem likely given how many commercials will be involved. So, was an episode cancelled, did Nick just screw up, or did i just miscount?
* No,
the rote techniques season finale is being advertised coming out in 23rd of June, two weeks from now. Next week is still business as usual. They're just advertising early.
* Good, thanks for clearing
that you've had drilled into you up for years instead me. I think i'd go through withdraws if they cut an episode.
** At least I ''think'' this is the case. I got no confirmation either, but at least there has been no hint
of getting creative and fancy. That is how armies have worked for pretty much all of human history.\\\
It's not IdiotBall, it's
leaving out next week's episode in any source I know. Our own wiki tells that Turning the Tides will come out in June 16th.
** Many
people who have been trained for years falling back on seem to believe there won't be an episode next week. Good job, Nick. I think that training when they're in a tense situation and borderline panicking.
** You don't want to inadvertently cause a cave-in and wind up killing yourselves in
promo was more harmful than no promo at all like the process. Earthbenders might be most dangerous underground, but they are also vulnerable to being buried with the enemy in the process.last couple of weeks.



[[folder: Are we ever going to see Republic City call for help in dealing with The Equalists?]]
This would seem to be a situation tailor-made for a group of non-bender combatants to at least come in and consult with Republic City's law enforcement. Like, say... the Kyoshi Warriors (assuming they're still around, of course). For that matter, wouldn't word have gotten out about the Equalists by now, and the other three nations would've probably made inquiries about how they could help (if for no other reason than to keep the Equalist movement from spreading to their territories)?
* It's mostly a matter of politics and perception. The Equalists are the United Republic's mess, and having to call in foreign countries to bail them out of that mess would be deeply politically embarrassing. It would at the ''very least'' destroy the council's reputation, painting members like Tarrlok as failures. It would also run the risk of boosting the standing of the Equalists among the Republic's citizenry. Internal domestic disputes are one thing, but foreign troops would sharpen the battle lines: "The Equalists might be scum, but they're OUR scum."
* One has to remember that while the Equalists were being taken seriously they were not seen as something that couldn't be contained in the city, it was only in the last two episodes that they realized just how big of a threat the Equalists truly are.
* It is mentioned in the Welcome to Republic City interactive game that the Kyoshi Warriors are still around.
* Yes. In "Turning the Tides," Tenzin calls the United Forces fleet to help them.

to:





[[folder: Are we ever going to see Republic City call for help in dealing with Why is everybody so lightly dressed?]]
The Equalists?]]
This would seem
only thing coming close to be a situation tailor-made for a group reasonable outfit is Lin's coat.
* She had time to change, they did not.
** It's less about that, it's their choice
of non-bender combatants to at least come wardrobe in the first place. It's winter, and consult with Republic City's law enforcement. Like, say... the Kyoshi Warriors (assuming they're still around, wearing the same things they are wearing all the time. Korra, of course). For that matter, wouldn't word course, is the worst offender, leaving the house like that. The Satomobiles aren't exactly warm and cozy either, which would have gotten out about explained why Bolin and Mako don't put on more clothes.
* Korra use to live in
the Equalists by now, and the other three nations would've South Pole. She's probably made inquiries about how they could help (if for no other reason than use to keep the Equalist movement from spreading cold. Mako, Bolin, And Asami didn't have time to their territories)?
* It's mostly a matter of politics and perception. The Equalists are the United Republic's mess, and having to call in foreign countries to bail them
change what with breaking out of that mess would be deeply politically embarrassing. It would at the ''very least'' destroy the council's reputation, painting members like Tarrlok as failures. It would also run the risk of boosting the standing of the Equalists among the Republic's citizenry. Internal domestic disputes are one thing, but foreign troops would sharpen the battle lines: "The Equalists might be scum, but they're OUR scum."
* One has to
jail and all. Tenzin's cloths seem pretty warm. (Don't quite remember that while the Equalists were being taken seriously they were not seen as something that couldn't be contained in the city, it what he was only in the last two episodes that they realized just how big of a threat the Equalists truly are.
wearing.)
* It is mentioned in the Welcome to Republic City interactive game that the Kyoshi Warriors are still around.
* Yes. In "Turning the Tides,"
Tenzin calls has the United Forces fleet excuse of being an airbender. Aang seemed just fine in both Poles with his regular clothes; fandom is that he used airbending to help them.insulate himself. Tenzin would have learned the technique from his father. As for Mako and Bolin, remember they lived as orphans on the streets; they know how to deal with being in winter weather without proper clothing.
* Korra and Mako are firebenders; they don't need heavy clothing to keep warm. Asami and Bolin are reasonably well dressed; judging from the copious snowfall, it can't be much below freezing, if at all. Thick snow only falls in relatively warm winter weather.










[[folder: The ruling council of Republic City... Really?]]
A city of the size and importance of Republic City only as a five-member ruling council? Mayberry had more councilors than that! Not to mention there doesn't seem to be any non-bender on the council. That's a serious oversight in the best of times. And this is beside the fact that the members other than Tarrlok and Tenzin don't seem to have a collective spine between the three of them.
* I think that's kind of the point. The republic of nations was set up as the representation of an ideal, rather than as an actual, practical government. It symbolizes the nations coming together, so all the nations should get a representative. All nations should be treated equally, so they got an equal amount of representation (and Katara and Sokka probably insisted that they shouldn't be lumped in with the northern water tribe). I doubt anyone in the gaang actually considered any long-term consequences when they were organising the city. It's indeed a stupid way to organise a country, but it is one I can see the gaang, especially aang making.
* The size of the ruling Council is not unrealistic. The Swiss equivalent, the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_Federal_Council Swiss Federal Council]] is not much larger.
* Um...OP, that's the point. The Equalists aren't completely wrong. Everyone on the council is a bender, they're not elected officals, not to mention, since they're each from a different nation presumably most of them lived in that nation until chosen as a council member (the exception being Tenzin). They're bringing in values and opinions that may not work in a place Republic City. It's like if the Governor of Texas was from Alaska.
* Remember that Republic City is just that, a city, and it has inhereted its politics from three monarchies and the loose confederation of tribes in the South. Five people sharing ultimate descision making power is probably quite large enormous by their standards.
* In the flashbacks, City Hall is full of people, with Aang sitting at one of the lower tables, occupying no special place. In the current time, five people sit in the middle of the giant, conspicuously empty hall, with no one around, not even a secretary to record minutes. Something seems to have happened that drastically altered the structure of government after the city's founding.
** Actually, it's more likely that the flashbacks are part of a trial. Specifically, Yakone's trial. The big room with the lines of benches that Korra threw Tarlok into before he started bloodbending? Yeah, it's that room.
* Did we ever actually get confirmation that everyone on the council is a bender?
** Tarrlok's speech in The Voice in the Night wouldn't be as effective if his audience had contained non-benders.
** And it's hard to imagine non-benders voting for the non-bender curfew law.
** It seems likely that the current Council only has benders on it but flashbacks indicate that it isn't a requirement, otherwise [[spoiler:Sokka]] could never have been a member.
*** Added to that, look two seats to the right of Sokka--there's someone wearing Air Nomad robes, who also couldn't be a bender.
*** Being the brother-in-law and chosen proxy (If he'd wanted to, Aang could've been on the Council) of a borderline deity (The Avatar) probably helped in that regard, and it's certainly possible that things have become more pro-bender and anti-nonbender since Aang's death.
* What's so wrong with there being only 5 councilors? Republic city isn't all that big (Well, compared to most other cities it is very large, but not when compared with nations, which are ruled by 1 person (Earth King, Fire Lord, Water... umm.... King). Omashu, which is of fairly comparable size, was ruled by Bumi all by himself. That said, I do agree that they should likely include a non-bender or two (to make the number odd to prevent deadlock) to the council. If Amon wasn't... well, Amon and the equalists had had a proper leader, that would have been a more likely course of action for them.
** What's so wrong with there being only five councilors is that The United Republic isn't just Republic City. The council is supposed to be passing laws for an entire nation, not just one city, and five people isn't enough for that sort of task.

to:

\n\n\n\n\n\n\n[[folder: The ruling council of Republic City... Really?]]
A city of
Why wasn't Yakone in solitary after that stunt he pulled?]]
He somehow had
the size opportunity to beget Tarrlok 4 years later, despite receiving a life sentence for 12 counts of bloodbending and importance proceeding to bloodbend the entire courtroom to resist being sent to jail, and then bloodbends the Avatar with intent to kill. That seems like it merits the sentence being upgraded to life in prison with no human contact (and only because they don't have the death penalty out of respect for Aang), except the people who will bring his meals, who are in turn forbidden to speak to him.
* Sounds like you're expecting
Republic City only as a five-member ruling council? Mayberry had more councilors than that! Not to mention there doesn't seem prisons to be any non-bender on the council. That's a serious oversight as cruel as Fire Nation prisons in the best of times. And this is beside the fact original series. It's not unlikely that the members other than Tarrlok influence of Aang/Katara/etc made the retributive system in Republic City more humane, and Tenzin don't seem to have a collective spine between the three of them.
* I think that's kind of the point. The republic of nations was set up as the representation of an ideal, rather than as an actual, practical government. It symbolizes the nations coming together, so all the nations should get a representative. All nations should be treated equally, so they got an equal amount of representation (and Katara and Sokka probably insisted that they shouldn't be lumped
things like conjugal visits were allowed in with the northern water tribe). I doubt anyone in the gaang actually their prisons, which would've made Tarrlok's conception possible. Since Aang took Yakone's bending away, he wasn't considered any long-term consequences when they were organising dangerous anymore, so he wouldn't have needed to be kept in solitary. That, or Yakone simply escaped from prison, and catching him wasn't a high priority anymore because he'd lost his bloodbending, so he managed to find a wife and live the city. It's indeed a stupid way to organise a country, but it is one I can see the gaang, especially aang making.
* The size
rest of the ruling Council is not unrealistic. The Swiss equivalent, the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_Federal_Council Swiss Federal Council]] is not much larger.
his life in hiding.
* Um...OP, that's the point. The Equalists aren't completely wrong. Everyone on the council is a bender, Because they're not elected officals, not evil scum who want to mention, since they're each from a different nation presumably most of them lived drive their prisoners insane? Even Ozai wasn't given such treatment.
* Aang says he's 40 years old
in the flashback which means that nation until chosen as a council member (the exception being Tenzin). They're bringing in values stated it is 42 years ago, he dies 26 years later and opinions that may not work in a place Republic City. It's like if Korra is now 16. According to the Governor of Texas was from Alaska.
* Remember that
Welcome to Republic City game Tarrlok is just that, a city, and it has inhereted its politics from three monarchies and the loose confederation of tribes 37. He was born when his father was in the South. Five people sharing ultimate descision making power is probably quite large enormous by their standards.
* In the flashbacks, City Hall is full of people, with Aang sitting at one of the lower tables, occupying no special place. In the current time, five people sit in the middle of the giant, conspicuously empty hall, with no one around, not even a secretary to record minutes. Something seems to have happened that drastically altered the structure of government after the city's founding.
prison.
** Actually, it's more likely that the flashbacks are part of a trial. Specifically, Yakone's trial. The big room with the lines of benches that Korra threw Tarlok into before he started bloodbending? Yeah, it's that room.
* Did we ever actually get confirmation that everyone on the council is a bender?
**
Or Tarrlok's speech listed age is wrong or represents a lie he's told. A fit man in The Voice in the Night wouldn't be as effective if his audience had contained non-benders.
** And it's hard to imagine non-benders voting for the non-bender curfew law.
** It seems likely that the current Council only has benders on it but flashbacks indicate that it isn't a requirement, otherwise [[spoiler:Sokka]]
forties could never pass as 37, especially one as vain as Tarrlock.
** Could easily be a lie. Tarrlock does bare a resemblance to Yakone after all...if anyone brought attention to it, he could just make an offhand comment that he was born after Yakone was already in jail and the matter would drop.
** Or maybe Yakone was broken out of prison. He did
have been a member.
*** Added to that, look two seats to the right of Sokka--there's someone wearing Air Nomad robes, who also couldn't be a bender.
*** Being the brother-in-law and chosen proxy (If he'd wanted to, Aang could've been on the Council) of a borderline deity (The Avatar) probably helped in that regard, and it's certainly
criminal empire.
** It's
possible that things have become more pro-bender the background people, like JK Rowling, can't do math, and anti-nonbender since Aang's death.
* What's so wrong with there being only 5 councilors? Republic city
Tarrlock isn't all that big (Well, compared to most other cities it is very large, but not when compared with nations, which are ruled by 1 person (Earth King, Fire Lord, Water... umm.... King). Omashu, which is of fairly comparable size, was ruled by Bumi all by himself. That said, I do agree that they should likely include a non-bender or two (to make the number odd to prevent deadlock) to the council. If Amon wasn't... well, Amon and the equalists had had a proper leader, that would have been a more likely course of action for them.
** What's so wrong with there being only five councilors is that The United Republic isn't just Republic City. The council is
supposed to be passing laws for an entire nation, have been born after Yakone went to prison.
** The math assumes the Avatar is reborn right away, which may
not just one city, and five people isn't enough for be the case. Alternatively, considering the catastrophic emotional consequences of removing someone's bending, the council may have amended his sentence on the grounds that sort of task.he has "suffered enough" and is no longer a threat.
*** A previous episode specifically states that Yakone was defeated 42 years ago.
**** Considering the fact that nobody knew Tarrlock was Yakone's son, I would say that Tarrlock is older than 42 and lied about his age along with his parentage.
**** Same troper as above, I stay corrected. The real answer is that Yakone escaped.



[[folder: Why is there only one Earthbending councilor?]]
Much like the the Headscracther above, I also question why the council is set up the way it is. But for me I have to wonder why the earthbenders only have one representative? It is understandable why fire and air only have one. (Both have small populations.) And it is also understandable why the water tribes have two representatives. They are two nations and thus they need representatives from each nation. But the Earth Kingdom is a massive country with many different regions and probably the largest population out of all the nations. Plus, they even have a population of water benders (the swamp folks) and firebenders (those who came during the war and never left). You'd think they'd at least have two representatives like the water tribes?
* The Earth Kingdom is evidently still a kingdom, with a single ruler, so the representative is a representative of the Earth King.
** The Earth Kingdom probably doesn't recognize any Earth Kingdom territory that wasn't reorganized into the United Republic of nations as a separate entity, and any would-be independent Earth nations probably don't have the strength or influence to get a seat on the Council, as they probably would be hedged out by the Earth Kingdom. The Southern Water Tribe meanwhile probably gained a huge amount of influence due to two of their members being major players in ending the war, allowing them to be independently represented.
** Unlike the isolationist Northern Water Tribe, the South ''helped'' the Earth Kingdom during the war by providing it with a small but effective naval force. Perhaps the Earth Kingdom went ''quid pro quo'' post-war, repaying the debt by lobbying for the South to get a seat.
* Also the Fire Nation members who came and never left were formed into the United Republic of Nations, which Republic City was the capital of.
* The US Senate has two representatives for each state - the same number for Wyoming (568K people) and California (38M people, over 66 times as many) - and they have several exclusive powers the House does not. At the time the US Constitution was drafted, none of the less populated states would settle for a pure proportional representation scheme, due to fear of being marginalized by more populated areas with very different political interests. I think the analogy is appropriate here.
** The US also created the House of Representatives because the Senate system alone was completely unacceptable, although including that would make their politics much more complex without adding anything to the show.

to:
















[[folder: Why is there only How did Shiro Shinobi know Tarrlok was the one Earthbending councilor?]]
Much like
who kidnapped Korra?]]
And if he had used his old IntrepidReporter skills to find out, how did Tarrlok's cover story work? Would
the the Headscracther above, I also question why the council is set up the way it is. But for me I truth not have to wonder why been broadcast on the earthbenders only radio for all to hear?
* The "Previously On" segments are clearly not happening in-universe. I'm simply amazed that someone could
have one representative? It is understandable why fire and air only have one. (Both have small populations.) And it is also understandable why come to the water tribes have two representatives. They are two nations and thus conclusion they need representatives from each nation. But the Earth Kingdom were. Just...''wow'', I seriously cannot understand how this is being asked for a massive country with many different regions and second time.
* The confusion
probably stems from the largest population out of all fact that, in the nations. Plus, they even have a population of water benders (the swamp folks) and firebenders (those who came during the war and never left). You'd think they'd at least have two representatives like the water tribes?
* The Earth Kingdom is evidently still a kingdom, with a single ruler, so the representative is a representative
preview of the Earth King.
** The Earth Kingdom probably doesn't recognize any Earth Kingdom territory that wasn't reorganized into the United Republic of nations as a separate entity, and any would-be independent Earth nations probably don't have the strength or influence to get a seat on the Council, as they probably would be hedged out by the Earth Kingdom. The Southern Water Tribe meanwhile probably gained a huge amount of influence due to two of their members being major players in ending the war, allowing them to be independently represented.
** Unlike the isolationist Northern Water Tribe, the South ''helped'' the Earth Kingdom during the war by providing it with a small but effective naval force. Perhaps the Earth Kingdom went ''quid pro quo'' post-war, repaying the debt by lobbying for the South to get a seat.
* Also the Fire Nation members who came and never left were formed into the United Republic of Nations, which Republic City
seventh episode, Tarrlok was the capital of.
* The US Senate has two representatives for each state - the same number for Wyoming (568K people) and California (38M people,
voice over 66 times as many) - and they have several exclusive powers in the House does not. At the time the US Constitution previous episode Shiro was drafted, none of the less populated states would settle for a pure proportional representation scheme, due attack, and Tarrlok's voice over is clearly in-universe. So to fear of being marginalized by more populated areas with very different political interests. I think the analogy is appropriate here.
** The US also created the House of Representatives because the Senate system alone was
be fair, it's not completely unacceptable, although including unbelievable that someone would make their politics much more complex without adding anything be confused.
** It is also the only time that the voice over has mentioned information that wouldn't have realistically be available
to the show.public.
*** So who Mako and Korra have crushes on--that they've never told anyone about--is information available to the public, too?
**** [[EveryoneCanSeeIt There's a trope for that.]]






[[folder: Episodes? Season Finale?]]
I may have heard wrong, but according to the commercial, the Season Finale is next week, a One-Hour season finale. Cool, i'm excited, don't get me wrong, but one hour? that's two episodes, right? which means, after next week, the series will be at 11 episodes. I thought it was supposed to be twelve. I guess its possible to fit three episodes in an hour, but it doesn't seem likely given how many commercials will be involved. So, was an episode cancelled, did Nick just screw up, or did i just miscount?
* No, the season finale is being advertised coming out in 23rd of June, two weeks from now. Next week is still business as usual. They're just advertising early.
* Good, thanks for clearing that up for me. I think i'd go through withdraws if they cut an episode.
** At least I ''think'' this is the case. I got no confirmation either, but at least there has been no hint of leaving out next week's episode in any source I know. Our own wiki tells that Turning the Tides will come out in June 16th.
** Many people seem to believe there won't be an episode next week. Good job, Nick. I think that promo was more harmful than no promo at all like the last couple of weeks.

to:

\n\n\n[[folder: Episodes? Season Finale?]]\nI may have heard wrong, but according [[folder:Yakone's escape]]
* Forget solitary, how did Yakone get out of jail in order
to start a new life in the commercial, North Pole?
** They explicitly said that some of his criminal buddies broke him out. He was
the Season Finale is head of a vast criminal empire. Exactly why they broke him out when he was stripped of his bending abilities, who knows? Maybe he had assets that the next week, a One-Hour season finale. Cool, i'm excited, don't gang leader could use, and only he knew where to get me wrong, but one hour? that's two episodes, right? which means, after next week, them, or maybe he simply possessed a level of fanatical devotion in his subordinates (maybe its in the series will be at 11 episodes. I thought it was supposed to be twelve. I guess its possible to fit three episodes in an hour, but it doesn't seem likely given how many commercials will be involved. So, was an episode cancelled, did Nick just screw up, or did i just miscount?
* No, the season finale is being advertised coming out in 23rd of June, two weeks from now. Next week is still business as usual. They're just advertising early.
* Good, thanks for clearing
blood) that up for me. I think i'd go through withdraws if they cut an episode.
** At least I ''think'' this is the case. I got no confirmation either, but at least there has been no hint of leaving out next week's episode in any source I know. Our own wiki tells that Turning the Tides will come out in June 16th.
** Many people seem to believe there won't be an episode next week. Good job, Nick. I think that promo was more harmful than no promo at all like the last couple of weeks.
didn't care about his bending status.



[[folder: Why is everybody so lightly dressed?]]
The only thing coming close to a reasonable outfit is Lin's coat.
* She had time to change, they did not.
** It's less about that, it's their choice of wardrobe in the first place. It's winter, and they're wearing the same things they are wearing all the time. Korra, of course, is the worst offender, leaving the house like that. The Satomobiles aren't exactly warm and cozy either, which would have explained why Bolin and Mako don't put on more clothes.
* Korra use to live in the South Pole. She's probably use to the cold. Mako, Bolin, And Asami didn't have time to change what with breaking out of jail and all. Tenzin's cloths seem pretty warm. (Don't quite remember what he was wearing.)
* Tenzin has the excuse of being an airbender. Aang seemed just fine in both Poles with his regular clothes; fandom is that he used airbending to insulate himself. Tenzin would have learned the technique from his father. As for Mako and Bolin, remember they lived as orphans on the streets; they know how to deal with being in winter weather without proper clothing.
* Korra and Mako are firebenders; they don't need heavy clothing to keep warm. Asami and Bolin are reasonably well dressed; judging from the copious snowfall, it can't be much below freezing, if at all. Thick snow only falls in relatively warm winter weather.

to:



[[folder: Why is everybody so lightly dressed?]]
The
Was Korra originally meant to be a six-hour long movie?]]
Is it me, or unlike ATLA, they've pretty much wrapped it up here, with Korra becoming a Fully realized Avatar? Was it actually meant to go on for
only thing coming close one season until late in production?
* Yes. It was originally supposed
to be a reasonable outfit is Lin's coat.
* She had time to change,
one season miniseries, but they did not.
** It's less about that, it's their choice of wardrobe in
got a second season while the first place. It's winter, and they're wearing the same things they are wearing all the time. Korra, of course, is the worst offender, leaving the house like that. The Satomobiles aren't exactly warm and cozy either, which would have explained why Bolin and Mako don't put on more clothes.
* Korra use to live in the South Pole. She's probably use to the cold. Mako, Bolin, And Asami didn't have time to change what with breaking out of jail and all. Tenzin's cloths seem pretty warm. (Don't quite remember what he
one was wearing.)
* Tenzin has the excuse of being an airbender. Aang seemed just fine
alredy in both Poles with his regular clothes; fandom is that he used airbending to insulate himself. Tenzin would have learned the technique from his father. As for Mako and Bolin, remember they lived as orphans on the streets; they know how to deal with being in winter weather without proper clothing.
* Korra and Mako are firebenders; they don't need heavy clothing to keep warm. Asami and Bolin are reasonably well dressed; judging from the copious snowfall, it can't be much below freezing, if at all. Thick snow only falls in relatively warm winter weather.
production.



[[folder: Why wasn't Yakone in solitary after that stunt he pulled?]]
He somehow had the opportunity to beget Tarrlok 4 years later, despite receiving a life sentence for 12 counts of bloodbending and proceeding to bloodbend the entire courtroom to resist being sent to jail, and then bloodbends the Avatar with intent to kill. That seems like it merits the sentence being upgraded to life in prison with no human contact (and only because they don't have the death penalty out of respect for Aang), except the people who will bring his meals, who are in turn forbidden to speak to him.
* Sounds like you're expecting Republic City prisons to be as cruel as Fire Nation prisons in the original series. It's not unlikely that the influence of Aang/Katara/etc made the retributive system in Republic City more humane, and things like conjugal visits were allowed in their prisons, which would've made Tarrlok's conception possible. Since Aang took Yakone's bending away, he wasn't considered dangerous anymore, so he wouldn't have needed to be kept in solitary. That, or Yakone simply escaped from prison, and catching him wasn't a high priority anymore because he'd lost his bloodbending, so he managed to find a wife and live the rest of his life in hiding.
* Because they're not evil scum who want to drive their prisoners insane? Even Ozai wasn't given such treatment.
* Aang says he's 40 years old in the flashback which means that as stated it is 42 years ago, he dies 26 years later and Korra is now 16. According to the Welcome to Republic City game Tarrlok is 37. He was born when his father was in prison.
** Or Tarrlok's listed age is wrong or represents a lie he's told. A fit man in his forties could pass as 37, especially one as vain as Tarrlock.
** Could easily be a lie. Tarrlock does bare a resemblance to Yakone after all...if anyone brought attention to it, he could just make an offhand comment that he was born after Yakone was already in jail and the matter would drop.
** Or maybe Yakone was broken out of prison. He did have a criminal empire.
** It's possible that the background people, like JK Rowling, can't do math, and Tarrlock isn't supposed to have been born after Yakone went to prison.
** The math assumes the Avatar is reborn right away, which may not be the case. Alternatively, considering the catastrophic emotional consequences of removing someone's bending, the council may have amended his sentence on the grounds that he has "suffered enough" and is no longer a threat.
*** A previous episode specifically states that Yakone was defeated 42 years ago.
**** Considering the fact that nobody knew Tarrlock was Yakone's son, I would say that Tarrlock is older than 42 and lied about his age along with his parentage.
**** Same troper as above, I stay corrected. The real answer is that Yakone escaped.

to:

[[folder: Why wasn't Yakone














[[folder:What happened to the North Pole?]]
More specifically, the Northern Water Tribe. The first series showed it to be a relatively large place with a design similar to Venice, Italy. Yet when we see it
in solitary Taarlok's flashback story, it's comparable to what we saw of the Southern Water Tribe back in "The Boy in the Iceberg". And considering it's only ever referred to as ''the'' Northern Water Tribe, there seems to be no indication it would be some sort of outpost town or settlement.
* Is there any actual reason to believe it ''wasn't'' some sort of outpost town or settlement?
* Yeah. The Northern Water Tribe is just the name of the whole tribe, like the Zulu. Just because the Zulu are referred by a common tribe name doesn't mean they all live in the same city.
* The Northern Water Tribe we saw was one
after that stunt he pulled?]]
He somehow had the opportunity to beget Tarrlok 4
100 years later, despite receiving a life sentence of war--a fortification made for 12 counts of bloodbending and proceeding to bloodbend defense. At the time, yes, that was probably where the entire courtroom to resist being sent to jail, Tribe lived--but after the war ended and then bloodbends the Avatar with intent to kill. That seems like it merits the sentence being upgraded to life in prison with no human contact (and only because they don't have the death penalty out danger of respect for Aang), except the people who will bring his meals, who are in turn forbidden to speak to him.
* Sounds like you're expecting Republic City prisons to be as cruel as
Fire Nation prisons in the original series. It's not unlikely soldiers attacking and abducting people was gone, it makes sense that the influence of Aang/Katara/etc made the retributive system in Republic City more humane, and things like conjugal visits were allowed in their prisons, which would've made Tarrlok's conception possible. Since Aang took Yakone's bending away, he wasn't considered dangerous anymore, so he wouldn't have needed to be kept in solitary. That, or Yakone simply escaped from prison, and catching him wasn't a high priority anymore because he'd lost his bloodbending, so he managed to find a wife and live the rest of his life in hiding.
* Because they're not evil scum who want to drive their prisoners insane? Even Ozai wasn't given such treatment.
* Aang says he's 40 years old in the flashback which means that as stated it is 42 years ago, he dies 26 years later and Korra is now 16. According to the Welcome to Republic City game Tarrlok is 37. He was born when his father was in prison.
** Or Tarrlok's listed age is wrong or represents a lie he's told. A fit man in his forties could pass as 37, especially one as vain as Tarrlock.
** Could easily be a lie. Tarrlock does bare a resemblance to Yakone after all...if anyone brought attention to it, he could just make an offhand comment that he was born after Yakone was already in jail and the matter
they would drop.
** Or maybe Yakone was broken out of prison. He did have a criminal empire.
** It's possible that the background people, like JK Rowling, can't do math, and Tarrlock isn't supposed to have been born after Yakone went to prison.
** The math assumes the Avatar is reborn right away, which may not be the case. Alternatively, considering the catastrophic emotional consequences of removing someone's bending, the council may have amended his sentence on the grounds that he has "suffered enough" and is no longer a threat.
*** A previous episode specifically states that Yakone was defeated 42 years ago.
**** Considering the fact that nobody knew Tarrlock was Yakone's son, I would say that Tarrlock is older than 42 and lied about his age along with his parentage.
**** Same troper as above, I stay corrected. The real answer is that Yakone escaped.
expand into other settlements.







[[folder: How does a terrorist group have so many members?]]
Seriously, am I the only one wondering why there seem to be an almost unlimited amount of Equalist soldiers? First of all, there wasn't much discrimination against non-benders to begin with, especially not violence. There are almost no reasons to join the Equalists unless someone you know got killed by a bender, like Amon [[spoiler: and Hiroshi]], but it's not like that many people have been killed by benders. Not to mention, these are dedicated soldiers, trained in the art of chi-blocking and all that stuff. It's obvious by now they aren't just {{Well Intentioned Extremist}}s, they're terrorists. You don't see someone who doesn't really like benders join a TERRORIST GROUP to try and get equality. So, how is there so many people willing to give up their life for the cause?
* The problem is assuming that he got all of his troops from Republic City instead of taking them in from all of the nations. He has a lot of people for one city, but from across five nations that span the entire globe it's a lot less unbelievable. As for there not being that much discrimination, there is still the fact that it appears all of the triads in Republic City alone are completely staffed by Benders, as we saw in the original series with Zuko Alone Benders still oppressed people. So think of it as generations of pent up aggression at the inequality of power between benders and non-benders.
* Also keep in mind that the Republic City houses millions of people, and judging by the numbers we've seen, I'd estimate that there are only a few hundred full-time Equalist chi-blockers out there. Sympathizers who are willing to look the other way, or give financial aid and other indirect support probably amount to a few thousand at most. There were organizations in early 20th century Europe with equally grand plans to reorganize the society to their liking with similarly numbered ranks, who took over countries and reigned for decades.
* The show has failed to show it but there were three large all bender gangs in the city. The number of non-benders people who don't want to be helpless in the face of that kind of abuse must be tremendous. Except for one scene all of this has been off screen so its impossible for us to really sympathize with their position.

to:

\n\n\n\n[[folder: How does a terrorist group have so many members?]]
Seriously, am I the only one wondering why there seem to be an almost unlimited amount of Equalist soldiers? First of all, there wasn't much discrimination against non-benders to begin with, especially not violence. There are almost no reasons to join the Equalists unless someone you know got killed by a bender, like Amon [[spoiler: and Hiroshi]], but it's not like
The "Balance Patch" that many people have been killed by benders. Not to mention, these are dedicated soldiers, trained in is the art of chi-blocking and all that stuff. It's obvious by now they aren't just {{Well Intentioned Extremist}}s, they're terrorists. You don't see someone who doesn't really like benders join a TERRORIST GROUP to try and get equality. So, how is there so many people willing to give up their life for the cause?
* The problem is assuming that he got all of his troops from Republic City instead of taking them in from all of the nations. He has a lot of people for one city, but from across five nations that span the entire globe it's a lot less unbelievable. As for there not being that much discrimination, there is still the fact that it appears all of the triads
Law in Republic City alone are completely staffed by Benders, as we saw City]]
* The Avatar is a focal point of balance towards goodness and the right choices
in the original series with Zuko Alone world at large, which includes the city. Because of this, and the major role she plays in restoring balance and order to the world as they are fated to do, they are given a great deal of leeway. This is no longer the case, and that severely gimps Korra's overall effectiveness for very pedantic reasons. Benders still oppressed people. So think of it as generations of pent up aggression at should have the inequality of power between benders and non-benders.right to defend themselves, as should non-benders. So I'm not entirely seeing the law as helpful or beneficial to the long-run to the city, much less to her job. They would only serve to get in her way.
* Also keep ** That worked back in mind the old days. In an industrialized nation, Korra's antics are nearly as harmful as helpful, and she is not omniscient. The police are there to cover what she can't, which is basically everything except the occasional random incident.
*** Of course, but if they are putting their foot down and preventing the Avatar from doing what the Avatar does, they're as much a threat to the balance as they could be a help. I'm not speaking about stopping mafia here-which Korra, as the Avatar and a lot of precedent behind her from Kiyoshi and Aang, should be allowed to do-this can get much worse; what if they decide that restoring balance would cause too much instability within the city?
*** If Korra's keeping with the law, which should be entirely reasonable, then they have no reason to object. Tenzin could also extend some political protection if he needs to.
*** Um, where's it ever said
that the Republic City houses millions of people, and judging by the numbers we've seen, I'd estimate law prohibits bending in any way? Or that there are only a few hundred full-time Equalist chi-blockers out there. Sympathizers who are willing to look benders can't defend themselves? The problem with Korra's actions in the other way, or give financial aid first episode is more that she wrecked up the street, and other indirect support probably amount to that she was acting as a few thousand at most. There vigilante, not just that she was acting as a bender or the Avatar.
*** Precisely. Tenzin and the White Lotus may be sitting on museum pieces, but if Korra
were organizations in early 20th century Europe with equally grand plans allowed to reorganize the society to inflict property damage at her own vigilante discretion, she'd deplete their liking with similarly numbered ranks, who took over countries and reigned operating budget in a matter of weeks...heck, the lack of HeroInsurance could be mined for decades.a subplot.
* The show has failed to show it but *** It's all part of the deconstruction that is going on. As of now, there were three large all bender gangs is no need for Avatar-involvement. Having Korra wreck the place is not necessary. It's an era of peace. I am sure that as the plot progresses, there will be a need for Korra to act as the Avatar to the world. But as of now, there isn't.
** This is hilarious. Its exactly the sort of political insanity that probably exists
in the city. setting. The number crime wasn't "bending" (though benders might well think of non-benders people who don't want it that way) it was "blowing up other people's stuff and attacking the police". You shouldn't get away with destroying buildings just because you happened to do it with superpowers. I imagine that's exactly the mentality that has Equalist sympathizers scared.
*** I wouldn't
be helpless surprised to see merchants whose property she destroyed at an Equalist rally in the face of future, given that kind the reason anyone pays protection money is out of abuse must be tremendous. Except fear for one scene all of this has been off screen so its impossible for us to really sympathize with their position.lives and livelihoods. Ironically, Korra may have done by accident what the Triple Threat Triads [[ShameIfSomethingHappened threaten to do]] when they go unpaid, and as a result some struggling business owners might just find themselves looking for a nice bush to sleep under.
*** The perfect opportunity for the return of the [[RunningGag Cabbage Seller]]!
*** Actually, Tenzin said that he would pay for the damages.





[[folder: How did Shiro Shinobi know Tarrlok was the one who kidnapped Korra?]]
And if he had used his old IntrepidReporter skills to find out, how did Tarrlok's cover story work? Would the truth not have been broadcast on the radio for all to hear?
* The "Previously On" segments are clearly not happening in-universe. I'm simply amazed that someone could have come to the conclusion they were. Just...''wow'', I seriously cannot understand how this is being asked for a second time.
* The confusion probably stems from the fact that, in the preview of the seventh episode, Tarrlok was the voice over and in the previous episode Shiro was attack, and Tarrlok's voice over is clearly in-universe. So to be fair, it's not completely unbelievable that someone would be confused.
** It is also the only time that the voice over has mentioned information that wouldn't have realistically be available to the public.
*** So who Mako and Korra have crushes on--that they've never told anyone about--is information available to the public, too?
**** [[EveryoneCanSeeIt There's a trope for that.]]

to:

\n\n[[folder: How did Shiro Shinobi know Tarrlok The United Republic of Nations isn't very republican]]
* I'm using "republican" in the way that it's used in the US Constitution "The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government..." For the sake of clarity, I'll add [[http://www.constitution.org/fed/federa10.htm Federalist no. 10]], where Madison outlines the idea of a republic as I am used to using it. As far as I can tell, the government is chosen by the original four nations, not the people of the city. It's as if Wales was jointly governed by a representative of Ireland, Scotland and England. Such a government couldn't be called republican in any sense of the word, let alone the one I was thinking of. Now, it is true that no other government has been shown, meaning it is possible that the council is only in charge of Republic City. This led me to believe that it
was the only game in town, and that the council is in charge of the entire nation.
** The US doesn't have a monopoly on the term. Seeing as how we've only seen the
one city, one can hardly say the identified form of government cannot be considered a republic.
** I think your assumption of republic being "What the US defined it as is" is a bit of an oversimplification of a form of government that has had dozens of variants amongst them oligarchies very similar to the one in show. It should also be remembered that this government was designed for a different world than the one its in right now, back when the city was founded it made complete sense to have the city intended to be a melting pot be governed by representatives of each major group in the world, unfortunately this is now pretty obsolete as Republic City has developed its own unique culture.
*** I'm wondering what Republics you're thinking of that have oligarchies similar to the one on the show? The closest things I can think of would be Florence and Venice in the Renaissance. However, given that the Florentine republic included about a thousand citizens in its census for
who kidnapped Korra?]]
And if he had used his old IntrepidReporter skills
counted as a citizen who could participate in government (circa 1500) and the Venetian aristocracy was abnormally large (which resulted in frequent problems of aristocratic poverty) and could could be bought into, I'm not sure they should count either since there is a big difference between around a thousand people sitting in a senate and five people ruling in a council. Remember, Venice's Council of Ten answered to find out, a much larger senate and the Doge and Florence's Eight Saints were a war time necessity (and they were tax assessors).
* I don't think we know enough about it. Or could you clarify what doesn't seem republican to you? It doesn't seem to be a monarchy, so I guess republic in the meaning of "res publica" isn't so far off.
** Republic as a term is far older than the United States, and even today it has numerous definitions around the world. At core it simply means a nation ruled by an elected council. The election does not have to be democratic as we understand it, nor does the position of electee have to be open for everyone. Pre-Imperial Rome was a non-democratic Republic, for example. The United Republic does seem to be a democracy however, though
how it functions is unknown. It seems that the representatives have to include members from the four Nations, and that Benders are overpresented compared to non-Benders. Tenzin is an influential member in spite of the near-extinction of the Air Nomads, for example.
*** Tenzin's father was one of the founders of Republic City. He's probably doing it as a legacy thing, not to represent the almost non-existent Air Nomads.
*** Except that the Council, or at least its leaders apart from Tenzin consist of representatives of Fire Nation, Earth Kingdom, and Southern and Northern Water Tribes. It seems fairly clear that the city is lead by the representatives of the four Bending cultures, even the near-extinct Air Nomads.
* I think the source of the confusion here is that we're assuming Republic City is an independent state, which may not be the case. It's possible Republic City is a kind of "neutral ground" that all four nations have limited control over. If this is the case, the representatives that control Republic city may very well be elected...by the total populations of the nations they hail from. So it's less like Wales being governed by representatives from Ireland, Scotland, and England and more like if everyone in the United States was able to vote for the mayor and city council of New York City.
** So Republic City is basically [[WashingtonDC Washington, DC]]. Limited home rule and all that.
** It's more like the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_International_Settlement Shanghai-that-Was]].
* Republic in its most basic sense means "state without monarchy." The council is made up entirely (I understand) by representatives of monarchies. So I honestly believe that the creators
did Tarrlok's cover story work? Would not know what the truth word republic means. It is a common mistakes, I remember a couple of occasions where Jorge Luis Borges made ​​the same mistake.
** I'm sure they know exactly what it means. It means a state
not ruled by a monarchy. It doesn't mean a state without any influence from any monarchies whatsoever. Republic City is ruled, as you said, by a council--not by a monarchy. That the councilmen represent monarchies doesn't matter.
** Also, the council isn't made up ''entirely'' of representatives of monarchies. The Air Nomads most certainly aren't a monarchy, they don't even have a state of their own, and nothing indicates Tenzin is considered to be their "king". The reason he seems to be the highest authority figure among them could simply be because he's the oldest, most experienced Airbender alive. Historically the Airbenders appear to
have been broadcast on ruled by councils of elders, one in each Air Temple, but we don't know what their current system is. As for the radio Southern Water Tribe, while they have a chief, there's no canon evidence that he's their sole leader, or that the position of the chief is inhereditary; for all we know he could be chosen by a tribe meeting, or by some other democratic process.
*** If Tenzin gets
to hear?
*
be one of the most powerful people in the world just because he's the best Airbender that would be a real problem. Nepotism is honestly more likely.
*** Being a council person in one city makes you "one of the most powerful people in the world"? Just because the series takes place there doesn't mean it's the most important place in the world.
*** But being the world's only Master Airbender probably would make you "one of the most powerful people in the world" by default.
** Since when does "Republic" mean a "state without monarchy"? By that definition, fascist, democratic, anarchist, and theocratic governments would be republican. A better defintion of a "republic" would be a state with a mixed constitution, incorporating elements of democracy, aristocracy, and (elected) monarchy. By this definition, we could include Rome, Florence, Venice, and the US. France might be harder to fit, since it seemed to include only democracy and (elected) monarchy, as far as I'm aware. And, of course, this does not work as well for the 20th century when it seemed to become the fashion to style everything a "republic" regardless of its actual form. Also, keep in mind that I'm using the term monarch losely to refer to a small executive branch (like the consuls, Doge, Signoria, or president), the way Roman and Renaissance political theorists did.
*** You define the entire Western world as being ruled by monarchs? (because pretty much every nation has a president or prime minister)
*** "Since when does 'Republic' mean 'a state without monarchy'?" Basically since the term was coined in the classical world. Although modern developments have complicated the matter, that's still the most basic way to define the term, and essential to every other definition that incorporates other aspects. "By that definition, fascist, democratic, anarchist and theocratic governments would be republican." Yes. You treat these terms as opposed to either monarchy or republic while they aren't (except anarchism which is opposed to both). Iran can be described as a theocratic republic, Saudi-Arabia as a theocratic monarchy.
The "Previously On" segments UK is a democratic monarchy, the US a democratic republic and so on. "A better definition ..." What follows is a pretty meaningless definition that has no descriptive purpose and no historical background. In general, people seem to be misled by the meaning of the word "Republican" in a US-American context, where it has a wider meaning, including rule of law, balance of power, democracy, equality before the law etc. and also carries a lot of historical and political baggage (there is a major party that derives its name from this word after all). This meaning comes from American history, not academic categorization of governments. And no, an elected head of the executive is not a monarch.
*** As to the idea of an elected head being a monarch, this is exactly how Polybius uses the term. Polybius defines Rome as a state with a mixed constitution, one that has elements of monarchy, aristocracy, and democracy. He equates the monarchical elements with the consuls, an elected office with one year in office. I am doing the same (note: a prime minister is not a head of state but a head of government, and thus would not represent a monarchic element). The definition of a republic as a state with a mixed constitution also comes from Polybius's understanding - he holds up Rome's Republic as an example of government to be contrasted with the democracy of Athens and various principates. I would argue that in most of the greatest historical examples, a balance of powers is an essential aspect of a republic, as it was in antique Rome and renaissance Florence and Venice. Aristotle would seem to agree given that he considers a mixed constitution as an alternative form of government to monarchy/tyranny, aristocracy/oligarchy, and democracy. Now, Machiavelli does seem to include all non-principate states in the category of "Republic", but given his historical environment, where the only non-monarchic states had mixed constitutions, states like Florence, Venice, and Bologna, I would hesitate to agree with his assessment, given that his analysis of Rome and the classical world was often heavily colored by his experience of politics in his own time. You say that classically this is how a republic was defined, but I'm not sure which classical authors you
are refering to. As I said above, Polybius and Aristotle did not make such a division. Plato divided his types of government much more broadly, defining five types of states based on the values of the ruler/ruling class (kallipolis, timocracy, oligarchy, democracy, and tyranny). To Thucydides, your division would not make sense, since part of his history is devoted to comparing the sort of governments Sparta and Athens had and to equate them as of the same sort would be counter to his efforts. Since the term, however, comes from Latin, we could look at Latin authors, but they tended to defer to Polybius and Aristotle on this matter. And if we are going to defer to the term "res publica", then even the Roman Empire would be a republic, since for the first century or so of its existence it was still called a "res publica". So, I do not see where your definition comes from, aside from perhaps Machiavelli or the French Revolution, neither of whom/which are classical sources and both of whom/which existed in periods where a more nuanced view was unnecessary. And as to theocracy - you said you can have theocratic republics and theocratic monarchies, but what would the bishopric of Rome be? A republic, given the prominence of the college of cardinals? A monarchy, given that it has a single head? Also, you seem to be lax on what a monarchy is - is it simply a state with a king? would a tyranny without a king be a republic? It would seem unfair to call Cuba a republic just because its head of state does not call himself king. It would seem unfair to call Sparta a monarchy just because its heads of state were kings.
* At the very least we can say that Republic City does not seem very republican. A ruling body of five people who represent only a "bending aristocracy" (my term) is much more oligarchic than it is republican. And since this small ruling body seems to make policy decisions without consulting anyone outside of themselves (there's no mention of having a vote in the senate on what to do about the rebel problem or what to do about terrorist threats), I feel it's safe to say that just these five are governing Republic City. So... yeah. Sounds like an oligarchy - more like the Thirty Tyrants than the Council of Ten.
** That does fit within some definitions of Republic since those five are "the body of citizens entitled to vote", if they were elected to those positions in some way it fits most definitions. What Republic City is
clearly not happening in-universe. I'm is a democracy, the general population has little to no say in the general affairs of government.
*** But size does matter in this. If you were
simply amazed going to say that someone could a republic has a "body of citizens entitled to vote" a tyranny would be a republic where that body numbered one. The voting base needs to be broader than five, even if it does not have come to the conclusion they were. Just...''wow'', I seriously cannot understand include a majority of people. If you were to ask me to define how this is being asked for a second time.
* The confusion
broad it needs to be, I would probably stems from the fact that, in the preview say at least 1% of the seventh episode, population. Though, there are other aspects of republic aside from having a voting base, namely the separation of powers - they tend to have at least an executive or executive body and a legislative body, but can also include bodies that propose legislation (like Rome's Senate) or various bodies that oversee economic or military concerns.
*** Represents a "bending aristocracy"? The councilmembers represent the different NATIONS, not the types of benders. We know that
Tarrlok was the voice over and in the previous episode Shiro was attack, and Tarrlok's voice over is clearly in-universe. So to be fair, Tenzin are benders, but it's not completely unbelievable never been shown about the others. True, Amon had them kidnapped, but that someone could be just as much to disrupt the current government as to target them as benders.
**** The way Tarrlok addresses them when he introduces his non-bender curfew certainly implies they are benders. And it seems unlikely they
would be confused.
**
have voted for the curfew if they were non-benders themselves.
* People have used the word "republic" to mean a lot of different things over the course of history.
It is also the only time that the voice over has mentioned information that wouldn't have realistically be available a usefully vague term, almost to the public.
*** So who Mako and Korra have crushes on--that they've never told anyone about--is information available to the public, too?
**** [[EveryoneCanSeeIt There's
point of being meaningless, in a trope for that.]]fictional setting.











[[folder:Yakone's escape]]
* Forget solitary, how did Yakone get out of jail in order to start a new life in the North Pole?
** They explicitly said that some of his criminal buddies broke him out. He was the head of a vast criminal empire. Exactly why they broke him out when he was stripped of his bending abilities, who knows? Maybe he had assets that the next gang leader could use, and only he knew where to get them, or maybe he simply possessed a level of fanatical devotion in his subordinates (maybe its in the blood) that they didn't care about his bending status.
[[/folder]]







[[folder: Was Korra originally meant to be a six-hour long movie?]]
Is it me, or unlike ATLA, they've pretty much wrapped it up here, with Korra becoming a Fully realized Avatar? Was it actually meant to go on for only one season until late in production?
* Yes. It was originally supposed to be a one season miniseries, but they got a second season while the first one was alredy in production.
[[/folder]]


[[folder:So is Equalism dead? Is that even a good thing?]]
Obviously Amon and his army were terrorists but defeating them still leaves the Avatar world with just about the worst possible social problem a society could ever face. Even if the somehow eliminate bender gangs, institutional oppression, and {{Smug Super}}s non-benders they've only just started to address the issue. There is a class of people with enormous economic and military privilege that is chosen entirely at random. Its kind of impossible for a society to not self destruct under that kind of pressure over and over again. The finale didn't do anything to address this, I guess I'll have to hope for the next season.
** I suppose we are left to assume things would improve without Tarrlok oppressive non-Bender rule and that the Equalists would be less of a threat to innocent Benders. Perhaps someone else would take Amon's mantle.
*** But Tarrlok was far from the only one oppressing the non-benders, and we never saw him oppressing the non-benders until later on. People like the members of the Triple Threat Triad seemed to be more of a direct threat.
*** Makes me really wonder how many Triple Threat Triad members Amon debended.
** They're probably going to deal with that stuff next season.
** I imagine that the reveal of Amon as a liar, as well as a bender, will have caused the terrorist Equalist movement to lose credibility and fall apart, for the most part, but a push for non-bender rights will still exist. Maybe it will come up in the second season.
[[/folder]]









[[folder:So is Equalism dead? Is that even a good thing?]]
Obviously Amon and his army were terrorists but defeating them still leaves the Avatar world with just about the worst possible social problem a society could ever face. Even if the somehow eliminate bender gangs, institutional oppression, and {{Smug Super}}s non-benders they've only just started to address the issue. There is a class of people with enormous economic and military privilege that is chosen entirely at random. Its kind of impossible for a society to not self destruct under that kind of pressure over and over again. The finale didn't do anything to address this, I guess I'll have to hope for the next season.
** I suppose we are left to assume things would improve without Tarrlok oppressive non-Bender rule and that the Equalists would be less of a threat to innocent Benders. Perhaps someone else would take Amon's mantle.
*** But Tarrlok was far from the only one oppressing the non-benders, and we never saw him oppressing the non-benders until later on. People like the members of the Triple Threat Triad seemed to be more of a direct threat.
*** Makes me really wonder how many Triple Threat Triad members Amon debended.
** They're probably going to deal with that stuff next season.
** I imagine that the reveal of Amon as a liar, as well as a bender, will have caused the terrorist Equalist movement to lose credibility and fall apart, for the most part, but a push for non-bender rights will still exist. Maybe it will come up in the second season.
[[/folder]]
















[[folder:What happened to the North Pole?]]
More specifically, the Northern Water Tribe. The first series showed it to be a relatively large place with a design similar to Venice, Italy. Yet when we see it in Taarlok's flashback story, it's comparable to what we saw of the Southern Water Tribe back in "The Boy in the Iceberg". And considering it's only ever referred to as ''the'' Northern Water Tribe, there seems to be no indication it would be some sort of outpost town or settlement.
* Is there any actual reason to believe it ''wasn't'' some sort of outpost town or settlement?
* Yeah. The Northern Water Tribe is just the name of the whole tribe, like the Zulu. Just because the Zulu are referred by a common tribe name doesn't mean they all live in the same city.
* The Northern Water Tribe we saw was one after 100 years of war--a fortification made for defense. At the time, yes, that was probably where the entire Tribe lived--but after the war ended and the danger of Fire Nation soldiers attacking and abducting people was gone, it makes sense that they would expand into other settlements.
[[/folder]]








[[folder: The "Balance Patch" that is the Law in Republic City]]
* The Avatar is a focal point of balance towards goodness and the right choices in the world at large, which includes the city. Because of this, and the major role she plays in restoring balance and order to the world as they are fated to do, they are given a great deal of leeway. This is no longer the case, and that severely gimps Korra's overall effectiveness for very pedantic reasons. Benders should have the right to defend themselves, as should non-benders. So I'm not entirely seeing the law as helpful or beneficial to the long-run to the city, much less to her job. They would only serve to get in her way.
** That worked back in the old days. In an industrialized nation, Korra's antics are nearly as harmful as helpful, and she is not omniscient. The police are there to cover what she can't, which is basically everything except the occasional random incident.
*** Of course, but if they are putting their foot down and preventing the Avatar from doing what the Avatar does, they're as much a threat to the balance as they could be a help. I'm not speaking about stopping mafia here-which Korra, as the Avatar and a lot of precedent behind her from Kiyoshi and Aang, should be allowed to do-this can get much worse; what if they decide that restoring balance would cause too much instability within the city?
*** If Korra's keeping with the law, which should be entirely reasonable, then they have no reason to object. Tenzin could also extend some political protection if he needs to.
*** Um, where's it ever said that the law prohibits bending in any way? Or that benders can't defend themselves? The problem with Korra's actions in the first episode is more that she wrecked up the street, and that she was acting as a vigilante, not just that she was acting as a bender or the Avatar.
*** Precisely. Tenzin and the White Lotus may be sitting on museum pieces, but if Korra were allowed to inflict property damage at her own vigilante discretion, she'd deplete their operating budget in a matter of weeks...heck, the lack of HeroInsurance could be mined for a subplot.
*** It's all part of the deconstruction that is going on. As of now, there is no need for Avatar-involvement. Having Korra wreck the place is not necessary. It's an era of peace. I am sure that as the plot progresses, there will be a need for Korra to act as the Avatar to the world. But as of now, there isn't.
** This is hilarious. Its exactly the sort of political insanity that probably exists in the setting. The crime wasn't "bending" (though benders might well think of it that way) it was "blowing up other people's stuff and attacking the police". You shouldn't get away with destroying buildings just because you happened to do it with superpowers. I imagine that's exactly the mentality that has Equalist sympathizers scared.
*** I wouldn't be surprised to see merchants whose property she destroyed at an Equalist rally in the future, given that the reason anyone pays protection money is out of fear for their lives and livelihoods. Ironically, Korra may have done by accident what the Triple Threat Triads [[ShameIfSomethingHappened threaten to do]] when they go unpaid, and as a result some struggling business owners might just find themselves looking for a nice bush to sleep under.
*** The perfect opportunity for the return of the [[RunningGag Cabbage Seller]]!
*** Actually, Tenzin said that he would pay for the damages.
[[/folder]]

[[folder: The United Republic of Nations isn't very republican]]
* I'm using "republican" in the way that it's used in the US Constitution "The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government..." For the sake of clarity, I'll add [[http://www.constitution.org/fed/federa10.htm Federalist no. 10]], where Madison outlines the idea of a republic as I am used to using it. As far as I can tell, the government is chosen by the original four nations, not the people of the city. It's as if Wales was jointly governed by a representative of Ireland, Scotland and England. Such a government couldn't be called republican in any sense of the word, let alone the one I was thinking of. Now, it is true that no other government has been shown, meaning it is possible that the council is only in charge of Republic City. This led me to believe that it was the only game in town, and that the council is in charge of the entire nation.
** The US doesn't have a monopoly on the term. Seeing as how we've only seen the one city, one can hardly say the identified form of government cannot be considered a republic.
** I think your assumption of republic being "What the US defined it as is" is a bit of an oversimplification of a form of government that has had dozens of variants amongst them oligarchies very similar to the one in show. It should also be remembered that this government was designed for a different world than the one its in right now, back when the city was founded it made complete sense to have the city intended to be a melting pot be governed by representatives of each major group in the world, unfortunately this is now pretty obsolete as Republic City has developed its own unique culture.
*** I'm wondering what Republics you're thinking of that have oligarchies similar to the one on the show? The closest things I can think of would be Florence and Venice in the Renaissance. However, given that the Florentine republic included about a thousand citizens in its census for who counted as a citizen who could participate in government (circa 1500) and the Venetian aristocracy was abnormally large (which resulted in frequent problems of aristocratic poverty) and could could be bought into, I'm not sure they should count either since there is a big difference between around a thousand people sitting in a senate and five people ruling in a council. Remember, Venice's Council of Ten answered to a much larger senate and the Doge and Florence's Eight Saints were a war time necessity (and they were tax assessors).
* I don't think we know enough about it. Or could you clarify what doesn't seem republican to you? It doesn't seem to be a monarchy, so I guess republic in the meaning of "res publica" isn't so far off.
** Republic as a term is far older than the United States, and even today it has numerous definitions around the world. At core it simply means a nation ruled by an elected council. The election does not have to be democratic as we understand it, nor does the position of electee have to be open for everyone. Pre-Imperial Rome was a non-democratic Republic, for example. The United Republic does seem to be a democracy however, though how it functions is unknown. It seems that the representatives have to include members from the four Nations, and that Benders are overpresented compared to non-Benders. Tenzin is an influential member in spite of the near-extinction of the Air Nomads, for example.
*** Tenzin's father was one of the founders of Republic City. He's probably doing it as a legacy thing, not to represent the almost non-existent Air Nomads.
*** Except that the Council, or at least its leaders apart from Tenzin consist of representatives of Fire Nation, Earth Kingdom, and Southern and Northern Water Tribes. It seems fairly clear that the city is lead by the representatives of the four Bending cultures, even the near-extinct Air Nomads.
* I think the source of the confusion here is that we're assuming Republic City is an independent state, which may not be the case. It's possible Republic City is a kind of "neutral ground" that all four nations have limited control over. If this is the case, the representatives that control Republic city may very well be elected...by the total populations of the nations they hail from. So it's less like Wales being governed by representatives from Ireland, Scotland, and England and more like if everyone in the United States was able to vote for the mayor and city council of New York City.
** So Republic City is basically [[WashingtonDC Washington, DC]]. Limited home rule and all that.
** It's more like the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_International_Settlement Shanghai-that-Was]].
* Republic in its most basic sense means "state without monarchy." The council is made up entirely (I understand) by representatives of monarchies. So I honestly believe that the creators did not know what the word republic means. It is a common mistakes, I remember a couple of occasions where Jorge Luis Borges made ​​the same mistake.
** I'm sure they know exactly what it means. It means a state not ruled by a monarchy. It doesn't mean a state without any influence from any monarchies whatsoever. Republic City is ruled, as you said, by a council--not by a monarchy. That the councilmen represent monarchies doesn't matter.
** Also, the council isn't made up ''entirely'' of representatives of monarchies. The Air Nomads most certainly aren't a monarchy, they don't even have a state of their own, and nothing indicates Tenzin is considered to be their "king". The reason he seems to be the highest authority figure among them could simply be because he's the oldest, most experienced Airbender alive. Historically the Airbenders appear to have been ruled by councils of elders, one in each Air Temple, but we don't know what their current system is. As for the Southern Water Tribe, while they have a chief, there's no canon evidence that he's their sole leader, or that the position of the chief is inhereditary; for all we know he could be chosen by a tribe meeting, or by some other democratic process.
*** If Tenzin gets to be one of the most powerful people in the world just because he's the best Airbender that would be a real problem. Nepotism is honestly more likely.
*** Being a council person in one city makes you "one of the most powerful people in the world"? Just because the series takes place there doesn't mean it's the most important place in the world.
*** But being the world's only Master Airbender probably would make you "one of the most powerful people in the world" by default.
** Since when does "Republic" mean a "state without monarchy"? By that definition, fascist, democratic, anarchist, and theocratic governments would be republican. A better defintion of a "republic" would be a state with a mixed constitution, incorporating elements of democracy, aristocracy, and (elected) monarchy. By this definition, we could include Rome, Florence, Venice, and the US. France might be harder to fit, since it seemed to include only democracy and (elected) monarchy, as far as I'm aware. And, of course, this does not work as well for the 20th century when it seemed to become the fashion to style everything a "republic" regardless of its actual form. Also, keep in mind that I'm using the term monarch losely to refer to a small executive branch (like the consuls, Doge, Signoria, or president), the way Roman and Renaissance political theorists did.
*** You define the entire Western world as being ruled by monarchs? (because pretty much every nation has a president or prime minister)
*** "Since when does 'Republic' mean 'a state without monarchy'?" Basically since the term was coined in the classical world. Although modern developments have complicated the matter, that's still the most basic way to define the term, and essential to every other definition that incorporates other aspects. "By that definition, fascist, democratic, anarchist and theocratic governments would be republican." Yes. You treat these terms as opposed to either monarchy or republic while they aren't (except anarchism which is opposed to both). Iran can be described as a theocratic republic, Saudi-Arabia as a theocratic monarchy. The UK is a democratic monarchy, the US a democratic republic and so on. "A better definition ..." What follows is a pretty meaningless definition that has no descriptive purpose and no historical background. In general, people seem to be misled by the meaning of the word "Republican" in a US-American context, where it has a wider meaning, including rule of law, balance of power, democracy, equality before the law etc. and also carries a lot of historical and political baggage (there is a major party that derives its name from this word after all). This meaning comes from American history, not academic categorization of governments. And no, an elected head of the executive is not a monarch.
*** As to the idea of an elected head being a monarch, this is exactly how Polybius uses the term. Polybius defines Rome as a state with a mixed constitution, one that has elements of monarchy, aristocracy, and democracy. He equates the monarchical elements with the consuls, an elected office with one year in office. I am doing the same (note: a prime minister is not a head of state but a head of government, and thus would not represent a monarchic element). The definition of a republic as a state with a mixed constitution also comes from Polybius's understanding - he holds up Rome's Republic as an example of government to be contrasted with the democracy of Athens and various principates. I would argue that in most of the greatest historical examples, a balance of powers is an essential aspect of a republic, as it was in antique Rome and renaissance Florence and Venice. Aristotle would seem to agree given that he considers a mixed constitution as an alternative form of government to monarchy/tyranny, aristocracy/oligarchy, and democracy. Now, Machiavelli does seem to include all non-principate states in the category of "Republic", but given his historical environment, where the only non-monarchic states had mixed constitutions, states like Florence, Venice, and Bologna, I would hesitate to agree with his assessment, given that his analysis of Rome and the classical world was often heavily colored by his experience of politics in his own time. You say that classically this is how a republic was defined, but I'm not sure which classical authors you are refering to. As I said above, Polybius and Aristotle did not make such a division. Plato divided his types of government much more broadly, defining five types of states based on the values of the ruler/ruling class (kallipolis, timocracy, oligarchy, democracy, and tyranny). To Thucydides, your division would not make sense, since part of his history is devoted to comparing the sort of governments Sparta and Athens had and to equate them as of the same sort would be counter to his efforts. Since the term, however, comes from Latin, we could look at Latin authors, but they tended to defer to Polybius and Aristotle on this matter. And if we are going to defer to the term "res publica", then even the Roman Empire would be a republic, since for the first century or so of its existence it was still called a "res publica". So, I do not see where your definition comes from, aside from perhaps Machiavelli or the French Revolution, neither of whom/which are classical sources and both of whom/which existed in periods where a more nuanced view was unnecessary. And as to theocracy - you said you can have theocratic republics and theocratic monarchies, but what would the bishopric of Rome be? A republic, given the prominence of the college of cardinals? A monarchy, given that it has a single head? Also, you seem to be lax on what a monarchy is - is it simply a state with a king? would a tyranny without a king be a republic? It would seem unfair to call Cuba a republic just because its head of state does not call himself king. It would seem unfair to call Sparta a monarchy just because its heads of state were kings.
* At the very least we can say that Republic City does not seem very republican. A ruling body of five people who represent only a "bending aristocracy" (my term) is much more oligarchic than it is republican. And since this small ruling body seems to make policy decisions without consulting anyone outside of themselves (there's no mention of having a vote in the senate on what to do about the rebel problem or what to do about terrorist threats), I feel it's safe to say that just these five are governing Republic City. So... yeah. Sounds like an oligarchy - more like the Thirty Tyrants than the Council of Ten.
** That does fit within some definitions of Republic since those five are "the body of citizens entitled to vote", if they were elected to those positions in some way it fits most definitions. What Republic City is clearly not is a democracy, the general population has little to no say in the general affairs of government.
*** But size does matter in this. If you were simply going to say that a republic has a "body of citizens entitled to vote" a tyranny would be a republic where that body numbered one. The voting base needs to be broader than five, even if it does not have to include a majority of people. If you were to ask me to define how broad it needs to be, I would probably say at least 1% of the population. Though, there are other aspects of republic aside from having a voting base, namely the separation of powers - they tend to have at least an executive or executive body and a legislative body, but can also include bodies that propose legislation (like Rome's Senate) or various bodies that oversee economic or military concerns.
*** Represents a "bending aristocracy"? The councilmembers represent the different NATIONS, not the types of benders. We know that Tarrlok and Tenzin are benders, but it's never been shown about the others. True, Amon had them kidnapped, but that could be just as much to disrupt the current government as to target them as benders.
**** The way Tarrlok addresses them when he introduces his non-bender curfew certainly implies they are benders. And it seems unlikely they would have voted for the curfew if they were non-benders themselves.
* People have used the word "republic" to mean a lot of different things over the course of history. It is a usefully vague term, almost to the point of being meaningless, in a fictional setting.
[[/folder]]



14th Aug '12 1:59:17 PM ccoa
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* [[TheLegendOfKorraTechnologyAndMedicine Technology and Medicine]]

to:

* [[TheLegendOfKorraTechnologyAndMedicine [[Headscratchers/TheLegendOfKorraTechnologyAndMedicine Technology and Medicine]]
14th Aug '12 1:59:00 PM ccoa
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* [[TheLegendOfKorraTechnologyAndMedicine Technology and Medicine]]



[[folder: The whole ultra fast progress]]
Yeah, I know, just a show, I should relax, but still, it have been what, around 50-60 years and they managed to go from ancient history with touches of steam punk to the 1920's. It stretches the willing suspension of disbelief a little, even with benders being a big factor on making the changes go faster. And not only there were incredibly fast improvements in the tech, but the societal and cultural changes were mind blowing for such short amount of time.
* Which isn't that different from the real world. The potential was there. An era of peace brought the means to capitalize on it.
* We went from 185X to 192X in FarEast {{Wuxia}}land. Sounds about right.
* you're giving humans way less credit than we deserve, especially when you notice how much we've done in just 40 years. The reason the world hadn't changed sooner is a result of the strict divisions between nations. How slow would our development go if our own countries never interacted with each other?
* They had tanks, submarines, bombs, airships, trucks, a monorail, a GIANT FUCKING DRILL, elevators, and even jet skis in ATLA. The Fire Nation brought on a century-long war that kept most of the world in an industrial stasis, while they continued to innovate. The only area outside of the FN with technology like this, without the help of the Mechanist? Ba Sing Se. That is to say, the society that kept itself completely cut off from the rest of the earth kingdom, thanks to the influence of Long Feng, and presumably, the naivete or selfishness of the previous earth kings. The amount of evolution that the Avatar society went under makes perfect sense, after the war ended and Aang and Zuko presumably did *not* allow the machinery to be kept by only the elite of BSS and the militaries.
* Look at our history within the last 100 years. 1912, we were just beginning to grapple with motorcars, airplanes, and long-distance communications. [[HumansAreSpecial All it takes is the right spark, and the right people together to send civilization full steam ahead.]]
* Also they have a massive collection of people who can manipulate elements, it's shown that some lightning benders generate power, so tht is free energy. Which means they don't need to bring in as much resources just to keep the technology going. Normal firebenders can simply boil water, and water benders condense it providing vastly more energy. So effectively they can use all thier resources on production, rather then fuel.

to:







[[folder: The whole ultra fast progress]]
Yeah,
Bullying A Dragon]]
* Okay, so once again, there's that "We hate the people with superpowers!" plot going on. Now,
I know, understand the concerns of the non-Benders, and I get that not every Bender is a good-hearted soul who won't abuse it, but here is my issue: With all the "Let's permanently block their ability to bend!" talk, you'd think that someone would say, "Hey, uh...let's not give them a good reason to hate us!" Especially if said person is the AVATAR (aka, the one who could turn Republic City into a smoldering wasteland if he/she so chose.) Are they just asking for Korra to find a show, I should relax, but still, it have been what, around 50-60 years and they managed reason to go from ancient history with touches of steam punk to apecrap on them and the 1920's. It stretches the willing suspension of disbelief a little, even with benders being a big factor on making the changes go faster. And not only there were incredibly fast improvements city in the tech, but the societal and cultural changes were mind blowing for such short amount of time.
* Which isn't that different
general? Plus, don't they remember Aang? The previous Avatar who saved their collective asses from the real world. Fire Nation? If they know she's the new Avatar (and likely the reincarnation of Aang) why are they pissing her off? [[TooDumbToLive Are they just trying to get her angry enough to go apeshit and Avatar-State the crap out of them and the city in general?]]
** If i were an Anti-Bender? That is EXACTLY what i'd want.
The potential was there. An era Avatar using her godlike powers to slaughter a bunch of peace brought people? that's exactly the means kind of press that proves every single thing that Amon is spewing. Martyrs make for good press. I'm willing to capitalize bet that this will be a plot point in future episodes, especially if Amon is smart enough to organize a situation wherein Korra goes Apeshit on it.
* We went from 185X to 192X in FarEast {{Wuxia}}land. Sounds about right.
some peaceful protesters.
* you're giving humans way less credit than we deserve, especially when you notice how much we've done in just 40 years. The reason the world hadn't changed sooner is a result ** A large part of the strict divisions between nations. How slow would our development go if our own countries never interacted Equalist's rhetoric seems to be that people ''shouldn't have to'' live in fear of offending a Bender just because of what that Bender might do in retaliation. Amon's story paints a nice little picture of this, with each other?
* They had tanks, submarines, bombs, airships, trucks,
his family being oppressed by a monorail, a GIANT FUCKING DRILL, elevators, Bender, and even jet skis in ATLA. then them all being killed when his father tries standing up to said Bender. The Fire Nation brought on a century-long war that kept most people of the world in an industrial stasis, while city suffering under the gangs aren't going to think "Gee, let's try to be as inoffensive as possible and maybe they'll leave us alone", because they continued to innovate. The only area outside of know that there is no possible way that that could ever work. With the FN with technology way he presents it, Amon's power seems like this, without it's a perfect 'solution' to the help problem of Bending; i.e. "Standing up to the Mechanist? Ba Sing Se. That is Benders will just get us killed, but this guy can take away their Bending, and so we'll have nothing to say, the society that kept itself completely cut off fear from them anymore".
** And about Aang having saved them
from the rest of Fire Nation, the earth kingdom, thanks to the influence of Long Feng, and presumably, the naivete or selfishness of the previous earth kings. The amount of evolution Equalist view is that a war wouldn't even HAPPEN if Fire Benders didn't exist to begin with, so the Avatar society went under makes perfect sense, after the war ended and Aang and Zuko presumably did *not* allow the machinery to saving their asses would be kept by only the elite unnecessary. It's a flawed point of BSS and the militaries.
* Look at our history within the last 100 years. 1912, we were just beginning to grapple with motorcars, airplanes, and long-distance communications. [[HumansAreSpecial All it takes is the right spark, and the right people together to send civilization full steam ahead.]]
* Also they have a massive collection of people who
view, sure, but one can manipulate elements, it's shown that some lightning benders generate power, so tht is free energy. Which means they don't need to bring in see it working as much resources just to keep the technology going. Normal firebenders can simply boil water, and water benders condense it providing vastly more energy. So effectively they can use all thier resources on production, rather then fuel.propaganda.



[[folder: Bullying A Dragon]]
* Okay, so once again, there's that "We hate the people with superpowers!" plot going on. Now, I understand the concerns of the non-Benders, and I get that not every Bender is a good-hearted soul who won't abuse it, but here is my issue: With all the "Let's permanently block their ability to bend!" talk, you'd think that someone would say, "Hey, uh...let's not give them a good reason to hate us!" Especially if said person is the AVATAR (aka, the one who could turn Republic City into a smoldering wasteland if he/she so chose.) Are they just asking for Korra to find a reason to go apecrap on them and the city in general? Plus, don't they remember Aang? The previous Avatar who saved their collective asses from the Fire Nation? If they know she's the new Avatar (and likely the reincarnation of Aang) why are they pissing her off? [[TooDumbToLive Are they just trying to get her angry enough to go apeshit and Avatar-State the crap out of them and the city in general?]]
** If i were an Anti-Bender? That is EXACTLY what i'd want. The Avatar using her godlike powers to slaughter a bunch of people? that's exactly the kind of press that proves every single thing that Amon is spewing. Martyrs make for good press. I'm willing to bet that this will be a plot point in future episodes, especially if Amon is smart enough to organize a situation wherein Korra goes Apeshit on some peaceful protesters.
** A large part of the Equalist's rhetoric seems to be that people ''shouldn't have to'' live in fear of offending a Bender just because of what that Bender might do in retaliation. Amon's story paints a nice little picture of this, with his family being oppressed by a Bender, and then them all being killed when his father tries standing up to said Bender. The people of the city suffering under the gangs aren't going to think "Gee, let's try to be as inoffensive as possible and maybe they'll leave us alone", because they know that there is no possible way that that could ever work. With the way he presents it, Amon's power seems like it's a perfect 'solution' to the problem of Bending; i.e. "Standing up to the Benders will just get us killed, but this guy can take away their Bending, and so we'll have nothing to fear from them anymore".
** And about Aang having saved them from the Fire Nation, the Equalist view is that a war wouldn't even HAPPEN if Fire Benders didn't exist to begin with, so the Avatar saving their asses would be unnecessary. It's a flawed point of view, sure, but one can see it working as propaganda.
[[/folder]]







[[folder: How common will the new MechaMooks that Hiroshi created be?]]
He's said that they're made of Platinum. Platinum isn't exactly a common metal, it's more valuable than gold. Considering how much platinum comprises the blast door that traps the heroes and the amount that comprises the mecha mooks, that's gotta be a sizeable chunk of Hiroshi's fortune.
* More valuable ''today''. Think about this from their perspective. Platinum is probably dirt cheap in their world. They haven't advanced to the point where platinum's true value would be apparent. More pliable, impure metals would be in much higher demand, especially when metalbenders need it for equipment and such.
* There are two possibilities. Either platinum is more common in the Avatar universe, and thus less expensive, or earthbenders make mining far more productive than anything we can do in the real world. Meaning that the only reason the Equalists' anti-bender mechas are a plausible threat against metalbenders could be [[{{Irony}} because of labor only earthbenders can perform]].
* Even in RealLife platinum is more common than, say, gold. It's just needed in so many electrical appliances that it's price is higher. Since relatively few electronics still exist in the world, larger amounts would probably be just lying around, not yet seen as all that valuable by most people. In the 18th century plantinum was sometimes treated as little more than garbage, if you can believe that.
** Platinum is more expensive than gold because its much harder to get at despite its marginally greater presence in the crust.
*** Even so, platinum used to be dirt cheap, to the point that counterfeiters used it to counterfeit gold coins (the counterfeit coins were gold plated, of course, since platinum looks nothing like gold).
** In terms of abundance in the Earth, Platinum is nearly 100 times rarer than gold. The real issue is that platinum is weaker than normal armor armor materials like steel.
*** Weaker maybe, but as pointed out on the Fridge page it makes great armor against benders. It can't be bent by the metalbenders, has a high melting point to resist firebenders, and is resistant to corrosion by waterbenders. The weakness relative to steel will probably become apparent once the metalbenders wise up and start smashing the moving parts with rocks, though.
* Are we sure the stuff is solid platinum? Maybe they just have a shell a few millimeters thick that blocks the bending. Still hugely expensive but certainly less absurd.
** Hiroshi Sato ''explicitly'' stated that the walls and mechas were all solid purified platinum, though that might just be him being a hyperbolic rich man.
** A shell wouldn't block bending. The metalbenders would be able to sense the presence of impure metals and manipulate them.
* Aside from the rarity issue, pure platinum is actually a rather malleable metal, and wouldn't make very effective armor - any earthbender throwing a good sized rock should be able to at least severely dent the mechas. This may be a case of DidNotDoTheResearch. Alternately, the wall might have been pure platinum, but the mechas may have been using an alloy of platinum with another metal that was also pure. At any rate, Lin's ability to pierce the platinum armor with her metal-bended spikes (presumable iron/steel) is not surprising.
** She actually just pierced the cockpit glass. However, from what I can see throughout the series, metalbending requires you to actually touch the metal or touch earth touching the metal(since you need to be able to find the impurities with echo-sense earthbending). A thin layer of solid purified platinum would be enough to stop that.
*** No, it doesn't. There are plenty of examples of benders bending their element without the need to touch it. Including Toph metalbending.
*** For the other elements, yes. But I don't think we've ever seen metalbending without touching it or touching earth touching it. Can you name a counter-example?
**** The metalbender police hemming in non-benders at the supposed Equalist rally with loating wooden barricades with metal nails riveted through.
**** Those rivets disappear half-way through the bending process, which could admittedly be an animation error, but the barricades also bent a lot further than a thick plank of wood should, so I just assumed those things were made out of painted rock.
[[/folder]]

to:

[[folder: How common will the new MechaMooks that Hiroshi created be?]]
He's said that they're made of Platinum. Platinum isn't exactly a common metal, it's more valuable than gold. Considering how much platinum comprises the blast door that traps the heroes and the amount that comprises the mecha mooks, that's gotta be a sizeable chunk of Hiroshi's fortune.
* More valuable ''today''. Think about this from their perspective. Platinum is probably dirt cheap in their world. They haven't advanced to the point where platinum's true value would be apparent. More pliable, impure metals would be in much higher demand, especially when metalbenders need it for equipment and such.
* There are two possibilities. Either platinum is more common in the Avatar universe, and thus less expensive, or earthbenders make mining far more productive than anything we can do in the real world. Meaning that the only reason the Equalists' anti-bender mechas are a plausible threat against metalbenders could be [[{{Irony}} because of labor only earthbenders can perform]].
* Even in RealLife platinum is more common than, say, gold. It's just needed in so many electrical appliances that it's price is higher. Since relatively few electronics still exist in the world, larger amounts would probably be just lying around, not yet seen as all that valuable by most people. In the 18th century plantinum was sometimes treated as little more than garbage, if you can believe that.
** Platinum is more expensive than gold because its much harder to get at despite its marginally greater presence in the crust.
*** Even so, platinum used to be dirt cheap, to the point that counterfeiters used it to counterfeit gold coins (the counterfeit coins were gold plated, of course, since platinum looks nothing like gold).
** In terms of abundance in the Earth, Platinum is nearly 100 times rarer than gold. The real issue is that platinum is weaker than normal armor armor materials like steel.
*** Weaker maybe, but as pointed out on the Fridge page it makes great armor against benders. It can't be bent by the metalbenders, has a high melting point to resist firebenders, and is resistant to corrosion by waterbenders. The weakness relative to steel will probably become apparent once the metalbenders wise up and start smashing the moving parts with rocks, though.
* Are we sure the stuff is solid platinum? Maybe they just have a shell a few millimeters thick that blocks the bending. Still hugely expensive but certainly less absurd.
** Hiroshi Sato ''explicitly'' stated that the walls and mechas were all solid purified platinum, though that might just be him being a hyperbolic rich man.
** A shell wouldn't block bending. The metalbenders would be able to sense the presence of impure metals and manipulate them.
* Aside from the rarity issue, pure platinum is actually a rather malleable metal, and wouldn't make very effective armor - any earthbender throwing a good sized rock should be able to at least severely dent the mechas. This may be a case of DidNotDoTheResearch. Alternately, the wall might have been pure platinum, but the mechas may have been using an alloy of platinum with another metal that was also pure. At any rate, Lin's ability to pierce the platinum armor with her metal-bended spikes (presumable iron/steel) is not surprising.
** She actually just pierced the cockpit glass. However, from what I can see throughout the series, metalbending requires you to actually touch the metal or touch earth touching the metal(since you need to be able to find the impurities with echo-sense earthbending). A thin layer of solid purified platinum would be enough to stop that.
*** No, it doesn't. There are plenty of examples of benders bending their element without the need to touch it. Including Toph metalbending.
*** For the other elements, yes. But I don't think we've ever seen metalbending without touching it or touching earth touching it. Can you name a counter-example?
**** The metalbender police hemming in non-benders at the supposed Equalist rally with loating wooden barricades with metal nails riveted through.
**** Those rivets disappear half-way through the bending process, which could admittedly be an animation error, but the barricades also bent a lot further than a thick plank of wood should, so I just assumed those things were made out of painted rock.
[[/folder]]




[[folder: Mecha tanks with magnets]]
I suppose the metalbenders armour is made from steel or iron or something, but how strong were those magnets to lift up people?
* Magnets capable of lifting ''cars'' are routinely used in industrial work in RealLife. There's nothing special about magnets that can lift human-sized objects. What I wonder though is why none of the metalbenders thought to mess up with the magnets' structure and break down their polarity.
** I just wonder why they didn't slip out of their armour. The first few benders may not have had enough time, but the chief definitely had.
** Magnets can be very powerful but they don't have that kind of range. Its just a dramatic conceit.
** Good point on the car thing, was underestimating the strength of magnets. But to take their armour or to mess with the magnets structure, they would need to move their arms to bend, which they can't do.
** More to the point, it's explicitly stated that these mechas are made of pure platinum, which the metalbenders can't bend. Of course, Platinum is malleable enough that they should be able to just... bend it. How they even made a self-supporting Mecha out of the stuff in the first place (or even got enough to make so many mechas) is what bothers me.
[[/folder]]



to:

[[folder: Mecha tanks with magnets]]
I suppose the metalbenders armour is made from steel or iron or something, but how strong were those magnets to lift up people?
* Magnets capable of lifting ''cars'' are routinely used in industrial work in RealLife. There's nothing special about magnets that can lift human-sized objects. What I wonder though is why none of the metalbenders thought to mess up with the magnets' structure and break down their polarity.
** I just wonder why they didn't slip out of their armour. The first few benders may not have had enough time, but the chief definitely had.
** Magnets can be very powerful but they don't have that kind of range. Its just a dramatic conceit.
** Good point on the car thing, was underestimating the strength of magnets. But to take their armour or to mess with the magnets structure, they would need to move their arms to bend, which they can't do.
** More to the point, it's explicitly stated that these mechas are made of pure platinum, which the metalbenders can't bend. Of course, Platinum is malleable enough that they should be able to just... bend it. How they even made a self-supporting Mecha out of the stuff in the first place (or even got enough to make so many mechas) is what bothers me.
[[/folder]]








[[folder: What's up with the massive leaps in medicine?]]
So, just thirty years or so after the original series, the Avatar world seriously has fully effective plastic surgery? Where did that come from? I mean, I know there was a technology boom as the world came together, but even throughout the rest of Korra, the most advanced medicine we see is made of bandages and waterbending.
* You know, I was about to say that they had plastic surgery in the 20s (which they did) but then I remembered that Yakone would've gotten the surgery over 40 years prior, in the equivalent of the 1880s. So, yeah, I think they pulled that clean out of their ass, unless this is a case of RealityIsUnrealistic and they actually had plastic surgery in the late 1800s.
** Dude, they had plastic surgery in AncientEgypt. Do some research yourself instead of complaining for answers, this is the Internet for God's sake.
*** Ancient India, they could reconstruct noses sliced off by swords. In Ancient Rome, they had ''sex change operations''. (Or at least they were talking/thinking about it enough that a particular Roman Emperor asked his physician to perform one)
*** When it comes right down to it, the basic techniques of lots of surgeries date ''way'' back in real-life. The thing that prevented them being used extensively until recently is the lack of effective anesthetic and infection control, which prevented surgeons from being too ambitious in terms of having procedures last too long or require too much tissue manipulation. Surgeons could readily dream up things like full facial reconstructions, but they couldn't do it on a living person without inflicting horrendous agony followed by death from infection and blood loss. But in the Avatarverse, waterbending healing can probably take care of the anesthesia, infection, and wound healing concerns, meaning that ambitious surgeries probably could have been contemplated quite early on in its history. (In fact, in 1800's real-world, a severe scar like the one Zuko received had a high likelihood of fatality from infection after the fact. Zuko's survival suggests medical care has always been pretty advanced, relatively speaking, in the Avatar world.)
* The basic techniques go back much earlier than the 1800s and they didn't make a huge change. Tarrlok and pre-surgery Yakone look fairly similar and only more similar post-surgery. With water bending healers they can keep a person safe through elective surgery like that. So its an AssPull to an extent but not totally absurd. The amazing thing is that they seemed to anesthetize him.
** I agree. It's good to bear in mind that in the decades after the war, the Fire Nation shared their vastly superior technology with the world. Combined with waterbending medical science, it seems pretty feasible to me.
*** The anachronistic thing that is setting off the question here is that the (1880-ish) surgeons are clearly dressed like modern-day doctors, in a room that looks almost ''exactly'' like an OR, complete with those power lights over the operating table. '''Nowhere''' in Korraworld do we see anything even remotely similar to that, so the scene came pretty much out of the blue.
**** Perhaps not so anachronistic. In the flashbacks we see that Republic City already was technologically advanced at that point. Satomobiles hadn't been invented yet, but there were still skyscrapers and city hall and they presumably had power lights. As far as inventing electricity, didn't the Fire Nation airships and that giant drill from A:TLA already have lightbulbs and such?
**** I don't think the issue at hand is lights existing, so much as a remarkably modern setting at all. I'm just spitballing here (and please correct me if I'm wrong) but that kind of OR didn't become until the 50s or so?

to:

[[folder: What's up with the massive leaps in medicine?]]
So, just thirty years or so after the original series, the Avatar world seriously has fully effective plastic surgery? Where








[[folder:Yakone's escape]]
* Forget solitary, how
did that come from? I mean, I know there was a technology boom as the world came together, but even throughout the rest Yakone get out of Korra, the most advanced medicine we see is made of bandages and waterbending.
* You know, I was about
jail in order to say that they had plastic surgery start a new life in the 20s (which North Pole?
** They explicitly said that some of his criminal buddies broke him out. He was the head of a vast criminal empire. Exactly why
they did) but then I remembered broke him out when he was stripped of his bending abilities, who knows? Maybe he had assets that Yakone would've gotten the surgery over 40 years prior, next gang leader could use, and only he knew where to get them, or maybe he simply possessed a level of fanatical devotion in his subordinates (maybe its in the equivalent of the 1880s. So, yeah, I think they pulled blood) that clean out of their ass, unless this is a case of RealityIsUnrealistic and they actually had plastic surgery in the late 1800s.
** Dude, they had plastic surgery in AncientEgypt. Do some research yourself instead of complaining for answers, this is the Internet for God's sake.
*** Ancient India, they could reconstruct noses sliced off by swords. In Ancient Rome, they had ''sex change operations''. (Or at least they were talking/thinking about it enough that a particular Roman Emperor asked his physician to perform one)
*** When it comes right down to it, the basic techniques of lots of surgeries date ''way'' back in real-life. The thing that prevented them being used extensively until recently is the lack of effective anesthetic and infection control, which prevented surgeons from being too ambitious in terms of having procedures last too long or require too much tissue manipulation. Surgeons could readily dream up things like full facial reconstructions, but they couldn't do it on a living person without inflicting horrendous agony followed by death from infection and blood loss. But in the Avatarverse, waterbending healing can probably take care of the anesthesia, infection, and wound healing concerns, meaning that ambitious surgeries probably could have been contemplated quite early on in its history. (In fact, in 1800's real-world, a severe scar like the one Zuko received had a high likelihood of fatality from infection after the fact. Zuko's survival suggests medical care has always been pretty advanced, relatively speaking, in the Avatar world.)
* The basic techniques go back much earlier than the 1800s and
they didn't make a huge change. Tarrlok and pre-surgery Yakone look fairly similar and only more similar post-surgery. With water care about his bending healers they can keep a person safe through elective surgery like that. So its an AssPull to an extent but not totally absurd. The amazing thing is that they seemed to anesthetize him.
** I agree. It's good to bear in mind that in the decades after the war, the Fire Nation shared their vastly superior technology with the world. Combined with waterbending medical science, it seems pretty feasible to me.
*** The anachronistic thing that is setting off the question here is that the (1880-ish) surgeons are clearly dressed like modern-day doctors, in a room that looks almost ''exactly'' like an OR, complete with those power lights over the operating table. '''Nowhere''' in Korraworld do we see anything even remotely similar to that, so the scene came pretty much out of the blue.
**** Perhaps not so anachronistic. In the flashbacks we see that Republic City already was technologically advanced at that point. Satomobiles hadn't been invented yet, but there were still skyscrapers and city hall and they presumably had power lights. As far as inventing electricity, didn't the Fire Nation airships and that giant drill from A:TLA already have lightbulbs and such?
**** I don't think the issue at hand is lights existing, so much as a remarkably modern setting at all. I'm just spitballing here (and please correct me if I'm wrong) but that kind of OR didn't become until the 50s or so?
status.



[[folder:Yakone's escape]]
* Forget solitary, how did Yakone get out of jail in order to start a new life in the North Pole?
** They explicitly said that some of his criminal buddies broke him out. He was the head of a vast criminal empire. Exactly why they broke him out when he was stripped of his bending abilities, who knows? Maybe he had assets that the next gang leader could use, and only he knew where to get them, or maybe he simply possessed a level of fanatical devotion in his subordinates (maybe its in the blood) that they didn't care about his bending status.

to:

[[folder:Yakone's escape]]
* Forget solitary, how did Yakone get out of jail
[[folder: Was Korra originally meant to be a six-hour long movie?]]
Is it me, or unlike ATLA, they've pretty much wrapped it up here, with Korra becoming a Fully realized Avatar? Was it actually meant to go on for only one season until late
in order to start a new life in the North Pole?
** They explicitly said that some of his criminal buddies broke him out. He
production?
* Yes. It
was the head of originally supposed to be a vast criminal empire. Exactly why one season miniseries, but they broke him out when he got a second season while the first one was stripped of his bending abilities, who knows? Maybe he had assets that the next gang leader could use, and only he knew where to get them, or maybe he simply possessed a level of fanatical devotion alredy in his subordinates (maybe its in the blood) that they didn't care about his bending status. production.








[[folder: Was Korra originally meant to be a six-hour long movie?]]
Is it me, or unlike ATLA, they've pretty much wrapped it up here, with Korra becoming a Fully realized Avatar? Was it actually meant to go on for only one season until late in production?
* Yes. It was originally supposed to be a one season miniseries, but they got a second season while the first one was alredy in production.
[[/folder]]




[[folder:Magic plastic surgery?]]
I couldn't have been the only one who noticed. But Tarrlok looks just like his father post surgery.
* I think its okay to assume that Realism was abadoned for the sake of symbolism here. While Tarrlok look more like Yakone post-surgery, Noatak looks more like Yakone pre-surgery which is a neat contrast between the brothers.
* And it's not like Tarrlok ''doesn't'' look like Yakone even pre-surgery. People were pointing out the resemblance before the twist was ever revealed. He just happens to look slightly ''more'' like him post-surgery.
** Yep; see [[http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m50a7vyXCi1qlg334.jpg pre-surgery Yakone]] and [[http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m50a89w6tl1qlg334.jpg Adult Tarrlok]]
[[/folder]]







to:

[[folder:Magic plastic surgery?]]
I couldn't have been the only one who noticed. But Tarrlok looks just like his father post surgery.
* I think its okay to assume that Realism was abadoned for the sake of symbolism here. While Tarrlok look more like Yakone post-surgery, Noatak looks more like Yakone pre-surgery which is a neat contrast between the brothers.
* And it's not like Tarrlok ''doesn't'' look like Yakone even pre-surgery. People were pointing out the resemblance before the twist was ever revealed. He just happens to look slightly ''more'' like him post-surgery.
** Yep; see [[http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m50a7vyXCi1qlg334.jpg pre-surgery Yakone]] and [[http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m50a89w6tl1qlg334.jpg Adult Tarrlok]]
[[/folder]]












14th Aug '12 1:55:48 PM ccoa
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* [[Headscratchers/TheLegendOfKorraTarrlok Tarrlok]]



[[folder: Where did Tarrlok learn to bloodbend?]]
Katara was the only one who knew the technique, and she would never have passed it on like that; if she taught anyone at all, it would be Korra, and I doubt that she did. (Also, Tarrlok is from the Northern tribe, so he probably wouldn't have learned it from her anyway.) From what Korra said, it's not completely unheard of, just very rare; again, Katara certainly wouldn't have spread it around. Did someone else just develop it on their own in the interim?

* The first bloodbender, Hama, was imprisoned by the Fire Nation and she invented bloodbending because she was desperate for power, which she needed to escape the prison. We already saw Tarrlok's ambition for power, so it'd really make sense if he were to practice bloodbending on his own because he wanted the power.
* That, and [[spoiler:Yakone]] is implied to be a bloodbender, so the art was defenitely not lost.
* Maybe, one day in some pub in Republic city, one of Hama's victims told the story about how some freaky waterbender made him move around like a puppet. Someone overheard it and decided to try it out. I think it's one of those things where if you know it's possible, you can find a way to do it.
* Maybe the Ember Island Players uncovered Hama's story during their 'research' and worked it into their play. Once Bloodbending became common knowledge, any Waterbender with sufficient power could have independently developed the technique.
* Why not? The fundamental principle behind it is pretty simple. All it takes is for someone to observe that the human body is about 75% water and a villainous streak of insight to realize that it could be possible to bend a person's nerves and muscles by bending the water in them. More than one person could have figured that out. I mean it's not just the Japanese who made cool swords. The rest is all a lot of training. Eventually the bloodbender would become so powerful that they might not need the full moon at all. With even more skill they could bend even with their hands and feet tied (like King Bumi). Use a bicycle long enough and you can ride without using your hands.
* Also the Crescent Moon symbol on Yakhone's shirt is the same as the moon shown in the sky when Tarrlok drives Korra away. It's likely that Tarrlok is Yakone's son and he could have learnt it from him.
** [[spoiler:Confirmed as of "Out Of The Past."]]
* It's implied that the public (or the higher ups of Republic City) have fair knowledge of Bloodbending existance because Yukone's trial scene explicitly mentions it's outlawed.
[[/folder]]

to:

[[folder: Where did Tarrlok learn to bloodbend?]]
Katara was the only one who knew the technique, and she would never have passed it on like that; if she taught anyone at all, it would be Korra, and I doubt that she did. (Also, Tarrlok is from the Northern tribe, so he probably wouldn't have learned it from her anyway.) From what Korra said, it's not completely unheard of, just very rare; again, Katara certainly wouldn't have spread it around. Did someone else just develop it on their own in the interim?

* The first bloodbender, Hama, was imprisoned by the Fire Nation and she invented bloodbending because she was desperate for power, which she needed to escape the prison. We already saw Tarrlok's ambition for power, so it'd really make sense if he were to practice bloodbending on his own because he wanted the power.
* That, and [[spoiler:Yakone]] is implied to be a bloodbender, so the art was defenitely not lost.
* Maybe, one day in some pub in Republic city, one of Hama's victims told the story about how some freaky waterbender made him move around like a puppet. Someone overheard it and decided to try it out. I think it's one of those things where if you know it's possible, you can find a way to do it.
* Maybe the Ember Island Players uncovered Hama's story during their 'research' and worked it into their play. Once Bloodbending became common knowledge, any Waterbender with sufficient power could have independently developed the technique.
* Why not? The fundamental principle behind it is pretty simple. All it takes is for someone to observe that the human body is about 75% water and a villainous streak of insight to realize that it could be possible to bend a person's nerves and muscles by bending the water in them. More than one person could have figured that out. I mean it's not just the Japanese who made cool swords. The rest is all a lot of training. Eventually the bloodbender would become so powerful that they might not need the full moon at all. With even more skill they could bend even with their hands and feet tied (like King Bumi). Use a bicycle long enough and you can ride without using your hands.
* Also the Crescent Moon symbol on Yakhone's shirt is the same as the moon shown in the sky when Tarrlok drives Korra away. It's likely that Tarrlok is Yakone's son and he could have learnt it from him.
** [[spoiler:Confirmed as of "Out Of The Past."]]
* It's implied that the public (or the higher ups of Republic City) have fair knowledge of Bloodbending existance because Yukone's trial scene explicitly mentions it's outlawed.
[[/folder]]




[[folder: So, why doesn't Tarrlok just...kill everyone?]]
It sounds like a stupid question, but by the time the mid-point of episode nine rolls around, his secret's out, he's a wanted man, he has nothing left to lose, and he bloodbends virtually the entire extended Team Avatar right then and there, so...why not? Why not take it a little farther? He had the opportunity. He had the motive. Hell, since no one else knew he could bloodbend, it's a crime that almost covers itself right up. For that matter, I don't know why he didn't kill Korra when he got back to her little prison. Killing the Avatar is never the ideal solution, since they reincarnate, but that at least grants you a good 12-16 years of security while the new Avatar grows up. Basically, killing would seem perfectly in-character, and there just doesn't seem to be a good reason it didn't happen except for "It's a kids' show" and "There would be no plot."
* I figured he kept Korra alive as a hostage just in case. He even says so just before he meets [[spoiler:Amon.]] Also, as seen in the flash back, killing people take a lot more time then just knocking them out, time which he could use to make his escape.
** Keeping Korra as his hostage [[spoiler: to start a new life]] was his backup plan as seen in the following episode.
* If you payed attention during Korra's flashback to Aang's battle with Yakone, it explains why. Yakone, who is arguably far more powerful than Tarrlok since he doesn't even need his hands to bloodbend, was visibly exerting a ''huge'' amount of effort to kill Aang via bloodbending, and it was a very slow process as well, giving Aang enough time to go into the Avatar state. Tarrlok simply doesn't have the skill or time to kill off every single witness, and even then he'd have a very hard time covering it up.
* Bloodbending seems to involve a great deal of strain in general. Even knocking them out took a great deal of time and effort. If he takes the time to kill them he risks someone else entering the room, quite possibly a person more dangerous than his secretary.
* In addition, despite being quite the JerkAss, Tarrlok wasn't really portrayed as someone that would want to indiscriminately kill people. He wasn't THAT evil.

to:











[[folder: So, why doesn't Tarrlok just...kill everyone?]]
It sounds like a stupid question,
Episodes? Season Finale?]]
I may have heard wrong,
but by according to the time commercial, the mid-point of episode nine rolls around, his secret's out, he's Season Finale is next week, a wanted man, he has nothing left to lose, and he bloodbends virtually the entire extended Team Avatar right then and there, so...why not? Why not take it a little farther? He had the opportunity. He had the motive. Hell, since no one else knew he could bloodbend, it's a crime that almost covers itself right up. For that matter, I One-Hour season finale. Cool, i'm excited, don't know why he didn't kill Korra when he got back to her little prison. Killing get me wrong, but one hour? that's two episodes, right? which means, after next week, the Avatar is never the ideal solution, since they reincarnate, series will be at 11 episodes. I thought it was supposed to be twelve. I guess its possible to fit three episodes in an hour, but that at least grants you a good 12-16 years of security while the new Avatar grows up. Basically, killing would seem perfectly in-character, and there just it doesn't seem to likely given how many commercials will be a good reason it didn't happen except for "It's a kids' show" and "There would be no plot."
* I figured he kept Korra alive as a hostage
involved. So, was an episode cancelled, did Nick just screw up, or did i just miscount?
* No, the season finale is being advertised coming out
in 23rd of June, two weeks from now. Next week is still business as usual. They're just advertising early.
* Good, thanks for clearing that up for me. I think i'd go through withdraws if they cut an episode.
** At least I ''think'' this is the
case. He even says so just before he meets [[spoiler:Amon.]] Also, as seen I got no confirmation either, but at least there has been no hint of leaving out next week's episode in any source I know. Our own wiki tells that Turning the flash back, killing Tides will come out in June 16th.
** Many
people take a lot seem to believe there won't be an episode next week. Good job, Nick. I think that promo was more time then just knocking them out, time which he could use to make his escape.
** Keeping Korra as his hostage [[spoiler: to start a new life]] was his backup plan as seen in the following episode.
* If you payed attention during Korra's flashback to Aang's battle with Yakone, it explains why. Yakone, who is arguably far more powerful
harmful than Tarrlok since he doesn't even need his hands to bloodbend, was visibly exerting a ''huge'' amount of effort to kill Aang via bloodbending, and it was a very slow process as well, giving Aang enough time to go into no promo at all like the Avatar state. Tarrlok simply doesn't have the skill or time to kill off every single witness, and even then he'd have a very hard time covering it up.
* Bloodbending seems to involve a great deal
last couple of strain in general. Even knocking them out took a great deal of time and effort. If he takes the time to kill them he risks someone else entering the room, quite possibly a person more dangerous than his secretary.
* In addition, despite being quite the JerkAss, Tarrlok wasn't really portrayed as someone that would want to indiscriminately kill people. He wasn't THAT evil.
weeks.





[[folder: Why Tarrlok and not Amon?]]
OK. So Aang is trying to communicate with Korra. Due to Korra's spiritual problems, he is not able to flat out talk to her, only show her disjointed visions. So why focus on Tarrlok instead of the far more threatening Amon? Granted, Tarrlok is dangerous and they needed him out of power as soon as possible. But Amon is obviously the bigger threat, having the big army, and the truckload of evidence that he has energybending powers and a connection to the Spirit World. So why focus on Tarrlok instead of getting Korra intel on Amon?
* Its entirely possible he has no intel on Amon.
* What if the visions Aang showed her weren't just about Tarrlok? What if Aang was trying to warn her about Amon, too, because Amon's also a bloodbender? I mean, [[spoiler: Amon just stepped right through Tarrlok's bloodbending.]] In "The Puppetmaster," Katara was able to stop Hama bloodbending her because she also had that ability.
** The preview for the season finale [[spoiler:implies that this is right on the money.]]
* I certainly hope that there's more to it, because otherwise, it would be quite disappointing for a variety of reasons: first and foremost, the warning was ineffectual. Second, the Tarrlok storyline is pretty much over, unless Amon didn't actually take his bending. Third, Tarrlok, while scary and creepy, wasn't the actual threat in this story. Fourth, it would seem like a weird attempt at shoehorning the Gaang in. The flashbacks served exactly no purpose. Korra still hasn't actually communicated with Aang, she still hasn't airbended, and the flashbacks didn't reveal anything to her that only Aang could have known and she didn't learn a lesson from it either.
** The flashbacks were intended as a warning about Tarrlok, but due to lack of spiritual side, she received the hint too late. But considering the Avatar's past lives are always with them, it's probably not the last time we'll see them. As for why the warning was about Tarrlok, and not Amon, Aang died without ever having known Amon at all, but he knew Yakone had a son at some point (they had to be keeping an eye on him after he took away his bending). So while he couldn't advise Korra about Amon, not knowing him much, he COULD about Tarrlok.
*** That's the problem though. Even if she had received it earlier, how would it have helped her? Without Tarrlok bloodbending her, she probably wouldn't have guessed that he's Yakone's son. She would have known what Tenzin probably could have told her too. Anyway, because someone brought it up below, I hope attention will be drawn to the fact that Aang and Amon take bending away differently. Because other than the person debended, who except Aang witnessed the debending? Now Korra knows and can get suspicious about it.
** Were the flashbacks all about Tarrlok? The most important part of the scene I noticed was the juxtaposition of the council members and the act of energy bending in the past and present. The flashbacks give perspective to both new viewers who've never seen the original series and Korra herself who needs to learn to look at problems more complexly, which she's already started by standing up for the innocent non-benders.
** From a more out-of-universe perspective, the flashbacks also served to flesh out the backstory of the current episode. It wouldn't have been very satisfying to learn "Tarrlok can break the rules and bloodbend without a full moon because his dad taught him how" without actually seeing his dad in action.

to:

\n\n[[folder: Why Tarrlok and not Amon?]]
OK. So Aang
is trying to communicate with Korra. Due to Korra's spiritual problems, he is not able to flat out talk to her, everybody so lightly dressed?]]
The
only show her disjointed visions. So thing coming close to a reasonable outfit is Lin's coat.
* She had time to change, they did not.
** It's less about that, it's their choice of wardrobe in the first place. It's winter, and they're wearing the same things they are wearing all the time. Korra, of course, is the worst offender, leaving the house like that. The Satomobiles aren't exactly warm and cozy either, which would have explained
why focus Bolin and Mako don't put on Tarrlok instead of the far more threatening Amon? Granted, Tarrlok is dangerous and they needed him out of power as soon as possible. But Amon is obviously clothes.
* Korra use to live in
the bigger threat, having the big army, and the truckload of evidence that he has energybending powers and a connection South Pole. She's probably use to the Spirit World. So why focus on Tarrlok instead of getting Korra intel on Amon?
* Its entirely possible he has no intel on Amon.
* What if the visions Aang showed her weren't just about Tarrlok? What if Aang was trying to warn her about Amon, too, because Amon's also a bloodbender? I mean, [[spoiler: Amon just stepped right through Tarrlok's bloodbending.]] In "The Puppetmaster," Katara was able to stop Hama bloodbending her because she also had that ability.
** The preview for the season finale [[spoiler:implies that this is right on the money.]]
* I certainly hope that there's more to it, because otherwise, it would be quite disappointing for a variety of reasons: first and foremost, the warning was ineffectual. Second, the Tarrlok storyline is pretty much over, unless Amon
cold. Mako, Bolin, And Asami didn't actually take his bending. Third, Tarrlok, while scary have time to change what with breaking out of jail and creepy, wasn't the actual threat in this story. Fourth, it would all. Tenzin's cloths seem like a weird attempt at shoehorning pretty warm. (Don't quite remember what he was wearing.)
* Tenzin has
the Gaang in. The flashbacks served exactly no purpose. Korra still hasn't actually communicated excuse of being an airbender. Aang seemed just fine in both Poles with Aang, she still hasn't airbended, and the flashbacks didn't reveal anything to her his regular clothes; fandom is that only Aang could have known and she didn't learn a lesson from it either.
** The flashbacks were intended as a warning about Tarrlok, but due
he used airbending to lack of spiritual side, she received the hint too late. But considering the Avatar's past lives are always with them, it's probably not the last time we'll see them. As for why the warning was about Tarrlok, and not Amon, Aang died without ever having known Amon at all, but he knew Yakone had a son at some point (they had to be keeping an eye on him after he took away his bending). So while he couldn't advise Korra about Amon, not knowing him much, he COULD about Tarrlok.
*** That's the problem though. Even if she had received it earlier, how would it have helped her? Without Tarrlok bloodbending her, she probably wouldn't have guessed that he's Yakone's son. She
insulate himself. Tenzin would have known what Tenzin probably could have told her too. Anyway, because someone brought it up below, I hope attention will be drawn to learned the fact that Aang technique from his father. As for Mako and Amon take bending away differently. Because other than Bolin, remember they lived as orphans on the person debended, who except Aang witnessed the debending? Now Korra knows and can get suspicious about it.streets; they know how to deal with being in winter weather without proper clothing.
** Were the flashbacks all about Tarrlok? The most important part of the scene I noticed was the juxtaposition of the council members and the act of energy bending in the past and present. The flashbacks give perspective to both new viewers who've never seen the original series and * Korra herself who needs and Mako are firebenders; they don't need heavy clothing to learn to look at problems more complexly, which she's already started by standing up for keep warm. Asami and Bolin are reasonably well dressed; judging from the innocent non-benders.
** From a more out-of-universe perspective, the flashbacks also served to flesh out the backstory of the current episode. It wouldn't have been very satisfying to learn "Tarrlok can break the rules and bloodbend without a full moon because his dad taught him how" without actually seeing his dad
copious snowfall, it can't be much below freezing, if at all. Thick snow only falls in action.relatively warm winter weather.



[[folder: Episodes? Season Finale?]]
I may have heard wrong, but according to the commercial, the Season Finale is next week, a One-Hour season finale. Cool, i'm excited, don't get me wrong, but one hour? that's two episodes, right? which means, after next week, the series will be at 11 episodes. I thought it was supposed to be twelve. I guess its possible to fit three episodes in an hour, but it doesn't seem likely given how many commercials will be involved. So, was an episode cancelled, did Nick just screw up, or did i just miscount?
* No, the season finale is being advertised coming out in 23rd of June, two weeks from now. Next week is still business as usual. They're just advertising early.
* Good, thanks for clearing that up for me. I think i'd go through withdraws if they cut an episode.
** At least I ''think'' this is the case. I got no confirmation either, but at least there has been no hint of leaving out next week's episode in any source I know. Our own wiki tells that Turning the Tides will come out in June 16th.
** Many people seem to believe there won't be an episode next week. Good job, Nick. I think that promo was more harmful than no promo at all like the last couple of weeks.

to:




[[folder: Episodes? Season Finale?]]
I may have heard wrong, but according to
Why wasn't Yakone in solitary after that stunt he pulled?]]
He somehow had
the commercial, opportunity to beget Tarrlok 4 years later, despite receiving a life sentence for 12 counts of bloodbending and proceeding to bloodbend the Season Finale is next week, a One-Hour season finale. Cool, i'm excited, entire courtroom to resist being sent to jail, and then bloodbends the Avatar with intent to kill. That seems like it merits the sentence being upgraded to life in prison with no human contact (and only because they don't get me wrong, but one hour? that's two episodes, right? have the death penalty out of respect for Aang), except the people who will bring his meals, who are in turn forbidden to speak to him.
* Sounds like you're expecting Republic City prisons to be as cruel as Fire Nation prisons in the original series. It's not unlikely that the influence of Aang/Katara/etc made the retributive system in Republic City more humane, and things like conjugal visits were allowed in their prisons,
which means, after next week, the series will be at 11 episodes. I thought it was supposed would've made Tarrlok's conception possible. Since Aang took Yakone's bending away, he wasn't considered dangerous anymore, so he wouldn't have needed to be twelve. I guess its possible kept in solitary. That, or Yakone simply escaped from prison, and catching him wasn't a high priority anymore because he'd lost his bloodbending, so he managed to fit three episodes find a wife and live the rest of his life in an hour, but it doesn't seem likely hiding.
* Because they're not evil scum who want to drive their prisoners insane? Even Ozai wasn't
given how many commercials will be involved. So, was an episode cancelled, did Nick just screw up, or did i just miscount?
* No, the season finale is being advertised coming out in 23rd of June, two weeks from now. Next week is still business as usual. They're just advertising early.
* Good, thanks for clearing that up for me. I think i'd go through withdraws if they cut an episode.
such treatment.
* Aang says he's 40 years old in the flashback which means that as stated it is 42 years ago, he dies 26 years later and Korra is now 16. According to the Welcome to Republic City game Tarrlok is 37. He was born when his father was in prison.
** At least I ''think'' this Or Tarrlok's listed age is wrong or represents a lie he's told. A fit man in his forties could pass as 37, especially one as vain as Tarrlock.
** Could easily be a lie. Tarrlock does bare a resemblance to Yakone after all...if anyone brought attention to it, he could just make an offhand comment that he was born after Yakone was already in jail and the matter would drop.
** Or maybe Yakone was broken out of prison. He did have a criminal empire.
** It's possible that the background people, like JK Rowling, can't do math, and Tarrlock isn't supposed to have been born after Yakone went to prison.
** The math assumes the Avatar is reborn right away, which may not be
the case. I got no confirmation either, but at least there Alternatively, considering the catastrophic emotional consequences of removing someone's bending, the council may have amended his sentence on the grounds that he has been "suffered enough" and is no hint of leaving out next week's longer a threat.
*** A previous
episode in any source I know. Our own wiki tells specifically states that Turning Yakone was defeated 42 years ago.
**** Considering
the Tides will come out in June 16th.
** Many people seem to believe there won't be an episode next week. Good job, Nick. I think
fact that promo nobody knew Tarrlock was more harmful Yakone's son, I would say that Tarrlock is older than no promo at all like the last couple of weeks. 42 and lied about his age along with his parentage.
**** Same troper as above, I stay corrected. The real answer is that Yakone escaped.



[[folder: Why is everybody so lightly dressed?]]
The only thing coming close to a reasonable outfit is Lin's coat.
* She had time to change, they did not.
** It's less about that, it's their choice of wardrobe in the first place. It's winter, and they're wearing the same things they are wearing all the time. Korra, of course, is the worst offender, leaving the house like that. The Satomobiles aren't exactly warm and cozy either, which would have explained why Bolin and Mako don't put on more clothes.
* Korra use to live in the South Pole. She's probably use to the cold. Mako, Bolin, And Asami didn't have time to change what with breaking out of jail and all. Tenzin's cloths seem pretty warm. (Don't quite remember what he was wearing.)
* Tenzin has the excuse of being an airbender. Aang seemed just fine in both Poles with his regular clothes; fandom is that he used airbending to insulate himself. Tenzin would have learned the technique from his father. As for Mako and Bolin, remember they lived as orphans on the streets; they know how to deal with being in winter weather without proper clothing.
* Korra and Mako are firebenders; they don't need heavy clothing to keep warm. Asami and Bolin are reasonably well dressed; judging from the copious snowfall, it can't be much below freezing, if at all. Thick snow only falls in relatively warm winter weather.

to:




[[folder: Why Mecha tanks with magnets]]
I suppose the metalbenders armour
is everybody so lightly dressed?]]
The only thing coming close
made from steel or iron or something, but how strong were those magnets to a reasonable outfit is Lin's coat.
lift up people?
* She had time to change, they did not.
** It's less
Magnets capable of lifting ''cars'' are routinely used in industrial work in RealLife. There's nothing special about that, it's magnets that can lift human-sized objects. What I wonder though is why none of the metalbenders thought to mess up with the magnets' structure and break down their choice of wardrobe in the first place. It's winter, and they're wearing the same things polarity.
** I just wonder why
they are wearing all the time. Korra, of course, is the worst offender, leaving the house like that. The Satomobiles aren't exactly warm and cozy either, which would have explained why Bolin and Mako don't put on more clothes.
* Korra use to live in the South Pole. She's probably use to the cold. Mako, Bolin, And Asami
didn't have time to change what with breaking slip out of jail and all. Tenzin's cloths seem pretty warm. (Don't quite remember what he was wearing.)
* Tenzin has the excuse of being an airbender. Aang seemed just fine in both Poles with his regular clothes; fandom is that he used airbending to insulate himself. Tenzin would
their armour. The first few benders may not have learned had enough time, but the technique from his father. As for Mako and Bolin, remember they lived as orphans on the streets; they know how to deal with being in winter weather without proper clothing.
* Korra and Mako are firebenders;
chief definitely had.
** Magnets can be very powerful but
they don't have that kind of range. Its just a dramatic conceit.
** Good point on the car thing, was underestimating the strength of magnets. But to take their armour or to mess with the magnets structure, they would
need heavy clothing to keep warm. Asami and Bolin are reasonably well dressed; judging from the copious snowfall, it move their arms to bend, which they can't do.
** More to the point, it's explicitly stated that these mechas are made of pure platinum, which the metalbenders can't bend. Of course, Platinum is malleable enough that they should
be much below freezing, if at all. Thick snow only falls able to just... bend it. How they even made a self-supporting Mecha out of the stuff in relatively warm winter weather. the first place (or even got enough to make so many mechas) is what bothers me.




[[folder: Why wasn't Yakone in solitary after that stunt he pulled?]]
He somehow had the opportunity to beget Tarrlok 4 years later, despite receiving a life sentence for 12 counts of bloodbending and proceeding to bloodbend the entire courtroom to resist being sent to jail, and then bloodbends the Avatar with intent to kill. That seems like it merits the sentence being upgraded to life in prison with no human contact (and only because they don't have the death penalty out of respect for Aang), except the people who will bring his meals, who are in turn forbidden to speak to him.
* Sounds like you're expecting Republic City prisons to be as cruel as Fire Nation prisons in the original series. It's not unlikely that the influence of Aang/Katara/etc made the retributive system in Republic City more humane, and things like conjugal visits were allowed in their prisons, which would've made Tarrlok's conception possible. Since Aang took Yakone's bending away, he wasn't considered dangerous anymore, so he wouldn't have needed to be kept in solitary. That, or Yakone simply escaped from prison, and catching him wasn't a high priority anymore because he'd lost his bloodbending, so he managed to find a wife and live the rest of his life in hiding.
* Because they're not evil scum who want to drive their prisoners insane? Even Ozai wasn't given such treatment.
* Aang says he's 40 years old in the flashback which means that as stated it is 42 years ago, he dies 26 years later and Korra is now 16. According to the Welcome to Republic City game Tarrlok is 37. He was born when his father was in prison.
** Or Tarrlok's listed age is wrong or represents a lie he's told. A fit man in his forties could pass as 37, especially one as vain as Tarrlock.
** Could easily be a lie. Tarrlock does bare a resemblance to Yakone after all...if anyone brought attention to it, he could just make an offhand comment that he was born after Yakone was already in jail and the matter would drop.
** Or maybe Yakone was broken out of prison. He did have a criminal empire.
** It's possible that the background people, like JK Rowling, can't do math, and Tarrlock isn't supposed to have been born after Yakone went to prison.
** The math assumes the Avatar is reborn right away, which may not be the case. Alternatively, considering the catastrophic emotional consequences of removing someone's bending, the council may have amended his sentence on the grounds that he has "suffered enough" and is no longer a threat.
*** A previous episode specifically states that Yakone was defeated 42 years ago.
**** Considering the fact that nobody knew Tarrlock was Yakone's son, I would say that Tarrlock is older than 42 and lied about his age along with his parentage.
**** Same troper as above, I stay corrected. The real answer is that Yakone escaped.

to:

\n[[folder: Why How does a terrorist group have so many members?]]
Seriously, am I the only one wondering why there seem to be an almost unlimited amount of Equalist soldiers? First of all, there
wasn't Yakone in solitary after much discrimination against non-benders to begin with, especially not violence. There are almost no reasons to join the Equalists unless someone you know got killed by a bender, like Amon [[spoiler: and Hiroshi]], but it's not like that stunt he pulled?]]
He somehow had
many people have been killed by benders. Not to mention, these are dedicated soldiers, trained in the opportunity to beget Tarrlok 4 years later, despite receiving a life sentence for 12 counts art of bloodbending chi-blocking and proceeding to bloodbend the entire courtroom to resist being sent to jail, and then bloodbends the Avatar with intent to kill. That seems like it merits the sentence being upgraded to life in prison with no human contact (and only because all that stuff. It's obvious by now they aren't just {{Well Intentioned Extremist}}s, they're terrorists. You don't have the death penalty out of respect for Aang), except the see someone who doesn't really like benders join a TERRORIST GROUP to try and get equality. So, how is there so many people who will bring willing to give up their life for the cause?
* The problem is assuming that he got all of
his meals, who are in turn forbidden to speak to him.
* Sounds like you're expecting
troops from Republic City prisons to be as cruel as Fire Nation prisons instead of taking them in from all of the original series. It's not unlikely nations. He has a lot of people for one city, but from across five nations that span the influence of Aang/Katara/etc made entire globe it's a lot less unbelievable. As for there not being that much discrimination, there is still the retributive system fact that it appears all of the triads in Republic City more humane, alone are completely staffed by Benders, as we saw in the original series with Zuko Alone Benders still oppressed people. So think of it as generations of pent up aggression at the inequality of power between benders and things like conjugal visits were allowed in their prisons, which would've made Tarrlok's conception possible. Since Aang took Yakone's bending away, he wasn't considered dangerous anymore, so he wouldn't have needed to be kept in solitary. That, or Yakone simply escaped from prison, and catching him wasn't a high priority anymore because he'd lost his bloodbending, so he managed to find a wife and live the rest of his life in hiding.
* Because they're not evil scum who want to drive their prisoners insane? Even Ozai wasn't given such treatment.
non-benders.
* Aang says he's 40 years old Also keep in the flashback which means mind that as stated it is 42 years ago, he dies 26 years later and Korra is now 16. According to the Welcome to Republic City game Tarrlok is 37. He was born when his father was in prison.
** Or Tarrlok's listed age is wrong or represents a lie he's told. A fit man in his forties could pass as 37, especially one as vain as Tarrlock.
** Could easily be a lie. Tarrlock does bare a resemblance to Yakone after all...if anyone brought attention to it, he could just make an offhand comment that he was born after Yakone was already in jail and the matter would drop.
** Or maybe Yakone was broken out
houses millions of prison. He did have a criminal empire.
** It's possible that the background
people, like JK Rowling, can't do math, and Tarrlock isn't supposed judging by the numbers we've seen, I'd estimate that there are only a few hundred full-time Equalist chi-blockers out there. Sympathizers who are willing to have look the other way, or give financial aid and other indirect support probably amount to a few thousand at most. There were organizations in early 20th century Europe with equally grand plans to reorganize the society to their liking with similarly numbered ranks, who took over countries and reigned for decades.
* The show has failed to show it but there were three large all bender gangs in the city. The number of non-benders people who don't want to be helpless in the face of that kind of abuse must be tremendous. Except for one scene all of this has
been born after Yakone went off screen so its impossible for us to prison.
** The math assumes the Avatar is reborn right away, which may not be the case. Alternatively, considering the catastrophic emotional consequences of removing someone's bending, the council may have amended his sentence on the grounds that he has "suffered enough" and is no longer a threat.
*** A previous episode specifically states that Yakone was defeated 42 years ago.
**** Considering the fact that nobody knew Tarrlock was Yakone's son, I would say that Tarrlock is older than 42 and lied about his age along
really sympathize with his parentage.
**** Same troper as above, I stay corrected. The real answer is that Yakone escaped.
their position.



[[folder:Why didn't Tarrlok bend the snow?]]
* I can understand needing to focus on bloodbending the rest of the chi blockers, but when facing Amon couldn't Tarrlok have bent the surrounding snow into the cabin and used that against him? I'm sure it's not impossible to bend snow with enough force to break glass.
** He was probably confident enough in his bloodbending abilities. When it didn't work against Amon, he didn't react fast enough out of surprise/shock/fright.
*** Pretty much. Plus, Amon moves really fast and there wasn't much room. By the time he could think to shift strategies, Amon would be up in his face.
** Is it even possible to bend both blood and other water at the same time? Been a while since I saw the Puppetmaster and I don't remember Katara or Hama from A:TLA bloodbending and waterbending at once. If Tarrlok still needed to bloodbend the other Equalists to prevent them attacking maybe he couldn't bend the snow.
* Honestly, a better question is why he didn't try to bloodbend the other Equalists into Amon. Though again, he was taken completely off guard and had to deal with a master of close-combat fighting at close range.

to:

[[folder:Why didn't

[[folder: How did Shiro Shinobi know
Tarrlok bend was the snow?]]
one who kidnapped Korra?]]
And if he had used his old IntrepidReporter skills to find out, how did Tarrlok's cover story work? Would the truth not have been broadcast on the radio for all to hear?
* The "Previously On" segments are clearly not happening in-universe. I'm simply amazed that someone could have come to the conclusion they were. Just...''wow'', I can seriously cannot understand needing to focus on bloodbending how this is being asked for a second time.
* The confusion probably stems from
the rest fact that, in the preview of the chi blockers, but when facing Amon couldn't seventh episode, Tarrlok have bent was the surrounding snow into voice over and in the cabin previous episode Shiro was attack, and used that against him? I'm sure Tarrlok's voice over is clearly in-universe. So to be fair, it's not impossible to bend snow with enough force to break glass.
** He was probably confident enough in his bloodbending abilities. When it didn't work against Amon, he didn't react fast enough out of surprise/shock/fright.
*** Pretty much. Plus, Amon moves really fast and there wasn't much room. By the time he could think to shift strategies, Amon would be up in his face.
** Is it even possible to bend both blood and other water at the same time? Been a while since I saw the Puppetmaster and I don't remember Katara or Hama from A:TLA bloodbending and waterbending at once. If Tarrlok still needed to bloodbend the other Equalists to prevent them attacking maybe he couldn't bend the snow.
* Honestly, a better question is why he didn't try to bloodbend the other Equalists into Amon. Though again, he was taken
completely off guard unbelievable that someone would be confused.
** It is also the only time that the voice over has mentioned information that wouldn't have realistically be available to the public.
*** So who Mako
and had Korra have crushes on--that they've never told anyone about--is information available to deal with the public, too?
**** [[EveryoneCanSeeIt There's
a master of close-combat fighting at close range.trope for that.]]






[[folder: Mecha tanks with magnets]]
I suppose the metalbenders armour is made from steel or iron or something, but how strong were those magnets to lift up people?
* Magnets capable of lifting ''cars'' are routinely used in industrial work in RealLife. There's nothing special about magnets that can lift human-sized objects. What I wonder though is why none of the metalbenders thought to mess up with the magnets' structure and break down their polarity.
** I just wonder why they didn't slip out of their armour. The first few benders may not have had enough time, but the chief definitely had.
** Magnets can be very powerful but they don't have that kind of range. Its just a dramatic conceit.
** Good point on the car thing, was underestimating the strength of magnets. But to take their armour or to mess with the magnets structure, they would need to move their arms to bend, which they can't do.
** More to the point, it's explicitly stated that these mechas are made of pure platinum, which the metalbenders can't bend. Of course, Platinum is malleable enough that they should be able to just... bend it. How they even made a self-supporting Mecha out of the stuff in the first place (or even got enough to make so many mechas) is what bothers me.

to:

\n\n\n[[folder: Mecha tanks with magnets]]
I suppose the metalbenders armour is made from steel or iron or something, but how strong were those magnets to lift up people?
* Magnets capable of lifting ''cars'' are routinely used in industrial work in RealLife. There's nothing special about magnets that can lift human-sized objects. What I wonder though is why none of the metalbenders thought to mess
What's up with the magnets' structure massive leaps in medicine?]]
So, just thirty years or so after the original series, the Avatar world seriously has fully effective plastic surgery? Where did that come from? I mean, I know there was a technology boom as the world came together, but even throughout the rest of Korra, the most advanced medicine we see is made of bandages
and break down waterbending.
* You know, I was about to say that they had plastic surgery in the 20s (which they did) but then I remembered that Yakone would've gotten the surgery over 40 years prior, in the equivalent of the 1880s. So, yeah, I think they pulled that clean out of
their polarity.
ass, unless this is a case of RealityIsUnrealistic and they actually had plastic surgery in the late 1800s.
** I just wonder why Dude, they had plastic surgery in AncientEgypt. Do some research yourself instead of complaining for answers, this is the Internet for God's sake.
*** Ancient India, they could reconstruct noses sliced off by swords. In Ancient Rome, they had ''sex change operations''. (Or at least they were talking/thinking about it enough that a particular Roman Emperor asked his physician to perform one)
*** When it comes right down to it, the basic techniques of lots of surgeries date ''way'' back in real-life. The thing that prevented them being used extensively until recently is the lack of effective anesthetic and infection control, which prevented surgeons from being too ambitious in terms of having procedures last too long or require too much tissue manipulation. Surgeons could readily dream up things like full facial reconstructions, but they couldn't do it on a living person without inflicting horrendous agony followed by death from infection and blood loss. But in the Avatarverse, waterbending healing can probably take care of the anesthesia, infection, and wound healing concerns, meaning that ambitious surgeries probably could have been contemplated quite early on in its history. (In fact, in 1800's real-world, a severe scar like the one Zuko received had a high likelihood of fatality from infection after the fact. Zuko's survival suggests medical care has always been pretty advanced, relatively speaking, in the Avatar world.)
* The basic techniques go back much earlier than the 1800s and
they didn't slip make a huge change. Tarrlok and pre-surgery Yakone look fairly similar and only more similar post-surgery. With water bending healers they can keep a person safe through elective surgery like that. So its an AssPull to an extent but not totally absurd. The amazing thing is that they seemed to anesthetize him.
** I agree. It's good to bear in mind that in the decades after the war, the Fire Nation shared their vastly superior technology with the world. Combined with waterbending medical science, it seems pretty feasible to me.
*** The anachronistic thing that is setting off the question here is that the (1880-ish) surgeons are clearly dressed like modern-day doctors, in a room that looks almost ''exactly'' like an OR, complete with those power lights over the operating table. '''Nowhere''' in Korraworld do we see anything even remotely similar to that, so the scene came pretty much
out of their armour. The first few benders may the blue.
**** Perhaps
not so anachronistic. In the flashbacks we see that Republic City already was technologically advanced at that point. Satomobiles hadn't been invented yet, but there were still skyscrapers and city hall and they presumably had power lights. As far as inventing electricity, didn't the Fire Nation airships and that giant drill from A:TLA already have had enough time, but the chief definitely had.
** Magnets can be very powerful but they
lightbulbs and such?
**** I
don't have think the issue at hand is lights existing, so much as a remarkably modern setting at all. I'm just spitballing here (and please correct me if I'm wrong) but that kind of range. Its just a dramatic conceit.
** Good point on
OR didn't become until the car thing, was underestimating the strength of magnets. But to take their armour 50s or to mess with the magnets structure, they would need to move their arms to bend, which they can't do.
** More to the point, it's explicitly stated that these mechas are made of pure platinum, which the metalbenders can't bend. Of course, Platinum is malleable enough that they should be able to just... bend it. How they even made a self-supporting Mecha out of the stuff in the first place (or even got enough to make so many mechas) is what bothers me.
so?



[[folder: How does a terrorist group have so many members?]]
Seriously, am I the only one wondering why there seem to be an almost unlimited amount of Equalist soldiers? First of all, there wasn't much discrimination against non-benders to begin with, especially not violence. There are almost no reasons to join the Equalists unless someone you know got killed by a bender, like Amon [[spoiler: and Hiroshi]], but it's not like that many people have been killed by benders. Not to mention, these are dedicated soldiers, trained in the art of chi-blocking and all that stuff. It's obvious by now they aren't just {{Well Intentioned Extremist}}s, they're terrorists. You don't see someone who doesn't really like benders join a TERRORIST GROUP to try and get equality. So, how is there so many people willing to give up their life for the cause?
* The problem is assuming that he got all of his troops from Republic City instead of taking them in from all of the nations. He has a lot of people for one city, but from across five nations that span the entire globe it's a lot less unbelievable. As for there not being that much discrimination, there is still the fact that it appears all of the triads in Republic City alone are completely staffed by Benders, as we saw in the original series with Zuko Alone Benders still oppressed people. So think of it as generations of pent up aggression at the inequality of power between benders and non-benders.
* Also keep in mind that the Republic City houses millions of people, and judging by the numbers we've seen, I'd estimate that there are only a few hundred full-time Equalist chi-blockers out there. Sympathizers who are willing to look the other way, or give financial aid and other indirect support probably amount to a few thousand at most. There were organizations in early 20th century Europe with equally grand plans to reorganize the society to their liking with similarly numbered ranks, who took over countries and reigned for decades.
* The show has failed to show it but there were three large all bender gangs in the city. The number of non-benders people who don't want to be helpless in the face of that kind of abuse must be tremendous. Except for one scene all of this has been off screen so its impossible for us to really sympathize with their position.

to:

[[folder: How does a terrorist group have so many members?]]
Seriously, am I the only one wondering why there seem




[[folder:Yakone's escape]]
* Forget solitary, how did Yakone get out of jail in order
to be an almost unlimited amount of Equalist soldiers? First of all, there wasn't much discrimination against non-benders to begin with, especially not violence. There are almost no reasons to join the Equalists unless someone you know got killed by start a bender, like Amon [[spoiler: and Hiroshi]], but it's not like that many people have been killed by benders. Not to mention, these are dedicated soldiers, trained new life in the art of chi-blocking and all North Pole?
** They explicitly said
that stuff. It's obvious by now they aren't just {{Well Intentioned Extremist}}s, they're terrorists. You don't see someone who doesn't really like benders join a TERRORIST GROUP to try and get equality. So, how is there so many people willing to give up their life for the cause?
* The problem is assuming that he got all
some of his troops from Republic City instead of taking them in from all of criminal buddies broke him out. He was the nations. He has a lot head of people for one city, but from across five nations that span the entire globe it's a lot less unbelievable. As for there not being that much discrimination, there is still the fact that it appears all vast criminal empire. Exactly why they broke him out when he was stripped of the triads in Republic City alone are completely staffed by Benders, as we saw in the original series with Zuko Alone Benders still oppressed people. So think of it as generations of pent up aggression at the inequality of power between benders and non-benders.
* Also keep in mind
his bending abilities, who knows? Maybe he had assets that the Republic City houses millions of people, next gang leader could use, and judging by the numbers we've seen, I'd estimate that there are only a few hundred full-time Equalist chi-blockers out there. Sympathizers who are willing he knew where to look the other way, get them, or give financial aid and other indirect support probably amount to maybe he simply possessed a few thousand at most. There were organizations level of fanatical devotion in early 20th century Europe with equally grand plans to reorganize the society to their liking with similarly numbered ranks, who took over countries and reigned for decades.
* The show has failed to show it but there were three large all bender gangs
his subordinates (maybe its in the city. The number of non-benders people who don't want to be helpless in the face of blood) that kind of abuse must be tremendous. Except for one scene all of this has been off screen so its impossible for us to really sympathize with their position.they didn't care about his bending status.



[[folder: Why didn't Tarrlok use the bloodbent Equalists guards to stop Amon when Amon resists the bloodbending?]]
Think back to "The Puppetmaster." Hama made Aang and Sokka attack each other using bloodbending. Tarrlok could have done a similar thing against Amon using his own Equalist bodyguards. My guess is that he was just too surprised to react quickly.
* Surprised and terrified, definitely. But even if Tarrlok had done that, Amon probably would have had no trouble sidestepping them and getting to Tarrlok. One second is all he'd need.
** In light of "Skeletons in the Closet", even if Tarrlok had tried to use the bloodbent Equalists to restrain Amon, he still would have overpowered Tarrlok by canceling out his blood bending.

to:







[[folder: Why didn't Tarrlok use the bloodbent Equalists guards Was Korra originally meant to stop Amon when Amon resists the bloodbending?]]
Think back
be a six-hour long movie?]]
Is it me, or unlike ATLA, they've pretty much wrapped it up here, with Korra becoming a Fully realized Avatar? Was it actually meant
to "The Puppetmaster." Hama made Aang and Sokka attack each other using bloodbending. Tarrlok could have done a similar thing against Amon using his own Equalist bodyguards. My guess is that he go on for only one season until late in production?
* Yes. It
was just too surprised originally supposed to react quickly.
* Surprised and terrified, definitely. But even if Tarrlok had done that, Amon probably would have had no trouble sidestepping them and getting to Tarrlok. One
be a one season miniseries, but they got a second is all he'd need.
** In light of "Skeletons in
season while the Closet", even if Tarrlok had tried to use the bloodbent Equalists to restrain Amon, he still would have overpowered Tarrlok by canceling out his blood bending.first one was alredy in production.



[[folder: How did Shiro Shinobi know Tarrlok was the one who kidnapped Korra?]]
And if he had used his old IntrepidReporter skills to find out, how did Tarrlok's cover story work? Would the truth not have been broadcast on the radio for all to hear?
* The "Previously On" segments are clearly not happening in-universe. I'm simply amazed that someone could have come to the conclusion they were. Just...''wow'', I seriously cannot understand how this is being asked for a second time.
* The confusion probably stems from the fact that, in the preview of the seventh episode, Tarrlok was the voice over and in the previous episode Shiro was attack, and Tarrlok's voice over is clearly in-universe. So to be fair, it's not completely unbelievable that someone would be confused.
** It is also the only time that the voice over has mentioned information that wouldn't have realistically be available to the public.
*** So who Mako and Korra have crushes on--that they've never told anyone about--is information available to the public, too?
**** [[EveryoneCanSeeIt There's a trope for that.]]

to:

[[folder: How did Shiro Shinobi know Tarrlok was the one who kidnapped Korra?]]
And if he had used his old IntrepidReporter skills to find out, how did Tarrlok's cover story work? Would the truth not have been broadcast on the radio for all to hear?
* The "Previously On" segments are clearly not happening in-universe. I'm simply amazed

[[folder:So is Equalism dead? Is
that someone even a good thing?]]
Obviously Amon and his army were terrorists but defeating them still leaves the Avatar world with just about the worst possible social problem a society
could have come to ever face. Even if the conclusion they were. Just...''wow'', I seriously cannot understand how this is being asked for a second time.
* The confusion probably stems from the fact that, in the preview of the seventh episode, Tarrlok was the voice over
somehow eliminate bender gangs, institutional oppression, and in the previous episode Shiro was attack, and Tarrlok's voice over is clearly in-universe. So to be fair, it's not completely unbelievable that someone would be confused.
** It is also the only time that the voice over has mentioned information that wouldn't have realistically be available to the public.
*** So who Mako and Korra have crushes on--that
{{Smug Super}}s non-benders they've only just started to address the issue. There is a class of people with enormous economic and military privilege that is chosen entirely at random. Its kind of impossible for a society to not self destruct under that kind of pressure over and over again. The finale didn't do anything to address this, I guess I'll have to hope for the next season.
** I suppose we are left to assume things would improve without Tarrlok oppressive non-Bender rule and that the Equalists would be less of a threat to innocent Benders. Perhaps someone else would take Amon's mantle.
*** But Tarrlok was far from the only one oppressing the non-benders, and we
never told anyone about--is information available to saw him oppressing the public, too?
**** [[EveryoneCanSeeIt There's
non-benders until later on. People like the members of the Triple Threat Triad seemed to be more of a trope direct threat.
*** Makes me really wonder how many Triple Threat Triad members Amon debended.
** They're probably going to deal with that stuff next season.
** I imagine that the reveal of Amon as a liar, as well as a bender, will have caused the terrorist Equalist movement to lose credibility and fall apart,
for that.]]the most part, but a push for non-bender rights will still exist. Maybe it will come up in the second season.



[[folder: What's up with the massive leaps in medicine?]]
So, just thirty years or so after the original series, the Avatar world seriously has fully effective plastic surgery? Where did that come from? I mean, I know there was a technology boom as the world came together, but even throughout the rest of Korra, the most advanced medicine we see is made of bandages and waterbending.
* You know, I was about to say that they had plastic surgery in the 20s (which they did) but then I remembered that Yakone would've gotten the surgery over 40 years prior, in the equivalent of the 1880s. So, yeah, I think they pulled that clean out of their ass, unless this is a case of RealityIsUnrealistic and they actually had plastic surgery in the late 1800s.
** Dude, they had plastic surgery in AncientEgypt. Do some research yourself instead of complaining for answers, this is the Internet for God's sake.
*** Ancient India, they could reconstruct noses sliced off by swords. In Ancient Rome, they had ''sex change operations''. (Or at least they were talking/thinking about it enough that a particular Roman Emperor asked his physician to perform one)
*** When it comes right down to it, the basic techniques of lots of surgeries date ''way'' back in real-life. The thing that prevented them being used extensively until recently is the lack of effective anesthetic and infection control, which prevented surgeons from being too ambitious in terms of having procedures last too long or require too much tissue manipulation. Surgeons could readily dream up things like full facial reconstructions, but they couldn't do it on a living person without inflicting horrendous agony followed by death from infection and blood loss. But in the Avatarverse, waterbending healing can probably take care of the anesthesia, infection, and wound healing concerns, meaning that ambitious surgeries probably could have been contemplated quite early on in its history. (In fact, in 1800's real-world, a severe scar like the one Zuko received had a high likelihood of fatality from infection after the fact. Zuko's survival suggests medical care has always been pretty advanced, relatively speaking, in the Avatar world.)
* The basic techniques go back much earlier than the 1800s and they didn't make a huge change. Tarrlok and pre-surgery Yakone look fairly similar and only more similar post-surgery. With water bending healers they can keep a person safe through elective surgery like that. So its an AssPull to an extent but not totally absurd. The amazing thing is that they seemed to anesthetize him.
** I agree. It's good to bear in mind that in the decades after the war, the Fire Nation shared their vastly superior technology with the world. Combined with waterbending medical science, it seems pretty feasible to me.
*** The anachronistic thing that is setting off the question here is that the (1880-ish) surgeons are clearly dressed like modern-day doctors, in a room that looks almost ''exactly'' like an OR, complete with those power lights over the operating table. '''Nowhere''' in Korraworld do we see anything even remotely similar to that, so the scene came pretty much out of the blue.
**** Perhaps not so anachronistic. In the flashbacks we see that Republic City already was technologically advanced at that point. Satomobiles hadn't been invented yet, but there were still skyscrapers and city hall and they presumably had power lights. As far as inventing electricity, didn't the Fire Nation airships and that giant drill from A:TLA already have lightbulbs and such?
**** I don't think the issue at hand is lights existing, so much as a remarkably modern setting at all. I'm just spitballing here (and please correct me if I'm wrong) but that kind of OR didn't become until the 50s or so?

to:

[[folder: What's up with the massive leaps in medicine?]]
So, just thirty years or so after the original series,





[[folder:So is Equalism dead? Is that even a good thing?]]
Obviously Amon and his army were terrorists but defeating them still leaves
the Avatar world seriously has fully effective plastic surgery? Where did that come from? I mean, I know there was a technology boom as the world came together, but even throughout the rest of Korra, the most advanced medicine we see is made of bandages and waterbending.
* You know, I was
with just about to say that they had plastic surgery in the 20s (which they did) but then I remembered that Yakone would've gotten the surgery over 40 years prior, in the equivalent of the 1880s. So, yeah, I think they pulled that clean out of their ass, unless this is worst possible social problem a case of RealityIsUnrealistic and they actually had plastic surgery in the late 1800s.
** Dude, they had plastic surgery in AncientEgypt. Do some research yourself instead of complaining for answers, this is the Internet for God's sake.
*** Ancient India, they
society could reconstruct noses sliced off by swords. In Ancient Rome, they had ''sex change operations''. (Or at least they were talking/thinking about it enough ever face. Even if the somehow eliminate bender gangs, institutional oppression, and {{Smug Super}}s non-benders they've only just started to address the issue. There is a class of people with enormous economic and military privilege that is chosen entirely at random. Its kind of impossible for a particular Roman Emperor asked his physician society to perform one)
*** When it comes right down to it, the basic techniques of lots of surgeries date ''way'' back in real-life. The thing
not self destruct under that prevented them being used extensively until recently is the lack kind of effective anesthetic pressure over and infection control, which prevented surgeons from being too ambitious in terms of having procedures last too long or require too much tissue manipulation. Surgeons could readily dream up things like full facial reconstructions, but they couldn't do it on a living person without inflicting horrendous agony followed by death from infection and blood loss. But in the Avatarverse, waterbending healing can probably take care of the anesthesia, infection, and wound healing concerns, meaning that ambitious surgeries probably could have been contemplated quite early on in its history. (In fact, in 1800's real-world, a severe scar like the one Zuko received had a high likelihood of fatality from infection after the fact. Zuko's survival suggests medical care has always been pretty advanced, relatively speaking, in the Avatar world.)
*
over again. The basic techniques go back much earlier than the 1800s and they finale didn't make a huge change. do anything to address this, I guess I'll have to hope for the next season.
** I suppose we are left to assume things would improve without
Tarrlok oppressive non-Bender rule and pre-surgery Yakone look fairly similar and only more similar post-surgery. With water bending healers they can keep a person safe through elective surgery like that. So its an AssPull to an extent but not totally absurd. The amazing thing is that they seemed to anesthetize him.
** I agree. It's good to bear in mind that in the decades after the war, the Fire Nation shared their vastly superior technology with the world. Combined with waterbending medical science, it seems pretty feasible to me.
*** The anachronistic thing that is setting off the question here is
that the (1880-ish) surgeons are clearly dressed like modern-day doctors, in Equalists would be less of a room that looks almost ''exactly'' like an OR, complete with those power lights over the operating table. '''Nowhere''' in Korraworld do we see anything even remotely similar threat to that, so the scene came pretty much out of the blue.innocent Benders. Perhaps someone else would take Amon's mantle.
**** Perhaps not so anachronistic. In *** But Tarrlok was far from the flashbacks only one oppressing the non-benders, and we see never saw him oppressing the non-benders until later on. People like the members of the Triple Threat Triad seemed to be more of a direct threat.
*** Makes me really wonder how many Triple Threat Triad members Amon debended.
** They're probably going to deal with
that Republic City already was technologically advanced at stuff next season.
** I imagine
that point. Satomobiles hadn't been invented yet, the reveal of Amon as a liar, as well as a bender, will have caused the terrorist Equalist movement to lose credibility and fall apart, for the most part, but there were a push for non-bender rights will still skyscrapers and city hall and they presumably had power lights. As far as inventing electricity, didn't exist. Maybe it will come up in the Fire Nation airships and that giant drill from A:TLA already have lightbulbs and such?
**** I don't think the issue at hand is lights existing, so much as a remarkably modern setting at all. I'm just spitballing here (and please correct me if I'm wrong) but that kind of OR didn't become until the 50s or so?
second season.



[[folder: Why did Tarrlok blow up the boat?]] They were both fleeing, and after failing Noatok truly felt regret. He said Tarrlok was the only thing he had left, and was looking forward to starting a brand new life. Tarrlok responds to this by... blowing up the boat they were on. What? His brother has decided to turn over a brand new leaf and Tarrlok decides to kill him, along with himself? How does that even begin to make sense?
* They're well known, wanted criminals who can no longer bear to use their only defense against being recaptured. Imagine them being confronted by the White Lotus. Noatok would bloodbend them, he would have to, and the emotional strain of that would either drive him to suicide or result in Tarrlok killing him (which would leave Tarrlok nothing to live for). Suicide also kills off their father's dangerous genetic legacy which secures one real victory for the Equalist cause.
* It's Tarrlok's first chance to collect his thoughts and have a MyGodWhatHaveIDone moment. They have both done monstrous things, violated all of their principles, and gained nothing for it. Suicide is a tradition response.
* Who said Noatak was planning to turn over a new leaf? Start a new life, sure. But even doing that didn't stop their father from trying to take revenge. Tarrlok just wanted it to ''end''.
** Notice how Tarrlok takes awhile to look at both the gloves and Noatak. This could be interpreted as him simply forming the plan... or it could be him realizing that, since Noatak still had the Equalist weapons, he hadn't really changed. And then he decides to end it all.
*** In addition, Noatak had manipulated all of Republic City. Tarrlok had one chance to stop his brother, and had very little reason to trust him. When would he get a chance to stop Noatak again? Given how powerful he was, maybe never, so killing him then and there was the only chance.
* Tarrlok commits suicide because he sees his entire life as a dead end and is deeply depressed. Remember, just a couple of ''weeks'' ago at most, he was the most powerful man in Republic City, a respected member of the City Council. In that time he was called out by Korra, publicly exposed as a bloodbender and Yakone's son, had his bending taken away, and realized that the terrorist who's been attacking Republic City is actually his own brother. Given all that, it doesn't seem surprising that he might decide to end his painful family legacy once and for all. Keep in mind that Tarrlok described himself as someone who isn't afraid to go to extremes.
* I don't think i have much to add to this discussion, but i had a small problem with that scene for a different, but related reason. When i saw him eyeing the glove, i thought he was going to KO Amon and take him back to Republic City so he could try and play it off like he was a hero (I hope that wouldn't work, given all he's done, but that's the kind of weaselly thing i'd expect from him). And, actually, if he played it off right and kept his connections in politics, he might have succeeded in at least absolving him of responsibility for his actions against Korra and Council. That would've been entirely in-character and solidified him as the coldest son of a bitch to ever be animated. So yeah, forget killing himself, why didn't he do that?
** Because no prison could ever hold either of them. Korra's energybending at the end was set way later. At that moment, the fact was that Tarrlok and his brother were downright unstoppable, and Tarrlok knew it. It was only going down one way.
** CharacterDevelopment
** ^ This. One of the main points of the flashback to his and Amon's childhood was that both of them hated their father for what he put them through, but ultimately ended up doing exactly what he wanted. Their father taught them bloodbending so that they could take revenge on the city and the Avatar. They thought they were rebelling against him, with Tarrlok becoming a councilman and Amon starting a crusade against all benders, but they end up attacking the people of the city and the Avatar using bloodbending, just like their father had planned. Tarrlok even lost his bending and then was going to escape to start a new life, exactly what happened to his father. It's pretty clear that Tarrlok realizes all this and decides he just wants it all to be over.
* He's probably quite familiar with how Yakone's trial went down- either from Yakone's own account or Republic City's archives. Noatok sounded just like Yakone fleeing the courthouse. I submit that he thought that it wasn't over until Noatok was dead, and the only means he had available to kill him was blowing up the boat- even if he survived the explosion he'd be miles from land, and even a master bloodbender would drown under those circumstances.
* Amon shed a single tear about two seconds before Tarrlock blew up the boat. He may have been in on it too. They both knew it was all wishful thinking, and Amon might have known what Tarrlok was about to do (he'd have figured out that no one else could have leaked his secret). For all his hatred of bending, Noatok couldn't escape the fact that he was a bender himself, and could only become Amon and get his dream with the very bloodbending he loathed.
** Noatok sheds a single tear when he hears his real name, suggesting just how much he hated being Amon at that point and how he also knew they could never go back to those happy times when Noatok UsedToBeASweetKid. Both of them had ruined their lives by crossing the MoralEventHorizon. So when he said he was planning to start a new life, ''he meant ending the old one literally.''
* Because RedemptionEqualsDeath.

to:

[[folder: Why did Tarrlok blow up












[[folder:What happened to
the boat?]] They were both fleeing, and after failing Noatok truly felt regret. He said Tarrlok was North Pole?]]
More specifically,
the Northern Water Tribe. The first series showed it to be a relatively large place with a design similar to Venice, Italy. Yet when we see it in Taarlok's flashback story, it's comparable to what we saw of the Southern Water Tribe back in "The Boy in the Iceberg". And considering it's only thing he had left, and was looking forward ever referred to starting a brand new life. Tarrlok responds as ''the'' Northern Water Tribe, there seems to this by... blowing up the boat they were on. What? His brother has decided to turn over a brand new leaf and Tarrlok decides to kill him, along with himself? How does that even begin to make sense?
* They're well known, wanted criminals who can
be no longer bear to use their only defense against being recaptured. Imagine them being confronted by the White Lotus. Noatok indication it would bloodbend them, he would have to, and the emotional strain be some sort of that would either drive him to suicide outpost town or result in Tarrlok killing him (which would leave Tarrlok nothing to live for). Suicide also kills off their father's dangerous genetic legacy which secures one real victory for the Equalist cause.
settlement.
* It's Tarrlok's first chance to collect his thoughts and have a MyGodWhatHaveIDone moment. They have both done monstrous things, violated all of their principles, and gained nothing for it. Suicide is a tradition response.
* Who said Noatak was planning to turn over a new leaf? Start a new life, sure. But even doing that didn't stop their father from trying to take revenge. Tarrlok just wanted it to ''end''.
** Notice how Tarrlok takes awhile to look at both the gloves and Noatak. This could be interpreted as him simply forming the plan... or it could be him realizing that, since Noatak still had the Equalist weapons, he hadn't really changed. And then he decides to end it all.
*** In addition, Noatak had manipulated all of Republic City. Tarrlok had one chance to stop his brother, and had very little
Is there any actual reason to trust him. When would he get a chance to stop Noatak again? Given how powerful he was, maybe never, so killing him then and there was believe it ''wasn't'' some sort of outpost town or settlement?
* Yeah. The Northern Water Tribe is just
the only chance.
* Tarrlok commits suicide
name of the whole tribe, like the Zulu. Just because he sees his entire life as a dead end and is deeply depressed. Remember, just a couple of ''weeks'' ago at most, he was the most powerful man in Republic City, a respected member of the City Council. In that time he was called out Zulu are referred by Korra, publicly exposed as a bloodbender and Yakone's son, had his bending taken away, and realized that the terrorist who's been attacking Republic City is actually his own brother. Given all that, it common tribe name doesn't seem surprising mean they all live in the same city.
* The Northern Water Tribe we saw was one after 100 years of war--a fortification made for defense. At the time, yes,
that he might decide to end his painful family legacy once and for all. Keep in mind that Tarrlok described himself as someone who isn't afraid to go to extremes.
* I don't think i have much to add to this discussion, but i had a small problem with that scene for a different, but related reason. When i saw him eyeing
was probably where the glove, i thought he was going to KO Amon and take him back to Republic City so he could try and play it off like he was a hero (I hope that wouldn't work, given all he's done, but that's entire Tribe lived--but after the kind of weaselly thing i'd expect from him). And, actually, if he played it off right and kept his connections in politics, he might have succeeded in at least absolving him of responsibility for his actions against Korra and Council. That would've been entirely in-character and solidified him as the coldest son of a bitch to ever be animated. So yeah, forget killing himself, why didn't he do that?
** Because no prison could ever hold either of them. Korra's energybending at the end was set way later. At that moment, the fact was that Tarrlok and his brother were downright unstoppable, and Tarrlok knew it. It was only going down one way.
** CharacterDevelopment
** ^ This. One of the main points of the flashback to his and Amon's childhood was that both of them hated their father for what he put them through, but ultimately
war ended up doing exactly what he wanted. Their father taught them bloodbending so and the danger of Fire Nation soldiers attacking and abducting people was gone, it makes sense that they could take revenge on the city and the Avatar. They thought they were rebelling against him, with Tarrlok becoming a councilman and Amon starting a crusade against all benders, but they end up attacking the people of the city and the Avatar using bloodbending, just like their father had planned. Tarrlok even lost his bending and then was going to escape to start a new life, exactly what happened to his father. It's pretty clear that Tarrlok realizes all this and decides he just wants it all to be over.
* He's probably quite familiar with how Yakone's trial went down- either from Yakone's own account or Republic City's archives. Noatok sounded just like Yakone fleeing the courthouse. I submit that he thought that it wasn't over until Noatok was dead, and the only means he had available to kill him was blowing up the boat- even if he survived the explosion he'd be miles from land, and even a master bloodbender
would drown under those circumstances.
* Amon shed a single tear about two seconds before Tarrlock blew up the boat. He may have been in on it too. They both knew it was all wishful thinking, and Amon might have known what Tarrlok was about to do (he'd have figured out that no one else could have leaked his secret). For all his hatred of bending, Noatok couldn't escape the fact that he was a bender himself, and could only become Amon and get his dream with the very bloodbending he loathed.
** Noatok sheds a single tear when he hears his real name, suggesting just how much he hated being Amon at that point and how he also knew they could never go back to those happy times when Noatok UsedToBeASweetKid. Both of them had ruined their lives by crossing the MoralEventHorizon. So when he said he was planning to start a new life, ''he meant ending the old one literally.''
* Because RedemptionEqualsDeath.
expand into other settlements.





[[folder:Yakone's escape]]
* Forget solitary, how did Yakone get out of jail in order to start a new life in the North Pole?
** They explicitly said that some of his criminal buddies broke him out. He was the head of a vast criminal empire. Exactly why they broke him out when he was stripped of his bending abilities, who knows? Maybe he had assets that the next gang leader could use, and only he knew where to get them, or maybe he simply possessed a level of fanatical devotion in his subordinates (maybe its in the blood) that they didn't care about his bending status.

to:

\n\n[[folder:Yakone's escape]]\n[[folder:Magic plastic surgery?]]
I couldn't have been the only one who noticed. But Tarrlok looks just like his father post surgery.
* Forget solitary, how did I think its okay to assume that Realism was abadoned for the sake of symbolism here. While Tarrlok look more like Yakone get post-surgery, Noatak looks more like Yakone pre-surgery which is a neat contrast between the brothers.
* And it's not like Tarrlok ''doesn't'' look like Yakone even pre-surgery. People were pointing
out of jail in order to start a new life in the North Pole?
** They explicitly said that some of his criminal buddies broke
resemblance before the twist was ever revealed. He just happens to look slightly ''more'' like him out. He was the head of a vast criminal empire. Exactly why they broke him out when he was stripped of his bending abilities, who knows? Maybe he had assets that the next gang leader could use, post-surgery.
** Yep; see [[http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m50a7vyXCi1qlg334.jpg pre-surgery Yakone]]
and only he knew where to get them, or maybe he simply possessed a level of fanatical devotion in his subordinates (maybe its in the blood) that they didn't care about his bending status. [[http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m50a89w6tl1qlg334.jpg Adult Tarrlok]]



[[folder: Was Korra originally meant to be a six-hour long movie?]]
Is it me, or unlike ATLA, they've pretty much wrapped it up here, with Korra becoming a Fully realized Avatar? Was it actually meant to go on for only one season until late in production?
* Yes. It was originally supposed to be a one season miniseries, but they got a second season while the first one was alredy in production.

to:

[[folder: Was Korra originally meant The "Balance Patch" that is the Law in Republic City]]
* The Avatar is a focal point of balance towards goodness and the right choices in the world at large, which includes the city. Because of this, and the major role she plays in restoring balance and order
to the world as they are fated to do, they are given a great deal of leeway. This is no longer the case, and that severely gimps Korra's overall effectiveness for very pedantic reasons. Benders should have the right to defend themselves, as should non-benders. So I'm not entirely seeing the law as helpful or beneficial to the long-run to the city, much less to her job. They would only serve to get in her way.
** That worked back in the old days. In an industrialized nation, Korra's antics are nearly as harmful as helpful, and she is not omniscient. The police are there to cover what she can't, which is basically everything except the occasional random incident.
*** Of course, but if they are putting their foot down and preventing the Avatar from doing what the Avatar does, they're as much a threat to the balance as they could
be a six-hour long movie?]]
Is it me, or unlike ATLA, they've pretty
help. I'm not speaking about stopping mafia here-which Korra, as the Avatar and a lot of precedent behind her from Kiyoshi and Aang, should be allowed to do-this can get much wrapped it up here, worse; what if they decide that restoring balance would cause too much instability within the city?
*** If Korra's keeping
with Korra becoming a Fully realized Avatar? Was it actually meant to go on for only one season until late in production?
* Yes. It was originally supposed to
the law, which should be a one season miniseries, but entirely reasonable, then they got a second season while have no reason to object. Tenzin could also extend some political protection if he needs to.
*** Um, where's it ever said that the law prohibits bending in any way? Or that benders can't defend themselves? The problem with Korra's actions in
the first one episode is more that she wrecked up the street, and that she was alredy acting as a vigilante, not just that she was acting as a bender or the Avatar.
*** Precisely. Tenzin and the White Lotus may be sitting on museum pieces, but if Korra were allowed to inflict property damage at her own vigilante discretion, she'd deplete their operating budget
in production.a matter of weeks...heck, the lack of HeroInsurance could be mined for a subplot.
*** It's all part of the deconstruction that is going on. As of now, there is no need for Avatar-involvement. Having Korra wreck the place is not necessary. It's an era of peace. I am sure that as the plot progresses, there will be a need for Korra to act as the Avatar to the world. But as of now, there isn't.
** This is hilarious. Its exactly the sort of political insanity that probably exists in the setting. The crime wasn't "bending" (though benders might well think of it that way) it was "blowing up other people's stuff and attacking the police". You shouldn't get away with destroying buildings just because you happened to do it with superpowers. I imagine that's exactly the mentality that has Equalist sympathizers scared.
*** I wouldn't be surprised to see merchants whose property she destroyed at an Equalist rally in the future, given that the reason anyone pays protection money is out of fear for their lives and livelihoods. Ironically, Korra may have done by accident what the Triple Threat Triads [[ShameIfSomethingHappened threaten to do]] when they go unpaid, and as a result some struggling business owners might just find themselves looking for a nice bush to sleep under.
*** The perfect opportunity for the return of the [[RunningGag Cabbage Seller]]!
*** Actually, Tenzin said that he would pay for the damages.




[[folder:So is Equalism dead? Is that even a good thing?]]
Obviously Amon and his army were terrorists but defeating them still leaves the Avatar world with just about the worst possible social problem a society could ever face. Even if the somehow eliminate bender gangs, institutional oppression, and {{Smug Super}}s non-benders they've only just started to address the issue. There is a class of people with enormous economic and military privilege that is chosen entirely at random. Its kind of impossible for a society to not self destruct under that kind of pressure over and over again. The finale didn't do anything to address this, I guess I'll have to hope for the next season.
** I suppose we are left to assume things would improve without Tarrlok oppressive non-Bender rule and that the Equalists would be less of a threat to innocent Benders. Perhaps someone else would take Amon's mantle.
*** But Tarrlok was far from the only one oppressing the non-benders, and we never saw him oppressing the non-benders until later on. People like the members of the Triple Threat Triad seemed to be more of a direct threat.
*** Makes me really wonder how many Triple Threat Triad members Amon debended.
** They're probably going to deal with that stuff next season.
** I imagine that the reveal of Amon as a liar, as well as a bender, will have caused the terrorist Equalist movement to lose credibility and fall apart, for the most part, but a push for non-bender rights will still exist. Maybe it will come up in the second season.

to:

\n[[folder:So is Equalism dead? Is [[folder: The United Republic of Nations isn't very republican]]
* I'm using "republican" in the way
that even a good thing?]]
Obviously Amon and his army were terrorists but defeating them still leaves
it's used in the Avatar world with just about US Constitution "The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government..." For the worst possible social problem a society could ever face. Even if sake of clarity, I'll add [[http://www.constitution.org/fed/federa10.htm Federalist no. 10]], where Madison outlines the somehow eliminate bender gangs, institutional oppression, and {{Smug Super}}s non-benders they've only just started idea of a republic as I am used to address using it. As far as I can tell, the issue. There is a class of people with enormous economic and military privilege that government is chosen entirely at random. Its kind of impossible for a society to by the original four nations, not self destruct under the people of the city. It's as if Wales was jointly governed by a representative of Ireland, Scotland and England. Such a government couldn't be called republican in any sense of the word, let alone the one I was thinking of. Now, it is true that kind of pressure over and over again. The finale didn't do anything to address this, I guess I'll have to hope for no other government has been shown, meaning it is possible that the next season.
** I suppose we are left
council is only in charge of Republic City. This led me to assume things would improve without Tarrlok oppressive non-Bender rule believe that it was the only game in town, and that the Equalists council is in charge of the entire nation.
** The US doesn't have a monopoly on the term. Seeing as how we've only seen the one city, one can hardly say the identified form of government cannot be considered a republic.
** I think your assumption of republic being "What the US defined it as is" is a bit of an oversimplification of a form of government that has had dozens of variants amongst them oligarchies very similar to the one in show. It should also be remembered that this government was designed for a different world than the one its in right now, back when the city was founded it made complete sense to have the city intended to be a melting pot be governed by representatives of each major group in the world, unfortunately this is now pretty obsolete as Republic City has developed its own unique culture.
*** I'm wondering what Republics you're thinking of that have oligarchies similar to the one on the show? The closest things I can think of
would be less Florence and Venice in the Renaissance. However, given that the Florentine republic included about a thousand citizens in its census for who counted as a citizen who could participate in government (circa 1500) and the Venetian aristocracy was abnormally large (which resulted in frequent problems of aristocratic poverty) and could could be bought into, I'm not sure they should count either since there is a threat big difference between around a thousand people sitting in a senate and five people ruling in a council. Remember, Venice's Council of Ten answered to innocent Benders. Perhaps someone else would take Amon's mantle.a much larger senate and the Doge and Florence's Eight Saints were a war time necessity (and they were tax assessors).
* I don't think we know enough about it. Or could you clarify what doesn't seem republican to you? It doesn't seem to be a monarchy, so I guess republic in the meaning of "res publica" isn't so far off.
** Republic as a term is far older than the United States, and even today it has numerous definitions around the world. At core it simply means a nation ruled by an elected council. The election does not have to be democratic as we understand it, nor does the position of electee have to be open for everyone. Pre-Imperial Rome was a non-democratic Republic, for example. The United Republic does seem to be a democracy however, though how it functions is unknown. It seems that the representatives have to include members from the four Nations, and that Benders are overpresented compared to non-Benders. Tenzin is an influential member in spite of the near-extinction of the Air Nomads, for example.
*** Tenzin's father was one of the founders of Republic City. He's probably doing it as a legacy thing, not to represent the almost non-existent Air Nomads.

*** Except that the Council, or at least its leaders apart from Tenzin consist of representatives of Fire Nation, Earth Kingdom, and Southern and Northern Water Tribes. It seems fairly clear that the city is lead by the representatives of the four Bending cultures, even the near-extinct Air Nomads.
* I think the source of the confusion here is that we're assuming Republic City is an independent state, which may not be the case. It's possible Republic City is a kind of "neutral ground" that all four nations have limited control over. If this is the case, the representatives that control Republic city may very well be elected...by the total populations of the nations they hail from. So it's less like Wales being governed by representatives from Ireland, Scotland, and England and more like if everyone in the United States was able to vote for the mayor and city council of New York City.
** So Republic City is basically [[WashingtonDC Washington, DC]]. Limited home rule and all that.
** It's more like the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_International_Settlement Shanghai-that-Was]].
* Republic in its most basic sense means "state without monarchy." The council is made up entirely (I understand) by representatives of monarchies. So I honestly believe that the creators did not know what the word republic means. It is a common mistakes, I remember a couple of occasions where Jorge Luis Borges made ​​the same mistake.
** I'm sure they know exactly what it means. It means a state not ruled by a monarchy. It doesn't mean a state without any influence from any monarchies whatsoever. Republic City is ruled, as you said, by a council--not by a monarchy. That the councilmen represent monarchies doesn't matter.
** Also, the council isn't made up ''entirely'' of representatives of monarchies. The Air Nomads most certainly aren't a monarchy, they don't even have a state of their own, and nothing indicates Tenzin is considered to be their "king". The reason he seems to be the highest authority figure among them could simply be because he's the oldest, most experienced Airbender alive. Historically the Airbenders appear to have been ruled by councils of elders, one in each Air Temple, but we don't know what their current system is. As for the Southern Water Tribe, while they have a chief, there's no canon evidence that he's their sole leader, or that the position of the chief is inhereditary; for all we know he could be chosen by a tribe meeting, or by some other democratic process.
*** If Tenzin gets to be one of the most powerful people in the world just because he's the best Airbender that would be a real problem. Nepotism is honestly more likely.
*** Being a council person in one city makes you "one of the most powerful people in the world"? Just because the series takes place there doesn't mean it's the most important place in the world.
*** But Tarrlok being the world's only Master Airbender probably would make you "one of the most powerful people in the world" by default.
** Since when does "Republic" mean a "state without monarchy"? By that definition, fascist, democratic, anarchist, and theocratic governments would be republican. A better defintion of a "republic" would be a state with a mixed constitution, incorporating elements of democracy, aristocracy, and (elected) monarchy. By this definition, we could include Rome, Florence, Venice, and the US. France might be harder to fit, since it seemed to include only democracy and (elected) monarchy, as far as I'm aware. And, of course, this does not work as well for the 20th century when it seemed to become the fashion to style everything a "republic" regardless of its actual form. Also, keep in mind that I'm using the term monarch losely to refer to a small executive branch (like the consuls, Doge, Signoria, or president), the way Roman and Renaissance political theorists did.
*** You define the entire Western world as being ruled by monarchs? (because pretty much every nation has a president or prime minister)
*** "Since when does 'Republic' mean 'a state without monarchy'?" Basically since the term
was far coined in the classical world. Although modern developments have complicated the matter, that's still the most basic way to define the term, and essential to every other definition that incorporates other aspects. "By that definition, fascist, democratic, anarchist and theocratic governments would be republican." Yes. You treat these terms as opposed to either monarchy or republic while they aren't (except anarchism which is opposed to both). Iran can be described as a theocratic republic, Saudi-Arabia as a theocratic monarchy. The UK is a democratic monarchy, the US a democratic republic and so on. "A better definition ..." What follows is a pretty meaningless definition that has no descriptive purpose and no historical background. In general, people seem to be misled by the meaning of the word "Republican" in a US-American context, where it has a wider meaning, including rule of law, balance of power, democracy, equality before the law etc. and also carries a lot of historical and political baggage (there is a major party that derives its name from this word after all). This meaning comes from American history, not academic categorization of governments. And no, an elected head of the executive is not a monarch.
*** As to the idea of an elected head being a monarch, this is exactly how Polybius uses the term. Polybius defines Rome as a state with a mixed constitution, one that has elements of monarchy, aristocracy, and democracy. He equates the monarchical elements with the consuls, an elected office with one year in office. I am doing the same (note: a prime minister is not a head of state but a head of government, and thus would not represent a monarchic element). The definition of a republic as a state with a mixed constitution also comes from Polybius's understanding - he holds up Rome's Republic as an example of government to be contrasted with the democracy of Athens and various principates. I would argue that in most of the greatest historical examples, a balance of powers is an essential aspect of a republic, as it was in antique Rome and renaissance Florence and Venice. Aristotle would seem to agree given that he considers a mixed constitution as an alternative form of government to monarchy/tyranny, aristocracy/oligarchy, and democracy. Now, Machiavelli does seem to include all non-principate states in the category of "Republic", but given his historical environment, where
the only one oppressing non-monarchic states had mixed constitutions, states like Florence, Venice, and Bologna, I would hesitate to agree with his assessment, given that his analysis of Rome and the non-benders, classical world was often heavily colored by his experience of politics in his own time. You say that classically this is how a republic was defined, but I'm not sure which classical authors you are refering to. As I said above, Polybius and Aristotle did not make such a division. Plato divided his types of government much more broadly, defining five types of states based on the values of the ruler/ruling class (kallipolis, timocracy, oligarchy, democracy, and tyranny). To Thucydides, your division would not make sense, since part of his history is devoted to comparing the sort of governments Sparta and Athens had and to equate them as of the same sort would be counter to his efforts. Since the term, however, comes from Latin, we could look at Latin authors, but they tended to defer to Polybius and Aristotle on this matter. And if we are going to defer to the term "res publica", then even the Roman Empire would be a republic, since for the first century or so of its existence it was still called a "res publica". So, I do not see where your definition comes from, aside from perhaps Machiavelli or the French Revolution, neither of whom/which are classical sources and both of whom/which existed in periods where a more nuanced view was unnecessary. And as to theocracy - you said you can have theocratic republics and theocratic monarchies, but what would the bishopric of Rome be? A republic, given the prominence of the college of cardinals? A monarchy, given that it has a single head? Also, you seem to be lax on what a monarchy is - is it simply a state with a king? would a tyranny without a king be a republic? It would seem unfair to call Cuba a republic just because its head of state does not call himself king. It would seem unfair to call Sparta a monarchy just because its heads of state were kings.
* At the very least we can say that Republic City does not seem very republican. A ruling body of five people who represent only a "bending aristocracy" (my term) is much more oligarchic than it is republican. And since this small ruling body seems to make policy decisions without consulting anyone outside of themselves (there's no mention of having a vote in the senate on what to do about the rebel problem or what to do about terrorist threats), I feel it's safe to say that just these five are governing Republic City. So... yeah. Sounds like an oligarchy - more like the Thirty Tyrants than the Council of Ten.
** That does fit within some definitions of Republic since those five are "the body of citizens entitled to vote", if they were elected to those positions in some way it fits most definitions. What Republic City is clearly not is a democracy, the general population has little to no say in the general affairs of government.
*** But size does matter in this. If you were simply going to say that a republic has a "body of citizens entitled to vote" a tyranny would be a republic where that body numbered one. The voting base needs to be broader than five, even if it does not have to include a majority of people. If you were to ask me to define how broad it needs to be, I would probably say at least 1% of the population. Though, there are other aspects of republic aside from having a voting base, namely the separation of powers - they tend to have at least an executive or executive body and a legislative body, but can also include bodies that propose legislation (like Rome's Senate) or various bodies that oversee economic or military concerns.
*** Represents a "bending aristocracy"? The councilmembers represent the different NATIONS, not the types of benders. We know that Tarrlok and Tenzin are benders, but it's
never saw him oppressing been shown about the others. True, Amon had them kidnapped, but that could be just as much to disrupt the current government as to target them as benders.
**** The way Tarrlok addresses them when he introduces his non-bender curfew certainly implies they are benders. And it seems unlikely they would have voted for the curfew if they were
non-benders until later on. themselves.
*
People like the members of the Triple Threat Triad seemed to be more of a direct threat.
*** Makes me really wonder how many Triple Threat Triad members Amon debended.
** They're probably going to deal with that stuff next season.
** I imagine that the reveal of Amon as a liar, as well as a bender, will
have caused used the terrorist Equalist movement word "republic" to lose credibility and fall apart, for mean a lot of different things over the most part, but course of history. It is a push for non-bender rights will still exist. Maybe it will come up in usefully vague term, almost to the second season.point of being meaningless, in a fictional setting.








[[folder:So is Equalism dead? Is that even a good thing?]]
Obviously Amon and his army were terrorists but defeating them still leaves the Avatar world with just about the worst possible social problem a society could ever face. Even if the somehow eliminate bender gangs, institutional oppression, and {{Smug Super}}s non-benders they've only just started to address the issue. There is a class of people with enormous economic and military privilege that is chosen entirely at random. Its kind of impossible for a society to not self destruct under that kind of pressure over and over again. The finale didn't do anything to address this, I guess I'll have to hope for the next season.
** I suppose we are left to assume things would improve without Tarrlok oppressive non-Bender rule and that the Equalists would be less of a threat to innocent Benders. Perhaps someone else would take Amon's mantle.
*** But Tarrlok was far from the only one oppressing the non-benders, and we never saw him oppressing the non-benders until later on. People like the members of the Triple Threat Triad seemed to be more of a direct threat.
*** Makes me really wonder how many Triple Threat Triad members Amon debended.
** They're probably going to deal with that stuff next season.
** I imagine that the reveal of Amon as a liar, as well as a bender, will have caused the terrorist Equalist movement to lose credibility and fall apart, for the most part, but a push for non-bender rights will still exist. Maybe it will come up in the second season.
[[/folder]]








[[folder: Why did nobody see through Tarrlok's little "Equalists kidnapped Korra" lie?]]
There was a huge crater on the floor of the main hall, half the floor in his office got ripped apart, an entire wall was askew, rock debris everywhere... Equalists can't do that. Even their mechas would have left different marks on the building. Further, he knocked himself out with an Equalist glove while wearing it. He had no guarantee he'd wake up in time to get it off!
* ''Korra'' can do all that, and Tarrlok's explanation was that they had fought the Equalists. Korra most definitely wouldn't care about some collateral damage if she was about to get captured. The bigger question in all this is why Tarrlok himself wouldn't have been captured right along with the Avatar, but he kept everyone too busy to ask that crucial question until much later.
* I figured Tarrlok was able to hold onto consciousness long enough to yank the glove off and toss it away after shocking himself.
[[/folder]]







[[folder:What happened to the North Pole?]]
More specifically, the Northern Water Tribe. The first series showed it to be a relatively large place with a design similar to Venice, Italy. Yet when we see it in Taarlok's flashback story, it's comparable to what we saw of the Southern Water Tribe back in "The Boy in the Iceberg". And considering it's only ever referred to as ''the'' Northern Water Tribe, there seems to be no indication it would be some sort of outpost town or settlement.
* Is there any actual reason to believe it ''wasn't'' some sort of outpost town or settlement?
* Yeah. The Northern Water Tribe is just the name of the whole tribe, like the Zulu. Just because the Zulu are referred by a common tribe name doesn't mean they all live in the same city.
* The Northern Water Tribe we saw was one after 100 years of war--a fortification made for defense. At the time, yes, that was probably where the entire Tribe lived--but after the war ended and the danger of Fire Nation soldiers attacking and abducting people was gone, it makes sense that they would expand into other settlements.
[[/folder]]

[[folder:Magic plastic surgery?]]
I couldn't have been the only one who noticed. But Tarrlok looks just like his father post surgery.
* I think its okay to assume that Realism was abadoned for the sake of symbolism here. While Tarrlok look more like Yakone post-surgery, Noatak looks more like Yakone pre-surgery which is a neat contrast between the brothers.
* And it's not like Tarrlok ''doesn't'' look like Yakone even pre-surgery. People were pointing out the resemblance before the twist was ever revealed. He just happens to look slightly ''more'' like him post-surgery.
** Yep; see [[http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m50a7vyXCi1qlg334.jpg pre-surgery Yakone]] and [[http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m50a89w6tl1qlg334.jpg Adult Tarrlok]]
[[/folder]]







[[folder: The "Balance Patch" that is the Law in Republic City]]
* The Avatar is a focal point of balance towards goodness and the right choices in the world at large, which includes the city. Because of this, and the major role she plays in restoring balance and order to the world as they are fated to do, they are given a great deal of leeway. This is no longer the case, and that severely gimps Korra's overall effectiveness for very pedantic reasons. Benders should have the right to defend themselves, as should non-benders. So I'm not entirely seeing the law as helpful or beneficial to the long-run to the city, much less to her job. They would only serve to get in her way.
** That worked back in the old days. In an industrialized nation, Korra's antics are nearly as harmful as helpful, and she is not omniscient. The police are there to cover what she can't, which is basically everything except the occasional random incident.
*** Of course, but if they are putting their foot down and preventing the Avatar from doing what the Avatar does, they're as much a threat to the balance as they could be a help. I'm not speaking about stopping mafia here-which Korra, as the Avatar and a lot of precedent behind her from Kiyoshi and Aang, should be allowed to do-this can get much worse; what if they decide that restoring balance would cause too much instability within the city?
*** If Korra's keeping with the law, which should be entirely reasonable, then they have no reason to object. Tenzin could also extend some political protection if he needs to.
*** Um, where's it ever said that the law prohibits bending in any way? Or that benders can't defend themselves? The problem with Korra's actions in the first episode is more that she wrecked up the street, and that she was acting as a vigilante, not just that she was acting as a bender or the Avatar.
*** Precisely. Tenzin and the White Lotus may be sitting on museum pieces, but if Korra were allowed to inflict property damage at her own vigilante discretion, she'd deplete their operating budget in a matter of weeks...heck, the lack of HeroInsurance could be mined for a subplot.
*** It's all part of the deconstruction that is going on. As of now, there is no need for Avatar-involvement. Having Korra wreck the place is not necessary. It's an era of peace. I am sure that as the plot progresses, there will be a need for Korra to act as the Avatar to the world. But as of now, there isn't.
** This is hilarious. Its exactly the sort of political insanity that probably exists in the setting. The crime wasn't "bending" (though benders might well think of it that way) it was "blowing up other people's stuff and attacking the police". You shouldn't get away with destroying buildings just because you happened to do it with superpowers. I imagine that's exactly the mentality that has Equalist sympathizers scared.
*** I wouldn't be surprised to see merchants whose property she destroyed at an Equalist rally in the future, given that the reason anyone pays protection money is out of fear for their lives and livelihoods. Ironically, Korra may have done by accident what the Triple Threat Triads [[ShameIfSomethingHappened threaten to do]] when they go unpaid, and as a result some struggling business owners might just find themselves looking for a nice bush to sleep under.
*** The perfect opportunity for the return of the [[RunningGag Cabbage Seller]]!
*** Actually, Tenzin said that he would pay for the damages.
[[/folder]]

[[folder: The United Republic of Nations isn't very republican]]
* I'm using "republican" in the way that it's used in the US Constitution "The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government..." For the sake of clarity, I'll add [[http://www.constitution.org/fed/federa10.htm Federalist no. 10]], where Madison outlines the idea of a republic as I am used to using it. As far as I can tell, the government is chosen by the original four nations, not the people of the city. It's as if Wales was jointly governed by a representative of Ireland, Scotland and England. Such a government couldn't be called republican in any sense of the word, let alone the one I was thinking of. Now, it is true that no other government has been shown, meaning it is possible that the council is only in charge of Republic City. This led me to believe that it was the only game in town, and that the council is in charge of the entire nation.
** The US doesn't have a monopoly on the term. Seeing as how we've only seen the one city, one can hardly say the identified form of government cannot be considered a republic.
** I think your assumption of republic being "What the US defined it as is" is a bit of an oversimplification of a form of government that has had dozens of variants amongst them oligarchies very similar to the one in show. It should also be remembered that this government was designed for a different world than the one its in right now, back when the city was founded it made complete sense to have the city intended to be a melting pot be governed by representatives of each major group in the world, unfortunately this is now pretty obsolete as Republic City has developed its own unique culture.
*** I'm wondering what Republics you're thinking of that have oligarchies similar to the one on the show? The closest things I can think of would be Florence and Venice in the Renaissance. However, given that the Florentine republic included about a thousand citizens in its census for who counted as a citizen who could participate in government (circa 1500) and the Venetian aristocracy was abnormally large (which resulted in frequent problems of aristocratic poverty) and could could be bought into, I'm not sure they should count either since there is a big difference between around a thousand people sitting in a senate and five people ruling in a council. Remember, Venice's Council of Ten answered to a much larger senate and the Doge and Florence's Eight Saints were a war time necessity (and they were tax assessors).
* I don't think we know enough about it. Or could you clarify what doesn't seem republican to you? It doesn't seem to be a monarchy, so I guess republic in the meaning of "res publica" isn't so far off.
** Republic as a term is far older than the United States, and even today it has numerous definitions around the world. At core it simply means a nation ruled by an elected council. The election does not have to be democratic as we understand it, nor does the position of electee have to be open for everyone. Pre-Imperial Rome was a non-democratic Republic, for example. The United Republic does seem to be a democracy however, though how it functions is unknown. It seems that the representatives have to include members from the four Nations, and that Benders are overpresented compared to non-Benders. Tenzin is an influential member in spite of the near-extinction of the Air Nomads, for example.
*** Tenzin's father was one of the founders of Republic City. He's probably doing it as a legacy thing, not to represent the almost non-existent Air Nomads.
*** Except that the Council, or at least its leaders apart from Tenzin consist of representatives of Fire Nation, Earth Kingdom, and Southern and Northern Water Tribes. It seems fairly clear that the city is lead by the representatives of the four Bending cultures, even the near-extinct Air Nomads.
* I think the source of the confusion here is that we're assuming Republic City is an independent state, which may not be the case. It's possible Republic City is a kind of "neutral ground" that all four nations have limited control over. If this is the case, the representatives that control Republic city may very well be elected...by the total populations of the nations they hail from. So it's less like Wales being governed by representatives from Ireland, Scotland, and England and more like if everyone in the United States was able to vote for the mayor and city council of New York City.
** So Republic City is basically [[WashingtonDC Washington, DC]]. Limited home rule and all that.
** It's more like the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_International_Settlement Shanghai-that-Was]].
* Republic in its most basic sense means "state without monarchy." The council is made up entirely (I understand) by representatives of monarchies. So I honestly believe that the creators did not know what the word republic means. It is a common mistakes, I remember a couple of occasions where Jorge Luis Borges made ​​the same mistake.
** I'm sure they know exactly what it means. It means a state not ruled by a monarchy. It doesn't mean a state without any influence from any monarchies whatsoever. Republic City is ruled, as you said, by a council--not by a monarchy. That the councilmen represent monarchies doesn't matter.
** Also, the council isn't made up ''entirely'' of representatives of monarchies. The Air Nomads most certainly aren't a monarchy, they don't even have a state of their own, and nothing indicates Tenzin is considered to be their "king". The reason he seems to be the highest authority figure among them could simply be because he's the oldest, most experienced Airbender alive. Historically the Airbenders appear to have been ruled by councils of elders, one in each Air Temple, but we don't know what their current system is. As for the Southern Water Tribe, while they have a chief, there's no canon evidence that he's their sole leader, or that the position of the chief is inhereditary; for all we know he could be chosen by a tribe meeting, or by some other democratic process.
*** If Tenzin gets to be one of the most powerful people in the world just because he's the best Airbender that would be a real problem. Nepotism is honestly more likely.
*** Being a council person in one city makes you "one of the most powerful people in the world"? Just because the series takes place there doesn't mean it's the most important place in the world.
*** But being the world's only Master Airbender probably would make you "one of the most powerful people in the world" by default.
** Since when does "Republic" mean a "state without monarchy"? By that definition, fascist, democratic, anarchist, and theocratic governments would be republican. A better defintion of a "republic" would be a state with a mixed constitution, incorporating elements of democracy, aristocracy, and (elected) monarchy. By this definition, we could include Rome, Florence, Venice, and the US. France might be harder to fit, since it seemed to include only democracy and (elected) monarchy, as far as I'm aware. And, of course, this does not work as well for the 20th century when it seemed to become the fashion to style everything a "republic" regardless of its actual form. Also, keep in mind that I'm using the term monarch losely to refer to a small executive branch (like the consuls, Doge, Signoria, or president), the way Roman and Renaissance political theorists did.
*** You define the entire Western world as being ruled by monarchs? (because pretty much every nation has a president or prime minister)
*** "Since when does 'Republic' mean 'a state without monarchy'?" Basically since the term was coined in the classical world. Although modern developments have complicated the matter, that's still the most basic way to define the term, and essential to every other definition that incorporates other aspects. "By that definition, fascist, democratic, anarchist and theocratic governments would be republican." Yes. You treat these terms as opposed to either monarchy or republic while they aren't (except anarchism which is opposed to both). Iran can be described as a theocratic republic, Saudi-Arabia as a theocratic monarchy. The UK is a democratic monarchy, the US a democratic republic and so on. "A better definition ..." What follows is a pretty meaningless definition that has no descriptive purpose and no historical background. In general, people seem to be misled by the meaning of the word "Republican" in a US-American context, where it has a wider meaning, including rule of law, balance of power, democracy, equality before the law etc. and also carries a lot of historical and political baggage (there is a major party that derives its name from this word after all). This meaning comes from American history, not academic categorization of governments. And no, an elected head of the executive is not a monarch.
*** As to the idea of an elected head being a monarch, this is exactly how Polybius uses the term. Polybius defines Rome as a state with a mixed constitution, one that has elements of monarchy, aristocracy, and democracy. He equates the monarchical elements with the consuls, an elected office with one year in office. I am doing the same (note: a prime minister is not a head of state but a head of government, and thus would not represent a monarchic element). The definition of a republic as a state with a mixed constitution also comes from Polybius's understanding - he holds up Rome's Republic as an example of government to be contrasted with the democracy of Athens and various principates. I would argue that in most of the greatest historical examples, a balance of powers is an essential aspect of a republic, as it was in antique Rome and renaissance Florence and Venice. Aristotle would seem to agree given that he considers a mixed constitution as an alternative form of government to monarchy/tyranny, aristocracy/oligarchy, and democracy. Now, Machiavelli does seem to include all non-principate states in the category of "Republic", but given his historical environment, where the only non-monarchic states had mixed constitutions, states like Florence, Venice, and Bologna, I would hesitate to agree with his assessment, given that his analysis of Rome and the classical world was often heavily colored by his experience of politics in his own time. You say that classically this is how a republic was defined, but I'm not sure which classical authors you are refering to. As I said above, Polybius and Aristotle did not make such a division. Plato divided his types of government much more broadly, defining five types of states based on the values of the ruler/ruling class (kallipolis, timocracy, oligarchy, democracy, and tyranny). To Thucydides, your division would not make sense, since part of his history is devoted to comparing the sort of governments Sparta and Athens had and to equate them as of the same sort would be counter to his efforts. Since the term, however, comes from Latin, we could look at Latin authors, but they tended to defer to Polybius and Aristotle on this matter. And if we are going to defer to the term "res publica", then even the Roman Empire would be a republic, since for the first century or so of its existence it was still called a "res publica". So, I do not see where your definition comes from, aside from perhaps Machiavelli or the French Revolution, neither of whom/which are classical sources and both of whom/which existed in periods where a more nuanced view was unnecessary. And as to theocracy - you said you can have theocratic republics and theocratic monarchies, but what would the bishopric of Rome be? A republic, given the prominence of the college of cardinals? A monarchy, given that it has a single head? Also, you seem to be lax on what a monarchy is - is it simply a state with a king? would a tyranny without a king be a republic? It would seem unfair to call Cuba a republic just because its head of state does not call himself king. It would seem unfair to call Sparta a monarchy just because its heads of state were kings.
* At the very least we can say that Republic City does not seem very republican. A ruling body of five people who represent only a "bending aristocracy" (my term) is much more oligarchic than it is republican. And since this small ruling body seems to make policy decisions without consulting anyone outside of themselves (there's no mention of having a vote in the senate on what to do about the rebel problem or what to do about terrorist threats), I feel it's safe to say that just these five are governing Republic City. So... yeah. Sounds like an oligarchy - more like the Thirty Tyrants than the Council of Ten.
** That does fit within some definitions of Republic since those five are "the body of citizens entitled to vote", if they were elected to those positions in some way it fits most definitions. What Republic City is clearly not is a democracy, the general population has little to no say in the general affairs of government.
*** But size does matter in this. If you were simply going to say that a republic has a "body of citizens entitled to vote" a tyranny would be a republic where that body numbered one. The voting base needs to be broader than five, even if it does not have to include a majority of people. If you were to ask me to define how broad it needs to be, I would probably say at least 1% of the population. Though, there are other aspects of republic aside from having a voting base, namely the separation of powers - they tend to have at least an executive or executive body and a legislative body, but can also include bodies that propose legislation (like Rome's Senate) or various bodies that oversee economic or military concerns.
*** Represents a "bending aristocracy"? The councilmembers represent the different NATIONS, not the types of benders. We know that Tarrlok and Tenzin are benders, but it's never been shown about the others. True, Amon had them kidnapped, but that could be just as much to disrupt the current government as to target them as benders.
**** The way Tarrlok addresses them when he introduces his non-bender curfew certainly implies they are benders. And it seems unlikely they would have voted for the curfew if they were non-benders themselves.
* People have used the word "republic" to mean a lot of different things over the course of history. It is a usefully vague term, almost to the point of being meaningless, in a fictional setting.
[[/folder]]



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